Why was carpet ended? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Why was carpet ended?

TigerTim
09-21-2012, 08:57 PM
Sorry if this has been done, I tried to search and couldnt find anything.

I loved carpet, it seemed they began to phase out in the late 90s but why? Thought that was before surface homogenisation?

Edit: to ppl blaming Rafeal and co. YEC switched to hard in 97, 2 carpet masters shrunk to 1 in 99

GOATsol
09-21-2012, 08:58 PM
They knew Rafito would come along and wouldn't be able to win a single game on carpet so saved him from the embarrassment.

Sanya
09-21-2012, 09:00 PM
http://www.tennistalk.com/images/article/1611.jpg

GOATsol
09-21-2012, 09:01 PM
^
lol

abraxas21
09-21-2012, 09:04 PM
there's a leeengthy thread about how nadal/federer lobbied to the ATP to stop using carpet as a surface in ATP tournaments.

I personally think the pressure from those 2 is exaggerated here. The ATP would have probably get rid of carpet one way or the other. It was just highly convenient for them that their 2 biggest stars were up for it too.

i guess i could also say that both federer and nadal benefited from this. nadal especially, but that still hasn't allowed him to fare well in the indoor season.

TigerTim
09-21-2012, 09:04 PM
I expect this. But seriously :lol:

Any ideas???

TigerTim
09-21-2012, 09:05 PM
there's a leeengthy thread about how nadal/federer lobbied to the ATP to stop using carpet as a surface in ATP tournaments.

Yes but it was already being phased out.

Tag
09-21-2012, 09:05 PM
excellent first replies

muster started moaning about fast carpet in 95(?). even sampras (yes, the same sampras who was a beast on fast courts) complained one end of year tournament/end of year masters that you couldn't see the ball properly

then federer and nadal complained that their games did not translate well to properly fast surfaces, and that was the fatal blow

abraxas21
09-21-2012, 09:11 PM
I expect this. But seriously :lol:

Any ideas???

i expanded the post a little bit but i think tag is more in the line of the answer you're looking for

TigerTim
09-21-2012, 09:20 PM
Thanks :)

Intresting about Sampras :eek:

156mphserve
09-21-2012, 09:33 PM
Because it wa too easy to stain :sad:

caisenma
09-21-2012, 09:40 PM
because of injuries/injury fears, most likely.

i've done my ankle in quite bad on carpet before. it's a shit surface, as far as i'm concerned. faster than the wind though, which in itself would make for a nice change on tour.

Tag
09-21-2012, 09:47 PM
Thanks :)

Intresting about Sampras :eek:

yeah, it's unusual since his game suited the surface so well

i forget which tournament it was was, but it was mid 90s. think he might have won it as well, so he complained even though he won

Tag
09-21-2012, 09:49 PM
because of injuries/injury fears, most likely.

i've done my ankle in quite bad on carpet before. it's a shit surface, as far as i'm concerned. faster than the wind though, which in itself would make for a nice change on tour.

far more players have been injured on hard courts (especially this current brand) than on carpet. actually, i can recall more injuries, however slight, on grass courts and clay courts than on carpet

TigerTim
09-21-2012, 09:51 PM
far more players have been injured on hard courts (especially this current brand) than on carpet. actually, i can recall more injuries, however slight, on grass courts and clay courts than on carpet

agreed. And think of the long term damaged done on grinding slow hard courts like we have today.

caisenma
09-21-2012, 09:52 PM
isn't that more likely because historically have been far more games played on hard than carpet? and also by the fact that it's been so long since any of us saw matches on carpet, we wouldn't remember as many injuries in the first place.

but nevertheless, you might very well be right. it was just a thought.

DrJules
09-21-2012, 09:56 PM
Paying public wanted to see more than a serving contest.

Sampras, Ivanisevic and Becker on indoor courts turned matches into serve contests.

Tag
09-21-2012, 09:58 PM
isn't that more likely because historically have been far more games played on hard than carpet? and also by the fact that it's been so long since any of us saw matches on carpet, we wouldn't remember as many injuries in the first place.

but nevertheless, you might very well be right. it was just a thought.

no, not really, carpet has always been a historic surface

hard courts, less so. game started on grass, then clay.

tennis is a very injury inducing game, but generally, hard courts force the body into unnatural contortions moreso than other courts

caisenma
09-21-2012, 10:02 PM
well fair enough!

anyone here ever seen footage of wooden courts? i've read about it, but never seen it. sounds like a riot.

TennisOnWood
09-21-2012, 10:10 PM
Sorry if this has been done, I tried to search and couldnt find anything.

I loved carpet, it seemed they began to phase out in the late 90s but why? Thought that was before surface homogenisation?

Edit: to ppl blaming Rafeal and co. YEC switched to hard in 98, 2 carpet masters shrunk to 1 in 99

Masters Cup switched to Hard in 1997., after 1996. tournament (when we saw one of the best matches of all time) players complained it was just to quick

TigerTim
09-21-2012, 10:13 PM
Masters Cup switched to Hard in 1997., after 1996. tournament (when we saw one of the best matches of all time) players complained it was just to quick

thanks, updated :yeah:

Certinfy
09-21-2012, 10:42 PM
Berdych's only big title came on carpet. :bigcry:

TigerTim
09-21-2012, 10:43 PM
Berdych's only big title came on carpet. :bigcry:

same with Tim :sobbing:

rocketassist
09-21-2012, 10:51 PM
Paying public wanted to see more than a serving contest.

Sampras, Ivanisevic and Becker on indoor courts turned matches into serve contests.

Were we getting serve contests in 2006 (the final year it was used) I think not.

Certinfy
09-21-2012, 10:53 PM
same with Tim :sobbing:
Lets hug it out mate. :hug: :awww:

TigerTim
09-21-2012, 10:58 PM
Lets hug it out mate. :hug: :awww:

:hug:

TennisOnWood
09-21-2012, 11:02 PM
Were we getting serve contests in 2006 (the final year it was used) I think not.

I could swear I saw Carpet in Lyon 2008. ;)

TigerTim
09-21-2012, 11:04 PM
Were we getting serve contests in 2006 (the final year it was used) I think not.

UgZUal3uNaY&
SKSzTGoZM3o
p5VmH0BSeHE

agreed, watch this if you think carpet = serve bot tennis

Looner
09-21-2012, 11:05 PM
Why couldn't they just slow down carpet :confused:. Or is that a stupid question? I mean they slowed down grass of all surfaces :rolleyes:.

Matt01
09-21-2012, 11:43 PM
I like the last 2 options best :spit:

n8
09-21-2012, 11:51 PM
Because it wa too easy to stain :sad:

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/5054_101409337623_6313812_n.jpg

:tears:

tennisfan856
09-21-2012, 11:56 PM
The real answer is that the ATP was too afraid of having Berrer become the ATP king.

philosophicalarf
09-22-2012, 12:05 AM
Why couldn't they just slow down carpet :confused:.

They did at some events, ended up even with a medium speed carpet at a few.

redshift36188
09-22-2012, 12:34 AM
Hasn't the homogenisation on the outdoor courts (which is the biggest part of the season) changed the metagame for less net play in general?


Do you think the game play would be different now if they switched back to carpet on the indoor season?


(Honest questions, as I barely followed the tour back then.)

TigerTim
09-22-2012, 12:39 AM
Hasn't the homogenisation on the outdoor courts (which is the biggest part of the season) changed the metagame for less net play in general?


Do you think the game play would be different now if they switched back to carpet on the indoor season?


(Honest questions, as I barely followed the tour back then.)

I think it would encourage attacking tennis. But in the course of a year there would be little change in the game play. At the very least it would force players to adapt and diversify the calendar, providing a oppounity for attacking players to gain points.

Topspindoctor
09-22-2012, 01:13 AM
Because carpet sucks.

GOATsol
09-22-2012, 02:09 AM
Because carpet sucks.
So the pushfests we're having on these clay courts all year round are fantastic.

Mountaindewslave
09-22-2012, 02:17 AM
So the pushfests we're having on these clay courts all year round are fantastic.

US Open final was more of a pushfest than any Nadal match in the whole clay season so that's funny you say that; clay is a beautiful surface, it's a great surface, it's just a shame the damnation of hard court and dissapearance of carpet. grass is exaggerated about the changes, it always wore down over other generations as tournaments went on, people just choose to ignore this because it happened that big servers dominated it in the 90s

GOATsol
09-22-2012, 02:21 AM
US Open final was more of a pushfest than any Nadal match in the whole clay season so that's funny you say that; clay is a beautiful surface, it's a great surface, it's just a shame the damnation of hard court and dissapearance of carpet. grass is exaggerated about the changes, it always wore down over other generations as tournaments went on, people just choose to ignore this because it happened that big servers dominated it in the 90s
I agree that the USO final was a worse pushfest than any nadull match.

I disagree about the grass- I think it slowed down quite a bit.

Topspindoctor
09-22-2012, 02:30 AM
So the pushfests we're having on these clay courts all year round are fantastic.

Clay isn't a pusher surface - Mugray sucks on it after all.

GOATsol
09-22-2012, 02:34 AM
Clay isn't a pusher surface - Mugray sucks on it after all.
good point tdoc :lol:

But the super slow USO court did allow for the awful USO final.

Mark Lenders
09-22-2012, 02:40 AM
I agree that the USO final was a worse pushfest than any nadull match.

I disagree about the grass- I think it slowed down quite a bit.

The USO final was a worse pushfest than any other match in recent memory. It was simply horrendous, hurt the eyes just watching. If this is the future of tennis, then it's a dire future - doesn't get much worse than one dimensional baseline grinders dominating the game unopposed.

Of course the courts, namely hardcourts, won't be sped up because that'd mean the ATP cash cows would often be sent packing before the SFs. Fuck the quality of the tennis as long as they're making money :rolleyes:

Djokovic vs Murray on (slow) HC is a particularly dire matchup: those two are pretty much carbon copies of each other as far as strengths and weaknesses are concerned - both are return/defense oriented players with great backhands and movement... - and neither can hit through the other's defense, so not only are we treated to pushathons but it's like they're mirroring each other on court. I can hardly think of a matchup with less variety on display.

Freak3yman84
09-22-2012, 02:50 AM
I asked this once in the S.Q.T. thread and TigerTim answered my question so it's funny he started this thread. I also got a pic of Uncle Toni as an answer :haha:

Whiznot
09-22-2012, 05:59 AM
What do you guys think about synthetic grass courts like omnicourt. I don't know how it would play for the pros but I loved playing on it. I had a bad knee and omnicourt wasn't painful.

atennisfan
09-22-2012, 03:10 PM
The USO final was a worse pushfest than any other match in recent memory. It was simply horrendous, hurt the eyes just watching. If this is the future of tennis, then it's a dire future - doesn't get much worse than one dimensional baseline grinders dominating the game unopposed.


+1

Looner
09-22-2012, 03:15 PM
I asked this once in the S.Q.T. thread and TigerTim answered my question so it's funny he started this thread. I also got a pic of Uncle Toni as an answer :haha:

That'd be from me :p and I also remember that conversation :p.

TigerTim
09-22-2012, 03:17 PM
The poll results are reviling

Freak3yman84
09-22-2012, 03:20 PM
That's be from me :p and I also remember that conversation :p.

:lol:

BodyServe
09-22-2012, 04:00 PM
Don't care much about carpet removal, problem is the slowing down of hard courts particularly indoor's.

Mr.Michael
09-22-2012, 04:10 PM
Are the regulations clear and are the carpet courts actually banned? There's even no theoretical chance that some tournament director decides to lay down a vintage blue supreme court from the year 1991? I'd just love to see that.

Londinium
09-22-2012, 04:13 PM
well fair enough!

anyone here ever seen footage of wooden courts? i've read about it, but never seen it. sounds like a riot.

Never seen any footage of it but I used to work at a hotel where we had wooden courts and used to host international events right up until the early 60s. It even hosted a few Davis Cup matches back in the 30s, GBR vs Poland if I remember right. It's a riot if you've got a good serve otherwise it's blink and you miss it.

I wish they'd bring back carpet though, we should have a fair share of all the different court types (..well aside from wood). Somewhere in England Tim Henman is gently sobbing in a corner about the demise of carpet.

Are the regulations clear and are the carpet courts actually banned? There's even no theoretical chance that some tournament director decides to lay down a vintage blue supreme court from the year 1991? I'd just love to see that.

If I was a billionaire, I'd build a tennis club with carpet courts and personally fund a tournament with high prize money just to flip the bird at the ATP's homogenisation drive. Ah if only...

philosophicalarf
09-22-2012, 06:01 PM
Are the regulations clear and are the carpet courts actually banned? There's even no theoretical chance that some tournament director decides to lay down a vintage blue supreme court from the year 1991? I'd just love to see that.

Carpet is still allowed in the rules.

Gerflor (Taraflex) still make and sell their version, it's used at some challengers. Apparently the ITF pace measurement for it is a few notches higher than Bercy 2010 :-)


As a tournament director though, would you want to take the risk of being the odd one out? Players might withdraw, your crowds fall, and the tournament can die pretty quickly. A masters can get away with it I suppose, but that's only Bercy, and it's in trouble already with the new schedule.

Ibracadabra
09-22-2012, 07:41 PM
Nadal cant play on it. Case solved.

BigJohn
09-22-2012, 07:49 PM
Players from the WTA were munching the surface.

BK 201
09-22-2012, 08:04 PM
They knew Rafito would come along and wouldn't be able to win a single game on carpet so saved him from the embarrassment.

Nadal actually won Madrid 2005 along with making the Paris finals in 2007. Back when they were carpet courts.

TigerTim
09-22-2012, 08:08 PM
Madrid was never carpet :shrug:

In 2007 Paris was no longer carpet :shrug:

Nice try.

BK 201
09-22-2012, 08:18 PM
My mistake.


Although I don't see why people are talking about Nadal; He's won titles on fast courts. It's not like the guy is winning solely on one surface. If anyone is to blame of the state of tennis - it's the ATP.


You live in Bristol? Which part?

Looner
09-22-2012, 08:20 PM
My mistake.


Although I don't see why people are talking about Nadal; He's won titles on fast courts. It's not like the guy is winning solely on one surface. If anyone is to blame of the state of tennis - it's the ATP.


You live in Bristol? Which part?

:spit: That's like saying Federer has won titles on blue clay.

BK 201
09-22-2012, 08:24 PM
:spit: That's like saying Federer has won titles on blue clay.

Dubai 2006?
Queens 2008?
US Open 2010?
Madrid 2005?
Paris final 07?

TigerTim
09-22-2012, 08:47 PM
My mistake.


Although I don't see why people are talking about Nadal; He's won titles on fast courts. It's not like the guy is winning solely on one surface. If anyone is to blame of the state of tennis - it's the ATP.


You live in Bristol? Which part?

Redland :)

Allez
09-22-2012, 08:54 PM
Uncle Toni is very powerful.

BK 201
09-22-2012, 10:18 PM
Redland :)

You train at the LTA? Heard it's pretty good, as far as courts are concerned in Bristol, I pretty much play on concrete down Eastville......Lol.

TigerTim
09-22-2012, 10:27 PM
You train at the LTA? Heard it's pretty good, as far as courts are concerned in Bristol, I pretty much play on concrete down Eastville......Lol.

Train? I hack!!! I am a terrible weekend player :p

The court coverage of Bristol isn't brilliant, or the UK for that matter

You from rovers neck of the woods ?? :p

BK 201
09-22-2012, 10:33 PM
Train? I hack!!! I am a terrible weekend player :p

The court coverage of Bristol isn't brilliant, or the UK for that matter

You from rovers neck of the woods ?? :p

Yeah I live in Stapleton, but not a rovers fan, in fact, most of the rovers fans are only interested in getting into confrontations with the city crew.

TigerTim
09-22-2012, 10:34 PM
Yeah I live in Stapleton, but not a rovers fan, in fact, most of the rovers fans are only interested in getting into confrontations with the city crew.

Being rock bottom in league two the football is hardly fun to watch :lol:

Of course City are superior ;)

BK 201
09-22-2012, 10:51 PM
Being rock bottom in league two the football is hardly fun to watch :lol:

That bad huh.


Of course City are superior ;)

My lips are sealed.

Super Djoker
09-22-2012, 11:30 PM
Train? I hack!!! I am a terrible weekend player :p

The court coverage of Bristol isn't brilliant, or the UK for that matter

You from rovers neck of the woods ?? :p

In my county we have Acrylic , Carpet , Clay , Grass and indoor and outdoor hard courts !

TigerTim
09-22-2012, 11:37 PM
In my county we have Acrylic , Carpet , Clay , Grass and indoor and outdoor hard courts !

Nice! Where do you live?

detrance
09-24-2012, 07:38 AM
That's why :rolleyes: :
IK0CVxU1_yg

Chris Kuerten
09-24-2012, 09:00 AM
Never seen that video, thanks for posting :lol:

Frauderer and Tio Toni gave the finishing blow to the surface.

J99
09-24-2012, 09:03 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I know they still play on carpet.

Chris Kuerten
09-24-2012, 09:12 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I know they still play on carpet.Indeed, they still have tournaments on it at the Challenger and Future circuit.

Super Djoker
09-25-2012, 08:19 PM
Nice! Where do you live?

Shropshire . Lots of tennis facilities in and around the area there,s even a woman's £75.000 event played every year at Welti ! I the men's event was a Challenger but it was stopped in 2007 after only starting in 2006 . Really stupid !

philosophicalarf
09-25-2012, 08:39 PM
Indeed, they still have tournaments on it at the Challenger and Future circuit.

Even the challenger ones are disappearing :-( Just Wolfsburg, Kyoto, Eckental and Toyota left.

nole_no1
09-25-2012, 09:01 PM
excellent first replies

muster started moaning about fast carpet in 95(?). even sampras (yes, the same sampras who was a beast on fast courts) complained one end of year tournament/end of year masters that you couldn't see the ball properly

then federer and nadal complained that their games did not translate well to properly fast surfaces, and that was the fatal blow

lol. So what? Adjust it. The tour is not only about you.Cry-babies

stebs
09-25-2012, 09:07 PM
Train? I hack!!! I am a terrible weekend player :p

The court coverage of Bristol isn't brilliant, or the UK for that matter

There are enough courts - Cotham Park, Redland, BLTSC, even Coombe Dingle a little further away (I also live in Bristol) - all within minutes of Redland with a range of surfaces (clay, grass, diverse hard courts). It's not accessible for kids or reasonably priced, that's the problem in my opinion.

TigerTim
09-25-2012, 09:08 PM
There are enough courts - Cotham Park, Redland, BLTSC, even Coombe Dingle a little further away (I also live in Bristol) - all within minutes of Redland with a range of surfaces (clay, grass, diverse hard courts). It's not accessible for kids or reasonably priced, that's the problem in my opinion.

Fair point. I forgot about that! Yes, tennis is expensive.

Tag
09-26-2012, 01:26 AM
lol. So what? Adjust it. The tour is not only about you.Cry-babies

i agree

the pair have acted disgracefully at times

they're like the kray twins of tennis

August
11-08-2012, 02:51 PM
I was wondering this, would indoor carpet be a cheaper surface than indoor HC, especially on temporary indoor courts. Installing a HC just sounds more expensive than laying a carpet.

latso
11-08-2012, 03:08 PM
"easy to stain" is probably the funniest poll answer on MTF ever :lol:

Tag
11-08-2012, 05:26 PM
this topic disgusts me every time i read it

Influencerer :o

Greedal :o

latso
11-08-2012, 06:35 PM
this topic disgusts me every time i read it

Influencerer :o

Greedal :o
Who said what about Federer? Gulbis f.e. is much more concerned...

Paranoiac much? :rolleyes:

latso
11-08-2012, 07:32 PM
The tourney directors can't just decide. They need approval from ATP and they wouldn't get it for carpet at all (challengers maybe, but not above).

The main problem with carpet is the same as the general slowing down of the courts - cutting out the unappealing serve fests.

ATP knows that if every match is = to an actual Karlovic - Raonic indoors match, tennis will drop in interest big time.

They'd prefer the classical gladiators' encounters to the death almost (as Djokovic - Nadal AO final), which are more interesting to the general public.

That's all. Slow hard indoors is just this notch slower for the returners to have a chance and have a tennis match. Otherwise the majority of the shots in a match are services, which is honestly quite boring.

I believe Ivanisevic could be named "The killer of carpet". He has a great share for the slowing down process.

Dougie
11-08-2012, 07:58 PM
The tourney directors can't just decide. They need approval from ATP and they wouldn't get it for carpet at all (challengers maybe, but not above).

The main problem with carpet is the same as the general slowing down of the courts - cutting out the unappealing serve fests.

ATP knows that if every match is = to an actual Karlovic - Raonic indoors match, tennis will drop in interest big time.

They'd prefer the classical gladiators' encounters to the death almost (as Djokovic - Nadal AO final), which are more interesting to the general public.

That's all. Slow hard indoors is just this notch slower for the returners to have a chance and have a tennis match. Otherwise the majority of the shots in a match are services, which is honestly quite boring.

I believe Ivanisevic could be named "The killer of carpet". He has a great share for the slowing down process.

All good points. I remember watching matches like Sampras-Becker on indoor carpet when I was a kid, and while both were spectacular players, the matches were really not that interesting. Almost every rally was 1-3 shots. I know a lot of people have a kind of "romantic" idea of carpet courts and want them back, but I sure don´t miss them.
Having said that, the AO final between Nadal and Djokovic is just too much, the courts are so slow that no one even attacks the net anymore. That´s too much, tennis should not be primarily an endurance sport. Outdoor hard courts should be faster and should favor some attacking tennis, no doubt about it. But indoor tennis is much more interesting now than it was in the 90´s.

sylacauga
11-08-2012, 08:35 PM
Carpet holds tons of allergens like mold and dust mites. Combine that with tons of sweat produced by hot stinky athletes and I think the answer to this question is pretty obvious. Plus hardwoods are just more aesthetically pleasing IMO.

Orange Wombat
11-08-2012, 08:45 PM
There is talk in some Asian Challengers to replace hardcourts with authentic Tibetan rugs (see below).

http://gatewaytotibet.com/images/rugs/Tibetan%20Auspicious%20Sleeping%20Carpet.jpg

The surface is actually less expensive to maintain than grass, and the tournament organizers feel it brings about a spiritual feel.

Tag
11-08-2012, 10:11 PM
Who said what about Federer? Gulbis f.e. is much more concerned...

Paranoiac much? :rolleyes:

frauderer got carpet removed

didn't you know?

TigerTim
11-09-2012, 01:27 AM
Intresting. Those rugs look great :)

Roy Emerson
11-09-2012, 01:31 AM
federer and nadal complained that their games did not translate well to properly fast surfacesThis is only true about Nadal.

Tag
11-09-2012, 03:11 PM
This is only true about Nadal.

it's true about frauderer as well

he is on record as saying that slowed down surfaces have helped him win more titles

frauderer did not like carpet apart from in his earliest years

Sophocles
11-09-2012, 03:41 PM
Ankle injuries I think. But it is a huge shame. The serve-fests in the 1990s weren't always fun but in the 1970s & '80s there were superb matches on carpet featuring Laver, Rosewall, Connors, Borg, McEnroe, Lendl, et al. Now with strings helping the returner so much I suspect carpet matches would be more similar to the 1980s than the 1990s.

TennisOnWood
11-09-2012, 06:13 PM
Ankle injuries I think. But it is a huge shame. The serve-fests in the 1990s weren't always fun but in the 1970s & '80s there were superb matches on carpet featuring Laver, Rosewall, Connors, Borg, McEnroe, Lendl, et al. Now with strings helping the returner so much I suspect carpet matches would be more similar to the 1980s than the 1990s.

Good point about Carpet in the 80's.. good mix between attacking and baseline tennis

latso
11-09-2012, 08:18 PM
Ankle injuries I think. But it is a huge shame. The serve-fests in the 1990s weren't always fun but in the 1970s & '80s there were superb matches on carpet featuring Laver, Rosewall, Connors, Borg, McEnroe, Lendl, et al. Now with strings helping the returner so much I suspect carpet matches would be more similar to the 1980s than the 1990s.
I doubt so. String can only help if you reach the ball and with the speeds of serving this ain't happening most of the time.

It's already a nightmare to return against Raonic on slow hard and on carpet they all become Raonic.

End da Game
11-09-2012, 08:59 PM
is carpet actually faster than wimbly grass (pre-nadal slowness)

tnosugar
11-09-2012, 10:01 PM
i loved reading through this thread :)

TennisOnWood
11-09-2012, 10:06 PM
is carpet actually faster than wimbly grass (pre-nadal slowness)

Not all Carpet courts were ultra fast

Raiden
11-09-2012, 11:39 PM
Ankle injuries I think.That was the provided excuse.

But the reason was of course Tio Toni.

Sunset of Age
11-10-2012, 01:07 AM
As far as my memory serves me, it was BOTH Federer and Nadal who complained about the carpet surfaces citing lame injury excuses and who eventually managed to get rid of the most of it.
If I ever recall a moment of resenting them both, it was that one. :o

I don't think their complaints were Reason #1 for the ATP to abandon it, rather that the ATP found it pretty convenient that these two lobbied for what would turn out more homogenization of the court surfaces, something the ATP was already inclined to do.

Clay isn't a pusher surface - Mugray sucks on it after all.

:lol: :angel:

Honestly
11-10-2012, 01:11 AM
Uncle Mafiosi :o

Topspindoctor
11-10-2012, 01:14 AM
Carpet was too fast for Noserer. He was afraid to meet Nadal there.

TigerTim
11-10-2012, 01:18 AM
Pistol Mugpras cannot be excused. His deceitful removal of carpet from the WtF and terrible all serve game is as much to blame as any other.

Travod
11-10-2012, 01:30 AM
Can someone explain the surface?

When I see it mentioned I literally think of people playing on like a shag carpet.

Tag
11-10-2012, 02:52 AM
Pistol Mugpras cannot be excused. His deceitful removal of carpet from the WtF and terrible all serve game is as much to blame as any other.

oh, you :o

latso
11-10-2012, 10:32 AM
is carpet actually faster than wimbly grass (pre-nadal slowness)
No, grass was faster and the bounce was lower.

Carpet was faster than the old days' hard.

So there was Grass, indoors carpet, indoors hard, outdoors hard and the only slow surface was clay.

That's also why Emilio Sanchez doesn't have a singles slam and would have had a dozen otherwise.

duarte_a
11-10-2012, 10:44 AM
Thank god TPD is banned. Was tired of reading the "noserer" BS. Now we need noserer the user to get banned as well.

latso
11-10-2012, 11:26 AM
Thank god TPD is banned. Was tired of reading the "noserer" BS. Now we need noserer the user to get banned as well.
I can think of at least one more tbh..

Ilovetheblues_86
11-10-2012, 12:04 PM
IK0CVxU1_yg

9Wfgg3Tje3U

(for the guy that wanted to know how is carpet)

TigerTim
11-10-2012, 12:26 PM
No, grass was faster and the bounce was lower.

Carpet was faster than the old days' hard.

So there was Grass, indoors carpet, indoors hard, outdoors hard and the only slow surface was clay.

That's also why Emilio Sanchez doesn't have a singles slam and would have had a dozen otherwise.

There was a few slower hard courts. Aussie Open was always slower than USO, Miami Masters was always on the slow side, as were some of the Asian tourneys in the 90s

Tag
11-10-2012, 02:06 PM
Thank god TPD is banned. Was tired of reading the "noserer" BS. Now we need noserer the user to get banned as well.

no

the good Dr adds some variety to this place

There was a few slower hard courts. Aussie Open was always slower than USO, Miami Masters was always on the slow side, as were some of the Asian tourneys in the 90s

exactly. canada/montreal was never quick either

fast carpet courts were at the end of the year

paris, vienna, stockholm, stuttgart, hannover