WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ) [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

WG QF: Rosol def. Golubev 4-6 6-4 6-2 7-6 (6) (CZE 2-0 KAZ)

Action Jackson
04-05-2013, 11:06 AM
Of course this was a fine battle of tactics. Golubev served for the 4th set at *5-4, but couldn't get it done.

Rosol was the steadier and delivered Golubev's first defeat at home in a DC tie. Not bad from the reserves to be leading 2-0

motorhead
04-05-2013, 11:15 AM
expected.

Puschkin
04-05-2013, 11:17 AM
expected.
I got this one totally wrong. :haha:

JamieMU30
04-05-2013, 11:21 AM
Lukas:bowdown:...Almost Top 50 now with this win:dance:

Topspindoctor
04-05-2013, 11:27 AM
Not such a difficult task to defeat a choking mug like Craplubev

Sombrerero loco
04-05-2013, 11:35 AM
noooo :hysteric:

JamieMU30
04-05-2013, 11:37 AM
Rosol made surprisingly few winners and unforced errors in this match, Golubev the opposite.

In the tie-break, Golubev led 5-4 with the serve but lost 2 points, Rosol served for it but lost the match point 6-6, then led 7-6, Golubev serving, who lost that point : 8-6 for Rosol.

From my calculation, Rosol will reach his carreer-high ranking at 54 or better.

(I assumed that one can't cumulate the 65 points from a win in Davis cup quarterfinal with the 10 points from playing a live rubber iwthout winning in the first round, which I think I checked in previous years but I've not documented it well then I'm not 100% sure : if anybody gave me an example, I would be reassured ;) )

I think that is wrong...Calculations show he should be around 51 with this win

JamieMU30
04-05-2013, 11:43 AM
the difference between both is cumulating the 65 points with the 10 points from first round as I mentioned between blankets.

If you have any evidence that they can be cumulated, I would be glad :worship:

I think you are right but I have him with 810 points, sitting at #52 in the rankings, tied with Ramos at #51

JamieMU30
04-05-2013, 11:47 AM
he would have 810 points if he had 75 points from Davis cup, that is 65+10, not if he can't cumulate, that is if he got 65 points only :shrug:

I think for this win he only got 57 points...753+57=810

If he had 75 points from Davis Cup he would be at 753+65=818

There is a 2 point discrepancy somewhere...Who knows from where:haha:

He should be at 51 or 52 I think! Ready to crack the Top 50:rocker2:

redshift36188
04-05-2013, 11:50 AM
the difference between both is cumulating the 65 points with the 10 points from first round as I mentioned between blankets.

If you have any evidence that they can be cumulated, I would be glad :worship:

but even if I have not documented it, I think I checked that it's not possible (it's possible to cumulate with the points from play-offs but that's something else)
The rules don't mention anything about the 10 points from R1 loss being a special case but I guess we'll find out next Monday.

Slasher1985
04-05-2013, 11:55 AM
Rosol is going to have 810 points with this win.

JamieMU30
04-05-2013, 11:57 AM
[QUOTE=duong;14485354]the Davis cup result has to replace the worst optional result before, which was 18 points[/

Are you sure the worst optional result is 10 and not 18? All I know is that I have him at 51 or 52 and I am sticking with that story:haha: Guess the rankings on Monday will show

Slasher1985
04-05-2013, 11:57 AM
The exact explanation is this one:

Rosol has 10 DC points, which are out of his countables.

With this win he gets to 75 DC points, 10 for R1, 65 from QF.

This 75 replaces his worst result of 18 points, thus he gains 57 effective points.

GSMnadal
04-05-2013, 11:59 AM
MTF's dream match this. No pushing, tactics, topspin, rallies or brain use whatsoever in this one.

JamieMU30
04-05-2013, 12:01 PM
The exact explanation is this one:

Rosol has 10 DC points, which are out of his countables.

With this win he gets to 75 DC points, 10 for R1, 65 from QF.

This 75 replaces his worst result of 18 points, thus he gains 57 effective points.

Thanks, that makes sense!! I knew I had 810 as being right...So will he be at 51 or 52? If you are tied with someone, doesn't the player playing that week or reaching those points come first in the rankings?

Slasher1985
04-05-2013, 12:02 PM
Thanks, that makes sense!! I knew I had 810 as being right...So will he be at 51 or 52? If you are tied with someone, doesn't the player playing that week or reaching those points come first in the rankings?

In a moment. My live rankings update will confirm his exact position and I will tell you.

Slasher1985
04-05-2013, 12:13 PM
He will be 52.

The first tiebreaker is the GS+Masters points. If two players are tied at that, the second tie-breaker is the number of tournaments played. The one with the lowest amount is in front. If this again is a tie, the next tiebreakers are the points gained in each tournaments played. PlayerA's maximum points gained vs. PlayerB's maximum points gained after which PA's second maximum points vs PB's second maximum points and so on.

JamieMU30
04-05-2013, 12:19 PM
He will be 52.

The first tiebreaker is the GS+Masters points. If two players are tied at that, the second tie-breaker is the number of tournaments played. The one with the lowest amount is in front. If this again is a tie, the next tiebreakers are the points gained in each tournaments played. PlayerA's maximum points gained vs. PlayerB's maximum points gained after which PA's second maximum points vs PB's second maximum points and so on.

Very in-depth, thank you:wavey:...52, 51, whatever...I am okay with either one...Too bad there probably won't be a live 4th rubber for him to gain more points and crack the Top 50:sad:

Slasher1985
04-05-2013, 12:24 PM
Slasher, do you have any evidence that the 10 points from R1 and the 65 from QF can be cumulated ?

No superior round of Davis Cup has ever dropped out points earned in a previous round, and all round points drop only after 52 weeks, including Bonus Points, which drop out 52 weeks after the Final is counted in.

Rosol's 10 points have been earned because he didn't win any match in Round 1. No QF match can remove his points, unless it's a ATP error, like it happened last year with the playoff and ATP didn't catch it until Round 1 this year. I have made sure about this rule by corresponding with the ATP via e-mail.:)

From the rulebook:

Participation: For the first round only, any player who competes in a “live”
singles match(es), without a win, shall receive 10 ranking points.

Slasher1985
04-05-2013, 12:30 PM
BTW, I hope you guys counted Hajek as earning 40 points, and not 65, since he didn't play Round 1.:)

Redaftw
04-05-2013, 12:36 PM
This was a pure choke from Golubev since 4-5 in the 2nd set he threw away every chance he had.

BroTree123
04-05-2013, 12:41 PM
Golubev is a huge mug. Choked that 4th set away like he did numerous times against Nadal at USO when he served for the set like 5 times.

Slasher1985
04-05-2013, 12:59 PM
To be fair duong, I don't remember (since 2009) a case where live rubber points from any round were not cumulated across 52 weeks (apart from the errors I mentioned happening last year). That is why I'm saying that these 10 points will also be cumulated and is enough evidence for me.

Quite a rare case to have a player with 10 points in R1 winning a rubber in QF, because it's rare to have a team qualify after one of their singles player loses both live rubbers.

It's all a matter of "let's see on Monday". In any case it's win-win even if I'm not right, because we learn something new about the rules yet again.:D

Let's put in here what DC site says:

a) Accumulated points for all Davis Cup play over the preceding 52-week period will count as one result and form part of the ATP World Tour 500 category, the best of which count towards a player’s ranking.

b) ATP ranking points are awarded for performances in live rubbers. Points will not be awarded for dead rubbers.

c) Players who miss a round of ties (i.e. not among the four nominated players at the draw) will be awarded points based on the immediately preceding round.(For example, a player who doesn’t play the first round but plays the second round will earn 40 points for each singles match won in that second round).

d) Points will be added after every round of ties and deducted at the same stage the following year.

Marked in bold are the phrases that tell me that Rosol's 10 will be added to the 65.

Burrow
04-05-2013, 01:15 PM
MTF's dream match this. No pushing, tactics, topspin, rallies or brain use whatsoever in this one.

Even the flattest of players are still using minimal topspin the vast majority of the time.

TigerTim
04-05-2013, 01:16 PM
:lick:

Slasher1985
04-05-2013, 01:16 PM
Of course they will not take off points from winning rubbers but it's a peculiar case because the 10 points are a very peculiar case of getting points from losing in an optional tournament then some people viewed it as an "encouragement" to commit to Davis cup which would be deleted for a more "normal" rankings points method when you could get points by winning at one moment.

And I remember that we had talked a lot of that case when the Davis cup points were first introduced and that many people were surprised when we had the evidence that they could be cumulated with the points won from winning a live rubber in play-offs. To show you that what looks "obvious" for one person can be the opposite from what looks "obvious" for another one.

Moreover, I didn't invent that the mention that they could not be cumulated which was previously written on the Davis cup website. I don't have the document anymore on my computer but the fact that I wrote it came from somewhere.


Yeah, but now they're saying "Accumulated points for all Davis Cup play" not win.

I know you didn't invent that rule, of course, but as always ATP take surprising decisions sometimes to change rules.

Right now though, giving 10 points even for losing is not a good idea only when talking about players ranked outside Top 200, to which 10 points is the equivalent of a Futures final and has a big impact on the rankings. But it's not gonna be an often scenario to have a team consisted mainly of players outside Top 200 part of the main World Group, so I don't see it as big trouble.

rocketassist
04-05-2013, 02:49 PM
So much for Rosol being 'curb-stomped' eh Everko? :lol:

GSMnadal
04-05-2013, 02:51 PM
Even the flattest of players are still using minimal topspin the vast majority of the time.

But you do agree on no brain use whatsoever apparently?

Way to take it way too literally man.

Certinfy
04-05-2013, 04:57 PM
Who needs Berdych and Stepanek when you have Hajek and Rosol? :haha: