Federer vs Henman: can Tim win? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Federer vs Henman: can Tim win?

tangerine_dream
03-30-2005, 04:46 PM
I know the idea may be laughable to some but seeing as how Tim's been on fire all week and Zombie Roger has had his pretty head down in the bowl all week, then it's quite possible Tim could pull off a win.

Then again, Roger tends to lift his game when he needs to. He's been on cruise-control so far with these lower-ranked players whom he knows he can get away with playing sloppy. He's been going through the motions. He won't be asleep when Tim shows up, that's for sure.

Either way, I'm really looking forward to this match. :banana:

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20050326/capt.flla12603262044.nasdaq_100_open_flla126.jpght tp://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/afp/20050330/capt.sge.cck67.300305063724.photo02.photo.default-260x384.jpg

Henman confident of Federer shock

British number one Tim Henman insists he can upset all-conquering world number one Roger Federer when they meet in Thursday's Nasdaq-100 quarter-final.

Henman has a favourable 6-3 record against the Swiss ace, but Federer has won the last two matches.

"There are plenty of guys with far better groundstrokes than me and he dominates them," Henman said.

"When I take his time away I think it gives him far less opportunity to show the repertoire of shots he has got."

"You don't want to be rushing everything so suddenly that you make a whole host of unforced errors, but I want to be aggressive."

Federer, who had to go to three sets in the two previous rounds, is aware than Henman can provide problems for him.

"Tim and I are good buddies, we get along well," the 23-year-old said.

"He gives you a tough match because he keeps coming at you. I've lost to him several times and I expect a tough match."

Henman admitted that a totally gung-ho attitude would not be advisable against a player of Federer's calibre.

"There's that fine line," he said. "You don't want to be rushing everything so suddenly that you make a whole host of unforced errors, but I want to be aggressive and really have that feeling of going for it."

- - - - - -

Henman not worried about Federer

Tim Henman hopes he can improve on an already impressive record against Roger Federer when the pair meet in the last eight of the Nasdaq-100 Open in Miami tomorrow.

Although world No1 Federer has won their last two encounters, Henman still holds a 6-3 advantage in career meetings.

British No1 Henman, seeded six at this ATP Masters Series event, moved into the last eight with a 7-6, 6-3 win over Czech Radek Stepanek.

Top seed Federer, 23, survived a tough encounter with Croatia's Mario Ancic, dropping a set for the second successive match before prevailing 6-3, 4-6, 6-4 against the 18th seed.

Looking ahead to Thursday's clash, 30-yearold Henman joked: "I'm one of the few guys who has a good record against Roger, although I think I beat him a couple of times when he was just 13 or 14. More recently he's taken the game to a new level and his record over the last 16 months has been phenomenal.

"But there will be no pressure or expectation on me so I can just focus on the things I'm doing well and see what happens.

"He's had a couple of tough matches - dropping a set against both Mariano Zabaleta and Ancic - and hopefully I can create a few opportunities.

"I've already beaten him six times so let's hope I can make it seven."

The pair flew to Miami together on a private jet and Federer admitted they are good friends off the court.

"We're good buddies. We get along well," said last year's Wimbledon champion. "But he gives you a tough match because he keeps coming at you.

"I think outdoors he's not as good as indoors, but I still won't underestimate him. I've lost to him several times and I expect a tough match tomorrow."

Elsewhere in the men's draw, six-times champion Andre Agassi went through to the last eight after beating French Open champion Gaston Gaudio 7-6, 6-2.

Agassi, said: "A match like that can just turn into a first-class battle or, if you take your chances, you can maybe break it open. Today, that's what happened."

Agassi will play Taylor Dent, who beat Florian Mayer 6-3, 6-4, in the quarter-finals.

In the women's event, Wimbledon champion Maria Sharapova beat former world No1 Justine Henin-Hardenne 6-1, 6-7, 6-2 to end the Belgian's run in her first tournament since last year's US Open.

Sharapova will play Venus Williams in the semi-final after she beat her sister Serena 6-1, 7-6 in the night session in Miami.

adeegee
03-30-2005, 04:47 PM
Tim's going to have to serve extremely well. It's not impossible but I expect Roger's level to rise when he needs it to. I hope I'm wrong, but I've gotta fancy Roger

alexito
03-30-2005, 04:54 PM
henman only win if federer injured.

Sjengster
03-30-2005, 04:55 PM
Henman's only lost one service game in the tournament thus far, but Chela and Stepanek are two of his pigeons and he can impose his game on them pretty easily. This is a slow hardcourt, Federer's last two victories have come on American hardcourt, and of course his first ever win over Henman was here in Miami three years ago - although that was a retirement, so you can't read too much into it. I expect Federer to raise his game for this match, but Henman should do as well so we could be in for an entertaining clash. Henman has to start well this time, in the last couple of meetings Federer has got the first break within six games at the most and cruised from there. In fact, at the US Open he held his first three service games to love; Henman has to prevent that, considering he has the ability with the blocked returns to limit the cheap points for Federer on serve. I hope for a hot and windy day, that'll make the balls fly and make passing shots much tougher to play.

Dirk
03-30-2005, 05:01 PM
Why do you want Tim to win Sjengster when he has no chance of winning the event?

tangerine_dream
03-30-2005, 05:25 PM
Why do you want Tim to win Sjengster when he has no chance of winning the event?

Here's another one of those obnoxious Fed trolls you were talking about, Jogy.

CooCooCachoo
03-30-2005, 05:26 PM
Federer loses a set to Zabaleta and Ancic. I'd say Tim could beat him.

adeegee
03-30-2005, 05:27 PM
Why do you want Tim to win Sjengster when he has no chance of winning the event?

Nonsense :fiery:

tennisman.
03-30-2005, 05:28 PM
Why do you want Tim to win Sjengster when he has no chance of winning the event?


I f he wins Federer which i doubt,then why wouldt he have a chance winning the whole thing?

Action Jackson
03-30-2005, 05:28 PM
Of course Tim can win, it's not like he hasn't done it before, but he really needs to be ready from the go and if Roger is sluggish and has to keep on him and not get tight as Henman has not delivered consistently enough in the big matches.

erik-the-red
03-30-2005, 05:34 PM
If Federer is not sick as the rumours say, then Henman will have a very hard time.

If he is not feeling well, then Henman has a very, very good chance.

Lee
03-30-2005, 05:36 PM
If Federer continues to play like he was, Tim has his chance. But I haven't seen Federer playing sluggish for more than 2 matches especially toward the final of a tournament.

Wulfram
03-30-2005, 05:42 PM
Chela and Stepanek are two of his pigeons and he can impose his game on them pretty easily.

The Henman - Chela head to head was 3-2 going into this tournament. That's hardly pigeonhood.

Anyway Henman obviously can win, but unfortunately probably won't. Not on this surface anyway.

Sjengster
03-30-2005, 05:44 PM
Why do you want Tim to win Sjengster when he has no chance of winning the event?

Because I'm strange like that sometimes. And I don't see a single one of Henman's nemeses left in this draw. Obviously no match is easy, but Federer is probably the toughest test he could have in this event. He played Agassi five years ago in Miami, and lost. Do you want to know what the score was?

Sjengster
03-30-2005, 05:46 PM
The Henman - Chela head to head was 3-2 going into this tournament. That's hardly pigeonhood.

Anyway Henman obviously can win, but unfortunately probably won't. Not on this surface anyway.

I know, but his last two wins against Chela in 2004 were very convincing and Chela hasn't actually beaten a physically 100% Henman since 2000, in Monte Carlo. Two out of Henman's four victories were on clay. I'd call that pigeonhood.

Golfnduck
03-30-2005, 05:50 PM
It should be a close match. If Tim is on fire and Roger is asleep, you never know.

uNIVERSE mAN
03-30-2005, 06:34 PM
How exactly is Timmy in form? Are you forgetting that horseshit match against Canas last week?

Action Jackson
03-30-2005, 06:36 PM
How exactly is Timmy in form? Are you forgetting that horseshit match against Canas last week?

Ever heard of match ups? Cañas loves playing Henman and will beat him more often than not on every surface but grass.

How is that a gauge, last week is last week.

Sjengster
03-30-2005, 06:56 PM
Exactly, Federer is not Canas, otherwise Henman would never have beaten him more than once. That said, his defensive play has certainly improved massively over the last couple of years and plan A for Henman - charge the net on Federer's backhand side - will not work nearly as well outdoors as it does indoors.

Action Jackson
03-30-2005, 07:00 PM
Rememeber Sjeng the convo we had when Henman lead 6-1 over Federer. I said I want to see them on a slower surface and I predicted the result in Indian Wells, so this could be a similar situation.

Sjengster
03-30-2005, 07:10 PM
I certainly do, and it also helped that all but one of Henman's victories was pre-TMC 03 when Federer had the breakthrough win against Agassi and really became a consistent player; heck, Wimbledon 01 was probably the last time the grass courts had the speed of old, if they met there now it would probably play like a hardcourt. But that said, Henman has also played below-par in their last two meetings - he was definitely badly off his game in the IW final, and at the US Open I remember he hit 35% first serves in the opening set (small wonder he was broken twice in a row towards the end).

NYCtennisfan
03-30-2005, 07:11 PM
Unless Federer is sick, injured or totally out of it, I don't think Henman can beat him. The last 5 sets they have played have been total beatdowns especially on Roger's serve. Henman has had a hard time getting to 30 in most of the games.

Action Jackson
03-30-2005, 07:12 PM
True Henman has never threatened Roger in their last 2 meetings. 35% of 1st serves is shocking almost as bad as winning 1 from 14 breakpoints in a match.

andylover_16
03-30-2005, 07:23 PM
Tim at his best and Federer playing decent.
It may be possible :)

I would hope that Henman would win.

uNIVERSE mAN
03-30-2005, 08:13 PM
Ever heard of match ups? Cañas loves playing Henman and will beat him more often than not on every surface but grass.

How is that a gauge, last week is last week.

Last week's match wasn't about matchups, Tim played shit, he couldn't have beaten anyone that day. Granted it might have something to do with his lack of confidence against Canas. I really wish Tim would show this kind of pre-match enthuisiasm day in and day out. I hate it when I root for him and he lets me down like the Davydenko match he tanked.

robinhood
03-30-2005, 08:28 PM
Roger in 2 sets!

WyveN
03-30-2005, 09:46 PM
Tim has a chance but after watching them in Kooyong, on this surface Tim would probably need Roger to be sick. If a serve volleyer is to take Federer out this week I give Dent a far bigger chance.

flyingmachine
03-30-2005, 10:11 PM
I feel a bit unease since both are my favourite players. :rolleyes:
Anyway I hope it will be a great match. :D

Geniey2g
03-30-2005, 10:28 PM
henman only win if federer injured.
Rubbish. Let's not forget Tim beat Roger last year in Rotterdam, where he wasn't injuerd atall.

I feel Tim has recaptured the attitude (and therefore success) of last year where he was swinging freely and playing as if he had nothing to lose, therefore I believe he has a great chance of beating Fedex tonight.

Geniey2g
03-30-2005, 10:29 PM
Tim has a chance but after watching them in Kooyong, on this surface Tim would probably need Roger to be sick. If a serve volleyer is to take Federer out this week I give Dent a far bigger chance.
Dent??! Are you serious?? :eek:

Sjengster
03-30-2005, 10:33 PM
Dent does have a bigger serve than Henman and he's more committed to serve-volleying on every point - Henman stays back on a good two thirds of his service points nowadays. I don't think Dent has the same returning and volleying skill as Henman, but I suppose the greater power and more all-out aggression would give him a better chance, if any.

uNIVERSE mAN
03-30-2005, 10:47 PM
If he could harness a more intelligent second serve it would do wonders for him, he double faults a lot. Sometimes going for 110 mph second serves in pressure situations. I have to say he's been a lot more effective since he dropped his weight down, I think even his volleying skills have improved due to better movement.

Some more patience in return game rallies, and improving his serve % and he's easily the third best american player.

Sjengster
03-30-2005, 10:50 PM
He served with good variety against Coria, and someone who saw his match yesterday said that he is placing his serve much better and using it more intelligently. It's great to see, he's the only American player I have any time for and he's the only other young American after Roddick who has actually achieved much by way of titles.

PinkFeatherBoa
03-30-2005, 10:56 PM
Roger in 2 sets!

I agree. Roger will win 6-3 6-2. :yawn:

Auscon
03-31-2005, 01:32 AM
yes, I can see into the future and Henman will win this match

Art&Soul
03-31-2005, 02:55 AM
Yep if Roger is bored and no if he is not and play like he did in IW! And i hope a day off could make him find his form again!Way to go ROGI, alezz Hopp!

Fergie
03-31-2005, 02:57 AM
Rogi in 2 ;)

NATAS81
03-31-2005, 03:00 AM
Henman is playing with some big game, but Chela pretty much tanked. Check it out, I actually got to see non American tennis on ESPN!

Federer in two tight sets.

mickymouse
03-31-2005, 03:19 AM
No, Tim doesn't have a strong serve to threaten Federer. He may be able to push Federer a little but I don't think he'll win.

*SKYE*
03-31-2005, 04:23 AM
mmm...Sorri to all the henman fans but i think he will lose miserably

Action Jackson
03-31-2005, 06:09 AM
Last week's match wasn't about matchups, Tim played shit, he couldn't have beaten anyone that day. Granted it might have something to do with his lack of confidence against Canas. I really wish Tim would show this kind of pre-match enthuisiasm day in and day out. I hate it when I root for him and he lets me down like the Davydenko match he tanked.

Tim would have beat Chela, Stepanek, Gaudio and a host of others that day. He can't play Cañas it's that simple, Cañas is in his head, just like Hewitt is.

Henman has a chance of winning, but whether he will or not is doubtful.

Becarina
03-31-2005, 06:17 AM
Tim would have beat Chela, Stepanek, Gaudio and a host of others that day. He can't play Cañas it's that simple, Cañas is in his head, just like Hewitt is.

Henman has a chance of winning, but whether he will or not is doubtful.

why would they be in his head?? I think Roddick and Hewitt and everyone else whom has lost to "The Fed" would be in his head...and how he could do so much better. Rogerer hasn't looked the "perfect" form this tourny so far. It IS possible to beat him, you know.

Action Jackson
03-31-2005, 06:22 AM
why would they be in his head?? I think Roddick and Hewitt and everyone else whom has lost to "The Fed" would be in his head...and how he could do so much better. Rogerer hasn't looked the "perfect" form this tourny so far. It IS possible to beat him, you know.

If you read the context of what I was saying then you would know who I was refering to.

Just to spell it out Cañas and Hewitt are in Henman's head and I never mentioned Roger in that context relating to Tim.

Considering I am not of one of the earlier posters who said that Henman could only win if Fed was injured or sick, you should read a bit closer.

bad gambler
03-31-2005, 06:39 AM
fed express in straight sets

Smankyou
03-31-2005, 06:59 AM
Come on, Timbo.

Win this match and I'll pay for the braces.

Becarina
03-31-2005, 07:06 AM
If you read the context of what I was saying then you would know who I was refering to.

Just to spell it out Cañas and Hewitt are in Henman's head and I never mentioned Roger in that context relating to Tim.

Considering I am not of one of the earlier posters who said that Henman could only win if Fed was injured or sick, you should read a bit closer.


ok...maybe YOU should read a bit closer. I said WHY would they be in his head when he is playing roger? I would think the only person he is worrying about is Roger, not who he has lost to or beat in the past.

Action Jackson
03-31-2005, 07:09 AM
ok...maybe YOU should read a bit closer. I said WHY would they be in his head when he is playing roger? I would think the only person he is worrying about is Roger, not who he has lost to or beat in the past.

No, no that comment was specific to Henman dealing with Cañas and Hewitt and only them and not anyone else.

Becarina
03-31-2005, 07:12 AM
ah my mistake :)

NYCtennisfan
03-31-2005, 07:32 AM
After 5 straight sets of beatdowns, Federer is in Tim's head. Tim served 35% of his first serves in that first set at the USO because he knew that weak first serves weren't going to cut it. He remembered that from IW and he knew had to go for it.

Action Jackson
03-31-2005, 07:41 AM
I am still waiting for Roger to beat Tim on a faster surface, but as Sjengster and I discussed well over a year ago, every win that Henman had was on a fast or low bouncing surface, which helped him to get to Federer's weaknesses. This being the case once they got on a slowish surface then Federer had more time and was able to impose his will on Henman.

Geniey2g
03-31-2005, 07:48 AM
If you read the context of what I was saying then you would know who I was refering to.

Just to spell it out Cañas and Hewitt are in Henman's head and I never mentioned Roger in that context relating to Tim.

Considering I am not of one of the earlier posters who said that Henman could only win if Fed was injured or sick, you should read a bit closer.
Totally agree. Canas and Hewitt are most def. now "in Tim's head" as you put it. Federer, however, is not, and I really believe Tim can do this!!

Becarina
03-31-2005, 07:50 AM
why have I been hearing that Roger is sick? Because he lost a set in each round or is he really sick?

NYCtennisfan
03-31-2005, 08:09 AM
I am still waiting for Roger to beat Tim on a faster surface, but as Sjengster and I discussed well over a year ago, every win that Henman had was on a fast or low bouncing surface, which helped him to get to Federer's weaknesses. This being the case once they got on a slowish surface then Federer had more time and was able to impose his will on Henman.

You don't consider IW or the USO a fast surface? It's not old school Wimby and it isn't the Paris Indoors but these are relatively fast surfaces that Federer handed out a beatdown on.

Action Jackson
03-31-2005, 08:13 AM
You don't consider IW or the USO a fast surface? It's not old school Wimby and it isn't the Paris Indoors but these are relatively fast surfaces that Federer handed out a beatdown on.

The US Open is well you never know what they produce there, but the point is anything medium paced or slower it's all Federer.

NYCtennisfan
03-31-2005, 08:23 AM
The US Open is well you never know what they produce there, but the point is anything medium paced or slower it's all Federer.

Good point about the Open, especially the variance between courts as I have seen first hand. Slow surface Fed all the way, and I really think that as of right now, the surface would not matter. It would be a beatdown on grass, carpet, glass, marble, jello....:)

WyveN
03-31-2005, 08:41 AM
It would be a beat down on grass, carpet, glass, marble, jello....:)

Likely and if it isn't you do have to wonder how Roger would go against serve-volleyers of prior generations who were generally a class above Tim.

Action Jackson
03-31-2005, 08:43 AM
Likely and if it isn't you do have to wonder how Roger would go against serve-volleyers of prior generations who were generally a class above Tim.

You mean someone like Paul Annacone. :)

WyveN
03-31-2005, 08:58 AM
You mean someone like Paul Annacone. :)

or Jimmy Arias, that terrific volleyer

TheMightyFed
03-31-2005, 10:02 AM
Yes he CAN win, otherwise you wouldn't be surfing on this board, and you wouldn't even hear about this game called "Federer destroys his opponents in live, look at the slaughter", that would be too boring to attract anyone... ouch, we are not that far ! ;)

El Legenda
03-31-2005, 10:07 AM
Who's Henman:shrug:

Billy Moonshine
03-31-2005, 01:03 PM
I´d like to see Henman win, and maybe it´s possible as he must be really fired up and encouraged by his form and he has beaten fed in the past, hmmm, I´d like to say yes, but as we know fed often saves his best til he meets the top players and his form of late suggests he´s mentally as tough as last year.
Fed in 3.

foul_dwimmerlaik
03-31-2005, 01:15 PM
Of course, he can. Fed must be tired by now and s&v style can rattle him. Tim needs to serve extremely well though.

Having said that, I won't be surprised if Fed wins in straights. Laws of nature don't seem to apply to him.

Puschkin
03-31-2005, 01:23 PM
Of course, he can. Fed must be tired by now and s&v style can rattle him. Tim needs to serve extremely well though.

Having said that, I won't be surprised if Fed wins in straights. Laws of nature don't seem to apply to him.

I fully agree. Of course, Tim can win that. In his favour is his performance in Miami so far, but Roger tends to step it up, if necessary, in numbers I'd go for Roger 60/40.

Angle Queen
03-31-2005, 03:11 PM
Of course, he can. Fed must be tired by now and s&v style can rattle him. Tim needs to serve extremely well though.

Having said that, I won't be surprised if Fed wins in straights. Laws of nature don't seem to apply to him.Two agrees in a row.

Tim served well against Stepanek (78% for the match...that's pretty damn good)...so if he can do it against Roger...he's got a chance. And I do think the S/V style causes some concern for a lot of players...since they see it so seldom.

Like to see Tim win...but think Roger is headed for another final.

TennisMan85
03-31-2005, 04:39 PM
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I tip on Henman to win since yesterday :)

Adman
03-31-2005, 05:08 PM
Henman will keep up with Roger until about the 8th game when the score will be 4-4 then Federer will go up a gear and win the first set 6-4. Then Henman will have to serve well to keep up in the second. I predict a 6-4 6-3 win for Federer.