Federer ignorant about Althea Gibson [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Federer ignorant about Althea Gibson

FedFan_2007
08-28-2007, 12:44 AM
Send him to the re-education camp immediately. This will not do. :devil:

Seriously, I'm tired of this leftist, PC crap. Why do they(stupid journos) have to pester every single player with this nonsense about an obscure player?

Fee
08-28-2007, 12:53 AM
Obscure player? Seriously, are you 12?

This isn't 'leftist PC crap', it's a part of tennis history, regardless of Gibson's skin color.

Oh wait, you want to win the ACC title this year. Nevermind.

Tennis Fool
08-28-2007, 12:55 AM
Send him to the re-education camp immediately. This will not do. :devil:

Seriously, I'm tired of this leftist, PC crap. Why do they(stupid journos) have to pester every single player with this nonsense about an obscure player?

What the hell are you talking about :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

MatchFederer
08-28-2007, 12:55 AM
FedFan_2007 would have no chance of winning the ACC, he is too sound.

Marek.
08-28-2007, 12:57 AM
Dear God.......

cmurray
08-28-2007, 12:58 AM
FedFan_2007 would have no chance of winning the ACC, he is too sound.

:shrug: I'll vote for him.

bluefork
08-28-2007, 01:01 AM
She's not an obsure player, but she won a handful of Grand Slams half a century ago. I wouldn't expect Federer to know anything about her. :shrug: I don't see what the point is of these journalists asking Fed about her.

barbadosan
08-28-2007, 01:01 AM
Total ignoramus!

federated
08-28-2007, 01:03 AM
Send him to the re-education camp immediately. This will not do. :devil:

Seriously, I'm tired of this leftist, PC crap. Why do they(stupid journos) have to pester every single player with this nonsense about an obscure player?

Seriously, I'm tired of this rightwing, provincial crap. Why do they (narrow-minded ignoramuses) have to get their panties in a bunch over historical milestones?

MatchFederer
08-28-2007, 01:04 AM
:shrug: I'll vote for him.

In the early rounds maybe... but he would be a huge longshot for the victory in the ACC. It would be like Donald Young beating Gasquet in the 2nd round of the US Open or something.

scoobs
08-28-2007, 01:05 AM
I am slightly surprised that a student of the history of the game has never heard of her, or hadn't picked something up purely from the schedule on Ashe tonight, but it's no big deal really.

Neely
08-28-2007, 01:07 AM
Could you provide something (a link, a little description or intro what happened,...) about what you are discussing because I don't understand anything (like about what this thread should be about) at all? :confused: :sobbing:

Must be some insiders thing :)

Marek.
08-28-2007, 01:09 AM
Two threads already.

Wow.

scoobs
08-28-2007, 01:10 AM
I'm guessing it was this:

Interview after his match

Q. What do you know about Althea Gibson?
ROGER FEDERER: I don't know. You're putting me on the spot. I don't know what you're talking about.
Q. She's being honored tonight.
ROGER FEDERER: Nothing, to be honest. It's before my time. Isn't much I can really say about it. I don't know, I'm sorry.

star
08-28-2007, 01:10 AM
Fed is an "international man."

This is too obscure and provincial for him. :) :) :)

Clara Bow
08-28-2007, 01:11 AM
I am a bit surprised since Feds is known for being well versed in tennis history. He sounds like he doesn't even know who she was- which is very odd.

She won 2 Wimbles, 2 USOs, 1 French and was runner up at the Aussie and USA another time. So it is not like she was some crap obscure player.

And I don't know why it is so wrong to want to celebrate historical landmark moments or to commemorate players? How is that leftist-PC crap? If the Aussie Open wanted to honor Evonne Goolagong for example- what would be wrong with that?

Neely
08-28-2007, 01:11 AM
All right, thanks to TennisFool and Scoobs I understand the context now!

scoobs
08-28-2007, 01:14 AM
I am a bit surprised since Feds is known for being well versed in tennis history. He sounds like he doesn't even know who she was- which is very odd.

She won 2 Wimbles, 2 USOs, 1 French and was runner up at the Aussie and USA another time. So it is not like she was some crap obscure player.
I agree - but then again I think he's much more versed in the history of the mens game than the womens - I don't think he's paid much attention, for example, to overhauling Graf recently to become longest consecutive weeks at #1 of either gender.

Either way, it's really not something that deserves a great big hoo-hah.

l_mac
08-28-2007, 01:14 AM
That is strange. Even I know who Althea Gibson was, and I'm just a Rafa fangirl. Maybe he meant he didn't know anything about the ceremony? Or maybe he has no interest in women's tennis. Misogynist! (JOKING)

Jade Fox
08-28-2007, 01:15 AM
I am a bit surprised since Feds is known for being well versed in tennis history. He sounds like he doesn't even know who she was- which is very odd.

She won 2 Wimbles, 2 USOs, 1 French and was runner up at the Aussie and USA another time. So it is not like she was some crap obscure player.


Yeah I'm kinda surprised too, considering his knowledge of other players that were before his time.:confused:

star
08-28-2007, 01:15 AM
I am a bit surprised since Feds is known for being well versed in tennis history. He sounds like he doesn't even know who she was- which is very odd.

She won 2 Wimbles, 2 USOs, 1 French and was runner up at the Aussie and USA another time. So it is not like she was some crap obscure player.

Maybe he is only well versed in men's tennis history, or only versed on records he needs to beat. ;)

Burrow
08-28-2007, 01:16 AM
Who the hell is althea gibson?

star
08-28-2007, 01:16 AM
I agree - but then again I think he's much more versed in the history of the mens game than the womens - I don't think he's paid much attention, for example, to overhauling Graf recently to become longest consecutive weeks at #1 of either gender.

Either way, it's really not something that deserves a great big hoo-hah.

Yeah. It's not like Nadal or Djokovic not knowing anything about Gibson. :) :)

Blondie1985
08-28-2007, 01:17 AM
From his after-match interview:

Q. What do you know about Althea Gibson?
ROGER FEDERER: I don't know. You're putting me on the spot. I don't know what you're talking about.

Q. She's being honored tonight.
ROGER FEDERER: Nothing, to be honest. It's before my time. Isn't much I can really say about it. I don't know, I'm sorry.



Feds: :ras:
Bad excuse about it being before his time. Borg was before his time :rolleyes: If you don't know the history, and don't open a newspaper, at least pay attention to what's going on at the tennis center. :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

At least he knew she was before his time. ;)

Jade Fox
08-28-2007, 01:18 AM
I agree - but then again I think he's much more versed in the history of the mens game than the womens - I don't think he's paid much attention, for example, to overhauling Graf recently to become longest consecutive weeks at #1 of either gender.

Either way, it's really not something that deserves a great big hoo-hah.

Yes it does. Boo Roger! You're outta my Perv book now!:ras: :p

Clara Bow
08-28-2007, 01:23 AM
Maybe he is only well versed in men's tennis history...

There may be something in that. I am pretty sure he knows a lot more about Borg and Sampras's records at Wimbledon than say- Navratilova.

Still surprised though- I mean- there are having an event tonight.

scoobs
08-28-2007, 01:23 AM
There may be something in that. I am pretty sure he knows a lot more about Borg and Sampras's records at Wimbledon than say- Navratilova.

Still surprised though- I mean- there are having an event tonight.
Yes I admit I'm surprised he's never heard of the chick.

JBdV
08-28-2007, 01:25 AM
FedFan_2007 would have no chance of winning the ACC, he is too sound.

Too desperate you mean.

Veronique
08-28-2007, 01:26 AM
A bit surprised. I bet Tiger knows plenty about Althea Gibson. Maybe he'll teach him. LOL

G4.
08-28-2007, 01:26 AM
looks like he doesn't care about women tennis , can't blame him

Jade Fox
08-28-2007, 01:26 AM
There may be something in that. I am pretty sure he knows a lot more about Borg and Sampras's records at Wimbledon than say- Navratilova.

Still surprised though- I mean- there are having an event tonight.

Maybe he does know more about the men's history than women. Could be the case.

It's still surprising coming from someone who is so about history and tradition. I mean, he dressed up like Lacoste at Wimbledon for Christ's sake!

Byrd
08-28-2007, 01:27 AM
Fedfan_2007 even though a clown shouldn't be abused for such a thing as this, i'm sure the majority of fans going tonight didn't know who she is before tonight, and some probably still don't, let alone real fans (mtfers) and players.

scoobs
08-28-2007, 01:28 AM
Maybe he does know more about the men's history than women. Could be the case.

It's still surprising coming from someone who is so about history and tradition. I mean, he dressed up like Lacoste at Wimbledon for Christ's sake!
Be thankful he didn't dress like Lenglen ;)

Jade Fox
08-28-2007, 01:30 AM
Be thankful he didn't dress like Lenglen ;)

I bet he wanted to though.;) :devil:

Of course, he'll need to shave those legs first.:p

scoobs
08-28-2007, 01:31 AM
I bet he wanted to though.;) :devil:

Of course, he'll need to shave those legs first.:p
Why? Lenglen never did :devil:

Jade Fox
08-28-2007, 01:33 AM
Why? Lenglen never did :devil:

Really? Fine then, as long as he wears the blue underwear, I'll be okay with the hairy legs.;)

Clara Bow
08-28-2007, 01:35 AM
I wonder if next year they will have a 55th anniversary of Maureen Connolly winning the grand slam and they can have Roger as the emcee of the event since his appreciation of women's tennis history appears to be great and vast. :lol:

i'm sure the majority of fans going tonight didn't know who she is before tonight, and some probably still don't, let alone real fans (mtfers) and players.

I actually think maybe more tennis fans in the US have heard of her than you may give them credit for. ;) Not many of the young ones- but I have known who she was for ages- she was even listed in my high school history book in terms of the civil rights era- and I am 31 and no great tennis history guru.

And- as has been stated- Feds is known as being appreciative of tennis history. I think that is why many folks are surprised. :)

Kuhne
08-28-2007, 01:37 AM
so because she is black everyone must know about her? I tought it was all about equality..

scoobs
08-28-2007, 01:39 AM
so because she is black everyone must know about her? I tought it was all about equality..
It's about realising that equality was something people like her helped to usher in...

Jeez.

cmurray
08-28-2007, 01:40 AM
so because she is black everyone must know about her? I tought it was all about equality..

Well, I'd say its more that she was a black woman playing tennis at a time when it WASN'T all about equality. There is something special about that, and I think its altogether fitting to give a tribute to the woman.

MatchFederer
08-28-2007, 01:42 AM
So nobody thinks Federer is a misogynist then?


.... :lol:

Jade Fox
08-28-2007, 01:42 AM
so because she is black everyone must know about her? I tought it was all about equality..

Considering that she's the first black woman to make a huge impact in tennis, yeah she's historically significant. In some ways she's more of a breakthrough player than Roger, even though she won fewer Slams. Breaking down color barriers when blacks still had to sit at the back of the bus is very significant.

Kuhne
08-28-2007, 01:42 AM
I didn't say she didn't desserve a tribute, hell give her half of the united states I don't care, I am just saying not everyone has to know about her

Fee
08-28-2007, 01:43 AM
so because she is black everyone must know about her? I tought it was all about equality..

No, not because she's Black, but because of the doors she opened for those who followed behind her. And it is about equality. It's about the people who fought (and still fight) to attain that equality, because I'm sure there are still places on this planet where someone is told 'you can't (fill in the blank) because you're a (fill in the blank).

I really don't understand why some people on this board (and it just seems to be the white males, I'm sure) have SUCH a problem with the topic of Althea Gibson. Did you have the same problem when the entire tennis center was named after Billie Jean King? What is the root of all of this?

scoobs
08-28-2007, 01:44 AM
I didn't say she didn't desserve a tribute, hell give her half of the united states I don't care, I am just saying not everyone has to know about her
Rest easy then - not everyone does :yeah:

Clara Bow
08-28-2007, 01:44 AM
so because she is black everyone must know about her? I tought it was all about equality..

No one is saying that everyone needs to know about her. As has been stated- folks are just surpised that Federer does not- since he is normally well versed in tennis history.

It's about realising that equality was something people like her helped to usher in...

Jeez.

Exactly. What is wrong with wanting to rememember and recoginze a player whose wins were singificant both on and off of the court? I do not understand this anger at remembering historically significant events or players.

bluefork
08-28-2007, 01:51 AM
I really don't understand why some people on this board (and it just seems to be the white males, I'm sure) have SUCH a problem with the topic of Althea Gibson. Did you have the same problem when the entire tennis center was named after Billie Jean King? What is the root of all of this?

I didn't bother watching Althea Gibson's ceremony tonight, but I did have a problem with BJK's ceremony last year. Why? Because it had nothing to do with her tennis achievements. It was all about the social change she spurred. I don't have a problem with honoring her for the doors she opened, but if that's all we're going to do, it ought to be in a different venue. If they're going to honor someone by naming a tennis stadium/complex after her, it ought to be for her tennis.

And I'm not a white male, by the way. :)

rocketassist
08-28-2007, 01:52 AM
She seemed like a good player in her day but she is no excuse not to put an ATP match on Ashe.

El Legenda
08-28-2007, 01:52 AM
would Roddick know something about a important swiss women who played tennis in the 50's? i think not.

Howard
08-28-2007, 01:53 AM
Color me surprised but not particularly disappointed. If he doesn’t know about her, he doesn’t know. It just tells me that he’s not as much of a tennis historian as he’s made out to be, not that he's racially insensitive or misogynistic.

El Legenda
08-28-2007, 01:54 AM
I really don't understand why some people on this board (and it just seems to be the white males, I'm sure) have SUCH a problem with the topic of Althea Gibson.

maybe because this is MENS TENNIS FORUM, not WTA WORLD :D
she hasnt done anything for mens tennis :)

amc
08-28-2007, 01:55 AM
God. How many people here knew Althea Gibson before tonigh? I sure didn't even know she played tennis and that she was black.

And isn't this a USTA ceremony? Why the rest of the World should know about the importance of her in US tennis?

scoobs
08-28-2007, 01:55 AM
Of course she did - Arthur Ashe, I believe, cited her as an inspiration.

Byrd
08-28-2007, 01:57 AM
The whole thing looks like a USTA cash-in, just a way to justify playing two famous black athletes back-to-back as it corresponds with another athletes anniversary who happens to be black, whilst rushing the afternoon schedules or not adding anymore matches to the schedule, if this was truly something to celebrate, other matches wouldn't take away from this situation.

scoobs
08-28-2007, 01:59 AM
God. How many people here knew Althea Gibson before tonigh? I sure didn't even know she played tennis and that she was black.

And isn't this a USTA ceremony? Why the rest of the World should know about the importance of her in US tennis?
The USTA organises the US Open and Althea won the US Open 50 years ago hence the ceremony at this event.

And it doesn't hurt for the rest of the world to be a little less ignorant of tennis history or social consequences. You've apparently learned something, in spite of yourself.

Not that the ceremony was shown here in the UK - instead we got Ivanovic beating down some hapless Japanese woman.

Jade Fox
08-28-2007, 02:03 AM
would Roddick know something about a important swiss women who played tennis in the 50's? i think not.

What does Andy Roddick have to do with this?

As far as I know there were no significant Swiss women tennis players in the 50's. Martina Hingis seems to be the most successful one, and I know that Andy knows who she is.

maybe because this is MENS TENNIS FORUM, not WTA WORLD :D
she hasnt done anything for mens tennis :)

Arthur Ashe was inspired by her.

The whole thing looks like a USTA cash-in, just a way to justify playing two famous black athletes back-to-back as it corresponds with another athletes anniversary who happens to be black, whilst rushing the afternoon schedules or not adding anymore matches to the schedule, if this was truly something to celebrate, other matches wouldn't take away from this situation.

Venus and Serena would've gotten back to back night matches even if it wasn't the 50th anniversary of Gibson's US Open victory, if it was possible.

Andi-M
08-28-2007, 02:05 AM
Well Federer probably only interested in mens history as its more relevant to him....

But its suprising considering he seems to think he has a great knowledge of tennis history.

CyBorg
08-28-2007, 02:06 AM
Send him to the re-education camp immediately. This will not do. :devil:

Seriously, I'm tired of this leftist, PC crap. Why do they(stupid journos) have to pester every single player with this nonsense about an obscure player?

Turn off Fox News, John Wayne.

Byrd
08-28-2007, 02:06 AM
Venus and Serena would've gotten back to back night matches even if it wasn't the 50th anniversary of Gibson's US Open victory, if it was possible.

I know the USTA are pretty biased but they know they wouldn't be able to get away with that, this way it looks justified and anyone complaining would look like an idiot.

El Legenda
08-28-2007, 02:07 AM
Arthur Ashe was inspired by her.
.

and? im sure other male players have been inspired by women, do you see threads about them on MTF?

nobama
08-28-2007, 02:08 AM
But its suprising considering he seems to think he has a great knowledge of tennis history.When did HE ever say that? :confused:

CyBorg
08-28-2007, 02:09 AM
Considering that she's the first black woman to make a huge impact in tennis, yeah she's historically significant.

Why do we have to place black people on a pedestal? Martin Luther King fought for equal rights. Equal rights.

Not Affirmative Action. Get it?

Byrd
08-28-2007, 02:13 AM
Why do we have to place black people on a pedestal? Martin Luther King fought for equal rights. Equal rights.

Not Affirmative Action. Get it?

Don't worry, double standards seem to be ever present in life nowadays unfortuantely....

LoveFifteen
08-28-2007, 02:14 AM
Come on, people, Althea did something for MEN's tennis, too. She was a person of color who triumphed in a sport that had been excluding people of color. She broke the color barrier. She inspired black male tennis players, too. Show some respect for a woman who rose above white prejudice and triumphed.

scoobs
08-28-2007, 02:15 AM
Why do we have to place black people on a pedestal? Martin Luther King fought for equal rights. Equal rights.

Not Affirmative Action. Get it?
Nobody is placing black people on a pedestal. Nobody is suggesting or implying special or preferencial treatment or affirmative action in favour of black athletes or anything like that.

There is nothing wrong with acknowledging that there wasn't always the equal ability of black and white athletes, and black and white people in general to compete on an equal footing, and Althea Gibson was one of many people, heroes and ordinary people, who played a part in bringing about a change in attitudes.

This is about celebrating equality, celebrating what Dr Martin Luther King fought for, celebrating that the change was made, not about putting anyone on a pedestal or favouring preferential treatment.

I don't know what's so difficult to understand about this :shrug:

CyBorg
08-28-2007, 02:16 AM
Don't worry, double standards seem to be ever present in life nowadays unfortuantely....

This just in: Donald Young says that Athea Gibson is 'awesome'. Boy, he sure must know his black history. Up next: Donald Young writes a 600 word article about Athea Gibson for the New York Times, entitled "The Awesome Athea Gibson", in which he utilizes the word awesome a record-setting 360 times (that's right, the first black person to accomplish the feat).

And after that: Donald Young receives Pulitzer for his 'good effort' in being a black man writing for a predominantly white paper.

Andi-M
08-28-2007, 02:17 AM
When did HE ever say that? :confused:

3/4/2005 at approx 4pm..:p

Federer has said on numerous occasions he is a student of the game.

CyBorg
08-28-2007, 02:18 AM
There is nothing wrong with acknowledging that there wasn't always the equal ability of black and white athletes, and black and white people in general to compete on an equal footing, and Althea Gibson was one of many people, heroes and ordinary people, who played a part in bringing about a change in attitudes.

Why, of course. She proved to the white man that black people can compete in athletics too. Oh joyous joy. My bleeding heart bleeds for her.

Veronique
08-28-2007, 02:18 AM
I'm astounded by the stupidity and ignorance in this place. Roger is already a legend at the tender age of 26. I've watched enough tennis for 18 yrs now to know that he's going to be very disappointed with himself that he didn't know anything about Althea Gibson. I cannot think of any legend before him who doesn't know about this remarkable woman. This is not about being a Fedtard or a Fedbasher. Most tennis fans and students of the game know who this legendary woman is. They are shocked the great Roger Federer doesn't. And again, if I know anything about Roger for having watched him since he came on tour, he'll be disappointed he didn't know much about Althea before tonight. That doesn't make him a bad person. I'm sure he's going to learn a lot about this spectacular tennis player from here on.

LoveFifteen
08-28-2007, 02:18 AM
Why do we have to place black people on a pedestal? Martin Luther King fought for equal rights. Equal rights.

Not Affirmative Action. Get it?

No one is placing black people on a pedastal. Do you not realize that tennis events banned black people? Can you imagine what it is like to be the first black person allowed to play at a tournament? Jesus! :rolleyes:

Althea was an amazing woman, and she deserves to be honored.

Jade Fox
08-28-2007, 02:18 AM
Why do we have to place black people on a pedestal? Martin Luther King fought for equal rights. Equal rights.

Not Affirmative Action. Get it?

And your point? I'm very well aware of what Dr. King did. It doesn't take away from Althea's achievements and breakthroughs. There have been plenty of black athletes in sports since, but the Gibsons were the ones who gave them the chance to succeed. She, along with Ashe, helped paved the way.

Why shouldn't we honor THAT?

LoveFifteen
08-28-2007, 02:20 AM
Why, of course. She proved to the white man that black people can compete in athletics too. Oh joyous joy. My bleeding heart bleeds for her.

What a fucking idiot you are! :mad:

She wasn't even allowed to play until she was 23 because the tennis establishment considered her an unworthy subhuman.

scoobs
08-28-2007, 02:22 AM
People seem to think that just because athletes can compete from a position of equality nowadays, means we should forget what it took for some people to get us to this point, and that any acknowlegement of it is somehow threatening, or worse, encouraging inequality in favour of black people.

I find that very disappointing, as well as extremely strange, but more revealing of those peoples' attitudes than anything else.

CyBorg
08-28-2007, 02:24 AM
No one is placing black people on a pedastal. Do you not realize that tennis events banned black people? Can you imagine what it is like to be the first black person allowed to play at a tournament? Jesus! :rolleyes:

Althea was an amazing woman, and she deserves to be honored.

Tennis events banned black people? Wow, you've learned me good sonny. I reckon I thought the 50s were like Mr Roger's neighbourhood. Racial minorities hand in hand with the white boys and girls all singing along in harmony.

And now we can celebrate the end of racial discrimination by honouring Athea Gibson with an enthusiastic orgy towards which we will pour a couple of hundred thou that we would rather not give to a black school.

Coo-coo Cachoo.

Jade Fox
08-28-2007, 02:25 AM
People seem to think that just because athletes can compete from a position of equality nowadays, means we should forget what it took for some people to get us to this point, and that any acknowlegement of it is somehow threatening, or worse, encouraging inequality in favour of blacks

I find that very disappointing, as well as extremely strange, but more revealing of those peoples' attitudes than anything else.

Indeed it is disappointing some of the attitudes around here. It reminds me why I don't come on GM anymore.:rolleyes:

Andi-M
08-28-2007, 02:25 AM
People seem to think that just because athletes can compete from a position of equality nowadays, means we should forget what it took for some people to get us to this point, and that any acknowlegement of it is somehow threatening, or worse, encouraging inequality in favour of black people.

I find that very disappointing, as well as extremely strange, but more revealing of those peoples' attitudes than anything else.

:yeah: Agreed

CyBorg
08-28-2007, 02:26 AM
What a fucking idiot you are! :mad:

She wasn't even allowed to play until she was 23 because the tennis establishment considered her an unworthy subhuman.

Clearly what Athea needs now is a fresh serving of white guilt. Coming right up!

We've solved the racism problem! Yes.

http://thinkprogress.org/wp-images/upload/thumb-Accomplished.jpg

CyBorg
08-28-2007, 02:29 AM
And your point? I'm very well aware of what Dr. King did. It doesn't take away from Althea's achievements and breakthroughs. There have been plenty of black athletes in sports since, but the Gibsons were the ones who gave them the chance to succeed. She, along with Ashe, helped paved the way.

Why shouldn't we honor THAT?

We can honour this by treating her like a human being. Her importance in tennis history should be judged based on her athletic achievements.

And if we've got some money why can't we sponsor some inner-city kids while we're at it? No, no. We need cake. And white guilt.

White guilt + consumerism + bloated egos = http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74nylouvtYc

scoobs
08-28-2007, 02:30 AM
Indeed it is disappointing some of the attitudes around here. It reminds me why I don't come on GM anymore.:rolleyes:
Yes I think I'm done here.

There's also this attitude that honouring her is somehow diverting resources from worthier causes - causes that would never have benefited from the money that has been spent anyway. I find the argument that nothing commemorative should ever be done because the money would be better spent elsewhere to be utterly absurd - reductionist and dreary and unimaginative. I'd rather enough money was diverted to these other needy resources but even if they aren't, there's got to be room for the occasional commemorative event - there have to be wider horizons from time to time - something that reminds us where we came from and how we got here.

And I see nothing about assuaging white guilt - I see it as coming to terms with a period of history where injustices were allowed to prevail, but recognising that lessons have been learned, and continue to be learned, from that period.

Tennis Fool
08-28-2007, 02:33 AM
Yes I think I'm done here.



:eek: What? I thought you liked troll threads :shrug: ;)

scoobs
08-28-2007, 02:34 AM
:eek: What? I thought you liked troll threads :shrug: ;)
Serena is on now - I'd rather watch that than continue with this pointless discussion.

bluefork
08-28-2007, 02:34 AM
Clearly what Athea needs now is a fresh serving of white guilt. Coming right up!

We've solved the racism problem! Yes.

http://thinkprogress.org/wp-images/upload/thumb-Accomplished.jpg

It's not just Bush, and I don't understand why you keep bringing him up. The American government has been putting African American icons on a pedestal for years, both parties.

Johnny Groove
08-28-2007, 02:35 AM
Cyborg :retard:

CyBorg
08-28-2007, 02:38 AM
It's not just Bush, and I don't understand why you keep bringing him up. The American government has been putting African American icons on a pedestal for years, both parties.

It would be much too time consuming to post all the pictures of the parties involved. I'd have to start somewhere around the early-to-mid 70s and go from there. That's 100,000 pictures at least. Bush is the current major suck up to the ideal of black rights, whenever he's not ignoring their plight all across the country.

So don't forget what Athea Gibson needs are images of totalizing normality. Symbols, appearances, quick quotes, sound bytes and all of that good stuff that the corporations will put together and feed to you with your can of Coke. Yes, it must be done. It will feed the black babies and turn racists into non-racists. And, most importantly, Andrea needs the head of a major corporation to come up to her, give her a medal and tell her right to her eyes that he cares about what she has done for this and that. She needs some white suit from strictly commercial to make it all better.

Hallelujah. Holy shit. Let's eat.

MusicMyst
08-28-2007, 03:17 AM
I'm not that surprised that Federer doesn't know who Gibson is, but I am surprised that somebody in his entourage didn't think ahead and anticipate his being asked about her, given that she was the Opening Night honoree, so that he could have given a better answer about her role in tennis history. But he was right, he was being put on the spot deliberately by a sportswriter. It was a "gotcha" moment.

Lillith
08-28-2007, 03:27 AM
Some of you are such ignorant asses. Better to keep your mouth shut and have those around you assume your stupidity than open your mouth and confirm it.


For those who are ignorant of US history, Althea Gibson played tennis in a time when it was still considered the province of very, very white wealthy country club elites. In the 1950s when Ms. Gibson played the game, African Americans were not allowed to vote in many parts of this country and the US civil rights movement was just gaining momentum. Brown v. Board of Education, the landmark US Supreme Court case in which it was essentially decreed that segregated schools were illegal, was only decided in 1954. Prior to the Brown decision, in many areas of the country African Americans were forced into separate and unequal schools which usually lacked in funding and equipment, were often in run down, delapidated buildings with outdated, incorrect textbooks.

In the US South, African Americans were still forced to sit in the rear of the bus (or stand/exit if space was needed for whites), were refused service at restaurants, and were forced to use the rear/service entrance to buildings. Althea Gibson played tennis in a time when African Americans were even refused medical treatment in certain Southern hospitals merely because of the color of their skin.

Gibson overcame much in her life to become a tennis champion, personal and family hardships as well as the racial constraints of US society at that time. Most of you thankfully have no idea the challenges faced by Gibson, and hopefully thanks to people like her, you never will. But the utter dismissiveness of many of the posts on this thread is sickening.



And on a side note, I find it rather ironic to see so many European posters asserting that they should know nothing about such an iconic US player. Funny that such latitude is not given to Americans. :)

G4.
08-28-2007, 03:32 AM
And on a side note, I find it rather ironic to see so many European posters asserting that they should know nothing about such an iconic US player. Funny that such latitude is not given to Americans. :)

where's the irony ?

nobama
08-28-2007, 04:15 AM
I'm not that surprised that Federer doesn't know who Gibson is, but I am surprised that somebody in his entourage didn't think ahead and anticipate his being asked about her, given that she was the Opening Night honoree, so that he could have given a better answer about her role in tennis history. But he was right, he was being put on the spot deliberately by a sportswriter. It was a "gotcha" moment.But why should he have expected to be asked about her? Roddick and Blake did interviews today and they weren't asked about her. Neither was Justine Henin.

FedFan_2007
08-28-2007, 04:30 AM
Blah, blah blah, yeah there was horrible racism 50 years ago, why must Americans have their noses rubbed in it every single day into the 2010s....

Winston's Human
08-28-2007, 04:50 AM
Federer was asked about Althea Gibson because US journalist are completely race-obsessed and assume that everyone else thinks about racial issues 24-7.

That said, it does not undermine the significance of Ms. Gibson's accomplishments -- especially removing race as a consideration in whether someone can enter a tennis major tournament. I am surprised at the dismissiveness of many posters.

TankingTheSet
08-28-2007, 04:51 AM
Althea Gibson was an AMERICAN icon, a symbol taught at AMERICAN schools to AMERICAN children. She is someone from America from the 50's who played WOMEN's tennis.

I am reasonably well versed in tennis history but didn't know her or at least didn't remember the name. Roger is European, brought up in Europe and was never taught American values or history, so I think it's understandable he didn't know about an American women's tennis icon from the 50's. Also in general tennis history before the 60's is rarely in the limelight as the game was pretty obscure back then. Maybe Federer should have acquainted himself with the schedule for this US Open, but you can't blame him for concentrating on his preparation for his games.

Seleshfan
08-28-2007, 04:55 AM
Althea Gibson was an AMERICAN icon, a symbol taught at AMERICAN schools to AMERICAN children. She is someone from America from the 50's who played WOMEN's tennis.

I am reasonably well versed in tennis history but didn't know her or at least didn't remember the name. Roger is European, brought up in Europe and was never taught American values or history, so I think it's understandable he didn't know about an American women's tennis icon from the 50's. Also in general tennis history before the 60's is rarely in the limelight as the game was pretty obscure back then. Maybe Federer should have acquainted himself with the schedule for this US Open, but you can't blame him for concentrating on his preparation for his games.

Is Althea Gibson even an American icon?? I, as an American, never heard of her until I began following tennis. I certainly never learned about her in school...

Svetlana.
08-28-2007, 04:59 AM
Federer was asked about Althea Gibson because US journalist are completely race-obsessed and assume that everyone else thinks about racial issues 24-7.
.

Welcome to America! :bigwave: They talk about it here 24-7...

nobama
08-28-2007, 05:00 AM
Is Althea Gibson even an American icon?? I, as an American, never heard of her until I began following tennis. I certainly never learned about her in school...
Me neither.

*bunny*
08-28-2007, 05:07 AM
I am neither American nor European, but I knew about Gibson, not in details but that she was the first black woman to play professional tennis and won multiple slams. It's one of those names you pick up as you listen to tennis commentaries, like Lenglen or Goolagong, isn't it? Or at least that's the impression I have.

Yes, I was a bit surprised Fed didn't know about her.

Tennis Fool
08-28-2007, 05:10 AM
Is Althea Gibson even an American icon?? I, as an American, never heard of her until I began following tennis. I certainly never learned about her in school...

Yes, because if she's black, she can't be all-American :rolleyes:

bluefork
08-28-2007, 05:22 AM
Is Althea Gibson even an American icon?? I, as an American, never heard of her until I began following tennis. I certainly never learned about her in school...

I grew up in America, and the first time I heard of Althea Gibson was when she died in 2003. And that was several years after I started following tennis. Even as a tennis icon, she wasn't that big. As someone else mentioned, there isn't a whole lot of focus on tennis pre-Open Era, and even in her generation, she wasn't the most accomplished player (Mo Connolly was).

So I think it's silly to criticize Fed for not knowing about her. And personally, I think it's kind of refreshing that he didn't give some politically correct spiel when asked about her.

RagingLamb
08-28-2007, 05:23 AM
On the one hand, I understand and agree with the fact that althea gibson was an important figure in the history of this sport, and her fame is well deserved. I think everyone should know about her, and what her accomplishments mean to the sport and to women.

On the other hand, I can sympathize with Roger not knowing about her. She was way before his time, and it's not like being world no 1. is a part time job. It's not like he has time to sit around and google stuff like you and I. So he didn't know. Big deal. He has too little time on his hands and he didn't have a chance to learn about althea.

star
08-28-2007, 05:28 AM
On the one hand, I understand and agree with the fact that althea gibson was an important figure in the history of this sport, and her fame is well deserved. I think everyone should know about her, and what her accomplishments mean to the sport and to women.

On the other hand, I can sympathize with Roger not knowing about her. She was way before his time, and it's not like being world no 1. is a part time job. It's not like he has time to sit around and google stuff like you and I. So he didn't know. Big deal. He has too little time on his hands and he didn't have a chance to learn about althea.

I don't think it's a character defect that Roger didn't know about Gibson, but it does sort of blow the myth that he's incredibly knowlegable about tennis history.

I wonder if "Don Budge" would ring a bell for Federer. :)

star
08-28-2007, 05:30 AM
But why should he have expected to be asked about her? Roddick and Blake did interviews today and they weren't asked about her. Neither was Justine Henin.

Blatant discrimination! How dare they?!

RagingLamb
08-28-2007, 05:32 AM
I don't think it's a character defect that Roger didn't know about Gibson, but it does sort of blow the myth that he's incredibly knowlegable about tennis history.

I wonder if "Don Budge" would ring a bell for Federer. :)

well I bet he's gonna look everyone up now that he was caught with a question like that.

but there is a lot of history in tennis. and he does know a lot, but not all of it. I guess that can be remedied at some point, maybe when he's retired he can learn more about tennis history.

star
08-28-2007, 05:36 AM
well I bet he's gonna look everyone up now that he was caught with a question like that.

but there is a lot of history in tennis. and he does know a lot, but not all of it. I guess that can be remedied at some point, maybe when he's retired he can learn more about tennis history.

Maybe he doesn't care about tennis history. Maybe he just cares to know who he has to beat to be the GOAT. :)

Greenday
08-28-2007, 05:38 AM
Is Althea Gibson even an American icon?? I, as an American, never heard of her until I began following tennis. I certainly never learned about her in school...

Me neither....I never heard abt althea gibson untill yesterday....same with my friends too.....I have been following tennis from Mid-sampras era.....I'm pretty sure most of the fans who went out there today didnt anything abt her until today... i'm pretty sure none of my friends knew abt her....

Allure
08-28-2007, 05:38 AM
Just because he doesn't know one particular thing doesn't mean he doesn't know a lot about tennis history.

Clara Bow
08-28-2007, 05:38 AM
Me neither.

Well- both my husband and I did- and I went to high school in South Carolina and he went to high school in Chicago. I understand not everyone may have heard about her in school- but we both learned about her during the discussions of civil rights, etc. in the 20th century - when you also learned about folks such as Jessie Owens, Jackie Robinson, Marian Anderson (a singer from the 1930s), Paul Robeson who helped break and/or had to deal with racial barriers in the US in the sporting and entertainment arenas. But curriculums and lesson plans can vary.

But I was aware of her before that even- when I was a kid there was a documentary about Little Mo on that was shown on HBO that also went into other important female tennis players of the 1950s and featured Althea.

I don't think most of us here are critisizing Feds per se- we are just surprised that he seems to have no idea who she was when he is often praised as being well versed in tennis history and they were having an event for her tonight.

Well- at least out of all of this- maybe folks are now more aware of Althea Gibson. I hope folks don't sneer away at her place just because of all of this hub bub. She did indeed help open doors in tennis- (she was playing when there was a separate tour for black Americans as they were not allowed to play many tournaments). Success can grant access- and that is what she did- even though her chances at success were hindered at times because of limited access.

Sorry for my spelling. :)

Rogiman
08-28-2007, 05:40 AM
A bit surprised. I bet Tiger knows plenty about Althea Gibson. Maybe he'll teach him. LOLAnd I bet Tiger knows everything about Marc Rosset too, huh...?

Federer is a tennis player, he's in NYC to win the title, he's not reading every article on the web the way we are, and anyway all that 'student of the history of the game' image had been created by morons.

Forehander
08-28-2007, 05:40 AM
will someone tell me wtf is this thread about? and why he or she called Federer ignorant once again for no apparent reason?

Rogiman
08-28-2007, 05:41 AM
Yes, because if she's black, she can't be all-American :rolleyes::bigclap:

Fucking idiot.

star
08-28-2007, 05:43 AM
will someone tell me wtf is this thread about? and why he or she called Federer ignorant once again for no apparent reason?

Read the first page, please.

And no one called Fed ignorant. The thread title simply states the fact that Federer was ignorant about Althea Gibson.

Fee
08-28-2007, 05:54 AM
will someone tell me wtf is this thread about? and why he or she called Federer ignorant once again for no apparent reason?

This thread is about the end of racism in America. According to some of the posts here, it's not a problem anymore. I'm so relieved.

On the other hand, reading some of the posts here has made me very very very sad. I can't even get angry about it, I can only update my ignore list. :sad:

Rogiman
08-28-2007, 05:57 AM
The level of hypocrisy in this thread (especially by the OP) once again reveals how some americans are convinced the whole world revolves about them, when they don't bother travelling outside the States, learning any other language or studying other countries' history, yet they're shocked that people from other nations aren't aware of every marginal detail in their history.

Again, I said that about 'some' americans, not 'all', I know PCness is the most important thing in the world for you.

Clara Bow
08-28-2007, 06:05 AM
that foreigners aren't aware of every marginal detail in their history.

Althea pertains to the sport here that this board is all about. She did help open doors that allowed more players to play this sport that we supposidly all care about here. Maybe you think it is marginal to tennis history- but I disagree because I think widening the scope of who can play- is not.

I don't expect everyone to know about Althea- as I don't expect for everyone to know the significance of Goolagong for Aussie tennis. But I appreciate that some players may have been important for tennis be something that a wider group of people could be interested in and have access to in some countries- and I do not think that makes said players marginal.

I am not going to hang Roger on the ropes for not knowing who Althea Gibson was- although I am a little surprised. But I see no need to dismiss or denigrate what Althea did and the doors she did indeed open for this sport that we all like on this board.

I guess you can just dismiss that as me being "PC"- but I do like to study the history of things and see the paths of where we came to be- including in this sport that I love. I don't begrudge other people for not doing that- but I do not think it is fair to water down what Althea actually did for tennis.

Not everyone knows who she was- fine. I understand that and frankly- there are so many names and figures to know in all aspects. But- at the same time- no need to bash Althea as nothing but as insignificant. A lot of folks don't know about people who made a big impact in their respective fields. Doesn't make the people who had the impact less.

Allure
08-28-2007, 06:06 AM
I don't think it's a big deal that Roger doesn't know who she is. I didn't know who she was until today. For people that did know, good for you. But if you don't know, it's not "OMG shame on you'' either.

Clara Bow
08-28-2007, 06:16 AM
But if you don't know, it's not "OMG shame on you'' either.

I agree- it is not shame on you. She is no Chrissie or BJK that everyone would know from the women's game. And heck- this is a men's tennis board.

My point is just that just because some folks are not aware of here does not mean that she was insignificant.

And I was just surprised that Roger did not know who she was. That is all.

turkjey5
08-28-2007, 06:41 AM
How is it ceremonies like this are supposed to be about equality and that race doesn't matter yet the entire thing was black this black that, it was the most racist spectacle i've seen at a sports event.

Fensler
08-28-2007, 06:50 AM
The level of hypocrisy in this thread (especially by the OP) once again reveals how some americans are convinced the whole world revolves about them, when they don't bother travelling outside the States, learning any other language or studying other countries' history, yet they're shocked that people from other nations aren't aware of every marginal detail in their history.

Again, I said that about 'some' americans, not 'all', I know PCness is the most important thing in the world for you.

I'm an American, and I don't think any less of Federer for not knowing much about Althea Gibson. Maybe it'll be a learning experience for him. Doesn't really matter one way or another, though. And I agree that Federer shouldn't be made to feel guilty about it in an interview like that.

Otherwise, I noticed how you implied that "not bothering to travel outside the States" stands as evidence of the arrogance and insularity of Americans. In actuality, most of us simply can't afford to jet around the world at our leisure. I understand that the same holds true for Europeans, Asians, etc. who travel to the States. But it works both ways.

In that regard, it can take a lifetime just to visit most of the states and Canadian provinces, let alone do that along with visiting the rest of the world. It's not like Europe where you can visit multiple countries in the span of a few days. Thus, a failure to travel abroad has much to do with needing more time to explore North America...as opposed to arrogantly not wanting to visit other continents. Moreover, I often see people chiding Americans for not knowing enough about their own country - about America itself. So I'm always glad when Americans travel within the USA a lot, even if it means they can't travel abroad.

Action Jackson
08-28-2007, 06:59 AM
Wow, my life just got more complete reading this thread and what a surprise Tennis Fool is acting like the baby that didn't get fed his milk.

As for all the racial stuff in here, well it makes for interesting read in a strange sense, but hey I forgot ignorance, stupidity, racism tends to transcend religions, skin pigmentation and location.

The whole ceremony anyway was a bit much anyway, the laws have changed, but the mentalities necessarily haven't.

So Federer didn't know who Gibson was, sure it would be good if he did, but the didn't and many Americans wouldn't know who or what Pele or Maradona looked like either and neither are hanging offences.

Rogiman
08-28-2007, 07:40 AM
For most people out of the USA (and aparently IN the USA too) "Althea Gibson" is the answer to a rather tricky trivia question.

I'd be more worried if Fed didn't know who Gandi was (not necessarily suggesting he does).

bokehlicious
08-28-2007, 08:38 AM
The level of hypocrisy in this thread (especially by the OP) once again reveals how some americans are convinced the whole world revolves about them, when they don't bother travelling outside the States, learning any other language or studying other countries' history, yet they're shocked that people from other nations aren't aware of every marginal detail in their history.

Again, I said that about 'some' americans, not 'all', I know PCness is the most important thing in the world for you.

:worship: :worship: :worship:

bokehlicious
08-28-2007, 08:41 AM
In that regard, it can take a lifetime just to visit most of the states and Canadian provinces, let alone do that along with visiting the rest of the world. It's not like Europe where you can visit multiple countries in the span of a few days.

It can take a lifetime to travel and figure out the European continent too... :rolleyes: Sure you can visit it in the span of a few days, but just like the US, if you just bother to head to NYC, LA & SF....

Apemant
08-28-2007, 08:45 AM
I must admit I didn't remember who she was, either - had to look her up @ Wikipedia, even though the name sounded a bit familiar. I guess she means much more in the USA than in other parts of the world...

Anyway, since Federer didn't even know who Sigmund Freud was, this really doesn't come as a big surprise. :devil:

Fensler
08-28-2007, 09:08 AM
It can take a lifetime to travel and figure out the European continent too... :rolleyes: Sure you can visit it in the span of a few days, but just like the US, if you just bother to head to NYC, LA & SF....

Sure - I know that it would take a lifetime to explore all of Europe. I didn't say that it wouldn't. I think you're combining two different points I was making.

I was simply using the "take a lifetime to visit all of America" comment as an alternative explanation for why many Americans haven't been to Europe, Asia, etc. They're too busy trying explore as much of their own continent as they can. It's not that they don't care about going to Europe - they just don't have the time or money. I wish I had the money to go to Europe, but I don't right now.

As for the "span of a few days" comment, I was just referring to the following concept, which really goes without saying. Europe is a continent with many, many countries, whereas mainland North America is a big continent with only a few countries. Given the same travel time/distance, you can visit far more countries in Europe than in North America. That's all I was saying.

Finally, I agree with your insinuation that travel by both Europeans and Americans alike is too often limited to the "major" destinations, like London, Paris, Rome, NYC, LA, Miami, etc. Visiting only those places doesn't always give a thorough feel for the respective cultures.

Rumour
08-28-2007, 09:57 AM
This just in: Donald Young says that Athea Gibson is 'awesome'. Boy, he sure must know his black history. Up next: Donald Young writes a 600 word article about Athea Gibson for the New York Times, entitled "The Awesome Athea Gibson", in which he utilizes the word awesome a record-setting 360 times (that's right, the first black person to accomplish the feat).

And after that: Donald Young receives Pulitzer for his 'good effort' in being a black man writing for a predominantly white paper.
This is the first thread to actually move me to bad rep a poster, whom I otherwise considered one of the more knowledgeable tennis voice on here, purely based on the content of one post. Not because of political or social views expressed in it but taking the opportunity to snidely put down a young black tennis player - at least he was one the last time I checked, but I suppose the NYT would hire him right off the street purely due to his skin colour - who wasn't even being discussed here :rolleyes:

What was the main point of it anyway - that blacks or other minorities only get recognized for minimal accomplishments, which in turn get magnified, because of their race? That shouldn't be a problem as long as there are enough people around to not only diminish such recognition but also go out of their way to denigrate others in the process :tape:

Veronique
08-28-2007, 10:08 AM
And I bet Tiger knows everything about Marc Rosset too, huh...?

Federer is a tennis player, he's in NYC to win the title, he's not reading every article on the web the way we are, and anyway all that 'student of the history of the game' image had been created by morons.

So Althea Gibson and Marc Rosset are in the same league tennis history wise? Nice try!

OTOH I bet Tiger knows who Freud is though. LOL

All kidding aside, like many here, I'm just surprised he didn't hear about her before yesterday. Many tennis fans came to know of Althea Gibson upon Serena and Venus Williams success. How many times have we heard Serena Williams introduced as the 1st black female to win the USO since Althea Gibson? Same with Venus in regards to Wimbledon?

Action Jackson
08-28-2007, 10:08 AM
What was the main point of it anyway - that blacks or other minorities only get recognized for minimal accomplishments, which in turn get magnified, because of their race? That shouldn't be a problem as long as there are enough people around to not only diminish such recognition but also go out of their way to denigrate others in the process :tape:

I think he was taking the piss actually and CyBorg will answer when he sees this. More along the lines of hypocrisy and tokenism, that is how I saw it.

It was like a major incident that happened in my home country that our most famous indigenous singer didn't want to appear at the Opening Ceremony cause in her words. "I didn’t want to be a decoration".

it could be seen as an American thing happening at an international event, highlight the cause and then quickly forget about it.

*Ljubica*
08-28-2007, 10:09 AM
Althea Gibson was an AMERICAN icon, a symbol taught at AMERICAN schools to AMERICAN children. She is someone from America from the 50's who played WOMEN's tennis.

I am reasonably well versed in tennis history but didn't know her or at least didn't remember the name. Roger is European, brought up in Europe and was never taught American values or history, so I think it's understandable he didn't know about an American women's tennis icon from the 50's. Also in general tennis history before the 60's is rarely in the limelight as the game was pretty obscure back then. Maybe Federer should have acquainted himself with the schedule for this US Open, but you can't blame him for concentrating on his preparation for his games.

Pretty much exactly how I feel :worship: So he had never heard of her? So what? Maybe you could argue that someone in his entourage should have made him aware beforehand :shrug: But he's there to play tennis. What's the big deal?

Rumour
08-28-2007, 10:24 AM
I don't expect everyone to know about Althea- as I don't expect for everyone to know the significance of Goolagong for Aussie tennis. But I appreciate that some players may have been important for tennis be something that a wider group of people could be interested in and have access to in some countries- and I do not think that makes said players marginal.

I am not going to hang Roger on the ropes for not knowing who Althea Gibson was- although I am a little surprised. But I see no need to dismiss or denigrate what Althea did and the doors she did indeed open for this sport that we all like on this board.
I know about Althea Gibson because she was referenced quite a bit on ESPN during the Williams' matches especially when they were at the height of their success. Otherwise, I would probably not know about her or expect the general tennis audience, especially outside the US, to be familiar with her name or accomplishments. Fed is certainly not at fault for not knowing about Gibson and answered the questions about her about as well as could be expected under the circumstances, although I too am slightly surprised that no one had mentioned to him even in passing what the night's hullaballoo was all about.

What really bugs me is how some people here get all huffy and indignant about a one-off event like this one, acting as if it's some huge personal imposition on them :rolleyes: Guess what, no one was being forced to watch the ceremony (not to mention care about why it was held) or the women's tennis for this one night out of a two week tournament. Personally I slept through most of it and just caught the end of the first match and most of the second. Last year I kept busy with other things during the BJK celebration and basically just kept an eye on it, waiting for the end so that I could finally watch tennis.

bokehlicious
08-28-2007, 10:24 AM
Despite being ignorant about Althea Gibson, I'm pretty sure Roger knows who Paris Hilton is, hence he does have a clue about the real Greats of our world... :rocker2: :p

Veronique
08-28-2007, 10:30 AM
Me neither....I never heard abt althea gibson untill yesterday....same with my friends too.....I have been following tennis from Mid-sampras era.....I'm pretty sure most of the fans who went out there today didnt anything abt her until today... i'm pretty sure none of my friends knew abt her....

Do you and your friends switch channels when reporters speak of Venus Williams as the 1st black female to win Wimbledon since Althea Gibson? B/c it's been beaten to death since she won her 1st Wimbledon back in 2000. I didn't grow up in the US so didn't know of Ms Gibson until Serena made the USO 1999 final and subsequently won it. I don't know how anybody living in the US (assuming by your post that you are) could have escaped hearing about that tidbit.

thesupreme
08-28-2007, 11:10 AM
It would be much too time consuming to post all the pictures of the parties involved. I'd have to start somewhere around the early-to-mid 70s and go from there. That's 100,000 pictures at least. Bush is the current major suck up to the ideal of black rights, whenever he's not ignoring their plight all across the country.

So don't forget what Athea Gibson needs are images of totalizing normality. Symbols, appearances, quick quotes, sound bytes and all of that good stuff that the corporations will put together and feed to you with your can of Coke. Yes, it must be done. It will feed the black babies and turn racists into non-racists. And, most importantly, Andrea needs the head of a major corporation to come up to her, give her a medal and tell her right to her eyes that he cares about what she has done for this and that. She needs some white suit from strictly commercial to make it all better.

Hallelujah. Holy shit. Let's eat.

= a disgrace to humanity on numerous ocassions (in this thread alone!), a self serving d*ckhead and a race baiting fool, who knows very little of what is being discussed here if he actually spent the time and inclination to REALLY think about it.

I hope the sanctity & loneliness of your own ignorance sets you free, now go slap yourself

Rogiman
08-28-2007, 11:17 AM
So Althea Gibson and Marc Rosset are in the same league tennis history wise? Nice try!News Flash: Rosset is way bigger in Switzerland than Althea (Who?)Gibson.OTOH I bet Tiger knows who Freud is though. LOL So Althea Gibson and Freud are in the same league history wise? Nice try!
All kidding aside, like many here, I'm just surprised he didn't hear about her before yesterday. Many tennis fans came to know of Althea Gibson upon Serena and Venus Williams success. How many times have we heard Serena Williams introduced as the 1st black female to win the USO since Althea Gibson? Same with Venus in regards to Wimbledon?I never knew Serena was the 1st black female to win the USO since Althea Gibson, I must have heard that somewhere but couldn't care less so I never bothered to remember that.

Even now, talking about that, I hope I'll forget that little piece of info ASAP.

denisgiann
08-28-2007, 11:28 AM
I think its typical from the Americans.They speak about American history but they dont realise that as a nation they are so young and their history so small comparing to many european nations that it is at least funny even to talk about it..... or wonder why a european doesnt know their history.
Its like a child with an adult.Compare the experiences of an adult(europe) with the experiences of a child(america)and then try to make convincing arguments why someone doesnt know the history of the child.
Gibson is no doubt part of the american history as there are gazillion other people in other countries with the same of even bigger impact.Do the americans know about them?(retorical question...lol.)
So all this seem pretty pointless to me.If you are an american and IF you are following tennis then you must have heard something of her....In all other cases.....are you serious?

Veronique
08-28-2007, 11:57 AM
News Flash: Rosset is way bigger in Switzerland than Althea (Who?)Gibson.

Still doesn't put him in the same league as Ms. Gibson.



Cute! They're in a league of their own. A league of historic figures Roger knows nothing about:)

[QUOTE=I never knew Serena was the 1st black female to win the USO since Althea Gibson, I must have heard that somewhere but couldn't care less so I never bothered to remember that.

Even now, talking about that, I hope I'll forget that little piece of info ASAP.

You, I really don't care. But I bet Roger knows much more about Ms. Gibson now than he did before that press conference yesterday. And he'll never forget it.

Veronique
08-28-2007, 12:01 PM
I think its typical from the Americans.They speak about American history but they dont realise that as a nation they are so young and their history so small comparing to many european nations that it is at least funny even to talk about it..... or wonder why a european doesnt know their history.
Its like a child with an adult.Compare the experiences of an adult(europe) with the experiences of a child(america)and then try to make convincing arguments why someone doesnt know the history of the child.
Gibson is no doubt part of the american history as there are gazillion other people in other countries with the same of even bigger impact.Do the americans know about them?(retorical question...lol.)
So all this seem pretty pointless to me.If you are an american and IF you are following tennis then you must have heard something of her....In all other cases.....are you serious?

This is a big deal to some only b/c it's Roger Federer we're talking about. Many expected him to know. So he didn't. No big deal. I have great confidence he knows by now.

Rogiman
08-28-2007, 12:12 PM
You, I really don't care. But I bet Roger knows much more about Ms. Gibson now than he did before that press conference yesterday. And he'll never forget it.Yay! you tell him!

:retard:

stebs
08-28-2007, 12:27 PM
Is it surprising? Yes, but only because the first night was dedicated to her, if it hadn't have been I wouldn't be at all surprised. Roger never said he knew anything about women's tennis or American historical figures who fought for Racial equality.

Winston's Human
08-28-2007, 12:38 PM
I do not blame Federer for not knowing about Althea Gibson.

It does put to lie the media blathering about Federer being a student of tennis history.

Forehander
08-28-2007, 12:46 PM
K i finally get this thread - FedFan2007 is just simply an insane crazy mentally ill person who expects perfection from Federer who apparently is also a human. Who fking cares if he doesn't knows Althea? I've been playing tennis for years and I know nothing about tennis history except for some past great players.

OrinUK
08-28-2007, 01:24 PM
I must admit I didn't remember who she was, either - had to look her up @ Wikipedia, even though the name sounded a bit familiar. I guess she means much more in the USA than in other parts of the world...

Anyway, since Federer didn't even know who Sigmund Freud was, this really doesn't come as a big surprise. :devil:

Is this true?:eek: :eek: :eek:

MusicMyst
08-28-2007, 01:55 PM
But why should he have expected to be asked about her? Roddick and Blake did interviews today and they weren't asked about her. Neither was Justine Henin.

Roger's place in tennis today is different from Blake's or Roddick's (or Justine's). He's one of the greatest tennis players of all time, and might, by the end of his career, be acknowledged as THE greatest. So, questions about what he knows about a tennis pioneer like Gibson are to be expected, I'd think. And he has a history of giving good quotes, so I'm not surprised that he was asked.

I originally thought that some sportswriter was trying for a "gotcha" moment, but now that I think about it, I think somebody just wanted a quote from Roger to put into his or her article about the ceremony.

nobama
08-28-2007, 02:44 PM
Roger's place in tennis today is different from Blake's or Roddick's (or Justine's). He's one of the greatest tennis players of all time, and might, by the end of his career, be acknowledged as THE greatest. So, questions about what he knows about a tennis pioneer like Gibson are to be expected, I'd think. And he has a history of giving good quotes, so I'm not surprised that he was asked.

I originally thought that some sportswriter was trying for a "gotcha" moment, but now that I think about it, I think somebody just wanted a quote from Roger to put into his or her article about the ceremony.The idea that Roger is Mr know-it-all when it comes to the history of the sport is media BS. I agree, I don't think the person asking the question was playing "gotcha", but I still don't understand why anyone cares what he thinks about Althea Gibson. :shrug: I can understand with the Williams sisters, players that were influenced by her, or knew her, or played with her. Anyway I'd rather have Fed give an honest answer (even if it makes him look ignorant to some) than some PC BS crap - like he and others have done when they've been asked about equal prize money.

GonzoFed
08-28-2007, 02:49 PM
WTF? I can't believe this thread is still going.

Rafa = Fed Killa
08-28-2007, 03:23 PM
Good for Federer.
With his stance on America and Womens tennis my respect for him is growing.

The Womens game is a joke and there is no point in remembering these useless easy accomplishments. Good for you Federer, you are now acting like a man.

Burrow
08-28-2007, 03:25 PM
After he realises Nadal will never pass Federer, Rafa=Fed Killa becomes a Federer fan.

Rafa = Fed Killa
08-28-2007, 03:28 PM
After he realises Nadal will never pass Federer, Rafa=Fed Killa becomes a Federer fan.

I will never be his fan, but at least he is manning up a bit and has stopped acting like a wussy for a couple of days.

Tess Gray
08-28-2007, 03:34 PM
I just think racism is way more alive in the US than it is in Europe. Therefor I do not think it's weird he doesn't know her.

I do think it's weird that he didn't know who she was, even after he saw she was getting an event organised for her. That is the weird part IMO.

Castafiore
08-28-2007, 03:34 PM
I just think racism is way more alive in the US than it is in Europe.
Oh, it's very much alive in Europe as well. I can't compare with the US very well but it's not exactly a non-issue here.

Tess Gray
08-28-2007, 03:38 PM
Oh, it's very much alive in Europe as well. I can't compare with the US very well but it's not exactly a non-issue here.

I put it the wrong way. Here ( I think) it's not about black-white issues. More about different ethnical groups, maybe gay vs straight (which has been a big issue over the last few days here in Holland)

But not so much black-white

Apemant
08-28-2007, 03:45 PM
Oh, it's very much alive in Europe as well. I can't compare with the US very well but it's not exactly a non-issue here.

How would you define racism in your own words, without looking it up at Wikipedia or someplace else?

calvinhobbes
08-28-2007, 04:57 PM
Poor Roger. He falls periodically in the claws of journalists, as do other players. He may know about tennis history in the sense it is important to the game itself. He knows about tendencies, schools, styles and the practical results derived from every innovation. This is the real meaning of history, not the anecdotical lore collected in trillions of articles. I think miss Gibson belongs to this anecdotical lore more than to the technical development of tennis. So, although it is appropriate to recall her in an official political ceremony, it is inappropriate for a journalist to say "gotcha!" using her name as a token of erudition. I highly appreciate the candid answer given by Roger.

MatchFederer
08-28-2007, 05:00 PM
Calvin, you would win the CCC... (clever clowns championship)


Except you're not a clown.. :p I just couldn't think of a better way to put it.

Anyway, I agree with your view.

Castafiore
08-28-2007, 05:17 PM
How would you define racism in your own words, without looking it up at Wikipedia or someplace else?
:scratch:
Why do you ask that question?

But ok, I'll play so without checking other sources:
It has the word "race" in it so I would describe it as prejudice not with a rational foundation but purely based on skin color, race,...

FedFan_2007
08-28-2007, 05:46 PM
How can prejudice ever be rational?

Castafiore
08-28-2007, 05:52 PM
How can prejudice ever be rational?
:lol: It's not, you're right about that but I just wanted to stress the irrationality of it.

Why am I getting this question anyway?

henree
08-28-2007, 06:00 PM
Poor Roger. He falls periodically in the claws of journalists, as do other players.

Dude this was a pretty big Ceremony. Posters were posted all over the grounds about last nights celebration. He should have known just a little about what was going on. And maybe should have asked someone about who they were honoring tonight.:rolleyes:

Apemant
08-28-2007, 06:09 PM
:scratch:
Why do you ask that question?

Because I note a lot of confusion over that term. (and other similar terms with regard to some burning issues of modern civilization)

Castafiore
08-28-2007, 06:47 PM
Because I note a lot of confusion over that term. (and other similar terms with regard to some burning issues of modern civilization)
Right.

And?
Did I pass the grade?

tangerine_dream
08-29-2007, 05:38 PM
Wertheim's blog:

5. Roger Federer isn't perfect. Apart from playing peerless tennis, the three-time defending champ has an uncommon knack for saying and doing the right things. He is not, however, infallible, as evidenced by his press conference on Monday.

After dusting Scoville Jenkins, Federer was asked what he knew about Althea Gibson. Federer responded: "I don't know. You're putting me on the spot. I don't know what you're talking about." Nudged by the "hint" that she was being honored later in the evening, he still drew a blank. "It's before my time. Isn't much I can really say about it. I don't know, I'm sorry."

Allowing for the fact that Federer is a tennis player and not a historian -- and he grew up in a foreign country (Switzerland) where the Civil Rights movement might not be part of the curriculum -- his remarks were surprisingly tone-deaf.

This isn't a politically correct cant. It's simply that a tennis purist who hates instant replay, a traditionalist who reveres Rod Laver, ought to have at least heard of a pioneering Wimbledon champ, particularly when her name has been inescapable at this event. I suppose that in a way, this opens a window into just how "tunneled" a top-tier athlete must be.

Personally, I'm getting tired of the media always prefacing every Federer faux pas with a breathless exclamation of "OMG, Roger Federer really is just HUMAN!" Really? Gee, I didn't know that. :cuckoo:

Apemant
08-29-2007, 05:50 PM
Right.

And?
Did I pass the grade?

I wasn't testing you, I was just curious what you would say.

Raquel
08-29-2007, 06:45 PM
How ironic that Jon Wertheim is calling Roger "surprisingly tone-deaf" for not knowing the full Althea Gibson story of 50 years ago, when he himself gets facts wrong about the current game all the time - facts he's paid to know.

I think honesty was the best policy for Roger rather than give a publicity soundbite that someone had to prompt him with 5 minutes before going into the interview.

nisha
08-29-2007, 07:33 PM
i dont know her

kiwi10is
08-29-2007, 08:07 PM
I am tennis fan since 1985 and I don`t know her, too

And as far as I read in the pressconference Roger was asked what he knows about her.So they expected him to talk about what she did and achieved. So hey... she played tennis far before his time and he didn`t say that he doesn`t know her he just said that he doesn't know what to say about her. Maybe he didn`t know enough to open a public discussion. You cannot blame him for this and it doesn´t mean that he has a problem with her skin or whatever. Not all celebrities who are famous in USA are famous all over the world.