Federer I'm lucky I'm not American [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Federer I'm lucky I'm not American

tennis2tennis
08-25-2007, 09:02 AM
swissinfo.com = interview Mon Aug 20
translated from swiss german
Thank you Fedfirstfan#1

He was asked whether he sometimes wished he was American, that he would get more endorsement deals and better credit for his achievementsÖ

I want Americans to appreciate me, I will be honest I care about them. But I also see the glass as half full I never have to worry about public expectations. Iím not the heir to anyone! Being constantly compared to Sampras, Courier, McEnroe and Connors would be too much, Iím glade Iím not American. I know the next generation of Swiss players will have their success be compared to mine but everything Iím achieving now is a bonus.

Forehander
08-25-2007, 09:05 AM
There's many reasons why people don't want to be Americans.

tennis2tennis
08-25-2007, 09:12 AM
There's many reasons why people don't want to be Americans.

using his arguement he could have easily said I don't want to be Australian and be compared to Newcombe, Rosewall and Laver

Forehander
08-25-2007, 09:18 AM
using his arguement he could have easily said I don't want to be Australian and be compared to Newcombe, Rosewall and Laver

yeh i agree u're not wrong.

The_Nadal_effect
08-25-2007, 09:21 AM
Nadal wants to stay a Spaniard. :)

tennis2tennis
08-25-2007, 09:28 AM
Nadal wants to stay a Spaniard. :)

that's because with the exception of Manolo Santana he's pretty much achieved what most spaniards have!

Or Levy
08-25-2007, 09:50 AM
That's about the most stupid question anyone could ever ask any patriotic boy from whatever country, I mean what did they expect him to say, "Yes, being Swiss is boring, being an American is so cool, and all those endorsement deals, too!'

I think he gave a fantastic answer, considering.

Kuhne
08-25-2007, 10:05 AM
what a dumbass question. does this reporter realise federer gets more than enough recognition in all of the european continent for him to care about being recognized in america? just how many tournaments a year are in the USA?... god some ignorant people

Stensland
08-25-2007, 10:37 AM
once again, good answer by fed. he's constantly oretty honest during interviews without offending anyone. i like that attitude; it's better than a-rod, who's funny but lying like hell..."oh yeah, this tournament is the most important out there"..."oh yeah, this one too"..."yeah, and THIS one also"...pffff...

Greenday
08-25-2007, 10:49 AM
That's about the most stupid question anyone could ever ask any patriotic boy from whatever country, I mean what did they expect him to say, "Yes, being Swiss is boring, being an American is so cool, and all those endorsement deals, too!'

I think he gave a fantastic answer, considering.

Spot On...Idiotic question in the first place,,

FedFan_2007
08-25-2007, 10:53 AM
I don't think Fed is dissing America, but just stating that it's good to be a trailblazer for Swiss tennis. He is the Swiss standard for all the follow from now on. Just like Borg will always be the greatest tennis Swede.

star
08-25-2007, 02:23 PM
swissinfo.com = interview Mon Aug 20
translated from swiss german
Thank you Fedfirstfan#1

He was asked whether he sometimes wished he was American, that he would get more endorsement deals and better credit for his achievements…

I want Americans to appreciate me, I will be honest I care about them. But I also see the glass as half full I never have to worry about public expectations. I’m not the heir to anyone! Being constantly compared to Sampras, Courier, McEnroe and Connors would be too much, I’m glade I’m not American. I know the next generation of Swiss players will have their success be compared to mine but everything I’m achieving now is a bonus.

I always have the impression that Federer doesn't like America very much. I think what he said here was mild compared to what he might have said. It's kind of an insulting question

nobama
08-25-2007, 02:43 PM
I always have the impression that Federer doesn't like America very much. I think what he said here was mild compared to what he might have said. It's kind of an insulting questionJust curious why you have that impresson.

star
08-25-2007, 02:44 PM
Just curious why you have that impresson.

I have the impression from reading, watching and listening. :hatoff:

Rosa Luxembourg
08-25-2007, 02:45 PM
I always have the impression that Federer doesn't like America very much. I think what he said here was mild compared to what he might have said. It's kind of an insulting question


oh puhlese stop putting words/thoughts/intensions into his mouth.

Tess Gray
08-25-2007, 02:48 PM
I always have the impression that Federer doesn't like America very much. I think what he said here was mild compared to what he might have said. It's kind of an insulting question

A lot of european people don't really like America because it's just such a different culture than the european one. Especially the north part of Europe (including switzerland).

But I didn'n have the impression that he dislikes the US in anyway though..:)

thrust
08-25-2007, 02:57 PM
Reasonable question, good answer. Noone is saying Roger should change his citizenshop or live in the USA. The USA is not perfect, but more people from all over the world are risking their lives to get here. No other country offers so much opportunity to the poor of the world as the USA does.

gjalex
08-25-2007, 03:02 PM
In America if you don't do well in sport and you are expected to you are considered a loser and its really looked down on, like what happened to the American world cup coach last year, that guy had his reputation dragged through the mud and trodden on by the media. So I think thats where Federer is coming from. Its not the sort of pressure anyone wants, of course its not unique to America, the British are pretty bad at it too.

star
08-25-2007, 03:03 PM
A lot of european people don't really like America because it's just such a different culture than the european one. Especially the north part of Europe (including switzerland).

But I didn'n have the impression that he dislikes the US in anyway
though..:)

Lots of people don't like America. I'm not particularly bothered that they don't.

And I didn't mean that he "hated" America, but that just as you said a lot of European people don't like America.

And I also think America has lost a lot of good will through its actions over the last 5 plus years too. So, it's not all undeserved.

star
08-25-2007, 03:04 PM
In America if you don't do well in sport and you are expected to you are considered a loser and its really looked down on, like what happened to the American world cup coach last year, that guy had his reputation dragged through the mud and trodden on by the media. So I think thats where Federer is coming from. Its not the sort of pressure anyone wants, of course its not unique to America, the British are pretty bad at it too.

The American World Cup coach had his reputation dragged through the mud by the media?

:lol: :lol: I don't know the guy's name and never heard a word about it.

star
08-25-2007, 03:07 PM
Reasonable question, good answer. Noone is saying Roger should change his citizenshop or live in the USA. The USA is not perfect, but more people from all over the world are risking their lives to get here. No other country offers so much opportunity to the poor of the world as the USA does.

I don't agree with that. That's American myth. Lots of people risk their lives to get to European countries, and to any country they can get to. It's not just America.

gjalex
08-25-2007, 03:07 PM
The American World Cup coach had his reputation dragged through the mud by the media?

I don't know the guy's name and never heard a word about it.

You probably weren't living in the US at the time, of course its not like a massive amount of media attention was paid because its soccer, however far more attention was paid than ever before as the US overachieved in the 2002 WC. You wouldn't have seen the US soccer team on the front page of sports illustrated before the 2002 WC. Bruce Arena that was his name.

scoobs
08-25-2007, 03:09 PM
I've never gotten the impression that Federer dislikes America, more that there are some aspects of it that trouble him.

I remember reading a comment about "God Bless America" and his response was along the lines of "yes, and what about God Bless The World because you know, we're all on the same world and I think that gets forgotten" (I'm paraphrasing) but it was an indication that he disapproves of aspects of Nationalism that are an issue around the world but that are definitely very strong in America.

star
08-25-2007, 03:10 PM
You probably weren't living in the US at the time, of course its not like a massive amount of media attention was paid because its soccer, however far more attention was paid than ever before. You wouldn't have seen the US soccer team on the front page of sports illustrated in 2002.

I was living in the U.S., but it wasn't a big sports scandal in the U.S. I mean, we aren't talking about something on the scale of Michael Vick. :)

Plus, if winning were everything in the U.S., the Chicago Cubs would have NO fans. :)

barbadosan
08-25-2007, 03:11 PM
Reasonable question, good answer. Noone is saying Roger should change his citizenshop or live in the USA. The USA is not perfect, but more people from all over the world are risking their lives to get here. No other country offers so much opportunity to the poor of the world as the USA does.

One could hardly classify Federer as one of "the poor of the world", could one. Therefore, and for other reasons stated by other posters, a damn stupid question

gjalex
08-25-2007, 03:12 PM
I was living in the U.S., but it wasn't a big sports scandal in the U.S. I mean, we aren't talking about something on the scale of Michael Vick.

Plus, if winning were everything in the U.S., the Chicago Cubs would have NO fans.

No Scandal, im just saying the media scrutiny can be more intense and the failure of not meeting expectations has wider ramifications.

star
08-25-2007, 03:13 PM
I've never gotten the impression that Federer dislikes America, more that there are some aspects of it that trouble him.

I remember reading a comment about "God Bless America" and his response was along the lines of "yes, and what about God Bless The World because you know, we're all on the same world and I think that gets forgotten" (I'm paraphrasing) but it was an indication that he disapproves of aspects of Nationalism that are an issue around the world but that are definitely very strong in America.

:lol: Yes. I remember when Federer said "I'm an international man."

I think I said that Federer doesn't like america which to me is different than saying he "dislikes" america. I don't have the impression that he has a lot of positive feelings about the u.s.

I too am troubled by all the nationalistic crapola at the u.s. open.

star
08-25-2007, 03:14 PM
No Scandal, im just saying the media scrutiny can be more intense and the failure of not meeting expectations has wider ramifications.

Maybe that's why the Cubs have fans. No expectations. :)

scoobs
08-25-2007, 03:15 PM
Reasonable question, good answer. Noone is saying Roger should change his citizenshop or live in the USA. The USA is not perfect, but more people from all over the world are risking their lives to get here. No other country offers so much opportunity to the poor of the world as the USA does.
I think the answer to that is quite complicated.

I think in America, you can reach virtually any position in the social strata from any other position and it's entirely down to what talents you have and how hard you work. You can reach the very top of the social pyramid from the very bottom if you work hard enough and have the sort of abilities that you can use to get you there. There's far less deference toward your family line and your heritage in America - if you make your money and get to the top you are much more likely to be welcomed by the others there.

In the UK and other European countries, to take an example, there's still a lot of snobbery about your bloodline and your station in life, even today. People who get rich and make it to the top are still likely to be dismissed by some elements of the Upper Class as being "new money". They still close doors to you - although less so than used to be the case.

However, I'd find it hard to believe the argument that the US does more for the poor people that come into the country than other countries do. Many European countries have a much more generous welfare state for those with least in society than does the USA. In America you are expected to stand on your own two feet much more, don't expect much help from the state, and make your own way.

So I don't think it's anywhere near as simple as "country X has more opportunities for the poor than anywhere else" - it's a very complicated question.

star
08-25-2007, 03:22 PM
I think the answer to that is quite complicated.

I think in America, you can reach virtually any position in the social strata from any other position and it's entirely down to what talents you have and how hard you work. You can reach the very top of the social pyramid from the very bottom if you work hard enough and have the sort of abilities that you can use to get you there. There's far less deference toward your family line and your heritage in America - if you make your money and get to the top you are much more likely to be welcomed by the others there.

In the UK and other European countries, to take an example, there's still a lot of snobbery about your bloodline and your station in life, even today. People who get rich and make it to the top are still likely to be dismissed by some elements of the Upper Class as being "new money". They still close doors to you - although less so than used to be the case.

However, I'd find it hard to believe the argument that the US does more for the poor people that come into the country than other countries do. Many European countries have a much more generous welfare state for those with least in society than does the USA. In America you are expected to stand on your own two feet much more, don't expect much help from the state, and make your own way.

So I don't think it's anywhere near as simple as "country X has more opportunities for the poor than anywhere else" - it's a very complicated question.

I think that it is part of the American myth that anyone who works hard and has talent can get to the top. That is clearly not true. There are a very few people in modern day America who can scrape themselves up by their bootstraps. More and more America is becoming stratified by wealth. The aftermath of world war two was a great leveler in the nation because all of the war veterans were given the opportunity for education and education at some very good schools. That and the great depression significantly changed social stratification. But it's hard to look in the eye of some kid in the inner city where his school is a war zone and his neighborhood is even worse and say, "all it takes is hard work and talent, son."

scoobs
08-25-2007, 03:26 PM
I think that it is part of the American myth that anyone who works hard and has talent can get to the top. That is clearly not true. There are a very few people in modern day America who can scrape themselves up by their bootstraps. More and more America is becoming stratified by wealth. The aftermath of world war two was a great leveler in the nation because all of the war veterans were given the opportunity for education and education at some very good schools. That and the great depression significantly changed social stratification. But it's hard to look in the eye of some kid in the inner city where his school is a war zone and his neighborhood is even worse and say, "all it takes is hard work and talent, son."
*smile*

this is a discussion that could rage for days without resolution :)

and it's getting a bit off the topic of tennis so i'll leave it there ;)

Tess Gray
08-25-2007, 03:32 PM
I don't agree with that. That's American myth. Lots of people risk their lives to get to European countries, and to any country they can get to. It's not just America.

I agree with you, the US I think is very full of itself when it comes to issues like this. They're always saying how america is the best country in the world and whatnot, but they do not know how other countries are. So I guess I'm with the most european people, I do not like the way the american society is ( and yes I do know how it is like and I know what it is like over here)

zethand
08-25-2007, 03:34 PM
I am lucky too!

gjalex
08-25-2007, 03:42 PM
I am lucky too!

Coming from Luxembourg, according to your flag, id say your pretty lucky as it is the richest country in the world.

tennis2tennis
08-25-2007, 04:24 PM
I don't think the question was about whether or not he loves America , it's about getting greater recognition and money had he been American...look at Roddick he hasn't won half the tournaments Roger has, but he's making so much more money in endorsement deals! But like Roger answered he doesn't have to deal with the 'death of US tennis' that Roddick gets thrown at him in every interview!

Santorofan
08-25-2007, 04:26 PM
There's many reasons why people don't want to be Americans.


And many many more why people WANT to be....ever wonder why they have to build a wall just to keep 'em out??? This isn't a jingoistic statement; merely a sensible reply to a hater without a clue. :rolleyes:

Forehander
08-25-2007, 04:29 PM
And many many more why people WANT to be....ever wonder why they have to build a wall just to keep 'em out??? This isn't a jingoistic statement; merely a sensible reply to a hater without a clue. :rolleyes:

Jeez don't be angry lol what i typed never intended to be offensive. You can say the same for me but i don't see the point -_-

Winston's Human
08-25-2007, 04:29 PM
I don't think the question was about whether or not he loves America , it's about getting greater recognition and money had he been American...look at Roddick he hasn't won half the tournaments Roger has, but he's making so much more money in endorsement deals! But like Roger answered he doesn't have to deal with the 'death of US tennis' that Roddick gets thrown at him in every interview!


Exactly.

I did not read Roger's comments as anti-American. I think he was pointing out that American fans have unrealistic expectations due to the successes of players like McEnroe, Connors, Agassi, Sampras and Courier, and that he was glad that he did not have to play under such expectations.

zethand
08-25-2007, 04:34 PM
And many many more why people WANT to be....ever wonder why they have to build a wall just to keep 'em out??? This isn't a jingoistic statement; merely a sensible reply to a hater without a clue. :rolleyes:

Believe me nobody wants to be an american, but sometimes the desperation gets you there... and then you do not have a choice. Do you really think that the people from Latin America goes there to be threated with disrespect? Open your eyes, moron!

I repeat, I am lucky I am not American!

nobama
08-25-2007, 04:50 PM
:lol: Yes. I remember when Federer said "I'm an international man."

I think I said that Federer doesn't like america which to me is different than saying he "dislikes" america. I don't have the impression that he has a lot of positive feelings about the u.s.

I too am troubled by all the nationalistic crapola at the u.s. open.Seems to me your thrusting your opinions/feelings on Federer. ;) When did Federer say "I'm an international man"? If you're going to suggest he doesn't like the USA, at least back it up with some evidence.

I'm not even sure how this turned into this anti-American (which everyone will claim it's not) bs. Federer could have used Australia as his example. They've had their fair share of ledends in tennis too. But somehow I have a feeling if he had, people he wouldn't be claiming he doesn't like Australia. ;)

star
08-25-2007, 04:57 PM
Believe me nobody wants to be an american, but sometimes the desperation gets you there... and then you do not have a choice. Do you really think that the people from Latin America goes there to be threated with disrespect? Open your eyes, moron!

I repeat, I am lucky I am not American!

Well, I want to be an American and am glad I am. :) :)

I think many people move around the world seeking opportunities they don't have in their home countries. I think it has been this was since the beginning of time for humans. Some have an adventurous spirit, some look for better opportunites elsewhere, and some are forced to leave their homelands. Some Central and Latin Americans are very happy about the opportunites they have in the U.S. Many wish they could stay at home and be able to support their families. Some are running from political oppression. I don't think you can just say that it is one way. I think there are also many who go to Europe for the same reasons. I've read that many Central Americans now turn to Spain rather than the U.S. And I know that there are many illegal aliens in Europe. Not all of them are treated with respect either, and most of them probably wish they could have stayed at home and had opportunities there.

Did you know that a very popular T.V. show here in the states features a man who came to the U.S. as an illegal alien when he was 14? He thinks people in the U.S. are a little nutty, but most everyone respects him very much.

LocoPorElTenis
08-25-2007, 07:03 PM
I think in America, you can reach virtually any position in the social strata from any other position and it's entirely down to what talents you have and how hard you work. You can reach the very top of the social pyramid from the very bottom if you work hard enough and have the sort of abilities that you can use to get you there.

This is absolutely not true. It may have been somewhat true many decades ago, but certainly it is no more, and indeed social mobility is not just minimal but it's still decreasing.

And working hard has nothing to do with getting rich, people get rich mostly by getting lucky with investments (think internet bubble), or by having parents which can afford a quality university education (which is extremely expensive). If your parents have a minimum-wage job (assuming they are employed at all), good luck getting rich no matter how hard you work, unless you join a gang or become good at sports.

LocoPorElTenis
08-25-2007, 07:05 PM
*smile*

this is a discussion that could rage for days without resolution :)

and it's getting a bit off the topic of tennis so i'll leave it there ;)

So you bring up the topic, and when challenged you say it's off topic so you'll leave it there? :confused: . I would expect more from one of the most intelligent posters here :hatoff:.

LocoPorElTenis
08-25-2007, 07:10 PM
*smile*

this is a discussion that could rage for days without resolution :)

and it's getting a bit off the topic of tennis so i'll leave it there ;)

Check this for example (study of the London School of Economics): http://www.lse.ac.uk/collections/pressAndInformationOffice/newsAndEvents/archives/2005/LSE_SuttonTrust_report.htm The article focuses on Britain but also mentions that US has much lower social mobility than all the other European countries surveyed and Canada. The full report can be downloaded as well.


The discussion can rage for days but the facts are clear: social mobility in America is nothing more than a myth.

User ID 29337
08-25-2007, 07:44 PM
Honestly there are many reasons americans don't want to be associated with America.

And I know that just for posting it I'll get bashed by some uber patriotic person who claims I should just leave ect ect. The fact of the matter is, our foreign policy needs a complete and utter makeover, our education system is sad at best, health care is a joke even for the insured I could go on and on.

I don't think Federer was being antiamerican, I think he was answering a dumb question with a great answer.

turkjey5
08-25-2007, 07:45 PM
are you desperate to find controversy? How could anyone dare to not want to be american?

tennisgal_001
08-25-2007, 07:48 PM
There's nothing anti-American about Federer's comments. He CLEARLY stated that he's glad he's not playing under the American flag because he doesn't want to face the pressure of expectations of being the decendant of a generation of greats like Sampras, Courier, Connors, Agassi, etc... Part of his early success came because he was under no 'national' pressure or expectation, so he could swing freely without having to worry about what the Swiss media said or did not say. Forget Roddick, Blake, Mardy, Robby and the rest of those guys for a minute...the US media has already named Querrey, Young, and Isner the "trio" that will take over after the Federer-era. Talk about pressure.

Tennis Fool
08-25-2007, 07:50 PM
I think the answer to that is quite complicated.

I think in America, you can reach virtually any position in the social strata from any other position and it's entirely down to what talents you have and how hard you work. You can reach the very top of the social pyramid from the very bottom if you work hard enough and have the sort of abilities that you can use to get you there. There's far less deference toward your family line and your heritage in America - if you make your money and get to the top you are much more likely to be welcomed by the others there.


I agree with Star :eek: I think this is a myth. In actuality it is very hard to move from one socioeconomic class to another.


Although I think the "high society" world is dead. Why else would Paris Hilton (old money) look for low-class celebrity?

mangoes
08-25-2007, 08:05 PM
That's about the most stupid question anyone could ever ask any patriotic boy from whatever country, I mean what did they expect him to say, "Yes, being Swiss is boring, being an American is so cool, and all those endorsement deals, too!'

I think he gave a fantastic answer, considering.

Totally Agree

User ID 29337
08-25-2007, 08:10 PM
There is an old saying: "If you want to know about america, ask a Native American"

wcr
08-25-2007, 08:47 PM
:lol: Yes. I remember when Federer said "I'm an international man."

I think I said that Federer doesn't like america which to me is different than saying he "dislikes" america. I don't have the impression that he has a lot of positive feelings about the u.s.

I too am troubled by all the nationalistic crapola at the u.s. open.

Yes, you said that "Federer doesn't like america" but you've not provided any evidence of this. It is clear you have trouble with America and it sounds like you're overlaying your sentiment on Federer. If not, produce the quotes and let the readers here decide for themselves. That's a fair way to go about this. Impressions and vague recollections are not equal to facts.

Playing the national anthem at the USOPEN is off color to me because it's an international not a national event. Yet - post 9/11 - I understand why they do. I believe the FO plays the anthem of the winner like an Olympic awards ceremony. No anthems are played at the AO or Wimbledon which works best for me.

scoobs
08-25-2007, 08:52 PM
I agree with Star :eek: I think this is a myth. In actuality it is very hard to move from one socioeconomic class to another.


Although I think the "high society" world is dead. Why else would Paris Hilton (old money) look for low-class celebrity?
I may not have explained myself clearly - I'm not especially referring to social mobility per se - I agree that there's very little of it in the USA and there's little of it in the UK. It can be done by some people who work hard, have talent, and perhaps get lucky. For these people, I'm talking about, in individual cases where it DOES happen, the attitudes and reactions of those people when you get there. in America, if you can scratch and claw your way up to the higher echelons of society, you are more likely to be welcomed when you get there as opposed to places like the UK where you will encounter more snobbery.

wcr
08-25-2007, 09:03 PM
Why else would Paris Hilton (old money) look for low-class celebrity?

Word has it that Paris Hilton's inheritance is worth $3 million. While that's a lot for most folks, it's not enough to perpetuate the life style she's grown accustomed to living. Hilton lacks the intellectual stamina to pursue a fortune in such areas as engineering and science, not to mention broadcasting. She is, however, quite capable of building a small fortune of her own in Hollywood without very much talent by just being herself.

BTW - Paris Hilton doesn't represent "old money." It was her great-grandfather - Conrad Hilton - who started the hotel chain. We're not talking DAR (Daughter of the American Revolution) here.

scoobs
08-25-2007, 09:04 PM
"Will I go down to her yacht in St. Tropez!? Will I bugger!"
"... St. Tropez!?"
"I know! So common!"

:D
And standing by with an apt quotation - it's Diva J!

:haha:

scoobs
08-25-2007, 09:10 PM
:haha: Richsnob-Bubble is my favorite incarnation of Bubble, I'll have you know. :D "New wealth, so common!"
I know - I love that episode...

star
08-25-2007, 09:13 PM
Yes, you said that "Federer doesn't like america" but you've not provided any evidence of this. It is clear you have trouble with America and it sounds like you're overlaying your sentiment on Federer. If not, produce the quotes and let the readers here decide for themselves. That's a fair way to go about this. Impressions and vague recollections are not equal to facts.

Playing the national anthem at the USOPEN is off color to me because it's an international not a national event. Yet - post 9/11 - I understand why they do. I believe the FO plays the anthem of the winner like an Olympic awards ceremony. No anthems are played at the AO or Wimbledon which works best for me.

No, I've said I've the impression he doesn't like america. That's my impression. I could be wrong about it. It's just a lot of little things that have created my impression.

I'm not projecting on to Federer my own feelings about America because no matter my difficulties with american foreign and domestic political policies, I like living in the U.S. I like wide open spaces and being able to be where there are no people at all, yet able to return to a comfortable house and civilized ameneties. I am proud of many things that are american, but I'm not blind to faults in my country either.

star
08-25-2007, 09:17 PM
I may not have explained myself clearly - I'm not especially referring to social mobility per se - I agree that there's very little of it in the USA and there's little of it in the UK. It can be done by some people who work hard, have talent, and perhaps get lucky. For these people, I'm talking about, in individual cases where it DOES happen, the attitudes and reactions of those people when you get there. in America, if you can scratch and claw your way up to the higher echelons of society, you are more likely to be welcomed when you get there as opposed to places like the UK where you will encounter more snobbery.

I cant think of a modern day American who meets the description of coming from nothing to enormous wealth, and don't have any personal experience, ;), but from what I read, there are vastly rich who have been rich for generations who don't accept newcomers to their clubs. But you are right it is probably different in the U.K. because there isn't the overlay of aristocracy in the U.S.

I guess each of us just has to get fabulously wealthy to test out our theories. :) :)

MCL
08-25-2007, 09:25 PM
I cant think of a modern day American who meets the description of coming from nothing to enormous wealth, and don't have any personal experience, ;), but from what I read, there are vastly rich who have been rich for generations who don't accept newcomers to their clubs. But you are right it is probably different in the U.K. because there isn't the overlay of aristocracy in the U.S.

I guess each of us just has to get fabulously wealthy to test out our theories. :) :)

There are more than a few pro athletes and entertainers that might fit that description in America. It depends on your definition of "enormous"" wealth. Like it or not :shrug:, even porn stars can become multi-millionaires in the US.

wcr
08-25-2007, 09:27 PM
I cant think of a modern day American who meets the description of coming from nothing to enormous wealth, and don't have any personal experience, ;), but from what I read, there are vastly rich who have been rich for generations who don't accept newcomers to their clubs. But you are right it is probably different in the U.K. because there isn't the overlay of aristocracy in the U.S.

I guess each of us just has to get fabulously wealthy to test out our theories. :) :)

I suggest you spend some time researching folks who've done well in Silicone Valley for starters. Not all of the success stories there are the same as Bill Gates'.

I know plenty of Americans - past and present - who've come out of low-income households (try descendants of the Vietnamese boat people who became grocers in small markets in California), worked their butts off in school to secure great college educations in fields of science, medicine and technology and are enjoying great, great rewards. These same people are still working extremely hard (they love their work) and don't have time for jet-setting to NY to attend fashionable dinners with the likes of Oscar de la Renta and Roger Federer. They are not flashy, public figures. They are, however, people who have achieved - and are still achieving - the great American dream.

bayvalle
08-25-2007, 09:52 PM
Fed does not have to be an American - he speaks better English (Fed's second language) than some Americans (no offense to "some" Americans). Seriously, as gleaned from his response, Fed's country allegiance is not for sale (despite all the glitters that America can offer). Perhaps Fed would be uncomfortable to be referred to as "the greatest American player" (robbing Switzerland the honor), to the chagrin of all past and present American sports heroes. But "should" Fed indeed cross over to the American soil, the immediate question that comes to mind is, will he now be more "lenient" to Andy and James?

star
08-25-2007, 10:20 PM
I suggest you spend some time researching folks who've done well in Silicone Valley for starters. Not all of the success stories there are the same as Bill Gates'.

I know plenty of Americans - past and present - who've come out of low-income households (try descendants of the Vietnamese boat people who became grocers in small markets in California), worked their butts off in school to secure great college educations in fields of science, medicine and technology and are enjoying great, great rewards. These same people are still working extremely hard (they love their work) and don't have time for jet-setting to NY to attend fashionable dinners with the likes of Oscar de la Renta and Roger Federer. They are not flashy, public figures. They are, however, people who have achieved - and are still achieving - the great American dream.

Well, I thought about Silicone Valley for examples, but I can't think of anyone there who came from any sort of underclass.

I agree there is upward mobility in the U.S., but you are talking generational mobility and I understood that wasn't the example. It wasn't just living a comfortable life, but becoming part of the upper class. Also, many of the immigrants who started businesses in the u.s had money or access to money that people in the underclass don't possess.

The only guy I can think of who truly came from nothing to be very sucessful is Cesar Milan who came to this country as a illegal immigrant and worked his way up through lousy jobs into a tv show about dogs, but he's not fabulously wealthy. I guess there are sports figures who might fit this description too. And I am sure there are others as well, but it isn't an every day story and there are a gajillion people in the u.s. who work their butts off but still are living paycheck to paycheck. Simply working hard is not a guarantee of monetary success.

MisterQ
08-25-2007, 10:22 PM
Like it or not :shrug:, even porn stars can become multi-millionaires in the US.

Hey, that's a great idea! Thanks! :dance:

MisterQ
08-25-2007, 10:24 PM
I've never gotten the impression that Federer dislikes America, more that there are some aspects of it that trouble him.

I remember reading a comment about "God Bless America" and his response was along the lines of "yes, and what about God Bless The World because you know, we're all on the same world and I think that gets forgotten" (I'm paraphrasing) but it was an indication that he disapproves of aspects of Nationalism that are an issue around the world but that are definitely very strong in America.

This sounds right to me... it matches the impression I've gotten over the year of Federer's worldview. :yeah:

star
08-25-2007, 10:27 PM
There are more than a few pro athletes and entertainers that might fit that description in America. It depends on your definition of "enormous"" wealth. Like it or not :shrug:, even porn stars can become multi-millionaires in the US.

Yeah. It does depend on the definition. I would put Bill Gates in the category of enormous wealth. I'm looking at Vanderbilt/Astor type wealth.

Tennis Fool
08-25-2007, 10:30 PM
Word has it that Paris Hilton's inheritance is worth $3 million. While that's a lot for most folks, it's not enough to perpetuate the life style she's grown accustomed to living. Hilton lacks the intellectual stamina to pursue a fortune in such areas as engineering and science, not to mention broadcasting. She is, however, quite capable of building a small fortune of her own in Hollywood without very much talent by just being herself.

BTW - Paris Hilton doesn't represent "old money." It was her great-grandfather - Conrad Hilton - who started the hotel chain. We're not talking DAR (Daughter of the American Revolution) here.

Actually, to be considered old money, going back just a few generations in the US is enough. Conrad Hilton came here from Europe in the mid-1800s and made his fortune along the likes of the Vanderbilts, Roosevelts,Gettys, Carnegies, et al. Only older families I can think of are Astors and Schemerhorns.

Regarding Paris, it seems that it's really the fault of her parents in the way that she was raised--as if they had low expectations of their kids or expected them to just live without working.

I cant think of a modern day American who meets the description of coming from nothing to enormous wealth
Oprah Winfrey.

star
08-25-2007, 10:37 PM
Oprah Winfrey.

Great example!! Better than mine.

She was fortunate to get an education, and smart enough to take advantage.

wcr
08-25-2007, 10:51 PM
Well, I thought about Silicone Valley for examples, but I can't think of anyone there who came from any sort of underclass.

I agree there is upward mobility in the U.S., but you are talking generational mobility and I understood that wasn't the example. It wasn't just living a comfortable life, but becoming part of the upper class. Also, many of the immigrants who started businesses in the u.s had money or access to money that people in the underclass don't possess.

The only guy I can think of who truly came from nothing to be very sucessful is Cesar Milan who came to this country as a illegal immigrant and worked his way up through lousy jobs into a tv show about dogs, but he's not fabulously wealthy. I guess there are sports figures who might fit this description too. And I am sure there are others as well, but it isn't an every day story and there are a gajillion people in the u.s. who work their butts off but still are living paycheck to paycheck. Simply working hard is not a guarantee of monetary success.

My reference to "Americans - past and present" is not about generational money. The Vietnamese boat people was an example of an underclass who arrived in the US in the 70's with zilch. The "present" group I know about are children whose parents aren't legal citizens of the US, who are at poverty levels and who - through enormous hard work and dedication - will be attending Ivy league colleges majoring in science and engineering because it's their dream to do so.

I don't know who proposed the notion that working hard was any guarantee of monetary success. The examples I provided are of people who had to work hard - and by this I mean focus on their studies and do well in school - in order to move on to higher educations that provide them the basis necessary to make their fortunes. They learned the value of hard work - and to focus on what they want - from their parents.

The Rockefellers, Mellons, Carnegies, Frisks are not everyday occurences here in America or anywhere in the world. They are the exceptions and examples of what people can do if they put their minds to it as is the case with Cesar Milan. Milan, by the way, never referred to his first job in America working for two women who owned a dog grooming store in San Diego as "lousy." He thanked them in a moving passage in his book for helping him. Perhaps that's the difference between Cesar Milan and those who do not find their fortune - no matter how large or small - it's all in how you see it.

Santorofan
08-25-2007, 10:56 PM
Believe me nobody wants to be an american, but sometimes the desperation gets you there... and then you do not have a choice. Do you really think that the people from Latin America goes there to be threated with disrespect? Open your eyes, moron!

I repeat, I am lucky I am not American!


"NOBODY wants to be an American"...hmmm, thanks for speaking for the entire planet there :rolleyes: If people hated being American so much, why aren't tidal waves of folks leaving on an hourly basis and heading for oh say, Luxemburg?????? Oh yeh, because almost nobody has ever even heard of the place. Is that why you're feeling so insecure and envious?

Despite what you assume, not every Latin American (Asian, etc) who immigrates to the USA is "desperate." How insulting to families like my own who sacrificed so much to come here. Get a clue and stop making huge ASS-umptions about nuanced issues like American immigration that you clearly know nothing about ;)

Tennis Fool
08-25-2007, 11:11 PM
My reference to "Americans - past and present" is not about generational money. The Vietnamese boat people was an example of an underclass who arrived in the US in the 70's with zilch. The "present" group I know about are children whose parents aren't legal citizens of the US, who are at poverty levels and who - through enormous hard work and dedication - will be attending Ivy league colleges majoring in science and engineering because it's their dream to do so.

I don't know who proposed the notion that working hard was any guarantee of monetary success. The examples I provided are of people who had to work hard - and by this I mean focus on their studies and do well in school - in order to move on to higher educations that provide them the basis necessary to make their fortunes. They learned the value of hard work - and to focus on what they want - from their parents.

The Rockefellers, Mellons, Carnegies, Frisks are not everyday occurences here in America or anywhere in the world. They are the exceptions and examples of what people can do if they put their minds to it as is the case with Cesar Milan. Milan, by the way, never referred to his first job in America working for two women who owned a dog grooming store in San Diego as "lousy." He thanked them in a moving passage in his book for helping him. Perhaps that's the difference between Cesar Milan and those who do not find their fortune - no matter how large or small - it's all in how you see it.
True, but how you see things may come from the experiences you gain in working ;)
The hard work belief was brought to us by the Puritans, reinforced by people like
that guy in the 1800s (name's suddenly escaped me :unsure:, and propagated by the self-help industry and books like the "Secret".

Anyway, no one wants to admit that a lot of material success comes from luck and to bring this back around to tennis, if your ball hits your side of the net cord.

Sjengster
08-25-2007, 11:28 PM
True, but how you see things may come from the experiences you gain in working ;)
The hard work belief was brought to us by the Puritans, reinforced by people like
that guy in the 1800s (name's suddenly escaped me :unsure:, and propagated by the self-help industry and books like the "Secret".

Anyway, no one wants to admit that a lot of material success comes from luck and to bring this back around to tennis, if your ball hits your side of the net cord.

Benjamin Franklin? Actually, that may be completely off-base. Still, isn't it remarkable to have generated such an interesting cultural discussion from such humble beginnings? I wonder if constant reference to Federer's quotes could spark a similar debate on other great issues.

NYCtennisfan
08-25-2007, 11:36 PM
I cant think of a modern day American who meets the description of coming from nothing to enormous wealth, and don't have any personal experience, ;), but from what I read, there are vastly rich who have been rich for generations who don't accept newcomers to their clubs. But you are right it is probably different in the U.K. because there isn't the overlay of aristocracy in the U.S.

I guess each of us just has to get fabulously wealthy to test out our theories. :) :)

There are actually quite a few. There aren't too many who came from 'nothing', but quite a few who came from modest means to become extraoridinarily wealthy. They all seem to wind up here in the city. :) I know some kids here on Wall Street who started off in a 'small' town in India, tested into an IIT, came to graduate school here on scholarship, got an MBA, work in some hedge fund or one of the big banks and now make more money than the village they came from.

There are entire castes of people with inherited wealth, but there is now an even bigger class of wealthy that are 1st generation rich.

PamV
08-26-2007, 12:13 AM
The main thing to notice is that Roger said "But I also see the glass as half full" meaning that what ever his situation is he will see it as positive. So why would he lament not being American? Roger's style is not to look at what he doesn't have..... it's to appreciate what he does have.

I am not sure if he needs more endorsements any way.

scoobs
08-26-2007, 12:17 AM
I'm a member of RogerFederer.com and I got an August email update from the site today. There was a message from Roger (probably personally written to send out to his fans) where he's talking about how much he loves New York and it's one of his favourite cities.

So there are definitely aspects of America that he likes.

soraya
08-26-2007, 12:44 AM
There is an old saying: "If you want to know about america, ask a Native American"
:worship:that pretty much says it all.

Merton
08-26-2007, 01:25 AM
Nothing wrong with what Roger says, the burden of expectations for young Americans due to the previous great generation could be too much. The question was :retard: though.

jasmin
08-26-2007, 01:45 AM
I think he likes America and I like being an America but I do have some gripes about some things so I don't blame his comments. I also agree....all that expectation would be put on him like it is on Blake and especially Roddick. I'm glad that he doesn't have to deal with that but I appreciate Roger as an American. My mom also loves him but I think we are probably in the minority.

Winston's Human
08-26-2007, 04:32 AM
Actually, to be considered old money, going back just a few generations in the US is enough. Conrad Hilton came here from Europe in the mid-1800s and made his fortune along the likes of the Vanderbilts, Roosevelts,Gettys, Carnegies, et al. Only older families I can think of are Astors and Schemerhorns.


Conrad Hilton was born in New Mexico in 1887. He started his hotel business in the Texas oil fields after WWI.

Stensland
08-26-2007, 05:18 AM
thing is that there are 2 americas. if you go to the east coast or west coast, it's pretty much europe deluxe whereas the midwest for example (and i lived there for a year as an exchange student) is really narrow-minded when it comes to talking about the rest of the world. man, i can tell stories, but you won't believe me anyways.

this is something europe doesn't have to "offer". people usually know a lot more about the world itself. in america, for many citizens the world is america. period.

Chaos Inc.
08-26-2007, 06:07 AM
I cant think of a modern day American who meets the description of coming from nothing to enormous wealth, and don't have any personal experience, ;), but from what I read, there are vastly rich who have been rich for generations who don't accept newcomers to their clubs. But you are right it is probably different in the U.K. because there isn't the overlay of aristocracy in the U.S.

I guess each of us just has to get fabulously wealthy to test out our theories. :) :)


Sam Walton. Ray Kroc.

Ruski
08-26-2007, 06:17 AM
I am so glad that the current No.1 players on both ATP and WTA are not Americans!

Keep it going, Mr. Swiss Roger Federer!

Action Jackson
08-26-2007, 06:30 AM
It was a stupid question and Federer handled it quite well, it's not like Federer is lacking cash and endorsement deals and maybe Mirka just wants a bigger cut.

Fensler
08-26-2007, 06:50 AM
thing is that there are 2 americas. if you go to the east coast or west coast, it's pretty much europe deluxe whereas the midwest for example (and i lived there for a year as an exchange student) is really narrow-minded when it comes to talking about the rest of the world. man, i can tell stories, but you won't believe me anyways.

this is something europe doesn't have to "offer". people usually know a lot more about the world itself. in america, for many citizens the world is america. period.

In what part of the "Midwest" did you live, Rrrainer? You're painting with a rather broad brush via your conclusions. You lived in one town/city for a year, and you're generalizing about an area (the Midwest) that includes several states and many millions of people of various backgrounds. Are you sure that your experiences are comprehensive enough to allow for such definitive, categorical statements?

Stensland
08-26-2007, 07:01 AM
In what part of the "Midwest" did you live, Rrrainer?

bettendorf, iowa.

you may be right about my lack of experience, i actually didn't travel that much. but we were a group of about 10-15 students living in the u.s. (spread across the states) and most of them living in the midwest have been reporting pretty much the same things whereas people coming from the east coast for example were thrilled to go back there one day.

i'm not gonna go into details right now because it would be very ot, but those thing people talk about over here in europe (questions like "do you have television in europe?" etc.) are true to some extent. thought those things were just urban myths, badmouthing the states, but, you know, people did ask me stuff like that. and not just kids, grown-ups did. so all i'm saying is that america's got the "best" of everything: the brightest people on earth in silicon valley, new york and elsewhere, and probably the most stupid people on earth somewhere. guess that's why they call themselves a melting pot. ;)

Tennis Fool
08-26-2007, 07:50 AM
It was a stupid question and Federer handled it quite well, it's not like Federer is lacking cash and endorsement deals a

:rolleyes: You are always behind the times.

Action Jackson
08-26-2007, 08:02 AM
:rolleyes: You are always behind the times.

What is your problem honey? Yes, it was a stupid question and he handled it well, better than what lot of people handled it.

At least I am not a bandwagon jumper like you.

Fensler
08-26-2007, 08:04 AM
bettendorf, iowa.

you may be right about my lack of experience, i actually didn't travel that much. but we were a group of about 10-15 students living in the u.s. (spread across the states) and most of them living in the midwest have been reporting pretty much the same things whereas people coming from the east coast for example were thrilled to go back there one day.

i'm not gonna go into details right now because it would be very ot, but those thing people talk about over here in europe (questions like "do you have television in europe?" etc.) are true to some extent. thought those things were just urban myths, badmouthing the states, but, you know, people did ask me stuff like that. and not just kids, grown-ups did. so all i'm saying is that america's got the "best" of everything: the brightest people on earth in silicon valley, new york and elsewhere, and probably the most stupid people on earth somewhere. guess that's why they call themselves a melting pot. ;)

I'm sorry you had a disappointing experience as an exchange student.

Growing up in the Midwest, there were several European exchange students in my school. Some had good experiences; others apparently did not. It depended on the individual. I always felt bad for the ones who went back to Europe with negative feelings about the USA. Bad experiences dictate bad feelings.

But was everybody there as dumb as the people you described? I really doubt that they were. I don't blame you for being astounded and disgusted by the ignorance of those few, though. I would be too from your perspective. However, judging from my own knowledge of Europe, and the knowledge that many of my Midwestern friends have of Europe, I don't think those nitwits you described are the appropriate ambassadors for the region...at least I hope not. :)

Also, college towns - places like Ames, Iowa or Minneapolis, Minnesota or Champaign, Illinois - usually harbor people with a more worldly perspective than a random place like Bettendorf. I think you would have noticed a difference. Furthermore, Chicago provides an experience much more like NYC than say, Bettendorf, even though Chicago is also in the Midwest.

(As an aside, when I joined MTF, I didn't expect to be talking about Midwestern culture/geography in a thread about a Roger Federer interview. But maybe that's part of what makes this place interesting.)

Svetlana.
08-26-2007, 08:22 AM
bettendorf, iowa.

you may be right about my lack of experience, i actually didn't travel that much. but we were a group of about 10-15 students living in the u.s. (spread across the states) and most of them living in the midwest have been reporting pretty much the same things whereas people coming from the east coast for example were thrilled to go back there one day.

i'm not gonna go into details right now because it would be very ot, but those thing people talk about over here in europe (questions like "do you have television in europe?" etc.) are true to some extent. thought those things were just urban myths, badmouthing the states, but, you know, people did ask me stuff like that. and not just kids, grown-ups did. so all i'm saying is that america's got the "best" of everything: the brightest people on earth in silicon valley, new york and elsewhere, and probably the most stupid people on earth somewhere. guess that's why they call themselves a melting pot. ;)

There is definitely some truth in what you are saying. There is lack of international news/agenda in the USA. When I came to the States for the first time, I was surprised to find out that there is practically no news from around the world on American TV. There is of course some news, but only if Americans interests are involved like Iraq for instance. In contrary, in Europe you always can find a lot of diverse info on what is going on in the world even if it has nothing to do with your own country. So my point is the international agenda is not in demand in the States unless they are certain interests are involved.

Stensland
08-26-2007, 08:23 AM
well, i'm absolutely sure that there are loads of bright people in the midwest as well, you're definitely right about that. of course i met some nice people in bettendorf, too. but i had the slight feeling that overall, they'd be outnumbered by the, let's say, "mediocre" ones. on the east coast, i'd say the bright ones will probably outnumber the dumb ones easily, not only in posh colleges.

i hope all of this doesn't sound too sniffy; i'm not trying to claim intellectual superiority or anything like that, sorry.

Fensler
08-26-2007, 09:16 AM
There is definitely some truth in what you are saying. There is lack of international news/agenda in the USA. When I came to the States for the first time, I was surprised to find out that there is practically no news from around the world on American TV. There is of course some news, but only if Americans interests are involved like Iraq for instance. In contrary, in Europe you always can find a lot of diverse info on what is going on in the world even if it has nothing to do with your own country. So my point is the international agenda is not in demand in the States unless they are certain interests are involved.

I agree with your last sentence. I wish more Americans would demand international news in general. However, the internet is slowly changing that situation. Younger Americans are more in touch with world events now, I think, because of online interactions with people from various other countries. This, in turn, leads to a heightened interest in world events. And then they find themselves wanting to know about what's going in Europe, Asia, etc.

America still has a long way to go in that regard (as Europeans rightly point out), but I think that younger Americans are more worldly now than they were 10-15 years ago - even if only by a little bit.

Fensler
08-26-2007, 09:26 AM
well, i'm absolutely sure that there are loads of bright people in the midwest as well, you're definitely right about that. of course i met some nice people in bettendorf, too. but i had the slight feeling that overall, they'd be outnumbered by the, let's say, "mediocre" ones. on the east coast, i'd say the bright ones will probably outnumber the dumb ones easily, not only in posh colleges.

i hope all of this doesn't sound too sniffy; i'm not trying to claim intellectual superiority or anything like that, sorry.

You don't come across as too sniffy. You're just basing this off of your brief experiences. I can't blame you for that.

And as much as I hate to admit it, some of my Midwestern cohorts do need to educate themselves to a much better degree about world geography and culture. They're not inherently stupid; they're just ignorant by choice (which is also bad). I still think your opinion was unfortunately influenced by some of the worst of the bunch, though. It's too late to change that now, of course.

Stensland
08-26-2007, 09:56 AM
They're not inherently stupid; they're just ignorant by choice (which is also bad).

yep, absolutely. i guess my posting was kinda misleading to some extent: i didn't mean to say the midwest harbours the stupid. as you say, they just don't really care a lot about the rest of the world because they're fine within their boundaries. in that respect they (to by-standers) resemble for example with the way bavarians are depicted in germany. northern germans tend to think of them as stubborn, ignorant of the rest of germany, traditionalists, churchfreaks etc...yet bavaria's our economic powerhouse with loads of highly-educated people. sure, villages and small towns might have ignorant inhabitants who couldn't care less about the rest around them, but that of course doesn't mean that all bavarians (i.e. midwesterners) are like that.

ilovemarat
08-26-2007, 10:03 AM
Very good answer for a very stupid question :D I think Federer is a patriot... Besides that, he is the only Swiss tennis player to achieve that great success in sport. He wants to stay unique and be an idol for the next generation. :p

Tess Gray
08-26-2007, 01:19 PM
I've lived in Houston for a while and you'd think because it's a big city that people are educated on the rest of the world. But really a lot aren't (of course there are exceptions).

And just like Rrrainer said, I've had people come up to me and ask things like: woooh, so you seriously also have a Shell in holland? (it's a dutch company). But also stuff like: so do you have like mobile phones over there as well... (and they were completely serious.) I can think of many more examples to tell y'all. I think European people are much more aware of the world.

But of course there are also the americans who are 'ashamed' of their country and whatnot, I've met those too and those were really amazing people. A lot like europeans with the way they think, feel etc.

There's a good and a bad side to everything I guess :)

tennis2tennis
08-26-2007, 03:59 PM
one thing is for sure South Carolina (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lj3iNxZ8Dww) has alot to answer for :lol:

PamV
08-26-2007, 04:07 PM
It was a stupid question and Federer handled it quite well, it's not like Federer is lacking cash and endorsement deals and maybe Mirka just wants a bigger cut.

There was no other way to respond than how Roger answered. Roger is patriotic and loves being Swiss. He's not going to say he wished he was American so he could make more money. Wouldn't that alienate his own Swiss fans and probably the rest of Europe? Furthermore....the whole question is very small minded and ethnocentric on the part of who ever asked it. No doubt the reporter couldn't think of anything interesting to ask.

Tennis Fool
08-26-2007, 04:49 PM
What is your problem honey? Yes, it was a stupid question and he handled it well, better than what lot of people handled it.

At least I am not a bandwagon jumper like you.

Lucky you're a moderator and I can't put you on ignore.

The_Nadal_effect
08-26-2007, 04:56 PM
Reasonable question, good answer. Noone is saying Roger should change his citizenshop or live in the USA. The USA is not perfect, but more people from all over the world are risking their lives to get here. No other country offers so much opportunity to the poor of the world as the USA does.

No kidding, this post!

U2 took six albums to get there. :yeah:

Purple Rainbow
08-26-2007, 05:09 PM
one thing is for sure South Carolina (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lj3iNxZ8Dww) has alot to answer for :lol:

"I personally believe that U.S. Americans are unable to do so because, uhmmm, some people out there in our nation don't have maps and uh, I believe that our, I, education like such as uh, South Africa, and uh, the Iraq, everywhere like such as, and I believe that they should, uhhh, our education over here in the US should help the US, uh, should help South Africa, it should help the Iraq and the Asian countries so we will be able to build up our future, for us."

:worship:

CyBorg
08-26-2007, 06:52 PM
Tell us what you really think, Roger.

Just admit you can't stand the Yanks. :-)

Bremen
08-26-2007, 07:11 PM
one thing is for sure South Carolina (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lj3iNxZ8Dww) has alot to answer for :lol:

That was glorious....:worship: :worship: :worship:

guy in sf
08-26-2007, 07:44 PM
I think it's a very intelligent and respectable response to a "tricky" question. Is the interviewer Swiss too? if so, it's surprising that they have the same feeling about American journalism and our overall bloated sense of self importance. Just the other day on local TV, a sports newsman in the bay area said that he felt Federer is already more dominant in tennis than Woods is in golf and I thought that was very true and ballsy of this guy to say something that's rarely heard from the American press. Have you guys seen the American Gillette/shaving razor commercial? They feature Fed, Thierry Henry (soccer) and they show Tiger Woods last and have him stand in the middle between Henry and Fed, to suggest that he's the greatest of the 3.

Bobby
08-26-2007, 08:17 PM
"NOBODY wants to be an American"...hmmm, thanks for speaking for the entire planet there :rolleyes: If people hated being American so much, why aren't tidal waves of folks leaving on an hourly basis and heading for oh say, Luxemburg?????? Oh yeh, because almost nobody has ever even heard of the place. Is that why you're feeling so insecure and envious?

Despite what you assume, not every Latin American (Asian, etc) who immigrates to the USA is "desperate." How insulting to families like my own who sacrificed so much to come here. Get a clue and stop making huge ASS-umptions about nuanced issues like American immigration that you clearly know nothing about ;)

Why would you assume almost nobody has heard of Luxembourg?? One has to be pretty ignorant to say something like that! We all have our opinions, but you have to admit that USA is not a very popular country at the moment.

Svetlana.
08-26-2007, 09:40 PM
Why would you assume almost nobody has heard of Luxembourg?? One has to be pretty ignorant to say something like that! We all have our opinions, but you have to admit that USA is not a very popular country at the moment.

Santorofan had probably Americans in mind because only a few of them can find Luxembourg on the world map. :rolleyes:

wcr
08-27-2007, 01:12 AM
True, but how you see things may come from the experiences you gain in working ;)
The hard work belief was brought to us by the Puritans, reinforced by people like
that guy in the 1800s (name's suddenly escaped me :unsure:, and propagated by the self-help industry and books like the "Secret".

Anyway, no one wants to admit that a lot of material success comes from luck and to bring this back around to tennis, if your ball hits your side of the net cord.

Life is what you make of it. The experiences you take from work, school, play have everything to do with how you see the world around you. It is your value system that interprets and sorts inbound data. It is your choice what you do with what you learn and how you let it affect you. It's your choice what you want to make of your life.

There's this quote I hear frequently on tennis courts - and mostly from amateurs - that goes like this "Who needs to be good if you're lucky?" My answer has always been "Who needs luck if you're good?" I really have no clue what luck is. I understand how some people call a person lucky but what I see is a person who creates more opportunities for themselves with focus and dedication and a great sense of timing.

And, bringing it back around to tennis, timing is everything.

wcr
08-27-2007, 01:16 AM
Nothing wrong with what Roger says, the burden of expectations for young Americans due to the previous great generation could be too much. The question was :retard: though.

Brilliant. You got it!

DhammaTiger
08-27-2007, 01:18 AM
I don't think Federer is anti- American at all. I for one don't understand why this bashing of
Americans has erupted in this thread. George W. Bush does not represent all americans, and all Americans are not responsible for the horrible policies their government makes. I have been against US foreign policy since my time in American Universities, but I don't take it out on individual Americans? I was happy during the four years I spent in the US, and all the subsequent visits I made until the year 2000. Since then I have never been to USA, but it doesn't mean that I never enjoyed my time there. I owe my world view to the time i spent in the US and in the company of Americans. To be honest wherever I have lived, whether in my home country or now in Thailand, the closest friends I have are Americans. Americans have been kind and generous with me and i get along with them absolutely fine. I dislike the politics of the US government but love the ordinary American people. They have their faults, just like I have my faults, because, we are all human.
I refuse to generalize like most people on GM do.

Rafa = Fed Killa
08-27-2007, 03:56 AM
I am not a Federer fan but good for him.
Being American is the lowest form of humankind.

God Bless every country except USA

NYCtennisfan
08-27-2007, 04:11 AM
I am not a Federer fan but good for him.
Being American is the lowest form of humankind.

God Bless every country except USA

:lol:

Action Jackson
08-27-2007, 04:11 AM
Lucky you're a moderator and I can't put you on ignore.

Stop being a bitch, got any more misleading thread titles to try and create message board controversy.

Tennis Fool
08-27-2007, 04:57 AM
Stop being a bitch,

Any more foul language you want to use moderator :rolleyes:

Tennis Fool
08-27-2007, 04:59 AM
"Who needs luck if you're good?"

See my signature :)

Aerion
08-27-2007, 05:08 AM
Doesn't Maria Sharapova say she's not American; she is from Russia? :worship: She just lives here most of the time. :eek: But she's proud of her heritage. That's not wrong. :wavey:

MCL
08-27-2007, 05:15 AM
I am not a Federer fan but good for him.
Being R=FK is the lowest form of humankind.


:sad: :sad: Hey there little fellow - don't get so down on yourself. :hug:

Johnny Groove
08-27-2007, 05:21 AM
I am not a Federer fan but good for him.
Being American is the lowest form of humankind.

God Bless every country except USA

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :retard: :retard: :retard: :retard: :retard: :retard: :retard: :retard: :retard: :retard:

Bremen
08-27-2007, 06:02 AM
I am not a Federer fan but good for him.
Being American is the lowest form of humankind.

God Bless every country except USA

Let the light bathe us all in it's perfect glow!!!!:worship: :worship: :worship:

bayvalle
08-27-2007, 07:37 AM
No kidding, this post!

U2 took six albums to get there. :yeah:
Agree, although Lennon and his band only took ONE single (I Want To Hold Your Hand) to get there. Thanks for the info about U2. Nice guy, that Bono.

tennis2tennis
08-27-2007, 07:48 AM
one thing is for sure South Carolina (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lj3iNxZ8Dww) has alot to answer for :lol:

Dmitry Tursunov kinda agrees about South Carolinaians (made up word)
atp blogg (http://www.atptennis.com/5/en/blog/tursunov/2.asp)
Phone Call
Do any of you have friends who are way too bubbly?! You know, the kinds that are really nice and happy all the time but then… they are happy ALL the time! The type of people that you’ll see laughing at funerals because they can’t help themselves, and where you HAVE to use exclamation points after every sentence when you quote them because that is exactly how they talk. In general people with that type of personality are fun to be around but in certain situations I secretly wish it was legal to strangle them!

Well, I have a friend like that who calls me from S. Carolina at around 11.30PM screaming into the phone, “Hiiiiiii!!!! You missed me?!”, “Where are you?!?!”
“Umm…. I’m in Toronto.” – I answer, “Its 11.30 here… Kinda late…”
“Oh, it’s the same time there?!” – She says.
“Well, I guess…” – I say (a bit sarcastically).

So this is what she asks me next! Keep in mind that she lives in South Carolina and is now aware of the fact that Toronto and South Carolina are in the same time zone. She says, “Is Toronto on a West Coast or East Coast?!”

Lillith
08-27-2007, 01:27 PM
I think that it is part of the American myth that anyone who works hard and has talent can get to the top. That is clearly not true. There are a very few people in modern day America who can scrape themselves up by their bootstraps. More and more America is becoming stratified by wealth. The aftermath of world war two was a great leveler in the nation because all of the war veterans were given the opportunity for education and education at some very good schools. That and the great depression significantly changed social stratification. But it's hard to look in the eye of some kid in the inner city where his school is a war zone and his neighborhood is even worse and say, "all it takes is hard work and talent, son."


Thank you for a very good, measured response. The American Dream (or myth as you call it) has been sold to the world, and they seem to believe it more than many Americans these days. Absent Hollywood, sports or the lottery, how many kids who grow up in Houston's 5th ward, New Orleans' 9th ward or South Central LA are really ever going to have the same opportunity as the kid who grew up in Boston's Beacon Hill? It's hard to tell someone to pull themselves up by their bootstraps if they have no boots.

Lillith
08-27-2007, 01:30 PM
I don't think the question was about whether or not he loves America , it's about getting greater recognition and money had he been American...look at Roddick he hasn't won half the tournaments Roger has, but he's making so much more money in endorsement deals! But like Roger answered he doesn't have to deal with the 'death of US tennis' that Roddick gets thrown at him in every interview!


Roddick was supposed to be The Second Coming of Sampras. Tood bad for him that the fast court conditions of the 1990s disappeared not long after his tennis maturity.

I agree, I'm sure he feels quite a bit more pressure than many on the tour, and that was mostly to what Federer was alluding.

Lillith
08-27-2007, 01:44 PM
thing is that there are 2 americas. if you go to the east coast or west coast, it's pretty much europe deluxe whereas the midwest for example (and i lived there for a year as an exchange student) is really narrow-minded when it comes to talking about the rest of the world. man, i can tell stories, but you won't believe me anyways.

this is something europe doesn't have to "offer". people usually know a lot more about the world itself. in america, for many citizens the world is america. period.


As it is with any Empire. Though I am not trying to bash the US here, I do have to say that we are too powerful for our own good. We don't have to worry about the rest of the world because of our political and military power, unfortunately. Once the fall happens (and it always does) and India/China battle for supremacy, the US will hopefully mellow a little into a blending of the better aspects of US and Europe. (leave me alone- I can dream!)

Stensland
08-27-2007, 02:29 PM
don't worry, lillith, the same guy that predicted the downfall of the soviets first (1970s) now bets on the collapse of the usa in the near future (emmanuel todd). so to that effect, all you have to to is wait. ;)

jasmin
08-30-2007, 02:11 AM
If Fed didn't love the Yanks as some put it then why would he like MJ and Shaq.

Gonzo Hates Me!
08-30-2007, 03:03 AM
Federer is a guy who likes being the center of attention. He's not ostentatious or conspicuous about it, but he likes being THE SHIT. And who wouldn't wanna be the shit in the US.

But I don't get why this issue is such a recycled fuss. He's not even saying anything remotely gossip-worthy. It's the truth what he says, and furthermore, he can not change where he is born. Of course he is gonna have more success and endorsements outside of the USA. Just like Andy Roddick's endorsements have all been inside the states. Unless you're a blonde Russian female (and we're even selective about our blonde Russian females), then you'll probably never be a star in America. American tennis players aren't even stars here, so I doubt any non-American cares all that much about not being big in the US. So I dunno why people make so much fuss about this issue. I think the only people who are upset with their status in the US are the American players. None of them are Agassi

tangerine_dream
08-30-2007, 04:16 AM
I'm not even sure how this turned into this anti-American (which everyone will claim it's not) bs.
Because your troll twin tennis2tennis deliberately set it up that way with the misleading title.

nobama
08-30-2007, 04:21 AM
Because your troll twin tennis2tennis deliberately set it up that way with the misleading title.
And you're trolling right now by bumping this thread.

tangerine_dream
08-30-2007, 04:45 AM
And you're trolling right now by bumping this thread.
Thread was already bumped.

buddyholly
08-30-2007, 04:49 AM
The title of the thread does not seem related to what Federer actually said, and is more likely what you wished he had said..

tennis2tennis
08-30-2007, 07:39 AM
Because your troll twin tennis2tennis deliberately set it up that way with the misleading title.

The title of the thread does not seem related to what Federer actually said, and is more likely what you wished he had said..

jeez don't shoot the messanger I didn't give it the title people that's what it read in the Swiss-German station!