Peak Safin vs Peak Nadal in Hardcourt slams [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Peak Safin vs Peak Nadal in Hardcourt slams

2003
02-15-2012, 08:47 PM
Its pointless going surface by surface because I think, unless very early rounds of a slam, any clay or grass match would be easy straights for peak Nadal.

However, I could see a very ferocious battle between these two on hardcourts. Both have a lot in common there.

2 hardcourt slams, both one at US and Australian Open.

At least a couple of other hardcourt slam finals.

Would have won more hardcourt slams if not for an eventual GOAT contender in those hardcourt finals.

An epic semi or final in hardcourt slams (Safin 2005 AO, Djokovic Nadal 2012 AO final).

It would come down to match ups I guess.

Safins epic backhand vs Nadals topspin.

How does this one end up?

TennisOnWood
02-15-2012, 08:50 PM
On what Hard court.. Sand of AO 2012 or some older?

r2473
02-15-2012, 08:52 PM
Fast surface / balls, etc = Safin by a mile

Slow surface / balls, etc = Nadal by a mile

I'm currently watching the Safin / Agassi AO SF 2004. That was a great match.

TennisOnWood
02-15-2012, 08:54 PM
Fast surface / balls, etc = Safin by a mile

Slow surface / balls, etc = Nadal by a mile

I'm currently watching the Safin / Agassi AO SF 2004. That was a great match.

It was 2005. Maybe match of the century

Nole Rules
02-15-2012, 08:56 PM
LOL. Nadal can't reach the level of Peak Safin on Hardcourts.

r2473
02-15-2012, 08:58 PM
It was 2005. Maybe match of the century

No, not Federer / Safin semis.

I actually like Safin / Agassi better. With the roof closed the ball sounds like it is being shot out of a cannon on pretty much every shot. Those boys hit HARD.

TennisOnWood
02-15-2012, 09:00 PM
No, not Federer / Safin semis.

I actually like Safin / Agassi better. With the roof closed the ball sounds like it is being shot out of a cannon on pretty much every shot. Those boys hit HARD.

Sorry, I always think about that Federer vs Safin match :D

Yeap, Andre done some good damage that days

Nole Rules
02-15-2012, 09:00 PM
Nadal's best shot (FH CC) won't bother peak Safin at all and keep in mind that Safin has a much better serve and net game than Djokovic. Peak Safin would be a nightmare match up for Nadal on Hardcourts.

viruzzz
02-15-2012, 09:05 PM
Peak Safin won over Peak Federer.

Peak Safin is almost impossible to defeat in HC.

romismak
02-15-2012, 09:18 PM
Peak Safin could beat Nadal even at today´s slow like ass AO, but not so sure, but if we are talking about faster HC - from early-mid 2000s than Rafa is doomed, peak Safin got big serve, big powerfull shots from bogh wings, his movement wasn´t best but on fast HC you didn´t need that much with that kind of game Marat had - Delpo is similar what i can remember on fast USO 09 he destroyed RAfa- but RAfa wasn´t at his peak that day, but still we can imagine that on early 2000s fast HC Marat would destroy peak HC Nadal

Orka_n
02-15-2012, 09:19 PM
Safin would expose him. Badly.

Jamoz
02-15-2012, 09:22 PM
Safin. Big man and big shots(almost in my league):haha:

r2473
02-15-2012, 09:26 PM
I forgot we are talking about PEAK Safin (US Open 2000 vs. Sampras; AO 2004 vs. Agassi; AO 2005 vs. Federer).

In that case, we might see some bagels.

BauerAlmeida
02-15-2012, 09:26 PM
Safin playing at his best would defeat him in every slam except RG.

Shirogane
02-15-2012, 09:34 PM
I'm currently watching the Safin / Agassi AO SF 2004. That was a great match.ahah, every time I'm about to forget about the Safin-Agassi epic, a thread like this happens – then I remember how close Andre was from "being up four sets to love" in that match. :mad:

Chase Visa
02-15-2012, 09:34 PM
Define 'hard court'.

And define 'peak Safin'. Cos the one we saw at the AO/USO when he won, Nadal could throw a kitchen sink at Safin and still not dent him....

r2473
02-15-2012, 09:42 PM
ahah, every time I'm about to forget about the Safin-Agassi epic, a thread like this happens – then I remember how close Andre was from "being up four sets to love". :mad:

It certainly could have happened that way.

But all credit to Safin. It isn't like Agassi handed it to him or anything.

What I enjoy so much about this match (and I only just rewatched the first set a few nights ago, still 4 more to go) is how each will hit ridiculous shots and neither the guy that hit the shot or the other guy will have much if any reaction at all. Just two professionals going at it.

Hard to remember this about Safin because of his antics later in his career.

pray-for-palestine-and-israel
02-15-2012, 10:07 PM
bear in mind soderling was doing a poor safin act and he destroyed nadal on nadal's best surface

safin would just be cruel

Johnny Groove
02-16-2012, 01:42 AM
In a 10 match series:

AO- Safin 6-4
USO- Safin 7-3

leng jai
02-16-2012, 01:58 AM
Peak Safin would dominate a peak Rafito but the difference is that peak Rafito has appeared on tour over 10 times as much.

Ajde.

Houstonko
02-16-2012, 02:59 AM
In the past the hard courts used to reward flat hitters when the ball hit without spin bounce lower than net, not the case now. I will say in those courts peak safin > peak djokovic too. Dont' even need to mention Nadal. Peak Gonzalez even shit on him in AO.

Hewitt =Legend
02-16-2012, 03:05 AM
Ajde peak players.

Seriously though, discussing how different players would fare against each other at their "peaks" would have to be MTF's favourite past time.

Ajde.

leng jai
02-16-2012, 03:06 AM
Ajde peak players.

Seriously though, discussing how different players would fare against each other at their "peaks" would have to be MTF's favourite past time.

Ajde.

Actually MTF's favourite past time in breakout out the Ajde + leg up combo.

Ajde.

Kiedis
02-16-2012, 03:09 AM
Virtual/Hypothetical reality is always a bitch with Rafa, thence his haters adore it so much.

jcempire
02-16-2012, 06:35 AM
Peak Safin > Peak Federer > Peak Nadal

Sri
02-16-2012, 06:40 AM
Nadal's top spin forehand may not hurt Safin's backhand that much..

River
02-16-2012, 08:08 AM
Peak Safin would've demolished him easy. I don't care how much of a fan I am of Nadal, but you'd best be crazy to not bet on Safin when he was 100% focused on a hard court.

GSMnadal
02-16-2012, 08:13 AM
In a 10 match series:

AO- Safin 6-4
USO- Safin 7-3

There's no such thing as 'Peak Safin' in a '10 match series'.

Peak Safin is something that happened once every 3 years or so, if they met 10 times Nadal would've probably won about 7-8 of them. With Safin zoning and actually showing up in the other 2 or 3.

Jimnik
02-16-2012, 08:15 AM
Marat's sense of humor would bagel Nadal.

Jimnik
02-16-2012, 08:16 AM
They've achieved equally at hard court slams but h2h I would fancy Nadal. His endless retrieving and retarded slice BH would have driven Marat nuts.

Mystique
02-16-2012, 08:32 AM
They've achieved equally at hard court slams but h2h I would fancy Nadal. His endless retrieving and retarded slice BH would have driven Marat nuts.

This and that. :o

TBkeeper
02-16-2012, 09:02 AM
Remember fools Safin against Agassi AO SF 2004 made 33 aces and 0 DFs ..... you make the decision :D

Sophocles
02-16-2012, 11:07 AM
Safin in slam-winning form would beat any version of Nadal. But as others have pointed out, he wasn't in slam-winning form very often.

mooncreek
02-16-2012, 04:24 PM
I forgot we are talking about PEAK Safin (US Open 2000 vs. Sampras; AO 2004 vs. Agassi; AO 2005 vs. Federer).

In that case, we might see some bagels.

It's funny how the peaks are when it comes to Safin but I totally agree. This is a guy who blasted close-to-peak and untouchable-in-GS-finals Sampras off the court! Along with the Agassi and at-that-point-untouchable Federer encounters, it's easy to say Rafa would be in deep trouble.

Clay Death
02-16-2012, 04:30 PM
Peak Safin won over Peak Federer.

Peak Safin is almost impossible to defeat in HC.

affirmative.

peak safin was a monstah. ask sampras all about it.

Clay Death
02-16-2012, 04:30 PM
excellent thread idea/topic by 2003.

samanosuke
02-16-2012, 05:32 PM
I would pay a lot for a chance to see that . outcome of that match would easily surpass all nadal's beatdowns .

next on my wishlist of giving all matches would be hard court match between peak agassi and peak nadal

joy for my eyes and viagra for my libido

those early taken backhands would ruin nadal's libido though . no moonballing with these guys

Stronga23
02-16-2012, 05:37 PM
Safin has way more quality wins on HC than Nadal

USO 2000- Demolished Sampras who had won 7 HC GS.
AO 2004- Beat Roddick(When he was #1) and Agassi who had been the king in Australia in back-to back five setters.
AO 2005- Beat Peak Fed in the greatest HC match ever and came back to beat Hewitt in his home slam.

Vida
02-16-2012, 07:30 PM
it wouldnt be as easy for safin as some are beating their bananas at.

Mountaindewslave
02-16-2012, 07:35 PM
Safin hits through Nadal easily at his peak on hard court, this isn't even a discussion. ala Del Potro US OPEN 2009

Vida
02-16-2012, 07:37 PM
Safin hits through Nadal easily at his peak on hard court, this isn't even a discussion. ala Del Potro US OPEN 2009

nadal was a rag doll there.

r2473
02-16-2012, 07:55 PM
it wouldnt be as easy for safin as some are beating their bananas at.

Well, the OP did say "peak". And peak safin would beat peak nadal on hardcourts everytime.

That said, "peak vs. peak" discussions are pretty pointless.

If Nadal and Safin "just played", Nadal would probably win most every time. The current record is 2-0 in favor of Nadal, both matches played on hardcourt.

Even a guy like Robredo or Santoro has a winning record against Safin (even on hard courts).

In reality, you would never see "peak Safin" against Nadal, because Nadal would not give Safin the kind of balls and rallies the produce "peak Safin".

Vlad1980
02-16-2012, 07:59 PM
Speaking as a big Safin fan of the past, I say Nadal will dominate 3 out of 4 (RG, W, US Open) and Marat may have a chance at AO if he is playing at his best.

The tennis that is played today by top 4 far far exceeds anything that Marat or his rivals such as Hewitt, etc ever were capable of. If you think otherwise, please put the crack pipe down.

Vida
02-16-2012, 08:04 PM
Well, the OP did say "peak". And peak safin would beat peak nadal on hardcourts everytime.

That said, "peak vs. peak" discussions are pretty pointless.

If Nadal and Safin "just played", Nadal would probably win most every time. The current record is 2-0 in favor of Nadal, both matches played on hardcourt.

Even a guy like Robredo or Santoro has a winning record against Safin (even on hard courts).

nadal AO 09? not sure he would've certainly lost to peak safin. firstly safins BH isnt djokos BH, at least not on defense. secondly, its not for definite, even peak of peaks safin would've had as much in the tank to hang with nadal for as long as nadal could probably make him, esp not on slow HC. sure, overall it goes to (peak) safin, but nadal is no gimp as some injured fans would like to think, thats all Im saying.

r2473
02-16-2012, 08:06 PM
Speaking as a big Safin fan of the past, I say Nadal will dominate 3 out of 4 (RG, W, US Open) and Marat may have a chance at AO if he is playing at his best.

The tennis that is played today by top 4 far far exceeds anything that Marat or his rivals such as Hewitt, etc ever were capable of. If you think otherwise, please put the crack pipe down.

I don't know. Sampras was still pretty good on US Open surface in 2000. Agassi didn't look bad to me in 2004. Federer was no slouch in 2005.

I have these matches on DVD and have seen them all quite recently. It looks pretty high quality to me.

Stronga23
02-16-2012, 08:07 PM
Speaking as a big Safin fan of the past, I say Nadal will dominate 3 out of 4 (RG, W, US Open) and Marat may have a chance at AO if he is playing at his best.

The tennis that is played today by top 4 far far exceeds anything that Marat or his rivals such as Hewitt, etc ever were capable of. If you think otherwise, please put the crack pipe down.

Yeah that is why Marat's two GS wins came aginst the two players with the most GS :wavey:

Mountaindewslave
02-16-2012, 08:10 PM
Safin playing at his best would defeat him in every slam except RG.

dream on, at Wimbledon there just is no way, regardless of the speed of the grass

Stronga23
02-16-2012, 08:12 PM
dream on, at Wimbledon there just is no way, regardless of the speed of the grass

You know whats weird Marat's only good performance after all the knee problems was 2008 Wimbledon :eek:

Haelfix
02-16-2012, 08:14 PM
Safin would be a really bad matchup for Nadal (and for that matter Djokovic) on hards (even slow hards). On the other hand, Murray would likely be a major problem for him.
Of course this is Safin we are talking about, so you can expect a few free wins while his mind wanders. But if he's zoning, he would do what Del Potro did to Rafa at the USO a few years ago.

On clay and grass, Rafa dominates him.

Stronga23
02-16-2012, 08:19 PM
Safin would be a really bad matchup for Nadal (and for that matter Djokovic) on hards (even slow hards). On the other hand, Murray would likely be a major problem for him.
Of course this is Safin we are talking about, so you can expect a few free wins while his mind wanders. But if he's zoning, he would do what Del Potro did to Rafa at the USO a few years ago.

On clay and grass, Rafa dominates him.

Marat would dominate him indoors also.

Pirata.
02-16-2012, 09:15 PM
Speaking as a big Safin fan of the past, I say Nadal will dominate 3 out of 4 (RG, W, US Open) and Marat may have a chance at AO if he is playing at his best.

Nadal would not beat Safin on a quick USO.

HKz
02-16-2012, 09:22 PM
Fast surface / balls, etc = Safin by a mile

Slow surface / balls, etc = Nadal by a mile

I'm currently watching the Safin / Agassi AO SF 2004. That was a great match.

Actually, peak Safin on a slow hardcourt would still be a great match up against Nadal. His movement was superb especially for his height and we all know his ferocious backhand which Djokovic plays to perfection against Nadal. That along with a very blistering forehand and much better serve than Djokovic, I think he could of had a good record against Nadal in general, not just on hardcourts slow or fast. Sure, you can say Safin was a mental nutcase, but he has played plenty of matches which showed his true mental strength.

Naudio Spanlatine
02-16-2012, 09:44 PM
Safin is too good for Peak Rafa, of course rafa will challenge him but still Safin was a beast on hardcourts:worship:

thrust
02-16-2012, 10:44 PM
Peak Safin won over Peak Federer.

Peak Safin is almost impossible to defeat in HC.

The problelem for Safin was that he not play his best very often. Something tells me Roger probably has the better H-H over Safin. Marat and Nalbandian are probably the most overrated players on this forum. Both could play brilliant tennis, but not often.

Vida
02-16-2012, 10:50 PM
The problelem for Safin was that he not play his best very often. Something tells me Roger probably has the better H-H over Safin. Marat and Nalbandian are probably the most overrated players on this forum. Both could play brilliant tennis, but not often.

whole this peak vs peak thing is mumbojumbo. you can take a club player at his "peak" beating anybody just hitting everything perfect.

Stronga23
02-16-2012, 10:52 PM
The problelem for Safin was that he not play his best very often. Something tells me Roger probably has the better H-H over Safin. Marat and Nalbandian are probably the most overrated players on this forum. Both could play brilliant tennis, but not often.

Please dont compare Marat and Nalby. 2 Slams to 0 Slams and wins over Sampras,Fed and Agassi in slams.

stewietennis
02-16-2012, 11:14 PM
Peak Nadal (2008) wasn't a really hardcourt player so he wouldn't win

nolop
02-16-2012, 11:21 PM
Safin's epic backhand wins by inertia.

BauerAlmeida
02-16-2012, 11:22 PM
Please dont compare Marat and Nalby. 2 Slams to 0 Slams and wins over Sampras,Fed and Agassi in slams.

But Nalbandian won the Masters Cup, Safin didn't. He also beat Fed at GS (twice), and against Sampras and Agassi he never played I think.

Stronga23
02-16-2012, 11:31 PM
But Nalbandian won the Masters Cup, Safin didn't. He also beat Fed at GS (twice), and against Sampras and Agassi he never played I think.

Very true you could also say that Nalbandian's win equals Marat's because they were both five-setters in that same year. I am a huge Nalby fan he is in my top five favorite players. So pissed about what happened at the AO he could have reached the second week :sad:

BauerAlmeida
02-17-2012, 12:05 AM
Very true you could also say that Nalbandian's win equals Marat's because they were both five-setters in that same year. I am a huge Nalby fan he is in my top five favorite players. So pissed about what happened at the AO he could have reached the second week :sad:


Yeah, me too, big fan of both (Marat and Nalby). I think he would have defeated Lopez in the 3rd round. Would have been nice to see him against Nadal.

Sophocles
02-17-2012, 10:22 AM
Safin's cross-court backhand is the equal of Djoker's & his backhand down the line was better.

leng jai
02-17-2012, 10:41 AM
Safin power and offense on the backhand is far superior to that of Nole's and the opposite is true for defense.

Ajde