why coria is so underrated [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

why coria is so underrated

CoriaFan4ever
11-12-2004, 06:46 PM
1.guillermo played only half of the season and despite of this easily qualified for the master cup :worship: :worship: (compared to nalbandian and ferrero who also struggled with injuries and where nowhere near coria)
2.guille reached the final in almost every important tournament he played :worship:
3.guille went undefeated on clay EXCEPT for losses against gaudio (wouldve easily won if not injured) and federert (had blisters which is why he failed to win that match[hamburg final] :worship:
4.guille simply owns his countrymen (i.e. 3-0 h2h vs. nalbandian), they can beat him only when hes injured :worship:
5.guille has never lost to marat safin :worship:
6.when guille played argentina were easily winning davis cup ties 5-0, then he got injured and they promptly lost 0-5.... :worship:
C
O
R
I
A

E
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M
E
J
O
R

Crazy_Fool
11-12-2004, 06:58 PM
Ok :rolleyes:

alfonsojose
11-12-2004, 07:04 PM
Why Coria is so hated? :fiery:
1. He's a crybaby, Guillermo Zvonareva style :bigcry:
2. He's more arrogant than anyone. Roddick is Tennis Dalai Lama next to him :rolleyes:
3. His cramping/i'm injured tactics :ras: ...
4. His nasty Childish/Chino face
5. fans like Coriafan4ever (Crazy_Fool contribution :yeah: )
6. ..

Fergie
11-12-2004, 07:08 PM
Coria is a "drama queen" and he still don't win nothing important :o

Peoples
11-12-2004, 07:08 PM
Why Coria is so hated? :fiery:
1. He's a crybaby, Guillermo Zvonareva style :bigcry:
2. He's more arrogant than anyone. Roddick is Tennis Dalai Lama next to him :rolleyes:
3. His cramping/i'm injured tactics :ras: ...
4. His nasty Childish/Chino face
5. ..
6. ..
5. is the boring dirtballer-style of play
6. ..
7. ..

Crazy_Fool
11-12-2004, 07:08 PM
6. Fans like CoriaFan4Ever

alfonsojose
11-12-2004, 07:14 PM
6. Fans like CoriaFan4Ever
:lol: that piece of .. Coria has the brain to bad-rep anyone :yeah: :hug: :lol:

RPH
11-12-2004, 07:25 PM
Coria isn't under-rated the only thing he's OK at is running

To carry on AlfonsoJose topic ;)
7. He is a cheat and drug taker
8. Embarrasment for the mens game that he can reach the Top 5 by simply running

sigmagirl91
11-12-2004, 07:27 PM
CoriaFan4Ever has waaaaay too much time on her hands.

User id 7816
11-12-2004, 07:41 PM
because he is http://www.mysmilie.de/smilies/schilder/img/024.gif

Pancakesong
11-12-2004, 07:49 PM
CoriaFan4Ever I agree with you! Guille is the best player!


it is that I have to wait some time with(bad) repping..

GOOOOOOOO GUILLERMO!

mordicus18
11-12-2004, 07:55 PM
that's not coz you're not fan of mago that you can say those bad things !

donc fermez vos gueules ! :mad:

*Ljubica*
11-12-2004, 07:57 PM
OMG - schools out and the Coria trolls are back :eek: :eek:

Pancakesong
11-12-2004, 08:00 PM
hoe wagen jullie zo te praten over zo'n sgattige jongen! denken jullie dat hij dat leuk vind fsow? ik ga toch ok niet zo praten over henman fsow, waark geen fan van ben maar wel respecteer.. aaargh.. stelletje onbeschfte mensjees.. gwoon zielig en sneu zijn jullie..

Guille.. ik blijf van je houden

Deco
11-12-2004, 08:03 PM
CoriaFan4Ever has waaaaay too much time on her hands.

OMG
YOU have too much time on yout hands! and Rosie, don;t talk about coria-fans like they are little kids or so. We are people. just like you :o
RPH, he;s not just running. I you woul use your eyes, you could have seen that :rolleyes:
I can understand not everybody likes him, but you don;t have to say thinks like that. I don't like gaudio. But I do respect him, I don't make a fool of him.
:mad:

Snoopy_Girl
11-12-2004, 08:04 PM
hoe wagen jullie zo te praten over zo'n sgattige jongen! denken jullie dat hij dat leuk vind fsow? ik ga toch ok niet zo praten over henman fsow, waark geen fan van ben maar wel respecteer.. aaargh.. stelletje onbeschfte mensjees.. gwoon zielig en sneu zijn jullie..

Guille.. ik blijf van je houden
Why reply in Dutch? :rolleyes:

sigmagirl91
11-12-2004, 08:05 PM
OMG
YOU have too much time on yout hands! and Rosie, don;t talk about coria-fans like they are little kids or so. We are people. just like you :o
RPH, he;s not just running. I you woul use your eyes, you could have seen that :rolleyes:
I can understand not everybody likes him, but you don;t have to say thinks like that. I don't like gaudio. But I do respect him, I don't make a fool of him.
:mad:

Uh....you could've used spell-checker for this hunk of mess you wrote.

RPH
11-12-2004, 08:11 PM
Uh....you could've used spell-checker for this hunk of mess you wrote.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Deco if Coria isn't just running what is he doing :confused: oh I know using gamemanship thanks for reminding me :)

sigmagirl91
11-12-2004, 08:13 PM
Yes, people the "short bus specials" have arrived!!! Problem is, do they know how to get on the short bus without missing the first step?

Pancakesong
11-12-2004, 08:13 PM
translation: how do you dare talking about him like that! do you think he would like?

I won't talk about someon like Henman, who I don't really like, but who I respect..
aargh.. you are so rude (...)

sigmagirl91
11-12-2004, 08:15 PM
translation: how do you dare talking about him like that! do you think he would like?

I don't care if he likes it or not.

I won't talk about someon like Henman, who I don't really like, but who I respect..
aargh.. you are so rude (...)

I know I'm rude. So what does that make you?

Golfnduck
11-12-2004, 08:29 PM
I will say that Coria always finds the perfect time to get a cramp, and then seem to play better than he was before. As for the drugs, I think once you get caught, people will always wonder if you're taking them again. I think if you get caught taking drugs, more severe actions should be taken.

mitalidas
11-12-2004, 08:32 PM
the biggest choker we've seen in years

2-sets to love up, 1 game away, cannot close

alfonsojose
11-12-2004, 08:39 PM
These Coria fans have to be kids from his tennis school. Lesson no. 1 .. cramping. The big tool :rolleyes:

User id 7816
11-12-2004, 08:57 PM
If you don't want people to speak their negative opinion about Coria why are you making this thread??..http://www.mainzelahr.de/smile/boese/crossbones.gif

Space Cowgirl
11-12-2004, 09:45 PM
Yes, people the "short bus specials" have arrived!!! Problem is, do they know how to get on the short bus without missing the first step?

Maybe you should show them how, seeing as you seemed to have managed it ok :devil: ;)

sigmagirl91
11-12-2004, 09:56 PM
Maybe you should show them how, seeing as you seemed to have managed it ok :devil: ;)

Maybe YOU should show 'em how, seeing as you've managed to climb the first step without trouble. :devil:

Space Cowgirl
11-12-2004, 10:04 PM
nah, Sigma, I bow to your superior experience in this area

mitalidas
11-12-2004, 10:21 PM
Why are you surprised at everyone's negative reaction when you start off this outrageous poll where he is the only choice for best player?

Man, this guy hasn't even won a GS. Never ended in the top few, never done anything significant ---- and best player in the world? Nobody can remember anything significant about him, except that he choked when a breath away from a GS.

So expect us to :rolleyes: negate this hype with the facts!!!!

El Mago has so far produced no magic, nada.

Chloe le Bopper
11-12-2004, 10:22 PM
Sigh. Threads like this are just begging people to make fun of Coria.

Golfnduck
11-12-2004, 10:25 PM
nah, Sigma, I bow to your superior experience in this area
Sigmagirl does seem to talk about this area alot. She must know something about it.

WyveN
11-12-2004, 10:33 PM
I dont like Coria but people who are saying he never achieved anything are.........wrong.

Chloe le Bopper
11-12-2004, 10:33 PM
True. I was too busy focusing on the thread starter for being a pain to notice those posts ;)

Pea
11-12-2004, 10:34 PM
coria fans are sooo underrated.

hidellized
11-12-2004, 11:24 PM
HEY! I am one..

Fedex
11-12-2004, 11:26 PM
CoriaFan4Ever has waaaaay too much time on her hands.
Doesn't she have an 'education' to tend to??

Fedex
11-12-2004, 11:29 PM
And to answer the question: For having pathetic fans like you.

hidellized
11-12-2004, 11:29 PM
Well, yeah its like me. I go to school on the weekdays.

tennischick
11-12-2004, 11:30 PM
Coria isn't underated but he's clearly not much liked by many fans.

as for me i love him :hearts: then again i love all my Argies :hearts:

Chloe le Bopper
11-13-2004, 05:28 AM
Maybe you should show them how, seeing as you seemed to have managed it ok :devil: ;)
:yeah:

FryslanBoppe
11-13-2004, 05:41 AM
coria fans are sooo underrated.

That they are.

Deco
11-13-2004, 08:09 AM
Uh....you could've used spell-checker for this hunk of mess you wrote.

:eek:

You are from America, so you can talk english perfectly. But I am not from an english-speaking country, I've only learned English for 2 or 3 years. You don't have to say that I wrote a mess ,I don't want to be arrogant but even with those foulds in it, I speak and write better English than many other people on this world.

Chloe le Bopper
11-13-2004, 08:41 AM
That is true, Deco, very true.

RonE
11-13-2004, 08:54 AM
I don't find Coria underrated- players respect his abilities and are wary of him. They know he gives nothing away.

His game is nice to watch- his use of the angles and his abilities to get to lost balls. He has one of the better pairs of hands in the game.

However, what I do not like about him is his attitude- watching him play in the FO was incredible but his reaction after losing the final really left a sour taste in my mouth- to trash all your racquets like that and behave like a 3 year old brat. I don't remember Medvedev throwing such a tantrum after his loss to Agassi in 1999, and yes he was 2 sets to 0 up in that final just like Coria was. Medvedev behaved in a very respectable way and was such a good sport after losing a heart-breaking final like that, Coria should take a leaf from his book.

*Ljubica*
11-13-2004, 09:18 AM
I don't find Coria underrated- players respect his abilities and are wary of him. They know he gives nothing away.

His game is nice to watch- his use of the angles and his abilities to get to lost balls. He has one of the better pairs of hands in the game.

However, what I do not like about him is his attitude- watching him play in the FO was incredible but his reaction after losing the final really left a sour taste in my mouth- to trash all your racquets like that and behave like a 3 year old brat. I don't remember Medvedev throwing such a tantrum after his loss to Agassi in 1999, and yes he was 2 sets to 0 up in that final just like Coria was. Medvedev behaved in a very respectable way and was such a good sport after losing a heart-breaking final like that, Coria should take a leaf from his book.

Great post and a voice of reason as ever RonE :worship: Like you, personally I have no problems with Coria's game - he has a great talent - no disputing it, and sometimes can be fun to watch. But it's his character and attitude that makes me dislike him so much :devil: I admit this wasn't always the case - at one time my feelings towards him were quite positive although I never liked the whining. But then I met him on many occasions and my feelings changed radically. In my opinion and from my observations and experiences, he is unbelievably arrogant and doesn't treat the people around him with respect and I hate that. As for threads like this - as Rebecca says they are just begging people to make fun of Coria. There is nothing wrong with supporting your favourite player and singing his praises (perhaps in your own Forum), but creating silly polls like this and giving out BadReps to everyone who doesn't like your personal favourite are actions that just beg other posters to throw out accusations of "immaturity".

Ferrero Forever
11-13-2004, 09:18 AM
where is the other option in this poll, i'm a coria fan, but i'm not voting if i don't think coria is the best player in the world.

Deco
11-13-2004, 09:26 AM
Great post and a voice of reason as ever RonE :worship: Like you, personally I have no problems with Coria's game - he has a great talent - no disputing it, and sometimes can be fun to watch. But it's his character and attitude that makes me dislike him so much :devil: I admit this wasn't always the case - at one time my feelings towards him were quite positive although I never liked the whining. But then I met him on many occasions and my feelings changed radically. In my opinion and from my observations and experiences, he is unbelievably arrogant and doesn't treat the people around him with respect and I hate that. As for threads like this - as Rebecca says they are just begging people to make fun of Coria. There is nothing wrong with supporting your favourite player and singing his praises (perhaps in your own Forum), but creating silly polls like this and giving out BadReps to everyone who doesn't like your personal favourite are actions that just beg other posters to throw out accusations of "immaturity".

I gave someone a badrep here (my first btw)not because she doesn't like my favourite playre, but because she said stupid things about how I write

tennisman.
11-13-2004, 10:53 AM
I just can't stand Coria,he is a crybaby and just look at him he looks like a micky mouse out there.
I don't like the way he plays either so the only thing i like him is he's beutiful wife :)

RPH
11-13-2004, 11:24 AM
I just can't stand Coria,he is a crybaby and just look at him he looks like a micky mouse out there.
I don't like the way he plays either so the only thing i like him is he's beutiful wife :)

:worship: :worship: :worship:

Pancakesong
11-13-2004, 11:28 AM
don't talk about his wife: then only thing I hate about him

Shadow
11-13-2004, 11:55 AM
don't talk about his wife: then only thing I hate about him

:lol: :baby:

Peta Pan
11-13-2004, 12:03 PM
Hmmmm what a nasty thread!!!!

Well done RonE with another wonderful post that brought some well needed reason to it.

*Ljubica*
11-13-2004, 12:03 PM
:lol: :baby:


:worship: Actually I forgot about Carla - she's about the only thing I like about him personally as well! She's stunningly beautiful and seems like a nice girl too - could do a lot better for herself!!

Jorge
11-13-2004, 02:38 PM
Coria is a very talented player. Nobody can deny that. But the best player of the world??? c'mon!!! have you ever heard about a swiss dude called Roger Federer who won 3 GS this year? :rolleyes:

What I dislike about Coria is his lack of sportmanship. I am not alone here. many players don't like him, including some argentinians.

1. Gaudio have told several times he is "almost sure" about how Coria pretended to be suffering by cramps at Hamburg earlier this year. After the FO, during a press conference in Buenos Aires Gaudio said he thought Coria was using the same "tactics" in Paris, although wasn't 100% sure about it.
when some journalist asked to Gastón if he was sure about Coria "antics"... he smiled and finished the press conference arguing a sudden cramp "a la Coria" (everybody understood what Gaudio wanted to express without "say it")

2. Luis Horna (it happened at Hamburg as well) once wanted to kick Coria's butt after Guillermo insulted Luis calling him "miedoso" (sorta coward). Horna clearly angry said to Guillermo, if my memory doesn't betrays me, "Yo no soy Gaudio, ¡yo si te la pego!" (I am not Gaudio, I will really smack you!) or sth like that. sorry but I am quoting facts from memory, Anyway it really happened, you can research for the right facts surfing the web. Although I think my memory is pretty accurate on this issue.

3. Henman, yes the phlegmatic english gentleman, the one who never goes mad... Henman surely wouldn't invite Coria to drink tea after what happened at Cincy 2003. Last year at Cincy Henman conceded to Coria a dubious point (it was out, but Henman being a gentleman, conceded the point), later after a bad call that affected Tim during a key game... even when Coria knew Tim was right he didn't concede back the point. Tim went mad. For the first time I saw him so angry.

4. the former captain of argentine davis cup team (Gustavo Luza) was fired because "some" players didn't want him as captain. The main voice against Luza was Coria. But he never accepted it.

5. Gabriel Markus broke his relationship with Coria among other things because Coria didn't want to follow his advices as coach.

And I am not even going to mention when he almost hits a ballboy with his racquet at 2003 FO semis (when he lost to "The Face"). And I am not going to mention anything related about his drugs affair. I concede him the benefit of the doubt

Summarizing: I am not saying Coria is a monster, what I am saying is that he doesn't knows the meaning of the words "sportsmanship" and "fair play". Although He can learn he is still young.

tennischick
11-13-2004, 02:45 PM
I don't remember Medvedev throwing such a tantrum after his loss to Agassi in 1999, and yes he was 2 sets to 0 up in that final just like Coria was. Medvedev behaved in a very respectable way and was such a good sport after losing a heart-breaking final like that, Coria should take a leaf from his book.
and Medvedev was how much older than Coria at the time? heck the guy was already balding.

give Coria a break guys. he may be married but he's still a kid and he went into the FO with his entire country's exppectations on HIS shoulders. Gaudio had none of the pressure that Coria did. and yes he crumbled at the end and was bitterly disappointed. how would you have felt in the same situation?

RPH
11-13-2004, 03:03 PM
and Medvedev was how much older than Coria at the time? heck the guy was already balding.

give Coria a break guys. he may be married but he's still a kid and he went into the FO with his entire country's exppectations on HIS shoulders. Gaudio had none of the pressure that Coria did. and yes he crumbled at the end and was bitterly disappointed. how would you have felt in the same situation?

Guillimero's 22 so surely it's time he grows up :rolleyes:

:worship: :worship: :worship: @ Jorge's comments

RonE
11-13-2004, 03:14 PM
and Medvedev was how much older than Coria at the time? heck the guy was already balding.

give Coria a break guys. he may be married but he's still a kid and he went into the FO with his entire country's exppectations on HIS shoulders. Gaudio had none of the pressure that Coria did. and yes he crumbled at the end and was bitterly disappointed. how would you have felt in the same situation?

So youth is an excuse for bratty behaviour then? It wasn't only the FO final- he acted up in many other situations. Many players younger than him do not behave as poorly as he had.

Like Jorge said, I am not here to 'demonize' Coria, but he does need to improve his behaviour and grow up if he wants to become more popular with his fellow peers and widen his fan base.

Pea
11-13-2004, 03:22 PM
I just can't stand Coria,he is a crybaby and just look at him he looks like a micky mouse out there.
I don't like the way he plays either so the only thing i like him is he's beutiful wife :)

Mickey mouse to your donald duck.:haha:

*Ljubica*
11-13-2004, 03:35 PM
:worship: :worship: To Jorge's post and I agree with every word. As it happens I was present at the match Jorge is talking about against Horna in Hamburg - accompanied by a friend who was a great Coria fan at that time. However, his disgusting antics in that match and in another Hamburg match (against young Almagro) turned her against him for life. And being young is no excuse in my opinion - Federer isn't exactly old is he and he behaves with good manners and sportsmanship at all times.

yanchr
11-13-2004, 03:36 PM
What I dislike about Coria is his lack of sportmanship. I am not alone here. many players don't like him, including some argentinians.

1. Gaudio have told several times he is "almost sure" about how Coria pretended to be suffering by cramps at Hamburg earlier this year. After the FO, during a press conference in Buenos Aires Gaudio said he thought Coria was using the same "tactics" in Paris, although wasn't 100% sure about it.
when some journalist asked to Gastón if he was sure about Coria "antics"... he smiled and finished the press conference arguing a sudden cramp "a la Coria" (everybody understood what Gaudio wanted to express without "say it")

2. Luis Horna (it happened at Hamburg as well) once wanted to kick Coria's butt after Guillermo insulted Luis calling him "miedoso" (sorta coward). Horna clearly angry said to Guillermo, if my memory doesn't betrays me, "Yo no soy Gaudio, ¡yo si te la pego!" (I am not Gaudio, I will really smack you!) or sth like that. sorry but I am quoting facts from memory, Anyway it really happened, you can research for the right facts surfing the web. Although I think my memory is pretty accurate on this issue.

3. Henman, yes the phlegmatic english gentleman, the one who never goes mad... Henman surely wouldn't invite Coria to drink tea after what happened at Cincy 2003. Last year at Cincy Henman conceded to Coria a dubious point (it was out, but Henman being a gentleman, conceded the point), later after a bad call that affected Tim during a key game... Even when Coria knew Tim was right he didn't concede back the point. Tim went mad. For the first time I saw him so angry.

4. the former captain of argentine davis cup team (Gustavo Luza) was fired because "some" players didn't want him as captain. The main voice against Luza was Coria. But he never accepted it.

5. Gabriel Markus broke his relationship with Coria among other things because Coria didn't want to follow his advices as coach.

And I am not even going to mention when he almost hits a ballbay with his racquet at 2003 FO semis (when he lost to "The Face"). And I am not going to mention anything related about his drugs affair. I concede him the benefit of the doubt

Thanks for all these information which made my dislike or say, hatred even more reasonable :wavey: This guy simply doesn't know there is sth called 'respect' in this world. That sucks biggest.

And it's totally a waste of time to make much serious sense here in this thread, with such fans to give out such a poll :o though some of you have done really a good job :worship:

RPH
11-13-2004, 04:06 PM
:worship: :worship: To Jorge's post and I agree with every word. As it happens I was present at the match Jorge is talking about against Horna in Hamburg - accompanied by a friend who was a great Coria fan at that time. However, his disgusting antics in that match and in another Hamburg match (against young Allegro) turned her against him for life. And being young is no excuse in my opinion - Federer isn't exactly old is he and he behaves with good manners and sportsmanship at all times.

The Almagro match was the match which turned me against him as well ;)
I'd never liked Coria then but his antics were disgraceful. He would consisentely argue for up to 5-10 minutes to the umpire and it happened at least 3 times :fiery:
Only inexperience from Almagro was the reason Coria won that day

But his gamemanship is fine he's only a kid don't you know :rolleyes:

Rogiman
11-13-2004, 04:13 PM
and Medvedev was how much older than Coria at the time? heck the guy was already balding.

give Coria a break guys. he may be married but he's still a kid and he went into the FO with his entire country's exppectations on HIS shoulders. Gaudio had none of the pressure that Coria did. and yes he crumbled at the end and was bitterly disappointed. how would you have felt in the same situation?

:hearts:


I actually like him, not really for his tennis but for having achieved so much with so little to rely on, I mean - the guy makes Hewitt look like a Karlovic, yet he could beat Ljubicic indoors.

What really bothers me about him is the sense that his time is limited, everything comes too hard for him, his body collapses, he has to hit his mind out to attain reasonable pace, I'll bet my balls he'll have called it a career by his 28th birthday - the rest of it: cramping, cheating etc. doesn't bother me - I guess it all sounds nicer in spanish...

Rogiman
11-13-2004, 04:19 PM
I've already writen in details my opinion on little Mrs. Coria here:

http://menstennisforums.com/showthread.php?p=839664#post839664

:devil: :devil:

RonE
11-13-2004, 04:21 PM
I've already writen in details my opinion on little Mrs. Coria here:

http://menstennisforums.com/showthread.php?p=839664#post839664

:devil: :devil:

:haha: I had a feeling you would link that thread :devil:

fabolous
11-13-2004, 04:29 PM
it is easy to dislike coria because
-he was banned for a positive drug test (but he did not take them with purpose)
-he is often injured
-sometimes he pretends being injured to force a timeout or sth like that, but hey: that's what many of the pros do. @Rosie: there were some players two weeks ago in Basel which complained about your beloved nal-b doing the same. i don't know if that's true, i just quote the players.
-sometimes he behaves very emotionally on the court, for some people it seems "unfair", "not-sportsmanlike",etc...well, i know many players who smash their rackets or are very disappointed after a tough loss.

and you all have to admit one thing: guille's game is great!! or how do you explain a 32-0 series on clay? or a masters cup qualifiyng just with having played for a half year?

ok that's my opinion. of course i can't tell you all to love coria, but a litle bit more respect would be only fair. if you don't think i am right, so please say it, but don't just insult me without a reason.

omg such a long post, i am very tired now.....

*Ljubica*
11-13-2004, 04:43 PM
it is easy to dislike coria because
-he was banned for a positive drug test (but he did not take them with purpose)
-he is often injured
-sometimes he pretends being injured to force a timeout or sth like that, but hey: that's what many of the pros do. @Rosie: there were some players two weeks ago in Basel which complained about your beloved nal-b doing the same. i don't know if that's true, i just quote the players.
-sometimes he behaves very emotionally on the court, for some people it seems "unfair", "not-sportsmanlike",etc...well, i know many players who smash their rackets or are very disappointed after a tough loss.

and you all have to admit one thing: guille's game is great!! or how do you explain a 32-0 series on clay? or a masters cup qualifiyng just with having played for a half year?

ok that's my opinion. of course i can't tell you all to love coria, but a litle bit more respect would be only fair. if you don't think i am right, so please say it, but don't just insult me without a reason.

omg such a long post, i am very tired now.....

Dear fabulous - I was in Basel at all of David's matches and I spoke to many of the participants socially afterwards as well as attending several Media Events and Press Conferences. I am not disputing what you are saying, but I am interested in whether you can back up your comments about other players saying things about David with proof and hard facts to corroborate your claims. I am not trying to pick a fight - just genuinely interested as I cant imagine I could have missed it all!

fabolous
11-13-2004, 06:04 PM
first of all: for me there's no doubt that nally really was injured. i just took this example to show how easy misunderstandings can be created. nally played against schüttler in the quarterfinal and schütler was up 6-4, 3-0 or sth like that (i cannot remember the exact score) when nalbandian took a timeout and called the doctor. after that break, rainer lost his rhythm and the match. and after the match, he said that he doubted that david really was injured (so it is the same situation as gaudio/coria). but of course the next matches proofed that david WAS injured and i think rainer also excused for his comments. so, what makes you sure that the situation of coria in hamburg was not the same? just because gaudio claimed that it was a tactical timeout, that i not automatically true.

sigmagirl91
11-13-2004, 07:15 PM
first of all: for me there's no doubt that nally really was injured. i just took this example to show how easy misunderstandings can be created. nally played against schüttler in the quarterfinal and schütler was up 6-4, 3-0 or sth like that (i cannot remember the exact score) when nalbandian took a timeout and called the doctor. after that break, rainer lost his rhythm and the match. and after the match, he said that he doubted that david really was injured (so it is the same situation as gaudio/coria). but of course the next matches proofed that david WAS injured and i think rainer also excused for his comments. so, what makes you sure that the situation of coria in hamburg was not the same? just because gaudio claimed that it was a tactical timeout, that i not automatically true.

Uh, fabolous, you said before that "some" players said they doubted that Nalby was injured. Name other players besides Schuettler whom you claim said he wasn't really injured.

tangerine_dream
11-13-2004, 07:28 PM
What I've learned so far from this thread:

The Nalbandian trolls are just as obnoxious as the Coria trolls.

:zzz:

*Ljubica*
11-13-2004, 07:45 PM
first of all: for me there's no doubt that nally really was injured. i just took this example to show how easy misunderstandings can be created. nally played against schüttler in the quarterfinal and schütler was up 6-4, 3-0 or sth like that (i cannot remember the exact score) when nalbandian took a timeout and called the doctor. after that break, rainer lost his rhythm and the match. and after the match, he said that he doubted that david really was injured (so it is the same situation as gaudio/coria). but of course the next matches proofed that david WAS injured and i think rainer also excused for his comments. so, what makes you sure that the situation of coria in hamburg was not the same? just because gaudio claimed that it was a tactical timeout, that i not automatically true.

Thanks fabulous for taking the time and trouble to answer me. I like and respect Schuettler a lot, and it is good to hear that even if he did say something in the "heat of the moment" he had the decency to apologise afterwards - it makes me like him even more :) About the Hamburg situation -well I know, like and respect Gaudio enormously so I trust what he says implicitly, - and also, as Jorge said in his brilliant post earlier, Gaudio is not the only player to have had "problems" like this with Coria - it has happened with Henman (who I also respect a great deal), with Horna and Almagro, and many others, including many experienced "behind the scenes" people like Gaby Markus, Alberto Mancini and Jorge Trevisan. He certainly has a unenviable reputation on the tennis circuit - both among his fellow Argentines and further afield. Anyway, at the end of the day, we all have our own views of things and are entitled to have those views. Thanks again for answering me honestly - I appreciate it :)

Golfnduck
11-13-2004, 08:03 PM
What I've learned so far from this thread:

The Nalbandian trolls are just as obnoxious as the Coria trolls.

:zzz:
LOL TANGY!!! I've learned that trolls in general are very annoying. I need your don't feed the trolls smiley!!!

Carito_90
11-13-2004, 08:08 PM
Like Jorge said, I am not here to 'demonize' Coria, but he does need to improve his behaviour and grow up if he wants to become more popular with his fellow peers and widen his fan base.

I agree but... I don't think he cares about being the most popular player on tour or with fans... he just wants to win as every player does.
I know he's not the most respectful player, not even close but... to be honest, Argentinean people are not the most respectful or fair people either you know so that's why I don't mind him being like that, I guess I'm already used to it hehe :p

But come on, he's not even close to be the best player in the world.

sigmagirl91
11-13-2004, 09:00 PM
LOL TANGY!!! I've learned that trolls in general are very annoying. I need your don't feed the trolls smiley!!!


The wittle duckfucks obsessed with "Nalby twats". Awwww.......We're totally flattered that you've thought of us today.

Chloe le Bopper
11-13-2004, 09:32 PM
I gave someone a badrep here (my first btw)not because she doesn't like my favourite playre, but because she said stupid things about how I write


I can't say that I blame you :)

Chloe le Bopper
11-13-2004, 09:33 PM
:worship: Actually I forgot about Carla - she's about the only thing I like about him personally as well! She's stunningly beautiful and seems like a nice girl too - could do a lot better for herself!!

Rosie, this was an erm... how you say.. stupid thing to say? You don't know him personally, you only know how he tits around on court. If he treats her like gold (I don't know or care if he does) then I'd say she has it pretty set. Somebody who treats her well and is worth a good chunk of change. How ridiculous to make comments like this :rolleyes:

Chloe le Bopper
11-13-2004, 09:36 PM
and Medvedev was how much older than Coria at the time? heck the guy was already balding.

give Coria a break guys. he may be married but he's still a kid and he went into the FO with his entire country's exppectations on HIS shoulders. Gaudio had none of the pressure that Coria did. and yes he crumbled at the end and was bitterly disappointed. how would you have felt in the same situation?

Well said.

IMO, it's absurd to call Coria's reaction to losing "throwing a tantrum" :rolleyes: He didn't "throw a tantrum" he was merely visibly dissapointed. So far as I know he never said anything negative about Gaudio, he merely expressed dissapointment in himself. I can understand that people don't like him, but telling blatent BS about him crosses the line, doesn't it?

Chloe le Bopper
11-13-2004, 09:40 PM
LOL TANGY!!! I've learned that trolls in general are very annoying. I need your don't feed the trolls smiley!!!
Some trolls are cute and funny, but generally, they blow.

Chloe le Bopper
11-13-2004, 09:41 PM
The wittle duckfucks obsessed with "Nalby twats". Awwww.......We're totally flattered that you've thought of us today.
It seems that you're returning their love, as always. Love connection :hearts:

TennisLurker
11-13-2004, 09:43 PM
I am not a fan of coria, but I do respect his game, I think it is funny how the 2 guys here who say his game is only running and it is a shame he made the top 5, are also big fans of hewitt, whose game is pretty much the same, with less talent.

Golfnduck
11-13-2004, 09:46 PM
The wittle duckfucks obsessed with "Nalby twats". Awwww.......We're totally flattered that you've thought of us today.
I didn't target you "Nalby twats", but if it helps you to think that people actually care what you have to say, then that's all that matters. ;)

Horatio Caine
11-13-2004, 10:12 PM
He isn't underrated.

Sjengster
11-13-2004, 10:42 PM
1.guillermo played only half of the season and despite of this easily qualified for the master cup :worship: :worship: (compared to nalbandian and ferrero who also struggled with injuries and where nowhere near coria)
2.guille reached the final in almost every important tournament he played :worship:
3.guille went undefeated on clay EXCEPT for losses against gaudio (wouldve easily won if not injured) and federert (had blisters which is why he failed to win that match[hamburg final] :worship:
4.guille simply owns his countrymen (i.e. 3-0 h2h vs. nalbandian), they can beat him only when hes injured :worship:
5.guille has never lost to marat safin :worship:
6.when guille played argentina were easily winning davis cup ties 5-0, then he got injured and they promptly lost 0-5.... :worship:
C
O
R
I
A

E
L

M
E
J
O
R

1. Had Agassi and Nalbandian played Paris and done well there in addition to Henman, Coria would not be going to the Masters Cup. Moreover, he was fortunate that his period of injury only occurred in the second half of the year, rather than in every other tournament like Ferrero's and Nalbandian's seemed to do.
2. He reached three TMS finals and a GS final, and for a time was the best Masters Series performer among the top players, but look what happened to him in those finals. When he didn't have Schuettler to beat up on, he developed physical problems in the other three matches and should probably have retired from all them, let alone just one.
3. Gaudio's fightback began in the long and hard-fought third set in which Coria showed no obvious signs of cramp, if he'd been fully fit it would still have taken him four sets to close out the match. If we're going to play the "If" game, I could just as well argue that if Federer hadn't served about 30% first serves in during the first set of the Hamburg final he wouldn't have been in trouble at all in that match.
4. I wouldn't argue against this, although it certainly helps that he's played Nalbandian on clay every time. A lot of the matches are still close, Zabaleta pushed him to five sets at RG last year for example. Heck, the Squirrel won a set off him in Buenos Aires this year.
5. Ooh look, Guille's never lost to Nicolas Almagro either. Impressive.
6. Coria trampled roughshod over the mighty Mounir El Aarej in the first round (the only tie he's played), but would probably have had as much chance against Mirnyi and Voltchkov on a lightning-fast indoor carpet as you have of making a sensible point now and then.

Horatio Caine
11-13-2004, 10:45 PM
Sjengster - who's the squirrel? :haha: :haha:

Sjengster
11-13-2004, 11:06 PM
"Tanko" Squillari (neither of them are my nicknames), former RG semifinalist back in 2000. He was the victim of Gasquet's breakthrough win at Monte Carlo in 2002.

star
11-13-2004, 11:11 PM
This is easily the funniest poll I've seen. :lol:

Thanks CoriaFan. It gave me a chuckle.

I'm looking forward to seeing Guille on the court again and spicing thing up with his sparkling game. :)

star
11-13-2004, 11:18 PM
:hearts:


I guess it all sounds nicer in spanish...


:haha: :haha:

That was very funny. :hatoff:

hitchhiker
11-14-2004, 12:37 AM
i wonder if sigmagirl realises that she is just as much a troll as anyone here. i dont have a problem with that but because of that maybe she shouldnt act so high and mighty.

Pea
11-14-2004, 12:57 AM
Oh yeah, hitchhiker is back...........................

Fedex
11-14-2004, 01:06 AM
Great post and a voice of reason as ever RonE :worship: Like you, personally I have no problems with Coria's game - he has a great talent - no disputing it, and sometimes can be fun to watch. But it's his character and attitude that makes me dislike him so much :devil: I admit this wasn't always the case - at one time my feelings towards him were quite positive although I never liked the whining. But then I met him on many occasions and my feelings changed radically. In my opinion and from my observations and experiences, he is unbelievably arrogant and doesn't treat the people around him with respect and I hate that. As for threads like this - as Rebecca says they are just begging people to make fun of Coria. There is nothing wrong with supporting your favourite player and singing his praises (perhaps in your own Forum), but creating silly polls like this and giving out BadReps to everyone who doesn't like your personal favourite are actions that just beg other posters to throw out accusations of "immaturity".
Thanks once again, Rosie, for bringing some sanity to this thread. :)

CoriaFan4ever
11-14-2004, 02:10 AM
Sjengster: you wrote:

1. Had Agassi and Nalbandian played Paris and done well there in addition to Henman, Coria would not be going to the Masters Cup. Moreover, he was fortunate that his period of injury only occurred in the second half of the year, rather than in every other tournament like Ferrero's and Nalbandian's seemed to do.
-----------------------

I know youre very knowledgeable, but wrong on this one. ;) Coria injured himself in the very first tournament he played in auckland (withdrew after winning 1st round match vs. kiefer) and this clearly affected him in the AO which is why he lost so early there.
he also suffered a back injury in the miami final (vs. roddick) which caused him to miss another month, there were fears hed be out for the entire clay season but returned in time for monte carlo (which he easily won btw).
well in the mentioned monte carlo, he injured himself in the final vs. schuettler (guille stated that ad he not won the third set hed have retired from the match), as a consequence missed another month (including barcelona and rome).
conclusion: coria had a very troublesome first half injury-wise.
well I wonder if Ill again get bashed by some people for that totally harmless post, wouldnt surprise me :rolleyes:

Fedex
11-14-2004, 02:26 AM
Oh yeah, hitchhiker is back...........................
And even better yet, CoriaFuck4ever is also back.

star
11-14-2004, 02:52 AM
he also suffered a back injury in the miami final (vs. roddick) which caused him to miss another month,

It wasn't a back injury, it was kidney stones. He did miss sometime because of that but not very much. In my mind, it really affected the outcome of the Miami final though.

Action Jackson
11-14-2004, 03:37 AM
I respect his game a lot and plays it very well, and that is all I will say about him, as I have already said enough about his antics and gamesmanship already.

I am not give him a break, because he is young, that's a just a cop out for bad behaviour.

Jorge
11-14-2004, 03:44 AM
I respect his game a lot and plays it very well, and that is all I will say about him, as I have already said enough about his antics and gamesmanship already.

I am not give him a break, because he is young, that's a just a cop out for bad behaviour.
you are right GWB, to be young is not a valid pretext to show such a poor gamensmanship. But I think he could learn about it. I mean everybody matures soon or later, isn't? :scratch:

Fedex
11-14-2004, 04:25 AM
I think he has a nice an excellent game, but his gamesmanship and antics, are the things that I really dont like about him. And you can add in the fact that he also has fans like CoriaFuck4ever, and that should explain it all.

Action Jackson
11-14-2004, 04:25 AM
you are right GWB, to be young is not a valid pretext to show such a poor gamensmanship. But I think he could learn about it. I mean everybody matures soon or later, isn't? :scratch:

Yes, he can learn about improving it for sure. I mean we as people have to learn all the time, but the question is that does he want to just concentrate on his tennis which he plays very well, or continue with the antics just to piss people off, when a lot of the time he doesn't need to do it.

Jorge, thanks for the Horna translations I remember watching this match and my friend told me he said those things to Coria.

I wouldn't know I have never done anything like that on a court and there are many fine players who play the game and don't feel the need for those tactics.

Fergie
11-14-2004, 10:37 AM
It wasn't a back injury, it was kidney stones. He did miss sometime because of that but not very much. In my mind, it really affected the outcome of the Miami final though.
Just in time for Davis Cup, what a surprise :rolleyes:

*Ljubica*
11-14-2004, 10:55 AM
Rosie, this was an erm... how you say.. stupid thing to say? You don't know him personally, you only know how he tits around on court. If he treats her like gold (I don't know or care if he does) then I'd say she has it pretty set. Somebody who treats her well and is worth a good chunk of change. How ridiculous to make comments like this :rolleyes:

Dear Rebecca - I normally agree with you 100% but on this I have to take exception. You do not know me personally - we have never met - and you have absolutely know idea what social circles I move in, who I know personally, or what I do in my life outside of my "hobby" of posting here on MTF. Just because I may not boast about who I have met or who I know doesn't mean anything, - it just means I respect peoples' privacy instead of starting a thread every time I have seem someone getting drunk, picking up a girl or whatever. So let's just say that I do know Coria (and many other players)outside their courtside activities, I do know more about a lot of personal things than I would ever post on here, and the posters here that I know and trust could definately verify that. So I don't think making a comment about something I do know about is ridiculous and I take exception to being called a liar and told I don't know people when you haven't got a clue what goes on in my life. Just because the majority of posters on this Board have never met a Top 10 player (and don't get me wrong - there is nothing wrong with that at all), it doesn't mean that we are all the same or should be pre-judged in that way. However I don't want to get into some silly "war" so let's just leave it at that shall we :) Thanks

Carito_90
11-15-2004, 12:13 AM
Just in time for Davis Cup, what a surprise

Okay, I can accept all the bull**** people are saying here, but not that.
Coria is the last person who'd not want to play the DC. I mean, I'm serious, HE makes me proud of being Argentinean. Yes, i know, I'm not very proud of my country but he really does make me proud of it.
Now kill me :)

star
11-15-2004, 12:46 AM
Not me. :)

Coria lives and breathes Argentina. He's want to play on the Davis Cup very badly.

By the way, THREE Argies in the Masters. :woohoo:

liptea
11-15-2004, 02:36 AM
Coria's not bad, and you have to admire his speed and heart.

We can't always look at a player, or an person, and assume that they're all bad. There's always a rational reason behind all acts of anyone. Coria, in his first Grand Slam final, one that he is touted to win, suddenly finds himself overcome with extreme nerves. Cramps can be caused by that.

He's been plagued by injury in the latter part of the year and has to be admired for attempting to legitimize his ranking by showing up in Houston.

As for his coaching disputes, as knowledgeable as a coach is, Guillermo knows his body better. Maybe he wants match play before the season ends, maybe he wants a decent ending to a dismal second half of the year, maybe he feels ready to play and feels that his coach is holding him back.

When we, as simple fans/bystanders, can't see into a player's mind, we can't be too quick to judge him. That being said, we can't assume that he's a saint among men and players, that he's the Tennis Messiah or something. :rolleyes:

Fergie :wavey: , your icon is lovely.

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 02:42 AM
Since when has Coria been underrated?

liptea
11-15-2004, 02:51 AM
Since when has Coria been underrated?

Correct. I think we rate Coria right where he needs to be, just because we don't think he's a goddess.....

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 02:54 AM
Correct. I think we rate Coria right where he needs to be, just because we don't think he's a goddess.....

I have my own opinions of him and the Gaby Markus sacking was bad, don't forget that Markus was quite a talented player and had some very good wins, before injury stopped his career, so I think he knew what was best, but Coria does like having yes men around him.

A fine player and that's the best thing I can say.

daze11
11-15-2004, 02:55 AM
speaking of people who know people...

federer was recently interviewed by a very high profile tennis magazine in the US, and afterwards was asked who he sees as his immediate competition for this week's houston masters. he enlarged the question away from the masters and onto talent. he mentioned 2 players abilities he respected the most. one of those was coria.

that's high marks from somene who, hands on, probably has a pretty good sense of who has genuine ability on court and the potential for future greatness. he may not prove himself this week in the masters, by coming back too early from shoulder surgery (which cut short kuerten's long term consistency as well...so hopefully he will at least succeed in getting a bit grooved before 2005 without incident), but his court sense, variety of shot making, remarkable touch and agility, and competitive spirit place him pretty close to the top of crown-holders of the future. the only thing against him is a relatively small frame in what's become a bruiser's sport; his being more prone to injury than a roddick type is unfortunate. and roddick also, by the way, makes baby faces all the time, arguing arrogantly with linesmen, and being upset that his all-power tactics dont always work out. and then, safin dropped his drawers. federer is the only complete on-court gentleman of any of the top 5.

but to coria's credit on that point, as well, he was also asked by a prominent journalist --who likes coria MORE after getting to know him-- if he'd wished to have played pete sampras. "Yes," Coria said, "but not on clay..." (coria's strength) "--on grass." (sampras' strength)... Since the question was purely theoretical, I'm sure Coria was answering in the dream of himself at his best and sampras at his best...and with the assumpition that he will add good grass play to his arsenal before embarking on that imaginary match. But I think it illustrates a good deal of character on his part, and a champion's mentality of taking on, and winning, along the most difficult road.

hitchhiker
11-15-2004, 02:58 AM
I have my own opinions of him and the Gaby Markus sacking was bad, don't forget that Markus was quite a talented player and had some very good wins, before injury stopped his career, so I think he knew what was best, but Coria does like having yes men around him.


and mr federer sacked coach peter "jabba the hut" Lundgren as soon as he got him to the top and he didnt feel he needed him anymore.

now federer is snubbing davis cup and friend marc rosset because his at the top yet none of you criticise this.

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 03:00 AM
and mr federer sacked coach peter "jabba the hut" Lundgren as soon as he got him to the top and he didnt feel he needed him anymore.

now federer is snubbing davis cup and friend marc rosset because his at the top yet none of you criticise this.

You seem to have a problem with comprehension and since when has this particular thread been about Federer. If you want to start a thread dealing with this subject, go ahead.

star
11-15-2004, 03:07 AM
but to coria's credit on that point, as well, he was also asked by a prominent journalist --who likes coria MORE after getting to know him-- if he'd wished to have played pete sampras. "Yes," Coria said, "but not on clay..." (coria's strength) "--on grass." (sampras' strength)... Since the question was purely theoretical, I'm sure Coria was answering in the dream of himself at his best and sampras at his best...and with the assumpition that he will add good grass play to his arsenal before embarking on that imaginary match. But I think it illustrates a good deal of character on his part, and a champion's mentality of taking on, and winning, along the most difficult road.

That's a nice point. I think the grass season this year showed everyone that Guille wants to play well on that surface too. He's not going to avoid grass, and he has shown he can play well on it. Coria probably will never be number one in the world even if Federer weren't there blocking the road. He's got his size against him and he has to play very hard to overcome that deficit. However, his game is a joy to watch.

I've watched him play live several times. About 6 or 7 times, and I've never seen anything unsportsmanlike about him in those appearances. He is a fierce competitor and he wants to win very badly. I've seen others do things far worse with less criticism. But that's the way of this board, I suppose. :)

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 03:12 AM
I've watched him play live several times. About 6 or 7 times, and I've never seen anything unsportsmanlike about him in those appearances. He is a fierce competitor and he wants to win very badly. I've seen others do things far worse with less criticism. But that's the way of this board, I suppose. :)

So you never saw Hamburg 03 with the convenient injury time out and the rubbish with Horna at Hamburg this year. Then the Cincinatti match with Henman last year?

In your eyes faking injuries is alright then? Any player who does that deserves to be criticised, not just Coria.

Chloe le Bopper
11-15-2004, 03:19 AM
Coria is one of my favourite players erm, probably ever, and even I can admit that he acts like a pansy sometimes.

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 03:22 AM
As I said earlier I quite like his game, especially his movement and he thinks very well on the court a lot better than most players and that can only be admired, but the other stuff that consistently goes on leaves a bad taste.

I remember in Monte Carlo after 2 games he was complaining and Cedric Mourier told him nicely to "shut up" and he wasn't so bad after that.

star
11-15-2004, 03:30 AM
So you never saw Hamburg 03 with the convenient injury time out and the rubbish with Horna at Hamburg this year. Then the Cincinatti match with Henman last year?

In your eyes faking injuries is alright then? Any player who does that deserves to be criticised, not just Coria.

I wasn't present at those matches. I'm only talking about the ones that I've actually attended and not about matches that are interpreted by other people for me. I've never been able to go to Hamburg although I would love to return to that city to see the clay tournament there. I'm sure it would be a lovely nostalgic time. Unfortunately, I don't have any tv coverage of it either.

I'm not willing to take the word of people who dislike him about his behavior. Your charaterizations may be accurate, but your evident bias makes your account not terribly reliable to my way of thinking.

Your belief is Coria faked an injury. I'm not atempting to argue you out of it. You take it as gospel that he did. I don't.

liptea
11-15-2004, 03:32 AM
So you never saw Hamburg 03 with the convenient injury time out and the rubbish with Horna at Hamburg this year. Then the Cincinatti match with Henman last year?

In your eyes faking injuries is alright then? Any player who does that deserves to be criticised, not just Coria.

Not necessarily to defend Coria or anything, I like the guy but not obsessively, but when a player is just mentally tired, things can start to hurt.

Once, playing a match for my school (on a side note, I get to play number one singles this year...!), I just felt so fatigued all of a sudden but I kept playing. By the end of the match, I was physically exhausted too, and ended up with badly torn ligaments in my wrist.

We don't necessarily need to obsessively hate or adore the guy. After all...we don't know him right? And we don't know him personally-he could be a villain or a saint (not likely either way).

Gosh, I think I'm going to be assaulted as a Coria fan.

daze11
11-15-2004, 03:38 AM
As I said earlier I quite like his game, especially his movement and he thinks very well on the court a lot better than most players and that can only be admired, but the other stuff that consistently goes on leaves a bad taste.

I remember in Monte Carlo after 2 games he was complaining and Cedric Mourier told him nicely to "shut up" and he wasn't so bad after that.
I haven't seen all his matches but I do have the 2003 Hamburg final and everyone saw the French 04...usually you fake an injury if theres a chance you might lose; he was outclassing both competitors by head and shoulders and would have absolutely no reason to fear a loss in these instances. We have to take into account something called "professional jealousy" when other players have issues with people who start pulling away from the pack as Coria has over the last couple of years.

To watch the french final in particular is to see him destroy a player in an embarrassment to the point where gaudio mouthed to his coach, during the match, that he was just going to leave (that's real class.... :rolleyes: ) and then guillermo let out this SCREAM of aggravation as he bounced the ball to serve before there was any trouble in sight (for us viewers). I'm sure Gaudio would love to convince himself he could have beaten a healthy coria that day and that he deserved the french open...but gaudio doesnt have "a leg to stand on" in arguing that at all based on the matchplay when both were healthy the first 2 plus sets.

Luckily for skinny-legged guys like bjorn borg, talent was allowed to complete the match in his day rather than having injuries (of all the players) take such a big role in the outcomes...I'm still of the old school that talent should determine matches. But injuries are very real these days in a way they never were before. And a smallish guy like coria IS going to have problems some of the others won't. Henin-Hardenne is in the same boat. But i understand a lot of folks think she's arrogant and a faker too... IMO, the sport is much better with Corias and Henins around than with just Roddicks and Serenas, using thinking instead of just brawn to determine all victory.

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 03:39 AM
I'm not willing to take the word of people who dislike him about his behavior. Your charaterizations may be accurate, but your evident bias makes your account not terribly reliable to my way of thinking.

Your belief is Coria faked an injury. I'm not atempting to argue you out of it. You take it as gospel that he did. I don't.

In other words you are basically calling me a liar. Thanks very much for that it was very much appreciated. I do have the capacity to talk about people I don't like without bias crudely effecting my judgements.

Ok, I didn't mind Jeff Tarango, but on the court he was a jerk at times, and the whole Wimbledon farce when he walked off the court. So would you be willing to take my word that Tarango overreacted and acted like a jerk on that day against Mronz?

So, in your mind it's ok to take an injury timeout for cramps at 1 set all in a tough match, then after the treatment have the ability to run faster than before, then after breaking serve giving Gaudio a gesture basically questioning his manhood?

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 03:42 AM
daze, who won the match that counted? No amount of excuses you use and this has been done so many times can justify that he choked under the pressure, and didn't have the right self-management and wasn't fit enough when he needed to be at his strongest mentally and physically.

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 03:49 AM
daze, if you watched these matches then you would be able to comment specifically on what I was saying. It was you that mentioned the French Open final in 2004 and not me. I used other examples and not that one, I can see with my own eyes what happened there and I am not deluded about what went on in that match.

The Horna match that incident was very silly. There were a few close calls that were on the line and were called out and Coria wiped them out as they were on the line. Then Coria served a massive double fault and Horna walked to the other side ready to play, and then Coria calls out to Horna asking him "Why didn't you call that serve in". Horna told him it was way out and TV replays showed this to be the case.

Coria and Horna start yelling across the net, and then Horna says "I am not Gaudio, I will really hit you". It sure made the match more interesting, but that was really something that shouldn't have happened at all.

daze11
11-15-2004, 03:50 AM
daze, who won the match that counted? No amount of excuses you use and this has been done so many times can justify that he choked under the pressure, and didn't have the right self-management and wasn't fit enough when he needed to be at his strongest mentally and physically.
THAT is a fair assessment. i dont agree with it; but its fair. I've seen him mature in big pressure situations which he handled masterfully when healthy too many times to buy it. Gaudio was as unthreateing as he could be as an opponent; against a federer or ferrero or even a moya, i could see some kind of choke, but not Gaston. I think he had inexperience in the grand slam final, so it was a new kind of pressure, but I think it was only with the weight of injury, and being distracted with his mind on not bringing the injury back during play, that caused his lack of focus which lost him the match in the end. I dont think it was Gaudio's play that did it. But as you said, the FO-04 been discussed ad nauseum & doesnt need a repeat here. My point was that 'faker'/gamesmanship usually occurs when a player is at least in some kind of trouble.

daze11
11-15-2004, 03:55 AM
daze, if you watched these matches then you would be able to comment specifically on what I was saying. It was you that mentioned the French Open final in 2004 and not me. I used other examples and not that one, I can see with my own eyes what happened there and I am not deluded about what went on in that match.

The Horna match that incident was very silly. There were a few close calls that were on the line and were called out and Coria wiped them out as they were on the line. Then Coria served a massive double fault and Horna walked to the other side ready to play, and then Coria calls out to Horna asking him "Why didn't you call that serve in". Horna told him it was way out and TV replays showed this to be the case.

Coria and Horna start yelling across the net, and then Horna says "I am not Gaudio, I will really hit you". It sure made the match more interesting, but that was really something that shouldn't have happened at all.
I missed this post as I was writing, sorry. He has been a prick about someline calls...a bit of an 'entitlement' complex, i agree. But not to the extent people are laying on the guy; i just think its steamrolled into something inaccurate. The more secure he gets that his play will win no matter how many bad calls he gets, the sooner those incidents will go away. (The Horna match was his FIRST title, remember). But again, i've seen roddick say "don't be a wimp" to his opponents in linecall situations as well. The tour is full of overly rich, bratty young kids. But Coria is the real deal, and I dont think his talent can be questioned.

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 03:58 AM
THAT is a fair assessment. i dont agree with it; but its fair. I've seen him mature in big pressure situations which he handled masterfully when healthy too many times to buy it. Gaudio was as unthreateing as he could be as an opponent; against a federer or ferrero or even a moya, i could see some kind of choke, but not Gaston. I think he had inexperience in the grand slam final, so it was a new kind of pressure, but I think it was only with the weight of injury, and being distracted with his mind on not bringing the injury back during play, that caused his lack of focus which lost him the match in the end. I dont think it was Gaudio's play that did it. But as you said, the FO-04 been discussed ad nauseum & doesnt need a repeat here. My point was that afakjer usually does so when they are in some kind of trouble.

Did you not read clearly what I said? Obviously as this match was played on one given day and that's what it meant on that given day, not before, not after on that given day.

Ok, here we go again? Are you trying to tell me cramp is an injury? If you are then anything else is discredited, because it has been mentioned at least 50x on this board that cramp is not an injury, and there have been medical explanations to why this is.

It never occured that Gaston was absolutely nervous and did nothing right in combination with Coria's very bright beginning had an outcome as to why the first 2 sets were easy. If you couldn't see Gaudio was playing better in the 3rd set, then you have sight problems. This doesn't mean that he was going to win the match, but the nerves, and what he had the chance to achieve and the fact Gaudio was playing better helped Coria get the cramping problems.

As I said I never mentioned this match at all in the examples of the times he has used blatant gamesmanship and faking injuries, you are the one who started on this track, there were 3 specific matches that I mentioned and this is not one of them.

star
11-15-2004, 03:59 AM
In other words you are basically calling me a liar. Thanks very much for that it was very much appreciated. I do have the capacity to talk about people I don't like without bias crudely effecting my judgements.

Ok, I didn't mind Jeff Tarango, but on the court he was a jerk at times, and the whole Wimbledon farce when he walked off the court. So would you be willing to take my word that Tarango overreacted and acted like a jerk on that day against Mronz?

So, in your mind it's ok to take an injury timeout for cramps at 1 set all in a tough match, then after the treatment have the ability to run faster than before, then after breaking serve giving Gaudio a gesture basically questioning his manhood?

Your attitude here is one of the reasons I wouldn't take your word without other verification. Obviously, I did not call you a liar. I merely said that you have an evident bias. My training is not to trust one with an evident bias without other reliable evidence. I have no idea who you are or anything about your character other than what I see here. What I do see is that you are greatly interested in convincing everyone that Coria is beyond redemption. That's a rather intersting stance you've taken, but it's not one that makes me think you are a dispassioned observer.

I wouldn't have to take your word for what occured with Jeff Tarango. I was able to observe some of it through television. I must say, however, that I was left with a deep admiration for Tarango's wife. :)

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 04:02 AM
I missed this post as I was writing, sorry. He has been a prick about someline calls...a bit of an 'entitlement' complex, i agree. But not to the extent people are laying on the guy; i just think its steamrolled into something inaccurate. The more secure he gets that his play will win no matter how many bad calls he gets, the sooner those incidents will go away. (The Horna match was his FIRST title, remember). But again, i've seen roddick say "don't be a wimp" to his opponents in linecall situations as well. The tour is full of overly rich, bratty young kids. But Coria is the real deal, and I dont think his talent can be questioned.

Did you ever see anything about me questioning Coria's talent? Find it, if I said that? No, don't use Roddick as an example and for the record I never have liked his on court behaviour.

What stop trying to justify his on court behaviour. That stuff with Horna was crap, and he won Hamburg in 2003 and this was Hamburg 2004 and what title are you actually talking about?

daze11
11-15-2004, 04:05 AM
That's fine. Then I'll point out only that those matches of 2003 you mention are before his title wins and before he matured in his behavior AND playing ability. If I am wrong, and he acts like that in 2005, I wont post another word placing him above it.

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 04:06 AM
Your attitude here is one of the reasons I wouldn't take your word without other verification. Obviously, I did not call you a liar. I merely said that you have an evident bias. My training is not to trust one with an evident bias without other reliable evidence. I have no idea who you are or anything about your character other than what I see here. What I do see is that you are greatly interested in convincing everyone that Coria is beyond redemption. That's a rather intersting stance you've taken, but it's not one that makes me think you are a dispassioned observer.

Ok, when did I actually say he was beyond redemption? People can and do grow up and I would love for him not to be so petty when he is on court, it takes away from the high quality of his game.

I don't like the fact that acting like a prick on court can be justified and I have given clear examples as to where this has happened.

I wouldn't have to take your word for what occured with Jeff Tarango. I was able to observe some of it through television. I must say, however, that I was left with a deep admiration for Tarango's wife. :)

She was the highlight of that Wimbledon.

star
11-15-2004, 04:09 AM
That phrase was my summation of all that you have written here. As you see, charaterizations can upset those who think they are unwaranted. You are enormously vehement on this subject. It is precisely because of the heated nature of your posts that they are unconvincing to me.

I'm sure that anything good I have to say about Coria is equally unconvincing to you.

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 04:10 AM
That's fine. Then I'll point out only that those matches of 2003 you mention are before his title wins and before he matured in his behavior AND playing ability. If I am wrong, and he acts like that in 2005, I wont post another word placing him above it.

Problem is that he has had injury problems and this is clear to see, but he really needs to build himself up and improve his durability and with the previous history, there are many people going to be sceptical.

daze11
11-15-2004, 04:12 AM
we're crossing signals, vladimir. i'm thinking of the 2003 Hamburg Final (Coria def Calleri) which i thought you mentioned...too much text to read, too little focus. I saw him twice in hamburg 2004 but not what you are mentioning. Sorry for the confusion on that.

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 04:13 AM
That phrase was my summation of all that you have written here. As you see, charaterizations can upset those who think they are unwaranted. You are enormously vehement on this subject. It is precisely because of the heated nature of your posts that they are unconvincing to me.

I'm sure that anything good I have to say about Coria is equally unconvincing to you.

Have you heard me criticise his game? As I said to daze find where I have criticised his game at all?

Even with people that I dislike, they have redeeming features. It's good for him that he still lives with grandmother, he opened up a tennis school and is putting something back into the game. He has handled the bitter disappointments of 2004 better than many of his fans. Coria is very good to his fans and yes I have seen that more than once with my own eyes ( I am lying there too :) ).

Anything else you would like me to add?

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 04:14 AM
we're crossing signals, vladimir. i'm thinking of the 2003 Hamburg Final (Coria def Calleri) which i thought you mentioned...too much text to read, too little focus. I saw him twice in hamburg 2004 but not what you are mentioning. Sorry for the confusion on that.

He killed Calleri in that final. It was the semi final 03 (Gaudio), Cincinatti 03 (Henman) and Hamburg 04 (Horna). It's alright no offence taken at all.

daze11
11-15-2004, 04:39 AM
Problem is that he has had injury problems and this is clear to see, but he really needs to build himself up and improve his durability and with the previous history, there are many people going to be sceptical.
yes, the only super-dumb thing i can attribute to him is that he drinks only water instead of vitamins etc like most players nowdays during matches because he is so suspicious of contaminants that will turn up positive on the drug test after the terrible incident of 2001. He should just ask federer (or any trusted source who HASN'T turned up positive for the steriods in their vitamins) what he uses, and move past it.
I agree with what you're saying completely about improving his durability. If he doesnt stop martyring himself over the false 'drug test', he'll keep getting injured OR cramped. But i must say regarding his willness to not use any supplements at all, it supports my first statement that beneath his argentinian pride & temper, is someone striving (in this case, over-striving in a way that is not helping him) to be good and true, and that is not seen often. And not in line with so many (not yours, per se) portraits of coria as this total jerk in need of being maligned.

Vladimir Poutine
11-15-2004, 04:51 AM
yes, the only super-dumb thing i can attribute to him is that he drinks only water instead of vitamins etc like most players nowdays during matches because he is so suspicious of contaminants that will turn up positive on the drug test after the terrible incident of 2001. He should just ask federer (or any trusted source who HASN'T turned up positive for the steriods in their vitamins) what he uses, and move past it.

That's why there is a banned list of substances and this is what his personal trainer should be doing finding out what stuff is legal and what isn't, and which ones can help him develop a better physique. Or if he is really sneaky, they should know the best making agents to cover up any illegal stuff, not that I am condoning this at all.

I agree with what you're saying completely about improving his durability. If he doesnt stop martyring himself over the false 'drug test', he'll keep getting injured OR cramped. But i must say regarding his willness to not use any supplements at all, it supports my first statement that beneath his argentinian pride & temper, is someone striving (in this case, over-striving in a way that is not helping him) to be good and true, and that is not seen often. And not in line with so many (not yours, per se) portraits of coria as this total jerk in need of being maligned.

It's not like electrolytes are illegal, and someone of his build needs plenty of endurance work, but also the right training problem to put on muscle, but not lose any of his speed. Whether he took the "vitamins" or not, the thing is he has done his time and that's something I am prepared to give him, but this whole trying to be true image is quite hypocritical, because if he was, then he wouldn't use the dodgy tactics, when he is a good enough player not to need them.

I have stated my points and gave particular reasons to why I think that way, and as said earlier if he acts like an arse, then he deserves to be grilled, but faking injuries in order to win a match, is one of the lowest things that can be done on a tennis court, that and deliberately hitting someone with a smash.

Smankyou
11-15-2004, 08:39 AM
speaking of people who know people...

federer was recently interviewed by a very high profile tennis magazine in the US, and afterwards was asked who he sees as his immediate competition for this week's houston masters. he enlarged the question away from the masters and onto talent. he mentioned 2 players abilities he respected the most. one of those was coria.

that's high marks from somene who, hands on, probably has a pretty good sense of who has genuine ability on court and the potential for future greatness. he may not prove himself this week in the masters, by coming back too early from shoulder surgery (which cut short kuerten's long term consistency as well...so hopefully he will at least succeed in getting a bit grooved before 2005 without incident), but his court sense, variety of shot making, remarkable touch and agility, and competitive spirit place him pretty close to the top of crown-holders of the future. the only thing against him is a relatively small frame in what's become a bruiser's sport; his being more prone to injury than a roddick type is unfortunate. and roddick also, by the way, makes baby faces all the time, arguing arrogantly with linesmen, and being upset that his all-power tactics dont always work out. and then, safin dropped his drawers. federer is the only complete on-court gentleman of any of the top 5.

but to coria's credit on that point, as well, he was also asked by a prominent journalist --who likes coria MORE after getting to know him-- if he'd wished to have played pete sampras. "Yes," Coria said, "but not on clay..." (coria's strength) "--on grass." (sampras' strength)... Since the question was purely theoretical, I'm sure Coria was answering in the dream of himself at his best and sampras at his best...and with the assumpition that he will add good grass play to his arsenal before embarking on that imaginary match. But I think it illustrates a good deal of character on his part, and a champion's mentality of taking on, and winning, along the most difficult road.

Not a single person in this thread is questioning his talent. It's obvious he has bucket loads of the stuff. Generally people have a problem with his antics whilst the ball isn't in motion i.e. between points, during breaks etc. Personally, I haven't seen the matches in question and have had to play it by ear.

daze11
11-15-2004, 02:52 PM
Not a single person in this thread is questioning his talent. It's obvious he has bucket loads of the stuff. Generally people have a problem with his antics whilst the ball isn't in motion i.e. between points, during breaks etc. Personally, I haven't seen the matches in question and have had to play it by ear.
i wish that were true...i am not the guy's brother, so i dont mind if people dont like him one way or the other as a person, but as a player, the first 4 pages of this thread were people saying he had accomplished 'no magic, nada' for not winning a grand slam (when he still won about 6 tournaments in only half a year of play), at a time we have the top 2 women players vying for #1 who have not even made a GS final all year. And then people saying his play is boring, his only strength is running fast, blah blah...it's only in the last few pages that any sensible comments were made at all. To have more shots at his command than almost anyone on a planet of 6 billion people (he's arguably behind federer only in his ability to hit any shot from anywhere on the court, and in the company of agassi, kuerten, & santoro) is impressive no matter his attitude; and he is not near the 'brat antics' that McEnroe, Connors, and Nastase rose to back in the 70s. So if Guillermo Coria is boring to watch, then the viewer doesnt like the dynamics of this sport.

Mlashtok
11-15-2004, 05:02 PM
Actually, Daze, Coria's only won 2 tournaments in what he played this year, not 6... still, he is a heck of a clay-court player, there's no argueing against that.

Chloe le Bopper
11-19-2004, 06:53 AM
Dear Rebecca - I normally agree with you 100% but on this I have to take exception. You do not know me personally - we have never met - and you have absolutely know idea what social circles I move in, who I know personally, or what I do in my life outside of my "hobby" of posting here on MTF. Just because I may not boast about who I have met or who I know doesn't mean anything, - it just means I respect peoples' privacy instead of starting a thread every time I have seem someone getting drunk, picking up a girl or whatever.

Heh. Bullshit, Rosie. If you had the knowledge that you claim to (and I'm not even touching that... you very well could, it makes no difference to me) and gave a damn about privacy, you wouldn't make comments like you do about Coria. You respect the privacy of those that you *like* perhaps, but you certainly don't respect Coria's.

So let's just say that I do know Coria (and many other players)outside their courtside activities, I do know more about a lot of personal things than I would ever post on here, and the posters here that I know and trust could definately verify that.

No need. As I said, I don't care what you know or who you talk to.

So I don't think making a comment about something I do know about is ridiculous and I take exception to being called a liar and told I don't know people when you haven't got a clue what goes on in my life.

If you dont' want to be called a liar, then perhaps you shouldn't have lied in this VERY post. You don't have any respect for Coria's privacy, as I explained above.

Just because the majority of posters on this Board have never met a Top 10 player (and don't get me wrong - there is nothing wrong with that at all), it doesn't mean that we are all the same or should be pre-judged in that way. However I don't want to get into some silly "war" so let's just leave it at that shall we :) Thanks

Frankly, if you have actually had personal interaction with him and then spend your time airing your views about him on a messageboard, you're even worse than those who have simply prejudged him based on how he acts on court. And, as I said, your call on privacy? Complete BS.

merle
11-19-2004, 07:07 AM
speaking of people who know people...

federer was recently interviewed by a very high profile tennis magazine in the US, and afterwards was asked who he sees as his immediate competition for this week's houston masters. he enlarged the question away from the masters and onto talent. he mentioned 2 players abilities he respected the most. one of those was coria.



Who was the 2nd one? Please say it was Safin! ;)

star
11-19-2004, 12:29 PM
My guess is that it was Tim because Federer said at Wimbledon that Tim was his biggest competition for that title and he has praised Tim's volley. But, my second guess would be Safin.