What does Andy have to do to beat Fed? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

What does Andy have to do to beat Fed?

Fumus
01-18-2005, 04:42 PM
Well...what's it going to take? He's got a new coach, new fitness, and a new year.

In an ideal condition match against Roger on a neutral surface like rebound ace, what does Andy have to do to beat Roger?

Deboogle!.
01-18-2005, 04:46 PM
Hope Roger's a little off and Andy would have to not only serve the match of his life but play the match of his life.

Fumus
01-18-2005, 04:59 PM
Hope Roger's a little off and Andy would have to not only serve the match of his life but play the match of his life.


Wow...that's alittle hard. haha..I thought S&V was the new answer all of a sudden? To beat him..basically what you are saying is that Andy needs to play like Gonzo.

Deboogle!.
01-18-2005, 05:00 PM
no, not like Gonzo but he has to play a nearly perfect match, very few errors, tons of first serves in, mixing it up - serve volleying, he'd have to return as well as possible, etc.

k-rod83
01-18-2005, 05:02 PM
i dont even think that would work....he had him in the 1st set at wimby then couldnt keep it up. i think the only way andy will bt fed is if fed forgets to turn up

Deboogle!.
01-18-2005, 05:16 PM
If it weren't for rain, I think Andy would have won that match the way he was playing. Just my opinion. Plus it's Wimby, fed's best surface... it would be different at USO or AO. Not saying the RESULT would be different but Andy would want to play Fed differently on hardcourts, and differently depending on the speed of the hardcourt.

Leena
01-18-2005, 06:10 PM
Well, at least for this week... Andy is gonna have to learn to take the ball earlier. If he continues this 10 feet behind the baseline junk on this surface, I doubt he even makes the SF.

For the other surfaces... Andy isn't too far off. I'd like to see him rely less on hitting a majority of flat power serves, because Roger is amazing at getting them back. Focus on placement, and mixing it up since Roger likes to move early on his returns once he reads them. And keep the 1st serve % up.

Andy can break Roger... Roger's one small weakness is switching to a purely offensive position. When Andy isn't making UE's and fights hard on return games, he can break Roger. Just 1 or 2 breaks can be enough to win.

Deboogle!.
01-18-2005, 06:16 PM
Well, at least for this week... Andy is gonna have to learn to take the ball earlier. If he continues this 10 feet behind the baseline junk on this surface, I doubt he even makes the SF.

Yes, completely agreed. And it's frustrating b/c Dean has been quoted a few times as saying that this is the biggest thing he wants Andy to improve - his court positioning. He did it sometimes last night, but not others. He'll have to play closer against Greg, and also try to take the net away from him.

Fumus
01-18-2005, 06:17 PM
If it weren't for rain, I think Andy would have won that match the way he was playing. Just my opinion. Plus it's Wimby, fed's best surface... it would be different at USO or AO. Not saying the RESULT would be different but Andy would want to play Fed differently on hardcourts, and differently depending on the speed of the hardcourt.

I agree Deb, the rain dicked Andy over. If there was no rain, then there would be no rest for Roger to think, and no time for Andy to lose focus. Also that second set, Roger got really lucky win that blowing a 4-0 lead. :o Certainly could have been Andy's second win, and maybe could have led to more.

Overall, I think for Andy to beat Roger...

I think he can beat Roger when both guys are playing their best. If they are on a fast hard court surface like US O, Andy can simply over power him. Much like Pete did to Andre. Andy in my opinion has a better forehand and a better serve. I do think he needs to be able to use the transiton game effectivly as well. Yea, he has to play great but has Andy played too many spotless matches in his career....eh..no...so that's definitly possible. Who knows what can happen when Andy plays in "Roddickulous" mode, it's not often he gets in that zone but, if he is...he can beat Fed. That's what I believe in my heart. :angel:

MisterQ
01-18-2005, 06:24 PM
If Andy tries to overpower him, he needs to follow the big shots and serves into the net. Because Fed can get anything back --- but not necessarily with a strong reply.

I would not recommend that Andy follow his weak slices and sometimes-mediocre-two-handed backhand into the net very much, however, because Roger is a great passer and lobber, and Andy does not have the volley skills and reflexes of someone like Henman.

Fumus
01-18-2005, 06:33 PM
Well, at least for this week... Andy is gonna have to learn to take the ball earlier. If he continues this 10 feet behind the baseline junk on this surface, I doubt he even makes the SF.


Oh yea? How did he make the semis before, ya know, pre-Brad? :o He's not Andre don't expect to see him take the ball on the rise from the baseline, that isn't not going to happen. He needs to step in the court more and impose his will, checkout the last 2 sets of last nights match and you will see Andy begins more of this. They actually talked about this somewhat during that match last night saying that Andy was a retriever type when he was kid and reverts those insticts. So, I think he needs to iron that out and step in to court. As for taking the ball early like Andre, that's just :retard: because that'll never happen consistanly. Andy doesn't play like that, instead Andy just winds up crushes the ball. :) Andy's a true serve and forehander not a baseliner... ;)


For the other surfaces... Andy isn't too far off. I'd like to see him rely less on hitting a majority of flat power serves, because Roger is amazing at getting them back. Focus on placement, and mixing it up since Roger likes to move early on his returns once he reads them. And keep the 1st serve % up.

eh, that's when Roger takes the serve on a rise, steps around and cracks an inside out forehand for a winner. Andy needs to come to net and put those little chips away. There's a reason players swing on returns, you don't wanna leave yourself vonerable. Andy needs to make Roger play more honest with his returns by S&Ving more. Yea, change ups are good always, placement is good always, and keeping the first serve % up is always good too. Hitting spin serves all the time however... :sad:

Andy can break Roger... Roger's one small weakness is switching to a purely offensive position. When Andy isn't making UE's and fights hard on return games, he can break Roger. Just 1 or 2 breaks can be enough to win.

I agree with this. I have always told the Federwhore fans that, if the beast bleeds you can kill it. Breaking Roger means you can beat him, if Andy can win more games on Rogers serve by improving his return, which btw I still think is the weakest part of his game, he will beat him. Last night he couldn't break Labatze serve and that fool hung around 7-5, except Roger doesn't hang around he will break you eventually.

J. Corwin
01-18-2005, 08:51 PM
Sometimes Andy plays too much like an aggressive counter-puncher, much like he played against Labadze. You see him way behind the baseline and retrieving balls. When he gets a short ball, you see him run around his backhand about to blast his forehand, he set it up...and what does he do? He hits the forehand barely pass the service line, not troubling his opponent at all. :o It gives a shortball to his opponent, so of course Andy now is gonna be doing most of the retrieving. :rolleyes: He needs to be consistently aggressive against Fed. Yea he needs to play the percentage shots but Andy needs to go for it before Fed does. He can't hang around like Fed as much cuz he is the worse baseliner of the two.

What he needs to do is play like how he played in the first few rounds at USO last year. Some of those deep forehand blasts. :eek: He needs to keep that up for a whole match, serve extremely well, and hope Roger has an off day on returning (and everything else ;)).

tangerine_dream
01-18-2005, 09:16 PM
Andy should try something completely different.

Instead of liking and respecting Roger, maybe Andy should learn to hate him and start trash-talking him (on the inside, of course).

See if that has any effect on his mental prowess during their matches. ;)

Fumus
01-18-2005, 09:20 PM
Andy should try something completely different.

Instead of liking and respecting Roger, maybe Andy should learn to hate him and start trash-talking him (on the inside, of course).

See if that has any effect on his mental prowess during their matches. ;)


Didn't someone say that in a live chat? He should get pissed at him? lol

heya
01-18-2005, 09:55 PM
Did Hrbaty, Nalbandian, Kuerten, Henman, Berdych, Agassi, Mirnyi, Hewitt, Costa and Nadal play near their best? NO

They didn't behave like surrendering clowns, like Andy did.
They didn't clap and act nice for everyone just because the match was friendly.
They didn't talk to the umpire/linesman.
They didn't beg for the crowd's sympathy.
They did not wait another second to crush the returns.

They were serious and took the speed off the ball a lot.

They didn't hop around 1 foot behind the baseline; they didn't throw their bodies off balance like Andy did.

They ate right, so they didn't struggle with weight probs and lazy footwork.

They worked hard in European clay and hardcourt events.

They hit forehands, backhands & angles much harder and played aggressively at net, even if they weren't comfortable.

Their serves were well-placed and they didn't exhaust themselves with 140 mph serves.

smucav
01-18-2005, 10:11 PM
Didn't someone say that in a live chat? He should get pissed at him? lolJimmy Connors's answer to this question: too much hugging.

Of course, it's rivalries like theirs that the game is crying out for today, but can never be recreated in the present sanitised climate. The sporting manner, say, in which Andy Roddick, the American No 1, has accepted his beatings this year at the hands of Roger Federer, the world No 1, does not augur well for the creation of a rivalry, quite apart the discrepancy in their ability.

"How can you have a rivalry when you go out and beat someone 6-3 in the fifth and you give the guy a hug afterwards?" Connors asked. "I lost to Borg a few times, I lost to McEnroe a few times, and there was no hugging. Christ, I mean, I followed Borg around the world just to get at him because he kicked my arse at Wimbledon two or three times. And it was the same with Mac.

"A rivalry is only a rivalry when you care. I know these kids care while they're playing, but rivalry is something that's living the year round. You still talk about me and Mac today, even if we're in the commentary booth. It carries over. That's the way it is. A rivalry is in your guts, it's not on the court."

Connors a rebel with a cause (http://sport.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml?xml=/sport/2004/12/19/stconn19.xml&sSheet=/sport/2004/12/21/ixtenn.html)

Golfnduck
01-18-2005, 11:01 PM
Did Hrbaty, Nalbandian, Kuerten, Henman, Berdych, Agassi, Mirnyi, Hewitt, Costa and Nadal play near their best? NO
They ate right, so they didn't struggle with weight probs and lazy footwork.

Nalbandian ate right??!!! Now that's something I have to see. Last year, Andy and David could have had a "who's belly is bigger" contest.

heya
01-18-2005, 11:20 PM
2 yrs. ago, David was beating Federer and winning marathons with a bandaged wrist. His footwork was not bad. He's only 5'11', so he can get away with a few extra pounds.
2004 was when his body and mind crumbled.

Andy is near/was around 200 pounds.
Who struggles more with movement and with the net game? Andy's body wasn't made for tennis, but he still managed to hang around with smaller and stronger guys who have no trouble moving.

Havok
01-19-2005, 02:09 AM
He needs to serve smarter to keep on holding serve. Don't get me wrong it's not like Federer breaks his serve so often, but if he mixes things up Fed will have more trouble. Roger seems to chip returns back most of the time off the backhand so he should S&V when serving to that side. When he catches on, then don't do it as much. Also giving him offspeed 1st serves might make Fed overcook some returns. He also needs to hit much more deeper than he normaly does and throughout the whole entire match. Oh and stop getting aced out wide on big points. He should literally stand there waiting for the outwide serve and smack it back hard and deep to take control. Though if Fed's playing well, he wins.

heya
01-19-2005, 03:38 AM
The best things are to continue the fast, short angles. Slow ball him and drop shot a lot. That's how good habits come naturally and steadily.
Andy used to be happy to show up, being a crowd pleaser with a thunder serve. The SERVE just makes him lose easily ---he had no energy left.
You can't get better when your body lets you down.

Brad is in denial because he thinks that a macho, immature, laid-back attitude toward tennis is good.
EARTH TO GILBERT--YOu DON'T KNOW ENOUGH. Get over it.