Rafa-Djoko-Fed = Salieri-Mozart-Beethoven?? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Rafa-Djoko-Fed = Salieri-Mozart-Beethoven??

krakenzero
03-23-2008, 12:10 AM
OK, everyone has got his own dumb thread already, so I think it's my turn:devil::rolleyes:...

My point is, it's amazing but even when Nadal is a great player who will be remembered as one of the greatest players in our time, he probably won't have an Era, a distinction that we could consider even more important that the "Legend" one (There are more legends than Era's masters).

Thinking about that I remembered the Salieri story, a great clasical compositor (who even "schooled" Mozart and Beethoven at a time, in his Academy) that was condemned to never get the recognition he deserved, just because of the Eras in which he performed. There was a great rivalry between Salieri and Mozart, but Mozart was always best valued by the people. There's even a theory about Salieri poisoning Mozart and causing his death, but that is considered more a myth than a reality. Ah! Mozart wanted to be the Music Professor of the Württemberg princess, but Salieri got that job instead of him. French Open anyone?:p

Now that Federer is slowly diminishing his level, we could think that the Nadal Era is coming soon. But, since Djokovic appeared from nowhere and started winning everything in hard courts, Nadal could esaily lose his "Era" too. That made me think about Beethoven, who became the best clasical musician a few years after Mozart's death, leaving Salieri in the shadow... again.

OK, that was my first great "sense-free" thread in GM, I hope you enjoy it. Any thoughts?:p

Aloimeh
03-23-2008, 12:12 AM
OK, everyone has got his own dumb thread already, so I think it's my turn:devil::rolleyes:...

My point is, it's amazing but even when Nadal is a great player who will be remembered as one of the greatest players in our time, he probably won't have an Era, a distinction that we could consider even more important that the "Legend" one (There are more legends than Era's masters).

Thinking about that I remembered the Salieri story, a great clasical compositor (who even "schooled" Mozart and Beethoven at a time, in his Academy) that was condemned to never get the recognition he deserved, just because of the Eras in which he performed. There was a great rivalry between Salieri and Mozart, but Mozart was always best valued by the people. There's even a theory about Salieri poisoning Mozart and causing his death, but that is considered more a myth than a reality. Ah! Mozart wanted to be the Music Professor of the Württemberg princess, but Salieri got that job instead of him. French Open anyone?:p

Now that Federer is slowly diminishing his level, we could think that the Nadal Era is coming soon. But, since Djokovic appeared from nowhere and started winning everything in hard courts, Nadal could esaily lose his "Era" too. That made me think about Beethoven, who became the best clasical musician a few years after Mozart's death, leaving Salieri in the shadow... again.

OK, that was my first great "sense-free" thread in GM, I hope you enjoy it. Any thoughts?:p

Hehe. I thought of the Mozart-Djokovic analogy before. But in that case Federer was Salieri. ;)

krakenzero
03-23-2008, 12:14 AM
:worship: well I guess I'm not the only one. Federer also schooled Djokovic until last year, just like Salieri used to school Mozart when he was young:rolleyes:

Voo de Mar
03-23-2008, 12:20 AM
Good psychodelic drugs you use ;) :yeah:

juninhOH
03-23-2008, 12:20 AM
Salieri-Mozart rivalry = myth, according to the biographers.

Adler
03-23-2008, 12:23 AM
Rafa looks more like Wagner, heavy pounding sounds and so on

But he's a Spaniard, so SKA-P fits better :D

*bunny*
03-23-2008, 12:29 AM
Salieri is the oldest of the three. :angel:

connectolove
03-23-2008, 01:17 AM
The "THREE AMIGOS", or the new three Tenors, or the three Mosqueteers ... or the three piglets...

DDrago2
03-23-2008, 01:24 AM
Good old times of classical music, when music mattered and when being a 'musical master' and a star was one and the same

platinum
03-23-2008, 01:43 PM
Federer = Graf

Djokovic = Seles

Nadal = Sanchez-Vicario

Aloimeh
03-23-2008, 01:55 PM
Federer = Graf

Djokovic = Seles

Nadal = Sanchez-Vicario

Yes, I had stated that before as well. Djokovic = Seles without any doubt. And Federer = Graf likewise. Let's just hope Djokovic doesn't get a Gunther Parche. :eek:

MisterQ
03-23-2008, 02:05 PM
I have thought of Federer as Mozartian and Nadal as Beethovenian, but that relates more to style.

I've probably thought too much about this already. :lol:

Safin = Mussorgsky :yeah:

ret
03-23-2008, 05:44 PM
no Salieri in this group.

SwiSha
03-23-2008, 05:46 PM
get some help son

r2473
03-23-2008, 06:07 PM
Good old times of classical music, when music mattered and when being a 'musical master' and a star was one and the same

Ah yes, I remember it well.

Why I remember telling Beethoven's drunkard, abusive father that.....

Metis
03-23-2008, 06:29 PM
I think MisterQ's analogies make more sense :D


I have thought of Federer as Mozartian and Nadal as Beethovenian, but that relates more to style.

I've probably thought too much about this already. :lol:

Safin = Mussorgsky :yeah:


:lol: good choice; maybe Schumann too but without his Clara

DDrago2
03-23-2008, 06:32 PM
Ah yes, I remember it well.

Why I remember telling Beethoven's drunkard, abusive father that.....

:confused:

I wanted to say that in classical times music was about being a good musician, I don't understand what are you getting at

platinum
03-23-2008, 10:53 PM
Let's just hope Djokovic doesn't get a Gunther Parche. :eek:

I hope not. that was very sad :sad::sad::sad::sad::sad:

Sunset of Age
03-23-2008, 10:57 PM
I have thought of Federer as Mozartian and Nadal as Beethovenian, but that relates more to style.

I've probably thought too much about this already. :lol:

Safin = Mussorgsky :yeah:

:yeah: :lol:

And Djoko = Johnny Rotten. :angel:

Adler
03-23-2008, 11:16 PM
yeah, what's next? Stepanek = Dvorak? Lightness and variety? Haas = Schubert? All-around composer?

BTW, Muzza or J.McEnroe are more like Johny Rotten for me

Kolya
03-24-2008, 04:55 AM
Tennis and music = Vince Spadea! :p

calvinhobbes
03-24-2008, 07:17 AM
I believe Salieri has nothing to do here. Instead of him, Joseph Haydn could complete this trinity. As a teacher of both Mozart and Beethoven, he created alone the whole classical vienese school, giving birth to styles and forms with his particular seal of elegance, discretion and equilibrium. He did not maintain any rivalry with his two pupils, and recognized with no envy their genius.His good-natured temperament maintaned itself with no explosions and he never broke a racket, in spite of having a difficult, patronizing and quarreling wife. As it is widely known, Fed .... er Haydn is the creator of the symphony, the quartett and the piano trio in their modern form. A superb legacy to his art.

calvinhobbes
03-24-2008, 07:18 AM
I believe Salieri has nothing to do here. Instead of him, Joseph Haydn could complete this trinity. As a teacher of both Mozart and Beethoven, he created alone the whole classical vienese school, giving birth to styles and forms with his particular seal of elegance, discretion and equilibrium. He did not maintain any rivalry with his two pupils, and recognized with no envy their genius.His good-natured temperament maintaned itself with no explosions and he never broke a racket, in spite of having a difficult, patronizing and quarreling wife. As it is widely known, Fed .... er Haydn is the creator of the symphony, the quartett and the piano trio in their modern form. A superb legacy to his art.

Aloimeh
03-24-2008, 07:47 AM
I believe Salieri has nothing to do here. Instead of him, Joseph Haydn could complete this trinity. As a teacher of both Mozart and Beethoven, he created alone the whole classical vienese school, giving birth to styles and forms with his particular seal of elegance, discretion and equilibrium. He did not maintain any rivalry with his two pupils, and recognized with no envy their genius.His good-natured temperament maintaned itself with no explosions and he never broke a racket, in spite of having a difficult, patronizing and quarreling wife. As it is widely known, Fed .... er Haydn is the creator of the symphony, the quartett and the piano trio in their modern form. A superb legacy to his art.

Yes, but it is Mozart and Beethoven that perfected these musical forms. ;)

HKz
03-24-2008, 07:56 AM
Considering Rafa one of the greatest tennis players is kind of stupid though.. Saying that he is one of the greatest clay-courters, now that would be accurate. Because seriously, Rafa hasn't really established anything. For example, people claim (mostly hardcore Rafaian fans) that Federer is the number two clay player while Nadal is number one, while on grass, Federer is the number one grass player while is number two. First if that was true, Nadal should AT LEAST reach the finals of Queen's Club because Federer does not play there. Instead however, Nadal has been barely able to reach the quaterfinals two times in a row losing to "out-of-prime" players. And then comes Wimbledon where he has seriously been lucky these past two years.

2006- faces virtually no competition. Kendrick blows match after being 2 sets to love. Baghdatis chokes almost whole match, except second set but is unable to break Nadal's serve.
2007- Soderling can't close out the match in 5th set. Youhzny injures his back after being up 2 sets to love. Berdych can't bring out his game. After winning the first set, Djokovic becomes injured and retires after losing the next two sets.

So obviously luck has played a huge part for Nadal. On hardcourts however, Nadal has had some sucess, but 5 titles on hardcourts and 18 titles on clay I'm pretty sure would be considered a clay courter rather than a overall player or else Thomas Muster would be considered a great overall player (however we all know that Muster is just considered a clay court player)

Djokovic has started this year with nice form but I'm waiting to see how long he can keep this up and if he can do anything on clay/grass; it is going to be interesting.

Federer: I really don't know what he is doing. How many more losses are required until he gets a coach, or at least turn his career around.