Better Career: Safin vs Rafter vs Kafelnikov [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Better Career: Safin vs Rafter vs Kafelnikov

stzenit
08-14-2009, 12:28 PM
So this thread(sorry if it has been discussed before) is comparing two of the best Russian Male tennis players ever. As Marat Safin's father said

"Yevgeny Kafelnikov is the last product of the soviet organization of sport, Marat is the first tennis champion of a modern liberal Russia..."
Mikhail Safin (Marat's dad)

Who will you remember more? Here is a career comparison.

Kafelnikov


Singles
Career Titles (26)
Grand Slam (2)+1 Runner Up
Olympic Gold (1)
ATP Championship Series (4)
ATP Tour (19)
Davis Cup(1)
Former World Number 1 in Singles
6th All-time leader in earnings

Doubles
Career Titles(27)
Grand Slam (4)+1 Runner Up
ATP Masters Series (7)
ATP Championship Series (6)
ATP Tour (10)
Former World Number 4 in Doubles


_____________

Safin

Career Titles(15)
Grand Slam tournaments (2)+2 Runner Up
ATP Masters Series /
ATP World Tour Masters 1000 (5)
ATP International Series Gold /
ATP World Tour 500 Series (1)
ATP International Series /
ATP World Tour 250 Series (7)
Davis Cup(2)
Former World Number 1

Pat Rafter:
2 Majors (USO '97, '98)
2 Major Finals (Wimby '00, '01)
1 Week at #1
11 Career Titles


Not really judging on Careers as on paper its obvious Kafelnikov had the better career eventhough both were good. Who will you remember more as a Tennis player/Personality/Professional

bokehlicious
08-14-2009, 12:29 PM
Kafel all the way :cool:

rocketassist
08-14-2009, 12:33 PM
Kafelnikov has the better career on paper but Safin was always more of a personality.

Yevgeny is class but he had a personality like the PMK (hence his nickname) so he wouldn't be as fondly remembered.

Kolya
08-14-2009, 12:47 PM
Most people on MTF will say Safin as he is younger.

Kafelnikov for me though.

Burrow
08-14-2009, 01:29 PM
Kafelnikov, definitely.

Safin is hated on this internet forum but in reality he is loved. :)

bokehlicious
08-14-2009, 01:51 PM
Safin is hated on this internet forum

:baby: :rolleyes: half of MTF girls are in love with the guy... :o :)

Bilbo
08-14-2009, 02:00 PM
Kafelnikov for sure

opeth84
08-14-2009, 02:07 PM
Kafelnikov but i have enjoyed watching both players alot.

Burrow
08-14-2009, 02:14 PM
:baby: :rolleyes: half of MTF girls are in love with the guy... :o :)

Guys want to be him and girls want to be with him.

I've heard so many people say that.

Everybody just thinks Marat is god and rightly so. :bowdown:

madmax
08-14-2009, 02:31 PM
Kafelnikov was a joy to watch when he was on - his baseline pure striking was one of the best of all time. He was my favorite player of the 90's, so my vote goes for him:worship:

Goldenoldie
08-14-2009, 02:57 PM
Kafelnikov is the clear winner in the "Can you spell my name right?" category among slam winners. And a good player as well!

vamosinator
08-14-2009, 03:03 PM
Safin because he was on my television set more recent.

Henry Chinaski
08-14-2009, 03:08 PM
safin of course. he's played in an era where I've had access to live tennis outside queens/wimbledon.

can't remember having watched many specific kafelnikov matches live

McAlistar
08-14-2009, 03:13 PM
Safin because of his personality and natural talent..

Andre♥
08-14-2009, 03:16 PM
Kafelnikov had by far the better career (and was the better player also), but Safin will be more remembered due to his looks and personality...

vamosinator
08-14-2009, 03:18 PM
I know Kafelnikov won the Australian Open and Roland Garros but the matches I remember most of Kafelnikov was an Australian Open match in which he wore yellow sneakers and played Michael Chang, I think Chang won. And the 1999 US Open semi-final whereby he was beaten by Andre Agassi and also the 2000 Australian Open Final when Agassi also defeated him.

Burrow
08-14-2009, 03:22 PM
Kafelnikov had by far the better career (and was the better player also), but Safin will be more remembered due to his looks and personality...

Kafelnikov didn't get injured aged 22 and 25 with serious injuries :lol:

Marat has natural talent, unbelievably fluid :bowdown: :worship:

Safin will always be remembered as a total Maverick, he's a legend :worship::D:D:D:D:D

Everko
08-14-2009, 03:32 PM
I will forget both in 5 years because niether made an impact on the game. I have already forgototen Kafelnikov mostly.

Bad Religion
08-14-2009, 08:05 PM
Kafelnikov head and shoulders over Safin

Plus , Kafelnikov has no an annoying sister with an ugly tennis and face. That helps

ad-out
08-14-2009, 08:50 PM
Guys want to be him and girls want to be with him.

I've heard so many people say that.

Everybody just thinks Marat is god and rightly so. :bowdown:

+1.

Marat may not have won as many titles but he will definitely be remembered more.

ys
08-14-2009, 09:19 PM
I remember, at the end of year 2000 when youthful and energetic Marat Safin had a glorious season, and Yevgeny was starting to fade, Yevgeny was asked a similar question.. who will be more remembered, who will be the greatest Russian player, him or Marat.. And the answer was .. "I'll always be"

Somehow , knowing Marat very well close and personal he knew very well already back then that Marat is not going to eclipse his career.

ad-out
08-14-2009, 10:17 PM
I don't think Marat eclipsed Yevgeny's career. I just think that Marat's persona is greater and he will be remembered more because of it. ;)

Burrow
08-14-2009, 11:08 PM
Marat won everything he has before 25. Kafelnikov had the luxury of playing injury free until he wanted to.

Marat has beaten the two greatest players of all time on the biggest stages.

Marat :bowdown:

It's just a tad obvious that Marat will be remembered more.

Ichiban1920
08-14-2009, 11:14 PM
I'm a Kafelnikov fan, but Marat was way more talented than Kafelnikov. Easily Marat.

ChinoRios4Ever
08-15-2009, 12:53 AM
Dr. K. what a legend :worship:

90's men tennis :D :rocker2:

abraxas21
08-15-2009, 01:20 AM
Marat has beaten the two greatest players of all time on the biggest stages.

nadal and federer?

leng jai
08-15-2009, 01:41 AM
Safin obviously.

jcempire
08-15-2009, 04:05 AM
Kafelnikov
100000000000000%

If Safin in Kafe's 1990s' that he couldn't win 2GS

stzenit
08-15-2009, 05:17 AM
nadal and federer?

I think he means Sampras and Federer.

Anyway responding to my question I always supported these two more then any other tennis player but i think following Safin since 1998 sort of made me like him more then Kafelnikov. If it wasn't for Safin's 2 serious injuries which he managed to still come back from i think he would have won more Singles wise then Kafelnikov. What seperated them was Kafelnikov treated tennis like a Job, Safin treated it(For most of his career) like a hobby. But Safin's 2 Grand Slam wins were more special then Kafelnikov's.

Argenbrit
08-15-2009, 05:30 AM
Safin. His hotness will be remembered. :drool:

jcempire
08-15-2009, 05:39 AM
I think he means Sampras and Federer.

Anyway responding to my question I always supported these two more then any other tennis player but i think following Safin since 1998 sort of made me like him more then Kafelnikov. If it wasn't for Safin's 2 serious injuries which he managed to still come back from i think he would have won more Singles wise then Kafelnikov. What seperated them was Kafelnikov treated tennis like a Job, Safin treated it(For most of his career) like a hobby. But Safin's 2 Grand Slam wins were more special then Kafelnikov's.

Safin's 2 Grand Slam because Andre and Pete got older

Leo
08-15-2009, 05:44 AM
Kafelnikov.

ys
08-15-2009, 01:36 PM
In terms of world tennis, neither will be remembered. Who really remembers those 2 Slam winners, Bruguera is nearly forgotten, Rafter.. Well, many of us nearly forgot that Hewitt exists, and he is still playing..
In Russia, it's Kafelnikov, cause of Olympic gold. That will make him remembered for a long time.
At the same time you have to admit that Kafelnikov played snake-in-grass winning his 2 Slams, both times it was, by and large, accidental. Safin won his 2 Grand Slams from a position of brutal force, and should have won more..

stebs
08-15-2009, 02:17 PM
Safin most probably. Definately he has been one of tennis most interesting and watchable players throughout his career. I don't think the same can really be said for Kafelnikov. He was a very strong player for sure but not the type to create a buzz like Safin can.

thegreendestiny
08-15-2009, 02:25 PM
Kafelnikov. He will always be regarded as THE REAL pioneer of the Russian Revolution (both men and women). Ask any Russian player and they would easily regard him as a legend.

tea
08-15-2009, 02:57 PM
Both will be forgotten in no time.:zzz: Fangirls, perhaps, will remember Safin a bit longer.
Rafa fangirls may probably remember Kafel' more, 'cause he's a fan of Nadal.

alfonsojose
08-15-2009, 03:09 PM
Yevgeny :hearts: :drool: :tears: My favorite before Rainer

oranges
08-15-2009, 03:11 PM
Safin is unforgettable

Nadie
08-15-2009, 08:29 PM
Kafelnikov, of course :hatoff:

roberthenman
08-15-2009, 10:02 PM
so far Kafelnikov

Marc23
08-16-2009, 08:22 AM
Safin!

ballbasher101
08-16-2009, 09:10 AM
Safin due to the fact that he is mental and has anger management issues. His fans are also a bit on the crazy side. One fan in particular comes to mind, his username starts with a B and ends with a W. I think we all know who he is ;).

GlennMirnyi
08-16-2009, 09:20 AM
I'll remember Safin more, especially because I watched him play more.

tennisvideos
08-16-2009, 09:25 AM
Safin because he also has a temper so even if they don't remember all of his results he will always be remembered for smashing rackets etc. I will always remember him as he is one of my favourites :)

drf716
08-16-2009, 09:41 AM
in terms of beginning and end, kafelnikov made me love tennis. safin with his retirement makes me want to stop following it.

joplin
09-24-2010, 04:33 PM
who was better?

gulzhan
09-24-2010, 04:37 PM
I just thought about finding a thread about Safin just to say--

I miss Marat SO MUCH! He retired early :sigh:

Oh, the question-- Marat is a bigger figure in Russian tennis imo.

aloniv
09-24-2010, 04:51 PM
Safin defeated Federer, Sampras, Hewitt, Martin, Kiefer, Ferrero and a young Djokovic to win his two slams, while Kafelnikov defeated Sampras (on clay), Enqvist, Stich, Courier (who was then #77 in the world), Krajicek (before Krajicek won Wimbledon), Martin and Haas to win his two. So on paper, it seems that Safin's slams are better.

tennishero
09-24-2010, 05:03 PM
Safin defeated Federer, Sampras, Hewitt, Martin, Kiefer, Ferrero and a young Djokovic to win his two slams, while Kafelnikov defeated Sampras (on clay), Enqvist, Stich, Courier (who was then #77 in the world), Krajicek (before Krajicek won Wimbledon), Martin and Haas to win his two. So on paper, it seems that Safin's slams are better.

i can also say

sampras was half retired
ferrero is good on clay
kiefer and martin?
djokovic was too young

:)

Johnny Groove
09-24-2010, 05:08 PM
Safin's 2002 AO player's box with the 3 blonde bimbos.

Bad Religion
09-24-2010, 05:08 PM
2 Slams + Olympic Gold Medal + 600 matches won
Kafelnikov by far

oranges
09-24-2010, 05:25 PM
sampras was half retired


:spit: Yet, he won Wimbledon just a few months before.

asmazif
09-24-2010, 05:40 PM
good comparison.

Start da Game
09-24-2010, 05:52 PM
kafelnikov, definitely.......

TennisOnWood
09-24-2010, 06:09 PM
2 Slams + Olympic Gold Medal + 600 matches won
Kafelnikov by far

No doubt about this

madmax
09-24-2010, 06:10 PM
Zhenya is my all time favorite male tennis player - the ballstriking talent that he showcased was a pure joy to watch. He was kinda a bit weak mentally, thus only winning 2 slams in his career. As for Safin, I like him too, just not as much as I enjoyed Zhenya's game:bowdown:

MariaV
09-24-2010, 06:27 PM
Well, hard to say and does it really matter? They are both very respected figures in Russia. Kafelnikov is an olympic champion of course but the stats are just one aspect. They won the first Davis Cup for Russia together, that was Zhenya's dream and Marat helped him to make it true. :)

Norrage
09-24-2010, 06:31 PM
Kafelnikov surely. He has won way more titles than Safin (26 to 15!!) and some good ones too. Besides, even if they would match eachother in singles Kafelnikov's awesome doubles record will give him the edge! He actually play doubles at all grand slams too! And won a few! :)

gulzhan
09-24-2010, 06:32 PM
I love Kafelnikov and respect him. Still, Marat is so special, I think even Zhenya himself would agree Marat wins this poll :lol:

MariaV
09-24-2010, 06:47 PM
I love Kafelnikov and respect him. Still, Marat is so special, I think even Zhenya himself would agree Marat wins this poll :lol:

:lol: Marat used to win every poll on MTF. :awww: :lol:

Purple Rainbow
09-24-2010, 07:03 PM
Kafelnikov wins this one on consistency and doubles results.
However, on peak form, Safin was better than peak Kafelnikov. Much better, in fact. Unfortunately we seldom got to see this side of Marat.

Puschkin
09-24-2010, 07:14 PM
Hard to say. Both were among my favourites at their time. Marat on charisma, though.

Filo V.
09-24-2010, 11:37 PM
This is tough to answer, because there are many different factors that both have an advantage in. So to answer this question you have to sort of section it and take everything into account.

I'll say Kafelnikov.

Kolya
09-25-2010, 01:40 AM
Kafelnikov, last man to win both the singles and doubles of a GS tournament.

aloniv
09-25-2010, 01:59 AM
Kafelnikov was quite lucky to win two slams, as Sampras didn't compete in the Australian Open and Muster failed to reach the finals at the French.

Topspindoctor
09-25-2010, 02:44 AM
Kafelnikov. Mugrat Safin is overrated as hell.

leng jai
09-25-2010, 03:33 AM
Kafelnikov beat Haas in the Olympic gold medal match so the answer is easy.

The Magician
09-25-2010, 03:38 AM
Kafelnikov. Mugrat Safin is overrated as hell.

Stick to Nadull threads please, your stupidity is showing :wavey:

As for the OP question, it's a pretty good comparison but I have to say Marat. Safin made the SF of all 4 slams, made 4 GS finals winning 2 (vs 3 finals winning 2) and won 5 MS events when they were actually difficult to win (vs 0). Olympics is a meaningless accomplishment in tennis, anyone with a basic knowledge of the game's history can tell you that.

Topspindoctor
09-25-2010, 03:44 AM
Stick to Nadull threads please, your stupidity is showing :wavey:

As for the OP question, it's a pretty good comparison but I have to say Marat. Safin made the SF of all 4 slams, made 4 GS finals winning 2 (vs 3 finals winning 2) and won 5 MS events when they were actually difficult to win (vs 0). Olympics is a meaningless accomplishment in tennis, anyone with a basic knowledge of the game's history can tell you that.

Kafelnikov won RG and bageled Clownprass in the process. Those 2 things alone make it better than entire Mugrat's career :wavey:

The Magician
09-25-2010, 03:52 AM
Kafelnikov won RG and bageled Clownprass in the process. Those 2 things alone make it better than entire Mugrat's career :wavey:

You think beating Sampras at RG is superior to beating him at the USO? Also superior to beating peak Fed in possibly the greatest match of all time? Wow :retard:

emotion
09-25-2010, 04:07 AM
Sigh...... bias is biased.

I like Safin better, but Kafelnikov. Pretty easy.

nadal_slam_king
09-25-2010, 05:07 AM
http://69.img.v4.skyrock.net/699/safinete/pics/200305607_small.jpg
http://81.img.v4.skyrock.com/81a/zoe001tennis/pics/199233341_small.jpg

Haelfix
09-25-2010, 06:40 AM
In terms of results, Kafelnikov or its a draw. In terms of who was a greater player, Safin by a country mile.

Kafelnikov was massively overrated.

joplin
09-25-2010, 08:08 AM
I dont know, but seems to me Kafelnikov had one of the best groundstrokes in the game ever, he was far superior than Safin on clay. Safin was lucky to win that 2005 AO, as for that 2000 US Open - it wasn´t the only time Sampras was toyed with in that tournament (Hewitt)
plus Federer was Kafelnikov´s biatch for a while
Safin was much more in the spotlight so that makes him more overrated

Boris Franz Ecker
09-25-2010, 09:03 AM
Safin was more talented.
Kafelnikov had the better career

leng jai
09-25-2010, 09:22 AM
I dont know, but seems to me Kafelnikov had one of the best groundstrokes in the game ever, he was far superior than Safin on clay. Safin was lucky to win that 2005 AO, as for that 2000 US Open - it wasn´t the only time Sampras was toyed with in that tournament (Hewitt)
plus Federer was Kafelnikov´s biatch for a while
Safin was much more in the spotlight so that makes him more overrated

Yes defeating Federer in 5 sets in the SF and a prime Hewitt in his home slam is clearly a fluke.

AnnaK_4ever
09-25-2010, 12:16 PM
2 GS W + 2 GS RU > 2 GS W + 1 GS RU
5 AMS >>>> 1 Gold medal
13-11 vs top-10 at GS >>>>>>>>> 4-12 vs top-10 at GS

tommyg6
11-17-2011, 10:38 PM
Discuss.

http://www.cadenaser.com/recorte/20091111csrcsrdep_15/XLCO/Ies/Marat-Safin-durante-ultimo-partido-tenista-profesional.jpg
Safin: won 2 grand slams - 2000 US Open and 2005 Australian Open, won Davis Cup 2002 and 2006, won 15 career titles, formerly ranked no.1 in the world, has 421-266 career singles record, has 14 million in career earnings.
http://www.toptenfiles.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/Yevgeny-Kafelnikov.jpg
Kafelnikov: won 2 grand slams - 1996 French Open and 1999 Australian Open, 2000 Olympic Gold Medalist in singles, won 2002 Davis Cup, won 26 career titles, formely ranked no.1 in the world, has a 609-366 singles career record, has 23.8 million in career earnings.

leng jai
11-17-2011, 10:58 PM
Theres no right answer, extremely close. Kafelnikov had better overall results but Safin is close besides titles won and has more memorable "big matches".

@Sweet Cleopatra
11-17-2011, 11:00 PM
Kafelnikov

SetSampras
11-17-2011, 11:14 PM
Kafelnikov for sure if you factor in the doubles

Corey Feldman
11-17-2011, 11:16 PM
Safin was the better player than that fat ungrateful pig Kafelnikov

fast_clay
11-17-2011, 11:16 PM
Theres no right answer, extremely close. Kafelnikov had better overall results but Safin is close besides titles won and has more memorable "big matches".

that's pretty much how i'd put it too...

in the black and white versions of success, Kafelnikov edges it because of matches, titles, prizemoney (significant doubles player) and durability... 2-2 head2head also says it's very close...

and it wasn't that kafelnikov's game wasn't aesthetically pleasing... i found his ball striking while hugging the baseline phenomenal... but safin's back court ON GAME was simply peerless, unplayable - powerful, deliberate and built to dominate... both players, when feeling below average were dire to watch at times... dire for me at least, because it was easy to see both of there games could have dominated the tour if they could have just mentally broken their own code that bound them in the same way federer managed to break his own shackles around 2003, 2004 - or like sampras around 92, 93...

Sunset of Age
11-17-2011, 11:20 PM
that's pretty much how i'd put it too...

in the black and white versions of success, Kafelnikov edges it because of matches, titles, prizemoney (significant doubles player) and durability... 2-2 head2head also says it's very close...

and it wasn't that kafelnikov's game wasn't aesthetically pleasing... i found his ball striking while hugging the baseline phenomenal... but safin's back court ON GAME was simply peerless, unplayable - powerful, deliberate and built to dominate... both players, when feeling below average were dire to watch at times... dire for me at least, because it was easy to see both of there games could have dominated the tour if they could have just mentally broken their own code that bound them in the same way federer managed to break his own shackles around 2003, 2004...

Pretty much spot-on.
Very, very close indeed.

leng jai
11-17-2011, 11:34 PM
Kafelnikov was also a a workaholic and played an obscene amount of doubles for a "singles" player. Explains the big discrepancy in prize money.

Kolya
11-18-2011, 02:21 AM
Kafelnikov last man to win the singles and doubles of a grand slam :worship:

emotion
11-18-2011, 02:33 AM
kafelnikov but barely

stewietennis
02-22-2012, 12:03 AM
Marat Safin:
2 Majors (USO '00, AO '05)
2 Major Finals (AO '02, '04)
9 Weeks at #1
15 Career Titles

Pat Rafter:
2 Majors (USO '97, '98)
2 Major Finals (Wimby '00, '01)
1 Week at #1
11 Career Titles

Yevgeny Kafelnikov:
2 Majors (FO '96, AO '99)
1 Major Final (AO '00)
6 Weeks at #1
26 Career Titles

So, who had the better (or more complete) career?

BauerAlmeida
02-22-2012, 12:11 AM
Marat.

LisaKoh
02-22-2012, 12:13 AM
Doesn't Kafelnikov have an Olympic gold medal?

I'll go for Kafelnikov. Safin could have done more with his talent whereas Kafelnikov seemed to make the most of his.

Johnny Groove
02-22-2012, 12:13 AM
Safin, then Rafter, then Kafelnikov.

leng jai
02-22-2012, 12:26 AM
Kafelnikov. Gold at the Olympics is big no matter how you try to spin it. Not to mention 26 titles and the fact he was a solid doubles player as well.

Ajde.

Action Jackson
02-22-2012, 01:24 AM
Poll Options updated.

Slice Winner
02-22-2012, 01:35 AM
Djokovic.

rocketassist
02-22-2012, 02:14 AM
Kafelnikov won 2 slams and reached the top spot but also won Olympic gold, so he'd get my vote.

samanosuke
02-22-2012, 08:56 AM
Kafelnikov didn't win a single masters 1000 title . this fact takes a lot from his achievements for me

LawrenceOfTennis
02-22-2012, 08:59 AM
Kafelnikov.
He's the least talented of the trio though.

duong
02-22-2012, 09:00 AM
Safin, then Rafter, then Kafelnikov.

+1

but the difference is not large, as for the talent it's bigger.

As for the Olympic Gold, I didn't even pay attention to that in that time :confused: I never paid attention to tennis in the Olympics (there are so many other sports where it's the most important competition in the meantime) until recent players talked so much about this :shrug:

duong
02-22-2012, 09:17 AM
They won the first Davis Cup for Russia together, that was Zhenya's dream and Marat helped him to make it true. :)

Don't forget Youzhny who replaced Kafelnikov for final match ;)