Peak Safin vs Peak Federer? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Peak Safin vs Peak Federer?

Mane
01-30-2004, 09:18 AM
Roger Federer will win

oxy
01-30-2004, 09:19 AM
i go with federer too!!!

Vass
01-30-2004, 09:27 AM
I said it before, and saying it again: MARAT ALL THE WAY! He diserves to win!
GO MARAT AND WIN THAT TITLE! :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

renatoal
01-30-2004, 09:30 AM
Both players deserves the title, but only one will win that, and I think will be Federer !! But I'm look foward for a GREAT match !

Mrs. B
01-30-2004, 09:30 AM
Roger. :angel:

lsy
01-30-2004, 09:34 AM
Both will be great winners...toughest draw to the final and they both did it!!! This is just too good!!! Now just go play your best and give us a great treat. I can't wait...

JeLuliA88
01-30-2004, 09:36 AM
Marat... he has proven over the last 2 weeks that he is right up there with the best - by beating roddick, agassi, blake, martin etc.... Nobody really gave him much chance against andy, andre and he has gone out and played his best tennis. He has a good chance to win, but Federer is probably the thoughest opponent he could face. I think Marat has a little bit more of an edge... and i'm certainly hoping that he would take out the title.

Iza
01-30-2004, 09:36 AM
Marat. he will win cos he's more motivated. but rogi is fitter, as marat is more tired. But I want 2 Marat 2 win.

J. Corwin
01-30-2004, 09:37 AM
I hope Marat, but Roger will probably be too tough.

Either way, one of these two will get his 2nd major, and a different slam to add to their first. They both deserve it.

safinagirly
01-30-2004, 09:42 AM
go marat im with u !!!!!

Aranince
01-30-2004, 09:46 AM
Roger will win!!! :banana:

Bubble
01-30-2004, 09:54 AM
Marat has nothing to lose and riding high on confidence, Roger is the favourite on paper.
Time for Marat to knock out another No. 1 player :p


Go Marat!

Hagar
01-30-2004, 09:55 AM
This is a dream final. It can go either way. Hope it's gonna be a gruelling fivesetter.

Dirk
01-30-2004, 10:13 AM
"Now I'm looking forward to playing Safin. He is one of my favourites to play against, not just the results, but he is a great guy. " Roger on Safin.

I love how both of these two guyes love each other and respect each other. :hug: The ceremony will be nice for sure.

lsy
01-30-2004, 10:23 AM
yes Dirk. He said he like playing Safin not just the game but on the human side. I just can't wait for the final.

Shy
01-30-2004, 10:39 AM
Either way, I'll love the outcome.

tinkerbell
01-30-2004, 10:44 AM
Safin will win...well he better as he has to redeem himself for beating Agassi:)

Dirk
01-30-2004, 10:47 AM
Federer said he was looking forward to playing against Safin in the final, describing him as one of his favourite opponents.


"Great guy, great match, great player, so I'm looking forward to playing him, he's one of my favourite guys to play against, not because of our results, but from the human side, he's in the final and it's really nice to see," he said.


"The whole tennis world is really happy to have him in the final, too."


:awww: :hatoff: :hug:

*~ The Leopard ~*
01-30-2004, 10:52 AM
I'm expecting Federer to win, but hoping it's Safin's turn.

Marat's return, and his great matches and results, have restored my love of men's tennis. I was losing interest a li'l. He deserves to win just for that. ;)

Billabong
01-30-2004, 11:28 AM
I really hope Federer wins, he can do it! Both players did absolutely great this week, but now I hope Fed wins! GOOOOO FED!!!!!

Aurora
01-30-2004, 11:44 AM
this one has got to break the boring-final-curse!





or am I jinxing now?

Maeike
01-30-2004, 11:46 AM
marat

Iza
01-30-2004, 12:14 PM
this one has got to break the boring-final-curse!





or am I jinxing now?


:lol:

Experimentee
01-30-2004, 12:41 PM
Its really tough to call. Both players are playing great tennis, getting better and better as the tournament goes on. But based on how Safin was playing the other night, I'd give him the edge. However there are question marks over his fitness, as hes played so much tennis over the last couple of weeks and might be tired. Also Safin might not mentally turn up, like it was against Johansson.

star
01-30-2004, 12:47 PM
I hope Safin is able to play his best in the final. He's had a much rougher two weeks than has Federer.

Safin plays with passion and heart. It would be a marvelous story if he came from the depths and won the championship. It would also be a wonderful thing for tennis if he puts his career on the path that everyone thought it would take after he won the USO.

SaFed2005
01-30-2004, 12:53 PM
WOW! The poll is so close 18/18

Hmm... This match can go either way. Hopefullay it turns out to be a great final unlike a previous few... I knew Ferrero didn't have a chance... This match on the ohter hand can go either way... It will be great!!!

merle
01-30-2004, 12:59 PM
Well, I really don't think Marat could win unless Rogi will have his day "off", of course. If Rogi will be concentreated enough, he has the talent and fitness to beat Marat. Marat winning would be absolutely incredible achievement, at least unbelievable physically. Then I would really believe he is superhuman. *lol*

TheBoiledEgg
01-30-2004, 01:10 PM
where's Mal Washingtons prediction :tape:

go Marat, behind you all the way :hatoff: :yeah: :)
Marat's got to get a good start and put doubts in Roger's head.

Roger is the Fav though but Marat can and will pull this off :)

yanchr
01-30-2004, 01:19 PM
Yeah, it's there, the dream final, between the two greatest players now IMO. I can't wait...

Hope both show their best and give us a great match.

Roger pls prove that you are real No.1

merle
01-30-2004, 01:25 PM
Yeah, it's there, the dream final, between the two greatest players now IMO. I can't wait...

Hope both show their best and give us a great match.

Roger pls prove that you are real No.1

Yeah, and I'm with you in your prayers! :cool:

CooCooCachoo
01-30-2004, 01:53 PM
Goooooooo Roger :D

Roger deserves to win. He has played the best and I really like him, so there.. :p But I'll be happy for Marat too, when he wins. Either way, it's been a good year at the AO!

Scotso
01-30-2004, 02:00 PM
Roger.

silverwhite
01-30-2004, 02:09 PM
2002 Moscow, Carpet, Q
Russia Carpet Q Safin 7 5 6 4
2002 Hamburg TMS, Clay, F
Germany Clay F Federer 1 6 3 6 4 6
2002 RUS v SUI WG Rd 1, Clay, RR
Moscow, Russia Clay RR Federer 5 7 1 6 2 6
2001 Rome TMS, Clay, R32
Italy Clay R32 Federer 6 4 4 6 6 7

Lady
01-30-2004, 02:41 PM
All Roger wins came on clay :eek:

3 setters :)

Sounds good!

Ma. Estefania
01-30-2004, 02:48 PM
Though Roger is the fave one to win, I think that Marat won't give it without a fight....and why not that can motivate him more and then win....

Then I really hope Marat can win. *praying*

Andre'sNo1Fan
01-30-2004, 02:50 PM
I would prefer Marat as well.

Gandalf
01-30-2004, 03:39 PM
I want Roger to win, but I'm afraid that if Safin starts playing hard to Federer's backhand it will break down.

Vass
01-30-2004, 04:08 PM
Marat will need to volley against this guy, and thank God he can do it! You can't play a guy who came to the net 80 times during a match at the baseline. That's a misteke Ferrero did.
Anyway, I don't think Marat has the edge in this match, the chances are fairly equal. Hopefully Marat relaxes enough during these two days.

drf716
01-30-2004, 04:09 PM
MARAT deserves this more than anyone. I mean Roger got it easy. Marat had it tough with his draw having to play with 5 Americans and having to put up with all the airs of American commentators. Go Marat and claim what is rightfully YOURS!

asotgod
01-30-2004, 04:10 PM
Federer will be fine against Marat whether Marat hits to his backhand with power or not. The major thing here is that Marat needs to start the match well, most likely winning the first set or else Federer might just run away with it.

Vass
01-30-2004, 04:10 PM
I want Roger to win, but I'm afraid that if Safin starts playing hard to Federer's backhand it will break down.
Hear that Marat? Some forehands down the line!

asotgod
01-30-2004, 04:13 PM
Roger did not get to the final easy. He had to play to get here. His draw was the toughest of all even though Marat played longer matches. Federer played three guys in the top 20 back to back, and in fact excellent players in the name of Hewitt, Nalbandian and Ferrero. The scores may have looked one-sided but that's not Federer's fault. Safin played longer matches which definitely gave him a good feel but in no wise was his draw tougher than Federer as he had to play two guys in the top 20, Roddick and Agassi. Actually, I was surer that he would beat Roddick but will have some problems with Agassi but he won.

So, the guys with the toughest draw are the most talented and they are also in the final. Here is to a good rivalry.

Vass
01-30-2004, 04:18 PM
He had to play two guys in the top 20, Roddick and Agassi. Actually, I was surer that he would beat Roddick but will have some problems with Agassi but he won.

Although 'top-20' remark is correct, but 'two guys from top-5' would have conveyed it more accurately.

asotgod
01-30-2004, 04:28 PM
Yeah, Vass22, he played two guys in the top 5 I reckon only Agassi as the tougher there, not Roddick because Safin can overpower Roddick once he gets the return in, which is what he did. But, player Hewitt, Nalbandian and Ferrero will have been an equally dauting task, if not more intimidating because they get a lot of balls back in play. But, it's not right to say that Safin had the tougher draw. At best, their draw were equally tough.

Rosa Luxembourg
01-30-2004, 04:39 PM
Roger will win.

Marat is 1-3 h-2-h with Roger. All Roger's wins came on clay (his worst surface) and when he wasn't nearly as good as he is these days.

Riley Finn
01-30-2004, 05:08 PM
Roger will win.

Marat is 1-3 h-2-h with Roger. All Roger's wins came on clay (his worst surface) and when he wasn't nearly as good as he is these days.


his worst surface? I thought he struggles more on hardcourts.

Deboogle!.
01-30-2004, 06:06 PM
Marat has grown on me during the AO as I've gotten to see him more. I'll be rooting for him :)

jtipson
01-30-2004, 06:34 PM
Maybe anyone rather than Roger, eh bunk?

jtipson
01-30-2004, 06:40 PM
Although 'top-20' remark is correct, but 'two guys from top-5' would have conveyed it more accurately.

That may be true, but as second seed it was not possible for Roger to play more than one other guy from the top 4, and another from the top 8, and yet still one more from the top 16.

There's also the fact that against these three players, Roger had a combined record of 6-15, and two of them could be described as "nemeses".

So although I am very impressed with Safin's having beaten both Agassi and Roddick, Federer's run is, to me, no less surprising.

Lady
01-30-2004, 07:56 PM
Well, Roger hasn't beat a guy who ranked higher then him, but for Marat I guess, everyone he beat was ranked higher ;) :lol:

Lady
01-30-2004, 07:57 PM
But look at the poll, they're tied :eek:

And no bitching in this thread ;)

asotgod
01-30-2004, 08:07 PM
Lady,

Two posts back, you did not make any sense. We all know Safin is capable of winning, rankings be damned. But also you said that Federer did not beat anyone ranked higher than him. You know why? Because he is #2, the only way he could beat someone high than him was for that someone to reach the final. That someone was Roddick but Roddick could not reach the final as Safin beat him. Even if Roddick had reached the final, it would have been a complete pasting put on him by Federer.

faboozadoo15
01-30-2004, 08:09 PM
i say federer... he's up in their head to head, reads the big serve well, and has kept his matches shorter and his legs fresher.

Ten_Isse_Fan
01-30-2004, 08:16 PM
My second and third favorites (behind X-Man :angel: ), so I don't really care who wins! Go both guys and play a GREAT match! :D :yeah:

Deboogle!.
01-30-2004, 08:17 PM
Maybe anyone rather than Roger, eh bunk?

um no... like I said, Marat has really grown on me throughout the AO (the first time I've ever really been exposed to him), I think it'd be a great story if he were able to pull out the win.

Havok
01-30-2004, 08:37 PM
lets go with another 5 set marathon in favor of Safin:banana:

lalaland
01-30-2004, 09:17 PM
I voted for Safin because I like the big handsome giant. Can't say who is better, they are equally good.

Pink Panther
01-30-2004, 09:21 PM
I think Federer is going to win although I'm rooting for Marat. It's so great to see him make his comeback! ;)

Won't it be so nice to have Marat win the AO, Ferrero to win RG, Federer to win Wimbledon and Roddick to win USO?

jmp
01-30-2004, 09:41 PM
I voted I don't know. I honestly can't see either player with an edge at this point because of their histories in this specific tournament. I am happy about how they both got to the final, though. I think it all depends on which version of each player shows up at each phase of the match.

I consider it an honor and a priviledge to be able to see these two talented athletes go head to head down under on Saturday night. I'm psyched! :D

Good luck, Roger! :bounce:

Good luck, Marat! :bounce:

Conchon
01-30-2004, 09:58 PM
I think Federer has the edge. Physically, he's much better off. I've always posited that Federer and Safin are equal in talent, so I think what will matter most in this match is the intangibles. Who wants it more? I think Marat does.

the cat
01-30-2004, 10:02 PM
I am rooting hard for Safin to win. But I think Federer will win in 4 sets. Federer's game is so polished and so impressive. And he's had a much easier time winning his matches than Safin has. Marat has struggled to win all six matches. But if Safin has a very good serving day he could put some doubt in Federer's mind and create the upset.

Udachi Marat! :D

P.S. - If Safin wins the 2004 Australian Open then he would have pulled off the greatest grand slam coup I have ever seen! :D I've been following tennis for more than 20 years and I've never seen any player make a grand slam final getting past such tough players from the third round on. Safin's comeback has invigorated me as a tennis fan. :) I just hope Marat has 1 more big match in him against Federer.

Crazy_Fool
01-30-2004, 10:26 PM
Go Marat!!

Deboogle!.
01-30-2004, 10:33 PM
I think Federer has the edge. Physically, he's much better off. I've always posited that Federer and Safin are equal in talent, so I think what will matter most in this match is the intangibles. Who wants it more? I think Marat does.

But you know, they've questioned Marat's freshness since the 3rd round lol and he keeps defying everyone. With an extra day's rest he'll be ok I would guess. I mean not 100% but fresh enough so that he can hang around. I'd agree... I think Marat wants it BAD. Is he a player like Lleyton who once he decides he's gonna win it's pretty tough to beat him? (I'm just curious, I don't know Marat well enough)

trixy
01-30-2004, 10:48 PM
Marat is going to win. I just think he wants it so much and they he has just come through to the final has been amazing. I'm not going to all into all the who is a better all round player?, who has had more court time? because i just think we'll have a great match and something tells me Safin will complete his return to the top of the tennis world by holding up the aussie open trophy on Sunday afternoon.

jmp
01-30-2004, 10:49 PM
bunk, the knock on Marat HAD been that he never wanted anything BAD. Everything came to him naturally. When he spanked Sampras at USO '00 he was just as natural, free flowing, and utterly dominant as can be. You might have heard the commentators bring it up over and over near the beginning of the tournament. It's sort of the way they keep harping on Davenport getting down on herself even though she hasn't demonstrated that trait for about two years.

The reason fans of his game are soooo ecstatic about his come back performance is that match after match he's shown composure, determination, and tactics combined with the great talent that was always there. I have no idea what will happen for the rest of the year. But, the Marat I saw in this tournament MADE MY YEAR in tennis. Simply AWESOME!! :D

masha
01-30-2004, 10:51 PM
:) marat :)

Tennis Fool
01-30-2004, 10:52 PM
I don't know who will win. Power or finesse? What trumps?

I know I will root for Safin, as Federer already has the No. 1 rank.

I think that Federer has the game to frustrate Safin, and expect to see lots of broken racquets.

J. Corwin
01-31-2004, 01:10 AM
I can't wait to see the match. I used to dislike Safin (about a couple years ago) but not anymore.

rogicomel
01-31-2004, 01:21 AM
Marat or Roger? Hoping for Rogi but honestly I don't mind who wins... Just want to enjoy great tennis by two most talented guys on the planet!

Chloe le Bopper
01-31-2004, 01:26 AM
I can't wait to see the match. I used to dislike Safin (about a couple years ago) but not anymore.
I dislike Marat when he's twitting around, being a waste of talent. Thankfully, it appears that those days are done. I like it when those days are done ;) So I'll be rooting for him. But if Roger wins, it's all good. I don't mind watching him, either. :)

Conchon
01-31-2004, 02:07 AM
But you know, they've questioned Marat's freshness since the 3rd round lol and he keeps defying everyone. With an extra day's rest he'll be ok I would guess. I mean not 100% but fresh enough so that he can hang around. I'd agree... I think Marat wants it BAD. Is he a player like Lleyton who once he decides he's gonna win it's pretty tough to beat him? (I'm just curious, I don't know Marat well enough)

Yes, I would not be surprised in the least if Marat will still be fresh, but I have my reservations. The last sets of his Roddick & Agassi match were tortuous to my eyes since he seems so thoroughly fatigued. However, with that extra day off, he must/should be refueling his tank.

I don't really know how to answer your question. To be honest, I think this is the first time I've seen Marat on a mission. Before, things seemed to fall into place. Everything was on at the right time.
Now, it seems a matter of proving that he does indeed belong in the top echelons of tennis.. that he can win and hopefully, will. With no added pressure, this might bode well.

Federer is not much different from Marat in this respect, save that he has been more mentally consistent so hopefully, this will prove to be an interesting match.

Shy
01-31-2004, 02:18 AM
Since Marat had help Roger become no 1 by beating Andy, maybe Roger should be nice to Marat tomorrow.;)Everyone said that Marat want it the most, but I get that impression too with Roger. I hope that it is going to be a nice final.

rogicomel
01-31-2004, 02:29 AM
Since Marat had help Roger become no 1 by beating Andy, maybe Roger should be nice to Marat tomorrow.;)

Rogi has always been nice! ;)

Action Jackson
01-31-2004, 06:30 AM
Actually I don't really care who wins as I like them both. My main thing is that it's a close final for a change, just because you have two very good players doesn't mean it will be a good match.

I remember the time they played in Hamburg and Feds chopped Safin big time and don't want to see that again. If it could be like the 88 AO final which was one of the last decent finals I have seen, then it would be great.

Action Jackson
01-31-2004, 06:40 AM
Originally posted by the cat
P.S. - If Safin wins the 2004 Australian Open then he would have pulled off the greatest grand slam coup I have ever seen! I've been following tennis for more than 20 years and I've never seen any player make a grand slam final getting past such tough players from the third round on. Safin's comeback has invigorated me as a tennis fan. I just hope Marat has 1 more big match in him against Federer.

If Safin wins yes it would be an absolutely outstanding performance by the big Russian. If you have been following tennis for all those years then how could you forget Kuerten winning the French Open in 1997?

He never won a match at a Slam. He beat 4 guys in the top 20 and 3 former French Open champions and won 3 5 setters (Muster, Kafelnikov and Medvedev). So it's very debatable whether Safin's performance would rival the one of Guga.

As I said in my previous post I want a close match.

Dirk
01-31-2004, 06:50 AM
I agree with George on this one. Guga was a nobody when he began that event and became a huge star during those two weeks. Everyone knows Safin has it and has seen him do great things so while this is a surprise nobody doubted his ability to do it.

azza
01-31-2004, 07:02 AM
Safina

WyverN
01-31-2004, 09:26 AM
depends if Roger plays well, if he does he will win in 4.
I am glad he got the #1 in the semis, now he will be more relaxed and hopefully will be able to play freely without any pressure

Kristen
01-31-2004, 10:05 AM
Since Marat had help Roger become no 1 by beating Andy, maybe Roger should be nice to Marat tomorrow.;)Everyone said that Marat want it the most, but I get that impression too with Roger. I hope that it is going to be a nice final.

very good call ;)
I voted for roger, because i prefer him of the two... but having said that, if marat loses another ao final... i'll feel quite bad for him... esp after having beaten brian vahaly and jarkko :(

Then... roger beat bogie... and hewitt :)

Either way I'll be happy.

Kristen
01-31-2004, 10:07 AM
Dirk...would you happen to be 'dirk the dagger' (or similar name... i forget!) from the roger group on yahoo? The rather "passionate" fan? :)

maratgirl
01-31-2004, 10:23 AM
I hope and think that marat is going to win *fingerscrosed*

LiHui
01-31-2004, 10:29 AM
Marat will win i believe!That's no doubt!
Marat=Winner!!!!!!!!!
federer is good~but not great as marat!

BNO
01-31-2004, 10:50 AM
Come on Marat! :banana:
But I don't mind if Federer wins

tennischick
01-31-2004, 11:23 AM
either way i'll be thrilled. if Federer wins, he shows us that he is the true #1. (so glad Duckboy has been deposed -- far may he plummet). if Safin wins he shows that he is really back and serious about becoming #1.

either way we fans should get the match of a lifetime to watch. ;)

amethyst
01-31-2004, 12:17 PM
Im gonna make myself very unpopular here by predicting that Federer will win in straight sets. I think nobody can stop him now the way he has been playing in this tournament. And Safin has shown not much patience in the past when facing players in perfect mood. He can grow frustrated and then get out of line very fast. But maybe he has really managed to change his attitude and can prove me wrong ;)

WyverN
01-31-2004, 01:01 PM
Im gonna make myself very unpopular here by predicting that Federer will win in straight sets. I

I agree although I think it will be 4 sets

the cat
01-31-2004, 02:21 PM
TC, Roddick will be back. Just remember who he has as his coach. :D And doesn't Federer remind you of Sampras? ;)

George, of course I remember Kuerten's great run to the 1997 French Open title. But the players he beat there weren't as good as Martin, Blake, Roddick and Agassi. Coming from nowhere to win the 1997 was a truly remarkable accomplishment by Guga. :D But Marat couldn't even win amatch at the end of last year. So his run to the 2004 Australian Open final beating such tough oppenents is also remarkable in it's own right. :)

Udachi Marat! :D

*Ljubica*
01-31-2004, 02:30 PM
I think it will be a very close match - but I want Roger to win it. At least then I can say that the only person David has lost too in 2004 is the Australian Open Champion! Good Luck Roger.

BelgianWaffle
01-31-2004, 02:30 PM
Come on Marat! :banana:
But I don't mind if Federer wins

I second that :)

amethyst
01-31-2004, 02:50 PM
I think you cant compare Guga in RG 1997 with Safin, because Guga had by then no experience with best of five matches at such a big stage, while Safin has remarkable experience as a top player (including two Slam finals). So these two accomplishments are somewhat uncomparable.

v_gopi
01-31-2004, 03:12 PM
i sincerely hope safin wins the final eventhough i like federer.safin plzzzzzzzzzz do it.

v_gopi
01-31-2004, 03:14 PM
i hope the jinx of losing a match immediaely after attaining no.1 continues.

oxy
01-31-2004, 03:25 PM
i hope the jinx of losing a match immediaely after attaining no.1 continues.

u r refering to Juan Carlos jinx???
hehehehheh

Shy
01-31-2004, 03:30 PM
See, you know if it was Andre against Roger, I'll vote for Roger to win. Now, since it is a Roger against Marat, I really don't know. They both deserved it. Marat had been going through a lot and had a few though matches. Roger had easier matches, but he beat a lots of his nemesis and actually pass the second week.

joie
01-31-2004, 06:08 PM
I say Federer will win but i'm hoping Marat can continue the upsets...so nice to see 2 guys fulfilling their potential ;) Wasn't a big federer fan until i saw him play at last year's US open...but go Marat..i like him for his looks :)

Iza
01-31-2004, 08:37 PM
just a few hours left..... :D

decemberlove
01-31-2004, 09:18 PM
im happy either way that both are in the final.

i just cant choose tween them :sad:

Safina_22
01-31-2004, 09:46 PM
I know Federer is so damned good but i hope from the bottom of my heart that our amazing Safin wins.
Good lucky Marat. No matter what happens i will always cheer for you!

Pavel239
01-31-2004, 09:56 PM
As a real-Russian-guy, I hope that Marat will defeat Federer.

Funny fact - Federer is the first number at ATP-tour. Roddick was the first. Marat defeated him... So... Will be able Marat defeat second first number(:)) of ATP in one tournament?

Tennis Fool
01-31-2004, 10:01 PM
The Russian contingent is really expanding on this board.

Welcome from a non-Russian :wavey:

RoddickPride
01-31-2004, 10:06 PM
I know Federer will win, but I want Safin to win.











Karma Will Get The Belgian Bitch!
Justine sucks!

Bubble99
12-20-2010, 09:58 PM
Who would win?

KaiserT
12-20-2010, 09:59 PM
Cocoa butter.

sabina_RF_lee
12-20-2010, 10:01 PM
joking???
haha

Fed is the GOAT, but Safin isnt close to the list of 15best players

SetSampras
12-20-2010, 10:03 PM
Well Fed early 05, was playing just as good tennis as he was at his supposed peak in 06 IMO.(Might I add, the tour was complete fucking Joke in 2006 though, and 2005 was actually much more solid, just as look at Fed's slam draws. Nadal playing his 4th grass court tournament EVER amd still just a greenhorn, Roddick playing like shit, Hewitt all washed up, Agassi retiring, and Blake making noise? LOL.. Of course how could u forget Davystinko and the rest of the 2006 clowns. Safin all finished, His complete joke slam draws, and Nalbandian nowhere around as slams) But the reason I think Fed's 06 record was so good was because of how much a joke the tour was at the time, Peak Safin was "peaked" at the AO and he eventually prevailed. You have to figure at the very least Peak Safin can beat Peak Fed on hardcourts. Of course nowhere else though.


Peak Safin ( Whatever that is, I guess its once every half a decade?) could probably beat anyone in history on hardcourts. Fed was still pretty damn close to the top of his game at the AO that year that he ever was in any other time. Just watch the match back and you will see. At the end of the day though, Safin was just out of this world.

Pirao666
12-20-2010, 10:19 PM
Lol, Safin is so overhyped it's insane.

HDW
12-20-2010, 10:35 PM
Safin, of course :o

Vivalavida18
12-20-2010, 10:47 PM
lol. Definitely Federer. Safin beats Federer once and suddenly he becomes comparable to Federer in terms of greatness? I dont think so.

neme6
12-20-2010, 11:04 PM
Peak Fed at the end of 06 and early 07 was the best we'll ever see, period. Stop making comparaisons with fed please, it's annoying!

tennishero
12-20-2010, 11:36 PM
are you serious? just look at the head to head. :o

Topspindoctor
12-20-2010, 11:40 PM
Seriously? Peak Federer would obliterate Safin on clay and grass and would win at least 50% on hard courts. Dumb thread.

Action Jackson
12-20-2010, 11:40 PM
ROmSCaCJGHg

paseo
12-20-2010, 11:42 PM
Nobody beats peak Federer.









Except maybe, peak Monfils.

Sonja1989
12-20-2010, 11:49 PM
No question, Federer.

Sonja1989
12-20-2010, 11:50 PM
Nobody beats peak Federer.









Except maybe, peak Monfils.

Rafa can beat him.

RedHotRafa
12-20-2010, 11:50 PM
:haha::haha::haha::haha::haha::haha::haha::haha:

IS THAT EVEN A QUESTION!!!! FEDERER!!!

barbadosan
12-21-2010, 01:56 AM
Funniest part of this thread: "This poll will close on 08-11-2012 at 07:59 PM"

Honestly, MTF needs to institute a minimum number of posts threshold before people can make threads. It would save some from themselves, and save the rest of us from them :)

paseo
12-21-2010, 02:42 AM
Rafa can beat him.

Nadal, ON CLAY, might be able to beat peak Fed, but not peak Monfils.

Allez
12-21-2010, 08:19 AM
Silly season :rolleyes:

bokehlicious
12-21-2010, 08:23 AM
Peak Fed is a mere peak Boetsch...

Next...

vn01
12-21-2010, 09:15 AM
Peak Federer can be defeated only by Nadal. :)

MariaV
12-21-2010, 09:22 AM
Who would win?

Safin SHOULD win every poll on MTF according to MTF laws and if I had anything to do with it but it seems times have changed. :o :awww: :sad:

Funniest part of this thread: "This poll will close on 08-11-2012 at 07:59 PM"

Honestly, MTF needs to institute a minimum number of posts threshold before people can make threads. It would save some from themselves, and save the rest of us from them :)

I've been pleading for it but 2003 & Co keep on cheering us up with new threads every day. And with the likes of 2003 the number of posts as a threshold would not help either. :o :D :shrug:

doomsday
12-21-2010, 09:34 AM
I like Safin a lot but Fedex wins.

Nadull_tard
12-21-2010, 04:43 PM
Peak Federer is beatable only on clay, and only from Nadal's hands. That's all.

ibreak4coffee
12-21-2010, 04:45 PM
Is this thread supposed to be a joke?

Blackbriar
12-21-2010, 06:33 PM
peak Safin?

Roger the Dodger
12-21-2010, 06:37 PM
Safin rocks. :)

oranges
12-21-2010, 06:40 PM
peak Safin?

That's your problem with this thread? His slams wins and runs to finals didn't look like peak enough to you?

ad-out
12-21-2010, 06:41 PM
:lol: "Peak" Safin might not win but I would still rather see him play any day. ;)

Lukenole
12-21-2010, 06:52 PM
Federer.

Roger the Dodger
12-21-2010, 06:53 PM
Safin did try this peak once.
http://tennisinfoblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/09/safin_hiking.jpg

luie
12-21-2010, 07:06 PM
Imo Safins best vs feds best by game, the only venue that Safin might edge fed would be the AO/ rebound ace.
Feds best HC slam by game & result is the USO which uses low bouncing fast deco turf.
The AO rebound ace @ that time was slow & higher bouncing. It was by far Safins best surface by consistency from 2002-2005,he made 3 finals in 4 years winning 1 against hewitt.
At 6-4, with a Massive serve & easy of power of both wings he was better @ exploiting the conditions than federer.
Fed of course beat safin @ the AO has more GS @ the venue but for arguement sake I would say AO,to make it interesting.

dombrfc
12-21-2010, 07:09 PM
Bubble99, HDW, Ibracadabra, ImmzB, Iona, Laszlo Kovacs, maratsmaiden, MariaV, octatennis, puppy555, rafaholic, Ralph214, Scola, SetSampras

Arseclowns

Blackbriar
12-22-2010, 08:01 AM
Why do all the female posters can't stop talking about Safin and refuse to discuss once about Ivanovic? very strange.....

oranges
12-22-2010, 02:02 PM
Why do all the female posters can't stop talking about Safin and refuse to discuss once about Ivanovic? very strange.....

Gotta love the dumb male specimen trying this insult :worship: Care to answer my question? USO 2000, AO 2002-2005 does not constitute peak in your esteemed male view?

Certinfy
12-22-2010, 02:14 PM
Peak Federer would destroy him.

BK 201
12-22-2010, 03:28 PM
They both played two slam matches in their peaks. 1-1. However Safin was playing his first tournament in over a year in 2004 and played so many long matches that it didnt't matter who he played in the final; he would have still lost. AO 2005 was Federer's best year in terms of the quality of tennis he played. Safin still won.

Roger the Dodger
12-22-2010, 06:12 PM
They both played two slam matches in their peaks. 1-1. However Safin was playing his first tournament in over a year in 2004 and played so many long matches that it didnt't matter who he played in the final; he would have still lost. AO 2005 was Federer's best year in terms of the quality of tennis he played. Safin still won.

Maybe not.

2003
12-22-2010, 07:55 PM
Peak Fed any day of the week and twice on sunday.

2005 AO was an epic match but it was a bad choke by Federer.

BK 201
12-22-2010, 10:40 PM
Maybe not.

Hard to deny that. The only players who beat Federer in slams in 05 were Safin who is capable of beating any player, and Nadal who was a beast on clay that year.


2006 & 2007 were good, but other from Nadal, noone showed up, and Safin was injured and down and out at that point.


The problem is that Federer fans can never accept that he played well and lost, 2005 Federer played all court tennis. I'm sure Safin of AO 2005 beats Federer in any hardcourt or carpet/indoor venue of 2006 and 2007.

barbadosan
12-22-2010, 10:56 PM
Hard to deny that. The only players who beat Federer in slams in 05 were Safin who is capable of beating any player, and Nadal who was a beast on clay that year.


2006 & 2007 were good, but other from Nadal, noone showed up, and Safin was injured and down and out at that point.


The problem is that Federer fans can never accept that he played well and lost, 2005 Federer played all court tennis. I'm sure Safin of AO 2005 beats Federer in any hardcourt or carpet/indoor venue of 2006 and 2007.

heh, ask how many houses/land/wealth have been lost on gambles beginning with "I'm sure..." Just sayin'

Sophocles
12-23-2010, 04:11 PM
It's stupid to imagine the decision as resting on 1 match. Depending on what you mean by "peak" Safin - presumably not just his performance in that one A.O. semi? otherwise I'll raise you Fed in the U.S.O. 2004 final - it is clear from their head-to-head record that Federer would win the majority of matches on every surface, but the match-up would be most competitive on Rebound Ace, as Luis said.

star
12-23-2010, 04:15 PM
Really. Is there a Safin "peak?" For me, he played a few times very well, but the vast majority of the time he played well under his potential. I think there may have been some physical reasons sometimes, but much of it was mental and lack of condition.

So, for me you can't compare the two. Federer has always worked hard to gain a good mental state on the court and also has tremendous physical conditioning. If Safin had actually ever put the effort into an attempt to be a number one player maybe he could have achieved it, but we'll never know. So much of Safin worship seems to be based more on what he "could have" done rather than on what he actually did -- which was very good, but not as good as his reputation for being good.

BK 201
12-23-2010, 07:13 PM
Really. Is there a Safin "peak?" For me, he played a few times very well, but the vast majority of the time he played well under his potential. I think there may have been some physical reasons sometimes, but much of it was mental and lack of condition.

So, for me you can't compare the two. Federer has always worked hard to gain a good mental state on the court and also has tremendous physical conditioning. If Safin had actually ever put the effort into an attempt to be a number one player maybe he could have achieved it, but we'll never know. So much of Safin worship seems to be based more on what he "could have" done rather than on what he actually did -- which was very good, but not as good as his reputation for being good.


Hard to win slams when you're injury prone, let's not forget Safin picked up horrible injuries when he did something big. Go figure.

2003
12-23-2010, 07:28 PM
People over rate Federers performace in that 2005 AO semi. It was very good, but it wasn't his best.

Even then the match was still basically on his racket more than it wasn't, so peak Fed wins more often than not.

Forehander
12-23-2010, 07:32 PM
Federer AO semi was not absolute JesusFed, but Safin did play godly tennis that tournament.

leng jai
12-24-2010, 05:44 AM
Maybe people should actually watch the 05 SF again. Federer did nothing special by his standard really, and Safin played better in the final.

oranges
12-24-2010, 06:53 AM
Maybe people should actually watch the 05 SF again. Federer did nothing special by his standard really, and Safin played better in the final.

You just love to shit over that semi, to an extent that I sometimes wonder whether we're talking about the same match :lol: Just those two out of this world angled dropshots Federer played (on BP or sth like that no less) are enough to dismiss the comment. I'm also not sure how Marat played better in the final, not to mention that the opponent has something to say about the level as well. If I watch it again this off season, I'll post at least some moments and you'll tell me how that qualifies as nothing special.

leng jai
12-24-2010, 08:50 AM
You just love to shit over that semi, to an extent that I sometimes wonder whether we're talking about the same match :lol: Just those two out of this world angled dropshots Federer played (on BP or sth like that no less) are enough to dismiss the comment. I'm also not sure how Marat played better in the final, not to mention that the opponent has something to say about the level as well. If I watch it again this off season, I'll post at least some moments and you'll tell me how that qualifies as nothing special.

Someone has to counter the claims of being the greatest match of all time. Fedclown going for the show boat on match point doesn't help, and the first two sets were pretty average.

Safin played Hewitt which is a pretty bad match up for him unless hes playing really well. He doesn't like playing retrievers, even Rochus gave him fits.

oranges
12-24-2010, 09:37 AM
^^ I don't know if it's THE greatest, but it's certainly one of the best matches in the past 20 years. You don't think it's easily among the best 10 or you just don't think that's good enough?

But the main point is you're making it up Federer hasn't played anything special. A half-hour highlights could easily be made with points like those droppers or the insane Safin BH that I actually know by now around which time happens in the match. You mention that twiner on MP as if it was pure extravagance on Fed's part, rather than a desperate attempt to do something after being lobbed beautifully, as just one example of a skewed perspective. Perhaps you need to watch it again ;)

leng jai
12-24-2010, 10:01 AM
Oh I've watched it many a time on my taped VHS copy. The twiner was the pinnacle of show boat tennis. The only logical shot that Safin could have hit was a lob and the fact that it had no topspin on it meant Federer had ample time to turn around and hit a convential forehand. Add the clown backhands and its a pretty crap breaker from him.

For a match that long its not hard to produce half an hour of good highlights, though I don't see this match as particularly highlight reel friendly. I can think of several other Federer matches that would fare a lot better in a 30 minute highlight reel, and Safin ones too.

Topspindoctor
12-24-2010, 10:28 AM
Might I also remind people voting for Safin that tennis is not all about hard court? Federer would thrash Safin on clay and grass without effort.

oranges
12-24-2010, 11:06 AM
Whatever, if you see an MP beautiful saved as a mug point, we're on different planets. You still haven't answered my question, though, would you list it among top 10 matches in the past 10 or 20 years?

Nathaliia
12-24-2010, 11:23 AM
It's about how much one can extend his peak. This is clearly Federer's virtue.

Mateya
12-24-2010, 11:34 AM
I agree with leng jai that it was nothing special. I have crucial moments of this match on my old VHS tape and watch it many times.
Fed played average for his standards, something we would call shankerer here, while Safin played near his best. And yet Safin was one point away from losing it.

To answer the question: peak Federer routines peak Safin and it's relatively not even close.
6-4 7-6 6-3, with Safin transforming a racquet or two in the process. ;)

Roger the Dodger
12-24-2010, 06:21 PM
I agree with leng jai that it was nothing special. I have crucial moments of this match on my old VHS tape and watch it many times.
Fed played average for his standards, something we would call shankerer here, while Safin played near his best. And yet Safin was one point away from losing it.

To answer the question: peak Federer routines peak Safin and it's relatively not even close.
6-4 7-6 6-3, with Safin transforming a racquet or two in the process. ;)

Well said. Now a more important question: Who's the rising tennis starlet in your avvi?

BK 201
12-24-2010, 08:11 PM
Federer loses because he played a bad match.












Not that someone with a huge serve, probably the best BH ever, very good FH, capable at the net, good defence and angles/craft play played his best on that day :rolleyes:

abraxas21
12-24-2010, 08:29 PM
they're both hugely overrated clowns but at least fedclown has more slams to back up the over hype.

barbadosan
12-24-2010, 09:34 PM
they're both hugely overrated clowns but at least fedclown has more slams to back up the over hype.

abraxas :wavey: Stay off the wild side for at least a few weeks :)

Zagor
12-24-2010, 10:57 PM
I remember Safin himself said that Federer is harder for him to play against than Agassi/Sampras were so I overall consider Fed to be a tough match-up for Marat.However Safin at the peak of his abilities is a monster on any kind of HC and carpet,on those surfaces on his best day he could beat any player ever IMO(even all time great legends like Fed,Sampras,Lendl etc. with themselves playing great),IMO Fed's level throghout 2005 AO was very high and he still got beat by Safin in SF.All of this is not to be confused with maintaining peak level throghout one player's career which honestly many players did much better than Safin(and also with Fed being one of the best ever in that department as his sick SF streak and tons of slam titles show).

On clay and grass(both modern and old)however even at their best I'd give Fed a considerable edge,no question about it.

abraxas21
12-25-2010, 02:21 AM
abraxas :wavey: Stay off the wild side for at least a few weeks :)

:)

i'll take it easy ;)

Vivalavida18
12-25-2010, 03:33 AM
Federer loses because he played a bad match.












Not that someone with a huge serve, probably the best BH ever, very good FH, capable at the net, good defence and angles/craft play played his best on that day :rolleyes:

lol. The hypocrisy is simply hilarious. Federer has a 10-2 H2H versus Safin. Since the start of their careers, Federer has had the edge in their matches. Certain Safin fans like yourself cling onto the AO 2005 match for your dear lives and claim that it was an indicator that Safin's peak form is higher than that of Federer's. What about the other 10 out of 11 matches that Federer whooped Safin in? oh yeah, Safin lost because he played a bad match. ( oh wait... werent you just criticizing Fed fans for this?)


Not that someone with a huge serve, best ever forehand, tremendous footwork/agility, volleying prowess, and destined GOAThood was playing his best on those days. :rolleyes:


There is no objective criteria that can be used to determine whether Federer was playing at the top of his abilities at the AO 2005 against Safin. Statistically speaking, the match with Safin in 2005 was not even close to his best performance on a tennis court. In fact, they were extremely similar to the stats from the Fed-Nadal final from 2009. Peak level my ass...:rolleyes:

FlameOn
12-25-2010, 06:26 AM
Peak Safin does everything as well, and has a backhand return, so Safin.

A_Skywalker
12-25-2010, 09:42 AM
How can you even compare drunk and one of the best players of all time.

Monteque
12-25-2010, 12:20 PM
Safin would beat Fed in terms of catching women:D

BK 201
12-26-2010, 09:40 AM
Not that someone with a huge serve, best ever forehand, tremendous footwork/agility, volleying prowess, and destined GOAThood was playing his best on those days. :rolleyes:


There is no objective criteria that can be used to determine whether Federer was playing at the top of his abilities at the AO 2005 against Safin. Statistically speaking, the match with Safin in 2005 was not even close to his best performance on a tennis court. In fact, they were extremely similar to the stats from the Fed-Nadal final from 2009. Peak level my ass...:rolleyes:


Federer WAS at his best though. Why can't some people actually give credit for once instead of breaking down a player's great win over someone so dominant in those years. Federer even stated at Wimbledon 2008 that he couldn't have played any better......


http://www.asapsports.com/show_interview.php?id=50644


I can't believe how well we actually played, because I really thought Marat was playing at his peak and I was playing almost as good as I could, as well.



No offense, but I'll take Federer's word over yours. It's not just me who think Federer played at his best (for the record, I think Safin probably played his best at US 2000).




Fine.....Federer played like crap in that match. You got me...............

Dougie
12-26-2010, 09:57 AM
Federer WAS at his best though. Why can't some people actually give credit for once instead of breaking down a player's great win over someone so dominant in those years. Federer even stated at Wimbledon 2008 that he couldn't have played any better......


http://www.asapsports.com/show_interview.php?id=50644


I can't believe how well we actually played, because I really thought Marat was playing at his peak and I was playing almost as good as I could, as well.



No offense, but I'll take Federer's word over yours. It's not just me who think Federer played at his best (for the record, I think Safin probably played his best at US 2000).




Fine.....Federer played like crap in that match. You got me...............


It was a great match from both ( AO 2005), but a match than ended 9-7 in the fifth is obviously not enough to say "one is better than the other", the margin is just too small, it could have gone either way. Im not trying to take anything away from Safin, it was a deserved win and he played great. But the fact is that Federer won their 3 prior and 4 following meetings and constantly made it to the final stages of GSs during that time, something Safin could not do.

If Safin really was at his peak in 2005 ( which is debatable ), than he really should have played more matches against Federer during that time, and won some of them. Using one match to make an argument, is about as viable as saying "peak Volandri is better than peak Federer".

Safin was a great player who had so much talent, but who did his best to waste it.

BK 201
12-26-2010, 01:35 PM
It was a great match from both ( AO 2005), but a match than ended 9-7 in the fifth is obviously not enough to say "one is better than the other", the margin is just too small, it could have gone either way. Im not trying to take anything away from Safin, it was a deserved win and he played great. But the fact is that Federer won their 3 prior and 4 following meetings and constantly made it to the final stages of GSs during that time, something Safin could not do.

If Safin really was at his peak in 2005 ( which is debatable ), than he really should have played more matches against Federer during that time, and won some of them. Using one match to make an argument, is about as viable as saying "peak Volandri is better than peak Federer".

Safin was a great player who had so much talent, but who did his best to waste it.


I agree with what you said.





However during the clay court season in 05, Safin picked up another big injury and was forced to take pain killers before matches (Safin actually said in an interview he was playing through pain pretty much all of 2005). Yet he still pushed Federer on grass in Halle. I respect that even with an injury, on his worst surface, against fully fit Federer on his best surface, he still made it a match.







However that idiot at the top saying the AO 2005 was Federer playing not so good tennis is a ridiculous thing to say. I'm not saying peak Safin beats Federer everytime. It would be impossible to call who wins each match.

Vivalavida18
12-26-2010, 09:43 PM
Federer WAS at his best though. Why can't some people actually give credit for once instead of breaking down a player's great win over someone so dominant in those years. Federer even stated at Wimbledon 2008 that he couldn't have played any better......


http://www.asapsports.com/show_interview.php?id=50644


I can't believe how well we actually played, because I really thought Marat was playing at his peak and I was playing almost as good as I could, as well.



No offense, but I'll take Federer's word over yours. It's not just me who think Federer played at his best (for the record, I think Safin probably played his best at US 2000).




Fine.....Federer played like crap in that match. You got me...............
Federer also considered his game to be "on" against Nadal at AO 2009. He also fondly recalls his match against blake at TMC 2006 to be one of his best performances on a tennis court because he was "hitting backhand winners down the line at will".

Another thing worth pointing out in the interview you posted, Federer mentioned he was in unbelievable pain from the sizable blisters he had developed on his feet. Strange, how can we say Federer was playing his peak level tennis if he is also claiming that he could barely run in the 5th? You cant read much into this interview. Fed has his thoughts all over the place.

I will agree that Safin was a tremendously talented player who could play against anyone on his day.Please dont put words in my mouth, Im not saying Federer played like crap( he played good!) but I dont believe it was conclusive in determining which player's peak level was higher.

Nadull_tard
12-26-2010, 09:44 PM
I can't believe this thread is going on.....

abraxas21
12-27-2010, 01:14 AM
I can't believe this thread is going on.....

not really that unbelivable once you consider that safin and nalbandian are easily the two most overrated players here on MTF.

nobama
12-27-2010, 12:32 PM
How does one define "peak" Safin?

Vida
12-27-2010, 01:14 PM
imo the h2h is more or less a true reflection of their 'natural' match-up.

sierra91
12-27-2010, 04:41 PM
I saw them play live at TMC Houston semis and think they could have had a great rivalry if Safin had stayed healthy (head and body).

BK 201
12-27-2010, 10:39 PM
Federer also considered his game to be "on" against Nadal at AO 2009. He also fondly recalls his match against blake at TMC 2006 to be one of his best performances on a tennis court because he was "hitting backhand winners down the line at will".

Another thing worth pointing out in the interview you posted, Federer mentioned he was in unbelievable pain from the sizable blisters he had developed on his feet. Strange, how can we say Federer was playing his peak level tennis if he is also claiming that he could barely run in the 5th? You cant read much into this interview. Fed has his thoughts all over the place.

I will agree that Safin was a tremendously talented player who could play against anyone on his day.Please dont put words in my mouth, Im not saying Federer played like crap( he played good!) but I dont believe it was conclusive in determining which player's peak level was higher.






Safin very nearly beat Federer on grass playing in tremendous pain (his painkillers did shit all). Hence Federer is overrated on grass.



See what I did there.




Federer from the baseline in AO 2009 was very good. The problem that day was his pitiful serve % and his ability to piss chances away against Nadal.


I can live with your opinion :). However I know many neutral fans who believe that Federer (and maybe Safin) played at his best.





You want my view on this peak V peak thing: Even......However Federer held his peak level higher than Safin. Of course, it's hard to keep up your peak when you're injured every other year and you don't enjoy the game.

Arakasi
12-27-2010, 11:51 PM
Just because Federer was at his peak in '05 doesn't mean he played his very very best in that particular match. Not to belittle Safin's achievement but there are quite a few matches in which Federer has played at a higher level.

Also, rebound ace is the most favourable surface for Safin in this match-up so using that match to suggest peak Safin > peak Federer is a bit silly.

oranges
12-28-2010, 12:03 AM
Just because Federer was at his peak in '05 doesn't mean he played his very very best in that particular match. Not to belittle Safin's achievement but there are quite a few matches in which Federer has played at a higher level.

Also, rebound ace is the most favourable surface for Safin in this match-up so using that match to suggest peak Safin > peak Federer is a bit silly.

This thread is pointless since the the two played several matches when both were playing at a high level, so it's not a matter of speculation, but could people please stop with "Fed was not playing his best". Peak doesn't mean playing the most perfect you could possibly be playing, it means at a level high enough to be considered your peak, nothing more, nothing less. I could similarly pretend that Safin's peak is solely when he plays as he did at USO 2000 final and he'd be pretty much unplayable.

Bottom line is, from what we've seen, it is obvious both that Safin was capable of beating peak Fed and that Fed's 'peak' was more consistent, that is he'd generally play at higher level regularly. H2H clearly shows the result and not much to discuss really.

Arakasi
12-28-2010, 12:35 AM
could people please stop with "Fed was not playing his best". Peak doesn't mean playing the most perfect you could possibly be playing, it means at a level high enough to be considered your peak, nothing more, nothing less.

I'm sorry but when we are discussing peak Safin vs peak Federer we are referring to the highest level they can each play at. I'm not saying Federer wasn't at his best because he wasn't playing perfectly. That would be ridiculous. I am saying that Federer on several occasions has played at a higher level than the level he displayed in that '05 semi. That is a perfectly legitimate thing to say when we are discussing peak performance.

Bottom line is, from what we've seen, it is obvious both that Safin was capable of beating peak Fed...

I agree that Safin beat peak Federer. But for me the word "peak" takes on a different meaning when we are arguing about peak Safin vs peak Federer.

luie
12-28-2010, 12:42 AM
This thread is pointless since the the two played several matches when both were playing at a high level, so it's not a matter of speculation, but could people please stop with "Fed was not playing his best". Peak doesn't mean playing the most perfect you could possibly be playing, it means at a level high enough to be considered your peak, nothing more, nothing less. I could similarly pretend that Safin's peak is solely when he plays as he did at USO 2000 final and he'd be pretty much unplayable.

Bottom line is, from what we've seen, it is obvious both that Safin was capable of beating peak Fed and that Fed's 'peak' was more consistent, that is he'd generally play at higher level regularly. H2H clearly shows the result and not much to discuss really.
Granted Safin played a great game @ the USO finals 2000 but you have to remember his opponent was 29 years old & Primarily a S&V. Just saying a 29 year old Samprass is not a 24/25 year old samprass where he had a great ground game.Highly unlikely he would suffer a defeat of that scoreline previously.

oranges
12-28-2010, 12:59 AM
Granted Safin played a great game @ the USO finals 2000 but you have to remember his opponent was 29 years old & Primarily a S&V. Just saying a 29 year old Samprass is not a 24/25 year old samprass where he had a great ground game.Highly unlikely he would suffer a defeat of that scoreline previously.

You mean just as Federer seemed infinitely better playing guys like Gonzalez, Roddick and the like than he did playing Safin ;) Sampras won Wimbledon that year and that was USO, not AO, so lay off the excuses. I was just trying to make a point that anyone can pick one or two matches when a certain player was near perfect, but that's not peak, or at least it becomes pointless to discuss anything in those terms. I don't think Safin played the best he can in AO 04 final, but I still consider it his peak. It was good enough to be called that, just not good enough to win. The same goes for both in 05.

oranges
12-28-2010, 01:00 AM
I agree that Safin beat peak Federer. But for me the word "peak" takes on a different meaning when we are arguing about peak Safin vs peak Federer.

Than you can argue with BK endlessly who's better at their peak, instead of going with Fed according to my definition of it ;)

Arakasi
12-28-2010, 01:01 AM
I was just trying to make a point that anyone can pick one or two matches when a certain player was near perfect, but that's not peak, or at least it becomes pointless to discuss anything in those terms.

Why?

oranges
12-28-2010, 01:09 AM
Why?

Well, you try prove BK wrong then. :haha: Good luck, I'll check back in a year to see whether the two of you have settled it.

luie
12-28-2010, 01:12 AM
You mean just as Federer seemed infinitely better playing guys like Gonzalez, Roddick and the like than he did playing Safin ;) Sampras won Wimbledon that year and that was USO, not AO, so lay off the excuses. I was just trying to make a point that anyone can pick one or two matches when a certain player was near perfect, but that's not peak, or at least it becomes pointless to discuss anything in those terms. I don't think Safin played the best he can in AO 04 final, but I still consider it his peak. It was good enough to be called that, just not good enough to win. The same goes for both in 05.
You stated that in the USO final safin was almost unplayable ,however I'am saying the opponents age/limitation has has something to do with the scoreline,yes just like federer beating roddick because match-up & roddicks limited game,@ the time samprass was limited he was volleying on first & second serves he would never do that pre- 1997. Federer had a Harder time beating safin that roddick because safin has a Great BH,while roddicks Bh is shit, fed is susceptable to player with strong left sides generally,nadull,novak,murray,nalbandian etc.
Safin was taken to 5 sets @ the USO by pozzi,grosjean,4 sets by kiefer. on theory he improved through out the tourny likely or that Samprass was old & one-dimensional @ the time.Taking nothing away from safin because he did play well.

Arakasi
12-28-2010, 01:17 AM
Than you can argue with BK endlessly who's better at their peak, instead of going with Fed according to my definition of it ;)

Well, you try prove BK wrong then. Good luck, I'll check back in a year to see whether the two of you have settled it.

Well I have to be consistent in my views. As much as I'd love to I can't just use your definition because it would put Fed on top :).

I just always tend to place a lot of significance on peak level in these discussions and unfortunately that is a inherently subjective thing. Thankfully, I have enough sense to realise that. There is a reason I quoted you and not BK in this thread ;).

oranges
12-28-2010, 01:22 AM
@ luie I wasn't citing that match because of the scoreline, the scoreline was actually less impressive than his play. I was citing it because he was practically flawless. All the talk about Sampras matchup, his age, previous matches, etc, becomes irrelevant if we are taking one or two matches as example of peak and consider it in vacuum as a standard that has to be attained to be called peak. After all, isn't that what people are doing when claiming Fed was not at his peak in 05 semi?

luie
12-28-2010, 01:33 AM
@ luie I wasn't citing that match because of the scoreline, the scoreline was actually less impressive than his play. I was citing it because he was practically flawless. All the talk about Sampras matchup, his age, previous matches, etc, becomes irrelevant if we are taking one or two matches as example of peak and consider it in vacuum as a standard that has to be attained to be called peak. After all, isn't that what people are doing when claiming Fed was not at his peak in 05 semi?
Yes safin did play flawless tennis that day @ the USO final 2000.I know a lot of people just cite that match because of the scoreline my bad.

leng jai
12-28-2010, 04:47 AM
Sampras was tactically inept in the USO 2000 final, whether it be due to his mental state or simply being unable to adapt his game. If you watch the match again, Safin doesn't even hit one winner from the baseline in that match. He played well within himself because he knew Sampras would net rush most of the time giving him the passing shot. Sampras was doing well in the baseline rallies and was even slightly on top hitting some nice forehands. Had he been willing or able to stay back for a lot more of the match, the scoreline would have been much closer.

Zagor
12-28-2010, 12:01 PM
Federer also considered his game to be "on" against Nadal at AO 2009. He also fondly recalls his match against blake at TMC 2006 to be one of his best performances on a tennis court because he was "hitting backhand winners down the line at will".

Another thing worth pointing out in the interview you posted, Federer mentioned he was in unbelievable pain from the sizable blisters he had developed on his feet. Strange, how can we say Federer was playing his peak level tennis if he is also claiming that he could barely run in the 5th? You cant read much into this interview. Fed has his thoughts all over the place.

I will agree that Safin was a tremendously talented player who could play against anyone on his day.Please dont put words in my mouth, Im not saying Federer played like crap( he played good!) but I dont believe it was conclusive in determining which player's peak level was higher.

Safin very nearly beat Federer on grass playing in tremendous pain (his painkillers did shit all). Hence Federer is overrated on grass.



See what I did there.




Federer from the baseline in AO 2009 was very good. The problem that day was his pitiful serve % and his ability to piss chances away against Nadal.


I can live with your opinion :). However I know many neutral fans who believe that Federer (and maybe Safin) played at his best.





You want my view on this peak V peak thing: Even......However Federer held his peak level higher than Safin. Of course, it's hard to keep up your peak when you're injured every other year and you don't enjoy the game.

I personally think Fed played considerably better in 2005 SF against Marat than against Nadal in 2009 AO final but that's just my personal impression after watching those matches.However if we put that aside the fact is that if we look at statistics Fed was overall just easier(or less hard if you want)to beat in 2009 than in 2005(his winning percentage was ridiculously good in that year,almost equaled Mcenroe's record),heck if Berdman kept his cool Fed most likely wouldn't have even made it to play Nadal in the first place while in 2005 AO Fed blitzed the field before he ran into Marat.

Furthemore Fed's confidence going into his match with Marat must have been considerably higher than going into 2009 AO final against Nadal(for obvious reasons)which made him tougher to beat(as with any player,confidence is closely tied to his tennis)so overall I see Safin's victory against Fed as a greater achievement of the two.

bandabou
12-28-2010, 12:43 PM
Tantalizing match for sure..on grass and clay, fed easily. On hc?! Oh la laa...

GlennMirnyi
12-28-2010, 01:29 PM
:lol: You spend a bloody year outside MTF and the threads are still the same. And just as useless.

Filo V.
12-28-2010, 03:41 PM
This thread is pointless since the the two played several matches when both were playing at a high level, so it's not a matter of speculation, but could people please stop with "Fed was not playing his best". Peak doesn't mean playing the most perfect you could possibly be playing, it means at a level high enough to be considered your peak, nothing more, nothing less. I could similarly pretend that Safin's peak is solely when he plays as he did at USO 2000 final and he'd be pretty much unplayable.

Bottom line is, from what we've seen, it is obvious both that Safin was capable of beating peak Fed and that Fed's 'peak' was more consistent, that is he'd generally play at higher level regularly. H2H clearly shows the result and not much to discuss really.
This pretty much sums it up.

nevenez
09-08-2012, 08:58 PM
Peak Safin is unreachable.

TigerTim
09-08-2012, 09:05 PM
Peak Borg would beat both.

nevenez
09-08-2012, 09:07 PM
Peak: Safin
Average: Federer

Elaka Farmor
09-08-2012, 09:47 PM
Peak Fed any day of the week and twice on sunday.

Not if a storm arrives :mad:

Sanya
09-08-2012, 10:07 PM
29 votes for Safin. :lol: I believe these people saw only one match between two. :lol:

Looner
09-08-2012, 10:07 PM
Is this even a question :smash:.

Orange Wombat
09-08-2012, 10:11 PM
:spit: Is this even a question?

Federer even has the wins against Safin to prove it.


(On a side note, Filo V is back:woohoo:)

cmoss
09-09-2012, 02:04 AM
Safin would be huge if he wasn't a grumpy dick on courts.:o

hisham70
09-09-2012, 03:23 AM
Peak Federer def. peak Safin.

Freak3yman84
09-09-2012, 03:26 AM
(On a side note, Filo V is back:woohoo:)

:scratch: No he isn't...

Topspindoctor
09-09-2012, 03:33 AM
:spit: Is this even a question?

Federer even has the wins against Safin to prove it.


(On a side note, Filo V is back:woohoo:)

Failo.V is still banned. Although Certinfy is back just in time to mourn Berdshit loss against Mandy :lol:

Jverweij
09-09-2012, 01:06 PM
Well Fed early 05, was playing just as good tennis as he was at his supposed peak in 06 IMO.(Might I add, the tour was complete fucking Joke in 2006 though, and 2005 was actually much more solid, just as look at Fed's slam draws. Nadal playing his 4th grass court tournament EVER amd still just a greenhorn, Roddick playing like shit, Hewitt all washed up, Agassi retiring, and Blake making noise? LOL.. Of course how could u forget Davystinko and the rest of the 2006 clowns. Safin all finished, His complete joke slam draws, and Nalbandian nowhere around as slams) But the reason I think Fed's 06 record was so good was because of how much a joke the tour was at the time, Peak Safin was "peaked" at the AO and he eventually prevailed. You have to figure at the very least Peak Safin can beat Peak Fed on hardcourts. Of course nowhere else though.


Peak Safin ( Whatever that is, I guess its once every half a decade?) could probably beat anyone in history on hardcourts. Fed was still pretty damn close to the top of his game at the AO that year that he ever was in any other time. Just watch the match back and you will see. At the end of the day though, Safin was just out of this world.

bashing Fed and downplaying his achievements is not gonna make Pete the GOAT. seriously it isnt. He lost pretty much all his records to Federer, because Federer is just a better player. Deal with it.

OT: they peaked at around the same time...look at the h2h.

TigerTim
09-09-2012, 01:13 PM
Failo.V is still banned. Although Certinfy is back just in time to mourn Berdshit loss against Mandy :lol:

He was back for a post and then went into hiding again :lol:

Las7
09-09-2012, 01:33 PM
Peak Safin? I swear no one has seen peak Safin - to me they are probably some of the most talented tennis players but Safin was able to go from GOAT to mental break down in the space of 5 minutes. I personally think no one has seen peak Safin, because he never achieved it himself. Although he is a lovable character and one of the main reason I started watching Tennis, Safin never achieved even 10% of what he was capable of doing on court.

SheepleBuster
09-09-2012, 02:10 PM
People still bitching about Safin? How can you compare the guy to a 17 time slam winner. The guy was a glorified Gulbis. He won two slams when he should have won 10