This French "musketeers" concept needs to be junked [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

This French "musketeers" concept needs to be junked

Ouragan
01-22-2011, 06:41 AM
Wow, a few years back they were being touted as the new "Musketeers", Tsonga-Gasquet-Simon-Monfils, now not one of them goes beyond the 3rd round. Only GiSi has an excuse this time :aparty:

I'm a bit fed up with them, especially since nobody from the next generation has stepped up to contend. Lots of talent going to waste there :banghead:

leng jai
01-22-2011, 06:44 AM
Never heard of such a concept actually.

allpro
01-22-2011, 06:49 AM
Never heard of such a concept actually.

:haha::haha:

green25814
01-22-2011, 07:10 AM
Which one would be Porthos?

fast_clay
01-22-2011, 08:53 AM
the original musketeers concept was shit as well as disappointing and a waste of my time so i think there are still parallels that can be drawn

Soliloque
01-22-2011, 09:17 AM
the original musketeers concept was shit as well as disappointing and a waste of my time so i think there are still parallels that can be drawn

6 Davis Cup, 19 singles GS, 27 doubles GS and 10 mixed GS titles. You're right, the original musketeers were so disappointing.

Ouragan
01-22-2011, 09:17 AM
Which one would be Porthos?

I see you like Nalby. Now he would do a fine Porthos :)

fast_clay
01-22-2011, 09:24 AM
6 Davis Cup, 19 singles GS, 27 doubles GS and 10 mixed GS titles. You're right, the original musketeers were so disappointing.

I was referring to the book

peribsen
01-22-2011, 10:05 AM
Sad to see French tennis slow down again. For my part, I'm worried that there really isn't any Spanish kid looking hot enough to replace the present Armada, and I'm not talking about replacing Nadal -that's a once-in-a-lifetime event-, simply replacing Ferrer/Ferrero/Verdasco. Boluda looked fine some time ago, but of late seems to have petered out.

Ouragan
01-22-2011, 10:11 AM
Hey, you've had Nadal, leave some to the others now!

blank_frackis
01-22-2011, 11:01 AM
the original musketeers concept was shit as well as disappointing and a waste of my time so i think there are still parallels that can be drawn

Sounds like an exaggeration just for the sake of it. It's not particularly clever, or as good as the Count of Monte Cristo, but still deserves its reputation as a classic.

wally1
01-22-2011, 11:38 AM
Sounds like an exaggeration just for the sake of it. It's not particularly clever, or as good as the Count of Monte Cristo, but still deserves its reputation as a classic.The follow up "Twenty Years After" is a much better book imo.

Blackbriar
01-22-2011, 12:41 PM
The french musketeers was a make-up from Canal + to hype the channel when they bought the rights for Wimbledon and Masters 1000. They also make a tv show about them diffused about every 3 months, where you can witness the "prowess" of this 4.
If you understand french you can watch it here:
http://www.canalplus.fr/c-sport/pid2708-interieur-sport.html

nalbyfan
01-22-2011, 12:45 PM
l'Equipe and Tennis Mag overrated them before they won anything big...now they are big headed, fragile both mentally and physically and take themselves for bigger than they are. Humility could be a good thing for them but with all the fuss french press makes about them, it's difficult to be realist

yuri27
01-22-2011, 01:42 PM
Sad to see French tennis slow down again. For my part, I'm worried that there really isn't any Spanish kid looking hot enough to replace the present Armada, and I'm not talking about replacing Nadal -that's a once-in-a-lifetime event-, simply replacing Ferrer/Ferrero/Verdasco. Boluda looked fine some time ago, but of late seems to have petered out.

Oh come on,don't make us cry!:rolleyes:

Even if you don't have a champion of Nadal's caliber in the future,you'll still have guys like Costa or Bruguera capable of winning the FO every year,which is something some big tennis countries would already dream of.

Even before Nadal,the spanish were often winning GSs whereas the french ,despite having much more registered tennis players than Spain,haven't won a GS for almost 30 years now(male players,i mean) and have won only 2 Master Series in the last decade.

So i were a spanish fan, i certainly wouldn't complain,even if the next years don't turn out to be as successful as they've been in the last 15 years.
Even the Boluda guy you are talking about will probably turn out to be a better player than any of the current french player lol.

yuri27
01-22-2011, 01:45 PM
l'Equipe and Tennis Mag overrated them before they won anything big...now they are big headed, fragile both mentally and physically and take themselves for bigger than they are. Humility could be a good thing for them but with all the fuss french press makes about them, it's difficult to be realist

Forgive them for having overrated a guy who was the most precocious player ever in history of french tennis and one of the most in the world(second youngest world junior champion ever,youngest player ever to win a MS match) and who beat a peak Federer blastering him with winners and almost beat Nadal on his favourite surface at the age of 18 and who made 2 MS finals both lost against Federer by the age of 20.:rolleyes:

Nobody could predict(and certainly not on this board if you look at some of the older polls) this guy would not only not improved from his 18-19 to his 22-23 but even more incredibly,would get worse!

Blackbriar
01-22-2011, 02:06 PM
I think the DC first round is certainly not already won. Forget should play the Simon's card early instead of relying on the same players.

yuri27
01-22-2011, 02:13 PM
I think the DC first round is certainly not already won. Forget should play the Simon's card early instead of relying on the same players.


Who cares about the DC anyway???
It's not like we haven't won it in the last 20 years.
On the other hand,a male french player hasn't won a GS for almost 30 years
If you list all the countries who have won Slams during this period,it would be quite embarassing for a country where tennis is such an important and big sport.
But guess the most important thing is to win the Davis Cup(it's not against you but i'm just tired about all this fuss about the Davis Cup).....:rolleyes:

simplet
01-22-2011, 02:39 PM
How about all you french posters stop obsessing about it? I can assure you noone else but you ever gave a shit, and everyone still don't, as evidenced by their (lack of) answers in this thread. So there is really no need to make a thread about it every week to explain to them they should stop caring about those "musketeers", and that's already assuming they even know what you're talking about.

The media in France hyped them up, because that is pretty much their job and was hard not to do when three of them were in the top 10 and beating good players. And even then they were hardly raving about it compared to other countries. All that psychological bullshit abut how they think they are hot shit one week, or are completely lacking in confidence the next, is just your way of trying to insult them by making them look stupid because you're disappointed with their results. And again, this is hardly their fault you were so hyped up about them to begin with.

yuri27
01-22-2011, 02:53 PM
How about all you french posters stop obsessing about it? I can assure you noone else but you ever gave a shit, and everyone still don't, as evidenced by their (lack of) answers in this thread. So there is really no need to make a thread about it every week to explain to them they should stop caring about those "musketeers", and that's already assuming they even know what you're talking about.

The media in France hyped them up, because that is pretty much their job and was hard not to do when three of them were in the top 10 and beating good players. And even then they were hardly raving about it compared to other countries. All that psychological bullshit abut how they think they are hot shit one week, or are completely lacking in confidence the next, is just your way of trying to insult them by making them look stupid because you're disappointed with their results. And again, this is hardly their fault you were so hyped up about them to begin with.

Well said.
Just look at Murray: the guy has been hyped and talked up in his country way way more than all the french players in their own country but it hasn't prevent him to already achieve much more things than all the 4 french players combined.
And nevertheless, we all know that the british press is much much more agressive than the french one.
So the media thing is just an excuse.

GlennMirnyi
01-22-2011, 03:41 PM
Well said.
Just look at Murray: the guy has been hyped and talked up in his country way way more than all the french players in their own country but it hasn't prevent him to already achieve much more things than all the 4 french players combined.
And nevertheless, we all know that the british press is much much more agressive than the french one.
So the media thing is just an excuse.

Murray hasn't achieved "way more" than the mousquetaires.

I agree with simplet's point, though. I remember reading l'Équipe right before Tsonga playing Frauderer in Melbourne's semifinal last year. They wrote a huge article on Tsonga's tactical and technical aspects and how he could beat Frauderer. In the end, the match was as one-sided as a GS semi-final could be.

Thing is: it's really their job to hype up French players.

yuri27
01-22-2011, 04:23 PM
Murray hasn't achieved "way more" than the mousquetaires.

He's made more GS finals and won much more Master Series than all the 4 french players combined.


I agree with simplet's point, though. I remember reading l'Équipe right before Tsonga playing Frauderer in Melbourne's semifinal last year. They wrote a huge article on Tsonga's tactical and technical aspects and how he could beat Frauderer. In the end, the match was as one-sided as a GS semi-final could be.

Thing is: it's really their job to hype up French players.

Because you think the press from other countries would have done differently had it been their player???
Wake up man.....
You accused them of hype him just because they suggest Tsonga,a guy who was just making a GS 1/2 final,COULD beat Federer???

Surcouf
01-22-2011, 04:39 PM
Who cares about the DC anyway???
It's not like we haven't won it in the last 20 years.
On the other hand,a male french player hasn't won a GS for almost 30 years
If you list all the countries who have won Slams during this period,it would be quite embarassing for a country where tennis is such an important and big sport.
But guess the most important thing is to win the Davis Cup(it's not against you but i'm just tired about all this fuss about the Davis Cup).....:rolleyes:


I care about the Davis Cup, because that's really the only big thing we can win.

To be realist, Simon, Monfils, Tsonga and Gasquet are not winning slams, or it would be a total fluke

Gasquet: Talented but weak mentally and not showing enough motivation

Monfils: Clownish player who is way too defensive and can lose to anyone, no regularity.

Tsonga: The stronger mentally, but he is too limited. He is borderline arrogant while his game is too one dimensional.

Simon: Like the other he does not have the game to win a slam. He can get a big win but nothing more.

We have to have a realist approach. They are too flawed to win a slam in the current state of the game. I am not expecting to see them winning the big prize. But they are making a really good DC team.

GlennMirnyi
01-22-2011, 04:46 PM
He's made more GS finals and won much more Master Series than all the 4 french players combined.

Because you think the press from other countries would have done differently had it been their player???
Wake up man.....
You accused them of hype him just because they suggest Tsonga,a guy who was just making a GS 1/2 final,COULD beat Federer???

TMSes are not important.

GS finals are important, alright but what matters is winning tittles and Mugray hasn't won any yet. And will he ever?

:lol: Chill out, mate. Depends. I think they went too far, though I can't blame them. In fact, Tsonga wasn't playing half as well as he played when he actually made the final. However, the hype was bigger. Of course he's talented but they made a huge deal out of Tsonga's "new game" (more consistent, etc - actually a huge step backwards in my opinion). They just couldn't predict that this consistent game made him an easy prey for Frauderer.

The match was awfully one-sided as well.

Sapeod
01-22-2011, 04:53 PM
GS finals are important, alright but what matters is winning tittles and Mugray hasn't won any yet. And will he ever?
Yes, he will. If you don't think he will, then you need to open your eyes.

Jimnik
01-22-2011, 05:15 PM
French tennis is in better shape than most countries. Probably 2nd best after Spain.

Whether you'd rather have four top 20 players or one solid top 5 player (challenging for slams) is a matter of opinion.

GlennMirnyi
01-22-2011, 05:21 PM
Yes, he will. If you don't think he will, then you need to open your eyes.

Considering his performances in the finals he reached... no.

Two straight sets humbling defeat.

kyleskywalker007
01-22-2011, 05:45 PM
Yeah, this concept should be thrown to the trash bin. I propose to call the the "Mickey Mouse-keteers" instead. Far more accurate to describe their performances.

Blackbriar
01-22-2011, 06:27 PM
French tennis is in better shape than most countries. Probably 2nd best after Spain.

Whether you'd rather have four top 20 players or one solid top 5 player (challenging for slams) is a matter of opinion.

yeah, you're right for the first part. France is a big tennis country and could realistically win Davis Cup in the future.
But honestly, for the second part, most countries would exchange the new musketeers in the blink of an eye with a single Murray or Djokovic.

GlennMirnyi
01-22-2011, 07:17 PM
yeah, you're right for the first part. France is a big tennis country and could realistically win Davis Cup in the future.
But honestly, for the second part, most countries would exchange the new musketeers in the blink of an eye with a single Murray or Djokovic.

I doubt it.

The LTA's administration is heavily criticised for not showing any results. Do you really think the Brits like having just one top player and nobody else in the top 100?

The thing about France is that at least it shows that the FFT is doing a good work with the younger talents. France sports huge depth in the tour. It's just a matter of time for someone to show up and become a top player.

Serbia's situation isn't so dire. They have a few other mugs in the top 100 but it's hardly a concerted effort.

Blackbriar
01-22-2011, 07:44 PM
For the Federations, i agree, the more is better. But common people can't follow which player is what doing in which tournament. When you've got a unique Murray or a Del Potro it's easier to follow. At the times of Noah, there was not much room for the other players.

Today, our medias are following mainly Tsonga and Monfils, but they also give some room to other players, knowing the 2 formers are just good but unremarkable players among 20 or 30 other good players. Plus they are very bitter and merciless with the ones that don't achieve stellar performances like the big 4. They didn't forgave Gasquet for turning into a regular mug, but they should blame themselves for being unable to form young player for the big league.

GlennMirnyi
01-22-2011, 07:50 PM
For the Federations, i agree, the more is better. But common people can't follow which player is what doing in which tournament. When you've got a unique Murray or a Del Potro it's easier to follow. At the times of Noah, there was not much room for the other players.

Today, our medias are following mainly Tsonga and Monfils, but they also give some room to other players, knowing the 2 formers are just good but unremarkable players among 20 or 30 other good players. Plus they are very bitter and merciless with the ones that don't achieve stellar performances like the big 4. They didn't forgave Gasquet for turning into a regular mug, but they should blame themselves for being unable to form young player for the big league.

Yeah but who cares about what common people think about tennis. It's not like they follow it closely and/or care about it.

Yeah, I read your media, mate. ;)

FormerRafaFan
01-22-2011, 08:25 PM
Sad to see French tennis slow down again. For my part, I'm worried that there really isn't any Spanish kid looking hot enough to replace the present Armada, and I'm not talking about replacing Nadal -that's a once-in-a-lifetime event-, simply replacing Ferrer/Ferrero/Verdasco. Boluda looked fine some time ago, but of late seems to have petered out.

Javier Marti. He is 19, currently ranked just inside of 300. He has moved up 300 ranking spots (from 600) since this same time last year. He still has a looong way to go. But I think the kid's go potential.

Blackbriar
01-28-2011, 04:22 PM
musketeers will be back for DC :yeah:

yuri27
01-29-2011, 12:29 AM
yeah, you're right for the first part. France is a big tennis country and could realistically win Davis Cup in the future.
But honestly, for the second part, most countries would exchange the new musketeers in the blink of an eye with a single Murray or Djokovic.

Especially countries whose their male players haven't won a Grand Slam for decades!

Topspindoctor
01-29-2011, 01:18 AM
I propose French Mugsketeers

ballbasher101
01-29-2011, 02:30 AM
Producing a slam winner is tough. After Hewitt Australia has struggled, the Americans have no one capable of winning a major. The Spanish only have Nadal as a slam contender the rest can only reach the last 8 or 4 at best. Tennis systems are not the best at producing slam winners. Slam winners normally make themselves. The French might be waiting for a very long time for a slam winner :devil:. Muzza is in with a chance tomorrow :worship:. It has been 75 years or so I think :secret:.