Queens R2: Mahut def. Murray 6-3 6-7(4) 7-6(1) [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Queens R2: Mahut def. Murray 6-3 6-7(4) 7-6(1)

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Filo V.
06-13-2012, 05:33 PM
Amazing final tiebreak from Nicolas. Great to see the way better player of the match win this. Did extremely well to hang in after being broken to love to start the third set and eventually break back. Nicolas was the one dictating the play with his forehand, hit some amazing returns off both sides and sweet slice BH's, and served well on the big points. Murray was very reactive most of the match, at times he was being offensive and he was playing clean tennis, but extremely up and down overall from Andrew, too many loose errors and he was struggling with his movement on the grass.

Nicolas says this is probably his best career win. He's such an awesome player on grass. Amazing win for him!

hipolymer
06-13-2012, 05:33 PM
:haha: Murray wants to win Wimbledon? :haha:

SheepleBuster
06-13-2012, 05:33 PM
lol lolo lol laughing my ass off pissing my pants off rolling on the floor.

Belludal
06-13-2012, 05:33 PM
Mahut :worship::yeah::worship:

Yves.
06-13-2012, 05:34 PM
Grass court tennis is still very much alive!

Drugs Ruin Lives
06-13-2012, 05:34 PM
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc219/5e4n/fail.gif

shadows
06-13-2012, 05:34 PM
Allez!

Great grass court tennis display.

rocketassist
06-13-2012, 05:35 PM
Nico :worship: what a legend.

This is real grass, real tennis.

Myrre
06-13-2012, 05:35 PM
Andy "Feeling not so good after all" Murray

Looner
06-13-2012, 05:35 PM
Murray is the 4th favourite for Wimbledon with about 0.000000000000001% chance.

Blue Heart24
06-13-2012, 05:35 PM
Great performance Mahut :yeah:
A joy to watch on grass.

OnyxRose
06-13-2012, 05:35 PM
This kind of makes the Roddick loss insignificant because at least Andy1 is at the end of his career. What's Andy2's problem?

Kat_YYZ
06-13-2012, 05:35 PM
Nico :hug: :D

dav abu
06-13-2012, 05:35 PM
Have probably got f**k all chance now of selling my final tickets but can't help but laugh. Peter Fleming's positive from the match is that 'He didn't get hurt'...

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 05:35 PM
Amazing final tiebreak from Nicolas. Great to see the way better player of the match win this.
From Mahut? Murray gave away most of the points with errors. I remember Mahut winning one with a winner, that's it.

Bad start to the grass season, Andy, but on to Wimbledon.

scoobs
06-13-2012, 05:36 PM
Well that was an utter mess, Andrew.

Well played Nico, deserved it in the end, kept steady, kept serving big and kept finding ways to attack. Kept himself in the match and let Mr Murray completely unravel in that shitfest final set tiebreak.

You'll be well-rested for Wimbledon anyway, Andy.

cutesteve22
06-13-2012, 05:36 PM
Fine, now no one could stop Dimugtrov from winning the title :facepalm:

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 05:36 PM
Good for the game. The more natural grasscourt player, with a more beautiful and classic game on the surface won. Hope Mahut can take confidence from this win and play well during the rest of the grass season, he's great to watch on this surface.

That said, Mahut made things unnecessarily complicated for himself by choking break points in absurd fashion in the second set. Could have wrapped this up in 2. But at least he did win in the end.

tektonac
06-13-2012, 05:36 PM
mahut has always been a fine grass court player. great win for nicolas.

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 05:36 PM
This kind of makes the Roddick loss insignificant because at least Andy1 is at the end of his career. What's Andy2's problem?
Mahut played well, the tiebreak was horrible from Andy. One of the worst tiebreaks I've ever seen him play. All of the points were errors except for one pretty much.

stillreal
06-13-2012, 05:36 PM
YES! Great result! Even though I am kinda sad for Andy, Mahut proved once again that he is at least top 10 on grass, and what he showed today was definitely the reason why he is one of my top favorites.

kiriri***
06-13-2012, 05:37 PM
Except 3rd set TB, Both of them were plyaing good grass court tennis:D
Murray on 3rd set TB is just error machine:o Some point is good for Mahut's.

Good win, Mahut:D

martyn
06-13-2012, 05:37 PM
Mahut was only very good for the 1st set, merely adequate after.

Murray was abysmal. Donating breaks back immediately after breaking yet again, forehand worse then ever, and movement to the forehand corner was very laboured. Actually, you can see that Murray's movement has depreciated, hard to see what has happened given that 6-8 months ago the guy was playing superb tennis.

Wing Man Frank
06-13-2012, 05:37 PM
Laughable performance from Murray.

habibko
06-13-2012, 05:37 PM
always a class act Mahut, apologizing twice to the crowd for winning a match? never seen anyone doing such a thing, well done Nico :yeah:

Moozza
06-13-2012, 05:38 PM
Horrible 3rd set tie-break from Murray and when he broke at the start of the 3rd should not have let Mahut back in to the match. Apart from that an ok performance for his first match on grass.

Mahut played very well and deserved the win.

theseth1119
06-13-2012, 05:38 PM
Rogie's winning Wimbledon, 7th Wimbledon title tying Sampras, and 17 singles grand slams overall.

Chris Kuerten
06-13-2012, 05:38 PM
One of the greatest results of all time.

rinnegan
06-13-2012, 05:38 PM
http://i55.tinypic.com/2u47m8o.gif

BroTree123
06-13-2012, 05:38 PM
Mahut played a great match. No excuses.

Sophocles
06-13-2012, 05:39 PM
Bad result for the tournament. Setback for Murray. He's trying to hit the forehand with more authority but it's just leaking errors.

bounccer
06-13-2012, 05:39 PM
Amazing

Now watch him draw Federer in the first round of Wimbledon :facepalm:

seljanin
06-13-2012, 05:39 PM
Amazing match by Nico :yeah: Whatta performance, just joy to watch such a beautiful display of grass court tennis :worship:

Seems that this small run in French Open has given Nico some good confidence, he really looked confident out there.

henke007
06-13-2012, 05:39 PM
Mahut should have won already in the 2nd set where he had chances in everyone of Murray's service games. Held his serve most of the time with ease untill the 3rd. A clinical breaker on serve and some gutsy returns won him the match and he deserved it.

Always nice when Murray loses.

ZaZoo)
06-13-2012, 05:40 PM
too good TB :haha:

iriraz
06-13-2012, 05:40 PM
Typical match on a grass court.Murray had his chances at 2-2 in the third set but missed an easy forehand on break point and then when it went to the tiebreak he played a couple of poor points and that was that.

out_grinder
06-13-2012, 05:40 PM
This kind of makes the Roddick loss insignificant because at least Andy1 is at the end of his career. What's Andy2's problem?

Murray is also near the end of his career, or at least in significant physical decline which will naturally cause dwindling results.

The guy is now 25 years old and plays a grinder's game, what do you expect?

Let's not get too down - he's had a good run

rocketassist
06-13-2012, 05:41 PM
Bad result for the tournament. Setback for Murray. He's trying to hit the forehand with more authority but it's just leaking errors.

Why are upsets bad for the tournament?

Mahut is awesome and I hope he goes on to win it. He is Mr. Queens as his previous runs testify and the field isn't exactly one to be frightened of besides Jo.

Przemek
06-13-2012, 05:41 PM
I think Andy has big chance to win Wimbledon right now. Every time he won Queens he was mediocre at SW19. Now it's all different. Also Wimbledon is played on more suitable grass for Murray IMHO. I'm happy for the Nico but this match is saying nothing about Andy's form. So give up haters :wavey:

Deathless Mortal
06-13-2012, 05:41 PM
I still remember Mahut beating Nadal in Queens, he's really a great player on grass :yeah:

Yves.
06-13-2012, 05:42 PM
Castle or Lloyd said before the match that Murray would beat him 3 and 4. Because Mahut plays one-dimensional tennis. :o

J99
06-13-2012, 05:42 PM
What do you mean amazing final TB from Mahut, he did nothing there, Murray gave him the match, it was amazing how bad Murray was, couldn't do anything right, it goes to show that you didn't even see the TB did you.

rocketassist
06-13-2012, 05:43 PM
This result is more evidence of what a disgrace Wimbledon are for slowing the courts the way they have.

shadows
06-13-2012, 05:43 PM
Why are upsets bad for the tournament?

Mahut is awesome and I hope he goes on to win it. He is Mr. Queens as his previous runs testify and the field isn't exactly one to be frightened of besides Jo.

It's bad for the tournament because it's light on big names as is this year, and now they lost the best ranked played and only real British hope. I'm sure it'll still be packed out for the remainder of the week but it will unquestionably get a bit less attention here with Murray gone already.

bounccer
06-13-2012, 05:44 PM
Too bad the Queen's is the last grass tournament of the year, though.

pray-for-palestine-and-israel
06-13-2012, 05:44 PM
http://www.lamebook.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/eh2.jpg

siffleanimaux
06-13-2012, 05:45 PM
mahut :worship:

Moozza
06-13-2012, 05:45 PM
Mahut was only very good for the 1st set, merely adequate after.

Murray was abysmal. Donating breaks back immediately after breaking yet again, forehand worse then ever, and movement to the forehand corner was very laboured. Actually, you can see that Murray's movement has depreciated, hard to see what has happened given that 6-8 months ago the guy was playing superb tennis.

Murray's movement is as good as ever imo. The courts today were very slippy which made it more difficult to move.

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 05:45 PM
It's bad for the tournament because it's light on big names as is this year, and now they lost the best ranked played and only real British hope. I'm sure it'll still be packed out for the remainder of the week but it will unquestionably get a bit less attention here with Murray gone already.

Bah who cares about Murray?

Jo is a far more entertaining player, I'm sure the crowds will be delighted :D Jo is the best ticket in men's tennis imo

And Mahut plays beautiful tennis on grasscourts, no real tennis fan would prefer watching Murray on this surface than Mahut, who plays classic grasscourt tennis.

trojanstallion
06-13-2012, 05:45 PM
Ahhh poor Cheatray, couldnt find a way to Cheat a win here???

Too bad, soo sad.

:wavey:

Filo V.
06-13-2012, 05:46 PM
From Mahut? Murray gave away most of the points with errors. I remember Mahut winning one with a winner, that's it.

Bad start to the grass season, Andy, but on to Wimbledon.

Mahut was clearly the better player. But you're too biased to see that.

zerocool_
06-13-2012, 05:46 PM
Mahut played really well, deserved this. Hope he can keep it up, didn't saw draw, who he play next?

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 05:46 PM
Bah who cares about Murray?

Jo is a far more entertaining player, I'm sure the crowds will be delighted :D Jo is the best ticket in men's tennis imo

And Mahut plays beautiful tennis on grasscourts, no real tennis fan would prefer watching Murray on this surface than Mahut, who plays classic grasscourt tennis.
Just so you know, Andy has far more shots than Tsonga, has a higher level than him and can actually construct points consistently.


Good win for Mahut btw, he's a great player to watch when he's on.

J99
06-13-2012, 05:47 PM
Bah who cares about Murray?

Jo is a far more entertaining player, I'm sure the crowds will be delighted :D Jo is the best ticket in men's tennis imo

And Mahut plays beautiful tennis on grasscourts, no real tennis fan would prefer watching Murray on this surface than Mahut, who plays classic grasscourt tennis.

Murray is quite entertaining really, always gesticulating and talking to himself.

Sombrerero loco
06-13-2012, 05:47 PM
murray :weirdo: no words

rocketassist
06-13-2012, 05:48 PM
It's bad for the tournament because it's light on big names as is this year, and now they lost the best ranked played and only real British hope. I'm sure it'll still be packed out for the remainder of the week but it will unquestionably get a bit less attention here with Murray gone already.

Queens survived when Querrey won it, I'm sure they'll be fine again. Murray can go warm up for Wimbledon where he won't be so prone to an upset on slow ass grass.

Mahut-Tsonga final would be nothing like Querrey-Fish.

J99
06-13-2012, 05:48 PM
Just so you know, Andy has far more shots than Murray, has a higher level than him and can actually construct points consistently.


Good win for Mahut btw, he's a great player to watch when he's on.

LOL, wut.

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 05:48 PM
Mahut was clearly the better player. But you're too biased to see that.
Actually, I noticed that Andy was lucky to not lose in straights. Mahut was bad on break points. As far as I see it, Mahut gave Murray chances to win the second set and Murray gave the match to Mahut in that last tiebreak. And it was a good win by Mahut anyway, he played well.

Hey, I may be biased sometimes, but at least I'm not an ACC champion :lol: I don't think I should take your opinion of me too seriously tbh :lol:

Moozza
06-13-2012, 05:48 PM
Mahut was clearly the better player. But you're too biased to see that.

He is telling the truth though. Mahut was very good and desrved the win but Murray was awful in the Tie-break, making about 4 UEs.

viruzzz
06-13-2012, 05:48 PM
Andy has far more shots than Murray

Words of wisdom.

Wing Man Frank
06-13-2012, 05:49 PM
This result is more evidence of what a disgrace Wimbledon are for slowing the courts the way they have.

Player power was responsible for that.

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 05:49 PM
LOL, wut.
My bad.
Words of wisdom.
I'd take my word over yours any day :shrug:

kiriri***
06-13-2012, 05:50 PM
Mahut played really well, deserved this. Hope he can keep it up, didn't saw draw, who he play next?

Dimitrov. Battle of one handed backhand;)

rinnegan
06-13-2012, 05:50 PM
Just so you know, Andy has far more shots than Murray, has a higher level than him and can actually construct points consistently.

Oh.

tektonac
06-13-2012, 05:51 PM
This result is more evidence of what a disgrace Wimbledon are for slowing the courts the way they have.

how many posts on the 'slow courts' did you have on MTF? 1000, 2000 or more?

RIboy
06-13-2012, 05:51 PM
Murray >> Nadull/Fakervic :yeah:

Sophocles
06-13-2012, 05:52 PM
Why are upsets bad for the tournament?

Because Murray is probably the only player in the field the tossers in the audience have heard of.

rocketassist
06-13-2012, 05:53 PM
how many posts on the 'slow courts' did you have on MTF? 1000, 2000 or more?

No more than most traditionalist tennis fans.

Moozza
06-13-2012, 05:53 PM
Murray >> Nadull/Fakervic :yeah:

You do realise Nadal has also lost to Mahut at this tournament.

henke007
06-13-2012, 05:53 PM
No serve = No slam :wavey:

RIboy
06-13-2012, 05:54 PM
You do realise Nadal has also lost to Mahut at this tournament.

do you know what >> means?

J99
06-13-2012, 05:54 PM
Too bad the Queen's is the last grass tournament of the year, though.

LOL, wut.

scoobs
06-13-2012, 05:55 PM
Just so you know, Andy has far more shots than Murray

A shame neither of them showed up today.

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 05:56 PM
No serve = No slam :wavey:
Nadal has slams :scratch:

Moozza
06-13-2012, 05:56 PM
do you know what >> means?

You were being sarcastic, weren't you?

madmax
06-13-2012, 05:56 PM
Murray was lackdaisical and leaking errors at important points...typical pre-slam MM event result, with huge underdog scraping a win over erratic top player. Mahut will lose in R2 of Wimby anyway

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 05:57 PM
:wavey: bye troll. :lol:
Oh, that seemed to hit a nerve. Truth hurts, I guess. Have a nice day :wavey:

70-68
06-13-2012, 05:57 PM
I wish the Wimbledon courts would play like this from the first until the last day.

tennishero
06-13-2012, 05:58 PM
From Mahut? Murray gave away most of the points with errors. I remember Mahut winning one with a winner, that's it.

Bad start to the grass season, Andy, but on to Wimbledon.

:baby: dont cry

RIboy
06-13-2012, 05:59 PM
You were being sarcastic, weren't you?

nope, i'm dead serious, Murray will win more slams than Nadal.....mark my words

SimaoPancao
06-13-2012, 05:59 PM
This victory made my day. Thank you Mahut! Hoping for an amazing performance at Wimbledon, if Nicolas don`t draw Isner...

tribalfusion
06-13-2012, 06:01 PM
No more than most traditionalist tennis fans.

Rocketassist is on a one-man crusade to talk about the good old days he never even saw in as many posts as possible. Good work princess.

So someone here rated Mahut as top 10 on grass...anyone care to draw up a top 10 on grass which would include Mahut?

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 06:02 PM
:baby: dont cry
I'm already thinking about Wimbledon when it comes to Andy. Losses like these mean nothing to me.
Truth? Of course you will take your shit over mine.
Who cares what you think? I don't write for you... Sorry dude, but you're reaaaally missing the point.
Yeah, I knew it. I hit a nerve. Sorry to say this, but even I wasn't me, I would take my word over yours.

Enjoy the rest of your day :hatoff:

rocketassist
06-13-2012, 06:02 PM
Rocketassist is on a one-man crusade to talk about the good old days he never even sawin as many posts as possible. Good work princess.

So someone here rated Mahut as top 10 on grass...anyone care to draw up a top 10 on grass which would include Mahut?

Again, more shit from the world's oldest sad act. Back to your porridge.

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 06:03 PM
Mahut did great. Well done.

Muzzah, average, rest up andy train well, I still believe :)

dav abu
06-13-2012, 06:04 PM
nope, i'm dead serious, Murray will win more slams than Nadal.....mark my words

I finally have a signature. They are some seriously deluded fans on this board. "Future number 1 and multiple Slam winner" and now the above quote! Have a word with yourselves :cuckoo:

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 06:06 PM
:rolleyes: guys

RIboy
06-13-2012, 06:07 PM
I finally have a signature. They are some seriously deluded fans on this board. "Future number 1 and multiple Slam winner" and now the above quote! Have a word with yourselves :cuckoo:

i want an apology when Murka wins 2 consecutive CYGS in '13 and '14....:wavey:

trojanstallion
06-13-2012, 06:07 PM
[QUOTE=Sapeod;12099414]I'm already thinking about Wimbledon when it comes to Andy. Losses like these mean nothing to me.

Thinking about what at Wimbledon?? A quarter or maybe semi, at best??

Dream big.

:wavey:

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 06:07 PM
Bloody hell Murray. Second round?

Li Ching Yuen
06-13-2012, 06:08 PM
Have probably got f**k all chance now of selling my final tickets but can't help but laugh. Peter Fleming's positive from the match is that 'He didn't get hurt'...

Fleming knows a thing or two about fine humor at the expense of the British.

J99
06-13-2012, 06:09 PM
Bloody hell Murray. Second round?

Well it's R1 for him, 0 pointer, defending champ loses 250.

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 06:09 PM
Bloody hell Murray. Second round?

Like the first round for Muzzah really :o

dav abu
06-13-2012, 06:10 PM
i want an apology when Murka wins 2 consecutive CYGS in '13 and '14....:wavey:

You won't be getting one because A. He will never win a slam unless he scabs one when the top 3 are injured and B. If he did that wouldn't take him to 12 slams to overtake Nadal. You are clearly a wum.

Allegretto
06-13-2012, 06:13 PM
Good for the sport. Mahut is one of the most fun players to watch during the grass season.

BauerAlmeida
06-13-2012, 06:13 PM
From Mahut? Murray gave away most of the points with errors. I remember Mahut winning one with a winner, that's it.

Bad start to the grass season, Andy, but on to Wimbledon.

If that's alwaaaaaaaaaaaaays the case when Murray loses why don't you just accept that that's his level, he's not playing bad.

RIboy
06-13-2012, 06:13 PM
Murray clearly tanked this match, you haters can't see the forest through the trees....

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 06:13 PM
Is that 6 games lost in a row for Murray after winning a tiebreak? :o

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 06:14 PM
I think the one who hit a nerve was me...
Not really. You're the one that started calling me a troll :lol:

So far, I haven't resorted to insults. Resorting to insults = getting annoyed :shrug:
You're the one who started this crap.
I guess you could say that. That doesn't change the fact that I hit a nerve however.
And, if I was every user in this board, I'd take my word, kid... You can't give a serious opinion whenever Murray's on topic.
I guess you would, but then again most people on here would take opinions over mine. I guess that's the forum's problem, right? :wavey:
Thinking about what at Wimbledon?? A quarter or maybe semi, at best??

Dream big.

:wavey:
Nice quoting :wavey:

Whatever the result, I'll be happy :shrug: Semi-final? Defends all of his points. Quarter-final? Meh, good result. lower? Disappointing, but there will be far better results to come on hardcourt, his far better surface :yeah:

Filo V.
06-13-2012, 06:15 PM
Mahut was more good then Murray was bad so therefore that's why I made the statement I did, in relation to the match/final breaker. Mahut hit some great returns and, yes, Andy made forehand errors. But it was Mahut that rose to the occasion.

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 06:15 PM
Well it's R1 for him, 0 pointer, defending champ loses 250.

Great. You know that didn't make me feel any better about this, right? Fucking Murray.

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 06:15 PM
If that's alwaaaaaaaaaaaaays the case when Murray loses why don't you just accept that that's his level, he's not playing bad.
Because it clearly isn't his level. That was very bad tiebreak. Far worse than any others he's ever played. He can play far better than how he did against Mahut. Anyone with eyes knows that.

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 06:17 PM
I am starting to lose hope. :sad: If he loses pre SF in Wimby...... :sobbing:

Tiger Tim all over again, no finals all semis

fast_clay
06-13-2012, 06:20 PM
simply watching 3 minute videos of mahut play is enough of a warm up for any grass court contest, so this match is ideal preparation for wimbledon... andy is on course...

Fumus
06-13-2012, 06:23 PM
Too bad for Murray...where does he go from here?

Oh..yea, Wimbledon where if he wins/makes the finals or semis no one will even remember this.

This is true for any other fucking player that loses in these tune up events.

delboy
06-13-2012, 06:24 PM
muzza tanked, couldnt care less about this warm up event. what a friend to gift mahut the win.

J99
06-13-2012, 06:27 PM
Too bad for Murray...where does he go from here?

Oh..yea, Wimbledon where if he wins/makes the finals or semis no one will even remember this.

This is true for any other fucking player that loses in these tune up events.

Why are there comments like these trying to totally bury this result, fact is Murray just lost 250 PTS down the drain cause he was defending here and was the favorite to win it again.

nick the greek
06-13-2012, 06:29 PM
From Mahut? Murray gave away most of the points with errors. I remember Mahut winning one with a winner, that's it.

Bad start to the grass season, Andy, but on to Wimbledon.
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHHAH AHAHAHAHHA.
I JUST ADORE WHEN THIS SLAMLESS MUG LOSES.ON TO WIMBLEDON?FIRST ROUND DEFEAT YOU MEAN?

born_on_clay
06-13-2012, 06:35 PM
Mugray is disgusting also on grass :o

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 06:37 PM
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHHAH AHAHAHAHHA.
I JUST ADORE WHEN THIS SLAMLESS MUG LOSES.ON TO WIMBLEDON?FIRST ROUND DEFEAT YOU MEAN?
When has Murray ever lost in the first round of Wimbledon? Oh yeah, never. The worst result he had at Wimbledon was he 3rd round and that was 7 years ago :lol: He's not losing early.

Corey Feldman
06-13-2012, 06:39 PM
nasty draw for Muzza, 1st match on slippery fast grass - real grass, Mahut was fantastic at times

only thing you could say is a result like this wouldnt happen on the clay courts at Wimbledon

Voo de Mar
06-13-2012, 06:40 PM
Amazing!

J99
06-13-2012, 06:42 PM
When has Murray ever lost in the first round of Wimbledon? Oh yeah, never. The worst result he had at Wimbledon was he 3rd round and that was 7 years ago :lol: He's not losing early.

Unless he draws Mahut again.:p

asmazif
06-13-2012, 06:42 PM
When has Murray ever lost in the first round of Wimbledon? Oh yeah, never. The worst result he had at Wimbledon was he 3rd round and that was 7 years ago :lol: He's not losing early.

2003 :yeah:



RELEVANT

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 06:43 PM
Unless he draws Mahut again.:p
Mahut's beating Murray in slams over 5 sets? Hahahaha, no :superlol:

Beating Murray over 3 sets is one thing, since there's not as much time to regroup as there is in best of 5 sets. Mahut is great on grass, but not that great.

Sapeod
06-13-2012, 06:44 PM
2003 :yeah:



RELEVANT
As far as I can see, Murray has no other Wimbledon main draws before 2005 :shrug:

In 2003, he was 16 :spit:

scoobs
06-13-2012, 06:45 PM
Why are there comments like these trying to totally bury this result, fact is Murray just lost 250 PTS down the drain cause he was defending here and was the favorite to win it again.

Cos 250 points is not going to kill his ranking? Will barely have any effect. Because it's a warm-up tournament. This result is not a disaster. It's not great preparation but it's not likely to be very significant in the long run - a couple of rounds won at Wimbledon and this will all be forgotten, as it should be.

In tennis whatever is going on that particular week always is hyped as the most important thing ever. It's not. If he does this at Wimbledon, THAT will be a disaster, but it doesn't automatically follow that he will play badly there because he lost early here.

asmazif
06-13-2012, 06:46 PM
As far as I can see, Murray has no other Wimbledon main draws before 2005 :shrug:

In 2003, he was 16 :spit:

Juniors ;)

and 2002 as well.

Both have great bearing on his Wimbledon performance this year I feel :lol:

Kat_YYZ
06-13-2012, 06:47 PM
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAH AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHHAH AHAHAHAHHA.
I JUST ADORE WHEN THIS SLAMLESS MUG LOSES.ON TO WIMBLEDON?FIRST ROUND DEFEAT YOU MEAN?

you should switch to decaf

J99
06-13-2012, 06:49 PM
Cos 250 points is not going to kill his ranking? Will barely have any effect. Because it's a warm-up tournament. This result is not a disaster. It's not great preparation but it's not likely to be very significant in the long run - a couple of rounds won at Wimbledon and this will all be forgotten, as it should be.

In tennis whatever is going on that particular week always is hyped as the most important thing ever. It's not. If he does this at Wimbledon, THAT will be a disaster, but it doesn't automatically follow that he will play badly there because he lost early here.

Yeah I know that, but going out so early isn't positive esp. for Murray, typically when he goes out early his next tourney he will do the same.

scoobs
06-13-2012, 06:54 PM
Yeah I know that, but going out so early isn't positive esp. for Murray, typically when he goes out early his next tourney he will do the same.

I don't think anyone's claiming it's positive, it's just not the worst thing, like, ever.

If your statement were true he would logically lose early at every event, which isn't true. He lost early at IW and made the finals of Miami.

nick the greek
06-13-2012, 06:54 PM
Happy for Nico.He's environmental aware,taking the trash out.:yeah:

Fireballer
06-13-2012, 06:58 PM
Whatever the result, I'll be happy :shrug: Semi-final? Defends all of his points. Quarter-final? Meh, good result. lower? Disappointing, but there will be far better results to come on hardcourt, his far better surface :yeah:

Shame Djoker,Rafa and Fed are all better hardcourt players than him by far

J99
06-13-2012, 06:59 PM
I don't think anyone's claiming it's positive, it's just not the worst thing, like, ever.

If your statement were true he would logically lose early at every event, which isn't true. He lost early at IW and made the finals of Miami.

I did not mean every event of course, I meant that for an event or a couple after he loses, but a 250 loss actually probably won't bother him much if at all, it's when he loses in the masters and majors that he goes into slumps, this year though when he lost to Gasquet he bounced back nicely at the French, maybe the Ferrer loss got to him though so that's why he lost today.

I wouldn't say he made the finals of Miami, he didn't have to play Milos or Rafa there when he was supposed to.

Hian-GOAT
06-13-2012, 07:00 PM
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa20/hyde_inside/bye-bitch-gif.gif

Best result possible for sport, honestly. Always a good day when living shit loses :)

Again.

http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa20/hyde_inside/bye-bitch-gif.gif

delboy
06-13-2012, 07:01 PM
lets be realistic here guys muzza was 50% effort, if this was wimbledon then he triple bagels mahut..

BroTree123
06-13-2012, 07:05 PM
P.S Suck shit Sapeod.

Time Violation
06-13-2012, 07:05 PM
In tennis whatever is going on that particular week always is hyped as the most important thing ever. It's not. If he does this at Wimbledon, THAT will be a disaster, but it doesn't automatically follow that he will play badly there because he lost early here.

Well, when was the last time Murray played really well, Dubai? For now it seems like his average play from clay season is continuing on grass, unless he steps it up considerably.

Hian-GOAT
06-13-2012, 07:06 PM
lets be realistic here guys muzza was 50% effort, if this was wimbledon then he triple bagels mahut..

Just accepte the loss, gurl.

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ltvn07GBKJ1r5frgno1_500.gif

Jamoz
06-13-2012, 07:09 PM
Murray's peaking for Wimbeldon :haha: Good job Andy :yeah:

LastRocket
06-13-2012, 07:11 PM
Murray is overrated. Out of the top 4 by the end of this year.
Mahut :yeah:

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 07:14 PM
Shame Djoker,Rafa and Fed are all better hardcourt players than him by far

Than Murray? That's bogus. Djokovic yes. 31 year old Federer? No. Rafa? No. Rafa has a US Open because he served out of his mind and has incredible mental strength and self belief. Murray hasn't won that tournament because he cracks when under pressure. Talent wise, Murray is a much better hard court player than Nadal and Federer at this stage in his career.

nole_no1
06-13-2012, 07:14 PM
Nico :worship: Always a tough opponent on grass
Well done :clap2:

atennisfan
06-13-2012, 07:16 PM
Grass court tennis is SOOO much more refreshing and entertaining than clay court

J99
06-13-2012, 07:17 PM
Mahut's beating Murray in slams over 5 sets? Hahahaha, no :superlol:

Beating Murray over 3 sets is one thing, since there's not as much time to regroup as there is in best of 5 sets. Mahut is great on grass, but not that great.

Yeah I know, I guess you missed the smilie.

motorhead
06-13-2012, 07:21 PM
I've enjoyed this sport more in the last two days than the whole RG

Ibracadabra
06-13-2012, 07:21 PM
Better for tennis.

Orange Wombat
06-13-2012, 07:21 PM
Congrats Nico! :worship: That's how you play tennis on grass!

DemiCrayanhan
06-13-2012, 07:28 PM
Than Murray? That's bogus. Djokovic yes. 31 year old Federer? No. Rafa? No. Rafa has a US Open because he served out of his mind and has incredible mental strength and self belief. Murray hasn't won that tournament because he cracks when under pressure. Talent wise, Murray is a much better hard court player than Nadal and Federer at this stage in his career.

i get being a fan, but murray better than fed on HC? seriously? you're talking about the guy with the most HC titles in the history of this sport.

didn't olderer just beat him in dubai on HC?

Fireballer
06-13-2012, 07:35 PM
Than Murray? That's bogus. Djokovic yes. 31 year old Federer? No. Rafa? No. Rafa has a US Open because he served out of his mind and has incredible mental strength and self belief. Murray hasn't won that tournament because he cracks when under pressure. Talent wise, Murray is a much better hard court player than Nadal and Federer at this stage in his career.

results prove it.Murray is overrated on hardcourts

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 07:37 PM
i get being a fan, but murray better than fed on HC? seriously? you're talking about the guy with the most HC titles in the history of this sport.

didn't olderer just beat him in dubai on HC?

Yeah. And he lost to Guillermo Lopez 4 days later in the second round. Not Murray's greatest moment. He's struggling this year.

Federer is the best player in the history of this sport. But he is not the player he used to be.

Murray and Federer have faced each other 15 times on hard and indoor courts over their careers. Murray holds a 8-7 edge. On hard courts, he leads 6-4. And that includes matches when Federer was younger.

So yes, 25 year old Murray is a better HC player than 31 year old Federer. And the data supports that.

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 07:40 PM
results prove it.Murray is overrated on hardcourts

Results do prove it. See my post above.

Time Violation
06-13-2012, 07:47 PM
Murray and Federer have faced each other 15 times on hard and indoor courts over their careers. Murray holds a 8-7 edge. On hard courts, he leads 6-4. And that includes matches when Federer was younger.

Fed is 2-0 is slams though, and without dropping a set.

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 07:50 PM
Fed is 2-0 is slams though, and without dropping a set.

Federer's mental strength >>>>>>>>>>> Murray's mental strength. That is not in question. And looking at slam performance proves that. Much of this game is more about mental than physical.

My point was simply that from a talent perspective, Murray is a great HC player and better than Federer is at age 31.

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 07:52 PM
Yeah. And he lost to Guillermo Lopez 4 days later in the second round. Not Murray's greatest moment. He's struggling this year.

Federer is the best player in the history of this sport. But he is not the player he used to be.

Murray and Federer have faced each other 15 times on hard and indoor courts over their careers. Murray holds a 8-7 edge. On hard courts, he leads 6-4. And that includes matches when Federer was younger.

So yes, 25 year old Murray is a better HC player than 31 year old Federer. And the data supports that.


Murray is overrated on hardcourts. He obviously hasn't won a Slam on the surface and I can't even remember the last time he beat a tough opponent at a hardcourt Slam and hasn't even made the WTF final despite playing at home and the 3-set format.

He does have 8 hardcourt Masters, more than anyone not named Federer or Djokovic (who has 8 too), but that doesn't that much in the big scheme.

simplet
06-13-2012, 07:59 PM
Just accepte the loss, gurl.

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ltvn07GBKJ1r5frgno1_500.gif

Could you please stop spamming those gifs in every thread? This is not wtaworld, it's kind of obnoxious.

Fireballer
06-13-2012, 08:02 PM
Results do prove it. See my post above.

Rafa has 2 hardcourt GS Murray 0.Also Rafa is better on hard than Murray now and will beat him most of the time there

Federer's mental strength >>>>>>>>>>> Murray's mental strength. That is not in question. And looking at slam performance proves that. Much of this game is more about mental than physical.

My point was simply that from a talent perspective, Murray is a great HC player and better than Federer is at age 31.

STOP talking about mental strength like it's the only problem.Murray is a pusher with no FH and a mediocre game with some variety and cant win a Slam period

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 08:04 PM
STOP talking about mental strength like it's the only problem.Murray is a pusher with no FH and a mediocre game with some variety and cant win a Slam period

And yet, Murray holds a 6-4 edge on hard courts over your hero Federer.

You can't just cherry pick the stats you like and ignore the ones you don't.

And this game IS about mental strength. Most of the time, victory is decided by just a few points. And it comes down to who handles those key moments better.

Do you even watch tennis?

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 08:09 PM
Henman would have won..........:p

J99
06-13-2012, 08:11 PM
Murray is overrated on hardcourts. He obviously hasn't won a Slam on the surface and I can't even remember the last time he beat a tough opponent at a hardcourt Slam and hasn't even made the WTF final despite playing at home and the 3-set format.

He does have 8 hardcourt Masters, more than anyone not named Federer or Djokovic (who has 8 too), but that doesn't that much in the big scheme.

Yeah it kinda does, Masters are the hardest tourneys to win considering the draws.

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 08:12 PM
Grass court tennis is SOOO much more refreshing and entertaining than clay court

Yep, Grass is class, even if my favourite loses at least he loses on the glourious greens :)

And yet, Murray holds a 6-4 edge on hard courts over your hero Federer.

You can't just cherry pick the stats you like and ignore the ones you don't.

And this game IS about mental strength. Most of the time, victory is decided by just a few points. And it comes down to who handles those key moments better.

Do you even watch tennis?

That H2H is skewed because Roger played Muzzah at Shanghai, his GOAT venue where no body can touch him. Can we make shanghai the slam btw :p

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 08:17 PM
That H2H is skewed because Roger played Muzzah at Shanghai, his GOAT venue where no body can touch him. Can we make shanghai the slam btw :p

If you made Shanghai a slam, Murray would never win there again because as soon as the match means something he turns into a mental midget. Fucking Murray. God damn it get your shit together.

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 08:22 PM
If you made Shanghai a slam, Murray would never win there again because as soon as the match means something he turns into a mental midget. Fucking Murray. God damn it get your shit together.

He's not a mental midget, he just lacks a world class serve and essentially forehand. Can you please tell me who was the last player to be a dominant force or even win a Slam with such a weak forehand (for top player/Slam-winning standards)?

Murray isn't mentally weak, well on the contrary - he has come back from 0-2 in sets plenty of times feeding on the mental weakness of his opponents. He simply lacks talent in some key areas, namely his forehand. He's not underachieving, the expectations are simply too high.

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 08:26 PM
It's his second serve that sucks. His first is good but so inconsistent if he just sorted that he would improve immeasurably.

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 08:34 PM
He's not a mental midget, he just lacks a world class serve and essentially forehand. Can you please tell me who was the last player to be a dominant force or even win a Slam with such a weak forehand (for top player/Slam-winning standards)?

Murray isn't mentally weak, well on the contrary - he has come back from 0-2 in sets plenty of times feeding on the mental weakness of his opponents. He simply lacks talent in some key areas, namely his forehand. He's not underachieving, the expectations are simply too high.

We'll have to agree to disagree I think. You don't win as many HC master series tournaments, make the finals of the US Open once and the Aussie open twice being a HC mug. So while I acknowledge that Murray has areas in his game he needs to improve (and I'm sorry but the MENTAL aspect in important matches is definitely one of - if not the most important - one), I still believe he is one of the best HC players in the world right now. And again, match stats support that when you look at H2H with the other top players.

And you aren't seriously going to try and convince me Murray is mentally stronger than Nadal, Djokovic or Federer are you? Because those guys have mental fortitude flowing out their ears. Murray isn't in the same league yet and that's why his slam performance is abysmal compared to his success in Master Series events.

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 08:41 PM
We'll have to agree to disagree I think. You don't win as many HC master series tournaments, make the finals of the US Open once and the Aussie open twice being a HC mug. So while I acknowledge that Murray has areas in his game he needs to improve (and I'm sorry but the MENTAL aspect in important matches is definitely one of - if not the most important - one), I still believe he is one of the best HC players in the world right now. And again, match stats support that when you look at H2H with the other top players.

And you aren't seriously going to try and convince me Murray is mentally stronger than Nadal, Djokovic or Federer are you? Because those guys have mental fortitude flowing out their ears. Murray isn't in the same league yet and that's why his slam performance is abysmal compared to his success in Master Series events.

Who said Murray was a hardccourt mug? He's a pretty good hardcourt player, but definitely not better than Federer or Nadal as you tried to suggest in one of your posts.

And yes, the mental aspect is important but it only matters if you have the game to back it up. Djokovic and Nadal aren't better than Murray because they're stronger mentally (although they probably are) but because they're more talented than Murray in key areas of the game. Murray's game suits the current conditions/court speed very well, but he still can't dominate without a big go-to weapon.

It's not like his career has been derailed by injuries or anything, he has maxed out his potential pretty greatly so far, but there are weaknesses that are too difficult to overcome, and his forehand is the biggest one.

ImmzB
06-13-2012, 08:42 PM
Mahut!! :yeah: :rocker2:

Time Violation
06-13-2012, 08:42 PM
And you aren't seriously going to try and convince me Murray is mentally stronger than Nadal, Djokovic or Federer are you? Because those guys have mental fortitude flowing out their ears. Murray isn't in the same league yet and that's why his slam performance is abysmal compared to his success in Master Series events.

What's puzzling is that he was much better (I think) in 2008-2009, I think that's also the time when he was beating both Fed and Nole on HC, he got to #2, etc, I don't follow him too carefully, but seems like he almost regressed since then?

J99
06-13-2012, 08:42 PM
He's not a mental midget, he just lacks a world class serve and essentially forehand. Can you please tell me who was the last player to be a dominant force or even win a Slam with such a weak forehand (for top player/Slam-winning standards)?

Murray isn't mentally weak, well on the contrary - he has come back from 0-2 in sets plenty of times feeding on the mental weakness of his opponents. He simply lacks talent in some key areas, namely his forehand. He's not underachieving, the expectations are simply too high.

People keep saying that Murray can't hit a big FH, yet he can/does, I've seen it myself, it's one of the way's he beat Rafa in last years Tokyo final, he has the weapon, he just doesn't bring it out nearly enough.

His 1st serve is WC.

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 08:43 PM
People keep saying that Murray can't hit a big FH, yet he can/does I've seen it myself, it's one of the way's he beat Rafa in last years Tokyo final, he has the weapon, he just doesn't bring it out nearly enough.

His 1st serve is WC.

WC :confused:

Jamoz
06-13-2012, 08:44 PM
WC :confused:

World Class maybe ;)

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 08:45 PM
World Class maybe ;)

:worship:

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 08:46 PM
Who said Murray was a hardccourt mug? He's a pretty good hardcourt player, but definitely not better than Federer or Nadal as you tried to suggest in one of your posts.

And yes, the mental aspect is important but it only matters if you have the game to back it up. Djokovic and Nadal aren't better than Murray because they're stronger mentally (although they probably are) but because they're more talented than Murray in key areas of the game. Murray's game suits the current conditions/court speed very well, but he still can't dominate without a big go-to weapon.

To be clear, I said 31 year old Federer. Not in his prime Federer (who was probably the best HC player of all time). And I never said he was better than Djokovic.

But Nadal? You can't seriously believe Nadal is a better HC player than Murray just because he has 2 slams on that surface. I'm a diehard Nadal fan and all, but even I don't believe that.

And you keep downplaying the mental aspect of this game, but your underselling it by a very large amount. Nadal beat Federer at Wimbledon 2008 and AO 2009 BECAUSE he was mentally stronger. Federer at the time was a better grass court and HC player than Nadal.

Winning slams is very much about having the mental strength to win. And that's because its best of 5 and not 3. You've got to dig deep to win a slam and Murray can't dig that deep. It isn't his game that's broken.

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 08:47 PM
People keep saying that Murray can't hit a big FH, yet he can/does, I've seen it myself, it's one of the way's he beat Rafa in last years Tokyo final, he has the weapon, he just doesn't bring it out nearly enough.

His 1st serve is WC.

He can't hit it consistently. All pros are capable of hitting big shots off both wings a few times, but what separates the best is the ability to do it consistently.

Even Gasquet has hit some great forehands, doesn't mean his forehand isn't a liability.

70-68
06-13-2012, 08:49 PM
What does the 3rd set tiebreak today tell about Murray's mental strenght

He hit like 3 unforced errors to go down 0-5, just after staying in the match with an untouchable service game at 6-5. And this was vs. Mahut, not vs. some mental giant...

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 08:51 PM
To be clear, I said 31 year old Federer. Not in his prime Federer (who was probably the best HC player of all time). And I never said he was better than Djokovic.

But Nadal? You can't seriously believe Nadal is a better HC player than Murray just because he has 2 slams on that surface. I'm a diehard Nadal fan and all, but even I don't believe that.

And you keep downplaying the mental aspect of this game, but your underselling it by a very large amount. Nadal beat Federer at Wimbledon 2008 and AO 2009 BECAUSE he was mentally stronger. Federer at the time was a better grass court and HC player than Nadal.

Winning slams is very much about having the mental strength to win. And that's because its best of 5 and not 3. You've got to dig deep to win a slam and Murray can't dig that deep. It isn't his game that's broken.

Even now Federer is better than him.

And please explain me how Murray is better than Nadal on hardcourts :confused: Nadal has been dominating hardcourt Slams beating anyone bar Djokovic, including Murray.

I do accept that the mental aspect is very important. But Fededer lost those close matches to Nadal because of the mental aspect of the game. Murray, however, was overmatched in all his finals. He didn't even get into a position to choke. When you're trashed so easily in 3 sets, it's not mental, it's game. The problem for Murray wasn't the best of 5 format, as he couldn't even take a set or coming close to taking one (bar third set AO 2010 vs Federer).

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 08:53 PM
What does the 3rd set tiebreak today tell about Murray's mental strenght

He hit like 3 unforced errors to go down 0-5, just after staying in the match with an untouchable service game at 6-5. And this was vs. Mahut, not vs. some mental giant...

Mahut is a mental giant though. After his epic against Isner, it'd be ridiculous to suggest otherwise. You can't hold to stay in the match so many times in a row without being tough mentally.

He does have a lot of limitations in his game though, although he's great to watch on grass.

tektonac
06-13-2012, 08:54 PM
muzza clearly tanked so he can practice with nole.

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 08:56 PM
What does the 3rd set tiebreak today tell about Murray's mental strenght

He hit like 3 unforced errors to go down 0-5, just after staying in the match with an untouchable service game at 6-5. And this was vs. Mahut, not vs. some mental giant...

he smacked an ace after not sitting down in the change over, but then did that UE into the net, don't think it tells you much really. Murray is solid at tie breaks. BUT, I think he has now lost 6 matches in a row after winning one. :eek:

rocketassist
06-13-2012, 08:56 PM
Even now Federer is better than him.

And please explain me how Murray is better than Nadal on hardcourts :confused: Nadal has been dominating hardcourt Slams beating anyone bar Djokovic, including Murray.

I do accept that the mental aspect is very important. But Fededer lost those close matches to Nadal because of the mental aspect of the game. Murray, however, was overmatched in all his finals. He didn't even get into a position to choke. When you're trashed so easily in 3 sets, it's not mental, it's game. The problem for Murray wasn't the best of 5 format, as he couldn't even take a set or coming close to taking one (bar third set AO 2010 vs Federer).

The last two sets against Nole in the 2011 AO were pretty much mental. Nole was average in those two sets, Murray was just a pure unforced error machine. He fell to pieces after a high quality first six games where both men had played well.

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 08:59 PM
The last two sets against Nole in the 2011 AO were pretty much mental. Nole was average in those two sets, Murray was just a pure unforced error machine. He fell to pieces after a high quality first six games where both men had played well.

He looked more tired than Nole imo. Spent a lot of energy, physically and mentally, to take the third set and had a let down in the fourth.

If anything, it showed good mental strength to come back from 5-2 in the fifth and almost winning the match. If he had though, he'd have probably been a lamb for the Nadal slaughter in the final.

156mphserve
06-13-2012, 09:00 PM
at least Wimbledon doesn't play like real grass so he won't embarrass himself there too:shrug:

J99
06-13-2012, 09:02 PM
He can't hit it consistently. All pros are capable of hitting big shots off both wings a few times, but what separates the best is the ability to do it consistently.

Even Gasquet has hit some great forehands, doesn't mean his forehand isn't a liability.

Murray can do it consistently though, he just chooses not to more often than not, he has a different game plan, he hit's it hard when he feels it's needed, he likes to change the pace and not let the other guy get into a hard hitting groove, alot of people seem to misunderstand his game, so this is a weak argument.

Geo
06-13-2012, 09:02 PM
Mahut :yeah: such a natural on grass. It's a shame he hasn't been able to win a title on this surface. What a confidence boost for him though to defeat both annoying Andy's in the span of a couple weeks :hearts:

Orka_n
06-13-2012, 09:05 PM
Great win Nicolas. :hug: I've felt sad for this guy since losing the epic against Isner and then having such a slump afterwards. He so deserved a big win. :)

Murray is really a mess these days.

70-68
06-13-2012, 09:09 PM
Mahut is a mental giant though. After his epic against Isner, it'd be ridiculous to suggest otherwise. You can't hold to stay in the match so many times in a row without being tough mentally.

He does have a lot of limitations in his game though, although he's great to watch on grass.

That's a good point about Mahut, but I was questioning Murray's mental strength here. If you are going to tell me that Mahut won because he was the mentally stroger player at the end, then something must be wrong with Murray if the 65th ranked player (Top 20 on this surface) is mentally stronger than him.

FiBeR
06-13-2012, 09:10 PM
Hard rock bottom first round exit for Murray at home
0-6 in final tiebreak against Mahut is something that tells you he is by no chance at his best...
Must be hard for his fans.

I respect Andy, not some of his fans though. most of the hardcore are gloryhunters who like taking down other players so Murray can have a bit of spotlight but they fail to see in their tiny lil minds that's not the way to deal with success and failure in life.

everyone is different in their own way, so are the players and most of british put so much pressure on a guy just by the way you see others. fans fail to understand that the way you speak about others is also the way your own players feel you talk about them.

If you ever want Murray to get to the finish line, then you gotta start growing up, take it as it come and stop taking credit or overreacting about the stuff that goes on.

IMO what you put into the equation is what you usually get. If all you grow is bitterness towards tennis world (- or + murray), then expect it back to your nation/society.

PS: this coming from a guy who lived there, and experienced a run to the final of a slam from murray with a tennis fan english family watching...

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 09:11 PM
And please explain me how Murray is better than Nadal on hardcourts :confused: Nadal has been dominating hardcourt Slams beating anyone bar Djokovic, including Murray.

I do accept that the mental aspect is very important. But Fededer lost those close matches to Nadal because of the mental aspect of the game. Murray, however, was overmatched in all his finals. He didn't even get into a position to choke. When you're trashed so easily in 3 sets, it's not mental, it's game. The problem for Murray wasn't the best of 5 format, as he couldn't even take a set or coming close to taking one (bar third set AO 2010 vs Federer).

You are simply ignoring Murray's record on hard courts and focusing on the matches he fell apart mentally in. He has 8 master series titles on HC, which is more than Nadal. And what was Nadal's last HC title again? US Open 2010. He's coming up on two years now. And I'm a DIEHARD Nadal fan BTW before you accuse me of being a hater.

And did you miss this year's Australian open where Murray took Djokovic to a 5th set (where he was leading 2 set to 1 and lost 7-5 in the 5th)? Yeah, definitely out matched there. Seriously, do your research.

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 09:15 PM
That's a good point about Mahut, but I was questioning Murray's mental strength here. If you are going to tell me that Mahut won because he was the mentally stroger player at the end, then something must be wrong with Murray if the 65th ranked player (Top 20 on this surface) is mentally stronger than him.

Surprised you didn't think of it yourself given your username :p

Also, that's a wrong way of seeing things. A player outside the top 100 could conceivably be mentally stronger than Djokovic. Mental toughness is only relevant if you have the game to back it up. Being ranked #4 doesn't necessarily mean Murray is tougher mentally than someone outside the top 60, probably just means he has a lot more game.

That said, don't think this match was decided on mental strength. It was Murray's first match on grass and Mahut's fourth, and Mahut is always a tough opponent on this surface. It was just right place, right time for Mahut to face Murray.

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 09:18 PM
You are simply ignoring Murray's record on hard courts and focusing on the matches he fell apart mentally in. He has 8 master series titles on HC, which is more than Nadal. And what was Nadal's last HC title again? US Open 2010. He's coming up on two years now. And I'm a DIEHARD Nadal fan BTW before you accuse me of being a hater.

And did you miss this year's Australian open where Murray took Djokovic to a 5th set (where he was leading 2 set to 1 and lost 7-5 in the 5th)? Yeah, definitely out matched there. Seriously, do your research.

I still don't get it: do you think Murray's Slam final defeats are to be blamed on his mentality.

I suppose you watched those finals, but here are the results if you need a reminder:

USO 2008: Fed def. Murray 6-2, 7-5 and 6-2

AO 2010: Fed def. Murray 6-3, 6-4 and 7-6

AO 2011: Djokovic def. Murray 6-4, 6-3 and 6-2


These finals were not close. Murray was never even in a position to choke. I'd like to know how this can be explained from a purely mental point of view.

FiBeR
06-13-2012, 09:19 PM
Surprised you didn't think of it yourself given your username :p

Also, that's a wrong way of seeing things. A player outside the top 100 could conceivably be mentally stronger than Djokovic. Mental toughness is only relevant if you have the game to back it up. Being ranked #4 doesn't necessarily mean Murray is tougher mentally than someone outside the top 60, probably just means he has a lot more game.

That said, don't think this match was decided on mental strength. It was Murray's first match on grass and Mahut's fourth, and Mahut is always a tough opponent on this surface. It was just right place, right time for Mahut to face Murray.

ATP kind of called it yesterday in their recaps when they quoted Mahut stating he will give it a shot and go for the upset... I rarely see the ATP site posting this kind of quotes and even though some crap gets posted, they are pretty on the line when stuff like this happen.. or maybe it was a coincidence

Anyway, Mahut called it, and the ATP published..

Mahut said of his chances against Murray, "I beat Rafa once here. I was one point away to beat Roddick when he was Top 5. I know I can do well. I know I can beat top players on this surface. I believe in me, I believe in my game. But I know it's a challenge to play against Top 4. I'll try. He's the favourite. I just have to come on the court and enjoy the crowd and enjoy the centre court and play my game."
http://www.atpworldtour.com/News/Tennis/2012/06/24/London-Tuesday-Karlovic-Fires-Past-Hewitt.aspx

rocketassist
06-13-2012, 09:19 PM
He looked more tired than Nole imo. Spent a lot of energy, physically and mentally, to take the third set and had a let down in the fourth.

If anything, it showed good mental strength to come back from 5-2 in the fifth and almost winning the match. If he had though, he'd have probably been a lamb for the Nadal slaughter in the final.

I was on about their final, not the SF this year where he played one of his best ever matches.

MIMIC
06-13-2012, 09:19 PM
Mahoot. Mahoot. Mahoot is on fire

:lol: Nice :yeah:

Fireballer
06-13-2012, 09:21 PM
You are simply ignoring Murray's record on hard courts and focusing on the matches he fell apart mentally in. He has 8 master series titles on HC, which is more than Nadal. And what was Nadal's last HC title again? US Open 2010. He's coming up on two years now. And I'm a DIEHARD Nadal fan BTW before you accuse me of being a hater.

And did you miss this year's Australian open where Murray took Djokovic to a 5th set (where he was leading 2 set to 1 and lost 7-5 in the 5th)? Yeah, definitely out matched there. Seriously, do your research.

Djokovic sucked in that SF.If he was on it's straight sets win

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 09:22 PM
Djokovic sucked in that SF.If he was on it's straight sets win

:facepalm: And I guess he was plain awful in the final also. Murray played well in the SF, but not well enough.

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 09:24 PM
I was on about their final, not the SF this year where he played one of his best ever matches.

Oh yeah, my bad.

Kind of true, I remember Murray went away after losing a relatively tight first set, especially after losing that neverending 40+ shots rally. Don't think you can explain the defeat on purely mental terms though.

AO should be Murray's best chance at a Slam in the future, I think. It's the slowest Slam by a distance, which is a feat in this era of slow courts. Perfect surface for the likes of Djokovic, Murray and Nadal to play neverending grindathons, like this year.

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 09:26 PM
I still don't get it: do you think Murray's Slam final defeats are to be blamed on his mentality.

To a large degree, yes. Do you believe Berdych gave Nadal his A game in the 2011 Wimbledon final? Don't underestimate the pressure of a slam final. The greats handle this pressure well (Nadal, Federer, Djokovic), the rest don't.


I suppose you watched those finals, but here are the results if you need a reminder:

USO 2008: Fed def. Murray 6-2, 7-5 and 6-2

AO 2010: Fed def. Murray 6-3, 6-4 and 7-6

AO 2011: Djokovic def. Murray 6-4, 6-3 and 6-2


No reminders needed. Those scorelines make me ashamed to be a Murray fan.


These finals were not close. Murray was never even in a position to choke. I'd like to know how this can be explained from a purely mental point of view.

So how then do you explain going 5 sets at this years AO? If the performance discrepancy isn't about who handled the pressure better and raised there game, then what is the explanation? Are you going to try and tell me Djokovic was a shell of himself this year and that's the only reason Murray was able to compete? And yet Murray and Djokovic have met 10 times on hard courts and split their meetings 5-5.

Your head is firmly inserted in your ass right now.

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 09:29 PM
Murray didn't "choke" in the finals, he went into them with a shocking mentality. Effectively he choked before they even begun.

Understandable in 2008, 2010 Federer was beast, but still, 2011? Very poor indeed. His 2011 final was a absolute joke.

Singularity
06-13-2012, 09:35 PM
He can't hit it consistently. All pros are capable of hitting big shots off both wings a few times, but what separates the best is the ability to do it consistently.

Even Gasquet has hit some great forehands, doesn't mean his forehand isn't a liability.
He can do it consistently within a match. You only need your very best for the last 2 or 3 matches of a grand slam.

Mark Lenders
06-13-2012, 09:41 PM
To a large degree, yes. Do you believe Berdych gave Nadal his A game in the 2011 Wimbledon final? Don't underestimate the pressure of a slam final. The greats handle this pressure well (Nadal, Federer, Djokovic), the rest don't.



No reminders needed. Those scorelines make me ashamed to be a Murray fan.



So how then do you explain going 5 sets at this years AO? If the performance discrepancy isn't about who handled the pressure better and raised there game, then what is the explanation? Are you going to try and tell me Djokovic was a shell of himself this year and that's the only reason Murray was able to compete? And yet Murray and Djokovic have met 10 times on hard courts and split their meetings 5-5.

Your head is firmly inserted in your ass right now.

Nadal is a nightmare matchup for Tomas. Yes, Tomas was a bit nervous in his first Slam final, but that's not the only reason why he lost.

As for AO 2011, different year, different circumstances, both players evolved... I'm not saying mentality has nothing to do with it. I just refuse to believe that it is the only reason why Murray doesn't have a Slam.

Matt01
06-13-2012, 09:48 PM
Murray didn't "choke" in the finals, he went into them with a shocking mentality. Effectively he choked before they even begun.



I think he was too nervous in those finals and therefore couldn't play as freely and well as he could. "Choking" isn't the right word but mentality had a lot to do with it IMO.

Moozza
06-13-2012, 09:51 PM
Is that 6 games lost in a row for Murray after winning a tiebreak? :o

I was thinking this aswell. Murray never seems to win a match after winning a TB.

Mateya
06-13-2012, 09:54 PM
Muzza :bigcry:

What a cruel draw, getting Mahut for the first match who was playing like a boss for most of the match. Yes, he made some stupid errors and had few mug games, but alltogether it was a quality grasscourt tennis out there. :worship: He's better than many seeded players here.

And Murray was sliding all over the court, almost like Godovic on blue clay.:lol: He was hillarious, just couldn't get a real grip and trust the surface. You can't play good tennis if you are afraid of running and moving around. He got better after first set though.

Murray's chances at Wimbledon? He still can aim for semifinal with a "normal" draw, but further on...I'm not sure.

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 09:55 PM
I was thinking this aswell. Murray never seems to win a match after winning a TB.

I can think of this, Ferrer at RG, Berdych at Monte Carlo, Gasquet at Rome, Nole in Miami. That's 5 of his last 6 losses. :eek:

I think he was too nervous in those finals and therefore couldn't play as freely and well as he could. "Choking" isn't the right word but mentality had a lot to do with it IMO.

Exactly, I regard "choke" as something one does within a match. Murray was plain rubbish from the start of those finals.

Andi-M
06-13-2012, 09:57 PM
No biggie losing at Queens, bigger events to come, i wouldn't read much into that performance, at all.

Murray knows how to win a tennis match on grass, but today he didnt care enough to try and win it, once he knew his oppeant was playing well and things weren't going his way.

If this was 1R Wimbledon draw andy would have probably won in 4...he has been 0-1,1-2, even 0-2 sets down at wimbledon many times in early rounds but he manages to pull through because over 5 sets Andy will be better than 95% of the tour on grass.

christallh24
06-13-2012, 10:38 PM
Oh, for real?

Well,....nobody expected the Inquisition, either.

Better luck at Wimby, Andy.

Wolfy
06-13-2012, 10:40 PM
Mahut obviously had a chance,but didn't know how Murray can make apes loads of errors. He's acting sucks too.

MuzzahLovah
06-13-2012, 10:41 PM
Andy is still slumping- but his winning queens never seem to help at Wimbledon, so I guessing this won't hurt much.

Chase Visa
06-13-2012, 10:45 PM
Heh, Murray.

Mahut is pretty good on grass though.

TigerTim
06-13-2012, 10:47 PM
Can I add how poor I thought the crowd was. Ungrateful mugs. Bloody londonites with their coffees and cream. Andy Murray is our best hope since 1297, get behind him!!!

henke007
06-13-2012, 10:49 PM
Murray better pray for his standard cakedraw to make 1/2 at Wimbledon.

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 11:25 PM
Murray didn't "choke" in the finals, he went into them with a shocking mentality. Effectively he choked before they even begun.

Understandable in 2008, 2010 Federer was beast, but still, 2011? Very poor indeed. His 2011 final was a absolute joke.

This. OMG this.

And I'm still pissed off at him a year after it happened.

ahadabans
06-13-2012, 11:36 PM
As for AO 2011, different year, different circumstances, both players evolved... I'm not saying mentality has nothing to do with it. I just refuse to believe that it is the only reason why Murray doesn't have a Slam.

It isn't the only reason, but it's a big one. His fitness was not always up to par either (though much better in recent years). And it really needs to be when you have absolute machines like Djokovic and Nadal at the top of the sport. He could have a better forehand and second serve, but they aren't huge weaknesses like some of you want to make them out to be. His ROS is fantastic - best in the game. His first serve is pretty good and he constructs points and makes match adjustments really well. He is very comfortable on hard courts.

He has what it takes to win a HC slam - he can beat the top players and has done it numerous times in the past in matches with less on the line (semi-final for example at AO - Murray loses in straights if it's the final because he can't handle the pressure but in semi-final, he pushes Nole to 5 sets).

That is the only point I've been trying to make. Again, I think we simply need to agree to disagree. Murray is a much better player than you are giving him credit for. And I hope one day he proves that to everyone here.

Although knowing MTF, you'll all just say he got lucky. Because of course lots of people get lucky and win slams. As tennis is a very lucky sport - very little skill going on there or anything. Sort of just a coin toss really, which explains why so few players win slams. Because they are awesome coin tossers.

rocketassist
06-13-2012, 11:40 PM
Murray better pray for his standard cakedraw to make 1/2 at Wimbledon.

I know, he'll be praying for the likes of Gasquet, Tsonga, LaLo and JCF who have no grass court pedigree rather than the likes of Del Potro who do....

william_renshaw
06-14-2012, 12:03 AM
Nadal lost to Mahut at Queens in 2007, but reached the final of Wimbledon that year ...

Mark Lenders
06-14-2012, 12:36 AM
It isn't the only reason, but it's a big one. His fitness was not always up to par either (though much better in recent years). And it really needs to be when you have absolute machines like Djokovic and Nadal at the top of the sport. He could have a better forehand and second serve, but they aren't huge weaknesses like some of you want to make them out to be. His ROS is fantastic - best in the game. His first serve is pretty good and he constructs points and makes match adjustments really well. He is very comfortable on hard courts.

He has what it takes to win a HC slam - he can beat the top players and has done it numerous times in the past in matches with less on the line (semi-final for example at AO - Murray loses in straights if it's the final because he can't handle the pressure but in semi-final, he pushes Nole to 5 sets).

That is the only point I've been trying to make. Again, I think we simply need to agree to disagree. Murray is a much better player than you are giving him credit for. And I hope one day he proves that to everyone here.

Although knowing MTF, you'll all just say he got lucky. Because of course lots of people get lucky and win slams. As tennis is a very lucky sport - very little skill going on there or anything. Sort of just a coin toss really, which explains why so few players win slams. Because they are awesome coin tossers.

His ROS isn't the best in the game, no way. Djokovic's is. Murray is the best returner of big serves (say Isner, Karlovic), but against top 10 players Djokovic's aggressiveness on his returns is far better. Murray's blocked returns are effective against guys like Roddick, Isner or Karlovic, but not against top 10 players who can actually finish the point with their forehands. That's why he can never do anything with Nadal's serve for instance.

The last paragraph is a bit rich coming from a Murray fan. Murray fans are the one constantly claiming that Del Potro's Slam was lucky - when in reality he was, if anything, unlucky to have got a career-threatening injury right after he won his maiden Slam, stunting his progress. I definitely don't think you can win a Slam on luck alone and I won't call Murray lucky if he wins one, but Murray fans, at least the ones on this boards, would really have no grounds to be upset if some people do claim he's lucky when/if he wins a Slam after their campaign to dismiss JMDP's Slam as a fluke. It'd be like the pot calling the kettle black.

I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens. Australia is Murray's best chance to win a Slam imo, the court is designed to suit pushers/players who can transition from defense to attack and likely to generate grinding marathons whenever Murray, Djokovic or Nadal are involved. Murray might be able to outlast one of them to win it, perhaps.

Moozza
06-14-2012, 12:38 AM
Mahut obviously had a chance,but didn't know how Murray can make apes loads of errors. He's acting sucks too.

To be honest, tie-break aside, I don't think Murray was making that many errors. Considering it was his first match on grass in about a year he was playing ok, Mahut was just the better player on the day.


As others have said, Mahut was a nasty draw for a first opponent on grass, The conditions suited him and were difficuilt for Murray. Come Wimbledon no-one will remember this loss.

Wolfy
06-14-2012, 12:45 AM
Also some need to train Mahut to use his backhand more, rip.it,stop slicing too much, which is affective on grass,but he's holding back too much

ossie
06-14-2012, 12:46 AM
Nadal lost to Mahut at Queens in 2007, but reached the final of Wimbledon that year ...
he even won 2 sets in the final. good news for murray.

ahadabans
06-14-2012, 12:48 AM
His ROS isn't the best in the game, no way. Djokovic's is. Murray is the best returner of big serves (say Isner, Karlovic), but against top 10 players Djokovic's aggressiveness on his returns is far better. Murray's blocked returns are effective against guys like Roddick, Isner or Karlovic, but not against top 10 players who can actually finish the point with their forehands. That's why he can never do anything with Nadal's serve for instance.

The last paragraph is a bit rich coming from a Murray fan. Murray fans are the one constantly claiming that Del Potro's Slam was lucky - when in reality he was, if anything, unlucky to have got a career-threatening injury right after he won his maiden Slam, stunting his progress. I definitely don't think you can win a Slam on luck alone and I won't call Murray lucky if he wins one, but Murray fans, at least the ones on this boards, would really have no grounds to be upset if some people do claim he's lucky when/if he wins a Slam after their campaign to dismiss JMDP's Slam as a fluke. It'd be like the pot calling the kettle black.

I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens. Australia is Murray's best chance to win a Slam imo, the court is designed to suit pushers/players who can transition from defense to attack and likely to generate grinding marathons whenever Murray, Djokovic or Nadal are involved. Murray might be able to outlast one of them to win it, perhaps.

I like Djokovic's game a lot and his ROS is fantastic. He's also probably the classiest guy on tour - which is a big 180 from when he was younger and a clown. He's matured a lot and has earned my respect even if he isn't someone I root for.

Don't confuse me with a fan boy. I'm a very objective tennis fan despite what you might think. I don't have tunnel vision when it comes to players I like. I see their weaknesses and I know when my guy is beaten by a better player.

Lucky slam wins don't exist. Those words have never been nor will ever be uttered from my mouth. That's hater talk. Not a fan of making excuses for players when they lose. Murray got beat at the AO and so did Nadal - both my second favorite and favorite players respectively. They both got beat by a better player in Novak. It happens, maybe next time.

Nole fan
06-14-2012, 12:55 AM
Murray having worse results than last year. That's not the breakthrough I was expecting Andrew. :smash:

Mark Lenders
06-14-2012, 12:57 AM
I like Djokovic's game a lot and his ROS is fantastic. He's also probably the classiest guy on tour - which is a big 180 from when he was younger and a clown. He's matured a lot and has earned my respect even if he isn't someone I root for.

Don't confuse me with a fan boy. I'm a very objective tennis fan despite what you might think. I don't have tunnel vision when it comes to players I like. I see their weaknesses and I know when my guy is beaten by a better player.

Lucky slam wins don't exist. Those words have never been nor will ever be uttered from my mouth. That's hater talk. Not a fan of making excuses for players when they lose. Murray got beat at the AO and so did Nadal - both my second favorite and favorite players respectively. They both got beat by a better player in Novak. It happens, maybe next time.

Fair enough. I agree about everything, especially that there is no such thing as lucky/fluke Slam wins, especially when you have to beat guys like Nadal, Federer and co. to win those Slams. I'll definitely not label it a fluke if/when Murray does win a Slam.

We only disagree about Murray's potential, I guess. I never, ever expected him to win a Slam and he's actually doing better than I thought he would when he first came into the scene. I still don't think he will win one, but I guess only time who is right. As long as he keeps making it deep in Slams, there's always a chance he might grab one.

And yeah, I know all about this year's AO. Just saying AO will be Murray's best chance for a Slam in the future imo. It suits Murray since it's almost impossible to hit through the courts: even guys with huge power like Soderling and Berdych are unable to hit through the AO courts, and so is Federer when he faces Nadal/Djokovic. Maybe JMDP at his best can do it, but I'm not sure. This Slam should be contested solely by Murray, Djokovic and Nadal in the next few years, with endless grindathons taking place; all it takes for Murray to win is to outlast those two. Assuming the surface isn't sped up of course, as it stands it's almost impossible for primarily offensive players to succeed in Australia.

leng jai
06-14-2012, 01:17 AM
From Mahut? Murray gave away most of the points with errors. I remember Mahut winning one with a winner, that's it.

Bad start to the grass season, Andy, but on to Wimbledon.

Sapeod giving huge credit to Murray's opponent as usual.

Time Violation
06-14-2012, 01:50 AM
Sapeod giving huge credit to Murray's opponent as usual.

Murray's opponents win because they very lucky. And because Murray was awful. Or because they were lucky to play awful Murray or something :P

ahadabans
06-14-2012, 01:50 AM
Fair enough. I agree about everything, especially that there is no such thing as lucky/fluke Slam wins, especially when you have to beat guys like Nadal, Federer and co. to win those Slams. I'll definitely not label it a fluke if/when Murray does win a Slam.

We only disagree about Murray's potential, I guess. I never, ever expected him to win a Slam and he's actually doing better than I thought he would when he first came into the scene. I still don't think he will win one, but I guess only time who is right. As long as he keeps making it deep in Slams, there's always a chance he might grab one.

And yeah, I know all about this year's AO. Just saying AO will be Murray's best chance for a Slam in the future imo. It suits Murray since it's almost impossible to hit through the courts: even guys with huge power like Soderling and Berdych are unable to hit through the AO courts, and so is Federer when he faces Nadal/Djokovic. Maybe JMDP at his best can do it, but I'm not sure. This Slam should be contested solely by Murray, Djokovic and Nadal in the next few years, with endless grindathons taking place; all it takes for Murray to win is to outlast those two. Assuming the surface isn't sped up of course, as it stands it's almost impossible for primarily offensive players to succeed in Australia.

They recently changed the surface at the AO didn't they (from rebound ace to something else)? Is it slower now than before?

I still don't think the bounce is all that high (even if the court is slow) otherwise Nadal's top spin would be more effective there.

Mark Lenders
06-14-2012, 02:12 AM
They recently changed the surface at the AO didn't they (from rebound ace to something else)? Is it slower now than before?

I still don't think the bounce is all that high (even if the court is slow) otherwise Nadal's top spin would be more effective there.

Plexicuxion. It's basically the slowest Slam by quite a distance now. It's almost impossible to hit through the surface. Berdych played two almost perfect sets vs Nadal this year, hitting lines and corners non-stop and still couldn't do it.

The bounce isn't particularly high, but the surface is just incredibly slow. Get ready for another Djokovic/Nadal vs Murray and Djokovic vs Nadal 5/6 hours semifinal and final again next year.

Topspindoctor
06-14-2012, 02:13 AM
And people still dare suggest Mugray is part of the big 4? What a joke.

Ashlar77
06-14-2012, 02:13 AM
Andy.... :tape: :banghead:

xargon
06-14-2012, 02:21 AM
He's not a mental midget, he just lacks a world class serve and essentially forehand..

When will he fire Lendl or better yet, when will Lendl quit?
If he doesn't win a GS,I give it until the end of the year.

Absolute Anthropoid
06-14-2012, 02:37 AM
Jesus Christ Murray :o

Topspindoctor
06-14-2012, 02:39 AM
When will he fire Lendl or better yet, when will Lendl quit?
If he doesn't win a GS,I give it until the end of the year.

Lendl is only a coach, not a miracle worker :shrug:

You literally need divine intervention in order for Pushray to win a slam.

MuzzahLovah
06-14-2012, 03:18 AM
No biggie losing at Queens, bigger events to come, i wouldn't read much into that performance, at all.

Murray knows how to win a tennis match on grass, but today he didnt care enough to try and win it, once he knew his oppeant was playing well and things weren't going his way.

If this was 1R Wimbledon draw andy would have probably won in 4...he has been 0-1,1-2, even 0-2 sets down at wimbledon many times in early rounds but he manages to pull through because over 5 sets Andy will be better than 95% of the tour on grass.

I don't know about that. Andy took Queens seriously last year, I don't see why he'd blow it off this year. I just think he's been in a funk and hasn't really found his form for more than a set or two in a rowsince the start of the clay season.

leng jai
06-14-2012, 03:21 AM
Considering there's a grand total of one warm up tournament for Wimbledon I'd say a first round loss isn't ideal.

Slice Winner
06-14-2012, 03:31 AM
Considering there's a grand total of one warm up tournament for Wimbledon I'd say a first round loss isn't ideal.

You never know - Murray could get a couple of matches at Eastbourne unless Young, Bogomolov, Anderson, Bellucci, Baghdatis, or Garcia-Lopez are playing.

ahadabans
06-14-2012, 03:51 AM
Plexicuxion. It's basically the slowest Slam by quite a distance now. It's almost impossible to hit through the surface. Berdych played two almost perfect sets vs Nadal this year, hitting lines and corners non-stop and still couldn't do it.

The bounce isn't particularly high, but the surface is just incredibly slow. Get ready for another Djokovic/Nadal vs Murray and Djokovic vs Nadal 5/6 hours semifinal and final again next year.

Funny thing is I don't think this really benefits Nadal in the end. Yeah it's great against big flat hitters like Berdych. But low bounce and slow court means he basically has no weapons versus Djokovic. That is what I noticed this year in the final. He had virtually no way to win that match. At least on clay, his obscene top spin gives him an edge there. And on grass I think Nadal's movement is better. But on hard courts? Not so much. Every aspect of Novak's game is better or equal.

I've said this several times now but it bears repeating. Nadal will need to improve his serve if he is going to beat Djokovic on hard courts. That's really the only part of Novak's game that isn't rock solid. Nadal can't let points on his serve get to neutral too quickly. Novak's ground game is too good and so is his ROS. He's got to do better on his service games.

ahadabans
06-14-2012, 03:53 AM
Murray having worse results than last year. That's not the breakthrough I was expecting Andrew. :smash:

I hear that. Murray is running out of time too. He's 25. Can't use the excuse that he just hasn't matured enough yet.

Who's the oldest player to win his first slam? Anyone know?

Synchronicity
06-14-2012, 04:05 AM
I saw the draw and thought this would potentially be a tricky first match on the transistion to grass. Disappointing but no disaster, sharpen up for Wimbledon.

Farenhajt
06-14-2012, 05:54 AM
Not a great comfort after the RG, but comfort it most certainly is. And a reason for certain vague... joy, I guess.

DanaKz
06-14-2012, 06:29 AM
I hear that. Murray is running out of time too. He's 25. Can't use the excuse that he just hasn't matured enough yet.

Who's the oldest player to win his first slam? Anyone know?

Li Na?







Kidding.

Farenhajt
06-14-2012, 06:43 AM
Li Na?







Kidding.

It appears to be Andres Gimeno, RG 1972 (his only slam title), at the age of 34y 10m 1d. (Is he Gimeno-Traver's granddad?)

Lopez
06-14-2012, 06:44 AM
I hear that. Murray is running out of time too. He's 25. Can't use the excuse that he just hasn't matured enough yet.

Who's the oldest player to win his first slam? Anyone know?

Andres Gomez has got to be up there, won RG in 1990 at around 30.

Beat
06-14-2012, 11:42 AM
wow, if he can't even win here ...

DjokerFan3
06-14-2012, 12:27 PM
Muzza :facepalm: Hope he plays better at Wimbledon! :)

nick the greek
06-14-2012, 01:05 PM
Murray having worse results than last year. That's not the breakthrough I was expecting Andrew. :smash:
That's one real Scotch on the rocks.

Fujee
06-14-2012, 01:27 PM
Gormless Murray

retister
06-14-2012, 02:43 PM
Blessing in disguise. After a loss like this nobody will expect him to do anything significant at wimby, so he should be playing more relaxed than ever.
Slower grass will suit him better there, and he is a lock-on for semis at least.

motorhead
06-14-2012, 03:04 PM
You never know - Murray could get a couple of matches at Eastbourne unless Young, Bogomolov, Anderson, Bellucci, Baghdatis, or Garcia-Lopez are playing.

:haha:

mark73
06-14-2012, 03:27 PM
I hear that. Murray is running out of time too. He's 25. Can't use the excuse that he just hasn't matured enough yet.

Who's the oldest player to win his first slam? Anyone know?

I think it's Andres Gomez at the 1990 FO (at least in the open era). He was a few months older than Ivanesivic at wimby 2001. He had, relative;y speaking, a very week draw.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andr%C3%A9s_G%C3%B3mez

Hian-GOAT
06-14-2012, 04:54 PM
http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg633/FORZAPENNETTA/tumblr_m036x6jkcu1qffb31o1_400.gif

And with haters I mean Mugraytards.

Moozza
06-14-2012, 05:00 PM
http://i1247.photobucket.com/albums/gg633/FORZAPENNETTA/tumblr_m036x6jkcu1qffb31o1_400.gif

And with haters I mean Mugraytards.

The hater posting the 'haters going to hate' meme. No sense of irony.

decrepitude
06-14-2012, 05:12 PM
I hear that. Murray is running out of time too. He's 25.

I do hope you are not one of the people saying Berdych or Tsonga have more chance - they are both older. So age is not the criterion totally.

rocketassist
06-14-2012, 05:25 PM
Hian is like that fly that buzzes around you that you keep opening the window to let out only for it to fly back in through the air vent constantly until you get the swatter and squash it.

Mark Lenders
06-14-2012, 05:27 PM
I do hope you are not one of the people saying Berdych or Tsonga have more chance - they are both older. So age is not the criterion totally.

They rely on movement far less than Murray. And Tsonga is a very young 27, due to injuries early in his career he has played barely more than 300 pro matches so far. Murray has far more mileage.

Sapeod
06-14-2012, 05:45 PM
They rely on movement far less than Murray. And Tsonga is a very young 27, due to injuries early in his career he has played barely more than 300 pro matches so far. Murray has far more mileage.
Tsonga is a very young 27 yet Murray is too old at 25? Right.

Also, Murray >> Tsonga anyway.

Mark Lenders
06-14-2012, 05:49 PM
Tsonga is a very young 27 yet Murray is too old at 25? Right.

Also, Murray >> Tsonga anyway.

Yeah, Murray will probably decline earlier. He has more mileage/matches on his body and relies on movement far more than Jo.

Murray isn't old, but he has played a lot of tennis and movement-reliant players traditionally decline earlier.

ahadabans
06-14-2012, 05:50 PM
I do hope you are not one of the people saying Berdych or Tsonga have more chance - they are both older. So age is not the criterion totally.

Murray has a better chance of winning a slam than Tsonga/Berdych combined. But yeah, he is running out of time to do it.

TigerTim
06-14-2012, 05:54 PM
Muzzah has only played around 450 games in his career and what with players seemingly peaking later I think he has plenty of time left.

Sapeod
06-14-2012, 06:04 PM
Yeah, Murray will probably decline earlier. He has more mileage/matches on his body and relies on movement far more than Jo.

Murray isn't old, but he has played a lot of tennis and movement-reliant players traditionally decline earlier.
No, Andy won't decline any time soon. Those who say he's declining because he hasn't had a stellar year are fools. I guess he was declining in 2010, right? But then 2011 was his best year. He'll have better years and Tsonga is not outlasting him :lol:

ahadabans
06-14-2012, 06:06 PM
Muzzah has only played around 450 games in his career and what with players seemingly peaking later I think he has plenty of time left.

Age is more a factor than number of games IMO, though time on court does play a role in a players decline. 25 is the last year of your prime (give or take).

Roger Federer (arguably the greatest player of all time) has only won 4 slams after age 26. And only 1 since age 28 (and nothing in the last 2 yaers). And that is the rule not the exception. This is a young man's sport. Sure, you have guys like Agassi who actually did better in their late 20's and up. But you should not expect that to happen for Murray.

He needs to win a slam in the next year or two or he's not winning one. And as a fan, I hope he gets his shit together in time to do it.

Mark Lenders
06-14-2012, 06:15 PM
No, Andy won't decline any time soon. Those who say he's declining because he hasn't had a stellar year are fools. I guess he was declining in 2010, right? But then 2011 was his best year. He'll have better years and Tsonga is not outlasting him :lol:

Did I say he will decline soon? No, just earlier than Tsonga.

It'd be unnatural if Tsonga didn't outlast him. He has far less mileage on his body than Murray and a far less physically taxing style of play.