Do you use anti-vibe? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Do you use anti-vibe?

juninhOH
03-17-2008, 05:56 PM
I feel better when I play without the anti-vibe thing on my racquet, but I've read in some places that the anti-vibe is good for the elbows and etc. I wonder if thats really a 'MUST USE'. I play like 3-4 times a week 1h max each day.

If anyone has an article in mind about that, please tell me I'd like to read about it.

empressdiver
03-17-2008, 09:33 PM
I don't use one either. At best, I think its useless. In fact, for me, it tends to deaden the feel for the ball, which I don't like.

Most players who get tennis elbow have a problem with their strokes, and a little rubber thingy ain't going to fix it.

I have been playing with natural gut string for over a year now, and I think it has helped my game a lot. Gut gives you better feel and control. And it will help people with tennis elbow problems because gut has more resiliency than any synthetic string on impact with a tennis ball. Tennis-warehouse.com has a good article about natural gut.

dunlopkickserve
03-23-2008, 02:35 AM
If you are winning without using one, i wouldn't change a thing. I don't think that you are playing enough to do any real damage yet, you might need one when you get older but you should be fine for now

GlennMirnyi
03-23-2008, 02:45 AM
Anti-vibes change nothing in the vibration dampening. No way a 5 gram thing will influence in something that weighs more than 300 grams. :)

GustavoM_Fan
03-23-2008, 04:12 AM
anti-vibes are schett :)

GlennMirnyi
03-23-2008, 07:00 AM
anti-vibes are schett :)

Second that.

jazar
03-23-2008, 06:16 PM
they're pretty useless. i never hit with a racket that has a dampner in, i always have to take it out

Jackie Stephens
03-28-2008, 02:09 AM
Second that.

Third that.

Clashcityrocker
05-18-2008, 01:51 PM
I once saw a guy who gave up his match because he lost that thingie on the court somewhere :D
i think i laughed for a whole half hour or something ;)

gaz
05-19-2008, 10:01 PM
it will depend on the string you use and how high your tension is when you have your racket strung

a vibration dampener is nothing to do with weight it is to do with science becuase the absorbs the vibrations and it works wether you prefer it or not

they do you not incourage injuries or stop you getting injured totally but they can help

Tulipe
06-15-2008, 01:47 PM
I play with a dampener, but I take it more like a fashion stuff (I mean I play with these Wilson Bowl of Fun dampeners that have shapes of smileys, hearts etc. - yeah, girlish). When I don't have it on, I'm able to play without it, of course. But I feel the difference. I think it's because I'm used to it. So I think if you don't use it and suddenly you put it on, you won't feel comfy and it will distract your concentration.

GlennMirnyi
06-16-2008, 01:19 AM
Science says that for something to absorb vibrations (energy), it must have mass. Something that weighs nothing can't absorb anything.

Anti-vibes are purely psychological.

Neely
06-16-2008, 11:35 PM
Science says that for something to absorb vibrations (energy), it must have mass. Something that weighs nothing can't absorb anything.

Anti-vibes are purely psychological.
Exactly right, the only thing they are doing is changing the high frequency string vibrations which results in a noise dampening, but I'm also pretty convinced they don't reduce the amont of vibrations which reach your arm.

jazar
06-17-2008, 06:54 AM
Exactly right, the only thing they are doing is changing the high frequency string vibrations which results in a noise dampening, but I'm also pretty convinced they don't reduce the amont of vibrations which reach your arm.

they have been scienifically proven to have very little benefit

gaz
06-18-2008, 12:44 AM
i have seen scientific evidence that they can decrease vibrations in the grip of the racket by upto 75%

jazar
06-18-2008, 08:45 PM
i have seen scientific evidence that they can decrease vibrations in the grip of the racket by upto 75%

i'd like to see that, cos it not only contradicts all the reseach i have seen but also sounds like complete bollocks

gaz
06-18-2008, 08:54 PM
ok string a racket with poly at a high tension and then hit with it with no vibration dampener, then put a small logo one i.e. babolat 'o' wilson 'w' etc and then use a long worm and you will def see a difference.

the research i saw was from a scientific company about 5 years ago but cant remember it

they were also talking about string tensions and that was interesteing cos they were saying a high tension gives you more control and the lower the tension doesnt give you more powerful jus a higher projection for the ball off the racket if that makes sense

jazar
06-18-2008, 08:59 PM
ok string a racket with poly at a high tension and then hit with it with no vibration dampener, then put a small logo one i.e. babolat 'o' wilson 'w' etc and then use a long worm and you will def see a difference.

i'm not saying there is no difference, i'm saying that there is no significant difference.

of course you will feel some difference with poly, its a stiff string that transmits more vibrations. with multifilament strings there will be very little difference.

they were also talking about string tensions and that was interesteing cos they were saying a high tension gives you more control and the lower the tension doesnt give you more powerful jus a higher projection for the ball off the racket if that makes sense

that is correct

GlennMirnyi
06-19-2008, 01:22 AM
i have seen scientific evidence that they can decrease vibrations in the grip of the racket by upto 75%

Prove it.

I can prove with very simple physics knowledge that this is bullshit.

gaz
06-19-2008, 10:48 PM
ok it is not my research

but take it to an extreme if you use poly at a high tension it creates more vibrations than a soft multifilament and if you use a multi there is a good cchance you will not need a vibration dampener

all i said was try it

it is no different to the systems the racket manufacturers work and they would not do it unless they could prove it works it would be illegal and with brnads like babolat and wilson whi quote figures on tehir products i would listen

jazar you work in wigmore so when some asks you i get a lot of vibrations - your response is........

glenn please enighten me in your physics

GlennMirnyi
06-20-2008, 03:54 AM
Simple:

A medium tennis ball weighs 56 grams (from ITF's website). A racket weighs like 330 grams. I doubt a anti-vibe weighs more than 5 grams.

So here it goes.

Let's take a 200 kph serve, for instance. It's an extreme of it all, but it should work. It will reach the opponent's racket at about 100 kph speed, maybe less.

The ball will reach the racket with a kinetic energy of 21.61J.

Considering an elastic collision and everything. (I'll spare you my calculations here, but it involves conservation of kinetic energy and momentum).

You'll end up with two speeds. The speed of the ball and the speed the racket would have if you weren't holding it. Now I used that speed to calculate the energy you'd have to put into it to keep the racket still. Mind you this is very simple but it will show you clearly.

Without the anti-vibe, E = 10.72 Joules
With the anti-vibe, E = 10.61 Joules

That means that the anti-vibe only absorbed 0.11 Joules of energy. 1.026% of the initial energy.

If you want my calculations I can show you.

Two things:
1- I'm using a very simple model, I know.
2- The vibrations are caused by the impact. They're a manifestation of the dissipation of energy throughout the racket's body. That's something I presume you understand mate. Simple physics.

I hope this is very clear. :)

gaz
06-20-2008, 08:15 AM
but you have assumed you are not holdong it - but you are holding i am sure that would make a difference

and i am not sure what you have measured what you need to measure is the amount of vibrations with and without a vibration dampener

jazar
06-20-2008, 11:46 AM
jazar you work in wigmore so when some asks you i get a lot of vibrations - your response is........

JOURNAL OF SPORTS SCIENCES
Volume 22, Issue 11-12, Pages 1041-1052, Published: 2004

By F.X. Li, D. Fewtrell and M Jenkins

In this study, we examined the effect of string vibration damping devices on reducing racket frame vibration transfer to the forearm. Twenty participants volunteered to hold a tennis racket stationary in a forehand and backhand stroking position while tennis balls were fired at 20 m (.) s(-1) towards two impact locations, the node of vibration and the dead spot. A three-way analysis of variance with repeated measures on damping condition, impact location and stroke condition was performed on the data. The resonant frequency of the hand-held racket was found to be similar to 120 Hz. No significant differences in amplitude of vibration at the resonant frequency were found for the wrist or the elbow when damped and non-damped impacts were compared. Impacts at the dead spot produced greater amplitudes of vibration (P < 0.01) but no interaction between impact location and string dampers was evident. The string dampers had no effect on the grip force used or the muscle electrical activity in the forearm after impact. In conclusion, we found that string dampers do not reduce the amount of racket frame vibration received at the forearm. We suggest that string dampers remain a popular accessory among tennis players because of their acoustic effects and psychological support rather than any mechanical advantage.

JOURNAL OF SPORTS SCIENCES
Volume 17, Issue 5, Pages 379-385, Published: MAY 1999

By C.L. Stroede, L. Noble and H.S. Walker

In this study, we evaluated the effect of the use of tennis racket string vibration dampers on racket handle vibrations, and perceptions of hand and arm discomfort experienced by tennis players owing to stationary racket impacts. Twenty tennis players (10 males, 10 females) aged 18-29 years volunteered for the study. Two different racket models were impacted at the geometric centre of the racket face and 100 mm distal to the centre both with and without string vibration dampers in place. The participants could neither see nor hear the impacts, and they indicated their discomfort immediately after each impact using a visual analogue scale. An analysis of variance (2 x 2 x 2 factorial) was performed on the scaled discomfort ratings with the factors damping condition, racket type and impact location. No significant differences in discomfort ratings between damped and undamped impacts or between the two racket types were found. Also, central impacts were found to be more comfortable than impacts 100 mm distal to the centre (P < 0.05). There were no significant interaction effects. Vibration traces from an accelerometer mounted on the racket handle revealed that string vibration dampers quickly absorbed high-frequency string vibration without attenuating the lower-frequency frame vibration. In conclusion, we found no evidence to support the contention that string vibration dampers reduce hand and arm impact discomfort.

these two studies prove what glenn and i have been saying throughout this thread. anyone who wishes to disagree with this scientific evidence is more than welcome to.

so gaz, what i tell customers is that vibration dampeners are not effective. if they experience excessive vibrations i recommend they change the string or racket they use.

GlennMirnyi
06-20-2008, 05:14 PM
I assumed the amount of energy you'd have to input to hold it. Can you read mate? The "not holding" part is just for the physical model matter.

I guess Newton himself could post here and you still wouldn't admit it.

adee-gee
06-21-2008, 12:36 AM
I use them, not because I think they're overly helpful but I find without them, the strings make an annoying pinging sound when I hit the ball. It's reduced with a dampener.

goldenboy_oscar
06-21-2008, 05:01 PM
ok string a racket with poly at a high tension and then hit with it with no vibration dampener, then put a small logo one i.e. babolat 'o' wilson 'w' etc and then use a long worm and you will def see a difference.

the research i saw was from a scientific company about 5 years ago but cant remember it

they were also talking about string tensions and that was interesteing cos they were saying a high tension gives you more control and the lower the tension doesnt give you more powerful jus a higher projection for the ball off the racket if that makes sense I now when i use a racket that as a tension of 55 the ball leaves the racket much faster then when i use a racket with 62 tension,i must hit the ball harder with my racket at 62 tension then with one of 55.

P.S do pro's all play with anti-vibrator?

GlennMirnyi
06-21-2008, 07:10 PM
Only joke pros use anti-vibes.

gaz
06-23-2008, 08:47 AM
most

nadal does, agassi always did (won all 4 grand slams - joke pro?) (rubber band smae thing) sampras did (joke pro?7 wimbledons?)
djokovic and roddick both do 2

ghostkid12
04-26-2009, 10:17 PM
i have one the racquet goes kapoinfzgfhadhgdah if i dont have one so its mainly for noise to me

Bernard Black
04-30-2009, 11:20 AM
God no!

I used to when I was a junior, thought they were an absolute necessity but now I just think they take away all the feel on the shot.

StanisKing
05-01-2009, 10:05 AM
I don't relly think that it helps in reducing vibration.
I got used to playing with that.
I think that the sound of playing( hitting the ball) without it distracts me.

Ilovetheblues_86
05-01-2009, 11:59 PM
I play without, very low vibration on wilson n codes.

bonzile
05-20-2009, 05:18 AM
Science says that for something to absorb vibrations (energy), it must have mass. Something that weighs nothing can't absorb anything.

Anti-vibes are purely psychological.

not true it is a feel thing. All the dampener really does is takes the bad sound out of the strings and makes it a bit softer.