Who is the best youngster on fast surfaces?? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Who is the best youngster on fast surfaces??

richie21
11-04-2006, 01:21 AM
i would go with Marcos,closely followed by Rafa and Richard :)

Andre♥
11-04-2006, 01:24 AM
Baghdatis isn't for sure. He'll get lost after a early loss in the AO.

I would need a Gasquet vs Nadal in hardcourt to decide.

Murray still needs to learn that pro tennis is not for crybabies to be considered a contender.

~*BGT*~
11-04-2006, 01:30 AM
Gasquet is better than all of them on all surfaces except clay.

Allure
11-04-2006, 01:54 AM
Gasquet is pretty good on fast surfaces (as seen in this year's US open) I think he is pretty sufficient in all surfaces.

World Beater
11-04-2006, 07:29 AM
nadal, then berdych/baggy...there just isnt enough evidence for any of the others.

on paper, game-wise one could make arguments but thats about it.

LocoPorElTenis
11-04-2006, 08:21 AM
Juan Martin del Potro :lol:

DrJules
11-04-2006, 09:35 AM
Berdych on a mentally good day.

Klaas_nalbandian
11-04-2006, 09:39 AM
richard

Deathless Mortal
11-04-2006, 09:46 AM
Berdych definitely!

richie21
11-04-2006, 10:34 AM
Berdych definitely!

i would be curious to know why you think he is definitely better than Baghdatis or Gasquet on fast surfaces......

disturb3d
11-04-2006, 10:58 AM
People see Nadal's post Wimbledon record with no titles, and get the idea that he's a mediocre fast court player.
As a matter of fact, the players who defeated Nadal played the undisputed match of their lives, and in most cases, had all the luck in the world on their side of the court.

You HAVE to play painfully good tennis to beat Nadal.
Whereas a Hrbaty or Rochus could wipe away any of the other youngsters on a half-decent day.
Nadal was insanely unfortunate this summer season, and should have come away with a big title.

His level is unbelievable. But at the same time, pushes particular opponents into a similar level. A level which they will probably never repeat in their career. And almost always revert in the next round, to get punished.

richie21
11-04-2006, 11:04 AM
People see Nadal's post Wimbledon record with no titles, and get the idea that he's a mediocre fast court player.
As a matter of fact, the players who defeated Nadal played the undisputed match of their lives, and in most cases, had all the luck in the world on their side of the court.


yeah that's obvious...... :o
so for you, Nadal lost 10 matches (not one or two but ten!) this season against players who were all playing their undisputed match of their lives?? come on.....

DrJules
11-04-2006, 11:13 AM
Murray still needs to learn that pro tennis is not for crybabies to be considered a contender.


In beating Roddick at Wimbledon he achieved the biggest individual result of any of the group on a grass court.

DrJules
11-04-2006, 11:15 AM
People see Nadal's post Wimbledon record with no titles, and get the idea that he's a mediocre fast court player.
As a matter of fact, the players who defeated Nadal played the undisputed match of their lives, and in most cases, had all the luck in the world on their side of the court.

You HAVE to play painfully good tennis to beat Nadal.
Whereas a Hrbaty or Rochus could wipe away any of the other youngsters on a half-decent day.
Nadal was insanely unfortunate this summer season, and should have come away with a big title.

His level is unbelievable. But at the same time, pushes particular opponents into a similar level. A level which they will probably never repeat in their career. And almost always revert in the next round, to get punished.

Berdych is now on a 3 match winning streak against Nadal.

disturb3d
11-04-2006, 11:16 AM
The real testament to Nadal's tennis, is the way he makes players way past their prime rekindle great tennis. Moya, Ferrero, Hewitt, Clement.

disturb3d
11-04-2006, 11:25 AM
Berdych is now on a 3 match winning streak against Nadal.Because of his extreme attacking game, he will always be the favorite against Nadal.
But he isn't anywhere near the player Nadal is.

Nadal cruises through tournaments, and requires of his opponent a superman performance to go down.
Berdych has achieved in merely making the 3rd round of a tournament.
Unfortunately for Nadal, he was drawn early against Berdych in 2 major tournaments.

Fans simply see Nadal as the big cheese, and anyone who can beat him is the best.
They forget that there are other players in this sport. Almost all of which trouble Berdych far more than Nadal.

▄︻┻┳═
11-04-2006, 11:33 AM
i would be curious to know why you think he is definitely better than Baghdatis or Gasquet on fast surfaces......

you'll always be curious, cuz u r not effable:rolleyes:

richie21
11-04-2006, 11:41 AM
to be fair ,i'm amazed by the very small number of votes Marcos has got until now(especially considering his performances at AO and Wimbledon)

vincayou
11-04-2006, 01:47 PM
People see Nadal's post Wimbledon record with no titles, and get the idea that he's a mediocre fast court player.
As a matter of fact, the players who defeated Nadal played the undisputed match of their lives, and in most cases, had all the luck in the world on their side of the court.

You HAVE to play painfully good tennis to beat Nadal.
Whereas a Hrbaty or Rochus could wipe away any of the other youngsters on a half-decent day.
Nadal was insanely unfortunate this summer season, and should have come away with a big title.

His level is unbelievable. But at the same time, pushes particular opponents into a similar level. A level which they will probably never repeat in their career. And almost always revert in the next round, to get punished.

I don't know if you are ironic. I hope so.
Let's put it the other way. Right now, with his defensive game and an average physical condition, if an opponent play good attacking tennis, Rafa can do nothing about it.

Nadal was not unfortunate this summer. He just wasn't good enough. Next year will be difficult for him as well on fast surface, because there are some talented youngster with teeth as long as his.

Grenouille
11-04-2006, 01:49 PM
Gasquet

shotgun
11-04-2006, 03:32 PM
Nadal is still the one who has achieved the most on hardcourts, even though his performance hasn't been that impressive as of late.

DrJules
11-04-2006, 03:36 PM
Nadal is still the one who has achieved the most on hardcourts, even though his performance hasn't been that impressive as of late.

Depends on each persons definition of a fast court. Hardcourts are of all speeds. Certainly Paris on carpet is fast. Not sure if Madrid or Montreal on hardcourts would necessarily be fast. Too many seem to think surfaces are either clay or fast. the most common surface is probably medium paced hard courts.

Andre♥
11-04-2006, 03:39 PM
In beating Roddick at Wimbledon he achieved the biggest individual result of any of the group on a grass court.

And what happened in the next round?

To be the best, you need to be consistent.

DrJules
11-04-2006, 03:43 PM
And what happened in the next round?

To be the best, you need to be consistent.

Agreed, but each year Murray has moved rapidly up the world rankings.

2004 - 411, 2005 - 64 and 2006 around 20.

shotgun
11-04-2006, 04:00 PM
Depends on each persons definition of a fast court. Hardcourts are of all speeds. Certainly Paris on carpet is fast. Not sure if Madrid or Montreal on hardcourts would necessarily be fast. Too many seem to think surfaces are either clay or fast. the most common surface is probably medium paced hard courts.

Well 'fast court' is definitely not a type of surface.

richie21
11-04-2006, 05:26 PM
man,i must admit that i didn t think Berdych would lead this poll ,let alone so widely(if we except Gasquet,he has nearly 30 more votes than everybody)........i guess that it's mostly because of his wins against Nadal.
31 votes for Berdych who hasn t won anything this year and only 3 votes for Baghdatis who has made the final at AO and the 1/2 final at Wimbledon and won a title.....hum hum :rolleyes:

angela
11-04-2006, 05:29 PM
Berdych is the best in this moment.

ezekiel
11-04-2006, 05:37 PM
For fast court a player needs a big serve and a big forehand so I give a tie between Berdych, Baghdatis and Djokovic

jazar
11-04-2006, 05:44 PM
baghdatis only plays well in the bigger events and when you don't expect him to do well. berdych has the game for fast courts-big serve and groundies. djokovic is too conservative. nadal has lost earlier than expected on almost every event since wimbledon, especially on hard courts. although i think he could give federer the biggest challenge on a fast court than all the others, he isn't the best of the young guys on fast courts. gasquet is too flashy and inconsistent week to week. murray still needs to work on his fitness and if the grass courts at wimbledon were faster roddick would have caned his sorry arse. monfils is just an idiot, plain and simple. and wawrinka is hit and miss.

so Berdych is the best at the moment, but Nadal will learn to play better hard court tennis. afterall he learnt how to play on grass.

richie21
11-04-2006, 05:53 PM
baghdatis only plays well in the bigger events and when you don't expect him to do well. berdych has the game for fast courts-big serve and groundies. djokovic is too conservative. nadal has lost earlier than expected on almost every event since wimbledon, especially on hard courts. although i think he could give federer the biggest challenge on a fast court than all the others, he isn't the best of the young guys on fast courts. gasquet is too flashy and inconsistent week to week. murray still needs to work on his fitness and if the grass courts at wimbledon were faster roddick would have caned his sorry arse. monfils is just an idiot, plain and simple. and wawrinka is hit and miss.

so Berdych is the best at the moment, but Nadal will learn to play better hard court tennis. afterall he learnt how to play on grass.

and the other youngsters (bar Nadal) aren t ???
ffs ,bar Nadal,Gasquet is the youngster who has won the most titles this year and the only one who has made a TMS final(only losing to Federer).....and this,despite having suffered from a few injuries in the first 6 months.

in the GSs,yes he was inconsistent but don t forget he had some really tough draws : he got Federer in his first round at Wimbledon(nuff said!) ,an in form Haas in the AO's first round(Haas had just beaten Federer in Kooyong the week before ....and he nearly beat him again in AO) and Nalbandian in his second round at RG(Nalby made then the semi final ,only losing to Federer because of an injury)......not exactly the easiest draws as you can see.

▄︻┻┳═
11-04-2006, 06:07 PM
man,i must admit that i didn t think Berdych would lead this poll ,let alone so widely(if we except Gasquet,he has nearly 30 more votes than everybody)........i guess that it's mostly because of his wins against Nadal.
31 votes for Berdych who hasn t won anything this year and only 3 votes for Baghdatis who has made the final at AO and the 1/2 final at Wimbledon and won a title.....hum hum :rolleyes:

What? so we can't vote for Tomas or something?

Hey, if you can't take any other one's opinion, why r u starting this thread? your behavior makes you look like a giant jerk:(

marti_228
11-04-2006, 06:12 PM
People see Nadal's post Wimbledon record with no titles, and get the idea that he's a mediocre fast court player.
As a matter of fact, the players who defeated Nadal played the undisputed match of their lives, and in most cases, had all the luck in the world on their side of the court.

You HAVE to play painfully good tennis to beat Nadal.
Whereas a Hrbaty or Rochus could wipe away any of the other youngsters on a half-decent day.
Nadal was insanely unfortunate this summer season, and should have come away with a big title.
His level is unbelievable. But at the same time, pushes particular opponents into a similar level. A level which they will probably never repeat in their career. And almost always revert in the next round, to get punished.

why was he so unlucky? he got injured just a week or 2 weeks ago.

richie21
11-04-2006, 06:16 PM
What? so we can't vote for Tomas or something?

Hey, if you can't take any other one's opinion, why r u starting this thread? your behavior makes you look like a giant jerk:(

eh calm down,i was just giving my opinion ,that's it


don t i have the right to be a bit surprised by the fact that Berdych get 30 more votes than Baghdatis??
and by the way ,i'm also very surprised that Gasquet has 20 more votes than everybody bar Berdych.

Ernham
11-04-2006, 06:28 PM
eh calm down,i was just giving my opinion ,that's it


don t i have the right to be surprised by the fact that Berdych get 30 more votes than Baghdatis??
and by the way ,i'm also very surprised that Gasquet has 20 more votes than everybody bar Berdych.

Why? There are two people that dominate tennis right now, Federer and Nadal. Berdych's combined record against the two is an impressive 4 -5.

Baghdatis's is 0-6
Gasquet's is 1-8

Katastrophe
11-04-2006, 06:38 PM
It's tough to say with Berdych. One match he plays like a dream, then the next day he can shock you with his performance and be out the door in a hurry. I'd say him if he can string together a run of consistent effort.

Same about Gasquet, IMO. He's got the shots, but needs to work on his fitness. I saw him cramp too many times this year.

As for Nadal...yes, he had great results earlier this year, but really struggled after the Wimbledon final. I think that particular chapter remains to be written, and '07, with a bucket of points to defend, will tell the story.

Jimnik
11-04-2006, 06:41 PM
Murray. I guarantee he'll win the US Open within the next 5 years, and possibly Wimbledon too.

richie21
11-04-2006, 06:44 PM
Why? There are two people that dominate tennis right now, Federer and Nadal. Berdych's combined record against the two is an impressive 4 -5.

Baghdatis's is 0-6
Gasquet's is 1-8

well Gasquet has only played Nadal on clay(Nadal hasnt been beaten there for nearly 2 years now) while Berdych has played 3 of his 4 matches against Nadal on hard courts(and he lost the one which was played on clay).....so i don t think it's really wise to compare their respective records against Nadal until now

Nadal dominates tennis on clay but certainly not on the other surfaces......even the die hardest Rafa's fan would reckon that.

and against Federer, Berdych is 1-4 while Richie is 1-5 yeah......BUT you 'll note that Fed's matches against Richie were more often closer affairs than his matches against Berdych.

Ernham
11-04-2006, 06:55 PM
well Gasquet has only played Nadal on clay(Nadal hasnt been beaten there for nearly 2 years now) while Berdych has played 3 of his 4 matches against Nadal on hard courts(and he lost the one which was played on clay).....so i don t think it's really wise to compare their respective records against Nadal until now

Nadal dominates tennis on clay but certainly not on the other surfaces......even the die hardest Rafa's fan would reckon that.

and against Federer, Berdych is 1-4 while Richie is 1-5 yeah......BUT you 'll note that Fed's matches against Richie were more often closer affairs than his matches against Berdych.

Gasquet and Bagdhatis have never beaten Federer on a fast surfaces, Berdych has.

Let me know if you are still confused so I can /ignore you, saving us both some time.

richie21
11-04-2006, 07:00 PM
Gasquet and Bagdhatis have never beaten Federer on a fast surfaces, Berdych has.

Let me know if you are still confused so I can /ignore you, saving us both some time.

yeah, in the Olympic games.....do i need to develop? :devil:

richie21
04-19-2009, 08:45 PM
I thought it was funny to revive this thread.
The poll's results looks just so funny now :haha::haha:

Andi-M
04-19-2009, 09:00 PM
I thought it was funny to revive this thread.
The poll's results looks just so funny now :haha::haha:

:haha: Nice bump richie :yeah:

Lullaby
04-19-2009, 09:36 PM
This is funny lol

Chris Seahorse
04-19-2009, 09:58 PM
I thought it was funny to revive this thread.
The poll's results looks just so funny now :haha::haha:

Outstanding bump. :haha:

Wow, this Men's Tennis Forum it sure knows it's stuff. :o

I am sure those 36 Berdych voters are glad this wasn't a public vote. :lol:

Xenosys
04-19-2009, 10:01 PM
Wow, Berdych comes out on top? You're kidding me. Murray, Nadal and Djokovic get some of the lowest counts. Mind you, it was 2006, and stranger things have happened. Zidane also chest-butted some Italian that year too.

fast_clay
04-19-2009, 10:08 PM
berdych

richie21
04-19-2009, 10:12 PM
Wow, Berdych comes out on top? You're kidding me. Murray, Nadal and Djokovic get some of the lowest counts. Mind you, it was 2006, and stranger things have happened. Zidane also chest-butted some Italian that year too.

The funniest thing in those poll's results is actually who is at the second place.:haha::haha:
Berdych has at least won a MS on hardcourt and has beaten Federer in hardcourt and Nadal numerous times on hardcourt contrary to Gasquette.

Lullaby
04-19-2009, 10:23 PM
Looking back at my old posts I have to conclude that Ritchies decline / non progression to this point is a big surprise to me

I though nole, andy and ritchie would all be head to head in fierce rivalry but at the moment del potro seems more likely to get involved in the three way battle

richie21
04-19-2009, 10:33 PM
Looking back at my old posts I have to conclude that Ritchies decline / non progression to this point is a big surprise to me


I think that when this thread was created,very few people (including myself)would have believed it if we had told them that in the three years that would follow,he would win only one title(and mickey mouse one to make it even worse).
What a waste of talent......


I though nole, andy and ritchie would all be head to head in fierce rivalry but at the moment del potro seems more likely to get involved in the three way battle

I would replace Del Potro by Tsonga.
Tsonga has a far better record against the top 4 than Del Potro,not to mention he has already won a big title(a MS) contrary to Del Potro and has produced better GS results as well.

NadalSharapova
04-19-2009, 10:35 PM
gasquet reached his potential early on in his career

Lullaby
04-19-2009, 10:38 PM
I think that when this thread was created,very few people (including myself)would have believed it if we had told them that in the three years that would followed,he would win only one title(and mickey mouse one to make it even worse).
What a waste of talent......



I would replace Del Potro by Tsonga.
Tsonga has a far better record against the top 4 than Del Potro,not to mention he has already won a big title(a MS) contrary to Del Potro and has produced better GS results as well.

Tsonga will be there or there abouts too although he needs to become less injury prone imo to put in that consistency (not his fault).

Del Potro imo has huge possibility for improvement particularly his serve which aint that great for a giant.

richie21
04-19-2009, 10:38 PM
gasquet reached his potential early on in his career

I've never heard of a player reaching his potential at 18-19.

NadalSharapova
04-19-2009, 10:43 PM
I've never heard of a player reaching his potential at 18-19.

players like berdych and gasquet reached their potential early. different players peak at different stages.

hingis peaked aged 17

Andi-M
04-19-2009, 10:43 PM
Tsonga will have a quiet few months but he will be fierce at Wimbledon.

richie21
04-19-2009, 10:47 PM
players like berdych and gasquet reached their potential early. different players peak at different stages.

hingis peaked aged 17

Actually i'm not sure Berdych ever peaked anyway.
Even when he won his only MS,it was in a MS without Federer and Nadal.
I'm far from being sure he was much better than he is now.

About Hingis,you can't really compare WTA to ATP tour.

NadalSharapova
04-19-2009, 10:51 PM
I still remember monte carlo 2005 when gasquet played his best match ever and took nadal to 3 sets. i was impressed by him then, but that was his peak and it has been downhill since.

richie21
04-19-2009, 10:54 PM
I still remember monte carlo 2005 when gasquet played his best match ever and took nadal to 3 sets. i was impressed by him then, but that was his peak and it has been downhill since.

Disagree.
He played better against Murray last year(at least during 3 sets): that was god-level stuff.

NadalSharapova
04-19-2009, 10:57 PM
Disagree.
He played better against Murray last year(at least during 3 sets): that was god-level stuff.

pushing the greatest clay courter of all time to 3 tight sets is harder than playing against murray on grass in 2008 when he was ranked outside top 5

richie21
04-19-2009, 11:00 PM
pushing the greatest clay courter of all time to 3 tight sets is harder than playing against murray on grass in 2008 when he was ranked outside top 5

Back then,Nadal was nowhere near as good as he is now,including on clay where he almost lost to Coria and to Puerta that year.

NadalSharapova
04-19-2009, 11:01 PM
Back then,Nadal was nowhere near as good as he is now,including on clay where he almost lost to Coria and to Puerta that year.

not as good as now but was still the worlds best claycourter in 2005

yellowboy906
04-20-2009, 12:41 AM
Tsonga will have a quiet few months but he will be fierce at Wimbledon.

how do you know? are you his mom?:eek: hi mrs tsonga, do you look like ali too?