Isnerīs best surface? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Isnerīs best surface?

romismak
03-15-2012, 11:49 AM
What do you think

Options: i separate HC, because they are many types

indoor HC:

advantages: indoor conditions perfect for guy like him, no distructions when he is serving or going for big FH, mostly faster surfaces
disadvantages: mostly lower bounce indoors, he is 2nd tallest guy so it is not good in rallies for him. Also indoors conditions can favour other guys with big serve, agressive tennis- Tsonga defeated him in Paris with the same weapons John can use

outdoor slow HC:

advantages: slow HC together with higher bounce generally means John has more time for his movement, return, deffense, ball is jumping to his striking zone.

disadvantages: his serve can be less effective when going for pace-raw speed, howewer his kick serve is jumping higher and is more effective. Also in rallies he canīt hit through opponents o easily and in rallies.

outdoor fast HC

advantages: his serve can get him more free points, his FH can dictate easily, can hit through opponents easily, quicker rallies on his own serve.

disadvantages: he has less time for setting up points in rallies, less time for his movement and deffense. Other guys can benefit more from their own serves and can dictate in rallies easier after their own serves.

clay

advantages: has enough time for setting up points, high bounce - ball is jumping to his striking zone, enough time for movement, deffense, his footwork on clay is getting better
disadvantages: can be forced to long rallies, make more errors, because game is slower and other guys can get more balls back than he is used to, also his serve is less effective

grass

advantages: his serve can be very effective, if he dominates rallies, can hit more winners in rallies than usually. Can play at the net, use more volleys.

disadvantages: lower bounce can trouble him in rallies, also his ROS is worse on grass than on other surfaces. Slice can bother him, both on serve and on groundstrokes.

Sonja1989
03-15-2012, 12:10 PM
Outdoor hard. I think indoor isn't that good, he needs to play too lot of tie-breaks. He isn't a grass court player neither and well.. he was good against Federer on clay but that was indoor. :p I think outdoor clay isn't that good for him.

Chase Visa
03-15-2012, 12:21 PM
Outdoor fast.

EliSter
03-15-2012, 12:22 PM
Clay obviously.

Nixer
03-15-2012, 12:29 PM
clay

DJ Soup
03-15-2012, 12:34 PM
clay

cmoss
03-15-2012, 12:51 PM
Clay of course.Highest bouncing,slide easily.

Surfaces at the IW are slow,but not as high bouce as clay.He also can't slide here.

Agrajag
03-15-2012, 01:02 PM
Outdoor slow HC.

BroTree123
03-15-2012, 01:30 PM
He's a mixed bag IMO.

reery
03-15-2012, 02:18 PM
Isner to reach RG final this year. :lol:

cmoss
03-15-2012, 02:47 PM
Isner to reach RG final this year. :lol:

Nothing is impossible...:rolleyes:

Sonja1989
03-15-2012, 02:52 PM
You will be surprised, I don't count on Isner on outdoor clay. Maybe indoor, sadly there are indoor clay in Davis Cup only. :rolleyes: Maybe Madrid isn't that terrible.

Sham Kay
03-15-2012, 02:57 PM
Taking Nadal to 5 at FO is proof enough for the American clay courter.

Sonja1989
03-15-2012, 02:59 PM
Taking Nadal to 5 at FO is proof enough for the American clay courter.

Yeah but.. look the rest of the clay season.. Lost to Chela twice very easily, 4-6, 1-6 and 1-6, 6-7. Lost to Mello in two, Stakovsky in three and beaten Lindell and Fish, it's his last clay season. Plus Houston, beaten Zeballos but lost to Karlovic.

cmoss
03-15-2012, 03:11 PM
Last year he lost in 1st round at Delray Beach,and lost in 2nd round at IW.

Just wait until the end of this season.

Start da Game
03-15-2012, 04:04 PM
a high bouncing hardcourt, doesn't really natter fast or slow.....

Sauletekis
03-15-2012, 06:30 PM
Basketball pitch...

Henry Chinaski
03-15-2012, 09:39 PM
totally hilarious so many people saying clay

Dougie
03-15-2012, 09:50 PM
His best shot is his serve, he is a tall guy with a limited movement, doesnīt hit his groundstrokes with a lot of spin and, consequently, makes a lot of errors and canīt play long rallies. Now why on earth would clay be his best surface is beyond me...

_Chaz
03-15-2012, 09:52 PM
totally hilarious so many people saying clay

+1
And this comes from an Isner fan here.
I think you are all a bit overrating his clay form because of two kind of "fluke" matches, because:

1. def. Federer in 4 -> this match was played firstly on an altitude of about 600 metres (like Madrid and Munich) plus it was indoors which makes the court even faster and you also know how it goes with freshly laid indoor clay courts for DC ties, they are all fast and have lots of bad bounces. Indeed Isner played the match on his life because the conditions suited him but it's not that the clay was the big factor here

2. lost to Nadal in 5 -> Roland Garros also plays almost like a HC plus Rafa was utterly unconfident at that time and Isner played great of course, but he does this most of the time when he meets a top gun in a top tournament (he also played quite well against Murray @USO last year I think)

It's very hard to find the best surface for Isner. I think it depends on his opponent. If he plays a rather weak server with better return game he will want to play indoors because he's almost unbreakable there and can go for his return and hope for return winners. But when his opponent's skills are the other way round, then he would want to play on a slow Hardcourt of course (but not on clay, look at his clay results bar the matches against Rafa and Roger and the Nole one which I forgot, but he was also slumping big during that time).

In the end, if I have to name a particular surface, I will say Indian Wells Hardcourts because
the dry desert air makes the ball fly more which is good for his serve and big baseline hitting
the bounce is very very high so the balls bounce onto his hitting zone
the bounce is slow so he has enough time to set up his shots and especially the return.

LastRocket
03-15-2012, 10:37 PM
Any surface.

Mongoose
03-16-2012, 12:03 AM
Grass is by far the worst and indoor hard is by far his second worst

expected overreaction to Isner's win over Federer. He is very good on clay but by no means amazing.

Outdoor hard is by far is best, and I would give a small to medium-sized edge on fast over slow.

hope this helps.

Mongoose
03-16-2012, 12:04 AM
Any surface.

nope, EVERY surface :worship:

Roddickominator
03-16-2012, 12:41 AM
It isn't crazy to say clay. His return is a million times better on the slower, high bouncing courts....while his serve can still blow people away and he hits big enough that he can still hit through guys pretty decently. He just can't have an off-serving day at all.

Sham Kay
03-16-2012, 12:46 AM
The guy has a 19/21 career clay record. Doubt many are being serious about it, though he isn't as bad as most Americans are on it. But it's his grass record that's pretty funny looking. Only won 2 matches on the stuff till 2011.

Sapeod
03-16-2012, 07:06 PM
Hardcourt, obviously.

green25814
03-16-2012, 07:26 PM
I dont think the surface makes much difference to his game. Only thing is he likes high bouncing balls and hates low bounce.

philosophicalarf
03-17-2012, 12:33 AM
Isner has two masters semis: Indian Wells and Paris last year. Both are medium/slow, high bounce.

Or earlier, he has made a masters R3 eight times, seven of those are medium/slow courts, one is clay (4*IW, 2*Miami, 1*Paris, 1*Madrid)

The fast courts of Cincy, he's never made it past the second round. Montreal last year was fast, he lost R2 to Troicki.


Anything he gains on serve from making the court faster, he loses....

1) in the rally to anyone with aggressive ability
2) vs anyone who hits flat, it stays below his strike zone on the forehand.
3) his poor return game becomes a massive problem - see Wimbledon vs Almagro or Mahut, he can't break for crap.

romismak
03-17-2012, 10:09 PM
It seems like IW is really great court for him - slow HC, has the time for his movement and unleash that monster FH and his flat bombs are effective anywhere but his kick serve is here monstrous.

_Chaz
03-17-2012, 10:15 PM
In the end, if I have to name a particular surface, I will say Indian Wells Hardcourts because
the dry desert air makes the ball fly more which is good for his serve and big baseline hitting
the bounce is very very high so the balls bounce onto his hitting zone
the bounce is slow so he has enough time to set up his shots and especially the return.

Today confirms my opinion I think :wavey:

blackwell
03-17-2012, 10:21 PM
Of course, outdoor slow HC

Start da Game
03-17-2012, 10:25 PM
Of course, outdoor slow HC

slow or fast doesn't matter that much for lanky big servers.....a big serve is a big serve on any surface.....it's the bounce which makes the difference.....higher bounce would enable these tall players to engage themselves in rallies and have a crack at the opponent's serve......

DrJules
03-17-2012, 10:28 PM
+1
And this comes from an Isner fan here.
I think you are all a bit overrating his clay form because of two kind of "fluke" matches, because:

1. def. Federer in 4 -> this match was played firstly on an altitude of about 600 metres (like Madrid and Munich) plus it was indoors which makes the court even faster and you also know how it goes with freshly laid indoor clay courts for DC ties, they are all fast and have lots of bad bounces. Indeed Isner played the match on his life because the conditions suited him but it's not that the clay was the big factor here

2. lost to Nadal in 5 -> Roland Garros also plays almost like a HC plus Rafa was utterly unconfident at that time and Isner played great of course, but he does this most of the time when he meets a top gun in a top tournament (he also played quite well against Murray @USO last year I think)

It's very hard to find the best surface for Isner. I think it depends on his opponent. If he plays a rather weak server with better return game he will want to play indoors because he's almost unbreakable there and can go for his return and hope for return winners. But when his opponent's skills are the other way round, then he would want to play on a slow Hardcourt of course (but not on clay, look at his clay results bar the matches against Rafa and Roger and the Nole on which I forgot, but he was also slumping big during that time).

In the end, if I have to name a particular surface, I will say Indian Wells Hardcourts because
the dry desert air makes the ball fly more which is good for his serve and big baseline hitting
the bounce is very very high so the balls bounce onto his hitting zone
the bounce is slow so he has enough time to set up his shots and especially the return.

5 sets with Djokovic on a clay court in Serbia during a Davis Cup encounter.

Johnny Iznrr
03-17-2012, 10:36 PM
Slowing down all the courts has created all sorts of weird conditions. Soderling being the best on indoor hard but making 2 RG finals (and no other clay results of consequence), Del Potro having his best results at the USO and the FO, Isner having great clay matches but poor results over his career, etc

Courts are way too slow nowadays for aggressive players to survive on the fast court season, the only possible chance for aggressive players is to be so powerful they can hit through anybody. For Isner, USO is his best slam because it's in the USA and it has the final set TB rather than the surface.

DrJules
03-17-2012, 10:40 PM
The guy has a 19/21 career clay record. Doubt many are being serious about it, though he isn't as bad as most Americans are on it. But it's his grass record that's pretty funny looking. Only won 2 matches on the stuff till 2011.

Certainly would expect his best results on hard courts.

Bounce too low on grass courts for his height and clay at times too slow.

_Chaz
03-17-2012, 10:51 PM
5 sets with Djokovic on a clay court in Serbia during a Davis Cup encounter.

Oh yeah, I know. I expressed it wrong, firstly I meant the Nole 'one' and not on and forgot because I didn't list it on the clay matches above. But yes, my mistake, sorry for that. Still remember it when I watched that match. From then on practically I was his fan.

romismak
04-08-2012, 06:41 PM
So after next tie against France who do you think about clay as his best surface? I believe still outdoor HC-both slow and fast are better for his game.

Start da Game
04-08-2012, 06:53 PM
it is still outdoor slow hardcourt.....

Clay Death
04-08-2012, 07:12 PM
how will dr isner (3.0 version) do on grass this year?

romismak
04-08-2012, 07:19 PM
how will dr isner (3.0 version) do on grass this year?

I donīt see him do nothing signifficat on Wimbledon or olympics. Grass is and will be his worst surface. too low bounce, too fast game for big guy with his movement. LAst year during Wimbledon he wasnīt at his best but still Almagro-who is probaly also worst on grass just beat him in tie-breaks. Tsonga would love to play this Isner on grass.

Coolio_Jack
04-08-2012, 07:23 PM
I donīt see him do nothing signifficat on Wimbledon or olympics. Grass is and will be his worst surface. too low bounce, too fast game for big guy with his movement. LAst year during Wimbledon he wasnīt at his best but still Almagro-who is probaly also worst on grass just beat him in tie-breaks. Tsonga would love to play this Isner on grass.

Isner has proven that he's consistantly working on improving himself, and is adaptable. So, i wouldnt count him off from anything.

Freak3yman84
04-08-2012, 07:28 PM
This answer is simple...
Hard- 110-65 .629
Clay- 17-21 .447
Grass- 8-7 .533
Indoor- 22-17 .564
Outdoor 113-76 .598
And it seems like he does better on slow courts so outdoor slow courts =D.

romismak
04-08-2012, 08:41 PM
Isner has proven that he's consistantly working on improving himself, and is adaptable. So, i wouldnt count him off from anything.

No he wonīt adapt to grass, his serve is to heavy-spin, his height is to much, everyone who can play slice and fast tennis can outplay him in rallies and his ROS on grass is much much worse than on slow HC or clay where he has more reaction time. - He is opposite to Karlovic, Karlovic with huge serve can benefit from grass, his BH is always sliced- Ivo canīt play otherway:D but the point is Karlovic with his height also can use net and his style suits to grass, while Isner is more baseliner, much more spin on his shots.

Acutally RAonic can be good on grass, his height isnīt such liability- he is tall like Berdych, also he has good slice serve.

Allez
04-10-2012, 08:09 PM
He is becoming a serious threat on clay. The high bounce doesn't trouble him and he has all the time in the world to saunter around the court. Who'd have thought it :eek:

Mongoose
04-10-2012, 08:19 PM
one weekend does not a career make. The obvious answer is still outdoor hard courts.

Is he a force on clay? Yes. But keep in mind that one of the reasons why Isner wins so much on clay is because almost everyone else on tour outside of Spain and South America is absolutely pathetic on it.

V.H.
04-10-2012, 08:52 PM
Clay, although I find it somewhat strange

tommyg6
04-10-2012, 09:01 PM
Isner reminds me of Soderking. Big forehand and win games by outbashing the ball against everyone. Maybe Big John will make a run to the final and take out one of the big 4.

Roddickominator
04-10-2012, 11:56 PM
one weekend does not a career make. The obvious answer is still outdoor hard courts.

Is he a force on clay? Yes. But keep in mind that one of the reasons why Isner wins so much on clay is because almost everyone else on tour outside of Spain and South America is absolutely pathetic on it.

It isn't "one weekend"....he has shown over the past year to be competitive against even the very top players in the world on clay. He needs to back it up with some real results in some clay Masters and RG, because there really is no excuse for losing to some mug when he can beat Djokovic and challenge Nadal on clay.

Like I said....it isn't crazy to say that clay could be his best surface. But we have a long year ahead of us....we have never seen this version of Isner before and he is playing better on every surface than he has before.