Is Nadal trying to take the tour finals from London? He is complaining about taxes. [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Is Nadal trying to take the tour finals from London? He is complaining about taxes.

martinatreue
10-13-2011, 08:30 PM
http://eurosport.yahoo.com/13102011/58/nadal-london-lose-atp-finals.html


We know that he has changed from Queen's to Halle already. Now this article shows up in which he is complaining about the high tax rate. I actually somewhat agree with Nadull on this one but the guy is stinking rich so he comes across spoiled and bitter about losing more and more. Let's face it. He hates indoor tennis especially at the O2 because it's super fast. I am wondering if he has some ulterior motives or is this just about him getting more pounds/euros and paying less in taxes? Honestly the tax rate does seem very high, so I can see his point, but for him to claim that he is not switching to Halle because there are offering twice as much money in appearance fees is pretty laughable. That is VERY VERY HARD for me to believe.

Thoughts on this potentially explosive topic?

Who thinks the taxes are just insanely high?

Who thinks the top players need to stop whining so much and expecting to be coddled? I mean he is also complaining about the balls in Asia and upset at the US Open too because of scheduling, but also Murray and Roddick have complained about more and more stuff. What's the real deal here?

Sapeod
10-13-2011, 08:38 PM
He's a crybaby :baby: Complaining about taxes? Nadal, you are a clown. Go and sulk about your latest loss somewhere where we can't see you :wavey:

guga2120
10-13-2011, 08:41 PM
As I was saying in the halle thread, I love the guy, but this whole thing makes him come off very greedy. He should just shut up and play.

timafi
10-13-2011, 08:41 PM
I hope they speed the surface even more in Bercy and the 02 Arena:drool:

EddieNero
10-13-2011, 08:44 PM
Fast indoors suit Nadal very well, no?

philosophicalarf
10-13-2011, 09:04 PM
O2 isn't fast at all, it's ITF rated at medium/slow. Just the low bounce confuses things :-)

Apparently playing Queens actually costs Nadal heavily, even if he wins the tournament, because it crosses some tax threshold.

Fujee
10-13-2011, 09:08 PM
I hope they speed the surface even more in Bercy and the 02 Arena:drool:

here me now:):)

LawrenceOfTennis
10-13-2011, 09:10 PM
Don't worry, Toni will arrange everything.

Sham Kay
10-13-2011, 09:11 PM
Well Federer is leading the H2H in the epic Fedal cash hoarding rivalry.. so it's understandable. But what an epic match up it is.

GOAT = Fed
10-13-2011, 09:18 PM
Woah. Nadal has been quite outspoken this week. Quite weird. hmmm.....

The WTF is gonna move away from the o2 anyway in 2 years time. Next years WTF will be the last one held at the o2.

Hensafmurrafter
10-13-2011, 09:24 PM
Wow what a douche ball. 50% isnt that much when you get to travel the world playing your favorite game and earning millions of dollars. That is a better life than 99% of people get to live. What an ungrateful little troll.

Myrre
10-13-2011, 09:27 PM
Greed rears its ugly head.

alter ego
10-13-2011, 09:28 PM
http://uptill1.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/Love_of_Money9p6Detail1.jpg

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 09:32 PM
Bitches on this forum will cry, but at the end of the day, money is what makes the world go round. So I have NO problem with Rafa or any of the other top players ensuring they make as much money as possible. Greedy? Is that supposed to be an insult? Throw as much money as Nadal makes in my face, or have the opportunity to make much more money in a given situation, anybody should take advantage.

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 09:33 PM
Oh, and he's right, the tax rate is quite high. He's only a man looking out for his best interests and the best interests of his fellow players. Smart man, very smart. Make that money, Rafa.

Sapeod
10-13-2011, 09:39 PM
Oh, and he's right, the tax rate is quite high. He's only a man looking out for his best interests and the best interests of his fellow players. Smart man, very smart. Make that money, Rafa.
What? He's a professional athlete with millions of dollars under his name. He shouldn't be complaining about taxes, of all things :rolleyes: He's an ugly, greedy man :rolleyes: Then again, he is a little crybaby too, so it's not too surprising, I guess :shrug:

Duncan
10-13-2011, 09:40 PM
Spoilt little brat. Greedy little brat as well. How I wish I had the problems he has in counting his cash.


Im beyond angry now!

Duncan
10-13-2011, 09:41 PM
What? He's a professional athlete with millions of dollars under his name. He shouldn't be complaining about taxes, of all things :rolleyes: He's an ugly, greedy man :rolleyes: Then again, he is a little crybaby too, so it's not too surprising, I guess :shrug:



For the first time ever I actually agree with you.

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 09:43 PM
Just because he has millions it means he shouldn't seek to make millions more or make as much money as possible? Please. You are ALL haters and bitter because he's a smart businessman, and you'll never touch his bank numbers if you tried.

MuzzahLovah
10-13-2011, 09:44 PM
http://uptill1.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/Love_of_Money9p6Detail1.jpg

:haha:

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 09:45 PM
Greed isn't a bad thing if you keep it in control. Everyone should be greedy to a certain extent. At the end of the day, it's me, myself and I in this world. So, you have to look out for your best interests.

Duncan
10-13-2011, 09:45 PM
Just because he has millions it means he shouldn't seek to make millions more or make as much money as possible? Please. You are ALL haters and bitter because he's a smart businessman, and you'll never touch his bank numbers if you tried.


What the hell has that got to do with it you idiot?


He is a greedy little shit. Millions of people in this planet would love to be in his shoes playing professional tennis at venues like Queens and Wimbledon and not 1 would moan about high taxes.

Geo
10-13-2011, 09:48 PM
It's hard to feel sorry for Nadal :spit: I mean, if he was a journeyman or something then OK, but given how much money he has made and continues to make, I find this comment to be insensitive during these hard economic times. Nadal and the other top players have their lodging paid for them, have travel cars, and get appearance fees-what is there to complain about? :o That said, I think I remember hearing something about this in the past? Didn't Agassi have a complaint about this too a few years ago? :scratch:

Henry Chinaski
10-13-2011, 09:51 PM
I understand his frustrations regarding the UK tax laws as a whole but he's being very short sighted if he thinks taking the WTF away from London is a good idea.

Sunset of Age
10-13-2011, 09:51 PM
It's hard to feel sorry for Nadal :spit: I mean, if he was a journeyman or something then OK, but given how much money he has made and continues to make...that said, I think I remember hearing something about this in the past? Didn't Agassi have a complaint about this too a few years ago? :scratch:

Picked this up from elsewhere: apparently the British tax rules include everything a player makes, including sponsor deals. It was the result from a 2006 court ruling in the UK where the Inland Revenue won a case against Andre Agassi regarding their desire to tax Agassi on his worldwide sponsorship endorsements. This led to a change in British law. :shrug:

It apparently leads to the situation wherein Rafa won't make any cash unless he goes far in the tournament - which apparently hasn't been his plan, look at his tank job this year against Tsonga. Though I think it wasn't the smartest idea (for those who don't get me here, this is an understatement :angel:) to talk about his reason to ditch Queens next year en plein publique, I don't think it's such a strange decision to make. Don't we all want to see the results of our labours in our wallets, too? ;)

Just for clarification, once again, I understand his decision though I'm not all too happy about him yapping about it in the open. Doesn't make for a 'goodie image', no? But at least he's being honest about it.

martinatreue
10-13-2011, 09:52 PM
Oh, and he's right, the tax rate is quite high. He's only a man looking out for his best interests and the best interests of his fellow players. Smart man, very smart. Make that money, Rafa.

Coming across as greedy in times of recession may not make him so marketable to fans and sponsors, so how is this smart? You need to see the bigger picture. By the way, since when is only looking out for your own immediate best interest more important than looking out for the sport you claim to love? That sounds very egocentric and selfish. Are those good qualities in a champion? I do think that that tax rate is very high, but Rafa himself talks about the fact thatmany fans show up at O2 and how enthusiastic they are. That is good for tennis (and thus, for him), no?

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 09:52 PM
He's moaning about the taxes because they're fucking up his cash flow! He's a businessman looking to make money, the taxes are getting in the way of he making the most money he could. How can anyone complain? Please. He's done the sane thing and keepin' it real 100%. If you have the opening to make more money, as much money as possible, you take it.

Millions of people may want to be him, but they aren't him, so get over it and quit crying about it, and make your own money, instead of making a big deal of someone else getting theirs.

Shirogane
10-13-2011, 09:53 PM
Let's face it. He hates indoor tennis especially at the O2 because it's super fast. It's not.

MuzzahLovah
10-13-2011, 09:54 PM
Greed isn't a bad thing if you keep it in control. Everyone should be greedy to a certain extent. At the end of the day, it's me, myself and I in this world. So, you have to look out for your best interests.

:o Ok Gordon Gekko- no one really cares about you're economic or political philosophy.

Humblelito or Fed or whoever should just remember they make most of their money through endorsements- because of their personal popularity. They should be conscious in this time of extraordinary hardship and unemployment across the globe of sounding like like greedy pricks.

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 09:58 PM
Coming across as greedy in times of recession may not make him so marketable to fans and sponsors, so how is this smart? You need to see the bigger picture. By the way, since when is only looking out for your own immediate best interest more important than looking out for the sport you claim to love? That sounds very egocentric and selfish. Are those good qualities in a champion? I do think that that tax rate is very high, but Rafa himself talks about the fact thatmany fans show up at O2 and how enthusiastic they are. That is good for tennis (and thus, for him), no?
I truly, truly doubt these quotes will ruin his marketability. You're not going to see millions of fans leaving him. In fact I'm sure most fans don't know of this story nor care. If some do leave, it's their loss, he's still going to make millions. The bigger picture is, he's making money, sees the opportunity to make more money, and he's going for it. That's the smaller picture, bigger picture, the entire picture.

As for fans, at the end of the day, what Rafa does on court, and his looks, are what drives his money machine. Again, I doubt fans will leave him in droves. As for good qualities of a champion, making money has nothing to do with that whatsoever. And Rafa is actually looking out for the PLAYERS in this situation by seeking that the players make more money without tax impedements. The players are what make tennis. Without players there is no tennis. Fans of tennis will watch regardless.

n8
10-13-2011, 09:59 PM
This seems unfair:

Government rules state that sportsmen and women competing or even just practising in the UK are taxed a proportion of their income from endorsements and sponsorships even if those deals have nothing to do with Britain.

alter ego
10-13-2011, 10:00 PM
He's moaning about the taxes because they're fucking up his cash flow! He's a businessman looking to make money, the taxes are getting in the way of he making the most money he could. How can anyone complain? Please. He's done the sane thing and keepin' it real 100%. If you have the opening to make more money, as much money as possible, you take it.


Actually he is a greedy tennis player who's trying to make 21 milion$ per year insted of the usual 20.

MuzzahLovah
10-13-2011, 10:01 PM
This seems unfair:

Where is this from?

And regardless, nobody is forcing him to play. If he needs his extra millions so badly he can skip.

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 10:01 PM
:o Ok Gordon Gekko- no one really cares about you're economic or political philosophy.

Humblelito or Fed or whoever should just remember they make most of their money through endorsements- because of their personal popularity. They should be conscious in this time of extraordinary hardship and unemployment across the globe of sounding like like greedy pricks.

Neither Rafa nor Roger will lose endorsements because they seek to make as much money as possible, the common sense thing to do, through other avenues.

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 10:02 PM
Actually he is a greedy tennis player who's trying to make 21 milion$ per year insted of the usual 20.

Oh, it's now "greedy" to seek to make as much money as possible. Or is that just another one of the litany of stupid MTF laws.

Sunset of Age
10-13-2011, 10:03 PM
Where is this from?

Read my earlier post. A court case versus Agassi back in 2006 lead up to this British tax law.

Sapeod
10-13-2011, 10:03 PM
Just because he has millions it means he shouldn't seek to make millions more or make as much money as possible? Please. You are ALL haters and bitter because he's a smart businessman, and you'll never touch his bank numbers if you tried.
Oh do be quiet :rolleyes:

MuzzahLovah
10-13-2011, 10:04 PM
Neither Rafa nor Roger will lose endorsements because they seek to make as much money as possible, the common sense thing to do, through other avenues.

Just because you embrace a controversial "greed is good" philosophy, you must recognize that many people don't. Whether or not you agree with them, you have to accept they exist. And given that most of the industrialized world(where tennis is popular) is socialist. It seems like a bad business decision to announce you are a greedy pig.

Roamed
10-13-2011, 10:05 PM
As a fan of Rafa, personally I think it's fine to feel regret about having to pay this in tax, as long as he only expresses it in private. But to complain about it in public is not on, whoever you are, when you earn as much as he does. Life hasn't exactly treated him badly. What about all those people, myself included, who have to save up to come and see him at the O2? I was disappointed to hear him saying these sorts of things.

Sunset of Age
10-13-2011, 10:08 PM
As a fan of Rafa, personally I think it's fine to feel regret about having to pay this in tax, as long as he only expresses it in private. But to complain about it in public is not on, whoever you are, when you earn as much as he does. Life hasn't exactly treated him badly. What about all those people, myself included, who have to save up to come and see him at the O2? I was disappointed to hear him saying these sorts of things.

Yep, fully agree. Keep this kind of stuff in private.
I wonder if Rafa will ever know or realize that some of us have to pay a whole month of our earnings just to be able to see him play a couple of days...

tektonac
10-13-2011, 10:09 PM
they should move WTF to monte carlo. brits use players' money for invasion purposes.

alter ego
10-13-2011, 10:10 PM
Oh, it's now "greedy" to seek to make as much money as possible.

Yes it is. Nadull probably has a fortune well above 100milion$. Enough to guarantee him and his familly a life of luxry. Why make more money that one can spend in a lifespan?

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 10:13 PM
Because making as much money as possible should be the objective for anyone. There is no such thing as too much money. And you never know how much money you'll need, so if you keep making a lot of it without any dry spells, you'll be able to do what you want and have what you want, and live the dream life.

alter ego
10-13-2011, 10:17 PM
Don't think so. I would rather live my life doing the things I like than worrying about money I'll never have the time to spend.

DomachowskaDreamer
10-13-2011, 10:23 PM
Nadal :facepalm:

tennisfan856
10-13-2011, 10:24 PM
I think the bigger question here is why isn't there a bigger outrage over this uk tax, this is the first I have heard of it. 50% is ludicrous, but do uk footballers get penalized like this or is it strictly tennis? Do 1st round wimbledon knockouts get taxed?

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 10:28 PM
Don't think so. I would rather live my life doing the things I like than worrying about money I'll never have the time to spend.

That's fair, although, I think a lot of people will say making money is something they like to do. And take a lot of pleasure and enjoyment in doing.

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 10:35 PM
Just because you embrace a controversial "greed is good" philosophy, you must recognize that many people don't. Whether or not you agree with them, you have to accept they exist. And given that most of the industrialized world(where tennis is popular) is socialist. It seems like a bad business decision to announce you are a greedy pig.

Yeah, a lot of people will disagree with that philosophy. And Rafa's (and other players') actions taken with the intent to make as much money as they can. But, we need to remember tennis players' life is tennis, and their shelf life is between 10-15 years. Not a long time to make money, so you gotta make as much as possibly during those years to set yourself up in the future to live comfortably off with money to spend at your discretion.

It may seem like a bad thing for Rafa to come out and say, at the same time, a lot of people will agree with him as well looking at the horrible tax penalty. And those who support him will not stop supporting him solely as a result of these statements. This will be forgotten tomorrow. Ultimately, he's a human doing the human thing, which is seeking money, and I think that's as far as this story goes.

alter ego
10-13-2011, 10:38 PM
That's fair, although, I think a lot of people will say making money is something they like to do. And take a lot of pleasure and enjoyment in doing.

Well I can agree that some people enjoy making money more than travelling or playing their favourite sport but I think the richman pleasure comes from opening new business, exploring new markets, not from bitching about high taxation.

TMJordan
10-13-2011, 10:39 PM
What a little greedy buttpicking piggy.

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 10:44 PM
Well I can agree that some people enjoy making money more than travelling or playing their favourite sport but I think the richman pleasure comes from opening new business, exploring new markets, not from bitching about high taxation.

Bitching about high taxation is something rich and poor people do. Taxes suck. And if one can avoid paying them at such a steep cost as these players are now, that is what they will and should do.

Also, the only pleasure from making money is the green going in the pocket. Work isn't fun. Money and what one can do with it, is fun. Work is just an evil that people have to endure to make it. If people didn't have to work to make money they would jump at that opportunity.

Getta
10-13-2011, 10:48 PM
What a little greedy buttpicking piggy.

ko5_bnzcKFQ

alter ego
10-13-2011, 10:55 PM
Also, the only pleasure from making money is the green going in the pocket. Work isn't fun. Money and what one can do with it, is fun. Work is just an evil that people have to endure to make it. If people didn't have to work to make money they would jump at that opportunity.

I'm sorry aren't you posting from the country that coined the term "workaholic"?
Also if greed is good and "making as much money as possible should be the objective for anyone", what's your opinion about charity? or better yet what's your opinion about Nadal's foundation? is it just a PR thing?

Henry Chinaski
10-13-2011, 10:56 PM
Because making as much money as possible should be the objective for anyone. There is no such thing as too much money. And you never know how much money you'll need, so if you keep making a lot of it without any dry spells, you'll be able to do what you want and have what you want, and live the dream life.

give it a rest you utter bore

Say Hey Kid
10-13-2011, 11:00 PM
I'm stunned everyone here is talking about Nadal being "greedy". This has nothing to do with greed, it's a matter of principle. Nadal earns the money he gets paid and he feels it's wrong for the UK government to take half of his paycheck. I agree with him completely. The players earn the money and they are entitled to the dollars they earn - not the government. Nadal's issue is not about paying taxes in general, but rather paying a ridiculous taxrate by almost any reasonable person's standards.

I'm sure Nadal would rather use his extra money and put it towards his charity to help people, as opposed to giving it in tax to the UK government, so they can give it to their banker buddies under the pretext of "bailouts".

The UK government is greedy - Not Rafael Nadal.

delboy
10-13-2011, 11:05 PM
I think the bigger question here is why isn't there a bigger outrage over this uk tax, this is the first I have heard of it. 50% is ludicrous, but do uk footballers get penalized like this or is it strictly tennis? Do 1st round wimbledon knockouts get taxed?

I think it's for anyone but only on any earnings above £150k a year (which some footballers get in a week) and there are loopholes and most can claim most of it back anyway.

Roamed
10-13-2011, 11:07 PM
Bitching about high taxation is something rich and poor people do. Taxes suck. And if one can avoid paying them at such a steep cost as these players are now, that is what they will and should do.

Also, the only pleasure from making money is the green going in the pocket. Work isn't fun. Money and what one can do with it, is fun. Work is just an evil that people have to endure to make it. If people didn't have to work to make money they would jump at that opportunity.

I personally aim to make enough money to sustain myself and after that it doesn't matter. I love my studies and my part-time job even though I get paid next to nothing. It's not a means to an end. I don't mind paying taxes to finance government spending that benefits me.

The UK government is campaigning to lower the 50pc tax rate (this is not the same thing, but the theory is similar if you can regard tennis players as entrepreneurs) to 40% as it apparently doesn't raise anything. They're obviously not in agreement with the Laffer curve stating 45% to be the optimum as if they were they wouldn't be doing something that produces no change at all... Simultaneously, they're raising non-progressive taxes like the VAT. Read into that what you will.

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 11:15 PM
I'm sorry aren't you posting from the country that coined the term "workaholic"?
Also if greed is good and "making as much money as possible should be the objective for anyone", what's your opinion about charity? or better yet what's your opinion about Nadal's foundation? is it just a PR thing?

I don't know...........did we coin the term? I have no idea. Nor do I really care, because I'm speaking as a sole individual human, not for my country or as an American.

Greed is good and making money is awesome, but giving back, when appropriate, is good as well. Greed comes in when making money, but when you make that money, what one chooses to do with it is their choice. Rafa and other players care about the well-being of others and want to make a positive impact in the world outside of tennis, and do so by creating charities.

Charities are a positive thing, but that doesn't mean that ultimately, the money you make you shouldn't put in your own pocket and spent yourself. Everyone should always put themselves first, because as I said, it's me, myself and I in this world.

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 11:19 PM
give it a rest you utter bore

I'm sorry, but if you have nothing but insults to bring to the table, then you should step away from it.

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 11:26 PM
I personally aim to make enough money to sustain myself and after that it doesn't matter. I love my studies and my part-time job even though I get paid next to nothing. It's not a means to an end. I don't mind paying taxes to finance government spending that benefits me.


I guess we just have different world views, which I respect. With that said, the amount of money it takes to sustain ones' self is not a fixed number. That's why by making a lot of money, you won't have to worry about sustainability. You have money left over. It's why making money is so important.

And to add just a quick 2 cents about taxes (UK and in general), I'm not one of the insane types who think a society can sustain with abysmally low tax rates. I'm not anti-tax.............within reason. But with that said, as I said, if a person has the opportunity to avoid taxes, they will take it, and they should take it.

Sham Kay
10-13-2011, 11:30 PM
This man needs to read Amir Weintraub's blog and get some goddamn perspective on his troubles.

n8
10-13-2011, 11:33 PM
So taxes explain why Nadal wins Monte Carlo every year.

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 11:34 PM
This has nothing to do with greed, it's a matter of principle.

/thread.

Sham Kay
10-13-2011, 11:37 PM
/thread.
/Filo V might be more popular.

alter ego
10-13-2011, 11:37 PM
You are right Shambritfan.
One of the many reasons I love the ATP and I don't give 2 cents about the WTA, is the way prize money is more proportionally distributed among the men. It shows the respect the top players have for the less talented. I would hate to see greed damaging that.

star
10-13-2011, 11:39 PM
What a little greedy buttpicking piggy.

:lol:

Well, at least I now know why Federer has always avoided playing Queens. :)

Sham Kay
10-13-2011, 11:44 PM
It's obviously not about money.. yeah, he wants to drive the best deal he can get during his career while tournaments are basically scrapping with one another to get him to play. There isn't a place for genuine down to Earth modesty in Sports nowadays, just look at Football (AKA soccer) it's pretty ridiculous what the best players will do to get a slightly better deal, even if they have to abandon a great club.

That said, I really don't blame him, most in his position of fame and respect given to him, would do the same. He has power. I can guarantee he won't enjoy Halle though, nothing beats the pristine grass of Queens. But at least he isn't taxed, and is therefore given the respect he obviously requires.. which is the most important thing...

Filo V.
10-13-2011, 11:46 PM
/Filo V might be more popular.

Reported.

rocketassist
10-13-2011, 11:50 PM
http://www.jerseysmarts.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/IRS-WWE.jpg

Sham Kay
10-13-2011, 11:54 PM
Reported.
For.. wishing death I assume. Well if your perfection has decided to take what I said in that perspective who am I to argue.

*Meep meep*

Matt01
10-13-2011, 11:54 PM
As a fan of Rafa, personally I think it's fine to feel regret about having to pay this in tax, as long as he only expresses it in private. But to complain about it in public is not on, whoever you are, when you earn as much as he does. Life hasn't exactly treated him badly. What about all those people, myself included, who have to save up to come and see him at the O2? I was disappointed to hear him saying these sorts of things.


On the other hand, maybe he wanted to give his fans an explaination to his fans on why he isn't playing Queens anymore.

MTwEeZi
10-13-2011, 11:57 PM
I have family residing in London. They are always moaning about how they don't get to keep their own money due to tax. I think it was close to 40%

Orka_n
10-13-2011, 11:58 PM
Greed isn't a bad thing if you keep it in control. Everyone should be greedy to a certain extent. At the end of the day, it's me, myself and I in this world. So, you have to look out for your best interests.You have a strange life philosophy. We're drifting a bit from the topic of this thread, but anyway: there is a very thin line between looking out for your best interests and being selfish. (I'm not talking about Nadal here.) In a way money does make the world go around, yes. But personally I don't want my desire of money to control my decisions as I think it a very unreliable source for achieving long term happiness.

Sham Kay
10-14-2011, 12:00 AM
Yeah, the taxes in the UK are pretty high, has to be said. But hey, even the government need to relax in jacuzzi's once in a while...

Matt01
10-14-2011, 12:02 AM
That's fair, although, I think a lot of people will say making money is something they like to do. And take a lot of pleasure and enjoyment in doing.


Making money should not be a pleasure or enjoyment. It should be an enjoyment to have enough money to sustain a certain standard of life. Apparently you think that making as much money as possible should be a goal for anyone in his life. I think that there about a hundred things which are much more important.


Bitching about high taxation is something rich and poor people do. Taxes suck. And if one can avoid paying them at such a steep cost as these players are now, that is what they will and should do.


I'm sorry but taxes are there for a reason. One can discuss the amount of taxes one has to pay but taxes in itself is a very good thing.

jadey
10-14-2011, 12:02 AM
" everyone should put themselves first , its me , myself , and I "
so glad thats not my philosophy

nobama
10-14-2011, 12:22 AM
The UK is socialist like most of Europe. They'll soak the rich any chance they get. I'm amazed this just dawned upon #2 now. :lol:

nobama
10-14-2011, 12:23 AM
Oh, it's now "greedy" to seek to make as much money as possible. Or is that just another one of the litany of stupid MTF laws.
The latter.

nobama
10-14-2011, 12:26 AM
Yep, fully agree. Keep this kind of stuff in private.
I wonder if Rafa will ever know or realize that some of us have to pay a whole month of our earnings just to be able to see him play a couple of days...
I don't necessarily disagree with what he's saying but he does come across as a whiner quite often. With this one it seems protesting in private to the appropriate parties makes more sense than whining about it in public. But hey if he'd rather not play WTF I won't mind. :D

nobama
10-14-2011, 12:31 AM
I'm sure Nadal would rather use his extra money and put it towards his charity to help people, as opposed to giving it in tax to the UK government, so they can give it to their banker buddies under the pretext of "bailouts".

The UK government is greedy - Not Rafael Nadal.
Or spend it on things like national health care and claim it's "free". Of course nothing is free, someone is paying for it. A government soaking weathly people with extra taxes for no other reason than they can is not a good enough reason.

thrust
10-14-2011, 12:32 AM
As I was saying in the halle thread, I love the guy, but this whole thing makes him come off very greedy. He should just shut up and play.

He is becoming a chronic complainer. He should shut up and pay his taxes, like every other player. He, like many top athletes today, are greedy spoiled brats.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 12:39 AM
You have a strange life philosophy. We're drifting a bit from the topic of this thread, but anyway: there is a very thin line between looking out for your best interests and being selfish. (I'm not talking about Nadal here.) In a way money does make the world go around, yes. But personally I don't want my desire of money to control my decisions as I think it a very unreliable source for achieving long term happiness.

Being selfish is fine in moderation. Selfishness means that you are looking out for yourself, your best interests and what is best for you, in the present and future (well, one would hope a person has such an insight/awareness level to do so). There is nothing wrong with sensible selfishness.

When it comes to money, money shouldn't completely control your decisions or your happiness, but money should always be something that has an impact on decisions you make where large financial opportunities are presented to you. If you are involved in a situation where the chance to make money is present, you need to take advantage of that opportunity. Even if you're not directly involved in such a situation, money is something that should always be in the back of your mind, because without money, you're nothing in this world. Devotion to money solely, maybe not, but making money most certainly needs to be included in the life plans, right at the top of the list.

Now, that's not to say that you shouldn't have a personal life that you find happiness from. Yeah, that's all well and good, but money enhances happiness because money opens the doors to things that you wouldn't be able to enter without it. Money is a beautiful thing. I don't think my perspective is weird, just very realistic.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 12:42 AM
Greedy selfish bastard=doing the same thing 90% of people would do.

But since he's an athlete, he can't actually seek to make the most money possible in a situation, because that makes him immoral. How ridiculous. So obvious how petty and bitter people are towards those who make money.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 12:49 AM
Making money should not be a pleasure or enjoyment. It should be an enjoyment to have enough money to sustain a certain standard of life. Apparently you think that making as much money as possible should be a goal for anyone in his life. I think that there about a hundred things which are much more important.
Making money isn't enjoyment, because to make money, it involves work. Work isn't fun. But money itself is a sense of pleasure. Knowing you have money to spend in your wallet brings joy, and IMO, it should, because with money, doors open and your life opens to many new and exciting possibilities. Not to mention rich people tend to live higher quality lives and have higher social status. So yes, making as much money as possible definitely needs to be a top priority, because if it isn't, you'll be broke without hope. There are other top priorities along with making money, but money is and needs to be near the top of the list.



I'm sorry but taxes are there for a reason. One can discuss the amount of taxes one has to pay but taxes in itself is a very good thing.I agree, Matt, but that doesn't mean I won't try to evade paying them. Taxes are needed, but does that mean I like them? No, I hate taxes, it's earned money out of my pocket, earned money I can spend on myself. So if anyone has the opportunity to not pay taxes, they should take it and most will take it.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 12:53 AM
The latter.
Thank you for the confirmation, that's what I suspected. Like the saying goes, man/women fix many things, but you can't fix stupid. Too bad this forum is full of it.

Mountaindewslave
10-14-2011, 12:57 AM
love Rafael Nadal but he is being allowed to play at these tournaments and it is his choice if he wants to or not... if so upset about the incentive or monetary value in participating in them, then why participate at all?

i am very dissapointed in him. comments like these make it appear as though Nadal is more interested in assets and making money than the sport itself, the enjoyment to compete. if this were some player like Rochus complaining about getting taxed at some tournament extremely on his winnings I would get it, but Rafael Nadal?? one of the richest sports stars in the world?

I am a huge Nadal fan and hugely dissapointed in him for making such a big issue out of this. one must wonder if his recent poor form has made him resort to child like antics and whine about other aspects of the tennis world; find excuses.

hope he drops this and focuses on his game and remembers or recognizes how much better off he is than 99.9% of the rest of the world

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 01:01 AM
He should be more interested in himself than anything else. He's the one putting his body on the line and playing the game at the elite of levels. Why shouldn't he seek the most possible money in doing so? I guess these players don't deserve the best of rewards for their play. They should just settle for less to make others feel better about themselves.

Johnny Groove
10-14-2011, 01:06 AM
50 percent is beyond ridiculous.

Of course the haters will jump on anything that Nadal says and bash him for it until the cows come home, but at the end of the day, any reasonable person in his shoes would do and say the same thing.

Roddickominator
10-14-2011, 01:07 AM
Rafa needs all the money he can get. He exchanges most of it for coins. He is practicing his coin toss skills, he knows he needs to win the toss to win the matches. He spends many hours flipping different coins, getting Uncle Toni to flip coins, and he watches intently and tries to guess which side it will land on. He carries this refined skill into matches and he will be very tough to beat on the coin toss.

Topspindoctor
10-14-2011, 01:13 AM
I agree with Nadal. Why should a player of his talent, reputation and achievements have to be forced to bail out failing British economy? Nadal is 100% correct in complaining. Perhaps, he can convince Olderer and Djoker to pull out of WTF, so Brits only have Mugray to look forward to. That would surely lift UK out of financial crisis :yeah:

paseo
10-14-2011, 01:13 AM
Government rules state that sportsmen and women competing or even just practising in the UK are taxed a proportion of their income from endorsements and sponsorships even if those deals have nothing to do with Britain.

How does this works exactly? If I have an endorsement worth $1 million a year, and I play tennis in UK for 2 weeks, they'll take (2*((1000000/52)*50%))=) $19,230 from me?

Yeah, I a tax dummy. There are probably a lot of rules so you don't count it that simple, but is it like that, you know, to put it simply?

Roddickominator
10-14-2011, 01:19 AM
A surprisingly legit complaint from Nadal here. Grownups who work hard and make money like to keep that money. Glad Nadal is finally growing up.

Mountaindewslave
10-14-2011, 01:47 AM
He should be more interested in himself than anything else. He's the one putting his body on the line and playing the game at the elite of levels. Why shouldn't he seek the most possible money in doing so? I guess these players don't deserve the best of rewards for their play. They should just settle for less to make others feel better about themselves.

rafael Nadal already makes far enough for a career based on a sport ... there are some people out there who work very hard and struggle. i'm not recommending socialism BUT certainly no one should be applauding Nadal for being greedy. he makes tens of millions of dollars a year, this desperate attempt to get taxed less just makes him seem like a punk..... Filo V, a player who is truly passionate about their sport and is already making TONS of money should be more concerned with PLAYING the sport than FIGHTING TAX laws. seriously, what is wrong with you AND Nadal.....

Orka_n
10-14-2011, 01:51 AM
Being selfish is fine in moderation. Selfishness means that you are looking out for yourself, your best interests and what is best for you, in the present and future (well, one would hope a person has such an insight/awareness level to do so). There is nothing wrong with sensible selfishness.

When it comes to money, money shouldn't completely control your decisions or your happiness, but money should always be something that has an impact on decisions you make where large financial opportunities are presented to you. If you are involved in a situation where the chance to make money is present, you need to take advantage of that opportunity. Even if you're not directly involved in such a situation, money is something that should always be in the back of your mind, because without money, you're nothing in this world. Devotion to money solely, maybe not, but making money most certainly needs to be included in the life plans, right at the top of the list.

Now, that's not to say that you shouldn't have a personal life that you find happiness from. Yeah, that's all well and good, but money enhances happiness because money opens the doors to things that you wouldn't be able to enter without it. Money is a beautiful thing. I don't think my perspective is weird, just very realistic.I completely disagree. Mainly for reasons you wouldn't understand even if I tried to explain them. You wrote that "without money, you're nothing in this world." - You're right. The difference between us is that I honestly feel no need to be adored by our superficial society.

Of course I don't mean that I hate money... but collecting it has never been a life goal in itself for me. And it probably never will be. I'm happy enough already.

Roddickominator
10-14-2011, 01:56 AM
^Maybe learning or going fishing or watching movies makes you happy....but maybe making money makes Nadal happy. Who are you to say what should or shouldn't make Nadal happy or what reasons he should play tennis? The fact of the matter is, Nadal gets paid because he's at the top of a sport which happens to also be an entertainment business. I don't blame him at all for fighting for every penny, if he doesn't then someone else will.

Say Hey Kid
10-14-2011, 02:02 AM
He should be more interested in himself than anything else.


I agree with your premise that Nadal is absolutely entitled to the vast majority of what he earns, but just because he is against giving 50% of his earnings to the government does not mean he's more interested in himself than other people.

The notion that if you are against the government taking half your earnings you are a greedy person, or self centered and worry about yourself first in life is asinine. Especially since a good majority of tax dollars are used to fund banker bailouts, questionable wars, and other controversial programs government has no business getting involved with. As I said earlier, this is not a discussion of greed but standing up for what's right. Reasonable people would agree that government should not take half your paycheck. That is beyond excessive.

Lastly, Nadal is always the first person to participate in charity events to help countries in need. Whether it's "hit for australia" to help the flood victims, or doing a charity soccer match with other tennis players to help raise money for Japan's disaster relief. In addition, as of 2010 I know he still lived at home with his mom and sister. I'm sure he lives comfortably, but he certainly doesn't seem like the athlete who will go broke after his retirement. He just has a sack of balls and knows what's right from wrong - and the government taking half of your paycheck is wrong.

munZe konZa
10-14-2011, 02:20 AM
it's better to have the power or money as it is with the player who is out there in the open than to a hidden centralized authoritarian government. No one will get better where any government opprsesses people

Mountaindewslave
10-14-2011, 02:22 AM
^Maybe learning or going fishing or watching movies makes you happy....but maybe making money makes Nadal happy. Who are you to say what should or shouldn't make Nadal happy or what reasons he should play tennis? The fact of the matter is, Nadal gets paid because he's at the top of a sport which happens to also be an entertainment business. I don't blame him at all for fighting for every penny, if he doesn't then someone else will.

i mean if 'money' is truly what makes Nadal happy, then that is very pathetic. no maybe's, no 'don't judge', no 'IMO's".... pure and simple if you think it's respectable or even worthy for a person to concern themselves with money more than anything than you are extremely foolish. I don't think that Nadal is really that way at all, but lately it has seemed a bit like it.

but seriously Roddicominator if you think it makes any sense when you are already one of the highest paid athletes in the world and are not particularly playing well to focus more on making money than improving your game... then you are seriously valuing things wrong.

if Nadal really were driven by money than obviously he wouldn't be very respected, it's not rocket science, it's common sense. society has values, and although we care about money because that's how we acquire OBJECTS that can help with temporary happiness, it's quite clear that being greedy is not a beautiful quality to have

MuzzahLovah
10-14-2011, 02:32 AM
love Rafael Nadal but he is being allowed to play at these tournaments and it is his choice if he wants to or not... if so upset about the incentive or monetary value in participating in them, then why participate at all?

i am very dissapointed in him. comments like these make it appear as though Nadal is more interested in assets and making money than the sport itself, the enjoyment to compete. if this were some player like Rochus complaining about getting taxed at some tournament extremely on his winnings I would get it, but Rafael Nadal?? one of the richest sports stars in the world?

I am a huge Nadal fan and hugely dissapointed in him for making such a big issue out of this. one must wonder if his recent poor form has made him resort to child like antics and whine about other aspects of the tennis world; find excuses.

hope he drops this and focuses on his game and remembers or recognizes how much better off he is than 99.9% of the rest of the world

Thank you for being reasonable- several of the other Americans here seem like anti-tax, anti-government, capitalist stereotypes.

addison
10-14-2011, 02:33 AM
At this stage in Rafa's career, he earns too much money outside of tennis to allow the British government to pull 50% of his extra-curricular income [i.e. Nike, Babolat, RIchard Mille, Armani, Quely, etc.] out of his pockets as well as 50% of his tennis money. That's ridiculous, and no sane person would agree to it. Why should he donate all that money to the British government when he can play in Germany & keep his hard- earned cash? The man's family lives in Spain. I'm sure he'd rather give that money to his school in India than to contribute to the upkeep of Buckingham Palace.

Why do many players live in Monaco? TAXES. Tennis players careers are very short. They've got to be shrewd & not allow their earnings to be sucked up by various governments.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Rafael Nadal defends himself against accusations of cheque-chasing
Neil Harman,Tennis Correspondent, Shanghai
October 13 2011 12:01AM

The Government’s tax on the “passive income” of individual sports stars was always going to drive the best abroad. It is that, more than any money that Rafael Nadal will receive for rejecting London next June for a tournament in Germany, that has persuaded him to commit to play at least two years on foreign grass before Wimbledon.

When he came off court having reached the third round of the Shanghai Rolex Masters yesterday, the world No 2 from Spain had been warned that a groundswell was building on the internet that accused him of grasping a big pay cheque courtesy of a German millionaire rather than playing on grass courts he admits to loving.
In any other circumstances, Nadal would have been returning to the AEGON Championships at Queen’s Club again in eight months’ time. He has played there every year since 2005, missing out only in 2009 because of the tendinitis problems that forced him to abandon his Wimbledon defence. Indeed, his experience of playing the Gerry Weber Open in Halle six years ago was a first-round defeat, hardly a happy memory.

“I like to play in all the tournaments where they really want me,” he told The Times. “It is good for tennis. There is a big change in Halle; they have wanted me to be there for the last few years but [in that time] I really wanted to play in Queen’s.

“The truth is, in the UK you have a big regime of tax, it’s not about the money for playing, it’s not a problem of that. They [Revenue & Customs] take from the sponsors, from Babolat, from Nike and from my watches [he is sponsored by Richard Mille]. This is very difficult. I am playing in the UK and losing money. I did a lot for the last four years, but it is more and more difficult to play in the UK. It is too much.”

He is reminded that one headline suggested that he is going to Germany for the sake of a guaranteed windfall just to show his face. “That’s not the truth,” he said. “The problem is easy to understand. I’m probably getting a bigger guarantee from Queen’s than for playing in Halle but I am losing a lot more money from sponsors.”

Nobody would surely expect a sportsman to come to Britain and accept losing money. Only by reaching the final next year could Nadal be guaranteed to break even. Although he does not say it publicly, there are clearly concerns that if this situation continues, doubts are genuine over the prospect of extending the present deal for the O2 arena in southeast London to host the season-ending Barclays ATP World Tour Finals that runs until 2015.

There are sensitive negotiations going on behind the scenes to try to obviate the demands of the taxman — indeed, Nadal and others had been led to believe that they may have been reaching a successful conclusion — but time is of the essence. He has to let the tournaments know as far in advance as possible where he is going to play and, much to the chagrin of those who pack Queen’s to the rafters to catch a sight of him, it is Germany.

The punitive elements of the law came to light when Andre Agassi, the former world No 1 and Wimbledon champion, discovered that any payments made in connection with activities carried out by a non-resident in the UK as a sportsman are subject to the deduction of UK income tax at source, where the payments are made by foreign companies to a foreign company controlled by him.

Agassi played in tournaments in Britain for a limited number of days and, using a foreign company that he set up and controlled, entered into sponsorship contracts with two non-resident manufacturers of sports and clothing equipment — Nike and Head — and received payments through his company derived (at least in part) from playing in those tournaments.

As a result of monies paid, HMRC assessed him for £27,520 of extra tax in 1998-99. Agassi appealed, but lost in the Special Commissioners and the High Court. In 2004, Agassi went to the Court of Appeal and won. HMRC appealed to the House of Lords, which voted in its favour.

Exceptions can be made case by case. There is a blanket income-tax exemption for all overseas athletes competing in the Olympics next year. The London Organising Committee of the Olympic Games is also exempt from corporation tax and the International Olympic Committee is exempt from income tax and capital gains tax.

All this, combined with the desire to offer something back to his German fans, has driven Nadal into foreign arms. “I respect Halle and one day I want to play Queen’s again,” he said.

Whether he does is a matter for others to answer.

munZe konZa
10-14-2011, 02:47 AM
i mean if 'money' is truly what makes Nadal happy, then that is very pathetic. no maybe's, no 'don't judge', no 'IMO's".... pure and simple if you think it's respectable or even worthy for a person to concern themselves with money more than anything than you are extremely foolish. I don't think that Nadal is really that way at all, but lately it has seemed a bit like it.

but seriously Roddicominator if you think it makes any sense when you are already one of the highest paid athletes in the world and are not particularly playing well to focus more on making money than improving your game... then you are seriously valuing things wrong.

if Nadal really were driven by money than obviously he wouldn't be very respected, it's not rocket science, it's common sense. society has values, and although we care about money because that's how we acquire OBJECTS that can help with temporary happiness, it's quite clear that being greedy is not a beautiful quality to have

look, sports and politics don't mix and they decided to push their noses into sport. Nothing good can come out of that. I think players don't want to give money to a faceless government to fund dubious projects, that's all. Just give them what they owe them , don't mix sports and politics.

Topspindoctor
10-14-2011, 02:53 AM
Nadal just fighting the good fight, why should he give away his money to struggling Euro countries? UK should give up WTF and Olympics as well because they clearly can't afford it :o

mark73
10-14-2011, 03:28 AM
How disturbing this must be to Nadal. I mean loosing all that money to taxes is much worse than starving too death, I mean the wretched poor have no money to loose.

I now see the light. I will become an american who votes republican.

Bobby
10-14-2011, 03:29 AM
Bitching about high taxation is something rich and poor people do. Taxes suck. And if one can avoid paying them at such a steep cost as these players are now, that is what they will and should do.Also, the only pleasure from making money is the green going in the pocket. Work isn't fun. Money and what one can do with it, is fun. Work is just an evil that people have to endure to make it. If people didn't have to work to make money they would jump at that opportunity.

This is pure nonsense. Taxes are what keep our society running. With tax money, we make sure our roads are safe, we have schools, libraries, healthcare, childcare, unemployment benefits etc. Your attitude is very typical nowadays: me, me , me.

And I think Nadal should keep quiet. With all the money he makes, he really shouldn't complain. A lot of the fans save money for year just to be able to go and watch a few matches at the O2. Including me.

mark73
10-14-2011, 03:32 AM
This is pure nonsense. Taxes are what keep our society running. With tax money, we make sure our roads are safe, we have schools, libraries, healthcare, childcare, unemployment benefits etc. Your attitude is very typical nowadays: me, me , me.

And I think Nadal should keep quiet. With all the money he makes, he really shouldn't complain. A lot of the fans save money for year just to be able to go and watch a few matches at the O2. Including me.

He probably voted for George Bush.

Bobby
10-14-2011, 03:39 AM
look, sports and politics don't mix and they decided to push their noses into sport. Nothing good can come out of that. I think players don't want to give money to a faceless government to fund dubious projects, that's all. Just give them what they owe them , don't mix sports and politics.

Wow, this works well. Do you think all the other professions "mix with politics". We are all part of politics, politics is not a bunch of evil people who want to take our money.

Bobby
10-14-2011, 03:41 AM
Nadal just fighting the good fight, why should he give away his money to struggling Euro countries? UK should give up WTF and Olympics as well because they clearly can't afford it :o

According to this logic, he really should pay even more, because he comes from one of the struggling euro countries, as you put it.

Lurking
10-14-2011, 03:45 AM
Nadal just fighting the good fight, why should he give away his money to struggling Euro countries? UK should give up WTF and Olympics as well because they clearly can't afford it :o

Bankrupt Euro countries otherwise known as Spain?

We all know the real reason, the Spanish government is asking it's Athletes to kiss German arse so they bail them out.

MuzzahLovah
10-14-2011, 03:56 AM
He probably voted for George Bush.

Exactly. I wouldn't think you encounter so many knuckle dragging conservatards in an forum discussing and elegant and multicultural sport like tennis.

Bobby
10-14-2011, 03:56 AM
I'm stunned everyone here is talking about Nadal being "greedy". This has nothing to do with greed, it's a matter of principle. Nadal earns the money he gets paid and he feels it's wrong for the UK government to take half of his paycheck. I agree with him completely. The players earn the money and they are entitled to the dollars they earn - not the government. Nadal's issue is not about paying taxes in general, but rather paying a ridiculous taxrate by almost any reasonable person's standards.

I'm sure Nadal would rather use his extra money and put it towards his charity to help people, as opposed to giving it in tax to the UK government, so they can give it to their banker buddies under the pretext of "bailouts".

The UK government is greedy - Not Rafael Nadal.

Wow, haven't seen this much nonsense for a while. Stimulating stuff, keep up the good work!

Topspindoctor
10-14-2011, 04:00 AM
Bankrupt Euro countries otherwise known as Spain?

We all know the real reason, the Spanish government is asking it's Athletes to kiss German arse so they bail them out.

It's not Spain that is trying to take advantage of superstars like Nadal to boost its failing economy :bigwave:

Bobby
10-14-2011, 04:03 AM
It's not Spain that is trying to take advantage of superstars like Nadal to boost its failing economy :bigwave:

Do you think this particular tax was created just for Nadal and other sportsmen?

Topspindoctor
10-14-2011, 04:03 AM
What? He's a professional athlete with millions of dollars under his name. He shouldn't be complaining about taxes, of all things :rolleyes: He's an ugly, greedy man :rolleyes: Then again, he is a little crybaby too, so it's not too surprising, I guess :shrug:

:rolleyes:

http://images.mirror.co.uk/upl/m4/feb2010/5/8/andy-murray-pic-getty-images-852821445.jpg

You should watch who you're accusing of being a "crybaby", Mugraytard. Your boy cries like a girl who fell into a puddle and dirtied her pink dress after that humiliation Olderer delivered to the huge mouth :wavey:

Topspindoctor
10-14-2011, 04:05 AM
Do you think this particular tax was created just for Nadal and other sportsmen?

No, it's an attempt to rip everyone off who has big earning power - Nadal is the only one with the balls to speak up.

Bobby
10-14-2011, 04:08 AM
No, it's an attempt to rip everyone off who has big earning power - Nadal is the only one with the balls to speak up.

Right. Let's make the poor and unemployed all pay more, because that way we can really keep our society going. Some of you should really spend a few hours reading about economics and society in general.

Topspindoctor
10-14-2011, 04:14 AM
Right. Let's make the poor and unemployed all pay more, because that way we can really keep our society going. Some of you should really spend a few hours reading about economics and society in general.

Most of the poor and the unemployed are there because of decisions of their own making such as drug abuse, unwillingness to work and blaming others for their failures.

Why should guys who work hard all their life and make endless sacrifices carry the trash of society on their backs?

I am not a rich person, to be honest I don't make enough to be even able to afford overpriced London Olympics - however I still don't think guys like Nadal and Fed should get milked just because they make a lot of money.

We shouldn't encourage the behavior of believing the people who make a lot of money owe some trailer trash something. THAT is what is wrong with the society today. Belief of self-entitlement.

jmjhb
10-14-2011, 04:22 AM
I don't think I've ever seen a post as spectacularly and offensively wrong as the one above.

Topspindoctor will be advocating the return of slavery next.

abraxas21
10-14-2011, 04:42 AM
He hates indoor tennis especially at the O2 because it's super fast.

it isn't.

abraxas21
10-14-2011, 04:44 AM
Most of the poor and the unemployed are there because of decisions of their own making such as drug abuse, unwillingness to work and blaming others for their failures.

Why should guys who work hard all their life and make endless sacrifices carry the trash of society on their backs?

I am not a rich person, to be honest I don't make enough to be even able to afford overpriced London Olympics - however I still don't think guys like Nadal and Fed should get milked just because they make a lot of money.

We shouldn't encourage the behavior of believing the people who make a lot of money owe some trailer trash something. THAT is what is wrong with the society today. Belief of self-entitlement.

at first i was like :rolleyes:

but then i was like :facepalm:

and finally i was like :superlol:

eclecticist
10-14-2011, 05:08 AM
obviously...he knows he will retire soon and is trying to earn as much money as he can before he does

Raferminator
10-14-2011, 05:13 AM
The Tards who are whining about Rafa making ALLLLLL that money, and winning slams like so many nickels and dimes, are just plain HYPOCRITES! :mad: If you had ALL that delicious money you'd spend it all on Yachts, Mansions, Sports Cars, Endangered Species for Exotic Pets and you would lose track of how many homes you owned and how many people worked for you like Slaves getting jack squat while you basically controlled their pitiful little lives! That is what you'd do, so what do you expect from Rafa? :shrug:

Rafa is just doing what anyone one of us would do because maybe, just maybe, he wants to own that fancy Golf Course in South America so he can quietly play it by himself IF he decides to EVER go visit there that is. Rafa doesn't HAVE to create SQUAT with that lovely dough. He owns it and he owns everything that goes with it. Rafa makes the rules, folks. The news, war, peace, famine, upheaval, the price per paper clip. Rafa picks that rabbit out of the hat while everybody sits out there wondering how the hell we did it. Now you're not naive enough to think we're living in a world that cares about other people's misfortunes, ARE YOU!? Didn't you get the memo that Social Darwinism is how it all works?

The point is, ladies and gentleman, that greed, for lack of a better word, is good. :yeah: Greed is right, Greed works! Greed clarifies, it cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit. Greed, in all of its forms; greed for life, for money, for love, for people's souls...it is ALL Good! Greed has marked the upward surge of mankind. And greed, you mark my words, will not only save Tennis, but will save that other malfunctioning corporation called the ITF. Thank you very much!

SERBINATOR
10-14-2011, 05:25 AM
Nadal Whining again ?

lol after the epic Hawk-eye fiasco now THIS ?

he is taking Tennis as a 9-5 job, bitching about schedules and now Money ? this is a sign of a player who is not Passionate about what he is doing

Benny_Maths
10-14-2011, 05:43 AM
No, it's an attempt to rip everyone off who has big earning power - Nadal is the only one with the balls to speak up.

Cross-subsidisation is an inherent part of any tax system. People pay taxes which end up being used for many things which are of no benefit to them. Every taxpayer is burdened with this, not just Nadal. In fact, a rich guy will feel the affects of taxes a lot less than most people who are on average incomes.

Bobby
10-14-2011, 05:49 AM
The Tards who are whining about Rafa making ALLLLLL that money, and winning slams like so many nickels and dimes, are just plain HYPOCRITES! :mad: If you had ALL that delicious money you'd spend it all on Yachts, Mansions, Sports Cars, Endangered Species for Exotic Pets and you would lose track of how many homes you owned and how many people worked for you like Slaves getting jack squat while you basically controlled their pitiful little lives! That is what you'd do, so what do you expect from Rafa? :shrug:

Rafa is just doing what anyone one of us would do because maybe, just maybe, he wants to own that fancy Golf Course in South America so he can quietly play it by himself IF he decides to EVER go visit there that is. Rafa doesn't HAVE to create SQUAT with that lovely dough. He owns it and he owns everything that goes with it. Rafa makes the rules, folks. The news, war, peace, famine, upheaval, the price per paper clip. Rafa picks that rabbit out of the hat while everybody sits out there wondering how the hell we did it. Now you're not naive enough to think we're living in a world that cares about other people's misfortunes, ARE YOU!? Didn't you get the memo that Social Darwinism is how it all works?

The point is, ladies and gentleman, that greed, for lack of a better word, is good. :yeah: Greed is right, Greed works! Greed clarifies, it cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit. Greed, in all of its forms; greed for life, for money, for love, for people's souls...it is ALL Good! Greed has marked the upward surge of mankind. And greed, you mark my words, will not only save Tennis, but will save that other malfunctioning corporation called the ITF. Thank you very much!

Quoting Gordon Gekko will not make argument any stronger... Gekko was so greed that he ended up in prison and lost his family, money and around 20 years as well...

Say Hey Kid
10-14-2011, 05:51 AM
Wow, haven't seen this much nonsense for a while. Stimulating stuff, keep up the good work!

The idea of being entitled to keep the majority of what you earn through work is nonsense?

I love the haters in this thread. Just because Nadal is successful and rightfully earns alot of money he should gladly hand over 50% of his paycheck to the government with a smile? This includes half of all money he earns through prize money, apperance fees, and even from his sponsors when he's at the event. Do you sincerely think it's reasonable to tax someone at a 50% rate?

The ironic thing is a good portion of people in support of taxing Nadal 50% most likely don't pay any taxes at all and are the degenerates receiving government checks in the mail every month.

BroTree123
10-14-2011, 06:08 AM
Money Talks.........bullshit Walks.

Roamed
10-14-2011, 06:38 AM
The ironic thing is a good portion of people in support of taxing Nadal 50% most likely don't pay any taxes at all and are the degenerates receiving government checks in the mail every month.

Oh give me a break. Do you think everyone who doesn't support social inequality is greedily trying to suck money off the state? I come from a well off family, I'll likely never need benefits ever, and if I end up richer because I earn more as I've been able to go to university with my place subsidised by the state then damn right I'm paying more taxes for that privilege. People born into poverty, both relative and absolute, face barriers for the rest of their lives. I'd like to see the bankers who caused the recession doing jobs like building the roads they drive on and making the clothes they wear, all for next to nothing. Ugh.

Like I said before - Rafa can resent this tax in private. Not many people enjoy giving up their money if they don't see the benefit of doing it. But complaining about it in public is not on.

MaxPower
10-14-2011, 06:47 AM
The idea of being entitled to keep the majority of what you earn through work is nonsense?

I love the haters in this thread. Just because Nadal is successful and rightfully earns alot of money he should gladly hand over 50% of his paycheck to the government with a smile? This includes half of all money he earns through prize money, apperance fees, and even from his sponsors when he's at the event. Do you sincerely think it's reasonable to tax someone at a 50% rate?

The ironic thing is a good portion of people in support of taxing Nadal 50% most likely don't pay any taxes at all and are the degenerates receiving government checks in the mail every month.

The marginal tax in Sweden used to be almost exactly 50% if you earned enough. Now it's been creeping downwards a few percent but come on. 50% tax doesn't sound unreasonable to me at least :shrug:

Now getting 750.000 for just for dragging your ass to Halle that sounds unreasonable. Tax more

syc23
10-14-2011, 07:51 AM
By the time WTF moves away from London, Rafa will be done anyway so why bother? There's no guarantees that WTF will definately moved anyway as success might tempt the ATP to keep it in London.

That said, the UK tax system is fucked up, I have been working since college for 10+ years and have made a good career out of design probably to see my taxes wasted on wars and benefit scroungers.

Kat_YYZ
10-14-2011, 08:11 AM
I agree, Matt, but that doesn't mean I won't try to evade paying them. Taxes are needed, but does that mean I like them? No, I hate taxes, it's earned money out of my pocket, earned money I can spend on myself. So if anyone has the opportunity to not pay taxes, they should take it and most will take it.

:stupid:

Taxes are needed, but everyone should try to avoid paying them??? Where will they come from, then? Fall from the sky?

By the way, not every ultra-rich person thinks taxes should be avoided, or even lowered:

http://articles.businessinsider.com/2011-08-15/news/30006203_1_lower-tax-tax-rates-capital-gains

habibko
10-14-2011, 08:59 AM
what a whiny little money whore

your_valentine
10-14-2011, 09:09 AM
Modest Nadull strikes back? He exposes his selfish side once again :wavey:

Castafiore
10-14-2011, 09:09 AM
Rafael Nadal has always resisted moving to a tax shelter (unlike many rich sports stars, incl. a great deal of tennis players). He's still living in Spain, paying full taxes there because he - as he said in an earlier interview and no, I don't have it to quote - feels no problem in paying taxes to his home country.

I think that Rafa had a contract with Queens so he's moving to Halle now that this contract is fulfilled (instead of extending his contract with Queens).

The problem started with one of the trashy UK tabloids saying in their usual subtle manner that he's going to Halle because they pay a higher appearance fee. They made it public and Rafa responded to it, saying that it's not the appearance money as such, but it's the tax regulation in the UK. that's over-the-top. So, Nadal didn't bring it up, he responded to it.

The timing of this is bad, however. The crisis is once again hitting hard, people are facing severe cutbacks, possible job loss, fears over their retirement money,... so they won't sympathise with a rich sportstar however....

...a rule like this is ludicrous and out of proportion:
Government rules state that sportsmen and women competing or even just practicing in the UK are taxed a proportion of their income from endorsements and sponsorships even if those deals have nothing to do with Britain.

Pirata.
10-14-2011, 09:13 AM
Oh give me a break. Do you think everyone who doesn't support social inequality is greedily trying to suck money off the state? I come from a well off family, I'll likely never need benefits ever, and if I end up richer because I earn more as I've been able to go to university with my place subsidised by the state then damn right I'm paying more taxes for that privilege. People born into poverty, both relative and absolute, face barriers for the rest of their lives. I'd like to see the bankers who caused the recession doing jobs like building the roads they drive on and making the clothes they wear, all for next to nothing. Ugh.

:worship:

I agree, Matt, but that doesn't mean I won't try to evade paying them. Taxes are needed, but does that mean I like them? No, I hate taxes, it's earned money out of my pocket, earned money I can spend on myself. So if anyone has the opportunity to not pay taxes, they should take it and most will take it.

:facepalm:

What a stupid post. Taxes go towards paying for public health services, education, government, social security, defense, police & fire departments, infrastructure, culture, the environment, etc. Don't complain that it's earned money out of your pocket if you use any of these services because it's our tax money that help keep some of them funded.

Sunset of Age
10-14-2011, 09:26 AM
Oh give me a break. Do you think everyone who doesn't support social inequality is greedily trying to suck money off the state? I come from a well off family, I'll likely never need benefits ever, and if I end up richer because I earn more as I've been able to go to university with my place subsidised by the state then damn right I'm paying more taxes for that privilege. People born into poverty, both relative and absolute, face barriers for the rest of their lives. I'd like to see the bankers who caused the recession doing jobs like building the roads they drive on and making the clothes they wear, all for next to nothing. Ugh.

Like I said before - Rafa can resent this tax in private. Not many people enjoy giving up their money if they don't see the benefit of doing it. But complaining about it in public is not on.

Well said. :yeah:

Rafael Nadal has always resisted moving to a tax shelter (unlike many rich sports stars, incl. a great deal of tennis players). He's still living in Spain, paying full taxes there because he - as he said in an earlier interview and no, I don't have it to quote - feels no problem in paying taxes to his home country.

I think that Rafa had a contract with Queens so he's moving to Halle now that this contract is fulfilled (instead of extending his contract with Queens).

The problem started with one of the trashy UK tabloids saying in their usual subtle manner that he's going to Halle because they pay a higher appearance fee. They made it public and Rafa responded to it, saying that it's not the appearance money as such, but it's the tax regulation in the UK. that's over-the-top. So, Nadal didn't bring it up, he responded to it.

The timing of this is bad, however. The crisis is once again hitting hard, people are facing severe cutbacks, possible job loss, fears over their retirement money,... so they won't sympathise with a rich sportstar however....

...a rule like this is ludicrous and out of proportion:

Agree for the most, but perhaps Rafa would have done wiser to just not react to those filthy tabloid vultures at all? Hard to do at times of course, but quite often a shrug of the shoulders and 'no comment' are the best ways to deal with vile in the press.

Myrre
10-14-2011, 09:29 AM
Because making as much money as possible should be the objective for anyone. There is no such thing as too much money. And you never know how much money you'll need, so if you keep making a lot of it without any dry spells, you'll be able to do what you want and have what you want, and live the dream life.

Well that'd pretty much be the definition of greed in my book.

Castafiore
10-14-2011, 09:33 AM
Agree for the most, but perhaps Rafa would have done wiser to just not react to those filthy tabloid vultures at all? Hard to do at times of course, but quite often a shrug of the shoulders and 'no comment' are the best ways to deal with vile in the press.
True.

He didn't respond directly to the tabloid, though. if I'm not mistaken (because I didn't follow the story from that close), he responded to questions asked about it by a journalist he trusts: Neil Harman (who wrote a balanced article about it).

But perhaps he should have stayed quiet on it alltogether.

Sunset of Age
10-14-2011, 09:42 AM
True.

He didn't respond directly to the tabloid, though. if I'm not mistaken (because I didn't follow the story from that close), he responded to questions asked about it by a journalist he trusts: Neil Harman (who wrote a balanced article about it).

But perhaps he should have stayed quiet on it alltogether.

Yeah I think that would have been far better, even if you talk about such a touchy subject with a trustworthy journo (do those folks even exist? :p), you should perhaps realize that the story will be out there on the streets anyways, and consequetively misinterpreted/abused by journo's with a little sloppier morals... but that's a clear case of 'wise after the event', isn't it.

Kat_YYZ
10-14-2011, 09:57 AM
To tell you the truth, I don't even disagree that the tax rule is excessive, especially as it relates to getting a percentage of sponsor money, endorsements, etc., stuff that doesn't even relate to the tournament you're coming to play.

And I'm not even saying that Nadal should keep quiet about it, because nothing ever changes if people don't speak up and bring things out into the open. It's just that Nadal is so ineloquent (in any language; it's not an English thing) that he really should be using someone else to convey his position on these issues. And perhaps addressing them from a different point of view -- like how these taxes would impact a lower-ranked player who doesn't make as much money overall.

Castafiore
10-14-2011, 10:03 AM
It's just that Nadal is so ineloquent (in any language; it's not an English thing) that he really should be using someone else to convey his position on these issues.
Exaggerated.

He's very eloquent in his own language.

The Magician
10-14-2011, 10:10 AM
What a joke. If Nadull never earned another penny he would have enough money to do anything he ever wanted for the rest of his life. It's not like the world needs tennis players, you think he'd be a little more humble (so much for that) and thankful for making millions doing something completely unnecessary to society.

I guess bribing the entire ATP organization costs a lot of money, he must be going broke :o

Jade Fox
10-14-2011, 10:16 AM
How disturbing this must be to Nadal. I mean loosing all that money to taxes is much worse than starving too death, I mean the wretched poor have no money to loose.

I now see the light. I will become an american who votes republican.

I'm with you on this. So what if it was corporate greed that nearly took the entire world's economy into another depression? So what if it's primarily Republicans who don't want the rich to be taxed or Wall Street to be held accountable for their actions?

So fucking what? IT'S ALL ABOUT ME!!!!! I'm gonna become a Republican and be the female Herman Cain! Woo woo! :aparty:


Okay seriously now, all these fools quoting Gordon Gecko? Uh he went to prison because of his greed. And for much of the sequel to Wall Street he basically denounces the whole "Greed is Good" philosophy.

And I do like Rafa but dude, this tax issue doesn't really hurt him in the long run now does it? He goes to London twice a year at the most, is still raking in millions of dollars a year, and lives a very priviledged life.

So sorry Rafa(and any rich player who might complain as well) but I gotta do this:

http://troll.me/images/sizing-alan-rickman/little-violin-its-playing-for-you.jpg

Castafiore
10-14-2011, 10:31 AM
It's not just tennis, though. It's affecting quite a few other sports events in the UK. For example, the organizers of the Ryder Cup have expressed their concern.

Let's drag this away from tennis and focus on athletics.

Usain Bolt can ask about $ 250.000 for a running appearance but in the UK, he's also taxed on a proportion of his worldwide endorsements (even if there's no link at all to the UK).

So, on the income side: you have $ 250.000 (see link below)

Does anybody know what his endorsement deals are worth worldwide?
Suppose it's $ 40 million.
The UK can tax 1/10 of that money if he turns up for a sports event or if he even just practices in the UK. 1/10 = $ 4 million.
This gets taxed for 50%, so the UK tax bill would be $ 2 million.

This means that Usain Bolt would actually be PAYING a lot of money to run/practice in the UK. That's an utterly crazy system, that.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/athletics/7886111/Usain-Bolt-confirms-he-will-miss-London-Grand-Prix-due-to-Britains-tax-laws.html



How disturbing this must be to Nadal. I mean loosing all that money to taxes is much worse than starving too death, I mean the wretched poor have no money to loose.
You're going to ridiculous extremes with that ^ comment.

Paying taxes so that public services can be afforded is one thing but paying more than you earn is ludicrious whether you're struggling or filthy rich.

You should only be paying taxes in a country based on the income and wealth you actually gather within that country.

Start da Game
10-14-2011, 10:47 AM
rafa haters lives revolve completely around nadal's occasional dips in results and are based on picking on him at every opportunity......he's talking for himself and his fellow players......nobody likes to see his hard earned cash evaporate in the form of taxes......

what if a not so rich hardworker like mardy fish makes it to the world tour finals and what if he has high hopes of earning big cash through this event? nadal can withstand the taxes but fish if he loses all his group matches, will most possibly return home having incurred a loss......

Tennis-Life
10-14-2011, 11:04 AM
More than agree with Nadal. British taxes are too high compared with other European countries :mad:

Sunset of Age
10-14-2011, 11:06 AM
More than agree with Nadal. British taxes are too high compared with other European countries :mad:

You should come and live in my country for a while. :hatoff:

lalit
10-14-2011, 11:43 AM
Uk tax laws are insane. So glad I immigrated to the States. And yes it is no crime to want lower taxes so that you can raise your family better rather than taking care of deadbeats' offspring. Given that half of Europe is bankrupt it is not even viable.

mark73
10-14-2011, 01:14 PM
I'm with you on this. So what if it was corporate greed that nearly took the entire world's economy into another depression? So what if it's primarily Republicans who don't want the rich to be taxed or Wall Street to be held accountable for their actions?

So fucking what? IT'S ALL ABOUT ME!!!!! I'm gonna become a Republican and be the female Herman Cain! Woo woo! :aparty:


Okay seriously now, all these fools quoting Gordon Gecko? Uh he went to prison because of his greed. And for much of the sequel to Wall Street he basically denounces the whole "Greed is Good" philosophy.

And I do like Rafa but dude, this tax issue doesn't really hurt him in the long run now does it? He goes to London twice a year at the most, is still raking in millions of dollars a year, and lives a very priviledged life.

So sorry Rafa(and any rich player who might complain as well) but I gotta do this:

http://troll.me/images/sizing-alan-rickman/little-violin-its-playing-for-you.jpg

Their are scientific studies also that show that their is no correlation between how much you make (above a modest amount, roughly 30k american) and happiness.

What type of society would one choose if one did not know where one will end up (e.g poor parents/rich parents, healthy/sick)? The answer is the type of welfare society that John Rawls (hands down the most influential political philosopher of the 20th century) advocates.

I think the type of society far right wings want is due either to some outdated metaphysical view of free will (which they implicitly believe in) and thus a lack of understanding of cause and effect (or a denial of cause and effect) and/or a cruel heart.

nalbyfan
10-14-2011, 01:29 PM
Poor guy, he uses each penny till it cries...he's like a homeless or a single mother...this greedy mentality is not a big surprise, this guy has no class, no honour...he moans as if he was out of money but he's richer that 90% of people
Disgusting attitude

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 01:43 PM
Your attitude is very typical nowadays: me, me , me.

It is all about me when it comes to my money. And life in general. Me, myself and I, above anything and anyone else. That's the way life works. Gotta put yourself first to ensure personal happiness and satisfaction.

rubbERR
10-14-2011, 01:47 PM
Its good to see that someone is not afraid to talk, Nadal may well become savior of tennis.

Federer is scared to talk, what have you heard from him? Yes, nothing.

Only King Nadal trying to make some positive changes.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 01:47 PM
Well that'd pretty much be the definition of greed in my book.

There isn't anything wrong with being greedy within reason.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 02:02 PM
Most of the poor and the unemployed are there because of decisions of their own making such as drug abuse, unwillingness to work and blaming others for their failures.

Belief of self-entitlement.

These two statements I agree with to varying degrees. It is true a lot of poor people are there because of their own misgivings, and it is true a lot of poor people who do luck into money blow it as soon as they make it. It's true a lot of people feel entitled to make money instead of working for it and it's true that these people are bitter towards those who make cash.

The rest of your post I don't support.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 02:05 PM
I agree with your premise that Nadal is absolutely entitled to the vast majority of what he earns, but just because he is against giving 50% of his earnings to the government does not mean he's more interested in himself than other people.
That may be true, what I'm saying is, that even if he were, there is absolutely nothing wrong in that. There is nothing wrong in focusing on yourself and your life/financial/sport/etc. situation above others. Because, ultimately, it's your life, so you should be looking out for you, first and foremost.

The Magician
10-14-2011, 02:06 PM
It is all about me when it comes to my money. And life in general. Me, myself and I, above anything and anyone else. That's the way life works. Gotta put yourself first to ensure personal happiness and satisfaction.

This is called being an asshole and a greedy, selfish, spoiled brat which is exactly what people are accusing Nadull of. So thanks for putting Nadull's feelings in simple terms, makes it easier to dismiss him and you.

mark73
10-14-2011, 02:09 PM
There isn't anything wrong with being greedy within reason.

There is a distinction between ambition and greed. Ambition is required for the creation of jobs. This is vital. But to believe one is entitled to all the money they make in a society that made it possible in the first place for them to make that money, that is greed. All people are a product of society (and genetics).

By giving back in taxes you make it possible for others to be successful (not to mention to help prevent unimaginable suffering) which in turn is good for the economy.

Besides if you get too much inequality you eventually get a revolution. History is proof of this. In the states alone there are countless examples.

Fujee
10-14-2011, 02:10 PM
I like the guy but this is pretty greedy. He earns millions of pounds.

abraxas21
10-14-2011, 02:13 PM
There isn't anything wrong with being greedy within reason.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_6Y-NXZmDcxU/TK860ZPxHqI/AAAAAAAAMh8/kFCnT1iKHBo/s1600/greedy+capitalist+pig.jpg

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 02:14 PM
:stupid:

Taxes are needed, but everyone should try to avoid paying them??? Where will they come from, then? Fall from the sky?

By the way, not every ultra-rich person thinks taxes should be avoided, or even lowered:

http://articles.businessinsider.com/2011-08-15/news/30006203_1_lower-tax-tax-rates-capital-gains

Obviously, people are in unlucky situations where we have to pay taxes. And yes, I know where the taxes go, and the benefits of taxes. But again, it's money out of my pocket. Money I can spend on going shopping, or doing something I want to do. So, I'm not going to be happy nor do I actually want to pay taxes. If I didn't have to, I wouldn't. Because it means I have more money for myself.

jmjhb
10-14-2011, 02:18 PM
Filo V should consider the fact that not everyone is as narcissistic as he is.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 02:18 PM
There is a distinction between ambition and greed. Ambition is required for the creation of jobs. This is vital. But to believe one is entitled to all the money they make in a society that made it possible in the first place for them to make that money, that is greed. All people are a product of society (and genetics).

By giving back in taxes you make it possible for others to be successful (not to mention to help prevent unimaginable suffering) which in turn is good for the economy.

Besides if you get too much inequality you eventually get a revolution. History is proof of this. In the states alone there are countless examples.

Entitled isn't the correct word, because, again, I agree taxes are a needed thing. I'm not anti-tax. The word is desire. I desire to make money and keep money. And that's my #1 and really only focus. If I'm happy and got money, I'm set.

green25814
10-14-2011, 02:20 PM
Rafa needs all the money he can get. He exchanges most of it for coins. He is practicing his coin toss skills, he knows he needs to win the toss to win the matches. He spends many hours flipping different coins, getting Uncle Toni to flip coins, and he watches intently and tries to guess which side it will land on. He carries this refined skill into matches and he will be very tough to beat on the coin toss.

:haha:

:worship:

abraxas21
10-14-2011, 02:28 PM
hello, my name is rafael and im a capitalist tennis player from the island of manacor
the island in question is fully owned by my uncle toni btw
i dont want to play in gran bretaña
because the island monkeys have set the tax bar too high for my taste
also their queen is an old push-over
still, i'm going to play in halle next year
because i know that my close amigo roger federer will be there
and i think the ballerina will be ready for taking me out for a dance

Henry Chinaski
10-14-2011, 02:35 PM
How much did it cost Agassi to appeal that 27k all the way to the house of Lords?

Roadmap
10-14-2011, 02:54 PM
Filo V should consider the fact that not everyone is as narcissistic as he is.

Do you believe in miracles.

Sapeod
10-14-2011, 03:44 PM
:rolleyes:

http://images.mirror.co.uk/upl/m4/feb2010/5/8/andy-murray-pic-getty-images-852821445.jpg

You should watch who you're accusing of being a "crybaby", Mugraytard. Your boy cries like a girl who fell into a puddle and dirtied her pink dress after that humiliation Olderer delivered to the huge mouth :wavey:
You're kidding, right? :lol: Andy was emotional over a big defeat. Nadal is whining because he doesn't like that he has to pay tax when he has millions in the bank. There's a MASSIVE DIFFERENCE there :wavey: The difference being that Nadal is a massively greedy little pig :wavey:

green25814
10-14-2011, 03:47 PM
hello, my name is rafael and im a capitalist tennis player from the island of manacor
the island in question is fully owned by my uncle toni btw
i dont want to play in gran bretaña
because the island monkeys have set the tax bar too high for my taste
also their queen is an old push-over
still, i'm going to play in halle next year
because i know that my close amigo roger federer will be there
and i think the ballerina will be ready for taking me out for a dance

Ok, this thread is now officially gold, no pun intended

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 04:03 PM
Filo V should consider the fact that not everyone is as narcissistic as he is.

Confidence=narcissism? No. I just have a lot of self-confidence, and I find it too bad others don't have that for themselves.

Clydey
10-14-2011, 04:08 PM
Nadal could do with reading this:

http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/how-rich-is-too-rich/

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 04:13 PM
rafael Nadal already makes far enough for a career based on a sport ... there are some people out there who work very hard and struggle. i'm not recommending socialism BUT certainly no one should be applauding Nadal for being greedy. he makes tens of millions of dollars a year, this desperate attempt to get taxed less just makes him seem like a punk..... Filo V, a player who is truly passionate about their sport and is already making TONS of money should be more concerned with PLAYING the sport than FIGHTING TAX laws. seriously, what is wrong with you AND Nadal.....

So, because Rafa makes a lot of money already, he shouldn't seek to make more money. Even though one of the main things in life anyone does is make money, and seek as much as they need to live. Somehow that changes because Rafa is a professional athlete? He's not allowed to seek to make as much money as possible? And not be penalized by a high tax number? That's ridiculous. He's doing what almost ANYONE in the world would do, which is improve his financial situation, and deserves no criticism.

As for playing the sport, he can do that and also seek to make as much money as possible in doing so. Because, at the end of the day, players drive the sport, this is his line of work, so therefore he's going to seek what, at the end of the day, players play for, which is money. Without money there isn't a sport and there aren't players playing.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 04:17 PM
I completely disagree. Mainly for reasons you wouldn't understand even if I tried to explain them. You wrote that "without money, you're nothing in this world." - You're right. The difference between us is that I honestly feel no need to be adored by our superficial society.

Of course I don't mean that I hate money... but collecting it has never been a life goal in itself for me. And it probably never will be. I'm happy enough already.

I don't need to be adored, but I also know that money gets you places. I couldn't care less about society, society is bullshit. People are bullshit. I care about my life and my place in it, and I know that with money, it's improved. Nothing else in this situation matters.

I'm glad you have found personal happiness, that's important. It's important to be happy in who you are as a person, but to be happy in your life, you need money.

Just like heaven
10-14-2011, 04:19 PM
He's not complaining. :rolleyes: He just answered the questions at the press conference and he's just telling it like it is. The problem isn't just about his money.

The sports believe that they and the athletes are being treated unfairly, particularly as football has been granted an exemption to the measures to allow Wembley to host the 2011 Champions League final.
As well taxing competitors on prize money earned in the UK, athletes are taxed on their global endorsement income, calculated on the proportion of events they play in Britain. If, for example, Bolt races 10 times in a year with just one event in the UK, the taxman would claim 10 per cent of his multi-million dollar earnings.
Other sportsmen understood to have avoided UK events, in part because of the tax issue, include Roger Federer, who has never played at Queen's, and Sergio Garcia, who is thought to require a top-three finish at this week's Open to avoid losing money on his week in Scotland.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/golf/rydercup/7888472/Usain-Bolts-tax-dash-from-UK-causes-alarm-for-Ryder-Cup-organisers.html

Sapeod
10-14-2011, 04:20 PM
He's not complaining. :rolleyes: He just answered the questions at the press conference and he's just telling it like it is. The problem isn't just about his money.



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/golf/rydercup/7888472/Usain-Bolts-tax-dash-from-UK-causes-alarm-for-Ryder-Cup-organisers.html
Of course it's about his money. He's a greedy little clown who wants as much money as possible now that he's falling :wavey:

Just like heaven
10-14-2011, 04:21 PM
Of course it's about his money. He's a greedy little clown who wants as much money as possible now that he's falling :wavey:

Go watch Cartoon Network or something..

Sapeod
10-14-2011, 04:28 PM
Go watch Cartoon Network or something..
:spit:

Nice comeback :superlol:

Pirata.
10-14-2011, 04:29 PM
Love the classism in this post, keep up the good work, MTF :o

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 04:35 PM
At this stage in Rafa's career, he earns too much money outside of tennis to allow the British government to pull 50% of his extra-curricular income [i.e. Nike, Babolat, RIchard Mille, Armani, Quely, etc.] out of his pockets as well as 50% of his tennis money. That's ridiculous, and no sane person would agree to it. Why should he donate all that money to the British government when he can play in Germany & keep his hard- earned cash? The man's family lives in Spain. I'm sure he'd rather give that money to his school in India than to contribute to the upkeep of Buckingham Palace.

Why do many players live in Monaco? TAXES. Tennis players careers are very short. They've got to be shrewd & not allow their earnings to be sucked up by various governments.

Exactly. It's what any intelligent businessman would do.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 04:42 PM
This is called being an asshole and a greedy, selfish, spoiled brat which is exactly what people are accusing Nadull of. So thanks for putting Nadull's feelings in simple terms, makes it easier to dismiss him and you.

No, it's called looking out for yourself. It's wrong to care about yourself now? I don't think so. I love myself, so why shouldn't I seek the best for myself? That goes for anyone else. Anyone who loves themselves will seek the best for themselves at any given opportunity.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 04:47 PM
He's not complaining. :rolleyes: He just answered the questions at the press conference and he's just telling it like it is. The problem isn't just about his money.



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/golf/rydercup/7888472/Usain-Bolts-tax-dash-from-UK-causes-alarm-for-Ryder-Cup-organisers.html

Exactly. He's doing what anyone would do in his shoes, which is look out for himself and his money and taking advantage of the better financial opportunity in light of the UK having a questionable tax system.

martyn
10-14-2011, 04:48 PM
Don't see the problem with Nadal's stance at all, seems a bit ridiculous to have to reach the latter stages of a tourney to 'break even' so to speak.

Probably unwise to stick his opinion in the public domain however.

Hensafmurrafter
10-14-2011, 04:48 PM
For the first time ever I actually agree with you.

Whiny, rich assholes bring all of us together ;)

ETA: I think this thread proves that a couple of us have been reading WAY too much Ayn Rand.

Egreen
10-14-2011, 06:48 PM
Nadal :facepalm:

Roadmap
10-14-2011, 06:57 PM
A charity should be set up so people can donate money to Nadull to ensure he doesn't go without food, water and clothing etc. Poor fella.

Matt01
10-14-2011, 07:09 PM
Go watch Cartoon Network or something..

+1

rocketassist
10-14-2011, 07:10 PM
Most of the poor and the unemployed are there because of decisions of their own making such as drug abuse, unwillingness to work and blaming others for their failures.

Why should guys who work hard all their life and make endless sacrifices carry the trash of society on their backs?

I am not a rich person, to be honest I don't make enough to be even able to afford overpriced London Olympics - however I still don't think guys like Nadal and Fed should get milked just because they make a lot of money.

We shouldn't encourage the behavior of believing the people who make a lot of money owe some trailer trash something. THAT is what is wrong with the society today. Belief of self-entitlement.

Fucking Tory scum. Hope you get the shit kicked out of you when you come to the Olympics (this isn't wishing death for any pedantic mods waiting to jump).

swebright
10-14-2011, 10:25 PM
Paying 50% on winning money, I can accept. But tax on endorsement deals should be payable to his home country only and that's it. I simply couldn't blame him.

swebright
10-14-2011, 10:27 PM
Oh my god, I don't know how things work in Australia, but you're so off reality. :facepalm:

There is some truth in what he is saying.:o

arm
10-14-2011, 10:30 PM
There is some truth in what he is saying.:o

There's about 1000 times more insensitivity and generalization there than truth.

There's an idiom, it goes like this: "walk a mile in my shoes"...

arm
10-14-2011, 10:41 PM
The poor people who keep reproducing when they can barely take care of themselves expect the rich to pay for all of their services as well. It's just a sickeningly entitled mentality. TPD is absolutely right, those that produce and entertain and are able to make a lot of money shouldn't have to carry the trash of society on their backs just because most of society is incredibly short-sighted and inefficient.

:facepalm: "poor people who keep reproducing". :facepalm: Feels like you're talking about animals.
Obvisouly, you have never been "poor". Do you actually think that poor people think the richer should pay for their services?

You people seriously live a reality check. You have no idea what's like having no money to buy your kids school books.

Roadmap
10-14-2011, 10:56 PM
For time immemorial the working class have been shat on. Fuck the landlords.

Johnny Groove
10-14-2011, 11:17 PM
Maybe if governments spent tax monies on actual road construction, public employment, education, health care, and other things that actually enhance society instead of directly into the pockets of politicians, lawyers, cops, judges, bankers, and other corrupt people and organizations, the world wouldn't be in this global financial shit storm.

The rich get richer, the poor get poorer. The richest 1% wipe their asses with $100 bills while everyone else is barely getting by. And people wonder why crime, drug and alcohol consumption, and suicides are at an all time high.

Oh, and Nadal is right.

Roddickominator
10-14-2011, 11:27 PM
^Oh yeah, I'M the internet tough guy here when he's the one that mentioned meeting him in an alleyway in the first place. I'm just responding in kind...he'd get worked over worse than Ricky Fatton against Mayweather.

Roadmap
10-14-2011, 11:28 PM
You'd get your mangled teeth stomped right into your face. I might even take your powdered wig as a trophy of the victory.

I would take you to town. After that I would take you to any American state that ends with the words 'Virginia' or 'Carolina' to show you some nice teeth.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 11:33 PM
You'd get your mangled teeth stomped right into your face. I might even take your powdered wig as a trophy of the victory.

You really need to check yourself, dude. Your constant tough-guy macho act is tired. No-one gives a fuck, acting so tough over a PC is bullshit.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 11:35 PM
Both of you are behaving like total losers. You're literally talking shit about how you'll beat each other? Please, sit down and grab your bottles, babies. You're on a tennis messageboard. Stop acting like this is some UFC forum or that anyone thinks anything of you for what you type on a keyboard.

Filo V.
10-14-2011, 11:42 PM
The rich get richer, the poor get poorer. The richest 1% wipe their asses with $100 bills while everyone else is barely getting by. And people wonder why crime, drug and alcohol consumption, and suicides are at an all time high.
These stats are somewhat incorrect. Suicides and drugs are way up, but not quite all-time levels. Alcohol consumption is around level, while the crime rate has actually gone down. Also more than the top 1% is getting by. It's the middle-class and lower who are hurting, but people above the middle-class level are still in proficient situations finacially.

With that said, I agree with the point you're trying to get across.

Mountaindewslave
10-15-2011, 01:42 AM
Maybe if governments spent tax monies on actual road construction, public employment, education, health care, and other things that actually enhance society instead of directly into the pockets of politicians, lawyers, cops, judges, bankers, and other corrupt people and organizations, the world wouldn't be in this global financial shit storm.

The rich get richer, the poor get poorer. The richest 1% wipe their asses with $100 bills while everyone else is barely getting by. And people wonder why crime, drug and alcohol consumption, and suicides are at an all time high.

Oh, and Nadal is right.

Nadal not getting taxed does not help stop any of those things. if he plays a tournament he must obey the tax regulations and it serves only to make him seem like a whiny little kid complaining about being taxed on money that is not HIS until he gets it - which is the afterwards of said taxing. this is just getting absurd, not only are the winning from the WTF trivial for such a wealthy person as Nadal, but do you seriously think that every country a player competes in, he can just change legislation and ENTIRE laws regarding their economy to better suit his pocket? very absurd idea

Mountaindewslave
10-15-2011, 01:47 AM
The poor people who keep reproducing when they can barely take care of themselves expect the rich to pay for all of their services as well. It's just a sickeningly entitled mentality. TPD is absolutely right, those that produce and entertain and are able to make a lot of money shouldn't have to carry the trash of society on their backs just because most of society is incredibly short-sighted and inefficient.

and this post is exactly what is entirely wrong with society.... you think you have any right to call all of those who are unfortunate 'trash'? and you believe that EVERY person can succeed just because they try their best? that's not the real world. the hardest workers in this world are not wealthy and that is a very very sad thing. maybe better yet, we should just kill all people who aren't wealthy tennis players and don't make large sums of money nor preform efficiently?

posters like you remind me why this world is becoming such a sad place, when people like you cannot even sympathize with the fact that some people are born in the mud and have no way to get out of the mud, and that people like Rafael Nadal fighting so that he can keep even more money of which he already has hundreds of millions is just a very very disturbing thing. as Rafael Nadal sends legislation to the British Parliament to change tax laws, meanwhile homeless people with no hope to get hired anywhere or DO anything will be going to shelters hoping they haven't ran out of food for the night. yeah, you're really in the right perspective

oh and by the way, you think if you 'try' or 'apply' yourself, that everyone will succeed? look across the world, recessions are everywhere, people can't just magically become rich tennis players or find stable jobs. things have changed

Mountaindewslave
10-15-2011, 01:50 AM
For time immemorial the working class have been shat on. Fuck the landlords.

i would not recommend useless online threats, but you are right, the lower classes have been taken advantage of and are now in a horrible situation in many economies. governments are ran by elitists and corporations and businesses in wall street and stock exchanges.

I really Hope Nadal drops this though, because if he doesn't it certainly would make for a confusing interpretation of his true colors

veganlunch
10-16-2011, 11:31 AM
He won't play Queen's because of British laws.

What is his aim? To become the richest man in the graveyard?

Luinir
10-16-2011, 11:32 AM
Yes.

Naudio Spanlatine
10-16-2011, 11:35 AM
OMFG.......enough w/ talking about what Rafa thinks JESUS CHRIST......is everyone that concern about him:facepalm:

Everytime i see a thread about Rafa its like a soap opera:o

*END THIS DAMN THREAD*

Roadmap
10-16-2011, 11:35 AM
One determined fucker is this veganlunch chap.

Kat_YYZ
10-16-2011, 11:35 AM
we have a thread for this. mods, please merge.