RG R3: Almagro def. Murray 6-3, 6-7(3), 6-3, 7-5 [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

RG R3: Almagro def. Murray 6-3, 6-7(3), 6-3, 7-5

osalsyst
05-30-2008, 03:37 PM
Expected but Andy had 3-1 and a point for 4-2 in the third.

prima donna
05-30-2008, 03:38 PM
Almagro is a rather delightful player, quite aesthetically pleasing. Murray definitely had his opportunities, he was up a break in the 3rd, but was unable to hold on -- although in part one could attribute that to Almagro's superb play.

The commentary was quite bothersome, as there was a deafening silence following any winners hit by Almagro, while contrarily each drop shot or baseline winner hit by Murray was applauded -- and of course his temper tantrums were completely ignored for the most part.

So much for the concept of only American commentators being biased.

Allegretto
05-30-2008, 03:38 PM
Man versus mug.

Sean.J.S.
05-30-2008, 03:38 PM
What's with the brackets between sets? :spit:

adee-gee
05-30-2008, 03:39 PM
Andy's serve let him down, he actually played well at times. Looked like he could win it when he led the 3rd, but his serve deserted him. On the other hand, Almagro served outrageously well, too good.

A lot of postives for Murray though, he showed he can play on the stuff. His volleying was majestic at times. With a decent draw at Wimbledon, he can reach the SF if he serves well.

shotgun
05-30-2008, 03:39 PM
Expected win by the far better claycourter.

Come the grass season, Murraymania will be back in full force.

scoobs
05-30-2008, 03:39 PM
Good job from Almagro - looked well done in the middle of the third set but Andy let it slip away and then couldn't quite come back.

Entertaining match.

Andy will be annoyed with himself but shouldn't be too down - he gave Almagro a tough battle.

guille&tati4life
05-30-2008, 03:40 PM
I disliek both but i thought it was a quite high quality match.

martinatreue
05-30-2008, 03:41 PM
wowwwwwwwww I loved that little finesse angled topspin 1-handed backhand crosscourt passing shot winner from Almagro on match point.

rocketassist
05-30-2008, 03:41 PM
It was a good match from Murray actually, but ultimately his serving wasn't consistently good enough, whereas Mucho served big consistently all the way through.

I thought the point for 5-5 from Murray might have been a turning point, but it wasn't and his next service game was shit.

He'll be happy with how he did though, Mucho was just too classy on this surface.

Sunset of Age
05-30-2008, 03:41 PM
Muzza... :sad:

Well, lost from the better clay-courter indeed. Not much of a shame there, good match. Well done Nicolas. :hatoff:

Iván
05-30-2008, 03:41 PM
Murray played really well but almagro had a good serving day.

Nico did choke though, surely he must erase this mental weakness out of his game soon.

Action Jackson
05-30-2008, 03:41 PM
Big serving by Almagro and good that he got the win and was able to serve it out the 2nd time around.

He has a big chance to make the QFs and he won't bend over for Nadal in the quarters like Murray would on clay, no this does mean Mucho will win.

TheBoiledEgg
05-30-2008, 03:42 PM
well done Almugro !!!!!!!!!

justClaudia
05-30-2008, 03:43 PM
good job, Mucho :D

GlennMirnyi
05-30-2008, 03:43 PM
How can someone be a fan of Murray?

Bottler.

3/2 two game points and jokes it around. Then breaks when the Mugro served for the match and can't manage to freaking hold.

Couldn't hit two returns in a row for the whole match or even 3 shots in a row from the baseline.

Almugro the clown won't go through another round though.

Iván
05-30-2008, 03:45 PM
Man versus mug.

are you calling almagro a man?

*5-2 up valencia final?

Johnny Groove
05-30-2008, 03:45 PM
Almugro the clown won't go through another round though.

So you expect Tursunov the clay king to beat him?

GlennMirnyi
05-30-2008, 03:46 PM
So you expect Tursunov the clay king to beat him?

If Mugray returning like Bolelli and rallying like Reynolds could almost do it...

Iván
05-30-2008, 03:48 PM
So you expect Tursunov the clay king to beat him?

no we all expect chardy to beat him.

Chiseller
05-30-2008, 03:49 PM
what did the gesture of murray at the net mean?

EnriqueIG8
05-30-2008, 03:51 PM
Almagro first time QF in Roland Garros? Yes he will beat his next victim and falls against Djoko in QF.

roddicking
05-30-2008, 03:54 PM
They threw the match to the No 7 court,damn schedule!I wanted to watch the match but couldn't find stream.

Clara Bow
05-30-2008, 03:58 PM
Some great volleys by Murray and some great movement and serving (outside of the first time he served for the match) by Nicolas. All and all pretty entertaining.

At the net it seemed that Nico was explaining to Andy what he did towards the crowd. I think he was directing it towards someone who had been heckling him or something. I should be annoyed by it, but I love that Nico seems to always heckle his hecklers. He seems to think they are funny more than annoying.

Apemant
05-30-2008, 04:01 PM
Almagro is actually leading in the aces department - I knew his serve was big, but he always somehow surprises me.

I wonder what his percentage of 1st serves won will look like vs. Nadal, though. :devil: It is usually sky high - I mean 80% against a returner of Murray's quality? :eek:

scoobs
05-30-2008, 04:05 PM
Some great volleys by Murray and some great movement and serving (outside of the first time he served for the match) by Nicolas. All and all pretty entertaining.

At the net it seemed that Nico was explaining to Andy what he did towards the crowd. I think he was directing it towards someone who had been heckling him or something. I should be annoyed by it, but I love that Nico seems to always heckle his hecklers. He seems to think they are funny more than annoying.
Seemed like good respect between the two of them at the net.

Kodjo
05-30-2008, 04:06 PM
Nic had to have this one - anything less than QF just is not up to his clay standards

ASP0315
05-30-2008, 04:09 PM
never in doubt.
almagro serve and strong baseline game too much muggay to handle.

ASP0315
05-30-2008, 04:11 PM
Almagro first time QF in Roland Garros? Yes he will beat his next victim and falls against Djoko in QF.

his serve is incredible though. he might take a set or two off djoko imo.

Andi-M
05-30-2008, 04:11 PM
Im not happy with result but the performance was something he can take alot from. end of 2nd and beginning of 3rd set he was playing so well. Murray has such phenomenal skill and talent which he showed on Wednesday and at times today. He's just the player i find the most entertaining.

Mentally he's a bit weak though he rescued 0-40 situation 2 or 3 times, ansd then played big ball in the TB which implies mental strength...His mind can then disappear for 20-30 minutes. Thats the only reason he's not having the same sucess as someone like Nole. He cant keep his intensity (physical and mental) up in matches He really needs to work on that!

Almagro played amazing as expected. And as for Muzza Theres no shame in losing to a guy that top 5 on clay is there?
I looking forward to the grass see what happens there. He is due a nice draw in a GS too!!

scoobs
05-30-2008, 04:12 PM
Incredible serving from Almagro though - 21 aces today against Murray, who is not a shabby returner - fine effort.

zcess81
05-30-2008, 04:13 PM
Almagro first time QF in Roland Garros? Yes he will beat his next victim and falls against Djoko in QF.

He can only meet Novak in semis, which would mean he has to beat Nadal.

zcess81
05-30-2008, 04:14 PM
How can someone be a fan of Murray?

Bottler.

3/2 two game points and jokes it around. Then breaks when the Mugro served for the match and can't manage to freaking hold.

Couldn't hit two returns in a row for the whole match or even 3 shots in a row from the baseline.

Almugro the clown won't go through another round though.

How can anyone be a fan of Stepanek?

Andi-M
05-30-2008, 04:15 PM
Congrats Almagro btw as i didnt say it before :p
Him Vs Nadal in the QFs will be mouthwatering!!!

GlennMirnyi
05-30-2008, 04:18 PM
How can anyone be a fan of Stepanek?

Easy. He's not a bottler and a baby on court.

EnriqueIG8
05-30-2008, 04:19 PM
He can only meet Novak in semis, which would mean he has to beat Nadal.

Yes , i was wrong. He will not beat Nadal here at RG, maybe if Rafa has problems with his blisters but i think he will go down in 4.

Action Jackson
05-30-2008, 04:19 PM
How can anyone be a fan of Stepanek?

:worship::worship::worship:

ASP0315
05-30-2008, 04:22 PM
Easy. He's not a bottler and a baby on court.

well said.

TheSwissMaster
05-30-2008, 04:23 PM
nice to see him through.
can he be the one who might help roger achieve his GOAT status, i hope so but i know nadal will crush him and my dreams

GlennMirnyi
05-30-2008, 04:24 PM
:worship::worship::worship:

Seems quite ironic to me coming from an Acasuso/Calleri/Horna/Almugro (aka the Coca-Cola bottling team) fan. :)

zcess81
05-30-2008, 04:25 PM
Easy. He's not a bottler and a baby on court.

If that is what it takes to like a player than you should have a framed picture of "Fakervic" on your bedroom wall.

GlennMirnyi
05-30-2008, 04:26 PM
If that is what it takes to like a player than you should have a framed picture of "Fakervic" on your bedroom wall.

Not fond of cheaters, like you seem to be.

Clara Bow
05-30-2008, 04:28 PM
Seemed like good respect between the two of them at the net.

Yes, that was nice to see.

zcess81
05-30-2008, 04:30 PM
Not fond of cheaters, like you seem to be.

only of an ugly worm dancing man who's more annoying than Paris Hilton.

ASP0315
05-30-2008, 04:30 PM
Not fond of cheaters, like you seem to be.

i agree the tennis is getting destroyed because cheats like fakervic and boredo.

Clydey
05-30-2008, 04:30 PM
I have to say, Murray is one of the best serve and volley players out there. That will serve him well on grass. Almagro began to pick it off the second serve in the latter part of the third set, but overall Andy's volley's were pretty special. Shame his groundies let him down a bit. Few too many errors in baseline exchanges. Also, he really didn't cover the serve up the T at all.

Deserved win for Almagro, though.

GlennMirnyi
05-30-2008, 04:32 PM
only of an ugly worm dancing man who's more annoying than Paris Hilton.

Only fangirls like you care about looks.

I'm a fan of one of the most intelligent players in the tour today. The one who outplayed Federer on clay, didn't quit mid-match.

i agree the tennis is getting destroyed because cheats like fakervic and boredo.

Very fair point.

scoobs
05-30-2008, 04:32 PM
Oh FFS does every fucking thread have to become a Djokovic Stepanek faker bottler mug bitchfest.

Can you not fuck off and do it somewhere else - there's several dozen threads on the main page and most of them contain this kind of bullshit.

stebs
05-30-2008, 04:32 PM
Almagro the better player winning on the day. Decent showing by Murray here after a poor first round display.

TheSwissMaster
05-30-2008, 04:32 PM
I have to say, Murray is one of the best serve and volley players out there. That will serve him well on grass. Almagro began to pick it off the second serve in the latter part of the third set, but overall Andy's volley's were pretty special. Shame his groundies let him down a bit. Few too many errors in baseline exchanges. Also, he really didn't cover the serve up the T at all.

Deserved win for Almagro, though.

with grass being slower than clay, i doubt it will help

Corey Feldman
05-30-2008, 04:34 PM
Almagro was too good

basically when Andy missed a 1st serve he was in deep shit

behind Nadal and Fed, Almagro is the best claycourter in the world.

GlennMirnyi
05-30-2008, 04:35 PM
Oh FFS does every fucking thread have to become a Djokovic Stepanek faker bottler mug bitchfest.

Can you not fuck off and do it somewhere else - there's several dozen threads on the main page and most of them contain this kind of bullshit.

:lol:

I haven't started this. Tell the Murray fanboy-club to just acknowledge he bottled today. When you miss about 60% of all your second serve returns what do you expect?

scoobs
05-30-2008, 04:35 PM
I don't give a rat's ass who started it. It's just boring.

Corey Feldman
05-30-2008, 04:37 PM
Any of you see Almagro's celebration?

i think Andy thought he was mocking him and said so at the net :lol: but it was all ok in the end.

GlennMirnyi
05-30-2008, 04:37 PM
I don't give a rat's ass who started it. It's just boring.

Boring is watching Murray throw away matches from winning positions. But I guess you're more accustomed than I am with that.

Andi-M
05-30-2008, 04:38 PM
:lol:

I haven't started this. Tell the Murray fanboy-club to just acknowledge he bottled today. When you miss about 60% of all your second serve returns what do you expect?

At least there is a Murray fan club. Heck when Stepanek's name is in a thread no-one even reads it!

scoobs
05-30-2008, 04:39 PM
Boring is watching Murray throw away matches from winning positions. But I guess you're more accustomed than I am with that.
So don't watch it.

rocketassist
05-30-2008, 04:40 PM
with grass being slower than clay, i doubt it will help

That's just a deluded fedtard theory.

Clara Bow
05-30-2008, 04:41 PM
Any of you see Almagro's celebration?

i think Andy thought he was mocking him and said so at the net :lol: but it was all ok in the end.


I think he did it to someone in the crowd. Nico seems to have fun with hecklers. At the net Nico was pointing to the crowd and then things were warm between the fellas.

I was glad to see Almagro not go completely off the rails after he screwed up his first chance to serve out the match. Of course, Andy had some good play in that game but Nico also seemed still rattled after his discussion with the chair ump.

Glenn-if it makes you so miserable to watch a match between two players that you can't stand and always deride and dismiss, why do you watch it? ;) No matter who wins or loses it doesn't seem you will like anything about the match anyway. I am not trying to be a smartass, I am sincerely curious.

ASP0315
05-30-2008, 04:43 PM
with grass being slower than clay, i doubt it will help

Grass slower than clay.? :haha: :spit:
But either way murray won't win no more than 2 rd at wimby.

GlennMirnyi
05-30-2008, 04:43 PM
At least there is a Murray fan club. Heck when Stepanek's name is in a thread no-one even reads it!

Stepanek isn't in the discussion, fangirl. :)

So don't watch it.

Maybe one day I'll own ESPN and tell them what to broadcast. :yeah:

Peta Pan
05-30-2008, 04:45 PM
:banana: Well done Nico

Wish I could have seen it instead of being stuck with WTA on my TV :mad:

Clara Bow
05-30-2008, 04:46 PM
Maybe one day I'll own ESPN and tell them what to broadcast. :yeah:

Can you find a feed online of another match? Or maybe do something that seems like it would be more enjoyable for you. Go for a swim? :p

decrepitude
05-30-2008, 04:46 PM
Maybe one day I'll own ESPN and tell them what to broadcast. :yeah:

You are compelled to watch everything that is broadcast? :confused:

How very sad.

groundstroke
05-30-2008, 04:46 PM
Much better from Murray, he will still falter to any top 50 player on clay, however. Glad to see Almagro knocking him out.

Clydey
05-30-2008, 04:46 PM
with grass being slower than clay, i doubt it will help

Grass slower than clay? You, sir, are an idiot.

Black Adam
05-30-2008, 04:47 PM
Murray sucks cock

Clydey
05-30-2008, 04:49 PM
Much better from Murray, he will still falter to any top 50 player on clay, however. Glad to see Almagro knocking him out.

Acasuso is top 50 and top 15 on clay. Murray spanked him. Almagro is top 5 on clay and it was a close match.

scoobs
05-30-2008, 04:49 PM
I thought it was an entertaining match and you'd think people would want to discuss what happened in the match - what were the key features, where it turned, what stats were relevant, where it might have gone differently, how each player played and what they did well.

But too many people around here just want to spout clichés and buzz phrases that are barely relevant to the situation at hand, or indeed any situation, insult other posters and wind them up, and make simplistic pronouncements as if what they're saying is the end of the argument.

I sometimes wonder if it's tennis fans who behave like they're in a playground or playground fans who just happen to post on a tennis forum for want of anywhere better to post.

Black Adam
05-30-2008, 04:49 PM
Grass slower than clay? You, sir, are an idiot.
Hear Hear!!

Clara Bow
05-30-2008, 04:49 PM
Much better from Murray, he will still falter to any top 50 player on clay, however. Glad to see Almagro knocking him out.

To be fair, one could make the argument that Nico top five players on clay (when his brain is working) so Murray did lose to a quality player.

decrepitude
05-30-2008, 04:49 PM
Much better from Murray, he will still falter to any top 50 player on clay, however.

Acasuso is ranked 49. :shrug:

Make it any top 10 or even 20 player on clay and I might agree.

Deivid23
05-30-2008, 04:52 PM
Too good from Mucho, he´s serving off a tree this week in Paris but today he was also good from behind, improving his previous showings there. It was funny to see how Murray thinks in a minute of a tennis match more than Mucho in 2 hours

groundstroke
05-30-2008, 04:54 PM
Acasuso is top 50 and top 15 on clay. Murray spanked him. Almagro is top 5 on clay and it was a close match.
Acasuso suffers from a rare disease. (no brain). When a low ranked 17 yr old made Murray go into 5 sets, that's when you know how confident and how skilled he is.

jonny84
05-30-2008, 04:54 PM
Kind of expected; Nico is just much better on clay.

justClaudia
05-30-2008, 04:56 PM
I thought it was an entertaining match and you'd think people would want to discuss what happened in the match - what were the key features, where it turned, what stats were relevant, where it might have gone differently, how each player played and what they did well.

But too many people around here just want to spout clichés and buzz phrases that are barely relevant to the situation at hand, or indeed any situation, insult other posters and wind them up, and make simplistic pronouncements as if what they're saying is the end of the argument.

I sometimes wonder if it's tennis fans who behave like they're in a playground or playground fans who just happen to post on a tennis forum for want of anywhere better to post.

most of the people who post in here watch Tennis matches to later bash either on the player who lost, or on his fans. :shrug:
People can't acknowledge that a certain player was good, played well & deserved to win, regardless their preferences.

& if you take in consideration this is the Tennis biggest messageboard in the world, it is indeed very sad & it says quite a lot about Tennis.

Clara Bow
05-30-2008, 04:59 PM
One thing I would like to see Nico approve upon is his break point conversion rate. Although again Murray had some fabulous play to save break points, really some of his volleys :drool:. That stated, in my broken watching of the match (have to fit it in with work) it seemed that Nico still tends to have a great point to get the break opportunity and them overhit, etc.

I was only able to see a couple of volleys by Nico in my scattered watching but I see that he did not really have a good percentage at net (17 of 31). For someone who was able to watch more of the match, was a lot of it Murray passing or playing well at the net or was it more Nico not doing well up there.

Clydey
05-30-2008, 05:00 PM
Acasuso suffers from a rare disease. (no brain). When a low ranked 17 yr old made Murray go into 5 sets, that's when you know how confident and how skilled he is.

That was to do with Andy's tactics. We all know how crap Andy can be when he plays passive. Today he didn't play passively and played well for the most part.

You're an idiot if you don't think Andy is skilled. Go watch some of his volleys today.

Deivid23
05-30-2008, 05:04 PM
I thought it was an entertaining match and you'd think people would want to discuss what happened in the match - what were the key features, where it turned, what stats were relevant, where it might have gone differently, how each player played and what they did well.

But too many people around here just want to spout clichés and buzz phrases that are barely relevant to the situation at hand, or indeed any situation, insult other posters and wind them up, and make simplistic pronouncements as if what they're saying is the end of the argument.

I sometimes wonder if it's tennis fans who behave like they're in a playground or playground fans who just happen to post on a tennis forum for want of anywhere better to post.

You take these things too seriously

scoobs
05-30-2008, 05:07 PM
You take these things too seriously
I get irritated sometimes with the actual very small amount of tennis discussion that goes on on these tennis match results threads.

I'll get over it and go back to ignoring the clowns as I usually do.

Lee
05-30-2008, 05:11 PM
You take these things too seriously

No, he's not.

Sometimes, it's just too much from tards. Everyone only need to try a little bit harder in really talk about matches on GM instead of bitching at each other, the message board will be a much better, at least on GM.

Deivid23
05-30-2008, 05:15 PM
No, he's not.

Sometimes, it's just too much from tards. Everyone only need to try a little bit harder in really talk about matches on GM instead of bitching at each other, the message board will be a much better, at least on GM.

Yes he is and you´re on the same bag. This is a freaking Internet Message Board, not the fucking Army

rocketassist
05-30-2008, 05:15 PM
He is taking it too seriously. There's an ignore function if he wants to use it.

Mucho was just too good in the end, although Murray's 5-5 game was a terrible one.

He can be pleased with how he did against a top 5 clay courter.

Lee
05-30-2008, 05:18 PM
Yes he is and you´re on the same bag. This is a freaking Internet Message Board, not the fucking Army

Why you keep posting on this "Freaking Internet Message Board" then?

And I am not going to get down to your level and continue to argue with you.

scoobs
05-30-2008, 05:20 PM
He is taking it too seriously. There's an ignore function if he wants to use it.

Mucho was just too good in the end, although Murray's 5-5 game was a terrible one.

He can be pleased with how he did against a top 5 clay courter.
I'd have to ignore 99% of the threads on this board.

Deivid23
05-30-2008, 05:22 PM
Why you keep posting on this "Freaking Internet Message Board" then?

And I am not going to get down to your level and continue to argue with you.

Freaking was the Army fyi, and I post here cause I don´t get irritated like you and I have fun, u tool :lol:

Allez
05-30-2008, 05:22 PM
Murray got cocky after that improbable Acasuso win.

NinaNina19
05-30-2008, 05:34 PM
Murray had his chances but Almagro played better from the parts I saw. I think Murray could have won the 4th set, but he couldn't capitalize on his break.

shotgun
05-30-2008, 05:37 PM
Acasuso is top 50 and top 15 on clay. Murray spanked him. Almagro is top 5 on clay and it was a close match.

Just acknowledge that Murray is a mediocre player on clay, nothing more, nothing less. Up to now he has just beaten other mediocre players or off-form players on this surface. Of course he may win a small clay tourney and have the odd good SF run in RG or a clay TMS event, but will he ever contend for big titles on the surface? Hell no.

groundstroke
05-30-2008, 05:40 PM
Just acknowledge that Murray is a mediocre player on clay, nothing more, nothing less. Up to now he has just beaten other mediocre players or off-form players on this surface. Of course he may win a small clay tourney and have the odd good SF run in RG or a clay TMS event, but will he ever contend for big titles on the surface? Hell no.
Spot on.

zcess81
05-30-2008, 05:42 PM
Only fangirls like you care about looks.

I'm a fan of one of the most intelligent players in the tour today. The one who outplayed Federer on clay, didn't quit mid-match.



Very fair point.

Nope he didn't, he only quits in semis against "Fakervic" when he's getting trashed.

Manon
05-30-2008, 05:45 PM
I thought it was an entertaining match and you'd think people would want to discuss what happened in the match - what were the key features, where it turned, what stats were relevant, where it might have gone differently, how each player played and what they did well.

But too many people around here just want to spout clichés and buzz phrases that are barely relevant to the situation at hand, or indeed any situation, insult other posters and wind them up, and make simplistic pronouncements as if what they're saying is the end of the argument.

I sometimes wonder if it's tennis fans who behave like they're in a playground or playground fans who just happen to post on a tennis forum for want of anywhere better to post.

I am steeling your post. It could be mine (but you write better:))

Clydey
05-30-2008, 05:49 PM
Just acknowledge that Murray is a mediocre player on clay, nothing more, nothing less. Up to now he has just beaten other mediocre players or off-form players on this surface. Of course he may win a small clay tourney and have the odd good SF run in RG or a clay TMS event, but will he ever contend for big titles on the surface? Hell no.

Making the semi-finals of the French makes one a mediocre player? I'll be delighted if Andy ever gets to the semis. I have no expectation of him winning the French or even contesting a final. If he has success it'll be on hard or grass.

maxxo
05-30-2008, 05:52 PM
Making the semi-finals of the French makes one a mediocre player?

...and instantly a certain bald fella from my country comes to mind...

safin-rules-no.1
05-30-2008, 05:53 PM
BYE BYE UGLY PUSSY :wavey:

The Pro
05-30-2008, 05:53 PM
Almagro is a rather delightful player, quite aesthetically pleasing. Murray definitely had his opportunities, he was up a break in the 3rd, but was unable to hold on -- although in part one could attribute that to Almagro's superb play.

The commentary was quite bothersome, as there was a deafening silence following any winners hit by Almagro, while contrarily each drop shot or baseline winner hit by Murray was applauded -- and of course his temper tantrums were completely ignored for the most part.

So much for the concept of only American commentators being biased.

Do you mean his play is aesthetically pleasing?

Cos he's a bit funny looking.

I noticed the UK commentators were a bit crestfallen too. I guess they're just tired of Murray playing like crap.

adee-gee
05-30-2008, 05:58 PM
Just acknowledge that Murray is a mediocre player on clay, nothing more, nothing less. Up to now he has just beaten other mediocre players or off-form players on this surface. Of course he may win a small clay tourney and have the odd good SF run in RG or a clay TMS event, but will he ever contend for big titles on the surface? Hell no.
Mediocre is a bit harsh.

I don't disagree with what you say, but is there anyone really suggesting he's going to win RG or a big TMS?

scoobs
05-30-2008, 06:02 PM
Mediocre is a bit harsh.

I don't disagree with what you say, but is there anyone really suggesting he's going to win RG or a big TMS?
Not that I've seen, but of course people have to create their own bullshit point of contention in order to demolish it.

What I wanted from Andy was a solid, injury-free claycourt season.

R3, R2, R2, R3, R3 is nothing special but at least he has got a couple of wins under his belt, stayed uninjured, and gained some much needed experience in playing on clay at the highest level.

This is clearly not going to be Murray's happiest time of the season, but it's only 2 months of the year, and his best part of the season is right around the corner. If his scorecard is R2 and R3 over the next 3 months before the US Open, then I will be disappointed. For this period of the season, it's okay but not startling and will hopefully be a bit better next year.

shotgun
05-30-2008, 06:02 PM
Making the semi-finals of the French makes one a mediocre player? I'll be delighted if Andy ever gets to the semis. I have no expectation of him winning the French or even contesting a final. If he has success it'll be on hard or grass.

Let's say that if a player spends 10 years within the top 100, plays Roland Garros ten times and reaches the semis once facing a weak draw (being seeded), you can well say that he's a mediocre clay player within the top 100. Neither a clown, nor an outstanding player.

If Murray gets the right draw, he's a player than can make the FO semis one day, just like Ljubicic and Henman.

scoobs
05-30-2008, 06:05 PM
I see the astrologers are out in force again. People who couldn't predict the weather if they looked out of the window, but can tell us how the next 10 years of someone's career will go with commendable certainty.

Clydey
05-30-2008, 06:08 PM
Let's say that if a player spends 10 years within the top 100, plays Roland Garros ten times and reaches the semis once facing a weak draw (being seeded), you can well say that he's a mediocre clay player within the top 100. Neither a clown, nor an outstanding player.

If Murray gets the right draw, he's a player than can make the FO semis one day, just like Ljubicic and Henman.

So unless Andy at least contends a FO final he's a mediocre clay courter? Got it. You sure know your stuff.

rocketassist
05-30-2008, 06:09 PM
Henman wasn't a mediocre clay courter, he did well in the Masters Series (especially MC) and won some good DC matches on the surface.

Clydey
05-30-2008, 06:10 PM
Let's say that if a player spends 10 years within the top 100, plays Roland Garros ten times and reaches the semis once facing a weak draw (being seeded), you can well say that he's a mediocre clay player within the top 100. Neither a clown, nor an outstanding player.

If Murray gets the right draw, he's a player than can make the FO semis one day, just like Ljubicic and Henman.

Look at Fed's draw (in fact look at just about every GS draw he has). Is he mediocre on clay because he has to beat a bunch of tomato cans (plus possibly Davydenko) to get to the final?

shotgun
05-30-2008, 06:13 PM
Mediocre is a bit harsh.

I don't disagree with what you say, but is there anyone really suggesting he's going to win RG or a big TMS?

me·di·o·cre [ m dee ṓkər, m dee kər ]

adjective

Definition:

average: adequate or acceptable, but not very good

Not harsh at all IMO.

Murray himself suggested that he could win all four Slams including RG, and some of his fans seem to believe in that.


I see the astrologers are out in force again. People who couldn't predict the weather if they looked out of the window, but can tell us how the next 10 years of someone's career will go with commendable certainty.

Talk about twisting my post.

Besides, you don't know me enough to talk about my predictions.

scoobs
05-30-2008, 06:16 PM
Not harsh at all IMO.

Murray himself suggested that he could win all four Slams including RG, and some of his fans seem to believe in that.




Talk about twisting my post.

Besides, you don't know me enough to talk about my predictions.
Well as I read it, it seemed like you were saying one RG SF is pretty mediocre, that Murray is mediocre on clay and one day he might get to one RG SF in the next 10 years.

Perhaps that's not what you meant. If not, my apologies. Not sure how else it was meant to be interpreted though.

Clydey
05-30-2008, 06:17 PM
Not harsh at all IMO.

Murray himself suggested that he could win all four Slams including RG, and some of his fans seem to believe in that.




Talk about twisting my post.

Besides, you don't know me enough to talk about my predictions.

Personally, I think Andy misspoke. I don't for one second think he meant he was definitely going to win all four slams. The suggestion was more likely that if he does win a slam, the French won't be the first.

That quote has been completely misinterpreted. As if he's going to blurt out that he'll do what Federer can't. People see what they want to see and find any excuse to jump on Andy. The same thing happened when he was asked about the English football team and his response was taken entirely out of context.

shotgun
05-30-2008, 06:19 PM
So unless Andy at least contends a FO final he's a mediocre clay courter? Got it. You sure know your stuff.

No, my example was about him reaching only one semi out of 10 tries.
Though if he consistently reaches the latter rounds, then of course he couldn't be deemed mediocre.

Look at Fed's draw (in fact look at just about every GS draw he has). Is he mediocre on clay because he has to beat a bunch of tomato cans (plus possibly Davydenko) to get to the final?

You're pushing it a bit here. Federer has beaten plenty of top 20, top 10 players en route to his Slam titles.

Look, I'm a Guga fan but I won't say he was a great grasscourter just because he took advantage of his seeding and managed to reach the quarterfinal once at Wimbledon. He was mediocre at best on the surface.

maxxo
05-30-2008, 06:22 PM
You saw by the way that he reacted at the end of the match that it was a tough match. To win against me on clay is a very good result. I'm not someone that's going to be taken lightly on this surface in the future I don't think. I believe that I'm going to be one of the top players on clay in a couple years - I just need a bit more experience, a bit more strength and understanding of how to play. And I'll be up there with the best players.

Murray :worship:

NinaNina19
05-30-2008, 06:30 PM
You saw by the way that he reacted at the end of the match that it was a tough match. To win against me on clay is a very good result. I'm not someone that's going to be taken lightly on this surface in the future I don't think. I believe that I'm going to be one of the top players on clay in a couple years - I just need a bit more experience, a bit more strength and understanding of how to play. And I'll be up there with the best players.

Murray :worship:
This is true:wavey:.

shotgun
05-30-2008, 06:30 PM
Well as I read it, it seemed like you were saying one RG SF is pretty mediocre, that Murray is mediocre on clay and one day he might get to one RG SF in the next 10 years.

Yes, one Roland Garros SF out of many tries, beating mostly unseeded players and losing to the first top player faced, is mediocre. Of course, one Roland Garros SF beating top 10 players on the way is not mediocre.

Yes, Murray is mediocre on clay. Does his results up to now suggest otherwise? What are his biggest scalps on the surface, his best results?

About the RG SF, what I'm saying is that it wouldn't be too much of a shock if he reached a SF at RG one day, if he gets the right draw, and people shouldn't deem him an outstanding claycourter just because of that.

Clydey
05-30-2008, 06:31 PM
No, my example was about him reaching only one semi out of 10 tries.
Though if he consistently reaches the latter rounds, then of course he couldn't be deemed mediocre.



You're pushing it a bit here. Federer has beaten plenty of top 20, top 10 players en route to his Slam titles.

Look, I'm a Guga fan but I won't say he was a great grasscourter just because he took advantage of his seeding and managed to reach the quarterfinal once at Wimbledon. He was mediocre at best on the surface.

You're basing your assertion on something that hasn't happened?

Murray is a mediocre clay courter. That's what you said. And you're backing it up by looking into the future?

Oh, and I'm sorry for "pushing it a bit here". I'll try to show your baseless conjectures more respect in future.

Clydey
05-30-2008, 06:34 PM
Yes, one Roland Garros SF out of many tries, beating mostly unseeded players and losing to the first top player faced, is mediocre. Of course, one Roland Garros SF beating top 10 players on the way is not mediocre.

Yes, Murray is mediocre on clay. Does his results up to now suggest otherwise? What are his biggest scalps on the surface, his best results?

About the RG SF, what I'm saying is that it wouldn't be too much of a shock if he reached a SF at RG one day, if he gets the right draw, and people shouldn't deem him an outstanding claycourter just because of that.

You're getting so far ahead of yourself it's not even funny. No one is suggesting that Murray is an outstanding clay courter. We think calling him mediocre is harsh, though, particularly as he has improved so quickly. He has barely played on the surface since coming on the tour. He's a second tier clay courter right now. Guys like Nadal, Djokovic, Fed and even Almagro are top tier.

shotgun
05-30-2008, 06:41 PM
You're basing your assertion on something that hasn't happened?

Murray is a mediocre clay courter. That's what you said. And you're backing it up by looking into the future?

Oh, and I'm sorry for "pushing it a bit here". I'll try to show your baseless conjectures more respect in future.

No, I'm basing it on his clay record, which is mediocre.

Don't worry, I don't need your respect, just try not to get your panties in a bunch everytime someone says some truths about your darling on a message board.

You're getting so far ahead of yourself it's not even funny. No one is suggesting that Murray is an outstanding clay courter. We think calling him mediocre is harsh, though, particularly as he has improved so quickly. He has barely played on the surface since coming on the tour. He's a second tier clay courter right now. Guys like Nadal, Djokovic, Fed and even Almagro are top tier.

Murray thinks he will be a top player on clay in the future. Some fans of his said he could take out Nadal in some of the RG warm-ups. Just make a search for the older posts.

He's a second tier claycourter, I agree with you.

First tier - good.
Second tier - mediocre.
Third tier - bad.

Is that so hard to grasp, or do I need to write you a 100 page tutorial?

I'm off this thread, I have already wasted too much time on here debating with fanboys.

scoobs
05-30-2008, 06:46 PM
I think his results at this point are mediocre but at least they're not out and out bad like they were in 2006 and 2007.

We'll see how he ends up over the course of his career.

Clara Bow
05-30-2008, 06:46 PM
Sorry to veer away from all the the talk about Murray, but I am still curious about a question I asked earlier about the other player in that match. (You mean there was another player besides Murray in the match? ;) . Since I was unable to see a good portion of the match could anyone who did tell me if Nico's not-to-good percentage of net points won due more to Murray's having great shots or Nico having poor ones?

Sorry to pester, but I really like Nico and was wondering how he was doing when he went up in the court.

scoobs
05-30-2008, 06:48 PM
Sorry to veer away from all the the talk about Murray, but I am still curious about a question I asked earlier about the other player in that match. (You mean there was another player besides Murray in the match? ;) . Since I was unable to see a good portion of the match could anyone who did tell me if Nico's not-to-good percentage of net points won due more to Murray's having great shots or Nico having poor ones?

Sorry to pester, but I really like Nico and was wondering how he was doing when he went up in the court.
It depends how they define "net points"

I didn't see Nico up there an awful lot by choice, but he was dragged up there a lot by dropshots and I suppose it's a net point at that point and yeah he struggled to deal with a lot of Andy's dropshots today.

Clara Bow
05-30-2008, 06:49 PM
It depends how they define "net points"

I didn't see Nico up there an awful lot by choice, but he was dragged up there a lot by dropshots and I suppose it's a net point at that point and yeah he struggled to deal with a lot of Andy's dropshots today.

Thanks- they didn't really say what constituted net points. Just that he want up there 31 times and lost 14 of those times.

Clydey
05-30-2008, 06:50 PM
No, I'm basing it on his clay record, which is mediocre.

Don't worry, I don't need your respect, just try not to get your panties in a bunch everytime someone says some truths about your darling on a message board.



Murray thinks he will be a top player on clay in the future. Some fans of his said he could take out Nadal in some of the RG warm-ups. Just make a search for the older posts.

He's a second tier claycourter, I agree with you.

First tier - good.
Second tier - mediocre.
Third tier - bad.

Is that so hard to grasp, or do I need to write you a 100 page tutorial?

I'm off this thread, I have already wasted too much time on here debating with fanboys.

It's that simple. Nadal is a top tier clay courter (a "good" clay court player, according to you). Anyone below that level is mediocre.

Your disdain for Murray is apparent. I'm being realistic, whereas you are making predictions based on what you see in your crystal ball. The fact that you think anyone who disagrees with you is a fanboy does little to support your position. In fact, by making such baseless assumptions you are losing the argument.

If you can't deal with opposing views, bugger off to a Kuerten forum and revel in consensus. Murray is a good clay courter. Not outstanding, not medicore, but good. He'll give anyone a match on his day, but he's unlikely to beat the top guys, unless he has "one of his crazy good days", to borrow a Federer phrase.

Clydey
05-30-2008, 06:53 PM
Sorry to veer away from all the the talk about Murray, but I am still curious about a question I asked earlier about the other player in that match. (You mean there was another player besides Murray in the match? ;) . Since I was unable to see a good portion of the match could anyone who did tell me if Nico's not-to-good percentage of net points won due more to Murray's having great shots or Nico having poor ones?

Sorry to pester, but I really like Nico and was wondering how he was doing when he went up in the court.

Murray had consistent success with drop shots. He won just about every point if one of his drop shots landed in. That is probably where Almagro's poor % at the net came from. He didn't volley much at all, to be honest.

rocketassist
05-30-2008, 06:55 PM
There aren't three tiers of clay courter. More like five.

World class- the big 3, Almagro, Pics, PMK
Good- Andreev, Boredo, Wawrinka, Moya, Ferrero (though both were once in the league above), Monaco, Acasuso
Ok- Murray's league- see also Ljubicic, Mathieu, Volandri, Haas, Canas, Chela
Average- Roddick, Blake, Tursunov, ToJo, Bjorkman
Poor- Fish. Isner, Ginepri, Srichaphan

Clydey
05-30-2008, 06:59 PM
There aren't three tiers of clay courter. More like five.

World class- the big 3, Almagro, Pics, PMK
Good- Andreev, Boredo, Wawrinka, Moya, Ferrero (though both were once in the league above), Monaco, Acasuso
Ok- Murray's league- see also Ljubicic, Mathieu, Volandri, Haas, Canas, Chela
Average- Roddick, Blake, Tursunov, ToJo, Bjorkman
Poor- Fish. Isner, Ginepri, Srichaphan

Hmm, I'd maybe put Andy slightly above the likes of Volandri. He's not as good as Wawrinka yet, mind you. Also, he gave Acasuso a beating.

He's probably in between 2 and 3, I'd say, going by your ratings.

ChinoRios4Ever
05-30-2008, 07:14 PM
too good Nico, finally in a 2nd week of a major :yeah:

DhammaTiger
05-30-2008, 07:20 PM
I am so happy that Nico bt Murray, It my day that one of my most favourite players beat one of my least favourite. Nico when he is focusing is really great to watch, unfortunately I couldn't watch him take out Murray.

Duncan
05-30-2008, 07:29 PM
Easy. He's not a bottler and a baby on court.



Maybe not a bottler but he is one of the biggest babies on tour :lol: :cool:






Great performance Andy. Nothing to be ashamed of! Roll on the grass now.

DrJules
05-30-2008, 07:30 PM
Big serving by Almagro and good that he got the win and was able to serve it out the 2nd time around.

He has a big chance to make the QFs and he won't bend over for Nadal in the quarters like Murray would on clay, no this does mean Mucho will win.

Do not expect Almagro to offer much challenge to Nadal.

Henry Chinaski
05-30-2008, 07:40 PM
Any of you see Almagro's celebration?

i think Andy thought he was mocking him and said so at the net :lol: but it was all ok in the end.

Yeah that's what I made of it too.

Murray's haters can now add "paranoid" to their list of perjoratives.

Henry Chinaski
05-30-2008, 07:41 PM
I seem to remember Stepanek double faulting 3 times when he served for a place in a Grand Slam semi-final.

scoobs
05-30-2008, 07:42 PM
I seem to remember Stepanek double faulting 3 times when he served for a place in a Grand Slam semi-final.
Against Bjorkman, yes.

Wow - he was a mug that day.

RogandyFan
05-30-2008, 08:41 PM
Stepanek isn't in the discussion, fangirl. :)



Maybe one day I'll own ESPN and tell them what to broadcast. :yeah:


I have not joined this board for a long time but you sir has nothing positive to post. :p

jazar
05-30-2008, 09:30 PM
i caught a glimpse of this match, just so i could heckle murray. i have to say he looks even more awkward live than he does on the tv.

very glad he lost. well done nico

Corey Feldman
05-30-2008, 11:01 PM
i caught a glimpse of this match, just so i could heckle murray. :lol::lol:

next time get his autograph for me will you

make him sign your arse cheeks as well

FedFan_2007
05-30-2008, 11:44 PM
Almugro def Nadal 6-3, 6-4, 6-0. You heard it here first!

scoobs
05-30-2008, 11:54 PM
Put down the crackpipe and walk away.

NinaNina19
05-31-2008, 12:18 AM
What does being a bottler mean?

scoobs
05-31-2008, 12:20 AM
What does being a bottler mean?
When the big moment comes, you blow it cos of nerves.

NYCtennisfan
05-31-2008, 12:25 AM
Almagro's serve on clay is as good as anyone's other than Ivo. Murray played well though and I think good things are in store for him at Queen's and Wimby.

Andi-M
05-31-2008, 01:51 AM
Muzza is an unlucky guy. He dosent get nice draws ala that Llodra/Gulbis section of RG. Muzza would be in the QFs if that was the case.

He in the main has only lost on clay to the creme de la creme he's not losing to Fish, Karlovic,+ Blake. So to call him a clay mug or even a mediocre claycourt player is harsh.

Muzza will be contesting for big claycourt tournies in 2-3 years. No doubt about it. Improved stamina is all thats required he has very good tactical awareness on clay and moves very well on it too.

His game is suitable for all surfaces.

scoobs
05-31-2008, 01:54 AM
I think it's lame to blame the draw, really.

Great players come through in spite of the draw, not lose because of it.

If Andy wants to become a great player on clay he has to find solutions to guys like Almagro - can't depend on a cakewalk draw to get him there.

Merton
05-31-2008, 02:02 AM
Excellent serving by Almagro throughout, finally makes it to the 2nd week at RG. Murray did more or less as expected on clay, he would need a different forehand to become more of a threat on the surface.

Andi-M
05-31-2008, 02:29 AM
I think it's lame to blame the draw, really.

Great players come through in spite of the draw, not lose because of it.

If Andy wants to become a great player on clay he has to find solutions to guys like Almagro - can't depend on a cakewalk draw to get him there.

I agree but Murray is not yet a great clay court player. And having bad luck in draws is making him face great claycourt players early on in tournaments preventing him from making last 16 last 8 or whatever.

He will eventually have to start to step it up and start beating players he's not supposed to, but I dont expect that frm him this year on clay. considering its the only real CC season he has played in.

On grass/hardcourts no more excuses....he needs to shine.

dsingh7
05-31-2008, 03:09 AM
most of the people who post in here watch Tennis matches to later bash either on the player who lost, or on his fans. :shrug:
People can't acknowledge that a certain player was good, played well & deserved to win, regardless their preferences.

& if you take in consideration this is the Tennis biggest messageboard in the world, it is indeed very sad & it says quite a lot about Tennis.

I second your opinion ...people end up bashing player instead of appreciating the play ...it was an entertaining match overall ..80% first serve against Andy is quite an achievement considering how good returner Andy is...Nadal will have tough time dealing with this guy if he keeps his head together...

Rafa = Fed Killa
05-31-2008, 03:23 AM
Muzza is an unlucky guy. He dosent get nice draws ala that Llodra/Gulbis section of RG. Muzza would be in the QFs if that was the case.

He in the main has only lost on clay to the creme de la creme he's not losing to Fish, Karlovic,+ Blake. So to call him a clay mug or even a mediocre claycourt player is harsh.

Muzza will be contesting for big claycourt tournies in 2-3 years. No doubt about it. Improved stamina is all thats required he has very good tactical awareness on clay and moves very well on it too.

His game is suitable for all surfaces.

You have to earn your draws. He has to win and increase his rank. With a high enough seed he will get his easy draws.

Farenhajt
05-31-2008, 06:47 AM
All talent and no mugness this Murray. You just gotta love him :inlove:

Rogiman
05-31-2008, 07:04 AM
Muzza is an unlucky guy. He dosent get nice draws ala that Llodra/Gulbis section of RG. Muzza would be in the QFs if that was the case.

He in the main has only lost on clay to the creme de la creme he's not losing to Fish, Karlovic,+ Blake. So to call him a clay mug or even a mediocre claycourt player is harsh.
That Blake guy you mention here killed Almagro at RG last year, it wasn't even close.

And yes, Murray's pretty horrible on clay.

jazar
05-31-2008, 08:28 AM
some pics

dodoboy
05-31-2008, 12:28 PM
Making it this far is good enough for the Brits!

Hopefully he can string together some good results in the grass season :)

Action Jackson
05-31-2008, 12:40 PM
Do not expect Almagro to offer much challenge to Nadal.

He will offer more than Murray would on a clay court.

groundstroke
05-31-2008, 12:45 PM
Hmm, I'd maybe put Andy slightly above the likes of Volandri. He's not as good as Wawrinka yet, mind you. Also, he gave Acasuso a beating.

He's probably in between 2 and 3, I'd say, going by your ratings.
Between 2? Fuck no. He's 3 at most. He's a joke of a tennis player.

rocketassist
05-31-2008, 01:02 PM
Between 2? Fuck no. He's 3 at most. He's a joke of a tennis player.

Hmm, this comment smacks of glory hunting British Federer 'I support winners only' fan :shrug:

NYCtennisfan
05-31-2008, 06:05 PM
That Blake guy you mention here killed Almagro at RG last year, it wasn't even close.

And yes, Murray's pretty horrible on clay.

Blake's hitting that day against Almagro...:eek:

Action Jackson
05-31-2008, 06:08 PM
Blake's hitting that day against Almagro...:eek:

Almagro's tactics were shocking. Trying to out ball bash Blake.

NYCtennisfan
05-31-2008, 06:17 PM
Almagro's tactics were shocking. Trying to out ball bash Blake.

:lol: Two masters of strategy going at it. Funny thing is that two guys who have the ability to hit like that just bashing the ball provides for some really good viewing at times.

leng jai
05-31-2008, 11:39 PM
:lol: Two masters of strategy going at it. Funny thing is that two guys who have the ability to hit like that just bashing the ball provides for some really good viewing at times.

They should play doubles together. I am sure they would employ the vintage doubles tactics of return winners and down the line passing shots every 2 seconds.

DrJules
06-03-2008, 07:59 PM
Big serving by Almagro and good that he got the win and was able to serve it out the 2nd time around.

He has a big chance to make the QFs and he won't bend over for Nadal in the quarters like Murray would on clay, no this does mean Mucho will win.

Really!!

scoobs
06-03-2008, 08:02 PM
:lol:

Not GWH's best prediction yet :)

GlennMirnyi
06-03-2008, 08:02 PM
When I complained about Murray's lost chance in this match everybody bashed me. ;)

Action Jackson
06-03-2008, 08:03 PM
Really!!

I got one wrong and what Murray has never turned in a stinker against Djokovic or Nadal.

DrJules
06-03-2008, 08:06 PM
I got one wrong and what Murray has never turned in a stinker against Djokovic or Nadal.

Murray has not lost that easily - average 1 game a set.

scoobs
06-03-2008, 08:09 PM
At least Murray would have swore a bit, given the crowd something to boo him for, woken them up a bit.

Merton
06-03-2008, 08:12 PM
Based on the Hamburg match it is hardly possible to make a case about how competitive Andy would be. :o Granted, he would certainly win more than 3 games total, actually he might make 3 times that number.

Jaap
06-03-2008, 08:12 PM
Mugro always bottles it against the top players.

Action Jackson
06-03-2008, 08:12 PM
Murray has not lost that easily - average 1 game a set.

Murray 6-1 6-0 against Djokovic. I'm not sure that is 1 game less than Almagro in 2 sets played.

6-2 6-3 against an average Nadal is classified as a win is it?

GlennMirnyi
06-03-2008, 08:13 PM
At least Murray would have tried some dropshots or something like it.

Action Jackson
06-03-2008, 08:16 PM
At least Murray would have tried some dropshots or something like it.

This is true. A beatdown done in a different manner, but still a beatdown.

GlennMirnyi
06-03-2008, 08:19 PM
This is true. A beatdown done in a different manner, but still a beatdown.

At least he would have tried something different for sure instead of just ballbashing. :)

scoobs
06-03-2008, 08:20 PM
At least he would have tried something different for sure instead of just ballbashing. :)
pushing the ball, maybe?

Action Jackson
06-03-2008, 08:22 PM
At least he would have tried something different for sure instead of just ballbashing. :)

I mean Mucho might have a big head, but is full of presunto and not used for tactical sense.

Lets be honest, this is a guy who tried to out ballbash James Blake. :)

GlennMirnyi
06-04-2008, 01:31 AM
pushing the ball, maybe?

Well, against Mugro he was S&Ving.