2nd Roland Garros doping case in addition to Argentine rumors? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

2nd Roland Garros doping case in addition to Argentine rumors?

vogus
10-01-2005, 04:35 AM
apparently there has been a definitive confirmation by the FFT that one of the players who reached the round of 16 this year has tested positive on both their samples, and that a tribunal is investigating - is this the same case as the mystery Argentine, or a new one? As far as i know there is not even a confirmation on the sex of this player, let alone nationality.

star
10-01-2005, 04:36 AM
:eek:

savesthedizzle
10-01-2005, 04:38 AM
Reached the Round of 16... as in that's the farthest they went? Because if it was someone who got to the quarterfinals they'd have said "someone who got to the quarterfinals."

So who lost in the Round of 16? Any possibilites?

vogus
10-01-2005, 04:41 AM
Reached the Round of 16... as in that's the farthest they went? Because if it was someone who got to the quarterfinals they'd have said "someone who got to the quarterfinals."
?


Not necessarily. It was someone who REACHED the round of 16, it doesn't mean they lost there.

+alonso
10-01-2005, 04:41 AM
lost in R16
Aca
Nal
Gau
Cor

cecilija
10-01-2005, 04:47 AM
i think it is a player at least reached the fourt round

savesthedizzle
10-01-2005, 04:47 AM
Not necessarily. It was someone who REACHED the round of 16, it doesn't mean they lost there.


But no source is going to call it that if there is a more specific term for them. I mean, if they were a quarterfinalist, they're going to say "Someone who reached the quarterfinals tested positive." It doesn't make sense to say Round of 16 unless that was the farthest they got. They might as well just say, "Someone who played in RG this year tested positive" if they're going to make it more vague than it really is.

cecilija
10-01-2005, 04:48 AM
it is not confirmed if the player is argentine yet

savesthedizzle
10-01-2005, 04:49 AM
lost in R16
Aca
Nal
Gau
Cor


And if those 4 all lost in the Round of 16, I think there's a pretty good chance that's what they meant, since Canas was already discovered. If it really is an Argentine.

vogus
10-01-2005, 04:50 AM
But no source is going to call it that if there is a more specific term for them. I mean, if they were a quarterfinalist, they're going to say "Someone who reached the quarterfinals tested positive." It doesn't make sense to say Round of 16 unless that was the farthest they got. They might as well just say, "Someone who played in RG this year tested positive" if they're going to make it more vague than it really is.


well, if you're right, then chances are pretty good it was an Argentine, since 4 of them lost in R16 (unless the positive is from WTA). So maybe it's just the same case we have already heard rumors about.

NYCtennisfan
10-01-2005, 05:35 AM
Very interesting.....

basil333
10-01-2005, 07:35 AM
I am an Argentine Tennis Fan - it really makes me mad that as soon as there is a doping scandal it is automatically an Argentine. OK I KNOW that Chela, Coria, Puerta and now Canas have all been punished... but people seem to over look Korda, Ulirich, Koubeck and Oliver in their constant accusations.... I also agree with the fact Agassi seems to be very picky with his tournament choices and also find it extremely suspicious that one month he is a complete cripple, quote him "walking like an old man in the street" to next month US OPEN Finalist.... - but as I said in another post, people like him will NEVER be punished, as after all this would be bad for Tennis.

The point of my post is for people to realise that there have been other doping cases.... not all doping cases are Argentine Players.

It just seems to be that the Argentine Players are easy scapegoats. How would people react if the guilty party in question is NOT an Argentine, maybe a Spaniard, a Russian, a Croat or even a Swiss.. would there be an MTF thread entitled - Apologies to the Argentine Players???? I doubt it.

Chloe le Bopper
10-01-2005, 07:37 AM
I am an Argentine Tennis Fan - it really makes me mad that as soon as there is a doping scandal it is automatically an Argentine. OK I KNOW that Chela, Coria, Puerta and now Canas have all been punished... but people seem to over look Korda, Ulirich, Koubeck and Oliver in their constant accusations.... I also agree with the fact Agassi seems to be very picky with his tournament choices and also find it extremely suspicious that one month he is a complete cripple, quote him "walking like an old man in the street" to next month US OPEN Finalist.... - but as I said in another post, people like him will NEVER be punished, as after all this would be bad for Tennis.

The point of my post is for people to realise that there have been other doping cases.... not all doping cases are Argentine Players.

It just seems to be that the Argentine Players are easy scapegoats. How would people react if the guilty party in question is NOT an Argentine, maybe a Spaniard, a Russian, a Croat or even a Swiss.. would there be an MTF thread entitled - Apologies to the Argentine Players???? I doubt it.
Bogomolov, the most recent asthma victim, will not get any of the flack that Puerta does. Lucky him.

Action Jackson
10-01-2005, 07:44 AM
The point of my post is for people to realise that there have been other doping cases.... not all doping cases are Argentine Players.

It just seems to be that the Argentine Players are easy scapegoats. How would people react if the guilty party in question is NOT an Argentine, maybe a Spaniard, a Russian, a Croat or even a Swiss.. would there be an MTF thread entitled - Apologies to the Argentine Players???? I doubt it.

Didn't you know only Argentine players are using drugs, so we are led to believe of course.

skel1983
10-01-2005, 08:08 AM
I am an Argentine Tennis Fan - it really makes me mad that as soon as there is a doping scandal it is automatically an Argentine. OK I KNOW that Chela, Coria, Puerta and now Canas have all been punished... but people seem to over look Korda, Ulirich, Koubeck and Oliver in their constant accusations.... I also agree with the fact Agassi seems to be very picky with his tournament choices and also find it extremely suspicious that one month he is a complete cripple, quote him "walking like an old man in the street" to next month US OPEN Finalist.... - but as I said in another post, people like him will NEVER be punished, as after all this would be bad for Tennis.

The point of my post is for people to realise that there have been other doping cases.... not all doping cases are Argentine Players.

It just seems to be that the Argentine Players are easy scapegoats. How would people react if the guilty party in question is NOT an Argentine, maybe a Spaniard, a Russian, a Croat or even a Swiss.. would there be an MTF thread entitled - Apologies to the Argentine Players???? I doubt it.


Wait a minute mate, you are very funny, you are calling people for assuming it's an Argentine, and your not happy with this BUT YOU THEN GO ON ABOUT AGASSI!!!!!!!! ASSUMING HE HAS TAKEN DRUGS PLEASE TELL ME WHATS THE DIFFERENCE!!!!!!!

David Kenzie
10-01-2005, 08:14 AM
But no source is going to call it that if there is a more specific term for them. I mean, if they were a quarterfinalist, they're going to say "Someone who reached the quarterfinals tested positive." It doesn't make sense to say Round of 16 unless that was the farthest they got. They might as well just say, "Someone who played in RG this year tested positive" if they're going to make it more vague than it really is.

I think the original source of this news said that he or she reached the 2nd week. So anyone who played on or after the second Monday is concerned.

basil333
10-01-2005, 09:05 AM
The difference is.... all Argentines have been painted Guilty whether they are innocent or not... and I suggest you study the form of the elite of the elite players and tell me you are not suspicious of any of their playing patterns and convince me that you are not 100% sure that they are all 100% clean...

I chose Agassi as an example as everyone else paints the Argentines as guilty parties regardless and as your post proves... you didnt like it.... now you know how us Argentine fans feel when everyone we support gets the Guilty brush painted over them.

For the record... I suggest you read the thread "Agassi Dop
ed" - it is at least 15 pages long.... - have a coffee and happy reading.

http://www.menstennisforums.com/showthread.php?t=54747

sigmagirl91
10-01-2005, 09:35 AM
Unfortunately, when it comes to the topic of doping these days, the Argentines are automatically, without thought or reason, implicated; whether they're guilty or innocent is not even important.

If the names are revealed, and they're not Argentine, still....the Argentine tennis community will be shaken to its core. Every Argentine player's integrity will be called into question every time they step onto a court. Do they need that kind of pressure or scrutiny? I think not.

sigmagirl91
10-01-2005, 09:36 AM
I think the original source of this news said that he or she reached the 2nd week. So anyone who played on or after the second Monday is concerned.

According to a certain article I had read, the culprit reached the quarterfinals. If that's the truth, then Acasuso, Coria, Gaudio, and Nalbandian are automatically eliminated from further scrutiny.

sigmagirl91
10-01-2005, 09:46 AM
Wait a minute mate, you are very funny, you are calling people for assuming it's an Argentine, and your not happy with this BUT YOU THEN GO ON ABOUT AGASSI!!!!!!!! ASSUMING HE HAS TAKEN DRUGS PLEASE TELL ME WHATS THE DIFFERENCE!!!!!!!

The nationality. Like she said, if the guilty party is not Argentine, then there would be no further discussion.

*Ljubica*
10-01-2005, 10:22 AM
I am an Argentine Tennis Fan - it really makes me mad that as soon as there is a doping scandal it is automatically an Argentine. OK I KNOW that Chela, Coria, Puerta and now Canas have all been punished... but people seem to over look Korda, Ulirich, Koubeck and Oliver in their constant accusations.... I also agree with the fact Agassi seems to be very picky with his tournament choices and also find it extremely suspicious that one month he is a complete cripple, quote him "walking like an old man in the street" to next month US OPEN Finalist.... - but as I said in another post, people like him will NEVER be punished, as after all this would be bad for Tennis.

The point of my post is for people to realise that there have been other doping cases.... not all doping cases are Argentine Players.

It just seems to be that the Argentine Players are easy scapegoats. How would people react if the guilty party in question is NOT an Argentine, maybe a Spaniard, a Russian, a Croat or even a Swiss.. would there be an MTF thread entitled - Apologies to the Argentine Players???? I doubt it.

:worship: :worship: Brilliant post!!!

Carlita
10-01-2005, 10:59 AM
According to a certain article I had read, the culprit reached the quarterfinals. If that's the truth, then Acasuso, Coria, Gaudio, and Nalbandian are automatically eliminated from further scrutiny. So that would be: Federer, Hanescu, Nadal, Ferrer, Davydenko, Robredo, Cañas & Puerta.

And if the culprit didn't go beyond the QF : Hanescu, Ferrer, Robredo & Cañas...

:scratch: were they not talking about Cañas then?? *confuzzled*

sigmagirl91
10-01-2005, 11:03 AM
So that would be: Federer, Hanescu, Nadal, Ferrer, Davydenko, Robredo, Cañas & Puerta.

And if the culprit didn't go beyond the QF : Hanescu, Ferrer, Robredo & Cañas...

:scratch: were they not talking about Cañas then?? *confuzzled*

The issue is not that "black and white". They say they have someone, but are not releasing any names until this "tribunal" confirms their findings.

Carlita
10-01-2005, 11:05 AM
The issue is not that "black and white". They say they have someone, but are not releasing any names until this "tribunal" confirms their findings.oh okay. I don't get why they would let out things without naming names.....best not say anything until it's confirmed! This way people will only acuse everything and everyone!! :sad:

sigmagirl91
10-01-2005, 11:13 AM
oh okay. I don't get why they would let out things without naming names.....best not say anything until it's confirmed! This way people will only acuse everything and everyone!! :sad:

The newspapers seem to have confirmed in their minds and on paper, of course, that an Argentine is involved. The law of averages is at work here. You do the math.

Carlita
10-01-2005, 11:16 AM
The newspapers seem to have confirmed in their minds and on paper, of course, that an Argentine is involved. The law of averages is at work here. You do the math.that sucks! But what can we do against the press??? :shrug: That's why ATP should keep their mouths shut until all's confirmed.....

Jelena
10-01-2005, 11:26 AM
that sucks! But what can we do against the press??? :shrug: That's why ATP should keep their mouths shut until all's confirmed.....
Actually it is the JOB of the newspapers/the journalists to look for scandals in any way (not necessarily doping scandals, but others too). And especially the French press has experience with dope scandals, which in the most cases, have been later revealed as true...

sigmagirl91
10-01-2005, 11:35 AM
that sucks! But what can we do against the press??? :shrug: That's why ATP should keep their mouths shut until all's confirmed.....

Actually, the ATP was not involved in the doping controls at the GS events; the ITF was. No one from the ATP has released an official statement of confirmation, pending the tribunal's findings.

~EMiLiTA~
10-01-2005, 11:36 AM
i also think it's stupid to release this and then nothing more...nothing should have been released until concrete info and names were known cos this just breeds speculation and convalution which is not fair to players

Galaxystorm
10-01-2005, 11:41 AM
According to a certain article I had read, the culprit reached the quarterfinals. If that's the truth, then Acasuso, Coria, Gaudio, and Nalbandian are automatically eliminated from further scrutiny.

Are you talking about the argentine positive or about the mysterious second possible positive ??

And the article that you read is this ?? http://www.rionegro.com.ar/arch200509/30/adelantos/rr.php

mangoes
10-01-2005, 11:56 AM
Are you talking about the argentine positive or about the mysterious second possible positive ??

And the article that you read is this ?? http://www.rionegro.com.ar/arch200509/30/adelantos/rr.php

Well, coria was complaining about arg being targeted.................maybe he knew something was brewing.

Carlita
10-01-2005, 12:06 PM
Actually, the ATP was not involved in the doping controls at the GS events; the ITF was. No one from the ATP has released an official statement of confirmation, pending the tribunal's findings.well ATP ITF...they both suck! ;)

Jelena
10-01-2005, 12:07 PM
And the article that you read is this ?? http://www.rionegro.com.ar/arch200509/30/adelantos/rr.php
No, the article everything began with (the original source) is this: http://www.equipe.fr/Tennis/20050930_090531Dev.html

I try to give a rough translation for those, who don't speak/understand French:

In its Friday (30.9.2005) edition the daily newspaper "L'Equipe" announces that there has been marked a doping-case among Roland Garros. One probe of the 152 taken this year is marked positive on a banned stimulanting substance. The second probe confirms the first result. It appears, that it is a m/f player, who was present in the second week, so someone who qualified either for the 4th round in Singles or QF in Doubles tournament.
The identity of the player has not yet been announced, "following our rules, that the case first has to be dealt with by a tribunal of three independent members, who are chosen of the lest of judges of the CAS."
There is also the talk of "an Argentinian track", so this would mean that there are 14 persons in suspect, who reached the second week in all competitions. (Seniors and Juniors competition)

Reading that article very accurate, they don't actually say, that it is again an Argentine case of doping, but that there is on one hand the doping case while RG and on the other hand the track to Argentina.

Action Jackson
10-01-2005, 12:08 PM
What are you doing Dick Pound? Get your gang from the WADA and take over the testing of tennis.

*Ljubica*
10-01-2005, 12:08 PM
Are you talking about the argentine positive or about the mysterious second possible positive ??

And the article that you read is this ?? http://www.rionegro.com.ar/arch200509/30/adelantos/rr.php

As far as I'm aware there is no second case - the Roland Garros press reports yesterday were just more definate confirmation of the original rumurs that have been going round for a while now - so there is only one.

Nathaliia
10-01-2005, 12:26 PM
There is also the talk of "an Argentinian track", so this would mean that there are 14 persons in suspect, who reached the second week in all competitions. (Seniors and Juniors competition)
Junior? But it isn't JMDP, is it? ;) my godness i'm really starting having fun of all those articles and accusations...

Galaxystorm
10-01-2005, 12:35 PM
Let's see

I was just asking Sigmargirl91 if the article she had read is that argentine article.

If she's quoting that article the problem is that she has read badly and when she says " the culprit reached QF " she is wrong because that argentine new just says the player reached second week , Round 16.

KFB
10-01-2005, 12:42 PM
Coria spoke to the newspaper " El Clarin" in Argentina about this case of doping in Rolland Garros : http://www.clarin.com/diario/2005/10/01/deportes/d-08303.htm.
Of corse, it is in spanish, but here it goes:
TENIS : ENTREVISTA A GUILLERMO CORIA

"Que lo del dóping sólo sea un rumor"







--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
—El diario francés L'Equipe publicó una noticia sobre la existencia de un dóping positivo en Roland Garros e insinuó que el tenista involucrado sería argentino. ¿Qué sensación te produce esto?

—Me preocupa. Es muy feo escribir algo así si no se está seguro porque se estaría ensuciando no sólo a un jugador sino también a un país. Ojalá que lo del dóping sólo sea un rumor, que no sea verdad. Y lo afirmo por todo lo que se vive en un caso así, más allá de que el involucrado sea o no sea argentino.

—¿Creés, como piensan muchos argentinos, que puede haber una especie de complot contra los tenistas de nuestro país?

—Lo que yo digo es que estoy feliz de que me hagan los controles antidóping. Ojalá que se los hagan a todos los jugadores y no sólo a los argentinos. Si uno no está sucio, si no tiene nada que ocultar, no debe tener ningún problema en que le hagan el control. Después, los resultados son otra cosa... Quiero creer que se hace todo bien... En lo personal, insisto, creo que está bien que se hagan controles.

—Esta semana se conoció la sanción por el positivo que dio el estadounidense Alex Bogomolov Jr. en el Abierto de Australia. Se lo penó apenas con un mes y medio de inactividad... Guillermo Cañas recibió dos años...

—Sí, parece que no se le dio tanta importancia a lo de Bogomolov... Y acordate de lo de (Bohdan) Ulihrach y de lo de (Greg) Rusedski... Ellos fueron sancionados y después se les conmutó la pena...

ROSARIO. ENVIADO ESPECIAL

Hope he really has nothing to do with this.

Jelena
10-01-2005, 01:19 PM
Junior? But it isn't JMDP, is it? ;) my godness i'm really starting having fun of all those articles and accusations...
They just said that there were 14 Argentinians (counting all competitions together), who were at the beginning of the 2nd week still active....

sigmagirl91
10-01-2005, 02:00 PM
Let's see

I was just asking Sigmargirl91 if the article she had read is that argentine article.

If she's quoting that article the problem is that she has read badly and when she says " the culprit reached QF " she is wrong because that argentine new just says the player reached second week , Round 16.

No, the article I read translated to read "quarterfinal"; now if "quarterfinal" now reads "round of 16", then the article is wrong. Don't get mad at me; get mad at the person who wrote the article, OK.

sigmagirl91
10-01-2005, 02:03 PM
Are you talking about the argentine positive or about the mysterious second possible positive ??

And the article that you read is this ?? http://www.rionegro.com.ar/arch200509/30/adelantos/rr.php

I am talking about both instances. Now, whether the so-called second positive derived from the first...I don't know.
If the article was translated incorrectly all along, then the meaning and intent are lost.

Carito_90
10-01-2005, 02:13 PM
Yesterday Gaudio gave an interview on tv and he said "I just found out about this doping case, and all I know is what you just told me (the reporter) but it's a pity and really sad... I want to believe there's is no such thing as a complot going on against us because that'd make it really hard for us to play. I have no idea of who might have been... I don't know, as far as I know, I'm not involved so..."

So yeah, if he said it, I don't think he'd lie like that or even give an interview regarding the subject.

Nalbandian also said he knew nothing about it when they interviewed him in Slovakia, saying he had only found out because of what the reporter had just told him.

I don't know... the only one I haven't heard talking was Puerta so... I'm not sure, I don't want to make any assumptions or anything but yeah...

That's all.

Neely
10-01-2005, 02:21 PM
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