Can Tsonga turn around his H2H with Djokovic? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Can Tsonga turn around his H2H with Djokovic?

Sanya
09-15-2012, 10:23 AM
After their quarter at AO-10 Jo leaded with five wins in seven matches between them, losing tough battle in GS final two years ago and one match in Miami. And after that - five losses in a row! For sure he had chances in some of them, but for me very demonstrative was that first set at Toronto-11 semi where Tsonga played on the top (or close) of his tennis and still lost 4-6. Assuredly all remember their meeting in Paris this year... I feel it can be one of the losses which make loser`s hand shake next few times, hard to swallow.

What do you think? Speaking about match-up issue for me it`s clear why Tsonga was/is uncomfortable rival for Nole who likes to crash opponents` second serve and construct rallies. Jo doesn`t give him time to adjust, lack of suitable temp for Djokovic.

Current situation - 7-5 in Nole`s favour. Can we see at least something like 10-10 between guys in a future?

TigerTim
09-15-2012, 10:27 AM
no. Djokovic is on a different level.

Federer in 2
09-15-2012, 10:32 AM
No. What TigerTim said.

redshift36188
09-15-2012, 11:05 AM
Even at the Olympics, tired Tsonga gave Nole a lot of problems in the 2nd set with the no rythm strategy, as you said. A couple of meetings in the indoor season should put the score back to even.


no. Djokovic is on a different level.
Consistency wise yes, but when they're both at their best, they are on the same level.

BroTree123
09-15-2012, 11:11 AM
No. Sadly he fucked up his chance in RG :o

EddieNero
09-15-2012, 11:21 AM
Probably not, I can't picture Tsonga beating Nole multiple times from now on, but he will always be a threat and very tough match-up for Djokovic who can cause him trouble when on.

Time Violation
09-15-2012, 11:30 AM
H2H shouldn't have been that close in the first place, Tsonga got several wins in a row in few months time/when Novak was shaky and then changed his racquet. Unless Tsonga is really in the zone and painting the lines consistently I don't see Novak losing much here.

Satasonic
09-15-2012, 11:35 AM
Nah, he wont. Tsonga regressed since his 2008 form and has only become worse. Sure, he does stand a chance against Djokovic, but will he actually take it? I dont think so.

Since Djokovic converted to his pushing self, there is no way a clown like Clownga can defeat him.

Gillouthe best
09-15-2012, 11:38 AM
Jo can't win vs Nole since 2010, right now I think Nole has become a bad matchup for Jo when it was the opposite in 2008-2009. I think their H2H will end at sthng like 11-6 for D'Joke.

Roy Emerson
09-15-2012, 12:44 PM
No.

Marcoo
09-15-2012, 01:00 PM
nope, they're on 2 different levels

Federer in 2
09-15-2012, 01:09 PM
Even at the Olympics, tired Tsonga gave Nole a lot of problems in the 2nd set with the no rythm strategy, as you said. A couple of meetings in the indoor season should put the score back to even.



Consistency wise yes, but when they're both at their best, they are on the same level.

No. Prime Djokovic would straight set prime Tsonga.

MaxPower
09-15-2012, 02:26 PM
Not on clay. And then I mean blue clay, purple clay and green clay too....

Saberq
09-15-2012, 02:54 PM
Even at the Olympics, tired Tsonga gave Nole a lot of problems in the 2nd set with the no rythm strategy, as you said. A couple of meetings in the indoor season should put the score back to even.



Consistency wise yes, but when they're both at their best, they are on the same level.

:haha:

Mark Lenders
09-15-2012, 03:33 PM
Don't think so. Tsonga can beat Novak for sure, but on an average he has too many weaknesses Novak can exploit.

Consistency wise yes, but when they're both at their best, they are on the same level.

Disagree. When they're both playing their absolute best tennis, Tsonga is clearly better. Tsonga's 'peak' days are basically the game that took him deep in Slams many times and as high as world #5 + the backhand and return as weapons instead of huge liabilities. There's very little you can do to stop him when he plays like that, as Federer and Nadal discovered on separate occasions.

I think Novak will win most of their matches because on most days he will be able to expose Jo's shit BH and ROS. He's definitely the much better player of the two. Tsonga is simply unpredictable, he can blow Novak (or anyone) off the court on any given day, but can also easily fold meekly. It's a matchup Novak won't relish at all because even though he knows he will win most times, if Tsonga happens to be on one of those rare days where his game is really clicking there's little he can do to stop him.

Cereal Killer
09-15-2012, 03:39 PM
Are you serious? It's weird how Tsonga is almost never at his best when playing top 4 players. The far more likely conclusion would be that those players are not at their best when Tsonga beats them. But maybe that's too far fetched.

Mark Lenders
09-15-2012, 03:56 PM
Are you serious? It's weird how Tsonga is almost never at his best when playing top 4 players. The far more likely conclusion would be that those players are not at their best when Tsonga beats them. But maybe that's too far fetched.

It's not weird at all. If Tsonga had the ability to always be at his best, he'd be in the top 4 himself. As it stands, on average Jo's game is full of holes those players can exploit, namely the worst BH and ROS in the top 10.

The only logical conclusion is that those player's average/normal level is far superior to Tsonga, which is not exactly controversial.

Tsonga is still a matchup neither of them relishes because he can simply blow them off the court on any given day. Performances like vs Nadal at AO 2008 or the last three sets vs Federer at Wimbledon are very rare - if they were the norm, Tsonga would be #1 - but when they do happen there's very little the opponent can do to stop him. On those (rare) days where you can't extract cheap errors off Jo's BH or get tons of free holds due to Jo's horrendous ROS, good luck beating him.

Cereal Killer
09-15-2012, 04:01 PM
Of course it's controversial. You underestimate the top 4 at their best. They could easily blow anyone off the court at any given day. Sadly, it is very rare to see two players play their very best Tennis in the same match.

Mark Lenders
09-15-2012, 04:12 PM
Of course it's controversial. You underestimate the top 4 at their best. They could easily blow anyone off the court at any given day. Sadly, it is very rare to see two players play their very best Tennis in the same match.

Federer yes. The other three, though, although great players, don't exactly win big matches by blowing anyone off the court, but on the basis of their consistency, fitness and defense, which to be fair are the most rewarded attributes in today's game/surfaces.

It's impossible to see two players play their very best tennis in the same match. By definition, if one players is playing his best tennis he's not allowing the other to play his.

Cereal Killer
09-15-2012, 04:17 PM
It has happened before. Maybe not necessarily in slams, but a few matches come to mind. Anyway, good for you that you have so much faith in your players. :)

Ben D.
09-15-2012, 04:55 PM
He was leading 5-2(!) and now Novak leads 7-5. It means something.
Tsonga can still win on occasions (FO 2012), but Djokovic will win arithmetically, like 3 to 1 during next years. Their career-end H2H should be like : Djokovic 16-8 Tsonga.

I think many Tsonga fans like Lenders try to find rational excuses for Tsongas repeated losses against top 4, this year most especially. Maybe there is only one reason : he is past his prime, and cant match them anymore. Look at Davydenko, Roddick, Nalbandian, who could think they were beating regularily top 4 few years ago :shrug:

cmoss
09-15-2012, 04:58 PM
Don't think so. Tsonga can beat Novak for sure, but on an average he has too many weaknesses Novak can exploit.



Disagree. When they're both playing their absolute best tennis, Tsonga is clearly better. Tsonga's 'peak' days are basically the game that took him deep in Slams many times and as high as world #5 + the backhand and return as weapons instead of huge liabilities. There's very little you can do to stop him when he plays like that, as Federer and Nadal discovered on separate occasions.

I think Novak will win most of their matches because on most days he will be able to expose Jo's shit BH and ROS. He's definitely the much better player of the two. Tsonga is simply unpredictable, he can blow Novak (or anyone) off the court on any given day, but can also easily fold meekly. It's a matchup Novak won't relish at all because even though he knows he will win most times, if Tsonga happens to be on one of those rare days where his game is really clicking there's little he can do to stop him.

Yes,when a hard hitter like Tsonga,Rosol... is really ON,he's almost unstoppable.

Legendary Lopata
09-15-2012, 05:19 PM
No. Tsonga' receive and 2nd service are horrible now. "New Djokovic" return is too good for Jo's 2nd service. Maybe, if Tso will serve >75% 1st he will has a chance. I guess, tsonga must rebuild his game, in 2012 he has too much troubles with movement speed.

Sanya
09-15-2012, 11:27 PM
Consistency wise yes, but when they're both at their best, they are on the same level.

They played both at their best at AO-08, Nole won, but it was close, yes. Still I have a feeling that despite Djokovic`s excellent form that match was on Tso`s racquet and lack of experience cost him a victory.

I miss that Jo, he never played again on that rate. :sad:

Topspindoctor
09-16-2012, 12:15 AM
Clownga is a mindless ballbashing mug with no RoS and backhand. It's a massive surprise he won as many matches against Djoker as he did.

Sunset of Age
09-16-2012, 12:23 AM
Yes he can. The true question is, will he be able to do it?
I still maintain - yes. Wait and see.

;)

HKz
09-16-2012, 12:57 AM
no. Djokovic is on a different level.

Not really, Tsonga has the game that Djokovic dislikes. Big server, can end points quickly and strong at the net. He should still be leading the H2H against Novak, but made some really poor decisions in some of their most recent matches, like that RG match. While Tsonga certainly could pick the H2H back up in his favor, but I think after several heartbreaks against Novak, it has become too mental for him now to perhaps overcome when it matters most.

Sanya
10-06-2012, 03:31 PM
If Tsonga is ever going to fulfil it, he should win tomorrow - relatively quick court, he wasn`t tested strongly, but due to it saved energy and on the great run right now.

abraxas21
10-06-2012, 03:42 PM
no

yuri27
10-06-2012, 03:45 PM
Of course it's controversial. You underestimate the top 4 at their best. They could easily blow anyone off the court at any given day. Sadly, it is very rare to see two players play their very best Tennis in the same match.

Murray for instance??
Murray at his very best is not unbeatable whereas players like Federer, Tsonga,Del Potro or even Djoker clearly are

pepita1964
10-06-2012, 04:31 PM
Thonga and Federer are very quality players but they are risky players.And Djokovic is not.AS you can see what happened to Djokovic when Federer is on his game.Of course at 31 Federer couldn't be on his game every single time. He has got to many things on his mind.

Murray Mint
10-06-2012, 04:38 PM
no. Djokovic is on a different level.
This.

Murray for instance??
Murray at his very best is not unbeatable whereas players like Federer, Tsonga,Del Potro or even Djoker clearly are
:lol: Get a grip, your boy Tsonga doesn't belong in such company, nor will he ever.

romismak
10-06-2012, 04:39 PM
Of course not, do we need voting for this? Tsonga was leading 5-2, because of where theier matches were played + Nole wasn´t at his best - also need to say since Tsonga is more consistent - solid top 10 guy it means they will play more often - that´s includes slower outdoor HC + clay where simply Nole is way better player, Tsonga´s only chances basically for close match are indoor HC, grass and fast outdoor HC and majority of tournaments are opposite - slow HC + clay. While Nole is clear favorite on slower surfaces , Tsonga can hope just for close matches at faster surfaces - even there he lost - for example Wimby lost, Olympics lost. Nole will end up their careers with highly positive H2H for sure.

Saberq
10-06-2012, 05:04 PM
Murray for instance??
Murray at his very best is not unbeatable whereas players like Federer, Tsonga,Del Potro or even Djoker clearly are

LOL I love how you said Tsonga,Del Potro and even Djoker

nick the greek
10-07-2012, 12:25 PM
No.

Sham Kay
10-07-2012, 01:04 PM
Tsonga has a mental block now, and will struggle to turn it around.

Give Djokovic the clear upper hand in a H2H and he's like a honey badger with a shotgun

nick the greek
10-07-2012, 01:06 PM
Tsonga has a mental block now, and will struggle to turn it around.

Give Djokovic the clear upper hand in a H2H and he's like a honey badger with a shotgun
Exactly.Hence 6 wins in a row.