Abracadabra [Archive] - Page 58 - MensTennisForums.com

Abracadabra


Dissident
12-11-2002, 01:01 AM
Oh my God, look at this:

In my tree

Up here in my tree. Yeah.
Newspapers matter not to me. Yeah.
No, no more crowbars to my head. Yeah.
I'm trading stories with the leaves instead. Yeah.

I wave to all my friends. Yeah.
They don't seem to notice me. No.
Ah, their eyes strait on the street. Yo! Oh...
Sidewalks cigarettes and seams. Yeah. Yeah...

Up here so high I start to shake.
Up here so high the sky I scrape.
I'm so high I hold just one breath deep within my chest just like innocence.

(Eddie's down in his home)
(Oh, the blue sky it's his home)
(Eddie's blue sky home)
(Oh, the blue sky it's his home)

I remember when, yeah, I swore I knew everything. Oh, yeah.
They say knowledge is a tree. Yeah.
It's growing up just like me. Yeah.

I'm so light the wind me shakes.
I'm so high the sky I scrape.
Yea, I'm so high I hold just one breath, to go back to my nest, to sleep with innocence.

Up here so high the boughs they break.
Up here so high the sky I scrape.
And my eyes feel both wide open.
And I got a glimpse of my inner sense.
Got back my innocence. Still got it. Still got it.

:D

Dissident
12-11-2002, 01:03 AM
What kind of song are you looking for, it would help. ;)

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 01:06 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
What kind of song are you looking for, it would help. ;)

Well, I don't know yet I don't have a long-range plan, really. The songs you've posted are quite nice, though :)

I'm working on ideas for the final at Palermo, but after that? Not really much to report. Waiting for Layla to come up with ideas, too. That's half the fun of the story, knowing that you aren't completely in control :D

Lee
12-11-2002, 01:08 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
Hi Lee! We are on some sort of "Find the Lyrics" quest. ;)

How´s Vince doing?

I leave all these lyrics to you 2. I am not good at it.

Vince is doing fine. He is the shephed in his class Nativity Pageant today. I have everything on video, unfortunately, mine is not a digital. Also, my hubby was in a meeting whole afternoon with all directors and VPs in his department so he was not there.

Dissident, about a question you have this afternoon in the post about the new coach of your team, I think the word is 'trainer'. I am too lazy to find the page and quote it.

Dissident
12-11-2002, 01:09 AM
I see... Well, Im gonna throw some ideas here, like Im doing then. ;)

Dissident
12-11-2002, 01:10 AM
Oh, good to know that Lee. :)

Thanks for the help with the team thing. :)

Dissident
12-11-2002, 01:15 AM
One more candidate. Is someone abandoning some other one any time soon?? :p

Light Years

I've used hammers made out of wood.
I have played games with pieces and rules.
I undeciphered tricks at the bar.
But now you're gone. I haven't figured out why.
I've come up with riddles and jokes about war.
I figured out numbers and what they're for.
I've understood feelings and I've understood words but how could you be taken away?

And wherever you've gone and wherever we might go.
It don't seem fair. Today just disappeared.
Your lights reflected now. Reflected from afar.
We were but stones. Your light made us stars.

With heavy breath awakened regrets.
Back pages and days alone that could have been spent together but we were miles apart.
Every inch between us becomes light years now.
No time to be void or save up on life.
Oh, you got to spend it all.

And wherever you've gone and wherever we might go.
It don't seem fair. You seam to like it here.
Your lights reflected now. Reflected from afar.
We were but stones. Your light made us stars.

And wherever you've gone and wherever we might go.
It don't seem fair. Today just disappeared.
Your lights reflected now. Reflected from afar.
We were by stones. Your light made us stars.


I love the stones and light part. ;)

Lee
12-11-2002, 01:16 AM
I may. I am torn between leave right now to watch last part of Gilmore Girl or staying here.

Dissident
12-11-2002, 01:23 AM
Oh, this version of Daughter has over 7 minutes!! :eek:

Lee
12-11-2002, 01:24 AM
Bye Dissident & TH! :wavey:

Vince want ice-cream and it's RIGHT NOW!

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 01:27 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
One more candidate. Is someone abandoning some other one any time soon?? :p

Nope :D But maybe it could be symbolic? Perhaps at the finalizaton of Layla and Juanqui's marriage :D

Dissident
12-11-2002, 01:27 AM
Bye bye Lee! :wavey:
Take care!

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 01:28 AM
LOL, bye Lee! :wavey:

hitman, wow!! :eek::eek:

If I disappear for long stretches of time, it's cause I'm working on the finale :D

Dissident
12-11-2002, 01:28 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack


Nope :D But maybe it could be symbolic? Perhaps at the finalizaton of Layla and Juanqui's marriage :D

I dunno, you are the boss. At least untill Layla comes to share the place with you. ;)

Dissident
12-11-2002, 01:31 AM
Dont mind me... Ill keep my little Jam Session going, lol

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 01:32 AM
LOL, okay. Yeah, keep brainstorming songsies for me :D

Dissident
12-11-2002, 01:37 AM
Hmm, is Juanqui facing some internal crisis?? :p

Sleight of Hand

Routine was the theme. He'd wake up wash and pour himself into uniform.
Something he hadn't imagined being.
As the merging traffic passed he found himself staring down at his own hands.
Not remembering the change. Not recalling the plan. Was it?

He was okay but wondering about wandering.
Was his age by consequence or was he moved by sleight of hand?

Mondays were made to fall. Lost on a road he knew by heart.
It was like a book he read in his sleep. Endlessly.
Sometimes he hid in the radio watching others pull into their homes.
While he was drifting.

On a line of his own. Off the line of the side. Bye the by.
As dirt turned to sand. As if moved by sleight of hand.

When he reached the shore of his clip on world he resurfaced to the norm.
Organized his few things. His coat and keys.
And he knew realizations would have to wait.
Till he had more time. More time.

A time to dream to himself. He waves goodbye to his self.
I'll see you on the other side.
Another man moved by sleight of hand.

Dissident
12-11-2002, 02:04 AM
lol McCready on the song Save You

"It just came from a guitar riff that I had," McCready said. "When we got together to work on the record, I brought in two ideas. One idea I worked really hard on and I thought it was really cool. I showed it to [guitarist] Stone [Gossard], and he goes, 'Um, you got anything else.' And so I went, 'OK, sh--. And I played him the 'Save You' riff, and he seemed excited about that."

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 02:05 AM
LOL!! Stone kills me :D

Dissident
12-11-2002, 02:08 AM
http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1459076/20021209/audioslave.jhtml?headlines=true

LOL! :D Check this out Hackie! I like Creed less and less each minute...

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 02:17 AM
"Beck and the Flaming Lips followed by Coldplay provided a few hours of envelope-pushing — so much that when headliners Creed took the stage afterward, they were met with boos and half the venue clearing out.

In all fairness, Creed would have likely been a hit on Saturday's bill, but singer Scott Stapp didn't score sympathy points when he stormed offstage during the first song because his mic wasn't working. He returned, but the set felt off."

What a prima donna! :rolleyes:

Beck :hearts: Coldplay :hearts: Even though Chris Martin (lead singer of Coldplay) is apparently dating Gwenyth Paltrow -- yuck! :(

Dissident
12-11-2002, 02:23 AM
Its somewhere on mtv.com that PJ is trying to put Audioslave on tour with them. Oh God, I wanna be at the US!!!! :sad:

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 02:28 AM
WHOA! :eek: That'd be sooooooooo cool!! A dream tour!!

I really wanted Ben Folds Five, Beck and DMB to do a show together. Right before they broke up, BF5 & Beck did a show in California somewhere, and I totally missed it :(

I'm sure you'll find a way to see them, in person or otherwise ;)

Dissident
12-11-2002, 02:30 AM
I just read a report on their show last night , and it made me be able to kill to see them here... :mad: :p lol

Maybe you will get your dream show someday. We never know... :D

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 02:39 AM
Well, Ben Folds Five broke up :( and DMB really leaves something to be desired . . .

I'd go see Beck in a heartbeat, especially if he and Coldplay struck up a deal :D

Dissident
12-11-2002, 02:42 AM
Coldplay is goood! :D

Im sorry to hear the band broke up. :sad:

Im tired, Ill go to bed I guess. :wavey:

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 02:55 AM
:eek: You just missed the final, then!

Oh, well . . .

:wavey: Goodnight!

Vera
12-11-2002, 03:42 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
Hi Becca! :wavey:

I was wondering about Vera too. She´s been absent for some time now.

VERA, IF YOURE AROUND, DROP BY TO SAY HI!! :(

Thanks for asking, Becca and Dissident!

I'm here. Just battling crisis with myself, I'm feeling very down so I can't bring myself to come here to talk, I'm afraid I might bring down you guys too :sad:. Anyway, when I feel better, I'll come around again.

Now I must go. Bye. :wavey:

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 04:54 AM
Originally posted by Vera
I'm here. Just battling crisis with myself, I'm feeling very down so I can't bring myself to come here to talk, I'm afraid I might bring down you guys too :sad:. Anyway, when I feel better, I'll come around again.

Now I must go. Bye. :wavey:

:sad::sad::sad:

I hope everything's okay :( If you need to talk, feel free to email or PM me.

Here's hoping you find your way back soon, cause we miss you! *hug*

ILR
12-11-2002, 09:48 AM
Hello :wavey:

anyone around?

ILR
12-11-2002, 09:53 AM
Originally posted by Vera


Thanks for asking, Becca and Dissident!

I'm here. Just battling crisis with myself, I'm feeling very down so I can't bring myself to come here to talk, I'm afraid I might bring down you guys too :sad:. Anyway, when I feel better, I'll come around again.

Now I must go. Bye. :wavey:

:(:( oh Vera,hope you feel better soon,we will always be here when you feel like it :)

Layla
12-11-2002, 11:05 AM
Morning folks! :wavey:

I've read all your posts over breakfast ;) but sadly, I don't have time to respond to them now because I have to go back to work. I did enjoy them immensely though: :D I'll try to be back later.

Vera, I'm really sorry to hear you're feeling so down. :sad: :sad: :sad: I hope you feel better soon. My depressions usually come in waves and they tend to dissappear in a few days. But what TH said goes for me too. Whenever you want to talk, you can PM me. I think it's always better to talk to someone when you're feeling down, even if it is only on the internet. So please don't stay away from the board just because you don't want to bring us down. :( We're here to help each other get through the tough times, among other things. :)

ILR
12-11-2002, 11:08 AM
Hi Layla :wavey:

lol just when I thought I had someone to talk to before I go out in a bit!Oh well never mind Ill try and come back later.

RogiFan
12-11-2002, 02:22 PM
Originally posted by Leo7
hey guys! great news! i just ordered my two tapes today from Sports Resources (Roma 2001 Juanqui/Guga final and Wimby 1999 Davy/Graf final :D). i'm so excited! but they won't come in the mail for another 28 days, so i'll just have to be patient... *sigh*

Hi Leo! :)

Did you order these online w a cc? Is this the UK site? How much in USD for one match? Same price for all matches or does the price vary? The Roma01 final is a match that I stupidly gave up on and erased [worse, as I said before, I left in disgust at Juanqui -- some faith I had in him!!!] so I too will have to PAY! Is this Brit coverage btw? Curious...

Can't wait to hear about these tapes: quality, completeness of match, extras [interviews, etc.]!

Hi Hackie!

Was watching the Cincy02 final and Carlos' GF Patricia was in the stands w his coach -- I like his coach -- he looks like a gypsy w that long s&p hair -- very animated guy! I'd like to meet him and Carlos!

Vera:

Hope you're feeling up to posting later -- I'm here now and then too, for support!

Hi ILR!

Lee
12-11-2002, 02:42 PM
Good morning from Arizona! :wavey:

Another sunny day in Scottsdale! :) :)

My stupid alarm went on strike this morning. Usually I was awake before it's on but this morning, when I needed it most......Now I need my hubby to drive Vince to school.

It seems my cold never actually leave me and keep on sneaking up on me.

Lee
12-11-2002, 02:48 PM
Originally posted by TennisHack

Beck :hearts: Coldplay :hearts: Even though Chris Martin (lead singer of Coldplay) is apparently dating Gwenyth Paltrow -- yuck! :(

Don't worry! I read from some gossip columns that she only interest in those princes with a fancy title but nothing else. :D

Lee
12-11-2002, 02:53 PM
Originally posted by Vera


Thanks for asking, Becca and Dissident!

I'm here. Just battling crisis with myself, I'm feeling very down so I can't bring myself to come here to talk, I'm afraid I might bring down you guys too :sad:. Anyway, when I feel better, I'll come around again.

Now I must go. Bye. :wavey:

*hug* *hug* *hug*

Vera, hope your crisis will be over soon. You need not to worry about brining ppl down in this thread. It will be much better to talk about it to someone.

ILR
12-11-2002, 02:59 PM
Hi Lee :wavey: I know you're here and RF?Are you still around?Hi anyway :wavey:

I have done half my x-mas shopping and have a blister ob my toe from walking round town in my new beige boots.Serves me right!:p

RogiFan
12-11-2002, 03:09 PM
:( Poor ILR! Are there tons of crowds? I'm supposed to be working hard today since I'll be out tonight and part of the next day or Fri. So difficult to be motivated to work!

I watched the Rogi/Lleyton Shanghai match -- started in 2nd set. Boy that crowd is NOISY! I wonder if it affected the players' concentration. Both Rogi and Lleyton were making their fair share of errors. I'm glad that Rogi fought to win the 2nd set though -- I think eveyone thought Lleyton w/win in 2, incl. PMac! I think Rogi was feeling the pressure of being in a big semi, esp. vs. Lleyton.

Rogi looked very sleepy-eyed to me -- I kept telling him to wake up! Dreamy...:angel: I just hope that this experience gave him a taste of the big times out there -- so that he can deal w it next year. But you have to credit Lleyton -- he gets everything back and NEVER gives up.

But Rogi made some fantastic shots, didn't he? I LOVE to see those impossible angles! As the reviews said "those well-angled balls"! ;)

Lee
12-11-2002, 03:09 PM
Hi Emma! I was buried in the musical, you shouldn't miss it.

I still have lots of x-mas shopping to do.

Lee
12-11-2002, 03:11 PM
Hi RF! I still have those TMC tapes piled up in my room.....

ILR
12-11-2002, 03:13 PM
Rf,No there werent many crowds people were in school or working!But there was still quite a lot of people.It is difficult to be motivated around xmas.I woke up at 11am this morning!:p then tidied my room,went shopping and just back in.As for my blister well I wont be moving much tonight,if at all!:p

RogiFan
12-11-2002, 03:15 PM
Originally posted by Lee


Don't worry! I read from some gossip columns that she only interest in those princes with a fancy title but nothing else. :D

Hi Lee!

Is everybody "yukking" about Gwyneth? If so, I agree!!! YUK indeed! What is her problem? I never cared for her since "EMMA" [was it that film?] and "Shakespeare in Love" -- the impostor! :p

I saw some sports guy reporting from a beautiful sunny SW place -- I figured it was Arizona -- I was right! It was Scottsdale! It sure looks nice there!

ILR
12-11-2002, 03:19 PM
she bashes English men more than me!:eek:;)and now she has bagged according to rumours.:rolleyes:

Lee
12-11-2002, 03:22 PM
Originally posted by RogiFan


Hi Lee!

Is everybody "yukking" about Gwyneth? If so, I agree!!! YUK indeed! What is her problem? I never cared for her since "EMMA" [was it that film?] and "Shakespeare in Love" -- the impostor! :p

I saw some sports guy reporting from a beautiful sunny SW place -- I figured it was Arizona -- I was right! It was Scottsdale! It sure looks nice there!

Yes, this woman is ruthless. I read about she actually stole the script of "Shakespeare in Love" from Winona Ryder when they were friends and then stole the role from her. She used all her ex-boyfriends for career gain.

Scottsdale is very beautiful and sunny. I was driving home last night when the sun set and it's gorgeous.

Lee
12-11-2002, 03:44 PM
Where are Emma & RF?:( :( :(

ILR
12-11-2002, 03:55 PM
oooopsie Im here but I was having a very interesting convo on WTAworld with David about football I got carried away :o sorry

RogiFan
12-11-2002, 03:55 PM
:) Hi Lee!

I'm kind of working and posting at the same time! I was also checking other net stuff! Are you all finished w Christmas shopping? What do you eat for Christmas? Turkey and the usual or sth different? Lots of people don't like turkey but it IS lean!!

Lee
12-11-2002, 03:58 PM
Christmas shopping in US never stops!!!!!!!!!

I don't think I will have turkey. It will be a week before we can finish one, my guess. If I staying home, I probably have ham steak (instead of whole or half ham). We may go to the mountains here since I miss the snow but we not yet have any solid plan.

ILR
12-11-2002, 04:01 PM
sometimes we have turkey,chicken and lamb.We are very greedy.Sorry about before :o

RogiFan
12-11-2002, 04:08 PM
:) So ILR what's on in the UEFA Champions League today?? Will FC Barca play today? Real Madrid?? Did Valencia win vs. Arsenal? I'll check to see what coverage we get -- btw it's the Brit coverage but I don't know the guys' names -- their voices are familiar though -- one guy is N Irish.

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:08 PM
Originally posted by IluvRogi
sometimes we have turkey,chicken and lamb.We are very greedy.Sorry about before :o

What's to sorry about? :(

ILR
12-11-2002, 04:10 PM
for leaving you on your own!

Yes I did see it but it was 0-0 and Barca are suppossed to be playing tonight.We get Man u v Deportivo,but Milan are playing :D Is the man Gerry Armstrong by any chance?

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:12 PM
There's no need to feel sorry. I just wonder where are everyone. I am everywhere on the net too! :D :D

Actually, I am going through my Tae Kwon Do class web site to learn all those tenets and oath.

ILR
12-11-2002, 04:15 PM
thats OK then ;) that sounds like a good thing to be doing,so you're still enjoying it?

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:17 PM
Here's a pic for Emma

http://photo.eastday.com/epublish/gb/paper5/20021211/class000500004/image/img840930_1.jpg

RogiFan
12-11-2002, 04:19 PM
Originally posted by IluvRogi
for leaving you on your own!

Yes I did see it but it was 0-0 and Barca are suppossed to be playing tonight.We get Man u v Deportivo,but Milan are playing :D Is the man Gerry Armstrong by any chance?
It could be -- I'll check this pm!

Gotta run and have me lunch!

Catch you guys later!!

Just reading up on Safin stuff elsewhere and checking out Spanish news -- Vivi Ruano Pascual will be playing w Robredo in the Hopman Cup. Costa and Moya play a new Spanish tourney starting today in Valladolid, not far from Madrid. Corretja plays an exo I think in Lleida Fri -- Costa's hometown. And I think Rogi plays tomorrow in St-Anton!

that's it for the news!!

ILR
12-11-2002, 04:19 PM
:eek: is that Recoba??lol thankyou,is there any of the other Milan?;)

ILR
12-11-2002, 04:20 PM
bye RF :wavey:

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by IluvRogi
thats OK then ;) that sounds like a good thing to be doing,so you're still enjoying it?

Vince and I will have the test next week and will be a yellow belt then.

But once we are in yellow belt, we need to buy all those sparring gear like protective vest, helmet, something that protect the teeth and will have a big cut into the x-mas budget.

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:22 PM
Bye RF! :wavey:

ILR
12-11-2002, 04:24 PM
oh well buying all the stuff sounds exciting but buying everything does cost a lot.And good luck for your test!Hope you both get your belt.:)

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:26 PM
Originally posted by IluvRogi
:eek: is that Recoba??lol thankyou,is there any of the other Milan?;)

I have no idea. The web site use simplified Chinese which is quite difficult for me and also, the names were translated to Chinese which I know nothing about. I can guess the name of some teams that are quite famous but that's my limit.

How many teams with the name 'Milan'?

The other pix are (my best guess) Rome/Ajax and one from yesterday is ManU with ?

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:27 PM
Oops! Not ManU but Man City

ILR
12-11-2002, 04:29 PM
just 2 teams,Inter Milan-usually called Inter,and AC Milan-usually called AC,they are my favourite Italian team,they have some great players :)There could be pics from Ajax Roma,as that ws yesterday

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:29 PM
http://photo.eastday.com/epublish/gb/paper5/20021211/class000500004/image/img840917_2.jpg

http://photo.eastday.com/epublish/gb/paper5/20021210/class000500004/image/img839641_1.jpg

ILR
12-11-2002, 04:30 PM
oh yes,Man City played either last night,or the night before

ILR
12-11-2002, 04:31 PM
yes they are the ones

ILR
12-11-2002, 04:35 PM
well I must go now :wavey:

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:36 PM
Bye Emma! :wavey:

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 04:37 PM
Hallo, thread :wavey:

TH's Temperature Watch: 34F/1C with a wind chill of 30F/-1C . It is wintry-mixing here :D after snowing a bit this morning. It's heavy and slushy, and since there are no classes today no one bothered to salt the sidewalks :rolleyes: I practically slid to lunch.

Today is not going to be too busy; I just have to study (re: read) for my exam tomorrow. I'll probably be in and out, but I see there's a nice conversation going already so I'll jump right in :)

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:40 PM
Hi TH! :wavey:

Bravo to the musical! As I said before, it's getting better and better and better.......

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 04:42 PM
Originally posted by Lee
Yes, this woman is ruthless. I read about she actually stole the script of "Shakespeare in Love" from Winona Ryder when they were friends and then stole the role from her. She used all her ex-boyfriends for career gain.


:eek::eek: WHOA! That's nasty! I knew there was a reason I didn't feel right about her . . . she sounds like a real bitch. I hope Chris Martin dumps her ass before she tires of him. He deserves better :)

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 04:43 PM
Originally posted by Lee
Hi TH! :wavey:

Bravo to the musical! As I said before, it's getting better and better and better.......

Well, thank you! :o It didn't come out exactly like I wanted it, but I knew how much everyone wanted to see the final, so :) I'm glad you liked :)

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:45 PM
Originally posted by TennisHack


:eek::eek: WHOA! That's nasty! I knew there was a reason I didn't feel right about her . . . she sounds like a real bitch. I hope Chris Martin dumps her ass before she tires of him. He deserves better :)

TH! You find the right word to describe her.

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 04:46 PM
Originally posted by RogiFan
What do you eat for Christmas? Turkey and the usual or sth different? Lots of people don't like turkey but it IS lean!!

We have turkey, but lots of people have ham or goose. Italians eat eel :D but there's no way to get good eel here in the States. We do follow the traditional Italian Christmas Eve meal, which is fish and spaghetti and clam sauce :lick: :lick:

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:48 PM
Again, Miss Anna K is voted the sexist woman instead of best tennis player by a men's magazine in Brit.
http://photo.eastday.com/epublish/gb/paper215/47/class021500001/image/img840587_1.jpg

I have to read the script to find out it's her.

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 04:49 PM
:rolleyes: at Anna. (Oops, don't let hitman see that!) If she wants to be taken seriously as a player, maybe she should stop doing all these photo shoots -- just a thought.

Lee
12-11-2002, 04:50 PM
Originally posted by TennisHack


We have turkey, but lots of people have ham or goose. Italians eat eel :D but there's no way to get good eel here in the States. We do follow the traditional Italian Christmas Eve meal, which is fish and spaghetti and clam sauce :lick: :lick:

It sounds very yummy and I am HUNGRY and I run out of choc.!

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 04:51 PM
ILR, I hope your toe feels better! I do the same thing :o wear great new shoes on some ardous journey (like, to the mall) before breaking them in well.

:wavey: Hi, Layla! Can't wait to see your responses to the posts, especially the Weezer concert :) I hope you can come by and chat a bit with us today :)

Lee
12-11-2002, 05:05 PM
:D :D A pic for Dissident. She's at 32.

http://photo.eastday.com/epublish/gb/paper215/46/class021500001/image/img839693_1.jpg

ILR
12-11-2002, 06:37 PM
:wavey:

Hi again,my toe is OK,Im not walking anywhere tonight!I have to get used to them now,at least they looked good with my slighty ripped jeans ;)

Lee
12-11-2002, 06:39 PM
Hi Emma!

ILR
12-11-2002, 06:42 PM
Hi Lee :wavey:

still here huh ;) What are you up to?

Lee
12-11-2002, 06:44 PM
Just came back after surfing all over the world for a while. Nothing exciting after Miss K's pic :D :D

ILR
12-11-2002, 06:47 PM
lol OK,sounds exciting.Well I bought a chain today aswell with the money that my grandad left me :)

Lee
12-11-2002, 06:48 PM
Probably can't hang around tomorrow. I need to search all the stores to find more x-mas light. My hubby went to those megastores and can't find the ones we have hung so I have to try those smaller ones tomorrow. Otherwise, we have to take down those already hung.:mad: :mad:

ILR
12-11-2002, 06:50 PM
that sounds like a lot of fuss.Hope you can get some because I know I wouldnt feel like taking down all the lights and starting again!

Lee
12-11-2002, 06:52 PM
Originally posted by IluvRogi
lol OK,sounds exciting.Well I bought a chain today aswell with the money that my grandad left me :)

Sounds good! I guess it's like your grandad buy you x-mas present.

The skin on my neck is so sensitive now I can only wear chains with pure gold or silver. Since I moved here, I can't wear my favourite necklace anymore. :fiery: :fiery:

Lee
12-11-2002, 06:54 PM
Originally posted by IluvRogi
that sounds like a lot of fuss.Hope you can get some because I know I wouldnt feel like taking down all the lights and starting again!

You bet!

ILR
12-11-2002, 06:56 PM
yeah,I guess it is!:) Well its to remember him by anyway.The only thing I know is that this chain is a solid Italian Figoro chain.Thats too bad about your neck :(

Lee
12-11-2002, 06:59 PM
You don't have school till new year?

ILR
12-11-2002, 07:01 PM
yeah I do but today some people had a histriy exam but I dont take history so I had a day off :)

Lee
12-11-2002, 07:06 PM
This is a very long holiday! Any plan other than shopping? or lazying around? :D :D

ILR
12-11-2002, 07:08 PM
Im in tomorrow and everyday except Monday untill the 20th.On Monday me and my brother are planning to go shopping for presents for my mum,dad and grandma.Today i bought presents for my friends.

Lee
12-11-2002, 07:13 PM
Go shopping with your bro!!!:rolleyes:

I have never done anything like that.

ILR
12-11-2002, 07:14 PM
lol why not?I only ever do it round xmas though.

Lee
12-11-2002, 07:20 PM
My bros are the lousiest shoppers. The only guy I know who enjoy shopping is my hubby.:D :D

ILR
12-11-2002, 07:22 PM
well I think my brother just likes spending money :rolleyes:

Lee
12-11-2002, 07:24 PM
That explains why my hubby love to shop!!

ILR
12-11-2002, 07:27 PM
everywhere we go he wants to buy things,hes money crazy!Not that he has a lot of money to spend,which is why I dont understand him really!

RogiFan
12-11-2002, 07:27 PM
Originally posted by TennisHack


We have turkey, but lots of people have ham or goose. Italians eat eel :D but there's no way to get good eel here in the States. We do follow the traditional Italian Christmas Eve meal, which is fish and spaghetti and clam sauce :lick: :lick:

Hi Hackie!

I know about this meatless tradition. I once had Christmas Eve din at my Italian friend's family and we had just that: pesce, spaghetti alle vongole [sp?] and tons of other dishes! Tutto di buon gusto!

We kind of do that too in our family -- no meat.

ILR:

No, the commentators are Mike Hill and Tommy Smyth [N Irish guy]! Man U vs. Depor -- 1-0 when I last looked... vamos Deportivo La Coruna!! It's freezing there 0 degrees w a chilly wind off the Mersey...:p

Lee
12-11-2002, 07:28 PM
My hubby doesn't exactly like to buy lots of things but the things he wants cost megabucks.

Lee
12-11-2002, 07:30 PM
Hi RF! you're back!

How long with you gals hang around? I want to finish my Gilmore Girls tape.

See you later!

ILR
12-11-2002, 07:32 PM
Bye Lee :wavey: and Hi Rf :wavey:

oh right thats the guy.Yes it is 1-0 but they scored twice,Van Nisterlrooy getting his goal wiped out for a supposed push on the Keeper.I hope AC are winning,remember ages ago after we went out of the CL I adopted them ;)

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 07:38 PM
Hi, again, all, just taking a short break from my extensive readings. I hope to finish them so I can read an extra chapter on language that we didn't go over, about bilingualism. I'll report if I find anything especially interesting :)

ILR
12-11-2002, 07:40 PM
Hi Hackie :wavey:

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 07:41 PM
Originally posted by RogiFan

Hi Hackie!

I know about this meatless tradition. I once had Christmas Eve din at my Italian friend's family and we had just that: pesce, spaghetti alle vongole [sp?] and tons of other dishes! Tutto di buon gusto!

We kind of do that too in our family -- no meat.

Hey, RF :wavey:

Yeah, it's a Roman Catholic tradition I believe. I used to know more about it but have forgotten the exact reason why Catholics don't eat meat on certain days :o

I like it because I like connecting with my roots :)

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 07:42 PM
Hi, ILR :wavey:

Lee: I hope you can find those lights. It'd be a huge hassle if you have to take down the ones you already have :( Or maybe you could arrange them in a different way? LOL, I don't know, my creativity doesn't work like that.

ILR
12-11-2002, 07:44 PM
your creativity is um lying about somewhere in another thread I think..................

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 07:55 PM
:eek::eek: Is that a compliment or a diss? :(

Lee
12-11-2002, 07:55 PM
Hi TH! I'm back! The eppy is a rerun. No wonder Leo didn't talk about it last night.

ILR
12-11-2002, 07:56 PM
lol its a compliment silly!:p

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 07:56 PM
Hmm, I was wondering about that, too. Thanks, Lee :) and welcome back!

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 07:56 PM
Originally posted by IluvRogi
lol its a compliment silly!:p

Oh, okay. Thanks :)

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 08:00 PM
Well, I'm going to do some more reading before dinner, so I'll see you guys later :wavey:

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:01 PM
Yeah, it's a Roman Catholic tradition I believe. I used to know more about it but have forgotten the exact reason why Catholics don't eat meat on certain days

I know why RC didn't eat meat on Ash Wednesday & Good Friday but I never heard about not eating meat on Christmas.:(

Lee: I hope you can find those lights. It'd be a huge hassle if you have to take down the ones you already have Or maybe you could arrange them in a different way? LOL, I don't know, my creativity doesn't work like that.

Thanks! It a real pain in the neck to take them down. I live in a desert and the landscaping in the front is mostly with desert plants and all have pricks. :fiery: :fiery:

No matter how creative one is, there is no way to re-arrange them to make it presentable.

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:01 PM
Bye TH! :wavey:

ILR
12-11-2002, 08:03 PM
bye Hackie :wavey:

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:05 PM
Talk about creativity, Emma, any more poems?

ILR
12-11-2002, 08:06 PM
hmmm well,Ive not really thought about it much,I kind of run out of subjects,so if you have any......;)

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:08 PM
How about your favorite football team Liverpool or Christmas?

ILR
12-11-2002, 08:10 PM
well I could,Ive already wrote one about Dudek and the champions league and some about xmas,but whats the harm in another ;)

RogiFan
12-11-2002, 08:13 PM
:) Good ideas, Lee! ILR, did you write a sort of year-end thingy for Rogi?? ;)

I have to go very soon!

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:13 PM
Also, the greedy me after Guga for Christmas, still wants

Clement for New Year & Haas for Chinese New Year :D :D

ILR
12-11-2002, 08:18 PM
yeah RF,I did ages ago :) Lee,you are greedy,hmm maybe I should get working,but dont expect any tonight!I have school tomorrow :(

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:18 PM
Bye RF!

ILR
12-11-2002, 08:20 PM
bye Rf :wavey:

RogiFan
12-11-2002, 08:21 PM
Originally posted by Lee
Also, the greedy me after Guga for Christmas, still wants

Clement for New Year & Haas for Chinese New Year :D :D

Oh, Lee! You make me laugh!!:D I'll have Rogi for Christmas and New Year, any kind of New Year... ;) and while we're at it, Valentine's Day, St. Patrick's Day, Easter, Victoria Day, Summer Solstice, Canada Day... :p

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:24 PM
:D :D I still have to find out when is Chinese New Year in 2003. Probably after AO so may be you can put Haas's sleeveless tennis shirt in the poem too!:D :D

ILR
12-11-2002, 08:24 PM
woah woah you girls are getting way ahead of yourselves!:p

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:28 PM
Originally posted by RogiFan


Oh, Lee! You make me laugh!!:D I'll have Rogi for Christmas and New Year, any kind of New Year... ;) and while we're at it, Valentine's Day, St. Patrick's Day, Easter, Victoria Day, Summer Solstice, Canada Day... :p

http://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/roflmao.gif

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:32 PM
Originally posted by IluvRogi
woah woah you girls are getting way ahead of yourselves!:p

It's fun http://www.stopstart.freeserve.co.uk/smilie/1syellow1.gif

ILR
12-11-2002, 08:33 PM
I know its fun :D I like doing it!But Im not writing all these poems!But I dont want to stop you dreaming of course!;)

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:35 PM
The dreaming part is most fun anyway!

ILR
12-11-2002, 08:36 PM
yep!I should know all about that!!!

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:37 PM
I finally put the nativity set at the alcove by the front door. It's not very artistic but at least it's there.

ILR
12-11-2002, 08:42 PM
yeh,at least its up.Im gonna go now and my comp is being awfully slow again :mad: bye :wavey:

Lee
12-11-2002, 08:43 PM
Bye Emma! :wavey:

Bye thread!

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 10:45 PM
Hi again, thread :wavey:

Well, I only have 1/2 a chapter left to read, then I can move on to the extra language section. Language is so fascinating to me! I mean, a child of age 5 has innately learned all of the rules for his/her own language, and from there on it's mostly learning the exceptions and vocabulary. And here I sit, a college student, struggling with basic concepts of grammar in my third language (technically it's my third but I don't really speak Spanish at all). I'll have to put some of the more interesting stuff up here so I can better illustrate my point.

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 10:46 PM
Originally posted by Lee
No matter how creative one is, there is no way to re-arrange them to make it presentable.

Aww :( That will really suck, then.

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 10:48 PM
Originally posted by IluvRogi
hmm maybe I should get working,but dont expect any tonight!I have school tomorrow :(

ILR, your poems are great! :) You should definitely keep exercising this talent of yours ;) I have your poem of Michel & me and I'm thinking of putting it up somewhere cause its cute :)

Lee
12-11-2002, 10:51 PM
Hi TH!

Yes, language is quite facinating. When Vince talk to my mom, he easily speak Cantonese with her, when he talk to my in-laws, he can talk in their dialect. Since my hubby and I mostly talk to him in English, he speak English with us and when I requested him to speak in Cantonese, he said it tired him. I didn't understand why in the beginning but then noticed he was actually doing translation when we wanted him to speak in Cantonese.

When he talks with his grandparents, he thinks in Chinese but with us, he thinks in English.

Leo7
12-11-2002, 10:59 PM
Originally posted by TennisHack
Allrighty, thanks Leo :) If I have a match you want, just let me know so I can return the favor :)

Tell me about the episode when you get back! :wavey:

oh, well it turned out to be a rerun :( :(

i had my eye on that Ferrero/Hewitt DC classic from 2000 ;)

Lee
12-11-2002, 11:01 PM
Originally posted by Leo7


oh, well it turned out to be a rerun :( :(



Hi Leo! :wavey:

And the most heart breaking eppy for me! :sad:

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 11:06 PM
Originally posted by Leo7
i had my eye on that Ferrero/Hewitt DC classic from 2000 ;)

LOL, okay. I have my copy of that and can arrange for it to be copied :) (I had a feeling that's the one you wanted :D)

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 11:10 PM
Well, I'm going to finish my reading while I still have the inclination to do so. I'll be back later :wavey:

Lee
12-11-2002, 11:11 PM
Bye TH! :wavey:

Good luck with your exam tomorrow!

Leo7
12-11-2002, 11:25 PM
Originally posted by TennisHack
I'm trying to work a Pearl Jam song into the story, and I already have an idea for "Elderly Woman", but not for one of their harder songs.

ooh insteresting. can't wait to see how you work that song into it. ;)

Leo7
12-11-2002, 11:29 PM
:wavey: see ya Hacks. kick some ass on that exam. ;)

i know Lee. it was so depressing. damn Christopher! do you think Chris will go through with the wedding and actually marry Sherry? i don't.

Lee
12-11-2002, 11:36 PM
Originally posted by Leo7
:wavey: see ya Hacks. kick some ass on that exam. ;)

i know Lee. it was so depressing. damn Christopher! do you think Chris will go through with the wedding and actually marry Sherry? i don't.

Base on the eppy of Shery's baby shower, I don't think so too!

Also, I think Rory will go to Yale instead of Harvard. It will make the writers' life easier but if this is the case, we may lose Paris who I do like.

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 11:42 PM
Well, that was a bust :( Turns out the bilingualism section of the extra language chapter didn't do anything but put more of my questions out there. But, I'll put up some of the interesting things I read nonetheless.

Lee, basically I want to know exactly what happened with Vince -- he can speak to his grandparents in Chinese but says speaking like that on command to you taxes him? Can someone be purely bilingual from birth? Theoretically, if one parent spoke one language natively and the other spoke a different language natively, which language would be the dominant one?

An how about age of acquisition? Will I ever become totally proficient in Russian since I didn't start studying it until I was 18?

TennisHack
12-11-2002, 11:50 PM
Advantages of Bilingualism

1. Bilinguals actually acquire more expertise in their native language.

2. Bilinguals are more aware of the phonological components of the language (how sounds sound, in other words).

3. Bilinguals excel at paying selective attention to relatively subtle aspects of a language task, ignoring more obvious linguistic characteristics (in other words, they can tell if a sentence is grammatically correct even if the statement itself is not true).

4. Bilinguals are more aware that the names assigned to concepts are arbitrary, and they have a better understanding of metalingustics -- the form and structure of languages.

5. Bilingual children are more sensitive to some pragmatic (social rules) aspects of a language.

6. Bilingual children are better at following complicated instructions.

7. Bilingual children perform better than monolinguals on tests of creativity, such as thinking of a wide variety of different uses for a paper clip.

8. Bilinguals perform better on concept formation tasks and on tests of nonverbal intelligence that require reorganization of visual patterns; they also score higher on problem-solving tasks that require them to ignore irrelevant information.


Disadvantages of Bilingualism

1. Momentary confusion about the language of a presented passage.

2. Longer language-processing times and speed.

3. Slower at making decisions about the language.

4. Mispronounce sounds in both languages.

Leo7
12-11-2002, 11:51 PM
Originally posted by Lee


Base on the eppy of Shery's baby shower, I don't think so too!

Also, I think Rory will go to Yale instead of Harvard. It will make the writers' life easier but if this is the case, we may lose Paris who I do like.

i agree, i think Rory will be going to Yale instead of Harvard. no way they'll separate Rory and Lorelai. i wonder what will happen with Lane and Jess and Dean and Paris when they have to go to college :confused: i hope none of them leave the show!

hey again Hackie! :wavey: loved your story. great ending too. :D :bounce:

Lee
12-11-2002, 11:59 PM
I don't think Lane will still live with her parents even she's in college, that means she can't go to anywhere to far. I doubt Jess will go to college and Dean, I have no idea since there is not much background on him like how's grade, whether his family can afford to put him to college, etc. As I said before, Paris will likely go to Harvard, so I worry losing her but her character is great. May be the writers can keep her in some way. Ah! I think she now also has a bf from Princeton, right?

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 12:00 AM
Age of Acquisition Debate

The age of acquisition debate has been raging for many years. The main hypothesis being tested is the critical period hypothesis, which states that one's ability to acquire a second language is limited to a period during which the brain is still maturing. It argues that the ability to learn a second language with a native-like fluency is already gone by the time one reaches puberty, when the brain has fully matured.

The crux of the argument is, how does one define "acquisition"? By phonology, vocabulary, or grammar? Studies have shown that those who learn a language during early childhood can produce speech sounds like a native speaker; the later in life the language is learned, the more of an accent one will have. The same is true for grammar; the older you are when you learn a second language the less likely you will have the same grammar skills as a native speaker.

However, the paths diverge at vocabulary. This makes sense; considering the fact that one is constantly learning new words in their native language, it isn't much a stretch to learn words in a different language.

If the languages are similar, the differences are even more minimal. Studies conducted on immigrants who spoke Spanish or Dutch as their first language find that later arrivers to the US actually have a greater mastery of English than early arrivers.

Leo7
12-12-2002, 12:01 AM
interesting Hackie. i never thought about some of those disadvantages of bilingualism. i wish i could become bilingual one day but i'm a long way off.. i'm not even close to speaking fluent french.

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 12:01 AM
I figured this was the perfect group to present this question to, since there are many non-native speakers who communicate in English on this board :) What are your thoughts on bilingualism?

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 12:01 AM
Originally posted by Leo7
hey again Hackie! :wavey: loved your story. great ending too. :D :bounce:

:D Thank you :)

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 12:04 AM
Originally posted by Leo7
interesting Hackie. i never thought about some of those disadvantages of bilingualism. i wish i could become bilingual one day but i'm a long way off.. i'm not even close to speaking fluent french.

The disadvantages are really trivial, considering bilinguals can communicate effectively in more than one language.

And I'm far from being fluent in Russian, as well. It takes me so long to translate, be it in conversation or writing. That's my main interest -- in bilingual children who grow up speaking two languages, do they translate between the two consciously, or can they just automatically communicate in more than one language? Or in bilinguals in general, do they actually translate the language they are speaking into the one they know innately, or can they forego that extra step?

Leo7
12-12-2002, 12:05 AM
Originally posted by Lee
I don't think Lane will still live with her parents even she's in college, that means she can't go to anywhere to far. I doubt Jess will go to college and Dean, I have no idea since there is not much background on him like how's grade, whether his family can afford to put him to college, etc. As I said before, Paris will likely go to Harvard, so I worry losing her but her character is great. May be the writers can keep her in some way. Ah! I think she now also has a bf from Princeton, right?

that's right, she's dating a guy from Princeton. i forgot his name.. but he seems perfect for Paris. maybe she'll decide to go to Princeton b/c of him, but she would still be far away from Stars Hollow :(

Leo7
12-12-2002, 12:09 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack


Or in bilinguals in general, do they actually translate the language they are speaking into the one they know innately, or can they forego that extra step?

yeah i've always been curious about that. i wonder how their minds really work. :confused:

Lee
12-12-2002, 12:12 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack
Well, that was a bust :( Turns out the bilingualism section of the extra language chapter didn't do anything but put more of my questions out there. But, I'll put up some of the interesting things I read nonetheless.

Lee, basically I want to know exactly what happened with Vince -- he can speak to his grandparents in Chinese but says speaking like that on command to you taxes him? Can someone be purely bilingual from birth? Theoretically, if one parent spoke one language natively and the other spoke a different language natively, which language would be the dominant one?

An how about age of acquisition? Will I ever become totally proficient in Russian since I didn't start studying it until I was 18?

Well, it's the thinking process. When I first moved to Canada, the way I speak English was I think in Chinese and translate it to English when I speak out. After many years of living in Canada, I basically watch North America TV programs and I spoke English in our working place, I get to the stage that I think in English most of the time other than talking to my family members.

For the case of parents with 2 different mother tongue, I guess whatever the mother speaks but I really can't say exactly. Now I need Vince as an example again. When he was 6 months old, I returned to work and he spent most of his time with my in-laws. My hubby and I were both having very long working hours and lots of time, we picked him up from my in-laws, returned home and went to bed, so he didn't have much chance talked to us. I quit working after he was 2 and he still spoke Chinese more than English. He started kindergarten before he was 5 at a French immersion school, i.e., everything was in French other than English language act. So, he spoke French in school, spoke English with us at home, and Chinese with his grandparents.

Now he is in US, everything is in English but he still has Spanish class and so far, his Spanish report card is outstanding.

Leo7
12-12-2002, 12:17 AM
wow, that's incredible Lee. i could never master so many languages at once! :eek:

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 12:18 AM
Originally posted by Lee

Well, it's the thinking process. When I first moved to Canada, the way I speak English was I think in Chinese and translate it to English when I speak out. After many years of living in Canada, I basically watch North America TV programs and I spoke English in our working place, I get to the stage that I think in English most of the time other than talking to my family members.

Of course, there is an immersion aspect to it all. If you are forced to use a second language as the primary means of communication, of course you will be good at it.

It just amazes me that one could find themself thinking in a language other than their native one :)


When he was 6 months old, I returned to work and he spent most of his time with my in-laws. My hubby and I were both having very long working hours and lots of time, we picked him up from my in-laws, returned home and went to bed, so he didn't have much chance talked to us. I quit working after he was 2 and he still spoke Chinese more than English. He started kindergarten before he was 5 at a French immersion school, i.e., everything was in French other than English language act. So, he spoke French in school, spoke English with us at home, and Chinese with his grandparents.

Now he is in US, everything is in English but he still has Spanish class and so far, his Spanish report card is outstanding.

Hmm, it would make sense that the child would learn the language of the primary caregiver -- and 2 is the age when most children are figuring out the more complicated grammar rules (in English at least).

That is truly amazing -- 4 languages!! Even if he loses one (French), still -- wow!! Perhaps another example of being 'forced' to acquire a language with the French, since that's the primary language he had to speak to communicate in school, but nonetheless, it is amazing. I guess he is evidence for the early acquisition hypothesis if he has managed to keep so many different languages floating around with relative ease.

The more you tell us about him, the more amazing he seems :)

Lee
12-12-2002, 12:22 AM
Well, I believe after certain age, it's much more difficult to learn another language. I started learning English when I start primary/elementary school and Hong Kong at that time is also a bilingual place. Until now, the part of English I still struggling is grammar since Chinese don't have present, past, past perfect, etc tense. But this is my case, my best friend in Hong Kong (we are schoolmates through elementary till high school) is very fluent in both languages, she is a senior interpreter in Hong Kong government.

Actually, Vince's English is much better that mine now. He starts correcting my pronunciation and grammer. :)

The accent part was also very interesting. My English teachers in Hong Kong were from Britain, so I have very strong British accent when I came to Canada but I lost that accent now. I speak English just like any North American.

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 12:25 AM
I see Layla :wavey:

Lee
12-12-2002, 12:28 AM
Originally posted by Leo7
wow, that's incredible Lee. i could never master so many languages at once! :eek:

Well, I can't say he master these languages because so far Vince can speak those languages but he can only write decent English.

Leo7
12-12-2002, 12:29 AM
i have to go. science paper and english papers need to be written. :(

:wavey: talk tro you guys later!

Lee
12-12-2002, 12:29 AM
Hi Layla! :wavey:

I think she's the one who can master more than one language very well.

Lee
12-12-2002, 12:30 AM
Bye Leo! :wavey:

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 12:30 AM
Originally posted by Lee
Well, I believe after certain age, it's much more difficult to learn another language. I started learning English when I start primary/elementary school and Hong Kong at that time is also a bilingual place. Until now, the part of English I still struggling is grammar since Chinese don't have present, past, past perfect, etc tense. But this is my case, my best friend in Hong Kong (we are schoolmates through elementary till high school) is very fluent in both languages, she is a senior interpreter in Hong Kong government.

Oh, it's definitely harder to learn another language, I believe after you've reached the age of 13 or so. I also struggle with grammar in Russian because there are so many other cases, and so many exceptions to the rule! At the same time, I am aware that the same can be said of English -- it's supposed to be the hardest language to learn, after all ;)

The accent part was also very interesting. My English teachers in Hong Kong were from Britain, so I have very strong British accent when I came to Canada but I lost that accent now. I speak English just like any North American.

Just as a total aside, accents can vary from region to region. There is a very distinct southern accent, as well as a 'Boston' and 'Midwestern' accent (usually typified by Minnesotans). And that's just within the US -- there are also distinct regional accents in England, though I don't know how strong they are as I've never been there.

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 12:32 AM
Originally posted by Lee
Well, I can't say he master these languages because so far Vince can speak those languages but he can only write decent English.

Master, perhaps not, but he understands 4 different languages and communicate effectively, at least verbally.

I'd guess when he learns to write in cursive, he'd have an easier time writing in other languages.

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 12:32 AM
Bye, Leo :wavey: Good luck on your papers!

Lee
12-12-2002, 12:34 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack



Just as a total aside, accents can vary from region to region. There is a very distinct southern accent, as well as a 'Boston' and 'Midwestern' accent (usually typified by Minnesotans). And that's just within the US -- there are also distinct regional accents in England, though I don't know how strong they are as I've never been there.

I hear more southern accent since I moved here.

My brother worked in an engineering firm in Hong Kong and his bosses were Scotts but from different area. He said when they talked, they had to keep on repeating cause their accents were so different.

When I worked in Hong Kong, the GM was Australian, the AGM was New Zealander and my boss was Brit moved to Australia, trust me, every time all were in a meeting, it's like hell.

Layla
12-12-2002, 12:40 AM
Hi everyone! :wavey:

Give me a second, I see a great conversation about languages. :D

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 12:58 AM
*waits for Layla to catch up :D*

LOL, I think I'm giddier than I should be about the story. I'm glad everyone's enjoying it :)

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:00 AM
:wavey:

Im gonna be a "catcher" now too. :D You were all on fire again today. :p

Lee
12-12-2002, 01:00 AM
Dinner time for me! You gals have a nice evening and again, TH, good luck with your exam tomorrow. :wavey:

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:02 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack
:eek: You just missed the final, then!

Oh, well . . .

:wavey: Goodnight!

Oh! :sad: I was so tired...
Well, I read it now, it was the first thing I came to look for when I arrived. Lol, it was brilliant again. :D

Lee
12-12-2002, 01:02 AM
Hi Dissident! You show up when I have to go! You do this on purpose? :( j/k

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 01:04 AM
Hi, hitman! :wavey: I was wondering where you disappeared to today ;)

And LOL, I do the same thing with the story :o:) I'm really happy you all enjoyed it :)

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:04 AM
Originally posted by Vera


Thanks for asking, Becca and Dissident!

I'm here. Just battling crisis with myself, I'm feeling very down so I can't bring myself to come here to talk, I'm afraid I might bring down you guys too :sad:. Anyway, when I feel better, I'll come around again.

Now I must go. Bye. :wavey:

Im so sorry about that! :sad:
But hey, dont feel like not coming if you are afraid to bring us down!
I can understand if you want to be alone and stuff, but please, dont feel like you would be a bad company or whatever! I like to help people feel better when they are down!
As the others said, feel free to send a pm to me as well! Or come to our group therapy! :D

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:11 AM
Originally posted by RogiFan


Hi Lee!

Is everybody "yukking" about Gwyneth? If so, I agree!!! YUK indeed! What is her problem? I never cared for her since "EMMA" [was it that film?] and "Shakespeare in Love" -- the impostor! :p

I saw some sports guy reporting from a beautiful sunny SW place -- I figured it was Arizona -- I was right! It was Scottsdale! It sure looks nice there!

If my mind is not playing games with me again, you were supposed to go see Habla con Ella today, right? If so, let me know your opinion when you come back! I see Almodovar is getting lots of prizes with it, and thats both good and bad.
Good because his film is great, and he will probably win the foreign language Oscar next year.
And bad, because a brazilian movie based on a TERRIFIC book I read will be one of his opponents. And they will probably get less attention then they should... :(

Layla
12-12-2002, 01:12 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack
Age of Acquisition Debate

The age of acquisition debate has been raging for many years. The main hypothesis being tested is the critical period hypothesis, which states that one's ability to acquire a second language is limited to a period during which the brain is still maturing. It argues that the ability to learn a second language with a native-like fluency is already gone by the time one reaches puberty, when the brain has fully matured.

The crux of the argument is, how does one define "acquisition"? By phonology, vocabulary, or grammar? Studies have shown that those who learn a language during early childhood can produce speech sounds like a native speaker; the later in life the language is learned, the more of an accent one will have. The same is true for grammar; the older you are when you learn a second language the less likely you will have the same grammar skills as a native speaker.


First of all, I believe the advantages of bilingualism far exceed the disadvantages. Vince's case, for example, is quite amazing. To be able to communicated in 4 different languages at this age is extraordinary and just proves that the acquisition of a second (or third, or fourth) language is much easier in the childhood. I'm fairly certain that should Vince decide to learn any other language in life, he will excel at it, as it will be much easier for him.

However, I disagree with the word gone in the first paragraph. Diminished perhaps, gone - I very much doubt it. In fact I'm sure that if an adult decides to learn a new language, it is not impossible for him or her to be fluent in that language. It's a complex issue which involves many different factors. To me, motivation and dedication is crucial, as well as the amount of time a person spends learning the language per week.

Children and adolescents have a very high motivation to learn a second language if they live in an environment where this is essential if one want to fit in. It is also an initial advantage that they don't really think and analyze the language like adults do, and they don't worry about making grammatical errors. I feel that's the best way to learn a new language - begin by being able to communicate verbally.

Adults on the other hand rarely have such a pressing need to learn a new language and when they do, the results are usually better as well. Of course I can't back any of this up, I'm just making logical deductions. Think about it. How much time does an adult usually devote to learning a new language? A few hours a week? Not enough, not even close. If they really wanted to become proficient, they would have to devote a few hours a day (or at least one hour a day) to this task, and who has the time for that?

Immersion is another aspect as TH mentioned. TH, I'm sure you would be much more fluent in Russian if you were constantly surrounded by the Russian language, either through TV, or newspapers, or simply by speaking to Russian friends on a daily basis. It makes a huge difference. In fact, I suggest you find a Russian board and start chatting. ;) No wait, I take that back, cause then you won't have time for us anymore. :( Should you find yourself in the position to actually spend a year in Russia, your fluency would shoot sky-high. True, there are many immigrants in the USA who can barely say two words in English or who are far from fluent, but that's because they never really had to learn the language. They live in a community where they communicate in their native language and get by just fine. There are many people from the former Yugoslavia living in Slovenia now who don't speak Slovene even though they've lived here for over 20 years. That's because everyone understands them (almost everyone in Slovenia understands and/or speaks the language formerly known as Serbo-Croatian, which functioned as the unofficial official language in Yugoslavia, but hardly any Croatians or Serbs speak Slovene).

I plan to be proficient in Spanish at some point in my life ;) and I believe that goal is achievable, but it all comes down to motivation and time. It's not impossible though.

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:14 AM
Originally posted by IluvRogi
:eek: is that Recoba??lol thankyou,is there any of the other Milan?;)

Definitely looks like Recoba to me. ;) Those teeth are like a trade mark. LOL

Layla
12-12-2002, 01:15 AM
Lol, I was writing a very long post and now I want to write another one. Hold on. ;)

Hi Hitman! :wavey:

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:16 AM
Originally posted by Lee


Vince and I will have the test next week and will be a yellow belt then.

But once we are in yellow belt, we need to buy all those sparring gear like protective vest, helmet, something that protect the teeth and will have a big cut into the x-mas budget.

Oh, good luck to you both! :D You two will rock that test, you´ll see.
And see it this way: I bought a tennis racquet last year, by Christmas time. It was about all I got that whole Christmas. And man, was I happy! I LOVE that racquet! :D

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:18 AM
Originally posted by IluvRogi
yes they are the ones

I see Emerson there, on the Roma pic. He is from the same state I am. Came from the goddamned team I cant name. :rolleyes:

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:20 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack
:rolleyes: at Anna. (Oops, don't let hitman see that!) If she wants to be taken seriously as a player, maybe she should stop doing all these photo shoots -- just a thought.

:o
Alright, I wont touch that again. :p

I dont like all these photos either. But its her choice in the end of the day... And I dont think that has a relation to her lack of results. The problem is in her head, not on photo shootings.

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 01:21 AM
Originally posted by Layla
Immersion is another aspect as TH mentioned. TH, I'm sure you would be much more fluent in Russian if you were constantly surrounded by the Russian language, either through TV, or newspapers, or simply by speaking to Russian friends on a daily basis. It makes a huge difference. In fact, I suggest you find a Russian board and start chatting. ;) No wait, I take that back, cause then you won't have time for us anymore. :( Should you find yourself in the position to actually spend a year in Russia, your fluency would shoot sky-high.

Oh, I'm sure that, if forced, I could get along in a Russian-speaking environment. But I seriously doubt I'd ever find myself thinking in, and being creatively expressive, in Russian. And therein really lies my problem -- I'm not confident in my ability to communicate in, and understand, Russian. I especially have very poor comprehension for spoken Russian (apparently something we're supposed to work on in the next semester).

Talk about huge individual differences . . . .

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:21 AM
Originally posted by Lee
:D :D A pic for Dissident. She's at 32.

http://photo.eastday.com/epublish/gb/paper215/46/class021500001/image/img839693_1.jpg

Lara Croft. LOL
Its for Layla too then! :D

Thanks Lee. I appreciate! 32, like that! :eek:

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 01:23 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
:o
Alright, I wont touch that again. :p

I dont like all these photos either. But its her choice in the end of the day... And I dont think that has a relation to her lack of results. The problem is in her head, not on photo shootings.

Well, you should be proud that I didn't write something demeaning about her abilities ;) No, seriously, I wasn't going to to there anyway. I just have to wonder where her interests lie when I see something like this . . . .

And okay, if you insist. It's her head.

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:26 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack


Hey, RF :wavey:

Yeah, it's a Roman Catholic tradition I believe. I used to know more about it but have forgotten the exact reason why Catholics don't eat meat on certain days :o

I like it because I like connecting with my roots :)

You have italian roots?? Oh, yet another coincidence! :eek:

Have you ever heard of "Panettone"? Its like a bread or a cake with fruits in it? And the other version called "Chocottone", that´s filled with chocolate drops?? Hmmmmmm.... :drool:

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 01:28 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
You have italian roots?? Oh, yet another coincidence! :eek:

Have you ever heard of "Panettone"? Its like a bread or a cake with fruits in it? And the other version called "Chocottone", that´s filled with chocolate drops?? Hmmmmmm.... :drool:

I thought you knew that . . . ? Oh, I guess I was talking about that in one of the threads in the Rogi forum. :o Yes, I am Italian by design :D You, too? Whoa :eek:

No, I haven't heard of those particular things, but they sound absolutely divine :drool:

Layla
12-12-2002, 01:29 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack


The disadvantages are really trivial, considering bilinguals can communicate effectively in more than one language.

And I'm far from being fluent in Russian, as well. It takes me so long to translate, be it in conversation or writing. That's my main interest -- in bilingual children who grow up speaking two languages, do they translate between the two consciously, or can they just automatically communicate in more than one language? Or in bilinguals in general, do they actually translate the language they are speaking into the one they know innately, or can they forego that extra step?

Well, I've mentioned this before, but I don't translate at all. More often than not I think in English. Perhaps that's because most of my sources of communication and information are English and have been for a long time. For example, my mom and I are watching wintersports on Eurosport these days and I have real problems translating the English back into Slovene or even communicating with her. I'm not sure that's the rule, but in my case, I suppose I just have an inexplicable affinity with the English language.

I'd even go so far as to say I can't really express myself in Slovene, at least not the way I want to. I always have a feeling that my personality doesn't come through in Slovene. Slovene is quite devoid of any emotions, at least at this stage. It is perhaps the only language in which the words I love you are practically unutterable. They sound so ridiculous, contrived and false. A phrase like that exists only in books. I find that extremely limiting. There is also a huge gap between the formal Slovene as used in books, and the spoken language. So much so that the Slovene movies are unwatchable, because they can't seem to strike the right balance. Spoken language is unacceptable in art, yet anyone who speaks proper Slovene (it's required when speaking in public, the politicans, tv presenters, teachers all speak it) sounds pretentious and unreal.

But I digress. My trip to the States was really interesting from a psychological point of view. I swear that I practically forgot that I come from Slovenia. It just felt like I've always lived there. I don't know if that's because of the ridiculous amounts of time I spend in front of the tv, or my proficiency, or something altogether deeper (I'd like to think it's the latter ;) ), but anytime someone asked me where I was front, I was almost startled. I had to remind myself I wasn't from around here.

Ok, I'll continue in the next post.

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:32 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack
Advantages of Bilingualism

1. Bilinguals actually acquire more expertise in their native language.

2. Bilinguals are more aware of the phonological components of the language (how sounds sound, in other words).

3. Bilinguals excel at paying selective attention to relatively subtle aspects of a language task, ignoring more obvious linguistic characteristics (in other words, they can tell if a sentence is grammatically correct even if the statement itself is not true).

4. Bilinguals are more aware that the names assigned to concepts are arbitrary, and they have a better understanding of metalingustics -- the form and structure of languages.

5. Bilingual children are more sensitive to some pragmatic (social rules) aspects of a language.

6. Bilingual children are better at following complicated instructions.

7. Bilingual children perform better than monolinguals on tests of creativity, such as thinking of a wide variety of different uses for a paper clip.

8. Bilinguals perform better on concept formation tasks and on tests of nonverbal intelligence that require reorganization of visual patterns; they also score higher on problem-solving tasks that require them to ignore irrelevant information.


Disadvantages of Bilingualism

1. Momentary confusion about the language of a presented passage.

2. Longer language-processing times and speed.

3. Slower at making decisions about the language.

4. Mispronounce sounds in both languages.

Omg, that is interesting and intriguing in so many levels! :)
Thanks for sharing Hackie. Ive been wondering about some of those things for quite a while.

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 01:34 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
Omg, that is interesting and intriguing in so many levels! :)
Thanks for sharing Hackie. Ive been wondering about some of those things for quite a while.

Oh, you're just about the hit the really good stuff. ;)

Layla
12-12-2002, 01:41 AM
I've read somewhere that if you expose an infant to different languages, for example playing him a tape of someone speaking Chinese, or Portuguese, or Russian, they will learn have less problems learning the sounds AND the vocabulary of those languages when they grow up. I think it's a brilliant idea.

Which brings me to another topic. Some people have a good ear for languages and dialects, and some just don't. It's like music. It's much easier for those who do have a good ear to acquire the correct accent then it is for the others. I also found my phonetics class very helpful. I believe pupils should be taught how sounds are produced. It's much easier to produce a foreign sound if you are taught early on to pay attention to everything that goes into producing a sound, the position of the tongue, the lips, the mouth cavity. That's often neglected in schools.

It's funny, I used to have a proper British accent in high school and at the University, but it all changed in the 3rd year when I was doing a linguistic project on presidential campaigns (Clinton vs. Bush) and at about the same time I fell in love with the American accent and I've spoken in an American accent ever since. But I notice I have difficulties when I speak to British friends, or my Scots friend. I tend to mimic the language of the person I'm speaking to so I'm torn between the two accents and it all ends up a huge mess lol. But I think that's psychological. I know my British and American friends in Slovenia can't stand each other because of their backgrounds. They look down upon each other's nations. So I feel awkward speaking in an American accent to a British dude. :o

Anyway, that's all I have to say, I think. And even that was way too much. :o

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:41 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack



It just amazes me that one could find themself thinking in a language other than their native one :)


Hmm, I can relate to that.
I started studying english when I was 9. I was in classes for about 8 to 9 years. I read a lot in english, write on message boards, listen to music, watch movies without reading subtitles most of the time, and I think in english maybe 50 to 60% of the time. When Im alone and in silence, that goes up to probably 80, 90%. :eek:

Sometimes I´m thinking about something from my college, like a building Im designing, and my thoughts get stuck for some seconds. It takes a while for me to get that I got stuck because I was thinking in english and the thought being developed needed a tecnical word I never read in english, and therefor I cant keep the thing going.
So, I have to come back to earth, make the portuguese come back and start it all over again. :eek:
Many times I speak to myself in english, and it happened some times that I spoke to my mom or my gf in english.

And all that with me starting to get in touch with the language at age 9, and without ever being in the states or any other english speaking nation for more than 15 days.

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:44 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack


Master, perhaps not, but he understands 4 different languages and communicate effectively, at least verbally.

I'd guess when he learns to write in cursive, he'd have an easier time writing in other languages.

I agree with Hackie, the kid is amazing. :)
Thats a huge deal that he doesnt get more than a bit confused with all that.

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:45 AM
Originally posted by Lee
Hi Dissident! You show up when I have to go! You do this on purpose? :( j/k

:sad: Sorry. Of course I dont do that on purpose. :)
:wavey: Good night and good luck with the lights.

Layla
12-12-2002, 01:46 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack


Oh, I'm sure that, if forced, I could get along in a Russian-speaking environment. But I seriously doubt I'd ever find myself thinking in, and being creatively expressive, in Russian. And therein really lies my problem -- I'm not confident in my ability to communicate in, and understand, Russian. I especially have very poor comprehension for spoken Russian (apparently something we're supposed to work on in the next semester).

Talk about huge individual differences . . . .

Oh you'd be surprised, if you persisted long enough. Confidence comes with practice and until then you just have to be brave. ;)

Seriously though, tape some Russian movies and watch them a few times. That's my suggestion. Or infiltrate yourself in a group of gorgeous Russian hunks. :angel:

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:47 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack
Hi, hitman! :wavey: I was wondering where you disappeared to today ;)

And LOL, I do the same thing with the story :o:) I'm really happy you all enjoyed it :)

I had a headache today, because of the heat and this damned allergy that´s still stuck to me. :(
Computers are nasty for headaches.
I went to the Shopping Center to discover that my monthly income is LATE again, so I have no money for Christmas shopping. :( Will have to wait more.
Also, Gabi had the year-end party, with a Christmas presentation at school at night. And then we went out for a pizza. And now Im home. ;)

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 01:50 AM
Originally posted by Layla
I've read somewhere that if you expose an infant to different languages, for example playing him a tape of someone speaking Chinese, or Portuguese, or Russian, they will learn have less problems learning the sounds AND the vocabulary of those languages when they grow up. I think it's a brilliant idea.

Actually, when an infant starts babbling (the second stage of language, after crying), s/he babbles every phoneme it's possible to make, for every language. There's a relatively famous study known as the "Hindi t", where they have found that American infants, with no exposure to Hindi, can disern between the two versions of the sound of "t" in the Indian language.

Phoneme production operates on the use-it-or-lose-it principle. After a few months, the baby's babbles narrow down to the ones actually used in its native language. Which brought on my question -- if a baby grows up in a household where two languages are spoken (say, for the sake of argument, English and Swiss German ;)), will they incorperate both language's phonemes, or only the dominant language's?


Which brings me to another topic. Some people have a good ear for languages and dialects, and some just don't. It's like music. It's much easier for those who do have a good ear to acquire the correct accent then it is for the others. I also found my phonetics class very helpful. I believe pupils should be taught how sounds are produced. It's much easier to produce a foreign sound if you are taught early on to pay attention to everything that goes into producing a sound, the position of the tongue, the lips, the mouth cavity. That's often neglected in schools.

Phonetics used to be a requirement in all elementary schools. I remember taking it in second grade, because I had a hard time discerning between when 'c' makes an 's' or a 'k' sound for awhile. Unfortunately, it was dropped as a requirement shortly after I took the class.

And I agree, it really helps if you have an ear for languages.

And please!! All opinions are welcome :) That's why I asked in the first place ;)

Layla
12-12-2002, 01:50 AM
Originally posted by Dissident


Hmm, I can relate to that.
I started studying english when I was 9. I was in classes for about 8 to 9 years. I read a lot in english, write on message boards, listen to music, watch movies without reading subtitles most of the time, and I think in english maybe 50 to 60% of the time. When Im alone and in silence, that goes up to probably 80, 90%. :eek:

Sometimes I´m thinking about something from my college, like a building Im designing, and my thoughts get stuck for some seconds. It takes a while for me to get that I got stuck because I was thinking in english and the thought being developed needed a tecnical word I never read in english, and therefor I cant keep the thing going.
So, I have to come back to earth, make the portuguese come back and start it all over again. :eek:
Many times I speak to myself in english, and it happened some times that I spoke to my mom or my gf in english.

And all that with me starting to get in touch with the language at age 9, and without ever being in the states or any other english speaking nation for more than 15 days.

Wow, that is VERY interesting. :eek: It's like hearing my own story, except I was 11 when I started. Getting stuck in my train of thought for lack of a word happens to me as well sometimes.

And embarrasingly enough, I quite often speak out in English when talking to my friends or my parents. :o :o That's why I want an English speaking boyfriend. ;)

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:52 AM
Originally posted by Layla
I plan to be proficient in Spanish at some point in my life ;) and I believe that goal is achievable, but it all comes down to motivation and time. It's not impossible though.

In my opinion, its difficult to learn the FIRST foreign language when you´re over puberty.
If you know one language besides your mother one, and you develop that ability when you are young, you will have a much bigger chance of excelling in some other language any given day. For example, as soon as I learned English, I can get other languages pretty easily. I can understand Spanish very well, although I can´t speak or write too well, and I never had enormous contact with it.

The first foreign language makes a HUGE difference to all the others you will learn. And as you said, persistency and time you invest in it.

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:53 AM
Originally posted by Layla
Lol, I was writing a very long post and now I want to write another one. Hold on. ;)

Hi Hitman! :wavey:

Hey Layla! :wavey:

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 01:54 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
Sometimes I´m thinking about something from my college, like a building Im designing, and my thoughts get stuck for some seconds. It takes a while for me to get that I got stuck because I was thinking in english and the thought being developed needed a tecnical word I never read in english, and therefor I cant keep the thing going.
So, I have to come back to earth, make the portuguese come back and start it all over again. :eek:

Well, I have thought of simple things in Russian, especially when I just come from the class my thoughts are still about the class and (usually) about mistakes I've made -- I'm rehearsing the right thing as I walk along. I've also dreamt in Russian, though it made little sense. But it never lasts very long.

I'm just completely amazed by you guys!!

Dissident
12-12-2002, 01:55 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack


I thought you knew that . . . ? Oh, I guess I was talking about that in one of the threads in the Rogi forum. :o Yes, I am Italian by design :D You, too? Whoa :eek:

No, I haven't heard of those particular things, but they sound absolutely divine :drool:

:p This thread is huge, and I had to jump some posts along the way, remember? When I was on class days, it was imposible to keep up with you guys in here. So maybe thats one of the info that I didnt have access to. ;)

Ill try to find a pic of the things for you to see. ;)

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 01:56 AM
Originally posted by Layla
Oh you'd be surprised, if you persisted long enough. Confidence comes with practice and until then you just have to be brave. ;)

Seriously though, tape some Russian movies and watch them a few times. That's my suggestion. Or infiltrate yourself in a group of gorgeous Russian hunks. :angel:

Brave :eek: That's a concept I'm not very familiar with :o

LOL!!! with your suggestions. When I'm on breaks, I try to watch Russian news on the international channel so I don't completely lose what little ability I have. And I sometimes understand the commercials :o No group of Russian hunks around, though.

Just a Croatian ;)

Layla
12-12-2002, 01:56 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack


Actually, when an infant starts babbling (the second stage of language, after crying), s/he babbles every phoneme it's possible to make, for every language. There's a relatively famous study known as the "Hindi t", where they have found that American infants, with no exposure to Hindi, can disern between the two versions of the sound of "t" in the Indian language.

Phoneme production operates on the use-it-or-lose-it principle. After a few months, the baby's babbles narrow down to the ones actually used in its native language. Which brought on my question -- if a baby grows up in a household where two languages are spoken (say, for the sake of argument, English and Swiss German ;)), will they incorperate both language's phonemes, or only the dominant language's?


Hmm, interesting. In my non-expert opinion, both sets of phonemes would be incorporated, but I can't argue that. I wonder how dominant the dominant language would actually be though. I think it would depend on later years, when the child goes to school.

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 01:58 AM
Originally posted by Dissident

I had a headache today, because of the heat and this damned allergy that´s still stuck to me. :(
Computers are nasty for headaches.

Aww *hug* totally understand with the allergies. I never went outside in the summer because my allergies just got worse :(


Also, Gabi had the year-end party, with a Christmas presentation at school at night. And then we went out for a pizza. And now Im home. ;)

Well, that sounds like it was fun :) And I was just kidding, you don't have to be accountable to the board ;)

Layla
12-12-2002, 02:01 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack


Brave :eek: That's a concept I'm not very familiar with :o

LOL!!! with your suggestions. When I'm on breaks, I try to watch Russian news on the international channel so I don't completely lose what little ability I have. And I sometimes understand the commercials :o No group of Russian hunks around, though.

Just a Croatian ;)

Hehe, Croatian is good enough. ;)

Actually, while watching the news is a great idea, only the movies and talk shows can convey the spoken language to any degree of accuracy. News presenters use a whole different language. Hey, rent Leningrad Cowboys! That's a hilarious movie. But I think it might not be in Russian at all. I forgot. :o

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:03 AM
Originally posted by Layla


Wow, that is VERY interesting. :eek: It's like hearing my own story, except I was 11 when I started. Getting stuck in my train of thought for lack of a word happens to me as well sometimes.

And embarrasingly enough, I quite often speak out in English when talking to my friends or my parents. :o :o That's why I want an English speaking boyfriend. ;)

Lol, yeah, I felt the same about a minute ago when I read your post. :p

Anyway, its really interesting. I wonder many times about this. I feel north-american a huge bunch of time too.

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 02:04 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
In my opinion, its difficult to learn the FIRST foreign language when you´re over puberty.

That's the basic argument to the critical period hypothesis; unfortunately the only studies I have are ones conducted on Chinese or Korean kids who immigrated to the US, versus their parents :rolleyes:

And I totally agree. I had a slight advantage when I began my Russian courses because I knew what to expect from my first foreign language courses in high school. I was pretty good at Spanish (well, for the beginner level), but I so despised the class that I was determined to go in the other direction.

Er . . . my original point was that each language does get easier. I try to keep up with the Russian forum here because the posters link to Russian articles all the time and it's good practice :) Plus during the Moscow tournament I kept my bookmark on the Russian version of the site and was able to find my way around.

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:05 AM
Layla, I watched No Man´s Land, what was the language they spoke in it?

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 02:06 AM
Originally posted by Layla
Actually, while watching the news is a great idea, only the movies and talk shows can convey the spoken language to any degree of accuracy. News presenters use a whole different language. Hey, rent Leningrad Cowboys! That's a hilarious movie. But I think it might not be in Russian at all. I forgot. :o

They never show Russian movies on the international channel :( and I don't have access to them at home because I live in a tiny town. So right now I'm also reading a few websites every so often to supplement.

Layla
12-12-2002, 02:07 AM
Originally posted by Dissident


I had a headache today, because of the heat and this damned allergy that´s still stuck to me. :(
Computers are nasty for headaches.
I went to the Shopping Center to discover that my monthly income is LATE again, so I have no money for Christmas shopping. :( Will have to wait more.
Also, Gabi had the year-end party, with a Christmas presentation at school at night. And then we went out for a pizza. And now Im home. ;)

Ouch, I hope the headache is gone now. But I know what you mean about computers. My eyes have been permanently read for days, to the point where I can't even look at the screen anymore. But I have to, there's no way around it.

And it sucks that you won't have any money for Christmas shopping. :sad: Hope you get it in time though.

Piiiiiiizzzzzzaaaa! :lick:

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:07 AM
Hackie, here you go:

http://www.bauducco.com.br/hotsite_natal_2002/images/panettone_80g-500g-750g-1kg.gif
This is Panettone. :D

http://www.bauducco.com.br/hotsite_natal_2002/images/chocottone_500g-750g.gif
And this is Chocottone. :D

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:10 AM
Originally posted by Layla


Ouch, I hope the headache is gone now. But I know what you mean about computers. My eyes have been permanently read for days, to the point where I can't even look at the screen anymore. But I have to, there's no way around it.

And it sucks that you won't have any money for Christmas shopping. :sad: Hope you get it in time though.

Piiiiiiizzzzzzaaaa! :lick:

yeah, it is better now. ;)
Im sorry about you having to face it... :(
And I hope you´re rigth about the money. I cant wait till 2003. :eek: :p

We brought some pizza home... You girls want a slice? ;)

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 02:10 AM
Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm :lick::lick: Those look absolutely delish.

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 02:11 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
We brought some pizza home... You girls want a slice? ;)

:eek: DA!

Lee
12-12-2002, 02:11 AM
Hi Layla, TH & Dissident!

Sorry to hear about your headache! Are you feeling better now?

I guess pizza is one of Gabi's favorite food.

Originally posted by Layla
I've read somewhere that if you expose an infant to different languages, for example playing him a tape of someone speaking Chinese, or Portuguese, or Russian, they will learn have less problems learning the sounds AND the vocabulary of those languages when they grow up. I think it's a brilliant idea.


This also applies to learn other things. Vincent learned the Suziki Piano method. Before he start learning how to play piano, he had to keep on listening to the songs that he was going to play, sort of 24 hours non-stop. Also, this method encourage kids start at a young age as 3 because in the beginning, they are not required to read notes. I found the children learned very fast and very good in their listening. For Vince, after 6 months in the program, he can listen to a song a few times, then he can find the notes and start playing.

Another example is Vince god-parents 2 sons also learn the same method and when the younger one start, he learned much faster than his older brother. It's the same for all children under this method, the reason is the younger one been exposed to those songs for a very long time already.

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:12 AM
And Layla, did you see our Pearl Jam Special last night? (Well, mostly MY PJ Special :o). I posted some interesting links. Hackie promised she will be checking them when she has free time.

I´m just finishing downloading the Pittsburgh 2000 bootleg, and the sound is out of this world! :eek: Three more songs to go and I can burn my new double album. :D

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:13 AM
Hi Lee! welcome back! :wavey:



Did you all see my new signature? That sentence is awesome, but very controversial. lol

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:14 AM
Oh, and pizza is DEFINITELY one of her fave food! :p

Layla
12-12-2002, 02:14 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
Layla, I watched No Man´s Land, what was the language they spoke in it?

I haven't seen the movie yet, but I heard it's great. Did you enjoy it?

The language is probably the non-existent Bosnian and perhaps Serbian, I'm not sure who the two soldiers were. But there isn't a huge difference between Croatian, Serbian or Serbo-Croatian, or Bosnian in my opinion, but if any Croatians or Serbs read this they'd probably want to murder me for uttering such a blasphemy. Some of the words are different, but that's about it. They're creating artificial lines of division now, by bringing back old croatian words for everyday things that they called something else their entire lives, just because that word happened to be Serbian in the great conglomerate of the Serbo-Croatian language.

There might have been some Slovene in there as well, since the movie was shot in Slovenia and the main actor now lives in Slovenia, is married to a Slovene actress and even speaks Slovene. He's one of the best Bosnian actors, and Bosnia has many great actors.

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 02:14 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
Hackie promised she will be checking them when she has free time.

Guess what I'm going to be doing tomorrow afternoon :D

Lee
12-12-2002, 02:15 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
Hi Lee! welcome back! :wavey:



Did you all see my new signature? That sentence is awesome, but very controversial. lol

Huh! What signature?

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:16 AM
Originally posted by Layla


I haven't seen the movie yet, but I heard it's great. Did you enjoy it?

The language is probably the non-existent Bosnian and perhaps Serbian, I'm not sure who the two soldiers were. But there isn't a huge difference between Croatian, Serbian or Serbo-Croatian, or Bosnian in my opinion, but if any Croatians or Serbs read this they'd probably want to murder me for uttering such a blasphemy. Some of the words are different, but that's about it. They're creating artificial lines of division now, by bringing back old croatian words for everyday things that they called something else their entire lives, just because that word happened to be Serbian in the great conglomerate of the Serbo-Croatian language.

There might have been some Slovene in there as well, since the movie was shot in Slovenia and the main actor now lives in Slovenia, is married to a Slovene actress and even speaks Slovene. He's one of the best Bosnian actors, and Bosnia has many great actors.

Oh the movie was grand! Very very very interesting. :D
Thanks for the answer. I guess. lol

Lee
12-12-2002, 02:17 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
Oh, and pizza is DEFINITELY one of her fave food! :p

I now see Vince and Gabi can be very good pal! Do Vince need to learn Portuguese or Gabi speak English?

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:19 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack


Guess what I'm going to be doing tomorrow afternoon :D

The problem is that the best site is having bandwidth problems, the other is almost untouchable because its always PACKED with people downloading stuff and I discovered a new one that had the Dec 5 show in full for download and it has bandwidth problems too. :sad:

Ill be praying it is all solved tomorrow. :) I dont want to be making a fuss about something to end on disappoitment for you. :(

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:20 AM
Originally posted by Lee


Huh! What signature?

The sig, on the very bottom of each of my posts...
A quote, in bold, says:

"Are you woman enough to be my man. Bandaged hand in hand"

That sentence. ;)

Layla
12-12-2002, 02:20 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
And Layla, did you see our Pearl Jam Special last night? (Well, mostly MY PJ Special :o). I posted some interesting links. Hackie promised she will be checking them when she has free time.

I´m just finishing downloading the Pittsburgh 2000 bootleg, and the sound is out of this world! :eek: Three more songs to go and I can burn my new double album. :D

Oh that's right! Yes, I read all the posts this morning. ;) I was going to ask you about that. If I go to that site tomorrow, which concert do you reccommend I download first. The Pittburgh one? What's the date again?

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 02:21 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
The problem is that the best site is having bandwidth problems, the other is almost untouchable because its always PACKED with people downloading stuff and I discovered a new one that had the Dec 5 show in full for download and it has bandwidth problems too. :sad:

Ill be praying it is all solved tomorrow. :) I dont want to be making a fuss about something to end on disappoitment for you. :(

Well, if at first I don't succeed, try, try again ;)

And it's okay. I amended my Christmas list to include 3 PJ albums (I believe), so I'll be getting some new stuff no matter if it's tomorrow or a few weeks from now :)

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:21 AM
Originally posted by Lee


I now see Vince and Gabi can be very good pal! Do Vince need to learn Portuguese or Gabi speak English?
Gabi doesnt speak english as of now, but she has some classes. She will be ready to go in some years, so we can plan the meeting in advance. ;)

Lee
12-12-2002, 02:23 AM
Originally posted by Dissident


The sig, on the very bottom of each of my posts...
A quote, in bold, says:

"Are you woman enough to be my man. Bandaged hand in hand"

That sentence. ;)

My set up here did not show the signature before, that's why I never see any. Now I can see that BOLD statement.

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:26 AM
Originally posted by Layla


Oh that's right! Yes, I read all the posts this morning. ;) I was going to ask you about that. If I go to that site tomorrow, which concert do you reccommend I download first. The Pittburgh one? What's the date again?

Hmm, lemme think... You have three options for what I recall.
I have the Lisbon one, which has a wonderful setlist of classic songs.
The Pittsburgh one is better for rarities and in therms of performance on stage.
And you have another one people make a fuss about that is the Boise one.

Ill post some more info.

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 02:30 AM
Just found this in my inbox . . . didn't someone here like Stereolab?

12/11/02, 6 p.m. ET -- Stereolabvocalist Mary Hansen died Monday (December 9) in London when she was hit by a car while riding her bicycle. She was 36.

An official statement said: "The suddenness of her death has shocked the band. Mary was a special person. Our thoughts are with her family and friends who will miss her greatly."

Stereolab formed in 1990 and Australian native Hansen joined the London-based band in 1992. The group has recorded eight studio albums the most recent of which was 2001's Sound-Dust.

Hansen was born January 11, 1966 in Maryborough, Brisbane. The band says her funeral will take place next week in her hometown.

London police are investigating the accident.

-- Darryl Morden, Los Angeles

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:31 AM
Setlists:
LISBON (23 May 2000)
Of the Girl
Do the Evolution
Animal
Red Mosquito (great performance in this)
Corduroy
Grievance
Light Years
Nothing as it Seems
Given to Fly (awesome)
Even Flow
Faithful (Wondeful!)
Untitled (Matt broke the drums while playing this so...)
Last Kiss (...they are fizing the thing and Ed invites the crowd to sing this one "just you and me, no drums...")
Breakerfall
MFC
Wishlist
Thin Air
Daughter
Evacuation
Immortality
Better Man (another awesome play of a classic)
Black
Go
Last Exit
Jeremy (they didnt play this one many times on the whole tour. I guess you wont find it in more than a couple of the bootlegs)
Elderly Woman... Small Town
Alive (same case as Jeremy)
Yellow Ledbetter (great closing act)

RogiFan
12-12-2002, 02:33 AM
:) Boy did it take me some time to catch up -- and ONLY from the Rogi forum's link to the Bilingual discussion!!

Ola, Dissident! Yes, I just returned from Hable con ella! What a film! I need to think about it more before talking about it... Caetano Veloso was good -- beautiful song! I was thinking that I hadn't seen a Brazilian film in ages! Do you know an old one called Gaijin?

Back to bilingualism... I know someone who studied Russian w me, of Scottish-Ukrainian background -- he speaks Ukrainian even though his mother is Scottish. I know some children who are sent to French school or immersion at a young age but whose English suffers, and consequently, French also, so they're taken out and returned to a regular school.

No doubt depends on the child. For those of you who have a facilitiy w languages, do you wonder where that came from?

I envy people who grew up w more than one language. I had to study languages in order to learn them. After years of study I finally immersed myself in the country -- and it makes al the difference in the world! My Spanish improved 100% -- more than my French [due to many reasons].

Layla
12-12-2002, 02:33 AM
Originally posted by Dissident
Now they are playing Knock-out Drag-Down. Its a rockier song. Pretty cool, some punk beat to it.

It seems they are just on the last record?

Ooo, now they went back to the first album, with Say It Aint So. A darkier song, slower beat, seems good.
Oh my God, I like this song! :)

Break again. Im taking some pics of the tv, lol. If I ever find a frigging cable for this camera, Ill post them to you. :p

Hitman, you're my hero! :hearts:

Thank you so much for the song-by-song, and if you ever manage to post some pics (if they came out at all), I will be over the moon. :bounce:

As you see I'm still smitten with my adorable hubby :hearts: I just don't talk about it that much anymore. ;)

And I thought the first song they played was The Sweater Song (with reference to being on the floor), but you mentioned later it was The Good Life and that's ok too. It sounds like an awesome show! :eek: I soooooooo wish I could've seen it lol. I talk like a teenybopper. :o

And lol @ TH for saying I was a bigger fan or something like that. You have got to be kidding. :D j/k I still remember who the real Weezer fan is around here, don't you worry. ;)

Lyrics to The Good Life! :eek:

When I look in the mirror
I can't believe what I see
Tell me, who's that funky dude
Staring back at me
Broken, beaten down
Can't even get around
Without an old-man cane
I fall and hit the ground
Shivering in the cold
I'm bitter and alone

Excuse the bitching
I shouldn't complain
I should have no feeling
Cos feeling is pain
As everything I need
Is denied me
And everything I want
Is taken away from me
But who do I got to blame?
Nobody but me

And I don't wanna be an old man anymore
It's been a year or two since I was out on the floor
Shaking booty, making sweet love all the night
It's time I got back to the good life
It's time I got back, it's time I got back
And I don't even know how I got off the track
I wanna go back, yeah!

Screw this crap, I've had it!
I ain't no Mr. Cool
I'm a pig, I'm a dog
So excuse me if I drool
I ain't gonna hurt nobody
Ain't gonna cause a scene
Just need to admit
That I want sugar in my tea
Hear me (hear me) I want sugar in my tea!

I don't wanna be an old man anymore
It's been a year or two since I was out on the floor
Shaking booty, making sweet love all the night
It's time I got back to the good life
It's time I got back, it's time I got back
And I don't even know how I got off the track
I wanna go back, yeah!

TennisHack
12-12-2002, 02:36 AM
Originally posted by Layla
And lol @ TH for saying I was a bigger fan or something like that. You have got to be kidding. :D j/k I still remember who the real Weezer fan is around here, don't you worry. ;)

Excuse me, "the"?! You're a fan of them, too! ;)

I said I was a bad fan because I hadn't listened to all their albums and couldn't pick out a song by its lyrics. :o

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:36 AM
PITTSBURGH (Sep 05 2000. Closed the US TOUR LEG ONE)

Even Flow (as an opener? GET OUTTA HERE!! Insane!)
Hail Hail (right after Even Flow?? Its worth the download just because of this combo!)
Animal
Corduroy
Grievance
In My Tree (perfect!!)
Nothing as it Seems
Daughter
Leatherman (great b-side)
Better Man ("and here comes the other man..." lol)
Sleight of hand
Given to Fly
Last Exit
RVM (!!!!!!!!!!!!)
I got shit
Black
Porch (woohoo!!)
Breakerfall
Go
Once (another one you dont see much these days)
Mankind (I assume you like this one if you love No Code so much. ;))
Elderly Woman... Small Town
Crazy Mary (another awesome b-side)
Wash (yet again a b-side)
I got you (rarity)
Insignificance
Baba O´Riley (another rarity)

I guess this one is a lot better overall. ;)

Layla
12-12-2002, 02:37 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack
Just found this in my inbox . . . didn't someone here like Stereolab?

12/11/02, 6 p.m. ET -- Stereolabvocalist Mary Hansen died Monday (December 9) in London when she was hit by a car while riding her bicycle. She was 36.


:eek: I'm not exactly a fan, but I do like their music. That's just so tragic. :sad: I had no idea this happened. Thanks for letting us know.

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:40 AM
BOISE (Nov 3, 2000) Last show of LEG TWO before the two closing ones in Seattle)

Of The Girl
Go
Corduroy
Grievance
Last Exit
Tremor Christ
Elderly Woman Behind The Counter In A Small Town
Insignificance
Animal
Nothing As It Seems
I Got Id
Better Man
Even Flow
Daughter
Light Years
Jeremy
Given To Fly
Rearviewmirror
Black
Crazy Mary
Do The Evolution
Spin The Black Circle
State Of Love And Trust
Parting Ways
Rocking In The Free World

Dissident
12-12-2002, 02:42 AM
Originally posted by TennisHack
Just found this in my inbox . . . didn't someone here like Stereolab?

12/11/02, 6 p.m. ET -- Stereolabvocalist Mary Hansen died Monday (December 9) in London when she was hit by a car while riding her bicycle. She was 36.

An official statement said: "The suddenness of her death has shocked the band. Mary was a special person. Our thoughts are with her family and friends who will miss her greatly."

Stereolab formed in 1990 and Australian native Hansen joined the London-based band in 1992. The group has recorded eight studio albums the most recent of which was 2001's Sound-Dust.

Hansen was born January 11, 1966 in Maryborough, Brisbane. The band says her funeral will take place next week in her hometown.

London police are investigating the accident.

-- Darryl Morden, Los Angeles

Oh shit! :eek:

I´m not a fan either, but that´s just horrible!! :sad:

Lee
12-12-2002, 02:42 AM
Originally posted by Layla


:eek: I'm not exactly a fan, but I do like their music. That's just so tragic. :sad: I had no idea this happened. Thanks for letting us know.

I don't even know about the band but it's sad for anyone died young. :sad:

Layla
12-12-2002, 02:42 AM
Thanks for the setlists Hitman! :) Mankind is not my favorite song off the No Code album. In My Tree and Red Mosquito are much, much better. ;)

I think I'll download Pittsburgh first, then Lisbon.