Please explain to me how Noam Okun got a "Lucky Loser" spot. [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Please explain to me how Noam Okun got a "Lucky Loser" spot.

TOP100
07-27-2005, 10:17 AM
How does a player get a LL spot if he loses in the 1st round of qualifying.?

Can someone explain this to me....thanks.

JMG
07-27-2005, 10:24 AM
Because he was the next best player who signed in for a LL spot. The 2nd round losers probably didn't sign in and left LA.

TOP100
07-27-2005, 10:28 AM
Not true.

Glenn is there right now,he's with Tommy,that's why I'm confused.

And Glenn lost in the second round of quallies,not the first.

ae wowww
07-27-2005, 10:50 AM
Did Glenn sign in as a lucky loser? I understand that he's present, but if he didn't sign in or something...?

smucav
07-27-2005, 03:32 PM
Because he was the next best player who signed in for a LL spot. The 2nd round losers probably didn't sign in and left LA.This is the right answer. Players have to sign-in every day until a ball has been struck in all first round matches (& in tournaments with first round byes, all second round matches) to be eligible for a lucky loser spot. If they don't sign in, they are not eligible even if they're higher ranked.

2005 ATP Offical Rulebook:A. Lucky Loser Selection
A player may be entered in the main draw of a Tournament if he meets the criteria outlined
for a Lucky Loser.
1) Lucky Losers are players who have lost in the final round of the qualifying event or, if
more Lucky Losers are required, those players who have lost in the previous qualifying
round(s). The Lucky Losers shall be selected on the basis of their position on the
INDESIT ATP Entry Ranking (Singles) List (Entry Protection is not considered) used for
the determination of qualifying seeding; that is, the Lucky Loser with the highest
Entry Ranking position shall be the first inserted into the main draw and so forth. Only
those accepted into the qualifying competition may sign in as Lucky Losers.
2) The Lucky Loser list shall be posted each day at least one (1) hour before the sign-in
deadline, which shall be one-half (1/2) hour before the first scheduled match of the
day. If rain or other disruptions occur, then the Supervisor can change the deadline as
appropriate. Such list shall not be available for sign-in on the preceding day. All Lucky
Loser sign-in deadlines must be placed on each day’s schedule of play.

TOP100
07-27-2005, 03:35 PM
Well maybe he didn't sign in,I'll know just now when he answers my SMS to him.

Could be a very expensive mistake in $$$,and points.

mad1town
07-27-2005, 04:15 PM
Top100...here is a partical article from the LA Times...SMUCAV is correct.

+++++++++++++

"...There were injuries, illness and upsets on the second day, culminated by the weird sight of not one, but two lucky losers strolling out onto the stadium court to play the second featured night match.

Mardy Fish and Taylor Dent of Newport Beach both withdrew from the tournament earlier in the evening, which resulted in the insertion of Dmitry Tursunov of Russia and Noam Okun of Israel into the draw, who had both lost in qualifying. Fish and Dent were supposed to play each other after top-seeded Andre Agassi defeated another lucky loser, Jean-Rene Lisnard of France, 6-1, 6-0, in the first round.

Dent cited the heat exhaustion he suffered in Indianapolis on Sunday, which forced him to quit playing in the third set of the final against Robby Ginepri. Fish, meanwhile, said his wrist injury was still healing.

And so, Okun may have been the luckiest loser considering he went out in the first round of qualifying, but had the wisdom (or vision?) to put his name on the lucky loser sign-in sheet. Though Tursunov beat Okun, 6-1, 6-2, in 53 minutes, Okun still earned $3,650 for the effort..."

Deboogle!.
07-27-2005, 04:43 PM
smart guy, that Okun... lol.

TOP100
07-27-2005, 05:56 PM
[B][The Lucky Losers shall be selected on the basis of their position on the
INDESIT ATP Entry Ranking (Singles) List (Entry Protection is not considered) used for
the determination of qualifying seeding; that is, the Lucky Loser with the highest
Entry Ranking position shall be the first inserted into the main draw and so forth/B]

Am I understanding this correctly,because if I am then it's an insane rule,which is typical of the ATP,so it doesn't surprise me one little bit.

Does this mean that even if a player loses in first round Quallies,he can still get the Lucky Loser spot because of his ATP ranking.
So because of his ranking he gets the spot before a player that loses in the 2nd round of Quallies who has a lower ranking.

That's so stupid it's almost impossible to believe.

TOP100
07-27-2005, 06:14 PM
Okay just got an SMS from Glenn.

This was a complete freak event.

There were 6 players before Glenn on the LL list...so Glenn didn't bother signing in.
All 6 players had left the tournament,Glenn knows this because they phoned him to tell him he was the next LL.

Anyway,Noam had signed in for the Doubles LL spot,so for the hell of it he signed in for the singles LL as well....that's why he got in.

binkygirl
07-27-2005, 06:27 PM
Okay just got an SMS from Glenn.

This was a complete freak event.

There were 6 players before Glenn on the LL list...so Glenn didn't bother signing in.
All 6 players had left the tournament,Glenn knows this because they phoned him to tell him he was the next LL.

Anyway,Noam had signed in for the Doubles LL spot,so for the hell of it he signed in for the singles LL as well....that's why he got in.

I hope Glenn is not beating himself up over this. Tell him he is a swell chap for me, please.

TOP100
07-27-2005, 06:43 PM
I hope Glenn is not beating himself up over this. Tell him he is a swell chap for me, please.

Not at all,Glenn is a very relaxed kind of guy,nothing really bothers him....he'll just take it in his stride,although he could have done with the money,and points. :D

Who shall I tell him say's he's a swell chap....what's your name.?

nitsansh
07-28-2005, 12:40 AM
Noam would have been 13th in order of consideration for LL, but apparently 10 players ahead of him didn't sign in, so after Tursunov he was the next player on the list.

Here is the LL order:
1 (2)Jean-Rene Lisnard (FRA) 106
2 (4)Dmitry Tursunov (RUS) 119
3 (7)Ivo Heuberger (SUI) 187
4 (WC)Jamil Al Agba (USA) NR
5 (3)Giovanni Lapentti (ECU) 114
6 (6)Chris Guccione (AUS) 175
7 (8)Mark Philippoussis (AUS) 204
8 Glenn Weiner (USA) 207
9 Eric Taino (USA) 331
10 Karan Rastogi (IND) 592
11 Robert Yim (USA) 610
12 Mashiska Washington (USA) 864
13 (5)Noam Okun (ISR) 144

TauRuZ
07-28-2005, 01:50 PM
I keep wondering what if Okun didn't sign in and no qualie loser listed below him sign in. What the tournament will do?

tal20
07-28-2005, 09:45 PM
i think in a case like that one of the playrs
in the main draw gets a wildcard...

TOP100
07-29-2005, 04:59 PM
It seems to me Noam was caught by surprise when he was told he was playing.

He seemed to lose to easily,had he been prepared he would have played a better match.

smucav
07-29-2005, 11:41 PM
Am I understanding this correctly,because if I am then it's an insane rule,which is typical of the ATP,so it doesn't surprise me one little bit.

Does this mean that even if a player loses in first round Quallies,he can still get the Lucky Loser spot because of his ATP ranking.
So because of his ranking he gets the spot before a player that loses in the 2nd round of Quallies who has a lower ranking.No, you left out the first (& most important) sentence of the rule:Lucky Losers are players who have lost in the final round of the qualifying event or, if more Lucky Losers are required, those players who have lost in the previous qualifying round(s).In this case, more were required.

I keep wondering what if Okun didn't sign in and no qualie loser listed below him sign in. What the tournament will do?Higher ranked lucky losers who missed the sign-in (or ones who did sign in, but were not ready to play when called if that's the case) would become the next lucky losers in line.