Fed's tough draw continues; R3 vs. Mahut [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Fed's tough draw continues; R3 vs. Mahut

RIboy
05-30-2012, 06:17 PM
:eek:

SheenKJohn
05-30-2012, 06:18 PM
not as good as fucking pig though

Certinfy
05-30-2012, 06:21 PM
Draw from hell will finally end Federer I think. Mahut 71-69 in the 5th.

Allez
05-30-2012, 06:25 PM
Mahut is tougher than Klizan that's for sure. People thought Ungur was going to be a walkover :facepalm:

Nole Rules
05-30-2012, 06:30 PM
Draw from hell for Roger. Can't blame him if he loses this one.

Mercury
05-30-2012, 06:35 PM
The way he's playing it seems he saw the draw and just went "to hell with it, I'll cruise for as long as they let me and I won't put any more energy into this than that."

Understandable really. Nadal plays mugs and Roger gets the hard game every friggin round. Though I have to admit, Kavcic was not a mug against Djoko today so at least he can think of that.

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 06:36 PM
People here at GM don't learn.

We witnessed today ourselves why Ungur was considered a threat. Expect the same with Mahut day after. What if it does go to 70-68 in the fifth? Indeed, Roger is getting roughed out there while his 2 younger rivals make mincemeat of their opponents in cakewalk draws.

Looner
05-30-2012, 06:37 PM
With the amount of hate some people have for the GOAT here, they'll die at about 30 to 40 years of age. I mean there's only so much hate one man can stand.

RIboy
05-30-2012, 06:40 PM
The way he's playing it seems he saw the draw and just went "to hell with it, I'll cruise for as long as they let me and I won't put any more energy into this than that."

Understandable really. Nadal plays mugs and Roger gets the hard game every friggin round. Though I have to admit, Kavcic was not a mug against Djoko today so at least he can think of that.

:haha: :haha:

comesbackatlast
05-30-2012, 06:41 PM
With the amount of hate some people have for the GOAT here, they'll die at about 30 to 40 years of age. I mean there's only so much hate one man can stand.

So Federer should outlive them too!

tangerine_dream
05-30-2012, 06:47 PM
He'll be lucky to get four games off of Mahut.

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 06:51 PM
The way he's playing it seems he saw the draw and just went "to hell with it, I'll cruise for as long as they let me and I won't put any more energy into this than that."

Understandable really. Nadal plays mugs and Roger gets the hard game every friggin round. Though I have to admit, Kavcic was not a mug against Djoko today so at least he can think of that.

Kamke, Ungur and Mahut. You are right, that does sound like a ferocious clay court draw.

Clown.

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 06:53 PM
^^It would do anyone well to not underrate a warrior like Mahut.

Mercury
05-30-2012, 06:54 PM
:haha: :haha:
What was so funny about that?

Looner
05-30-2012, 06:54 PM
I fear for Rogie. I wish he had an easy draw like Luckdal.

Gagsquet
05-30-2012, 06:54 PM
Are you stupid Mercury or trolling expert?

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 06:55 PM
I fear for Rogie. I wish he had an easy draw like Luckdal.

Nobody's favorable stars align quite as easily as Luckdal's.

Allez
05-30-2012, 06:55 PM
The way he's playing it seems he saw the draw and just went "to hell with it, I'll cruise for as long as they let me and I won't put any more energy into this than that."

Understandable really. Nadal plays mugs and Roger gets the hard game every friggin round. Though I have to admit, Kavcic was not a mug against Djoko today so at least he can think of that.

Say what? Roger makes it hard on himself. As decent as his first two opponents were if he'd had half the passion and desire to annihilate them that Rafa and Nole have he'd have destroyed his 1st two opponents without a sweat. He just doesn't want to spend more mental/emotional energy than he has to and is letting these guys boss him around for stretches in a match. I mean Ungur's backhand was destroying Roger's b/hand today. WTF was that all about :shrug: Had Rafa had the same opponents he'd have creamed them in no time. Roger's draw is only hard...ridiculously hard from the quarters onwards. From then on you'd be justified in calling Uncle Toni out for Rafa's relatively easy draw but not one round before :rolleyes:

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 06:56 PM
Are you stupid Mercury or trolling expert?

If we both have to ask, then at a minimum it's stupid trolling but probably just stupid.

Looner
05-30-2012, 06:58 PM
Man, all these haters proclaiming Rogie's draw from hell to be a walk in the park should look at Luckdal's draw and shut their trap or go and look at their Luckdal Armani posters :angel:.

Federer in 2
05-30-2012, 06:59 PM
Federer to pull the upset in 3!

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 07:00 PM
Man, all these haters proclaiming Rogie's draw from hell to be a walk in the park should look at Luckdal's draw and shut their trap or go and look at their Luckdal Armani posters :angel:.

With you it's always hard to tell if it's genuine trolling or the other more permanent option.

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 07:00 PM
Mercury is a great Federer fan. It would do people here well to show him more respect.

RIboy
05-30-2012, 07:01 PM
Bolleli- Kamke 2-0 on clay
Istomin- Ungur 0-0 ($1,739,869- $369,423 in career prize money; ungur is older)
F. Mayer- Mahut :facepalm:
Monaco/Raonic >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kubot/Goffin
Tipsarevic >> Berdych (2-1 on clay, 6-3 overall)

Looner
05-30-2012, 07:02 PM
I know, right? Rogie really got unlucky with the draw this time around.

tektonac
05-30-2012, 07:03 PM
People here at GM don't learn.

We witnessed today ourselves why Ungur was considered a threat. Expect the same with Mahut day after. What if it does go to 70-68 in the fifth? Indeed, Roger is getting roughed out there while his 2 younger rivals make mincemeat of their opponents in cakewalk draws.

you have no right to complain. roger was #1 for years and therefore enjoyed cakewalk draws as well.

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 07:05 PM
Bolleli- Kamke 2-0 on clay
Istomin- Ungur 0-0 ($1,739,869- $369,423 in career prize money; ungur is older)
F. Mayer- Mahut :facepalm:
Monaco/Raonic >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kubot/Goffin
Tipsarevic >> Berdych (2-1 on clay, 6-3 overall)

You know Federer fans won't appreciate head to head stats :)


Still, it's pretty funny all this whining.

Only Federer's quarterfinal if he actually gets a super in form Berdych (which is not a lock) makes a difference. And that Djokovic guy maybe.

Commander Data
05-30-2012, 07:06 PM
Federer is there for the taking. Give the title to Kneedal already :zzz:

Chris Kuerten
05-30-2012, 07:07 PM
Mahut is tougher than Klizan that's for sure. People thought Ungur was going to be a walkover :facepalm:Would've been 6-0 6-0 6-2 if Federer had the same mentality as Nadal.

ServeVolley
05-30-2012, 07:08 PM
He just doesn't want to spend more mental/emotional energy than he has to and is letting these guys boss him around for stretches in a match. I mean Ungur's backhand was destroying Roger's b/hand today. WTF was that all about :D Had Rafa had the same opponents he'd have creamed them in no time.

Which is why Roger is still making GS semis and winning Masters at the age of (almost) 31. Novak and Rafa might throw absolutely everything at their opponents and end up with a few breadsticks and bagels, but how will that affect them down the line? They want to win every point possible and get the victory, Federer doesn't care about losing a few points (or sets) along the way, just so long as he gets the victory. That's the big difference. And I think if Federer hadn't applied this mentality throughout his career, he wouldn't still be playing right now.

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 07:11 PM
you have no right to complain. roger was #1 for years and therefore enjoyed cakewalk draws as well.

:no:

Quite the contrary. Roger battled past 2 generations of players in their prime. First, the Hewitt/Safin/Roddick gen and then the Nadal/Djoker/Murray gen. He collected his slams beating players from both factions.

Cakewalks? Ask Nadal whose most heroic run at RG came force-feeding bagels and breadsticks to players he owns like Almagro and Verdasco.

comesbackatlast
05-30-2012, 07:12 PM
Bolleli- Kamke 2-0 on clay
Istomin- Ungur 0-0 ($1,739,869- $369,423 in career prize money; ungur is older)
F. Mayer- Mahut :facepalm:
Monaco/Raonic >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kubot/Goffin
Tipsarevic >> Berdych (2-1 on clay, 6-3 overall)

Flawed. Indirect H2H don't have much bearing on the matches to come.

For example, Davydenko has a positive H2H against Nadal (6-5). Federer has a positive H2H against Davydenko (17-2).

Should we conclude that Federer has a super H2H against Nadal?

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 07:12 PM
And I guess you've never felt that sensation. I really pity Luckdaltards :bigcry:




I just had to quote this for the sheer stupidity. So Fed's draw is only difficult because he gets the hardest 3 back matches :haha:. Shut up before you embarrass yourself further.


Let's take apart your lovely logic.

The early rounds for Federer are a cakewalk or should be. They would be for Nadal and Djokovic too.

The LAST round is hardest for Federer if he gets Nadal because Nadal is ostensibly the greatest clay courter...and can't play himself (helpful hint for your slow mind). But if Nadal plays Federer or Djokovic he gets the next best/hardest thing.

So we are left with an injured Del Po or perhaps Berdych for the quarters. If Berdych actually is playing well, he will have his chances but I am sure you know how often Berdych also wanders away mentally and otherwise.

So basically because of a probable Djokovic, you are bellyaching. Sorry, but we can't clear out the ATP for Roger's bedwetting fans.

Looner
05-30-2012, 07:14 PM
Let's take apart your lovely logic.

The early rounds for Federer are a cakewalk or should be. They would be for Nadal and Djokovic too.

The LAST round is hardest for Federer if he gets Nadal because Nadal is ostensibly the greatest clay courter...and can't play himself (helpful hint for your slow mind). But if Nadal plays Federer or Djokovic he gets the next best/hardest thing.

So we are left with an injured Del Po or perhaps Berdych for the quarters. If Berdych actually is playing well, he will have his chances but I am sure you know how often Berdych also wanders away mentally and otherwise.

So basically because of a probable Djokovic, you are bellyaching. Sorry, but we can't clear out the ATP for Roger's bedwetting fans.

In comparion Nadal has :confused::confused::confused::confused:

RIboy
05-30-2012, 07:15 PM
Flawed. Indirect H2H don't have much bearing on the matches to come.

For example, Davydenko has a positive H2H against Nadal (6-5). Federer has a positive H2H against Davydenko (17-2).

Should we conclude that Federer has a super H2H against Nadal?

i'm just saying every Nadull's opponent till semis would beat every Arroganterer's opponent

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 07:16 PM
In comparion Nadal has :confused::confused::confused::confused:

An immensely tough QF against Almagro, perhaps. 6-1 6-1 6-1 like 2008, no?

Mark Lenders
05-30-2012, 07:16 PM
Federer will win in 3.

But Mahut is still a legend. That Isner vs Mahut match :worship:

Good to see him make the third round of his home Slam.

MaxPower
05-30-2012, 07:19 PM
Lets not kid ourselves. This is men's tennis where the top seeds rarely go out R1-R3. If you want such action look no further than WTA

Besides among the top4 seeds Federer got the most brutal QF->SF->F combo. He deserves a let-up.

If it wasn't Mahut it could be Roddick who wisely tanked the the clay season. He escaped the 20 H2H difference, dumb to test his luck twice

MTwEeZi
05-30-2012, 07:19 PM
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m4hdtoPXWg1qksc64o3_r2_250.gif









Federer is falling.

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 07:19 PM
In comparion Nadal has :confused::confused::confused::confused:

I see you are confused. Let's make it simple: Nadal on clay makes most players look pretty hopeless.

However the next best clay courters after Roger and Djokovic are guys like Ferrer or Almagro and possibly Berdych though that remains to be seen.

2 of those 3 are on Nadal's side and Raonic would be potentially much more of a threat for Nadal than anyone Fed can play in an equivalent round. It doesn't mean Raonic WILL be but he could be.

Then there are the dangerous big men like Isner, Raonic and Del Po. One of those 3 is injured and flames out against Roger anyway.

Guess which one that is?

So we are left mostly talking about the semi which means Djokovic is on course to clash with Federer and that's of course the source of your bedwetting.

Enjoy.

tektonac
05-30-2012, 07:19 PM
:no:

Quite the contrary. Roger battled past 2 generations of players in their prime. First, the Hewitt/Safin/Roddick gen and then the Nadal/Djoker/Murray gen. He collected his slams beating players from both factions.

Cakewalks? Ask Nadal whose most heroic run at RG came force-feeding bagels and breadsticks to players he owns like Almagro and Verdasco.

one of the articles on roger's draws:

http://www.tennistalk.com/en/blog/Cheryl_Murray/20090903/The_Federer_conspiracy_continues

Say Hey Kid
05-30-2012, 07:20 PM
First Federer plays a clay court specialist in Ungur, and now a very dangerous Mahut who is routining former world #1's and grand slam champions.

Federer really has no weapons to hurt Nicolas. I'll go with Mahut in 4. 6-2 6-3 6-7 6-0

Mark Lenders
05-30-2012, 07:20 PM
An immensely tough QF against Almagro, perhaps. 6-1 6-1 6-1 like 2008, no?

Almagro is actually the only player in Nadal's half (apart from maybe Isner) who actually has the shots/game to beat Nadal.

But it will probably be a copy of their RG 2010 match, with Almagro getting into winning positions every set but wasting them and Nadal winning in 3. As shown in the past, Almagro has the shots to beat the best players, but not the mentality. He doesn't believe he can beat those guys (Bercy vs Nadal would be the prime example).

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 07:21 PM
An immensely tough QF against Almagro, perhaps. 6-1 6-1 6-1 like 2008, no?

Hate to tell you but Almagro is actually one of the best on clay.


That same year Roger won roughly the same amount of games. So yes, Nadal's draw could be easier by your logic if Nadal had Federer in Round 3.

Good thing they didn't do that.

Looner
05-30-2012, 07:22 PM
Almagro is actually the only player in Nadal's half (apart from maybe Isner) who actually has the shots/game to beat Nadal.

But it will probably be a copy of their RG 2010 match, with Almagro getting into winning positions every set but wasting them and Nadal winning in 3. As shown in the past, Almagro has the shots to beat the best players, but not the mentality. He doesn't believe he can beat those guys (Bercy vs Nadal would be the prime example).

What you said about Mugro is at least 3 times more relevant to Berdshit but he never beats Luckdal, only RF. So yeah...

RIboy
05-30-2012, 07:25 PM
one of the articles on roger's draws:

http://www.tennistalk.com/en/blog/Cheryl_Murray/20090903/The_Federer_conspiracy_continues

oh nooooooooo....what a disrespectful article about the GOAT/king of the world...how could they?

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 07:27 PM
What you said about Mugro is at least 3 times more relevant to Berdshit but he never beats Luckdal, only RF. So yeah...

We could say the same thing about Ferrer. He never beats Federer, only Nadal. That's ACTUALLY a fact though no matter when you look at their careers.

In this case, Berdych is 4-11 vs Federer and 3-12 against Nadal.

Come on, get real. Stop wetting the bed.

tektonac
05-30-2012, 07:27 PM
oh nooooooooo....what a disrespectful article about the GOAT/king of the world...how could they?

asked that myself, what a blasphemy!? :mad:

Looner
05-30-2012, 07:29 PM
We could say the same thing about Ferrer. He never beats Federer, only Nadal. That's ACTUALLY a fact though no matter when you look at their careers.

In this case, Berdych is 4-11 vs Federer and 3-12 against Nadal.

Come on, get real. Stop wetting the bed.

Berdych's last win against RN was in 2006. Give up, you're making a mockery of yourself. Not a first but every little helps :wavey:.

Nr 1 Fan
05-30-2012, 07:30 PM
Sad to see Mahut has no chance. Would love to see his celebration when he beats Federer on PC given his celebration after he beat Klizan: Like he won the CYGS

thrust
05-30-2012, 07:31 PM
With the amount of hate some people have for the GOAT here, they'll die at about 30 to 40 years of age. I mean there's only so much hate one man can stand.

The problem is that the Fedtards here are bigger crybabies than Roger is. The draw is what it is, no player has control over it. If Roger is playing anywhere near his best he will beat Mahut in 3 sets. Fans here need to Stop making silly excuses as to why their favorites lose. S--t happens!

Mark Lenders
05-30-2012, 07:32 PM
What you said about Mugro is at least 3 times more relevant to Berdshit but he never beats Luckdal, only RF. So yeah...

It's a very bad match-up for Tomas on slow courts (and every aggressive big hitter really). No wonder Nadal once won 18 consecutive sets against him. On the current slow courts, and aggressive big hitter like Tomas has to hit like 4/5 winners to finish a point against Nadal.

Soderling's 2009 RG win was an anomaly, not the rule. He managed to redline and paint lines and corners consistently for 4 sets, that's not something that can be done on a regular basis. Tsonga has a better chance because he's very comfortable at the net (is actually great) and can finish points there, and he also has one the best serves on better, considerably better than Berdych's - thus can get many more free points; Del Potro is always troublesome for Rafa even when not playing well because Nadal's topspin goes right into his hitting zone and he hits with great margin (he's not a particularly aggressive big hitter who goes for lines) so he will not give Nadal the errors Tomas does but instead draw short balls from him.

Berdych not beating Nadal has little to do with mentality and everything to do his court speed. His "would be winners against anyone else" just keep coming back. He played an almost perfect two sets at AO this year and still couldn't get it done. He can hit through Federer (whose defense isn't as superb as Nadal), but not through Nadal. Make those two play on a fast court and I have a feeling there will no mental issues whatsoever.

Claiming he tries his best against Federer and not against Nadal can only be done by either members of each fanbase (biased) or people who don't watch the matches. Simply, he can hit through Federer when playing well, he needs to be playing out of his mind to hit through Nadal for 3/5 sets on the tour's slow as moleasses courts.

Mercury
05-30-2012, 07:34 PM
I see you are confused. Let's make it simple: Nadal on clay makes most players look pretty hopeless.

However the next best clay courters after Roger and Djokovic are guys like Ferrer or Almagro and possibly Berdych though that remains to be seen.

2 of those 3 are on Nadal's side and Raonic would be potentially much more of a threat for Nadal than anyone Fed can play in an equivalent round. It doesn't mean Raonic WILL be but he could be.

Then there are the dangerous big men like Isner, Raonic and Del Po. One of those 3 is injured and flames out against Roger anyway.

Guess which one that is?

So we are left mostly talking about the semi which means Djokovic is on course to clash with Federer and that's of course the source of your bedwetting.

Enjoy.
How can you cancel out Berdych like that? The man has played wonderful tennis over the last few weeks and the first 2 rounds of this GS are no different. Honestly, there is no harder QF draw than Berdych in my eyes. Not Ferrer nor Tsonga are a tougher draw these days.

The way Berdych is playing I doubt he'd lose to anyone outside of the top 3 and you're just dismissing him as a useless mug that might give RF a bit of a challenge... Give me a break.

Looner
05-30-2012, 07:36 PM
It's a very bad match-up for Tomas on slow courts (and every aggressive big hitter really). No wonder Nadal once won 18 consecutive sets against him. On the current slow courts, and aggressive big hitter like Tomas has to hit like 4/5 winners to finish a point against Nadal.

Soderling's 2009 RG win was an anomaly, not the rule. He managed to redline and paint lines and corners consistently for 4 sets, that's not something that can be done on a regular basis. Tsonga has a better chance because he's very comfortable at the net (is actually great) and can finish points there, Del Potro is always troublesome even when not playing well because Nadal's topspin goes right into his hitting zone and he hits with great margin (he's not a particularly aggressive big hitter who goes for lines).

Berdych not beating Nadal has little to do with mentality and everything to do his court speed. His "would be winners against anyone else" just keep coming back. He played an almost perfect two sets at AO this year and still couldn't get it done. He can hit through Federer (whose defense isn't as superb as Nadal), but not through Nadal. Make those two play on a fast court and I have a feeling there will no mental issues whatsoever.

Claiming he tries his best against Federer and not against Nadal can only be done by either members of each fanbase (biased) or people who don't watch the matches. Simply, he can hit through Federer when playing well, he needs to be playing out of his mind to hit through Nadal for 3/5 sets on the tour's slow as moleasses courts.

He misses huge opportunities against RN and he's not clutch enough. I know he plays well but against RN you have to take nearly every chance you get. He doesn't. I consider that as a liability of his game. So yeah...

comesbackatlast
05-30-2012, 07:41 PM
i'm just saying every Nadull's opponent till semis would beat every Arroganterer's opponent

And I am saying that the opponents' H2Hs have no much bearing on their matches with Federer or Nadal.

Nadal's opponents may beat Federer's opponents, but it may be easier for Nadal than Federer; their games may suit Nadal more that Federer's opponents Federer.

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 07:41 PM
one of the articles on roger's draws:

http://www.tennistalk.com/en/blog/Cheryl_Murray/20090903/The_Federer_conspiracy_continues

Read it.

But shouldn't Roger's H2H against Del Potro till USO finals also be considered? And he faced Novak in the semis, yet defeated him. Ideally, if all were to go "as-per-rigged-draw-plan", shouldn't Roger have won the 2009 USO finals? But Delpo turned it around. So it is not about whom you own - as much as who has the will to defeat you among those you think you own. Also, lets not forget his puppet Davydenko defeated Roger twice after that USO.

The guys in Roger's half of the draw for this RG have immensely greater will (Ungur defeated Nalbandian, took set off Roger/Mahut's legend doesn't need recollection) than those turkeys and pigeons in Nadal's half - none of whom will ever turn it around vs Nadal, having too much admiration for him and lacking in will-power.

What did Bolleli do besides winning the poll?

thrust
05-30-2012, 07:43 PM
:no:

Quite the contrary. Roger battled past 2 generations of players in their prime. First, the Hewitt/Safin/Roddick gen and then the Nadal/Djoker/Murray gen. He collected his slams beating players from both factions.

Cakewalks? Ask Nadal whose most heroic run at RG came force-feeding bagels and breadsticks to players he owns like Almagro and Verdasco.

Hewitt was past his prime and never as good as Roger or Nadal at their best. Safin and Roddick were never consistantly great players. Nadal and Novak are the only great players Roger had to deal with in his prime. The rest of Roger's main competition till Nadal came along were tier 2 players, at best. Actually, Novak just reached his best last year.

Mark Lenders
05-30-2012, 07:46 PM
He misses huge opportunities against RN and he's not clutch enough. I know he plays well but against RN you have to take nearly every chance you get. He doesn't. I consider that as a liability of his game. So yeah...

That's kind of expected. When you face a bad match-up, you tend to be less confident in big points because you know you have to play above your usual level to get the point.

Federer has experienced the same vs Nadal many times, and Berdych's match-up issues with Nadal are far bigger than Federer's. Fed has far more variety than Tomas, he can mix it up, run away from the patterns of play that cause him problems in the match-up. Tomas can't, his game consists of hitting through his opponents from the baseline: against Nadal on super slow courts, that's almost impossible and he doesn't have a plan B to speak of - he's not good at the net so charging would be even worse and his serve doesn't give him that many free points and can be a liability, and obviously he doesn't have the same vast array of shots as Federer and some other players.

It's just expected he loses the big points: he has to do a lot to win points against Nadal. In pressure situations, Nadal, who only has to execute his normal game/plan is far more likely to succeed than Berdych who knows he has to be perfect + the added pressure of big points. Rafa is the one player I never expect Tomas to be competitive against. The way courts have been slowed down, it's almost impossible for a player with Tomas's game to be competitive against Nadal.

Noleta
05-30-2012, 07:49 PM
Roger in 3 close sets i think:)

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 07:52 PM
Hate to tell you but Almagro is actually one of the best on clay.


That same year Roger won roughly the same amount of games. So yes, Nadal's draw could be easier by your logic if Nadal had Federer in Round 3.

Good thing they didn't do that.

Roger was the second best on clay in 2008, ahead of Almagro. So it does not matter with Nadal's form on clay. Nadal's draw remains a cakewalk right up till he stops getting players whose game he recognizes and owns. So it doesn't matter how good Almagro or even Roger are on clay. In fact, in 2008, Nadal had problems in his opening round match against Bellucci because he had never faced him before. This time around, Nadal has no one in his half of the draw whose game he doesn't know, or someone who can potentially cause an upset because of a freak match-up issue.

Roger on the other hand is facing guys he's never faced before or legends like Mahut. Always tougher for Wogie. Quit trolling.

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 07:52 PM
Berdych's last win against RN was in 2006. Give up, you're making a mockery of yourself. Not a first but every little helps :wavey:.

So you're saying that Nadal stepped up his game against Berdych. True I agree.

On the other hand when has Ferrer beaten Federer?

It's always nice to see you live up to your name.

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 07:54 PM
Roger on the other hand is facing guys he's never faced before or legends like Mahut. Always tougher for Wogie. Quit trolling.

Translation: guys not good enough to make any round of significance on clay except by chance.

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 07:56 PM
He misses huge opportunities against RN and he's not clutch enough. I know he plays well but against RN you have to take nearly every chance you get. He doesn't. I consider that as a liability of his game. So yeah...

So by implication you don't need to take every chance against Roger? Why worry so much otherwise?

ServeVolley
05-30-2012, 07:58 PM
Do you Nadal-tards really think Federer has an easier draw overall than Nadal? Their first three opponents are comparatively difficult, Raonic obviously is trickiest in R4 (assuming he gets there of course), but then from QF on Fed's is by far the hardest:

Federer
R3 - Mahut
R4 - Kubot/Goffin
QF - Berdych/Del Potro
SF - Djokovic/Tsonga

Nadal
R3 - Mayer
R4 - Monaco/Raonic
QF - Almagro/Tipsarevic
SF - Murray/Ferrer

Let's be clear; the first four rounds are irrelevant for the Top 3. None of them have lost before the QF stages of any slam since 2009, so to judge the real difficulty for them you need to look at the potential QF/SF opponents.

As such, facing Berdych (a Masters winner and Grand Slam finalist) or Del Potro (a Masters finalist and Grand Slam champion), both of whom have beaten Federer in Grand Slams, and then Djokovic (the world #1), is far harder than facing Almagro (reached one Masters SF, never gone further than QF in a slam) or Tipsarevic (two SF at Masters, one QF at a slam), neither of whom have ever beaten Nadal (Tipsy's never taken more than 3 games in a set!), let alone in a Grand Slam, and then one of two players who you've repeatedly pwned on the surface.

It's an absolute joke to suggest otherwise. I mean the spaniard couldn't have got better QF/SF opponents if he'd picked them (which he probably did)! :rolleyes:

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 07:59 PM
Read it.

But shouldn't Roger's H2H against Del Potro till USO finals also be considered? And he faced Novak in the semis, yet defeated him. Ideally, if all were to go "as-per-rigged-draw-plan", shouldn't Roger have won the 2009 USO finals? But Delpo turned it around. So it is not about whom you own - as much as who has the will to defeat you among those you think you own. Also, lets not forget his puppet Davydenko defeated Roger twice after that USO.

The guys in Roger's half of the draw for this RG have immensely greater will (Ungur defeated Nalbandian, took set off Roger/Mahut's legend doesn't need recollection) than those turkeys and pigeons in Nadal's half - none of whom will ever turn it around vs Nadal, having too much admiration for him and lacking in will-power.



Congratulations on one of the most humorous posts I have seen today.

Somehow you know about the willpower of Roger's opponents and cite as proof of that, UNGUR beating Nalbandian and Mahut.

What exactly has either one done over his career? Is Federer's glee club reduced to talking up huge threats from Ungur and Mahut (on clay no less).

Too funny.

Nadal and Federer both have lots of pigeons as a function of being the 2 best players over the past several years. Stop wetting the bed.

Jaz
05-30-2012, 08:01 PM
Rogie in 5. You know it's due.

tennishero
05-30-2012, 08:02 PM
some people here really need to learn the meaning of sarcasm.

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 08:04 PM
Do you Nadal-tards really think Federer has an easier draw overall than Nadal? Their first three opponents are comparatively difficult, Raonic obviously is trickiest in R4 (assuming he gets there of course), but then from QF on Fed's is by far the hardest:

Federer
R3 - Mahut
R4 - Kubot/Goffin
QF - Berdych/Del Potro
SF - Djokovic/Tsonga

Nadal
R3 - Mayer
R4 - Monaco/Raonic
QF - Almagro/Tipsarevic
SF - Murray/Ferrer

Let's be clear; the first four rounds are irrelevant for the Top 3. None of them have lost before the QF stages of any slam since 2009, so to judge the real difficulty for them you need to look at the potential QF/SF opponents.

As such, facing Berdych (a Masters winner and Grand Slam finalist) or Del Potro (a Masters finalist and Grand Slam champion), both of whom have beaten Federer in Grand Slams, and then Djokovic (the world #1), is far harder than facing Almagro (reached one Masters SF, never gone further than QF in a slam) or Tipsarevic (two SF at Masters, one QF at a slam), neither of whom have ever beaten Nadal (Tipsy's never taken more than 3 games in a set!), let alone in a Grand Slam, and then one of two players who you've repeatedly pwned on the surface.

It's an absolute joke to suggest otherwise. I mean the spaniard couldn't have got better QF/SF opponents if he'd picked them (which he probably did)! :rolleyes:

:worship: If only dulltards could see the light.

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 08:04 PM
Do you Nadal-tards really think Federer has an easier draw overall than Nadal? Their first three opponents are comparatively difficult, Raonic obviously is trickiest in R4 (assuming he gets there of course), but then from QF on Fed's is by far the hardest:

Federer
R3 - Mahut
R4 - Kubot/Goffin
QF - Berdych/Del Potro
SF - Djokovic/Tsonga

Nadal
R3 - Mayer
R4 - Monaco/Raonic
QF - Almagro/Tipsarevic
SF - Murray/Ferrer



A draw is your WHOLE draw. And in fact, several posters in the Federer glee club spoke of EVERY round being harder.

So, assuming it plays out, I think the first 2 rounds of these are potentially much higher quality opponents for Nadal and I am not convinced that Berdych is necessarily as good as Almagro on RG type clay.

Berdych in fact just lost to Tipsarevic on clay so let's not make him out to be some sort of Nadal slayer. Del Potro is clearly impaired so let's just leave that one alone.

The real question is Murray/Ferrer vs Djokovic/Tsonga. We all know Djokovic is the next in line to Nadal here and he had to fall somewhere. If he were to lose, Ferrer and Murray are both potentially better than Tsonga on clay.

Hardly the stuff of great debates.

ciprianned
05-30-2012, 08:07 PM
Fed in 3
Something like 6-3 6-4 6-2 .

arm
05-30-2012, 08:07 PM
This thread :lol: :yeah:


Besides among the top4 seeds Federer got the most brutal QF->SF->F combo. He deserves a let-up.



:confused: SF and F would be less brutal if he had to face Nadal in the semis and Nole in the final? Really it makes no sense to put it like that, at most he has the most brutal QF and I am not even sure that's the case.

Sunset of Age
05-30-2012, 08:16 PM
Some rather amusing stuff in this thread.
Face it folks - NONE of the top four are to meet any players who could pose a serious threat to them (unless one of them epically truly f*cks *p) before R4-QF, and that's the way it usually is at GS tournaments.

And for those questioning who likely will have the most brutal QF, I'd advise you to watch Berdych's matches. :shrug:

As for Fed-Mahut: Fed should get it done in three.
But that's what I also said about the Fed-Ungur match...

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 08:16 PM
This thread :lol: :yeah:

True. :lol:

But there are those who reason that Almagro can defeat Nadal by virtue of being one of the best on clay, and similarly reason that facing Berdych in Quarters is easy for Roger (given how dangerous Tomas has become for Roger). Hilarious indeed!

Bottomline: The only things that can unsettle Nadal on clay are:
1. Freak match-up + superconfident player (Soderling)
2. New player whom Nadal hasn't figured out

Ergo,
Roger = Draw from Hell
Rafa = Cakewalk draw.

Looner
05-30-2012, 08:19 PM
Ferrer is playing better than Berdych atm. Murray has the toughest draw.

Certinfy, please comment.

arm
05-30-2012, 08:19 PM
True. :lol:

But there are those who reason that Almagro can defeat Nadal by virtue of being one of the best on clay, and similarly reason that facing Berdych in Quarters is easy for Roger (given how dangerous Tomas has become for Roger). Hilarious indeed!

Bottomline: The only things that can unsettle Nadal on clay are:
1. Freak match-up + superconfident player (Soderling)
2. New player whom Nadal hasn't figured out

Ergo,
Roger = Draw from Hell
Rafa = Cakewalk draw.

I hope you realize you're basically saying Nadal is much better than Roger. :p

Sunset of Age
05-30-2012, 08:21 PM
I hope you realize you're basically saying Nadal is much better than Roger. :p

On clay, yes he surely is. Common knowledge, I hope. :p ;)

Looner
05-30-2012, 08:22 PM
I hope you realize you're basically saying Nadal is much better than Roger. :p

Nah, Federer is the clay GOAT and you are a genius.

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 08:22 PM
I hope you realize you're basically saying Nadal is much better than Roger. :p

We all know little Humbalitos Rafitos is the ClayGOAT. Why would I argue? :shrug:

ServeVolley
05-30-2012, 08:25 PM
A draw is your WHOLE draw. And in fact, several posters in the Federer glee club spoke of EVERY round being harder.



Do you think I care what other posters have said? There is no genuine danger for any of the Top 3 before the QF. Full stop.



So, assuming it plays out, I think the first 2 rounds of these are potentially much higher quality opponents for Nadal and I am not convinced that Berdych is necessarily as good as Almagro on RG type clay.



Which is why he reached the semis in 2010 and then took Soderling to five, right? Because he's not as good on the RG clay? ;)



Berdych in fact just lost to Tipsarevic on clay so let's not make him out to be some sort of Nadal slayer. Del Potro is clearly impaired so let's just leave that one alone.



Don't be obtuse. Berdych and Del Potro have both beaten Nadal (the latter in a GS), whereas Almagro and Tipsarevic haven't. Whether they would beat him is debatable, the fact that they have a better chance of doing so is not.



The real question is Murray/Ferrer vs Djokovic/Tsonga. We all know Djokovic is the next in line to Nadal here and he had to fall somewhere. If he were to lose, Ferrer and Murray are both potentially better than Tsonga on clay.


Obviously in that case, but then what if Murray and Ferrer were to lose too? It's pointless speculation really. The fact is having the World #1 in your side of the draw puts the difficulty level up astronomically (I know as the #2 seed Nadal can't help it, but it's still a fact). :shrug:

arm
05-30-2012, 08:25 PM
On clay, yes he surely is. Common knowledge, I hope. :p ;)

We all know little Humbalitos Rafitos is the ClayGOAT. Why would I argue? :shrug:

Ok, great, I agree. :lol: But that makes it nonsense to compare Rafa and Rogie's draws, because Roger's is always going to look so much tougher. :shrug:

tektonac
05-30-2012, 08:26 PM
roger has a tougher RG draw than nadal. Both have enjoyed cake-draws in the past so this discussion is pointless.

rocketassist
05-30-2012, 08:27 PM
Nico gave Federer a great match at Wimbledon a few years ago.

I think I'd run around my street if he won this though.

RIboy
05-30-2012, 08:28 PM
roger has a tougher RG draw than nadal. Both have enjoyed cake-draws in the past so this discussion is pointless.

please don't sabotage my thread...

LastRocket
05-30-2012, 08:30 PM
Ferrer is playing better than Berdych atm.


Murray has the toughest draw. Then Nadal. Then Djokovic. Muger's cakewalk is lined with icing.

Berdych is the best player atm, besides Nadal and Djoker (those 2 are just better players)

rocketassist
05-30-2012, 08:31 PM
So you're saying that Nadal stepped up his game against Berdych. True I agree.

On the other hand when has Ferrer beaten Federer?

It's always nice to see you live up to your name.

More biased shite from someone who tries to claim objectivity.

tektonac
05-30-2012, 08:31 PM
please don't sabotage my thread...

all right, leaving now ...

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 08:32 PM
Don't be obtuse. Berdych and Del Potro have both beaten Nadal (the latter in a GS), whereas Almagro and Tipsarevic haven't. Whether they would beat him is debatable, the fact that they have a better chance of doing so is not.

All potential threats to Nadal are in Fed's half.
All potential threats to Fed are in Fed's half.


Obviously in that case, but then what if Murray and Ferrer were to lose too? It's pointless speculation really. The fact is having the World #1 in your side of the draw puts the difficulty level up astronomically (I know as the #2 seed Nadal can't help it, but it's still a fact). :shrug:

Nothing Nadal would like better than facing pigeon Claygod Almagro in QF and potential ClayGoat Murray in SF. ...Since you are only concerned about QF onwards.:D

Roger the Dodger
05-30-2012, 08:35 PM
More biased shite from someone who tries to claim objectivity.

Tribalfusion's rose-tinted specs are stuck with glue to her/his temples. There's no reasoning with this poster. h/she thinks Almagro is a threat to Nadal on clay. :haha:

Le_Bousier
05-30-2012, 08:38 PM
I won't be impressed if the crowd cheers for Roger in this match.

He's the cheering GOAT. Everybody loves him

EliSter
05-30-2012, 09:08 PM
I won't be impressed if the crowd cheers for Roger in this match.

He's the cheering GOAT. Everybody loves him

Praise the Olderer, our Lord :bowdown:

arm
05-30-2012, 09:09 PM
I won't be impressed if the crowd cheers for Roger in this match.

He's the cheering GOAT. Everybody loves him

:rolls::lol:

JediFed
05-30-2012, 09:09 PM
Like a boss. :D

Looner
05-30-2012, 09:10 PM
:rolls::lol:

Bet your boy won't be laughing when the French go crazy once RF whips him again in the SFs :wavey:. God Roger is there to share the love with everyone bar those two mugs at #1 and #2.

EliSter
05-30-2012, 09:10 PM
Bet your boy won't be laughing when the French go crazy once RF whips him again in the SFs :wavey:.

Keep dreamin bro.

Certinfy
05-30-2012, 09:13 PM
Bet your boy won't be laughing when the French go crazy once RF whips him again in the SFs :wavey:. God Roger is there to share the love with everyone bar those two mugs at #1 and #2.
:facepalm:

Looner
05-30-2012, 09:15 PM
Keep dreamin bro.

I hope you're looking forward to that Fed set. I don't think you'll find an image of him with a cigar but I can try to arrange that.


:facepalm:
Now why would you ignore my request to comment on MTwEeZi's opinion Ferrer's playing better than Berdych. Please, I'm really interested.

Here it is for reference purposes


Ferrer is playing better than Berdych atm.


Murray has the toughest draw. Then Nadal. Then Djokovic. Muger's cakewalk is lined with icing.

duarte_a
05-30-2012, 09:17 PM
Bet your boy won't be laughing when the French go crazy once RF whips him again in the SFs :wavey:. God Roger is there to share the love with everyone bar those two mugs at #1 and #2.

Keep dreamin bro.

You're right the french won't go crazy when Roger beats djokovic in the semis. They'll be like like "It was expected.".

Certinfy
05-30-2012, 09:19 PM
Now why would you ignore my request to comment on MTwEeZi's opinion Ferrer's playing better than Berdych. Please, I'm really interested.

Here it is for reference purposes
I didn't see that. :o Sorry.

EliSter
05-30-2012, 09:21 PM
I hope you're looking forward to that Fed set. I don't think you'll find an image of him with a cigar but I can try to arrange that.

I hope you will be rdy for epic Nole gif i have for you when Olderer losses ;) And no worries i keep my part of deal if Olderer makes it.

EliSter
05-30-2012, 09:23 PM
You're right the french won't go crazy when Roger beats djokovic in the semis. They'll be like like "It was expected.".

Hope u will be here after that semi :o

reery
05-30-2012, 09:23 PM
Rogie in 3.

Bet your boy won't be laughing when the French go crazy once RF whips him again in the SFs :wavey:. God Roger is there to share the love with everyone bar those two mugs at #1 and #2.

Affirmative.

JediFed
05-30-2012, 09:43 PM
and Roddick were never consistantly great players

How many players in the Open era have 10 grand slam semis?

arm
05-30-2012, 09:51 PM
Keep dreamin bro.

dammit don't quote! :angel:

A_Skywalker
05-30-2012, 09:54 PM
tough draw? :D
Ungur was playing like he already lost in the 4th set. Federer has only himself to blame he made his draw "hard

viruzzz
05-30-2012, 10:07 PM
Fans are calling it a tough draw because of Berdych in QF.
Berdych is playing great tennis, and it is the most difficult QFnalist on clay (Ferrer should be, but he kinda sucks in slams), like Tsonga is in USO/Wimbledon, and that's what Roger got.

So, that's exactly why we are calling it a tough draw. I don't think Stepanek or Lopez (the player who he should face) are difficult players to beat.

So... You bitches could still make fun of us saying this, but Berdych in clay is the real deal in 2012.

RIboy
05-30-2012, 10:10 PM
So... You bitches could still make fun of us saying this, but Berdych in clay is the real deal in 2012.

you already buried him, so much about him being a threat...

Mr. Oracle
05-30-2012, 10:14 PM
The way he's playing it seems he saw the draw and just went "to hell with it, I'll cruise for as long as they let me and I won't put any more energy into this than that."

Understandable really. Nadal plays mugs and Roger gets the hard game every friggin round. Though I have to admit, Kavcic was not a mug against Djoko today so at least he can think of that.

:confused::stupid::haha::silly:

FedvsNole
05-30-2012, 10:18 PM
Bet your boy won't be laughing when the French go crazy once RF whips him again in the SFs :wavey:. God Roger is there to share the love with everyone bar those two mugs at #1 and #2.


Had they kept the faster rock hard babolat balls I may agree but too much has happened to think fed will win agasinst nole if he EVEN MAKES it to Nole.

1. Slow heavy balls: favor berdych and Nole
2. Roger might have played too much and too well already this season and is in a "dip in play mode" compared to his level earlier in this amazing 9 month stretch
3. He had some type of hip/back issue going into the madrid final and rather than skip rome and rest he played and didn't get better and its still with him in the french open thus his movement has noticeably been off to what it was just a few weeks ago and affecting his forehand, backhand, and defense.
4. Losing to djokovic on clay right before french just made djoker even more confident and didn't help fed's confidence.

Honestly, i can finally admit it. Roger can only win a slam if he does not have to go through nadal/djokovic at any point except maybe roger could beat nole at wimbledon still but with the grass so slow who really even knows.

I would say he would have had his chances against both at us open but they keep slowing that shit down every year as it is and no way in hell can he beat them both with this super saturday and sunday final shit. And then when they finally make a monday final in 2013 roger will be 32, nadal 28, and nole, 27.


Thats the difference between roger now and in his prime. It didn't really matter outside the french who was in his draw. He would steamroll them or at most lose one set against them. Too much has to go right for fed at this point like counting on nadal/nole not to be there, trying to make sure fed gets through the first 5 matches without losing too much "energy" and then of course avoiding big hitters.

To win slams you gotta be able to endure anything thrown at you and it just seems to me fed really needs too many things to go right for him to win. Although if he's really around for another 2-3 years no way nole/rafa make every semi and final 3 years in a row so he may avoid them but then might be too old to beat the next in form player or even a tsonga who has relatively super young legs since he hardly played on tour due to injuries.

viruzzz
05-30-2012, 10:23 PM
you already buried him, so much about him being a threat...

Oh shut up.
In Madrid he outplayed Roger the first set and the man needed to play AWESOME tennis to defeat him.

In Rome, he played a great match vs Rafa. If we repeat the match, he would probably win a set.

Matt01
05-30-2012, 10:26 PM
Yeah, I agree. That's really a draw from hell for poor Federer :awww:

Good luck, Nicolas :D

tribalfusion
05-30-2012, 10:45 PM
Tribalfusion's rose-tinted specs are stuck with glue to her/his temples. There's no reasoning with this poster. h/she thinks Almagro is a threat to Nadal on clay. :haha:


No I don't. I don't think Berdych is a threat to Nadal on clay. I don't think Federer is essentially. I don't think Almagro is either in the sense that Novak is.

I do HOWEVER think Almagro is one of the tour's best clay courters.

See, that was simple even for you.

buzz
05-30-2012, 11:04 PM
Oh shut up.
In Madrid he outplayed Roger the first set and the man needed to play AWESOME tennis to defeat him.

In Rome, he played a great match vs Rafa. If we repeat the match, he would probably win a set.

:secret: it was a joke because you made a grammar mistake....;)

Looner
05-30-2012, 11:42 PM
tough draw

Another comrade who agrees. Glad so many have seen the light or loaned a brain, be it for just a day.

nick the greek
05-31-2012, 12:04 AM
Bet your boy won't be laughing when the French go crazy once RF whips him again in the SFs :wavey:. God Roger is there to share the love with everyone bar those two mugs at #1 and #2.
What you smokin' boy?Whatever it is,you'd better stop,it's fucking up that small brain of yours.Cold,hard fact of life:Fedmug is NO longer a factor and is going down before SF.

Looner
05-31-2012, 12:08 AM
What you smokin' boy?Whatever it is,you'd better stop,it's fucking up that small brain of yours.Cold,hard fact of life:Fedmug is NO longer a factor and is going down before SF.

Just so I make sure you didn't miss this.
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lwvkl6eAa11qcryjz.gif

nick the greek
05-31-2012, 12:15 AM
Whaaat?I see an ugly bitch waving her finger,noting much too see,really.However,this is something magnificent:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_S81DHu8OSg

paseo
05-31-2012, 12:25 AM
http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m4hdtoPXWg1qksc64o3_r2_250.gif









Federer is falling.

lol. When was that?

Whaaat?I see an ugly bitch waving her finger,noting much too see,really.However,this is something magnificent:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_S81DHu8OSg

Man, learn to post youtube links properly. We trolls and tards are too lazy to go to the website.

Freakin' noobs, these days.

viruzzz
05-31-2012, 12:28 AM
Whaaat?I see an ugly bitch waving her finger,noting much too see,really.However,this is something magnificent:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_S81DHu8OSg

Nick, get a punchbag to spread your hate. And stop posting the shit you eat in MTF.

nick the greek
05-31-2012, 12:31 AM
lol. When was that?



Man, learn to post youtube links properly. We trolls and tards are too lazy to go to the website.

Freakin' noobs, these days.
No man,don't wanna.Me to lazy too.

FedvsNole
05-31-2012, 12:52 AM
Let me be clear. I want fed to win. Maybe the trend of hard draws are better for fed. See indian wells and madrid for example.

Yeah, fed drew berdych, arguably the most dangerous player outside top 3 on clay right now. But remember injurer beat berdych on arguably a tougher surface to beat berdych on that blue slippery clay that was playing lightening quick on high altitude.


If fed has any chance to beating novak, it certainly wont help if he has 5 super easy matches and then plays djoker. Rather, if he gets pushed by berdych in say up to 4 sets it might actually make him play better and be ready for novak. He still might not win but he'll make it a better match as opposed to playing pony or cilic prior to nole.


As bad as federer is playing, I'd rather have him play like crap now in rounds 1-4 as opposed to him activating jesus fed accidentally. Hopefully
jesus-erer makes a showing in parts of the berdych and nole matches. That's when he'll need it.

Topspindoctor
05-31-2012, 01:19 AM
Olderer must be careful here: a player with amazing clay credentials and mental toughness like Mahut will be extremely difficult to beat on this surface. I expect an epic match with many momentum swings with Olderer ultimately prevailing 6-3 6-2 6-2.

Mimi
05-31-2012, 02:05 AM
With the amount of hate some people have for the GOAT here, they'll die at about 30 to 40 years of age. I mean there's only so much hate one man can stand.

rafa got more hatre than Roger :shrug:

die at 30 or 40 at their peak, die without an old face and ailing body, not that bad in my opinion :lol:

Looner
05-31-2012, 02:08 AM
rafa got more hatre than Roger :shrug:

die at 30 or 40 at their peak, die without an old face and ailing body, not that bad in my opinion :lol:

I thought only Olderer peaked past 30 years of age. Also, every bit of hatred towards RN is deserved in my book.

Mimi
05-31-2012, 02:15 AM
I thought only Olderer peaked past 30 years of age. Also, every bit of hatred towards RN is deserved in my book.

you are also a hater yourself, no difference than others :shrug:

evilmindbulgaria
05-31-2012, 02:15 AM
:no:

Quite the contrary. Roger battled past 2 generations of players in their prime. First, the Hewitt/Safin/Roddick gen and then the Nadal/Djoker/Murray gen. He collected his slams beating players from both factions.

Cakewalks? Ask Nadal whose most heroic run at RG came force-feeding bagels and breadsticks to players he owns like Almagro and Verdasco.

Bwahahaaaaaaa, are you serious???

Philippoussis/Baghdatis/Gonzalez/20-year old Djokovic/Soderling/Murray X2

How many Grand Slams has Federer won against Nadal? And how many has he lost?

Exactly!

Looner
05-31-2012, 02:18 AM
you are also a hater yourself, no difference than others :shrug:

I am, first and foremost, a tennis lover. That does not leave me with any choice with regard to my attitude towards Nadal.

evilmindbulgaria
05-31-2012, 02:20 AM
I am, first and foremost, a tennis lover. That does not leave me with any choice with regard to my attitude towards Nadal.

No, you are not! Every post of yours stinks of hate towards Rafa - the Master of your poor idol :wavey:

Topspindoctor
05-31-2012, 02:21 AM
I am, first and foremost, a tennis lover. That does not leave me with any choice with regard to my attitude towards Nadal.

:superlol:

Looner
05-31-2012, 02:22 AM
No, you are not! Every post of yours stinks of hate towards Rafa - the Master of your poor idol :wavey:

Nadal is the plague for tennis. I've said this plenty of times. My thinking is consistent and logical. Please be gone, evil troll.

Mimi
05-31-2012, 02:24 AM
someone is gonna get a high seeding in this year's ACC :cool: :lol: :cheerleader:

Looner
05-31-2012, 02:25 AM
someone is gonna get a high seeding in this year's ACC :cool: :lol: :cheerleader:

I support your candidature 100% :wavey:.

evilmindbulgaria
05-31-2012, 02:26 AM
Nadal is the plague for tennis. I've said this plenty of times. My thinking is consistent and logical. Please be gone, evil troll.

I really feel sorry for you, man! People are laughing at you left and right. It is one thing to be a fan of a player, but to hate a player the way you do can't be good for your health :wavey:

Can't wait for another Rafa - Federer final here, there is nothing sweeter than Nadal slapping his bitch :devil:

Looner
05-31-2012, 02:27 AM
I really feel sorry for you, man! People are laughing at you left and right. It is one thing to be a fan of a player, but to hate a player the way you do can't be good for your health :wavey:

Can't wait for another Rafa - Federer final here, there is nothing sweeter than Nadal slapping his bitch :devil:

I don't really hate him. I am naturally allergic to Nadull and all his antics. Ljubicic put it best in 2006 - he offends me with his behaviour. In my case, he offends me by playing tennis.

Mimi
05-31-2012, 02:31 AM
I support your candidature 100% :wavey:.

thanks for your support :hatoff:

Topspindoctor
05-31-2012, 02:33 AM
Nadal is the plague for tennis. I've said this plenty of times. My thinking is consistent and logical. Please be gone, evil troll.

Lol.

Looner
05-31-2012, 02:34 AM
Lol.

It'd be funny if it wasn't true :bigcry:

rocketassist
05-31-2012, 02:36 AM
Bwahahaaaaaaa, are you serious???

Philippoussis/Baghdatis/Gonzalez/20-year old Djokovic/Soderling/Murray X2

How many Grand Slams has Federer won against Nadal? And how many has he lost?

Exactly!

Nadal has lost many grand slams he's been in. More than he's won.

duchuy89
05-31-2012, 02:36 AM
Rogie in 3.

Topspindoctor
05-31-2012, 02:36 AM
It'd be funny if it wasn't true :bigcry:


So you can't appreciate an all time great playing amazing tennis for many years? I thought you were a "lover of the game"? :confused:

Mimi
05-31-2012, 02:37 AM
So you can't appreciate an all time great playing amazing tennis for many years? I thought you were a "lover of the game"? :confused:

he is "lover of Roger" only.

Looner
05-31-2012, 02:38 AM
Nadal's game is 2% tennis and 98% asspicking, grunting, hair tucking, bottle arranging and taking time outs at important moments as well as being a two-faced prima donna off court. Yup, I really have no taste.

he is "lover of Roger" only.
Wrong. I was first a Safin and Ferrero fan and hugely admired Federer's game and talent. After watching him for 2-3 years and learning more about him as a person did I start to admire him. I never lost the respect I had for the New Balls generation and similarly never had any respect for Robotic generation of pushers brought forth by RN. Hope this helps.

EDIT: I will now stop responding to people on my ignore list. This means only Mimi's posts count :wavey:.

evilmindbulgaria
05-31-2012, 02:39 AM
So you can't appreciate an all time great playing amazing tennis for many years? I thought you were a "lover of the game"? :confused:

:worship: Looner, just pack up the little dignity you have left and leave, you just got OWNED :wavey:

Do it FOR THE LOVE OF THE GAME :lol:

Mimi
05-31-2012, 02:40 AM
lethal forehand when it is on, accurate passing shots, ability to chase down unretrievable balls, still be able to hit winners in defending positions, these are not tennis?

fast_clay
05-31-2012, 02:41 AM
nadal is above the law

leng jai
05-31-2012, 02:42 AM
Looner could benefit from being less subtle IMO.

Looner
05-31-2012, 02:42 AM
lethal forehand when it is on, accurate passing shots, ability to chase down unretrievable balls, still be able to hit winners in defending positions, these are not tennis?

I really tried at the beginning. He's too much of a cheater. As Ferrero aptly put it today, I prefer to lose to a God rather to win against a monkey. Make of this what you'd like.

Looner could benefit from being less subtle IMO.
It's a flaw I've tried correcting all my life but I could never manage to say what I really like :o.

Mercury
05-31-2012, 03:35 AM
Watching a Nadal game makes me feel I just wasted about 45 minutes of my life watching some dude pulling his underwear out of his ass, touching his ear, then his nose, then his other ear, then his nose again, then grunting like a mad man, then wiping his sweat with a towel. That's porn for 14 year old Spanish girls, not a tennis match.

All this useless time between points sometimes just makes me want to scream MOVE IT ALREADY YA LAZY SPANIARD! This and his lack of personality off court keep me away from actually liking the dude cause he definitely has the game to get me all worked up the right way. I hope that proves you can be a "lover of the game" as TSD so elequently put it without going all mushy for Nadal. Yes TSD, that's possible and it doesn't mean I'm a wack job :P

Slade
05-31-2012, 03:50 AM
Most probably Federer in 3 but maybe Mahut can steal a set if he plays at 92%+ and Federror emerges

Mr. Oracle
05-31-2012, 04:43 AM
Fedtards are funny, Mughut has never gotten passed the 2nd round anywhere and usually goes out in the first. Yeah real tough draw so far,,,

duchuy89
05-31-2012, 05:48 AM
Fighting Rogie.

heya
05-31-2012, 06:10 AM
how dare you upgrade the djokovicsharpshooter to a higher hiercharchy than fedsy chokey?
you are insane moronic haters.

ban anyone who doesn't tout federer and his pigeons for
their "great rivalries".

Jaz
05-31-2012, 07:23 AM
Nadal is the plague for tennis. I've said this plenty of times. My thinking is consistent and logical. Please be gone, evil troll.

:worship: :worship:

This has summed up the thoughts of many Federer fans for years.

Mimi
05-31-2012, 07:40 AM
:worship: :worship:

This has summed up the thoughts of many Federer fans for years.

many federer fans hated rafa for soley one obvious and simple reason: rafa has beaten their idol 18 times. There wouldn't be any plague for tennis explanation for the hatre if Rafa did not have a winning record against the GOAT and "stole" 6 slams from Roger. Rafa is the plague for Roger but not tennis and thats why they hated him.

comesbackatlast
05-31-2012, 08:01 AM
many federer fans hated rafa for soley one obvious and simple reason: rafa has beaten their idol 18 times. There wouldn't be any ugly tennis style explanation for the hatre if Rafa did not have a winning record against the GOAT and "stole" 6 slams from Roger.

They hate him for the same reason many Nadal fans hate Federer; each is too successful (H2H or overall) for them to bear. If one owns the other in both H2H and overall achievements, his fans would deal with the other's like they deal with, say, someone who claims that Wilander is the GOAT. Fervent and even angry debate from both sides indicates that they feel they have a strong argument against them to counter.

Mimi
05-31-2012, 08:08 AM
They hate him for the same reason many Nadal fans hate Federer; each is too successful (H2H or overall) for them to bear. If one owns the other in both H2H and overall achievements, his fans would deal with the other's like they deal with, say, someone who claims that Wilander is the GOAT. Fervent and even angry debate from both sides indicates that they feel they have a strong argument against them to counter.

yes, thats totally understandable, just that i think it would be better that they simply admit this "hating of sucess" honestly instead of using these plage for tennis, ugly playing style excuses. I guess their pride does not allow them to do so as the "ugly mooballer" should not having a winning record against the GOAT.

comesbackatlast
05-31-2012, 08:10 AM
Explaining to Federer's fans why Nadal's fans like him is like explaining to classical music enthusiasts why death metal is good. However, it's not all subjective in tennis (neither in music but more so); it's not difficult for me as a Federer fan to be amazed by Nadal's retrievals or his passing shots, but I don't find his overall game beautiful. Also, there are many other little things, like the time he takes between points or his grunting,...etc.

delpiero7
05-31-2012, 08:19 AM
True. :lol:

Bottomline: The only things that can unsettle Nadal on clay are:
1. Freak match-up + superconfident player (Soderling)
2. New player whom Nadal hasn't figured out

Ergo,
Roger = Draw from Hell
Rafa = Cakewalk draw.

Since Nadal’s first RG title win in 2005, his clay losses have been to Federer (Hamburg 2007, Madrid 2009), JCF (Rome 2008), Soderling (RG 2009), Djokovic (Madrid & Rome 2011) and Verdasco (Madrid 2012).

He had played and beaten all of those players comfortably numerous times before they managed to defeat him on clay, so I certainly wouldn't class any of them as a new player whom Nadal hasn't figured out.

So your theory that Nadal is unsettled by players he has never seen before doesn’t really seem to stand up. You mentioned Bellucci as an example, and he did seem to cause Nadal problems for about a set and a half (despite that Nadal still won the first set), and he was consequently beaten in straight sets and Nadal went on and won the title.

Also, Nadal has played Djokovic more times than any other player. Yet it is he who provides Nadal more difficulty than any other player he has faced.

heya
05-31-2012, 08:29 AM
djoker has wingspan, better fitness and greatness on every surface.

federer can toot his own horn and cry after losses, but
he'll never be a top dog.

Matt01
05-31-2012, 11:56 AM
Looner could benefit from being less subtle IMO.


And this forum would benefit from less Looner IMO.

Looner
05-31-2012, 11:58 AM
Matt, shut up.

yes, thats totally understandable, just that i think it would be better that they simply admit this "hating of sucess" honestly instead of using these plage for tennis, ugly playing style excuses. I guess their pride does not allow them to do so as the "ugly mooballer" should not having a winning record against the GOAT.

BS. I hate Nadal not for his success against RF but for the unfair and cheating ways he uses to win. That sort of puts a stain on all of his achievements.

dencod16
05-31-2012, 12:03 PM
Lol tough draw, thats funny.

Matt01
05-31-2012, 12:13 PM
Matt, shut up.



:inlove:

thehotstuff66
05-31-2012, 12:47 PM
i hate nadal and it has nothing to do with fed and yes, i am a fed fan.

He's a cheater and i dont think he's a very good sport...i dont like the delay in tactics when he's losing, i dont like how much time he take betwen points and games, i dont like the picking out of his butt and the fake humility...i mean you have won so many times on this clay dirt but u are never the favorite in anything, his fakeness just grates with me...

The one good thing i can say about him is i like his fighting spirit but the rest, just am not a fan of his tennis or his antics on court and that's what i hate about him...dont know how he is off the court and dont care and since the tennis side is what i know, that is what i hate.

Thank You!

comesbackatlast
05-31-2012, 12:52 PM
Considering the H2H, there are factors that are sometimes overlooked. I'll try to mention all the arguments to explain it from my point of view:



- Nadal is a better clay courter than Federer. He has more time to run and prepare his shots, and his opponents can't hit through him easily. Federer is very good on clay; he reached 1 SF (05) and 4 Finals (06,07,08,11) at RG to lose to Nadal, plus a title (09) when he wasn't there. If you add 9 other appearances on clay, you find that regarding their 18-10 H2H, 12-2 is the record on clay and 6-8 is the record on other surfaces. The classical argument here goes as this: had Nadal been a better player outside clay to meet Federer in the final rounds more, the H2H would have been different.



- A common logical fallacy is to assume that the GOAT can't have weaknesses. It's a superlative. For examples, John is the best student in this class; he scored 98% while his closest competitor scored 92%. Here, John is the best, but he made mistakes which cost him the 2%. In tennis, every potential GOAT has arguments against him. One wins a grand slam when three were played on (fast?) grass. Had this been the case now, Federer might have had done it, multiple times even. Another candidate never reached the final at RG. A third has a relatively-weak backhand which caused him to have a losing record against his rival (see below). A GOAT simply has more strength/weakness ratio or differential than the others. It's very difficult to calculate and compare, which lead many to deny the concept of the GOAT itself.



- Nadal doesn't have to be a better player than Federer to defeat him, not even on clay; he plays with his left hand to Roger's right. He hits those super topspin balls all day and night till Federer makes the error. He goes for winners many times but so does Federer. He is simply made with the most power against Federer's weakest side. He might be a better player, but he also might not.



- The mental aspect. It's a tough one. Each has displayed signs of strengths and weaknesses in this.

Nadal is usually said to be tougher, which is true if he's on a roll; if he is winning, he gathers momentum and goes on a stampede. But if he starts to have difficult times on court or if he starts to lose, he begins to have doubts and play very defensively. But after the losses, he usually has the "I'll fight" attitude, which may or may not work, because I don't know if he's taking real steps to correct what's wrong, or just wants to fight the same way over and over until he succeeds.

Federer, on the other hand, has those many mental lapses during matches that I'm amazed no one asked him about them (did anybody?). Are they because of boredom, loss of concentration/tiredness/hunger/whatever, is he too old to keep it up for three sets without interruptions? I don't know. He is more resistant to doubts than Nadal (too arrogant to have them often, maybe :p), he is also more willing to improve and adapt than Nadal. He may have folded mentally against Nadal many times before up to RG last year but he seemed more willing to fight till the end in their last three meetings. But these are 3 of 28, his mental problems against Nadal probably had cost him a few of these 18 to say the least.

Another possible aspect is Federer's lack of desire to change his game to take advantage of his opponents weaknesses; for example, hitting to Nadal's backhand himself. It could be called arrogance, but it might also be the fact that playing his game works against practically anybody, so why not so with Nadal? However, he appears more willing to do that now than before.



- Other factors like that Nadal is younger and I think more athletic than Roger, so he is more likely to prevail in ball retrievals and five setters, or that Nadal takes a lot of time between points so he might, intentionally or not, disrupt his opponent's rhythm.



Any thoughts?

tribalfusion
05-31-2012, 02:28 PM
i hate nadal and it has nothing to do with fed and yes, i am a fed fan.

You could have stopped here.

tribalfusion
05-31-2012, 02:29 PM
- Other factors like that Nadal is younger and I think more athletic than Roger, so he is more likely to prevail in ball retrievals and five setters, or that Nadal takes a lot of time between points so he might, intentionally or not, disrupt his opponent's rhythm.



Any thoughts?

Nadal is younger, theoretically an advantage now but that was then obviously theoretically a disadvantage when Nadal was a teen or in his early 20s.

Can't have it both ways

comesbackatlast
05-31-2012, 03:10 PM
Nadal is younger, theoretically an advantage now but that was then obviously theoretically a disadvantage when Nadal was a teen or in his early 20s.

Can't have it both ways

18-year-old Nadal (December 2004):


http://www.theage.com.au/ffximage/2004/12/04/nadal_narrowweb__200x286.jpg
From: The Age. (http://www.theage.com.au/news/Tennis/Nadal-nails-Roddick-in-Davis-Cup/2004/12/04/1101923369886.html)

tribalfusion
05-31-2012, 06:12 PM
18-year-old Nadal (December 2004):


http://www.theage.com.au/ffximage/2004/12/04/nadal_narrowweb__200x286.jpg
From: The Age. (http://www.theage.com.au/news/Tennis/Nadal-nails-Roddick-in-Davis-Cup/2004/12/04/1101923369886.html)

And your point is?

rocketassist
05-31-2012, 06:14 PM
You could have stopped here.

Yeah there's zero reasons to dislike him AT ALL. None whatsoever.

Just admit you're a tard and biased. It's not hard. Quit the phony objectivity.

tribalfusion
05-31-2012, 06:20 PM
Yeah there's zero reasons to dislike him AT ALL. None whatsoever.

Just admit you're a tard and biased. It's not hard. Quit the phony objectivity.

A tard and biased? This is coming from an "unbiased" source who can't quit complaining every 2 seconds about Nadal and modern tennis.

I don't pretend to be "objective" in some metaphysical sense, I simply don't follow players droning on with a laundry list of silly complaints ad infinitum like you and some others here.

To "hate" a player you have never met who plays a GAME requires some personal issues.

To be a Federer fan and to "hate" his main rival and claim that the 2 things are unrelated strains credulity.

You should know a lot about straining credulity by now as you have had a lot of practice.

rocketassist
05-31-2012, 06:26 PM
A tard and biased? This is coming from an "unbiased" source who can't quit complaining every 2 seconds about Nadal and modern tennis.

I don't pretend to be "objective" in some metaphysical sense, I simply don't follow players droning on with a laundry list of silly complaints ad infinitum like you and some others here.

To "hate" a player you have never met who plays a GAME requires some personal issues.

To be a Federer fan and to "hate" his main rival and claim that the 2 things are unrelated strains credulity.

You should know a lot about straining credulity by now as you have had a lot of practice.

I'm unbiased enough not to hype my own favourite players nor do I care about their haters anyway.

Fireballer
05-31-2012, 06:39 PM
I'm unbiased enough not to hype my own favourite players nor do I care about their haters anyway.

you are very biased man :cool:

tribalfusion
05-31-2012, 06:47 PM
I'm unbiased enough not to hype my own favourite players nor do I care about their haters anyway.

I don't "hype" Nadal; he is one of the greats whatever I do or don't say about him. You just disagree with my assessment and so resort to calling me a "tard".

On the other hand, you not only hate Nadal, you drone on incessantly about the "modern" game without having even seen anything else.

rocketassist
05-31-2012, 06:51 PM
I don't "hype" Nadal; he is one of the greats whatever I do or don't say about him. You just disagree with my assessment and so resort to calling me a "tard".

On the other hand, you not only hate Nadal, you drone on incessantly about the "modern" game without having even seen anything else.

No, you're a tard because you won't have a bad word said about him.

I don't hate him as a person either.

Kiedis
05-31-2012, 07:00 PM
I don't "hype" Nadal; he is one of the greats whatever I do or don't say about him. You just disagree with my assessment and so resort to calling me a "tard".

On the other hand, you not only hate Nadal, you drone on incessantly about the "modern" game without having even seen anything else.

You're being too hard on him, mate. After all he is a Murray tard. We all should feel pity for him.

What think our friend about Muzza being the greatest Rafatard ever?

rocketassist
05-31-2012, 07:07 PM
You're being too hard on him, mate. After all he is a Murray tard. We all should feel pity for him.

What think our friend about Muzza being the greatest Rafatard ever?

Not the tiniest bit arsed.

born_on_clay
05-31-2012, 07:26 PM
and Kubot in round 4 ?
this is really the draw from hell :o

tribalfusion
05-31-2012, 07:27 PM
You're being too hard on him, mate. After all he is a Murray tard. We all should feel pity for him.

What think our friend about Muzza being the greatest Rafatard ever?

You have a point. I think Rocketassist is slowly deteriorating as a result.

I actually like Murray myself and would love to see him do well ironically.

comesbackatlast
05-31-2012, 07:31 PM
And your point is?

... that he has been physically advantaged since a relatively-young age. Look at his left arm in the picture. He was already peaking or at least at a high point physically when Federer was in his mid twenties. When Nadal starts/started to decline physically, Federer will have had/had had already declined significantly.

Commander Data
05-31-2012, 07:32 PM
and Kubot in round 4 ?
this is really the draw from hell :o

Almost as deadly as Nadals :hug:

born_on_clay
05-31-2012, 07:45 PM
Almost as deadly as Nadals :hug:

Monaco / Raonic > Goffin / Kubot any day :wavey:

Commander Data
05-31-2012, 07:50 PM
Monaco / Raonic > Goffin / Kubot any day :wavey:

Draw does not consist solely of R4 :wavey:

tribalfusion
05-31-2012, 09:35 PM
... that he has been physically advantaged since a relatively-young age. Look at his left arm in the picture. He was already peaking or at least at a high point physically when Federer was in his mid twenties. When Nadal starts/started to decline physically, Federer will have had/had had already declined significantly.

Um...just no.

Nadal from 2008 onwards is clearly a better player when not injured than he was when he was a kid.

Sure he had muscles but unless you think tennis is a function of biceps, that's largely irrelevant.

He has smaller arms now than then but is a better player than in 2006 clearly.

rocketassist
05-31-2012, 09:38 PM
You have a point. I think Rocketassist is slowly deteriorating as a result.

I actually like Murray myself and would love to see him do well ironically.

Deteriorating in what way?

JediFed
05-31-2012, 09:55 PM
Other factors like that Nadal is younger and I think more athletic than Roger, so he is more likely to prevail in ball retrievals and five setters, or that Nadal takes a lot of time between points so he might, intentionally or not, disrupt his opponent's rhythm.


Lendl is to Borg as Nadal is to Federer. Federer's rivals were Hewitt, Roddick, Safin, JCF, Haas, Nalbandian etc. He has a winning record against everyone of his generation.

Nadal is simply younger than Federer - end of story. Is Nadal a fabulous player? Sure. Does that make Lendl necessarily better than Borg? No. Does having a losing record vs one player younger than you, indicate that the younger player is superior? No.

I could see the concern if he had a negative head to head vs Nalbandian and Hewitt, but that's not been the case in some time. The only record still held by his peers is the total wins on Grass, with Hewitt at 105 and Roger at 102 wins. Fed's only 14 shy of the big three on Grass - Connors, McEnroe and Becker. It's still possible for Legs to be the winningest ever Aussie on the Grass.

Singularity
05-31-2012, 10:01 PM
Um...just no.

Nadal from 2008 onwards is clearly a better player when not injured than he was when he was a kid.

Sure he had muscles but unless you think tennis is a function of biceps, that's largely irrelevant.

He has smaller arms now than then but is a better player than in 2006 clearly.
The question isn't whether he was a better player. The question is whether he was as athletic in 2006 as he was in 2008. The debate is whether Federer ever had a physical advantage over Nadal.

comesbackatlast
05-31-2012, 10:08 PM
Um...just no.

Nadal from 2008 onwards is clearly a better player when not injured than he was when he was a kid.

Sure he had muscles but unless you think tennis is a function of biceps, that's largely irrelevant.

He has smaller arms now than then but is a better player than in 2006 clearly.

You quoted my last paragraph in which I put physical factors among the miscellany. Don't make it sound as if I am saying that "tennis is a function of biceps". I also hardly discussed who the better player is; I simply looked into some of the possible causes of the way the H2H is, which can explain much without resorting to more subjective analysis (barring the mental aspect, which I think I dealt with a bit objectively). Could Nadal be the better player from 2008 onwards? Possible. Am I discussing it? No.

henke007
05-31-2012, 10:09 PM
Nadal's tough draw continues R3 vs Schwank or if you'd like R1-R6 Bye

buzz
05-31-2012, 10:15 PM
I could see the concern if he had a negative head to head vs Nalbandian and Hewitt, but that's not been the case in some time. The only record still held by his peers is the total wins on Grass, with Hewitt at 105 and Roger at 102 wins. Fed's only 14 shy of the big three on Grass - Connors, McEnroe and Becker. It's still possible for Legs to be the winningest ever Aussie on the Grass.

Are USO on grass included here? Conners should have a bigger margin than 14 over Federer?

tangerine_dream
05-31-2012, 10:16 PM
Hold me, Looner. I'm scared for Rogie :bigcry:

tribalfusion
05-31-2012, 10:35 PM
The question isn't whether he was a better player. The question is whether he was as athletic in 2006 as he was in 2008. The debate is whether Federer ever had a physical advantage over Nadal.

No, a young player and an older player have different strengths. Experience, aura, tactical intelligence and savvy as well as just better skills on other surfaces.

It's amazing that fans of Roger will argue he wasn't in his prime even at 26 yet Nadal was in his prime at 18 or 19 because he was a physical specimen.

Prime isn't just how thick your arms are.

Singularity
05-31-2012, 10:40 PM
No, a young player and an older player have different strengths. Experience, aura, tactical intelligence and savvy as well as just better skills on other surfaces.
Where was this denied anywhere?

It's amazing that fans of Roger will argue he wasn't in his prime even at 26 yet Nadal was in his prime at 18 or 19 because he was a physical specimen.
Not me. And this isn't a discussion about primes anyway (frankly I think we should strike that word from discussions, because it just serves to confuse the issue).

Roamed
05-31-2012, 10:58 PM
Personally I'd take Bolelli>Istomin>Schwank>Raonic>Tipsarevic>Ferrer over Kamke>Ungur>Mahut>Kubot>Berdych>Djokovic

Can't wait for the match tomorrow! I love Mahut.

JurajCrane
05-31-2012, 11:02 PM
I would like to see Klizan against Fed, but unfortunately Martin probably wouldn´t give Fed trouble in his health condition right now.

Mahut is ok as a 3rd round opponent. Same as Goffin/Kubot in 4th. I am worried about QF - after 4 relative easy matches Berdych or Del Potro. Ladies has Tipsy or Almagro :)

Looner
05-31-2012, 11:08 PM
Hold me, Looner. I'm scared for Rogie :bigcry:

I know, right? You can sit on that electric chair over in the corner there :wavey:.

I'm only joking mods

tripwires
06-01-2012, 03:03 AM
I would like to see Klizan against Fed, but unfortunately Martin probably wouldn´t give Fed trouble in his health condition right now.

Mahut is ok as a 3rd round opponent. Same as Goffin/Kubot in 4th. I am worried about QF - after 4 relative easy matches Berdych or Del Potro. Ladies has Tipsy or Almagro :)

That explains why he's fooled around in his first two matches - he needs more match practice. :awww: I expect him to drop a set to Mahut today.

duchuy89
06-01-2012, 03:13 AM
Rogie in 3.

Sophocles
06-01-2012, 10:57 AM
Mahut gave peak Fed his toughest match at 2006 Wimbledon before the final, but even that was straight sets, and while Fed isn't what he was then, I don't suppose Mahut is either. Plus this is clay. Having said that, Fed's return can be iffy on this surface, so Mahut will probably hold serve more often than not. I'd expect 6-4,7-6,7-5 unless Roger's form dramatically improves.

RIboy
06-01-2012, 11:03 AM
the draw is getting tougher and tougher....Berdych is hopeless against Anderson aka "The Pink Clay God", Delpo is crippled...can't wait for the hair-raising QF showdown w/ Mugrin Sillych- really the toughest draw EVER

leng jai
06-01-2012, 11:04 AM
Rogie in 3.

There's no e in Rogi dear.

Deathless Mortal
06-01-2012, 11:08 AM
the draw is getting tougher and tougher....Berdych is hopeless against Anderson aka "The Pink Clay God", Delpo is crippled...can't wait for the hair-raising QF showdown w/ Mugrin Sillych- really the toughest draw EVER

:haha: you made a WWW thread about the Del Potro-Cilic match with no Cilic to win option and now you're predicting him for the QF. :stupid:

RIboy
06-01-2012, 11:15 AM
:haha: you made a WWW thread about the Del Potro-Cilic match with no Cilic to win option and now you're predicting him for the QF. :stupid:

made that thread just for you and daddy, but seriously we all know Delpo can't play tennis and if Mugrin doesn't hit more than 65 homeruns will be a routine...

EliSter
06-01-2012, 11:20 AM
Lol if ClayPinkGoat Anderson beats Berdick, Olderer will have the easiest draw i have ever seen in GS :o Even Nadull one from USO 2010 will look like titants draw :lol:

Looner
06-01-2012, 11:21 AM
Lol if ClayPinkGoat Anderson beats Berdick, Olderer will have the easiest draw i have ever seen in GS :o Even Nadull one from USO 2010 will look like titants draw :lol:

They've only been 10 GSs since 2010 so I am not surprised this is the easiet you would have seen :shrug:.

EliSter
06-01-2012, 11:23 AM
They've only been 10 GSs since 2010 so I am not surprised this is the easiet you would have seen :shrug:.

Im watching constantly tennis for 12 years now :shrug: Nadull 2010 was peice of cake, but Olderers atm its even easier :lol: And all the complains Fedtrads had on draw at start :worship:

Sophocles
06-01-2012, 11:49 AM
Lol if ClayPinkGoat Anderson beats Berdick, Olderer will have the easiest draw i have ever seen in GS :o Even Nadull one from USO 2010 will look like titants draw :lol:

Don't forget Nadull had a washed-up Youzhny in the semis. Fed will have Djoker and will probably be destroyed if he hasn't played any good ralleyers before then.

Looner
06-01-2012, 11:59 AM
Don't forget Nadull had a washed-up Youzhny in the semis. Fed will have Djoker and will probably be destroyed if he hasn't played any good ralleyers before then.

Now, now, stop with your logic. It's bothering me at MTF.

duarte_a
06-01-2012, 12:35 PM
All this talk and berdych will probably win his match and meet Roger in the quarters.... :o

christallh24
06-01-2012, 12:42 PM
Good Luck, Nicolaus! If Ungur can get a set, so, maybe, can you! But, I won't hold my breath. Congrats on your 2 FO, Roger! :wavey:

rocketassist
06-01-2012, 01:54 PM
They've only been 10 GSs since 2010 so I am not surprised this is the easiet you would have seen :shrug:.

Rafito's AO 08 draw was the easiest I've ever seen.

R1 Troicki (!)
R2 Serra (!!!!!)
R3 Simon ( :lol: )
R4 Mathieu (injury retirement)
QF Nieminen (tough QF opponent :rolls: )
SF Tsonga (thank god he blitzed him)

Fireballer
06-01-2012, 02:11 PM
Rafito's AO 08 draw was the easiest I've ever seen.

R1 Troicki (!)
R2 Serra (!!!!!)
R3 Simon ( :lol: )
R4 Mathieu (injury retirement)
QF Nieminen (tough QF opponent :rolls: )
SF Tsonga (thank god he blitzed him)

what do you think.If Nadal had beaten Tsonga that year would Djoker win that GS?

RIboy
06-01-2012, 02:24 PM
when we talk about joke draws:

2003 Wimbledon: Lee, Koubek, Fish, Lopez, Schalken, Roddick, Philippoussis :rolleyes:
2004 AO: Bogomolov, Morrison, Reid, Hewitt, Nalbandian, JCF, Safin
2004 Wimbledon: Bogdanovic, Falla, Johansson, Karlovic, Hewitt, Grosjean, Roddick
2004 USO: Costa, Baghdatis, Santoro, Pavel, Agassi, Henman, Hewitt
2005 Wimbledon: PHM, Minar, Kiefer, JCF, Gonzalez, Hewitt, Roddick
2005 USO: Minar, Santoro, Rochus, Kiefer, Nalbandian, Hewitt, Agassi
2006 AO: Istomin, Mayer, Mirnyi, Haas, Davydenko, Kiefer, Baghdatis :rolleyes:

Peak of the weak era, even Murray would easily win all this GS's these days...

TigerTim
06-01-2012, 02:30 PM
when we talk about joke draws:
2004 USO: Costa, Baghdatis, Santoro, Pavel, Agassi, Henman, Hewitt


any draw with Henman in the semi's is a tough draw, just ask Pistol pete

BlueSwan
06-01-2012, 02:32 PM
2004 AO: Bogomolov, Morrison, Reid, Hewitt, Nalbandian, JCF, Safin

Ehhh....Hewitt, Nalbandian, Ferrero, Safin. That was a tremendously tough draw in 2004. Three former #1's and one immensely talented player who at the time still had a positive H2H with Federer.

RIboy
06-01-2012, 02:32 PM
any draw with Henman in the semi's is a tough draw, just ask Pistol pete

sure, GS semis were always Tiger Tim's favorite matches...

Commander Data
06-01-2012, 02:33 PM
when we talk about joke draws:

2003 Wimbledon: Lee, Koubek, Fish, Lopez, Schalken, Roddick, Philippoussis :rolleyes:
2004 AO: Bogomolov, Morrison, Reid, Hewitt, Nalbandian, JCF, Safin
2004 Wimbledon: Bogdanovic, Falla, Johansson, Karlovic, Hewitt, Grosjean, Roddick
2004 USO: Costa, Baghdatis, Santoro, Pavel, Agassi, Henman, Hewitt
2005 Wimbledon: PHM, Minar, Kiefer, JCF, Gonzalez, Hewitt, Roddick
2005 USO: Minar, Santoro, Rochus, Kiefer, Nalbandian, Hewitt, Agassi
2006 AO: Istomin, Mayer, Mirnyi, Haas, Davydenko, Kiefer, Baghdatis :rolleyes:

Peak of the weak era, even Murray would easily win all this GS's these days...

:stupid: these players at their peak were much less a joke then some top ten now.

rocketassist
06-01-2012, 02:51 PM
what do you think.If Nadal had beaten Tsonga that year would Djoker win that GS?

Dunno but it would have been tougher than facing GS virgin Tsonga. It's a tough call.

rocketassist
06-01-2012, 02:52 PM
:stupid: these players at their peak were much less a joke then some top ten now.

Most of them are better than 4 and below.

viruzzz
06-01-2012, 02:55 PM
Why someone bother making a thread of someone he hates?

RIboy
06-01-2012, 02:56 PM
:stupid: these players at their peak were much less a joke then some top ten now.

why is Philippoussis bolded? :facepalm:

rocketassist
06-01-2012, 02:57 PM
why is Philippoussis bolded? :facepalm:

Because he was a great grass court player on quicker grass?

Fumus
06-01-2012, 03:00 PM
Because he was a great grass court player on quicker grass?

I don't think the grass was quicker when he made the finals in 2003.

Sophocles
06-01-2012, 03:09 PM
when we talk about joke draws:

2003 Wimbledon: Lee, Koubek, Fish, Lopez, Schalken, Roddick, Philippoussis :rolleyes:
2004 AO: Bogomolov, Morrison, Reid, Hewitt, Nalbandian, JCF, Safin
2004 Wimbledon: Bogdanovic, Falla, Johansson, Karlovic, Hewitt, Grosjean, Roddick
2004 USO: Costa, Baghdatis, Santoro, Pavel, Agassi, Henman, Hewitt
2005 Wimbledon: PHM, Minar, Kiefer, JCF, Gonzalez, Hewitt, Roddick
2005 USO: Minar, Santoro, Rochus, Kiefer, Nalbandian, Hewitt, Agassi
2006 AO: Istomin, Mayer, Mirnyi, Haas, Davydenko, Kiefer, Baghdatis :rolleyes:

Peak of the weak era, even Murray would easily win all this GS's these days...

Is this post a joke? You can't meet Top 10 players in early rounds you dipshit.

All the bolded draws are tough draws. Ironically it was at the 2006 A.O. that Federer struggled most.

tripwires
06-01-2012, 03:15 PM
Is this post a joke? You can't meet Top 10 players in early rounds you dipshit.

All the bolded draws are tough draws. Ironically it was at the 2006 A.O. that Federer struggled most.

Oh my god I can't stop laughing. :haha: You tell him, Sophy.

rocketassist
06-01-2012, 03:41 PM
I don't think the grass was quicker when he made the finals in 2003.

than today?

soJ_FVnijAw

This suggests it was quicker than 08.

Telegram Sam
06-01-2012, 03:52 PM
It would be really amazing if Mahut would defeat this queerbot, but it's highly unlikely. Miss Prissy is tough to beat.

Oh well. Someone will do it. Tomaš? Let's hope.

juan27
06-01-2012, 04:14 PM
djoker has wingspan, better fitness and greatness on every surface.

federer can toot his own horn and cry after losses, but
he'll never be a top dog.

federer is not a top dog????

this heya is a joke......

riboy , murray winning slams against the bests hewitt , safin , federer and roddick???? jajaja no way!!! even a past peak roddick in his home was capable to defeated murray , roddick of 2003-2006 in wimbledon can destroy murray perfectly.....

guys like hewitt or safin too , these guys not scared in slam finals like murray....even agassi with 35 years old was more dangerous in slams than murray!!! nalbandian in that years was capable to defeat everybody too