What is happening to the young guns?Monfils,Gasquet,Djokovic, Murray-OUT- [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

What is happening to the young guns?Monfils,Gasquet,Djokovic, Murray-OUT-

El Legenda
01-17-2006, 01:48 AM
Monfils, Djokovic, and Gaquet is down 2-0

everyone knew, Gaquet would have a hard match,

but the other to going down to Horna and Goldstein :confused:

how?

PinkFeatherBoa
01-17-2006, 01:50 AM
I figure they're all just pointing their guns in the wrong direction. :shrug:

DDrago2
01-17-2006, 03:14 AM
Monfils, Djokovic, and Gasquet are already out, and Murray is just loosing badly the first set against Chela

Cheers :lol:


Young guns... :smash:

Flibbertigibbet
01-17-2006, 03:15 AM
Meh, crap happens? :confused:

Hola Mr. SK
01-17-2006, 03:30 AM
just b/c they are young:shrug:!!
They lose,they learn...simple, Roger's not playing so good at their ages!

rommel99
01-17-2006, 03:33 AM
who did novak played? and whats the score?

wipeout
01-17-2006, 03:49 AM
Haven't seen the match so far, but looking at the stats:

Andy Murray
1st set - winners 3 - unforced errors 15
2nd set - winners 13 - unforced errors 17

Surely can't be nerves, he didn't have them at Wimbledon. :scratch:

Mistaflava
01-17-2006, 04:11 AM
because they suck....


get a clue Mike Jones...this is not a youth party...it's a tennis tournament

Leo
01-17-2006, 04:15 AM
Meh, crap happens? :confused:

Exactly my feeling. The point is that they're all still young. Their games and mentalities aren't develped enough to be consistently winning GS matches yet. Gasquet especially gets very down on himself.

I personally find these results less surprising and meaningful than most are making out of them, like Brad Gilbert. Not the end of the world.

Billabong
01-17-2006, 04:32 AM
Add Murray to the list:eek:

ClaycourtaZzZz.
01-17-2006, 04:35 AM
At the end Andy at least tried to do something, 6 months ago he would have gave it away easily.

Mistaflava
01-17-2006, 04:39 AM
Murray was the easiest fade of the night. Chela was an underdog and cashed huge $$$$$$$$$$$$4



:worship:

TennisGrandSlam
01-17-2006, 04:45 AM
Monfils

Gasguet

Muarry

:sad:

*Ljubica*
01-17-2006, 04:48 AM
just b/c they are young:shrug:!!
They lose,they learn...simple, Roger's not playing so good at their ages!
Absolutely - many people say tennis is a game played mostly in the head - it's all about concentration/coping with difficult circumstances/reading your opponent etc - and you only get that with practice and experience. These guys are young............because of their talent they're obviously going to win lots of matches - but they are also going to lose some as their mental faculties strive to catch up with their physical prowess. A Grand Slam with the 5 set format they're not going to be used to - especially in the heat of Australia (all these guys are European and just not used to that kind of heat - just the thought of those temperatures kills me :eek: !!) is obviously going to accentuate the problems. Just give them time.

liptea
01-17-2006, 04:49 AM
You forgot Carlos Moya, the other young gun.

El Legenda
01-17-2006, 04:50 AM
because they suck....


get a clue Mike Jones...this is not a youth party...it's a tennis tournament


and you are giving people tips on tennis betting :confused:

Leo
01-17-2006, 04:53 AM
Absolutely - many people say tennis is a game played mostly in the head - it's all about concentration/coping with difficult circumstances/reading your opponent etc - and you only get that with practice and experience. These guys are young............because of their talent they're obviously going to win lots of matches - but they are also going to lose some as their mental faculties strive to catch up with their physical prowess. A Grand Slam with the 5 set format they're not going to be used to - especially in the heat of Australia (all these guys are European and just not used to that kind of heat - just the thought of those temperatures kills me :eek: !!) is obviously going to accentuate the problems. Just give them time.

True about the heat adjustments for them, but I've heard that the temperature has been relatively low so far this week.

megadeth
01-17-2006, 04:58 AM
Haven't seen the match so far, but looking at the stats:

Andy Murray
1st set - winners 3 - unforced errors 15
2nd set - winners 13 - unforced errors 17

Surely can't be nerves, he didn't have them at Wimbledon. :scratch:

in the eyes of some fans, murray always had nerves... "the nerve" that is...

e.g.
"the nerve of him saying this... saying that, etc."

hehehe :lol:

Bolar Bolabi
01-17-2006, 05:04 AM
Gasquet Sux. Murray Sux. Monfils Sux.

*Ljubica*
01-17-2006, 05:21 AM
True about the heat adjustments for them, but I've heard that the temperature has been relatively low so far this week.

Maybe by Australian standards - but it's below freezing here - so it's all relative :) I personally suffer heat exhaustion in anything over 25 degrees C and that's not playing tennis :eek:

Mistaflava
01-17-2006, 06:42 AM
yeah and Wayne Arthurs...those guys are too young



:eek:

TheBoiledEgg
01-17-2006, 07:17 AM
how did JOKEovic lost to a over the hill journeyman like Goldstein :rolleyes:

others are more reasonable.
Haas always was predicted.

Murray over-rated.
Monfils sick.

Conita
01-17-2006, 07:38 AM
=(
all my favs r going
this sucks!
its bad enough that Safin is not playing but now the young ones are going :(((

Jogy
01-17-2006, 07:48 AM
yes that was a bit patetic, most of all from Djokovic and Monfils
Murray also no chance to Chela, must improve lot
Gasquet not enough training after his injury

vincayou
01-17-2006, 08:13 AM
French TV allowed me to watch Monfils and Gasquet.

Monfils was sick it seems. On the other hand, he was again playing too defensively, taking zero opportunity to attack. It was boring to watch, awful. And as he was not defending as well as usual, so there was nothing less.

Hopefully, they switched on Gasquet. It was at least very entertaining. Beautiful exchanges between the players. I think that he could have won the 2nd set. He had 2 balls of double break at 3-1 and winning his serve easily. When he lost his serve later in the set, he was trying to win points too quickly. Haas on the other hand was taking every opporitunity and was very solid. Rotten draw if you ask me, Gasquet would have won agaisnt many players yesterday. Then he failed to convert many breakpoint opportunity at the beginning of the 3rd (2 easy putaway in the net) and started to get angry when he was broken on his next serve. Then I know how it would end and switched off the tv. It was quite late. :)

TNX1.0E6TOPCA
01-17-2006, 12:45 PM
pfft... big mouth! little balls! :p

Castafiore
01-17-2006, 01:24 PM
It sure is a surprising result. I certainly didn't expect Monfils to get out so soon. Okay, so many predicted that Haas was going to beat Gasquet but how many predicted a straight sets victory? Murray is another surprise to me - not the defeat itself but the way he was defeated by some accounts.
(sadly, I didn't see any of those matches)

But I don't think that we should attach too much importance to one match per young player,
Therefor, an article like the following one seems a bit unfair to me although it seems to be more about the way they reacted to their defeat in the press conference afterwards.
Young hopes a threat to Federer? You're kidding
By Jake Niall
January 18, 2006

http://www.theage.com.au/ffximage/2006/01/17/svGAEL_narrowweb__300x409.jpg
On the evidence presented yesterday, Roger Federer has little to fear from the teen upstarts of Great Britain and France. Not in 2006 or 2007, in any case. If anyone has cause for concern, given yesterday's dismal showings by the wunderkinds, it is Pete Sampras, whose record of 14 grand slam titles isn't safe.

French pair Richard Gasquet and Gael Monfils and Brit Andy Murray are the best known representatives of the teenage "next generation" of men's tennis — assuming one does not count Raphael Nadal, a genuine prodigy. Yesterday, none of the trio managed to win a set in the opening round of the first grand slam of 2006.

Monfils was embarrassed by Peruvian Luis Horna 6-4, 7-5, 6-1, in a performance that belied both his seeding (22) and the optimistic perception that the tall Parisian is coming fast. Gasquet was dismantled by German Tommy Haas, admittedly a high-calibre opponent, in a prototype boy-versus-man match that contradicted the misleading rankings (Gasquet was seeded 14, Haas unseeded).

"He is a great player," Gasquet said of Haas, who also once bore the unwanted burden of being "the next Becker", and to date, has not met the grandiose plans others devised for him. Perhaps the career of Haas, only now picking himself off the canvas, should be a cautionary tale for those pumping air into the shoes of Gasquet, Monfils and Murray.

Monfils all but blamed an illness he had carried since he bombed at Kooyong last week. He said he had "no energy" yesterday and couldn't play his game. What should be worrying for his boosters wasn't so much the validity of the excuse — something was amiss — but his haste in making one.

Then came Murray, the great white hype of Great Britain — the Scottish lad in whom the English media have invested so much in the hope that, at the least, he will replacing the outgoing Tim Henman and give them someone to stalk around the globe.

Murray fared arguably even worse than his French peers in his drubbing by Juan Ignatio Chela, though in launching an exasperated strike against the British press, he at least gave them something to ponder and write about.

Murray's frustration on the court — he received a warning for smashing his racquet and wore a pained expression whenever things went against him, which was often — was actually exceeded by his display of teen angst in the media conference.

Turning fire on the British media for building unrealistic expectations, Murray, 18, referred several times to "you guys", complaining that the UK media expected him "to win all these matches". He finished with his head lowered in his hands, seemingly pushing back tears.

I mean, none of the teenagers played well today," he said, pointedly noting that Chela was ranked 20 places or so higher. "I think we're not going to play well every week … even Federer, it took him a while before he started to play as well as he is now."

Some of the English media were clearly startled by Murray's emotional response, for they had nursed the view that their great Scot had been treated kindly. "That was a bad performance on the court but an even worse one in the press conference," said one veteran British scribe.

It was noted by a few of Murray's alleged tormentors, too, that he had just signed a six-figure deal to write columns for London's primo tabloid The Sun, an organ not renowned for sensitivity to famous young sportsmen.

Murray believed that British media applied a heavier-duty blowtorch than their French and American counterparts. He wasn't sure about Australia. In part, Murray's problem is simple mathematics. France has several high-quality tennis players of both sexes, as does America, which is less interested in tennis anyway.

The UK has a vast tennis infrastructure, the world's biggest tournament, but no home-grown players despite the dollars pumped into the game, besides Murray and Henman. It has about two dozen or so journalists covering this tournament and with Henman finished on day one, Murray was facing an intimidating ratio of around 25 to 1.

Murray is, at this early stage, a more emotive and blunt customer than was Henman, so proper, reserved and upwardly mobile, he could play Hugh Grant's best mate. Murray is more Liam Gallagher. Regardless of how he fares, more vexed moments with the media are surely in store.

Novak Djokovic, of Serbia and Montenegro, was another beaten teenager, going down in four sets to American Paul Goldstein."
From: The Age.com.au
http://www.theage.com.au/news/tennis/young-hopes-a-threat-to-federer-youre-kidding/2006/01/17/1137466992602.html?page=2


- Murray has a point: the British press ARE building up the hype and expectations around him to ridiculous heights but I'm not sure whether pointing his finger at them during a press conference is the wise thing to do.
As far as I can tell, it's not a good idea to get on the bad side of certain sections of the UK press because they can get quite nasty if they set their eyes on a target. (I think that many of these teenagers could use a couple of lessons on how to deal with the press, but I digress)
- this is just one match per young player. I've read in the press that Gasquet plans to be in shape 100% in Marseille. Let's see what happens there in front of his homecrowd.
- Why don't they give these teenagers a bit of time to mature a bit more, to gain more experience,...? Sure, some of these defeats are very disappointing but it's a bit too soon to ridicule them for it. Some of these journalists expect them all to compete with a Federer at maestro level but are they forgettinget that the same Roger had to take his time to get to that level?
:rolleyes:

hitchhiker
01-17-2006, 01:36 PM
You forgot Carlos Moya, the other young gun.

young?

http://www.sundsvallspk.nu/images/sws/foto/gun.jpg

wcr
01-17-2006, 02:07 PM
There's one young gun still in the race. Tomas Berdych.

vincayou
01-17-2006, 02:20 PM
Jake Niall is a lazy idiot IMO.

1- No mention that Richie is coming back from an injury. But that does not suit his theory so he skips it. Or worse he doesn't know it.
2- First time I hear Monfils blaming an illness for a loss. In RG and in US open, he admitted that he hadn't played well enough.
3- Pressure from media on Murray is obvious and at 18, it can only affect him. Just go on BBC website to realize it. It's probably the first real setback in Andy's professional career so nothing really bad.

Truc
01-17-2006, 02:29 PM
2- First time I hear Monfils blaming an illness for a loss. In RG and in US open, he admitted that he hadn't played well enough.I agree, I read what Monfils said after the match, he does mention a cold, but he clearly says the main problem was mental and he couldn't deal with the pressure. His reaction after the match is fine, the article is completely biased. (His reaction in L'Équipe: http://www.menstennisforums.com/showpost.php?p=2940720&postcount=37)

uNIVERSE mAN
01-17-2006, 02:41 PM
in the eyes of some fans, murray always had nerves... "the nerve" that is...

e.g.
"the nerve of him saying this... saying that, etc."

hehehe :lol:

thanks for the example.

Merton
01-17-2006, 03:10 PM
Nothing extraordinary is happening, all of them will be back.

juanito7
01-17-2006, 03:21 PM
oh yeah they're gonna be back, btw, i think gasquet has improved a lot compared to his two firts matches of the year in doha and sydney, that makes me hope the best for him very soon...

mongo
01-17-2006, 04:22 PM
When he's in a slam draw, Goldstein has pulled a first round upset in the past. Though I thought Djokovic would prevail, I never trust Goldstein. The two Frenchmen threw in the towel. Chela beating Murray wasn't a surprise.

dmit424
01-17-2006, 04:28 PM
They are a little bit overhyped, imo. They are still not confident enough. All it takes to beat them, really, is a top-40 player who plays a consistent match. Gasquet, perhaps, is the exception, but he too demonstrated his youthfulness yesterday. None of these guys are phenoms like Nadal, so I am not sure if people are waiting for them to bust out into the semis or what?! But I don't think they are good enough at this point.

R.Federer
01-17-2006, 04:29 PM
Baghdatis is around, and I think he will do well and provide good competition against Robbi

case
01-17-2006, 05:02 PM
[QUOTE=dmit424]They are a little bit overhyped, imo. They are still not confident enough. All it takes to beat them, really, is a top-40 player who plays a consistent match. Gasquet, perhaps, is the exception, but he too demonstrated his youthfulness yesterday. None of these guys are phenoms like Nadal, QUOTE]

So where was your "phenom" Nadal?
A no show.

Gasquet hasnt played but two tournament matches in literally months. You try picking up something after a long lay off against a experienced opponent. At least Gasquet showed up knowing he wasnt in top form and knowing he would probably take a hit-from the press and fans. That actually shows maturity.

Nadal? Who knows why he didnt show up (apparently he wasnt injured) with his bulging muscles. Maybe he wants to enter the MR. Universe pageant instead. Or maybe he will only play on clay these days.

dmit424
01-17-2006, 05:12 PM
[QUOTE=dmit424]They are a little bit overhyped, imo. They are still not confident enough. All it takes to beat them, really, is a top-40 player who plays a consistent match. Gasquet, perhaps, is the exception, but he too demonstrated his youthfulness yesterday. None of these guys are phenoms like Nadal, QUOTE]

So where was your "phenom" Nadal?
A no show.

Gasquet hasnt played but two tournament matches in literally months. You try picking up something after a long lay off against a experienced opponent. At least Gasquet showed up knowing he wasnt in top form and knowing he would probably take a hit-from the press and fans. That actually shows maturity.

Nadal? Who knows why he didnt show up (apparently he wasnt injured) with his bulging muscles. Maybe he wants to enter the MR. Universe pageant instead. Or maybe he will only play on clay these days.


???
Why all the spiteful feelings? I can't say I am a fan of any of the young guns, including Nadal. Just going based on the accomplishments. And who are you to speak for Nadal, anyways?

Castafiore
01-17-2006, 05:16 PM
Nadal? Who knows why he didnt show up (apparently he wasnt injured) with his bulging muscles. Maybe he wants to enter the MR. Universe pageant instead. Or maybe he will only play on clay these days.
Is it really necessary to hit out like that at Nadal for no good reason?

Daniela_CABJ
01-17-2006, 06:01 PM
I haven't seen Gaël match, just parts of it.
Richard comes from a huge injury that kept him away for a long time (I think I said this probably 100 times during january). He has to play a little more to reach his level again and He was unlucky with the draw, Haas is playing really good.
Murray... well I don't like him and I'm happy Juan won! but I saw the match, Juan played really good, and Murray made a lot of silly mistakes.

Jimnik
01-17-2006, 07:14 PM
Who is the youngest player left in the draw now?

Rafa = Fed Killa
01-17-2006, 08:13 PM
Y do Gasquet fans have an obsession with attacking Nadal.

Do u guys want to be so much like Fed fans.

Gasquet = Mini Fed
Gasquet Fans = Mini Fed fans :D

Keep saying bad stuff about Nadal and maybe he will go away :rolleyes:

juanito7
01-17-2006, 08:13 PM
it might be either Berdych or Tipsarevic, i don't know who's trhe younger, Simon is just 20, if i'm right...

cincy
01-17-2006, 08:16 PM
Monfils was sick it seems. On the other hand, he was again playing too defensively, taking zero opportunity to attack. It was boring to watch, awful. And as he was not defending as well as usual, so there was nothing less.

I've managed to see Monfils play three times, in person, so far and I have been completely unimpressed by his game. :rolleyes: He never seems to have a plan when he's on the court. He just hangs back and hits hard and harder. :mad: He has the most boring game. I've tried to like him but I just can't. I hope he improves but I'm not expecting much.

I've not seen any of the others (except Nadel) in person but, I do feel they have been a bit overhyped over the past year. The press needs to chill and allow these guys to grow. I don't think the French press are nearly as bad as the Brit press. They are relentless. Poor Andy. :sad: He's just a baby.

Jimnik
01-17-2006, 08:19 PM
it might be either Berdych or Tipsarevic, i don't know who's trhe younger, Simon is just 20, if i'm right...
Yeah, it must be Berdych. He just turned 20 a couple of months ago.

case
01-17-2006, 08:33 PM
Is it really necessary to hit out like that at Nadal for no good reason?

I actually like Nadal. I'm just tired of comparisons between the young players to Nadal. His muscles are worthy of comment. How many people at the age of nineteen look like him? And even if he is clean everyone matures at different rates. And as for the no good reason-AGAIN HE IS A NO SHOW> GIVE ME AN ATHLETE-ANY ATHLETE-Who at least shows up to compete.

The worst player in the world outplayed Nadal at this years AO open.

I heard an athlete who was taking steroids make the comment once about the image of modern athletes. He said just ask yourself if that is how human beings look. Or if they look so muscular that they almost look deformed. A few female tennis players look like no woman I have ever seen as do some football players, swimmers, runners, etc. Strange that older athletes never were able to achieve that look before, isn't it?

World Beater
01-17-2006, 08:46 PM
I've managed to see Monfils play three times, in person, so far and I have been completely unimpressed by his game. :rolleyes: He never seems to have a plan when he's on the court. He just hangs back and hits hard and harder. :mad: He has the most boring game. I've tried to like him but I just can't. I hope he improves but I'm not expecting much.

.


:scratch: sounds like nadal. :nerner:

joking..i dont mind nadal.

Daniela_CABJ
01-17-2006, 09:10 PM
Y do Gasquet fans have an obsession with attacking Nadal.
I'm a Gasquet & Nadal fan :p


Tipsarevic was born in 1984 and Tomáš Berdych in 1985

_pyromatic
01-17-2006, 09:18 PM
I'm a Gasquet & Nadal fan :p

Me too :yeah:

Nadal is just more physically and mentally mature than the rest. Give them time :)

tangerine_dream
01-17-2006, 09:22 PM
Murray is starting to sound like Maria Sharapova :baby: "waaa! I'm only 18! Too much pressure!" Come on, since when did being young stop the good players from winning slams? Teenagers used to own the slams back in the day. ;)

Suzi
01-17-2006, 09:26 PM
Murray is starting to sound like Maria Sharapova :baby: "waaa! I'm only 18! Too much pressure!" Come on, since when did being young stop the good players from winning slams? Teenagers used to own the slams back in the day. ;)

hear hear

revolution
01-17-2006, 10:05 PM
Murray is starting to sound like Maria Sharapova :baby: "waaa! I'm only 18! Too much pressure!" Come on, since when did being young stop the good players from winning slams? Teenagers used to own the slams back in the day. ;)

Sometimes developing later is better.

Nadal is a rare commodity.

AgassiDomination
01-17-2006, 10:26 PM
You forgot Carlos Moya, the other young gun.

:lol:

dmit424
01-18-2006, 01:41 AM
I actually like Nadal. I'm just tired of comparisons between the young players to Nadal. His muscles are worthy of comment. How many people at the age of nineteen look like him? And even if he is clean everyone matures at different rates. And as for the no good reason-AGAIN HE IS A NO SHOW> GIVE ME AN ATHLETE-ANY ATHLETE-Who at least shows up to compete.

The worst player in the world outplayed Nadal at this years AO open.

I heard an athlete who was taking steroids make the comment once about the image of modern athletes. He said just ask yourself if that is how human beings look. Or if they look so muscular that they almost look deformed. A few female tennis players look like no woman I have ever seen as do some football players, swimmers, runners, etc. Strange that older athletes never were able to achieve that look before, isn't it?


Well, I can acknowledge where you are coming from, but if you read up about the development of modern sports, you will see that serious weight-training, for all sports, is a fairly new concept. Athletes in decades prior simply didn't spend all this time putting on muscle. Also, as you may know, genetics plays a large role. Just like NBA players are extraordinarily tall, some people are simply born more physically potent. Take someone like LeBron James. What, is that guy taking steroids AND some kind of growth pill?

I myself am an 18 year old who plays basketball, takes karate, and plays a little tennis. I have never even come close to the line of which lie steriods and such "enchancement" substances on the other side, yet I am 6'0. 180lbs, very fit... And I bet you would judge that I take steroids also, when in reality, I am so far from that stuff that I've never even seen a steroid pill or powder or whatever the heck it is.

Also, let alone the muscle thing, Nadal is a very talented player at age 19. Other players, such as Chang and Hewitt, not to metion many GREAT champions of the past, had won majors in their teens (or very close). Hewitt and Chang aren't exactly known for their poppin' forearms...

Gasquet is very good, but at this point immature, not as much in terms of his mentality (although that, also), but his game. He has loads of talent, and the breadth of it is arguably more impressive than Nadal's, but he just doesn't know how to use it. Will he eventually? Very likely. He's a good kid. But Agassi didn't start winning until an attitude change, and everyone who watches Kiefer knows that he has top-5 talent potentially, but his mental game isn't nearly up to par with Fed, Hewitt, Roddick, Safin, Nadal. Now, yes, Safin and Roddick aren't exactly known for their "mental" game, but they have shown that they know exactly what their strengths are and know how to utilize them to their full effeciency. Gasquet hasn't learned this yet. He plays wacky and weird sometimes, he gets down on himself at all the wrong moments, he makes mistakes he shouldn't make.

Gasquet is an amazing talent, but his mind is still not on par with his abilities. Simple as that. I am sure it will be, however.

fyi
01-18-2006, 02:52 AM
They were over-rated.

federated
01-18-2006, 06:50 AM
let's add berdych to that long list. help me, bhagdatis, you're my only hope.