Who's Better - Berdych or Ferrer? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Who's Better - Berdych or Ferrer?

Certinfy
05-17-2012, 09:55 PM
Had to be done.

viruzzz
05-17-2012, 09:56 PM
In this world of sucess... We have to sadly agree that M1000 > Not M1000.

Berdych.

reery
05-17-2012, 09:57 PM
Wimbledon finalist.

sexybeast
05-17-2012, 09:57 PM
Berdych got a slam final, M1000 and can actually beat all top players when he is on his game.

Berdych is better.

Mark Lenders
05-17-2012, 09:58 PM
Ferrer. He won Acapulco and Buenos Aires.

Ben.
05-17-2012, 09:59 PM
Mark Lenders has really brought out your inner Ferrer hater, huh?

stanch
05-17-2012, 10:00 PM
Berdych, but it's quite close.

Orka_n
05-17-2012, 10:01 PM
At peak level it's Berdych without the shadow of a doubt, and everyone knows it.

I feel that the purpose of this thread is to invite people to talk trash bout Ferrer again, which is pathetic. The guy has a limited game but he has perfected it with hard work and made it more solid than almost all other top tenners. He is a youngster-killer, and has been fighting in the top 10 for years. Only morons disrespect him.

asmazif
05-17-2012, 10:02 PM
Close career-wise, though Berd has 4 years in which to achieve

sexybeast
05-17-2012, 10:03 PM
One question I have in mind is if Ferrer ever peaked?

Certinfy
05-17-2012, 10:04 PM
Mark Lenders has really brought out your inner Ferrer hater, huh?
He made me accept my true feelings and help me share them to others. :) For that I think him very much. :awww:

Orka_n
05-17-2012, 10:05 PM
He made me accept my true feelings and help me share them to others. :) For that I think him very much. :awww:Pathetic.

Certinfy
05-17-2012, 10:06 PM
By the way I didn't make this to bash Ferrer. Just made it because the Tsonga - Ferrer poll was quite close.

emotion
05-17-2012, 10:07 PM
Wow,didn't expect to be such a minority
Usually best indicator is prize money, and Ferru leads there

Mark Lenders
05-17-2012, 10:07 PM
He made me accept my true feelings and help me share them to others. :) For that I think him very much. :awww:

You're welcome, man. Always glad to be of help :D

v-money
05-17-2012, 10:07 PM
Pretty close:

Berdych: 7 career titles (out of 14 finals), 1 GS Final at Wimbledon, 1 Masters title, 2 more Masters finals, QF at AO, SF at RG, 4R at USO, SF at WTF, career high rank of 6.
Ferrer: 14 career titles (out of 29 finals), 0 GS Finals, 0 Masters titles, 3 Masters finals, SF at AO, QF at RG, 4R at Wimbledon, SF at USO, Final at WTF, career high rank of 4.

I say slight edge to Berdych because of the Wimbledon final and because of who he beat to get there. Although Ferrer does have some achievements on him like the number of titles and a WTF final.

Ben.
05-17-2012, 10:08 PM
At peak level it's Berdych without the shadow of a doubt, and everyone knows it.

I feel that the purpose of this thread is to invite people to talk trash bout Ferrer again, which is pathetic. The guy has a limited game but he has perfected it with hard work and made it more solid than almost all other top tenners. He is a youngster-killer, and has been fighting in the top 10 for years. Only morons disrespect him.

This. The guy is a model professional and one of the hardest workers in the sport. You can never accuse him of not giving 100% or ever say he didn't achieve all he could.

Certinfy
05-17-2012, 10:11 PM
You're welcome, man. Always glad to be of help :D
No worries mate. We really should go to a Ferrer match together sometime though, no?

Mercury
05-17-2012, 10:12 PM
At peak level it's Berdych without the shadow of a doubt, and everyone knows it.

I feel that the purpose of this thread is to invite people to talk trash bout Ferrer again, which is pathetic. The guy has a limited game but he has perfected it with hard work and made it more solid than almost all other top tenners. He is a youngster-killer, and has been fighting in the top 10 for years. Only morons disrespect him.
That. I don't get the Ferrer bashing in this forum. The guy gives his heart out every time he's out there and granted he may not be as talented or diverse as most of the top 10 but what he can do he does at the highest level and he put a lot of sweat into it.

I have nothing against him, unlike players like Stepanek who makes me want to throw some clay in his eyes and chase him down the court with that clay straightening thing.

Ben.
05-17-2012, 10:12 PM
He made me accept my true feelings and help me share them to others. For that I think him very much.

You're welcome, man. Always glad to be of help :D

Kindred spirits. How touching.

Seriously though, I can fully accept you dislike his game or think he has overachieved. I just don't understand why that would boil your blood so much.

The only thing I can think is it's because he had been ranked ahead of your favourite players and thus taking the spotlight off them.

Mark Lenders
05-17-2012, 10:14 PM
No worries mate. We really should go to a Ferrer match together sometime though, no?

Sure. But you're paying for tickets. Maybe World Tour Finals, if Ferrer happens to fluke another top 8 finish?

ossie
05-17-2012, 10:14 PM
berdych and tsonga may not be as consistent as ferrer but they have shown to have the game to be able to beat the top 4 in slams which makes them better in my book.

Certinfy
05-17-2012, 10:14 PM
Sure. But you're paying for tickets. Maybe World Tour Finals, if Ferrer happens to fluke another top 8 finish?
Right there mate. Was at his match against Djokovic there last year and I admit he played well, lets hope he doesn't do the same this time around.

Ben.
05-17-2012, 10:16 PM
Right there mate. Was at his match against Djokovic there last year and I admit he played well, lets hope he doesn't do the same this time around.

:lol: I was there too. The whole place was screaming for him :cool: Except you it seems :armed:

Certinfy
05-17-2012, 10:17 PM
:lol: I was there too. The whole place was screaming for him :cool: Except you it seems :armed:
Obviously. Had Djokovic won it would have made Berdych's route to making the semi's less complicated.

Orka_n
05-17-2012, 10:18 PM
Kindred spirits. How touching.

Seriously though, I can fully accept you dislike his game or think he has overachieved. I just don't understand why that would boil your blood so much.

The only thing I can think is it's because he had been ranked ahead of your favourite players and thus taking the spotlight off them.Hit the nail on the head. Btw, that's the thing I find most confusing, how can people hate him for being overestimated when no one ever mentions him as a title contender? He is also one of the most humble guys out there.

Mark Lenders
05-17-2012, 10:21 PM
Right there mate. Was at his match against Djokovic there last year and I admit he played well, lets hope he doesn't do the same this time around.

Nah it will be more like 2010 where he can't even take a set. We'll be there to boo him if he starts hitting some fluke shots :D

Ben.
05-17-2012, 10:24 PM
Nah it will be more like 2010 where he can't even take a set. We'll be there to boo him if he starts hitting some fluke shots :D

Boo all you like. No one will hear you :p

Nole Rules
05-17-2012, 10:25 PM
Ability-wise/Talent: Berdych >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ferrer.
Ferrer doesn't have MS title and a slam final unlike Tomas. Berdych wins easily here.

JoWillyTso
05-17-2012, 10:27 PM
This. The guy is a model professional and one of the hardest workers in the sport. You can never accuse him of not giving 100% or ever say he didn't achieve all he could.

Exactly. Ferrer has squeezed every last bit of success out of his limited talents. When he retires he will have no regrets because he worked his socks off to acheive what he has.

Certinfy
05-17-2012, 10:27 PM
Boo all you like. No one will hear you :p
We'll make sure to do it so loud all you MTFers watching on TV will know it's us. :D

Nole Rules
05-17-2012, 10:29 PM
And why the Ferrer/Tsonga poll was close and this isn't? What's the damn difference between Tsonga and Berdych? MTF doesn't make sense. Tsonga/Ferrer poll shouldn't be close in the 1st place.

Certinfy
05-17-2012, 10:30 PM
And why the Ferrer/Tsonga poll was close and this isn't? What's the damn difference between Tsonga and Berdych? MTF doesn't make sense. Tsonga/Ferrer shouldn't be close in the 1st place.
Exactly. Was thinking the exact same thing.

Mark Lenders
05-17-2012, 10:37 PM
We'll make sure to do it so loud all you MTFers watching on TV will know it's us. :D

This. No worries though, he will surely not do anything worthwhile anyway. Hopefully won't even make it to the WTF.

rocketassist
05-17-2012, 10:39 PM
Berdych has the better career full stop. A TMS and slam final.

Mark Lenders
05-17-2012, 10:39 PM
And why the Ferrer/Tsonga poll was close and this isn't? What's the damn difference between Tsonga and Berdych? MTF doesn't make sense. Tsonga/Ferrer poll shouldn't be close in the 1st place.

Exactly.

If anything, Tsonga is better than Berdych. MTF is a strange place indeed.

unforcedterror
05-17-2012, 10:50 PM
That's not fair Jason, I like them both. :lol:

Consistency-wise, Ferrer's your guy. Barring an upset, he will usually, quietly make his way through the tournament.
However, when it comes to pure talent and ball-striking prowess and just who is a joy to watch and whose game when on can beat anyone, then it has to be Tomas all the way. I agree, a MS1000 + Slam final will trump Ferru any day, especially since Tomas' Wim10 run consisted of him winning over both Fed and Novak.

So, my answer is Tomas. :wavey:

Mark Lenders
05-17-2012, 11:15 PM
I love these threads of yours, Jason. Especially the Tsonga one, timing couldn't have been better there if you know what I mean :D Who knew Ferrer's mugginess could actually serve a purpose :)

These threads player x vs Ferrer are just legendary :D

Certinfy
05-17-2012, 11:21 PM
That's not fair Jason, I like them both. :lol:

Consistency-wise, Ferrer's your guy. Barring an upset, he will usually, quietly make his way through the tournament.
However, when it comes to pure talent and ball-striking prowess and just who is a joy to watch and whose game when on can beat anyone, then it has to be Tomas all the way. I agree, a MS1000 + Slam final will trump Ferru any day, especially since Tomas' Wim10 run consisted of him winning over both Fed and Novak.

So, my answer is Tomas. :wavey:
:worship: I knew there was a reason I loved you. :) Very fair analysis I must say.

I love these threads of yours, Jason. Especially the Tsonga one, timing couldn't have been better there if you know what I mean :D Who knew Ferrer's mugginess could actually serve a purpose :)

These threads player x vs Ferrer are just legendary :D:D They are, no idea who to go with next though...

BauerAlmeida
05-17-2012, 11:21 PM
I honestly don't get the Ferrer hate. He is one of the nicest guys on tour and the most hard-working.

Mark Lenders
05-17-2012, 11:24 PM
:D They are, no idea who to go with next though...

Oh I do have a few ideas. Will tell you not on here though, that'd be giving it away :D

Mountaindewslave
05-17-2012, 11:26 PM
Berdych is better by far, he is consistantly a huge threat. Ferrer is great and probably more of a fighter but he just can't hit a big ball like Berdych can. not to mention Berdych has improved so many facets of his game and actually moves fairly ok nowadays. besides fighting spirit and speed Ferrer does everything worse

Certinfy
05-17-2012, 11:29 PM
Oh I do have a few ideas. Will tell you not on here though, that'd be giving it away :D
Can't wait to hear them, would love for Ferrer to lose another poll. :o

Voo de Mar
05-17-2012, 11:38 PM
IMO Berdych and Tsonga have a potential to win one Grand Slam tournament, Pics hasn't.

acionescu
05-18-2012, 07:32 AM
Berdych. And this coming from a Ferrer fan.

FerrersLinda
05-18-2012, 11:48 AM
I hate these "who is better" threads, because it's so hard to compare when it comes to closely ranked players.

Obviously I'm a Ferrer fan but I like Birdman too. I'd say Birdie is a more naturally gifted player than Ferrer. Ferrer on the other hand is such a hard worker and fighter and has made the absolute most of his somewhat more limited talent.

Yes Tomas has a slam final and a MS1000 but Ferrer has been a top ten player for a much longer time. Sooooooo ......... :shrug:

FerrersLinda
05-18-2012, 12:14 PM
Does Berdych really have better results in slams? Apart from the Wimby final I believe he got knocked out of slams around the some round as Ferrer usually gets beaten. And I think overall Ferrers slam results are actually better. But I could be wrong.

FerrersLinda
05-18-2012, 12:22 PM
:rolleyes:So MC is now a MM tourney?:eek::cuckoo:

king David
05-18-2012, 12:40 PM
Berdych won a MS, not Ferru

henke007
05-18-2012, 12:49 PM
:rolleyes:So MC is now a MM tourney?:eek::cuckoo:

Its the lamest Masters tourney the last years with about half the top 20 not playing and 4-5 in the top 10 not playing was a bit better this year but not much. Players like Ferrer and Verdasco played finals when Players like Djokovic,Murray, Delpo, Soda in good form did not play..

FerrersLinda
05-18-2012, 12:54 PM
Berdych won a MS, not Ferru

True. There you have it. The thread can be closed now. Berdych is better.:):p

Federer in 2
05-18-2012, 01:00 PM
Pretty equal. Solid world #5-6. (Not Tsonga).

If I had to choose one, I'd give the edge to Ferrer.

henke007
05-18-2012, 01:05 PM
Ferrer will get 360 P this week though and Bird just 180 and that's also the story of Ferrer often gets good Draws and openings, Rafa injured at Ao the other year for Ex etc..

He is a nice guy and all though but i prefer Berdych Tennis over Ferrer's.

FerrersLinda
05-18-2012, 01:13 PM
Its the lamest Masters tourney the last years with about half the top 20 not playing and 4-5 in the top 10 not playing was a bit better this year but not much. Players like Ferrer and Verdasco played finals when Players like Djokovic,Murray, Delpo, Soda in good form did not play..

I don't agree. It's a M1000 and players not showing up doesn't mean it's a crappy ass tourney. The best have been there every year. It has history.

Players "like Ferrer and Verdasco" may have had more success in MC than Berdych when the top guys weren't around, but I do believe that Tomy B. got beat in MC by such very greats like Ljubo, that same Verdasco and THE Fognini.

FerrersLinda
05-18-2012, 01:18 PM
Ferrer will get 360 P this week though and Bird just 180 and that's also the story of Ferrer often gets good Draws and openings, Rafa injured at Ao the other year for Ex etc..

He is a nice guy and all though but i prefer Berdych Tennis over Ferrer's.

Oh give me a break with the whole Ferrer gets better draws and openings bs. You don't like Ferrer and that's fine. And you prefer Berdych's tennis which I also thoroughly enjoy. Fact is, it's hard to say who is the better player. They play different styles but have very close results and therefor ranking.

And that's it for me. Like I said in my first post, I don't actually like these comparison threads, so what the hell am I doing here.

Adios!

Fireballer
05-18-2012, 01:46 PM
Berdych has the better career full stop. A TMS and slam final.

and yet that is not the question

luie
05-18-2012, 04:12 PM
Ferrer IMO is the better player physically and mentally, while berdych is the more talented of the 2. The rankings , and h2h head with the top 4 is close , slams results are close career wise because of the final at Wimby for berdych gives him the edge.
I would still rank ferrer ahead of Birdshit because he is Nadulls bitchboy . Despite having the game to trouble nadull.
Ferrer is Feds bitch but he doesn't have the game to trouble fed.
Birdshit is an absolute waste of time and he and certinfy should retire immediately for tennis to move forward.

buzz
05-18-2012, 04:18 PM
Ferrer is more consistent, Berdych when on more dangerous, also more likely to win something big.

henke007
05-18-2012, 04:21 PM
Berdych is hardly inconsistent.

Berdych is by far the better player overall and on every surface.

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 04:23 PM
Berdych is hardly inconsistent.

Berdych is by far the better player overall and on every surface.

This, he's even better than Ferrer on clay.

Really, there's no contest here. You just need to watch them both play to realize who the more talented and dangerous player is.

luie
05-18-2012, 04:26 PM
Birdshit will win something yea right. The only title he won of worth is Paris 2006 and in those days fed n nadull never played Paris. His Paris title is like a MM title. He got straight setted at Wimby , in the final. He is just a bye for nadull. He should retire and move to Mallorca to spend more time with his boyfriend, instead of traveling around the world giving him byes.

v-money
05-18-2012, 04:27 PM
It must be said that Ferrer is up 5-3 in the H2H.

luie
05-18-2012, 04:35 PM
Ferrer has a better record on HC slams than Birdshit the choking clown. Ferrer has 2 HC SF and one final at the WTF , when he reaches this stage it usually takes an elite player to take him out. Novak, USO 07 , Murray AO 11 , fed shanghai 07 . Birdshit never passed the QF of a HC slam. And gets beaten by random nobodies.

Otlichno
05-18-2012, 04:40 PM
:lol: Anything to undermine Ferrer's obvious superiority.

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 04:40 PM
Ferrer has a better record on HC slams than Birdshit the choking clown. Ferrer has 2 HC SF and one final at the WTF , when he reaches this stage it usually takes an elite player to take him out. Novak, USO 07 , Murray AO 11 , fed shanghai 07 . Birdshit never passed the QF of a HC slam. And gets beaten by random nobodies.

Berdych is better than Ferrer on hardcourts - he has a Masters title in Paris 2004, better than anything Ferrer did on the surface.

Berdych is better than Ferrer on grass - Wimbledon final trumps everything Ferrer ever did on grass put together

Berdych is better than Ferrer on clay - no Masters titles for either, but Berdych actually reached the semifinals at Roland Garros (and only lost in 5) unlike Ferrer.

:wavey:

Kat_YYZ
05-18-2012, 04:41 PM
It must be said that Ferrer is up 5-3 in the H2H.

http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/56901000/jpg/_56901425_56901423.jpg

Johnny Groove
05-18-2012, 04:43 PM
Ferrer leads 5-3 in the H2H, so :shrug:

True Berdych's peak level is better, but Pics is more consistent.

v-money
05-18-2012, 04:43 PM
Also their performances against the top4 are really not all that different:

Ferrer: 13W-40L 24.5% win percentage (despite the 0-13 against Fed)
Berdych: 12W-34L 26.1% win percentage

Who really cares if Berdych has more potential or a higher peak level if he can't live up to it. Results matter too, and these guys have very comparable results.

I've already said that I think Berdych is better but don't let Mark Clownders fool you into thinking that this is not even an argument and Ferrer is a terrible player. Ferrer has achieved a lot in his career, which is even more impressive considering what he's working with.

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 04:45 PM
Also their performances against the top4 are really not all that different:

Ferrer: 13W-40L 24.5% win percentage (despite the 0-13 against Fed)
Berdych: 12W-34 26.1% win percentage

Who really cares if Berdych has more potential or a higher peak level if he can't live up to it. Results matter too, and these guys have very comparable results.

I've already said that I think Berdych is better but don't let Mark Clownders fool you into thinking that this is not even an argument and Ferrer is a terrible player. Ferrer has achieved a lot in his career, which is even more impressive considering what he's working with.

Brilliant :worship:

That said, Berdych's results at Grand Slams and Masters tournaments are much better as well. Only criteria where Ferrer wins is results at Mickey Mouse clay tournaments.

luie
05-18-2012, 04:47 PM
Berdych is better than Ferrer on hardcourts - he has a Masters title in Paris 2004, better than anything Ferrer did on the surface.

Berdych is better than Ferrer on grass - Wimbledon final trumps everything Ferrer ever did on grass put together

Berdych is better than Ferrer on clay - no Masters titles for either, but Berdych actually reached the semifinals at Roland Garros (and only lost in 5) unlike Ferrer.

:wavey:

Birdshit is a clown always is and always will be. He won Paris because of no competition . If fed was absent for WTF in 07 ferrer would have had a HC title , I guess Birdshit is lucky no one gives a damn about Paris in those days. He! He! Birdshit the clown never made it past a GS QF on Hard court , he never beat an elite player at a HC slam .Ferrer. Beat nadull 2 times in a HC slam.
His master request his services in Mallorca .

v-money
05-18-2012, 04:48 PM
Brilliant :worship:

That said, Berdych's results at Grand Slams and Masters tournaments are much better as well. Only criteria where Ferrer wins is results at Mickey Mouse clay tournaments.

I thought you'd like it :D

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 04:49 PM
Birdshit is a clown always is and always will be. He won Paris because of no competition . If fed was absent for WTF in 07 ferrer would have had a HC title , I guess Birdshit is lucky no one gives a damn about Paris in those days. He! He! Birdshit the clown never made it past a GS QF on Hard court , he never beat an elite player at a HC slam .Ferrer. Beat nadull 2 times in a HC slam.
His master request his services in Mallorca .

You're not making a good case for Ferrer. If a clown can make a Slam final and win a Masters tournaments and he can't, Ferrer is even worse/more overrated than I initially thought.

Pirata.
05-18-2012, 04:51 PM
:lol: Anything to undermine Ferrer's obvious superiority.

:yeah:

Who really cares if Berdych has more potential or a higher peak level if he can't live up to it. Results matter too, and these guys have very comparable results.

Should be a required post in every "who is better" thread.

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 04:51 PM
I thought you'd like it :D

I did. Although I was slightly surprised. Always thought the first time people would 'adapt' my user name on this forum it'd be introducing MTF's trademark mug.

But I guess clown is good too :D

Otlichno
05-18-2012, 04:53 PM
http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/56901000/jpg/_56901425_56901423.jpg

The tongue. :hearts: :inlove:

He should win just because of his ridiculous level of hotness. :drool:

luie
05-18-2012, 04:54 PM
Birdshit is so superior to ferrer yet the h2h with Novak is 9-1. A fluke at Wimby he! He! .
While ferrer is less talented and overmatched by Novak boast a h2h (Novak)9-5 (ferrer)even beating the Serbian in a BO5 on clay.

Corey Feldman
05-18-2012, 04:56 PM
Ferrer by a million miles

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 04:58 PM
Birdshit is so superior to ferrer yet the h2h with Novak is 9-1. A fluke at Wimby he! He! .
While ferrer is less talented and overmatched by Novak boast a h2h (Novak)9-5 (ferrer)even beating the Serbian in a BO5 on clay.

He's so superior that he won the same number of sets in his W2010 match vs Federer than Ferrer in 13 matches against the Swiss combined.

habibko
05-18-2012, 04:58 PM
this is like comparing Christopher Hitchens to Jerry Falwell

with charisma, great character and the love of people all around the world as well as his peers, Ferrer wins at life

FerrersLinda
05-18-2012, 04:59 PM
Brilliant :worship:

That said, Berdych's results at Grand Slams and Masters tournaments are much better as well. Only criteria where Ferrer wins is results at Mickey Mouse clay tournaments.

I'm not really here, but you've got to stop saying this. It's bullshit. Yes Berdych reached a final (where he didn't stand a chance to win), but overall Ferrer got further in slams. I believe he has actually got one QF more than Birdie but also more R16 wins.

I get that you think Ferrer sucks and Berdych is the shit, fine, that's ok. But quit lying to make your point.

sexybeast
05-18-2012, 05:01 PM
this is like comparing Christopher Hitchens to Jerry Falwell

with charisma, great character and the love of people all around the world as well as his peers, Ferrer wins at life

But Berdych got the most fanatic fans. Everyone likes Ferrer but he doesnt seem to trigger such strong emotions as Berdych. Many hate Berdych, some love him and others go back and forward from admiring his tennis to hating his guts.

dazed1
05-18-2012, 05:02 PM
Berdych better player.

Ferer - more likable by a mile

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 05:03 PM
I'm not really here, but you've got to stop saying this. It's bullshit. Yes Berdych reached a final (where he didn't stand a chance to win), but overall Ferrer got further in slams. I believe he has actually got one QF more than Birdie but also more R16 wins.

I get that you think Ferrer sucks and Berdych is the shit, fine, that's ok. But quit lying to make your point.

Beating Federer and Djokovic back-to-back to reach a Slam final is better than anything Ferrer ever did at Slam level.

He's 30yo and has been to Slams semis twice, not even coming close to winning one of them. These are not numbers of an elite player.

Number of round of 16/QF are not relevant at all. I mean, Safin only got past R4 at Slams eight times in his entire career. Does Murray have better results in Slams than Safin just because he gets past R4 more often?

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 05:04 PM
this is like comparing Christopher Hitchens to Jerry Falwell

with charisma, great character and the love of people all around the world as well as his peers, Ferrer wins at life

Berdych has/had the hotter girlfriends, so I'm afraid he wins at life too :D

And it's a good sign that he is not loved here, it's a sign that he doesn't just open his legs every time Federer is across the net and has actually beaten the great Swiss on some big matches.

FerrersLinda
05-18-2012, 05:06 PM
Beating Federer and Djokovic back-to-back to reach a Slam final is better than anything Ferrer ever did at Slam level.

He's 30yo and has been to Slams semis twice, not even coming close to winning one of them. These are not numbers of an elite player.

Number of round of 16/QF are not relevant at all. I mean, Safin only got past R4 at Slams eight times in his entire career. Does Murray have better results in Slams than Safin just because he gets past R4 more often?

Righto. :rolleyes:

v-money
05-18-2012, 05:07 PM
Berdych really is an underachiever. Sure he has the win at Paris Masters, but that win occurred in 2005! Seven years ago this guy already had the game for making runs in big tournaments, but his other big results were few and far between.

When on, Berdych is one of the cleanest ball strikers on tour. His game looks beautiful when he has time to set up and he's in a rhythm, but he's inconsistent and has shown to be mentally week. Ferrer on the other hand is very consistent, and even though he's also had his share of chokes, is a great fighter.

Consistency is huge in tennis and does have a lot to do with making a player great. A few weeks ago Certenfy said Verdasco is a better player than Ferrer. That's just ridiculous, Ferrer is better because of the consistency alone.

Pirata.
05-18-2012, 05:08 PM
Ferrer by a million miles

:hearts:

with charisma, great character and the love of people all around the world as well as his peers, Ferrer wins at life

:bowdown:

GSMnadal
05-18-2012, 05:09 PM
Berdych all the way. Ferrer is more consistent, but Tomas on his day, has the game to beat anyone (except Nadal) and can pull off the big win. He has that extra gear David hasn't, his choking habits are worrying however, that's a pretty fundamental problem, and not something you can easily improve on.

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 05:09 PM
Righto. :rolleyes:

So reaching two Slams semis in your entire career (losing both) and never winning a Masters are numbers of an elite player.

That's actually good to know; with the standards so low, some of my underachieving favorites are elite players too.

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 05:14 PM
Berdych really is an underachiever. Sure he has the win at Paris Masters, but that win occurred in 2005! Seven years ago this guy already had the game for making runs in big tournaments, but his other big results were few and far between.

When on, Berdych is one of the cleanest ball strikers on tour. His game looks beautiful when he has time to set up and he's in a rhythm, but he's inconsistent and has shown to be mentally week. Ferrer on the other hand is very consistent, and even though he's also had his share of chokes, is a great fighter.

Consistency is huge in tennis and does have a lot to do with making a player great. A few weeks ago Certenfy said Verdasco is a better player than Ferrer. That's just ridiculous, Ferrer is better because of the consistency alone.

So Ferrer has had his fair share of chokes, but it's ok because he's a great fighter. And when Berdych does the same it just shows that he's mentally weak? Amazing logic.

And can you please tell when Ferrer has ever shown consistency at the highest level. When did he consistently go deep in Slams or Masters Tournaments? Even in 2011 when he finished #5 he was stopped at R16 in three of the four Slams and got his ranking by virtue of results in 250/500 tournaments.

FerrersLinda
05-18-2012, 05:16 PM
So reaching two Slams semis in your entire career (losing both) and never winning a Masters are numbers of an elite player.

That's actually good to know; with the standards so low, some of my underachieving favorites are elite players too.

The standards are very low to become the number 6 player in the world. Meaning there are only 5 players in the world that are better. Do you get this? Now I know he only won 14 titles and only played 15 atp finals, it's an abomination that this man even gets to play on profesional court.:rolleyes:

I'm not saying he's better than Berdych. I'm saying they're about equal. Also I'm saying stop bitching and pretending Ferrer is shit at playing tennis. It only makes you look like a fool.

Adios.:wavey:

FerrersLinda
05-18-2012, 05:17 PM
So Ferrer has had his fair share of chokes, but it's ok because he's a great fighter. And when Berdych does the same it just shows that he's mentally weak? Amazing logic.

And can you please tell when Ferrer has ever shown consistency at the highest level. When did he consistently go deep in Slams or Masters Tournaments? Even in 2011 when he finished #5 he was stopped at R16 in three of the four Slams and got his ranking by virtue of results in 250/500 tournaments.

Pretty consistent :p

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 05:21 PM
The standards are very low to become the number 6 player in the world. Meaning there are only 5 players in the world that are better. Do you get this? Now I know he only won 14 titles and only played 15 atp finals, it's an abomination that this man even gets to play on profesional court.:rolleyes:

I'm not saying he's better than Berdych. I'm saying they're about equal. Also I'm saying stop bitching and pretending Ferrer is shit at playing tennis. It only makes you look like a fool.

Adios.:wavey:


Negative. Show me where I ever said or implied that he shouldn't play professional tennis. Just an abomination that he gets compared to better players, who did more at the highest level than him.

Also, the question is obviously not about current rankings, but about who the better player is overall.


Pretty consistent :p

I guess that's one way to look at it.

luie
05-18-2012, 05:53 PM
You're not making a good case for Ferrer. If a clown can make a Slam final and win a Masters tournaments and he can't, Ferrer is even worse/more overrated than I initially thought.

2010 was a weak year, so it allowed for clowns and opportunistic players to go deep that year. 2010 a player like Melzer never made it pass the 3 rd of a slam made a RG SF.
Old man Youzhny made a USO SF.
Melzer/Birdshit/ melzer never came close to their achievement again.
Murray went in post AO slump, fed lost form.delpo /davydenko injured, Novak served more double faults than aces didn't go gluten free as yet.
2010 was a very poor year in terms of tennis quality so a lot of second rate players took their chances including Birdshit.

luie
05-18-2012, 06:00 PM
He's so superior that he won the same number of sets in his W2010 match vs Federer than Ferrer in 13 matches against the Swiss combined.

I was talking about Novak . If you want to bring up fed-ferrer into it , I can bring up Birdshit - nadull . Despite Birdshit being 6'5" , plays with power and hits the ball flat he is Nadulls bitchboy.he! He!
Ferrer is a fighter unfortunately he has nothing to hurt fed with .
Birdshit is a choking, clown an absolute waste of talent , he isn't called birdbrain for nothing.

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 06:00 PM
2010 was a weak year, so it allowed for clowns and opportunistic players to go deep that year. 2010 a player like Melzer never made it pass the 3 rd of a slam made a RG SF.
Old man Youzhny made a USO SF.
Melzer/Birdshit/ melzer never came close to their achievement again.
Murray went in post AO slump, fed lost form.delpo /davydenko injured, Novak served more double faults than aces didn't go gluten free as yet.
2010 was a very poor year in terms of tennis quality so a lot of second rate players took their chances including Birdshit.

Brilliant.

2010 Roland Garros R3 - Melzer d. Ferrer 6-4, 6-0 and 7-6

The same Melzer you slate in your post. Too bad Ferrer isn't even a second rate player to take advantage of this weak 2010.

Singularity
05-18-2012, 06:11 PM
And can you please tell when Ferrer has ever shown consistency at the highest level. When did he consistently go deep in Slams or Masters Tournaments? Even in 2011 when he finished #5 he was stopped at R16 in three of the four Slams and got his ranking by virtue of results in 250/500 tournaments.
In 2011 he played 7 masters and reached the QF or better in 5 of them, achieving 2 finals. Over the same period, Berdych played all 9 masters, reaching 6 QFs and
achieving 2 semi-finals. So, Ferrer had the better winning percentage, and better results. In the slams, Ferrer made a semi-final and Berdych's best appearance was a QF, so Ferrer wins there too.

Overall, Berdych has 1 more semi-final in masters tournaments, and of course won in 2005. But Ferrer has many more QF appearances, indicating better consistency. In the slams, Berdych has a final, but that's about it. So really, not much to separate them in terms of results.

Edit: Actually taking into account this week's tournament, the only thing Berdych has over Ferrer in masters results is the win in 2005. Ferrer is equal or better everywhere else.

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 06:18 PM
In 2011 he played 7 masters and reached the QF or better in 5 of them, achieving 2 finals. Over the same period, Berdych played all 9 masters, reaching 6 QFs and
achieving 2 semi-finals. So, Ferrer had the better winning percentage, and better results. In the slams, Ferrer made a semi-final and Berdych's best appearance was a QF, so Ferrer wins there too.

Overall, Berdych has 1 more semi-final in masters tournaments, and of course won in 2005. But Ferrer has many more QF appearances, indicating better consistency. In the slams, Berdych has a final, but that's about it. So really, not much to separate them in terms of results.

Yes, Ferrer had a better 2011 than Tomas, but that's not what's being asked.

Overall, Tomas has the clear edge. He has 1 more semi in Masters and one title as you said, while being significantly younger, and has a Slam final, which is kind of a big deal. What does Ferrer have to counter Berdych's Masters title and Slam final? He has never achieved anything of similar importance.

He should be considered better because he has more Masters QF?! It's not like that is a relevant indicator anyway, especially considering that Ferrer has been on tour for longer/is far older.

romismak
05-18-2012, 06:22 PM
This vs this is pathetic... but once again i must say the same TSonga, Berdych vs Ferrer is - higher peak vs consistency - Ferrer is solid top 10 player, beating guys he is supposed to beat, Berdych and Tsonga are players with much bigger game - agressive-power game and serve, they can beat anyone, but they are more inconsistent, howewer over last 1-2 years Berdych and to some extent also Tsonga became much more consistent and are at least making QF - with their rankings QF is what they should make ,in QF mostly they will face big 4 to make it in SF and F. But even with Ferrer being super-consistent, getting points from Acapulco and so on.... Tsonga surpassed him in ranking this season and Berdych is really going toe-to-toe with him - it is pretty close. Imagine that there would be some 500 level grass or indoor event at the beginning of the year when nobody from big 4 will play - Berdych or Tsonga would win such ,,easy,, tournament and get ,,cheap,, 500 points for example.

So my answer is Berdych, Tsonga are better than Ferrer, they are more likely to beat higher-ranked player, especially on grass-indoors they are force that can beat even good playing top 4 players, but they are more likely going to loose against some mugs than Ferrer.

If we go career-wise, overall their accomplishments, it is not even clsoe, both Berdych and Tsonga have slam final, both won Masters 1000 title- so at biggest events achieve more.

Singularity
05-18-2012, 06:27 PM
Yes, Ferrer had a better 2011 than Tomas, but that's not what's being asked.

Overall, Tomas has the clear edge. He has 1 more semi in Masters and one title as you said, while being significantly younger, and has a Slam final, which is kind of a big deal. What does Ferrer have to counter Berdych's Masters title and Slam final? He has never achieved anything of similar importance.

He should be considered better because he has more Masters QF?! It's not like that is a relevant indicator anyway, especially considering that Ferrer has been on tour for longer/is far older.
I'm not saying Ferrer has had better results. I'm saying he's shown consistency at the highest level. You asked the question: "when did he consistently go deep in Slams or Masters Tournaments?" My response is that Ferrer has done this almost as much as Berdych, and arguably is more consistent when looking at QFs.

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 06:33 PM
I'm not saying Ferrer has had better results. I'm saying he's shown consistency at the highest level. You asked the question: "when did he consistently go deep in Slams or Masters Tournaments?" My response is that Ferrer has done this almost as much as Berdych, and arguably is more consistent when looking at QFs.

Fair enough. But given Berdych's Masters title and Slam final and Ferrer's lack of both, only if the Spaniard was far more consistent at the highest level (which isn't the case, he's slightly more consistent at best, and I'm not even convinced of that) could there be an argument made for Ferrer being equal/superior overall.

BauerAlmeida
05-18-2012, 06:40 PM
Ferrer isn't a threat to the top guys as much as Tsonga or Berdych (but sometimes he is, except against Federer), but he is not going to lose to clowns as the other two occasionally do.

willoughby
05-18-2012, 06:48 PM
I honestly don't get the Ferrer hate. He is one of the nicest guys on tour and the most hard-working.

No need to give any bit of importance to those two clowns. They are probably the only Ferrer haters around. You can dislike his game or whatever, but hating a guy who has made the most out of his abilities is really pathetic and disgraceful.

You can keep hating. He has probably achieved more money than both of you will ever have in your lives :wavey:

v-money
05-18-2012, 06:49 PM
That said, Berdych's results at Grand Slams and Masters tournaments are much better as well. Only criteria where Ferrer wins is results at Mickey Mouse clay tournaments.

This is not exactly true especially the use of the word much.

Ferrer:

Masters:
116W-78L - 59.8%
4 R4, 18 QF, 5 SF, 3F, 0W

Slams:
78W-37L - 67.8%
10 R3, 8 R4, 4 QF, 2SF, 0F, 0W

Berdych:

Masters:
103W-66L - 60.9%
4 R4, 11 QF, 6 SF, 2F, 1W

Slams:
69W-33L - 67.7%
5 R3, 10 R4, 4 QF, 1SF, 1F, 0W

Those look like VERY similar numbers. Similar win percentages. Ferrer reached 7 more master QF's, Berdych reached one more master's SF and converted on one of his finals while Ferrer lost all 3 times.

In slams, also very similar, Berdych reached 2 more R4, same number of QF and converted on one of his two SF's, while Ferrer lost both times.

When you look at these very similar Slam and Masters achievements where Berdych has the slight edge and consider that the season consists more of then just these events, then a good argument can be made for Pics. Ferrer is also a Davis Cup hero, had a better run at WTF and has more ATP 250 and 500 wins.

luie
05-18-2012, 06:58 PM
Brilliant.

2010 Roland Garros R3 - Melzer d. Ferrer 6-4, 6-0 and 7-6

The same Melzer you slate in your post. Too bad Ferrer isn't even a second rate player to take advantage of this weak 2010.

2010 was indeed the weakest year in recent memory. Why didn't ferrer take advantage of a weaken 2010 one explanation is he is better at HC than on natural surfaces. That's why his best results have come on HC
Regardless players like Youzhny , melzer, Birdshit even Soderling although he got sick , did nothing before or after. That was the year nadull cheated at Wimby and the USO.
Just tell me what Birdshit has done before the summer of 2010 or after.
Ferrer has been a consistent top ten player since 07.
Birdshit just a run if the mill fluke , he is dangerous as his birdbrain allows him to be .
Maybe one day again the top guys take disregard a tourney and he can win another "master"He! He!;)

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 07:00 PM
This is not exactly true especially the use of the word much.

Ferrer:

Masters:
116W-78L - 59.8%
4 R4, 18 QF, 5 SF, 3F, 0W

Slams:
78W-37L - 67.8%
10 R3, 8 R4, 4 QF, 2SF, 0F, 0W

Berdych:

Masters:
103W-66L - 60.9%
4 R4, 11 QF, 6 SF, 2F, 1W

Slams:
69W-33L - 67.7%
5 R3, 10 R4, 4 QF, 1SF, 1F, 0W

Those look like VERY similar numbers. Similar win percentages. Ferrer reached 7 more master QF's, Berdych reached one more master's SF and converted on one of his finals while Ferrer lost all 3 times.

In slams, also very similar, Berdych reached 2 more R4, same number of QF and converted on one of his two SF's, while Ferrer lost both times.

When you look at these very similar Slam and Masters achievements where Berdych has the slight edge and consider that the season consists more of then just these events, then a good argument can be made for Pics. Ferrer is also a Davis Cup hero, had a better run at WTF and has more ATP 250 and 500 wins.

Those numbers fail to take into account that Ferrer has been on tour longer, which is the reason why he has reached more Masters quarters (but still didn't manage more semis)...

And since when has winning % been more important than winning big events or, to a lesser extent, reaching the final of a Slam? Their achievements aren't similar, only the winning % is. A Masters title > no Masters title. A slam final > no Slam final.

v-money
05-18-2012, 07:15 PM
Is the question who is better or who will be better? I have nothing to say about who will be better, nor can I predict who will have a better longevity from this part of their careers. Maybe Berdych will play longer and still achieve much more, but maybe not.

Mark Lenders
05-18-2012, 07:22 PM
Is the question who is better or who will be better? I have nothing to say about who will be better, nor can I predict who will have a better longevity from this part of their careers. Maybe Berdych will play longer and still achieve much more, but maybe not.

His current achievements are already better though. He has won a big title, unlike Ferrer (and made a Slam final, which is a big deal too), which is enough to tip the balance if there ever was any doubt.

And I'm sure you're a regular tennis viewer: who do you think plays a higher level of tennis of the two? Ferrer can even touch Tomas's best tennis, which is enough to beat even the top players on the biggest stages.

v-money
05-18-2012, 08:34 PM
His current achievements are already better though. He has won a big title, unlike Ferrer (and made a Slam final, which is a big deal too), which is enough to tip the balance if there ever was any doubt.

And I'm sure you're a regular tennis viewer: who do you think plays a higher level of tennis of the two? Ferrer can even touch Tomas's best tennis, which is enough to beat even the top players on the biggest stages.

For me this was enough to tip the balance, and as I said earlier I think Berdych has achieved slightly more, but there indeed was doubt because it's very close.

I love these threads of yours, Jason. Especially the Tsonga one, timing couldn't have been better there if you know what I mean :D Who knew Ferrer's mugginess could actually serve a purpose :)

These threads player x vs Ferrer are just legendary :D

This, he's even better than Ferrer on clay.

Really, there's no contest here. You just need to watch them both play to realize who the more talented and dangerous player is.

These kind of statements are just silly and completely false. We're comparing two-second tier players who's achievements are very similar and very modest compared to the top players of this era. The comparison is fair and this is why Ferrer keeps getting votes in the polls, and why he was ahead in the Tsonga comparison thread. This is not a comparison of Ferrer and Federer, it's Berdych who we're talking about, the guy who was upset by Fish at Wimbledon, Tipsy at the USO, and Stephanie Robert at RG and you're trying to sell him as some kind of Masters and GS specialist. Well, maybe you're not doing that, but you're underselling Ferrer, in comparison to this guy.

I have watched a lot of tennis in the last few years and when you ask me who is more dangerous I will say Ferrer. Berdych would fall apart playing for anything significant which is why he struggled so much in his Wimbledon final and didn't win a title from May 2009 to October 2011. I think a player who can't even keep it together for a ATP 250 or 500 tournament is not all that dangerous. That's just my view. Maybe Berdych will sometime in the future prove my wrong, but for now he's really nothing special, certainly not so much better than Ferrer as you make it seem.

duong
05-18-2012, 10:18 PM
so far carreer-wise Ferrer imo, but Berdych surely can do many big things in next years, bigger than Ferrer did, and I've suspected for several years that Berdych could be better than Tsonga, it comes in the light more and more as Berdych improves everything.

At the moment probably Berdych but once again imo Ferrer played really great in Barcelona final, quite equivalent level as Berdych today, maybe better, but Berdych surely can do better things on other surfaces.

Hian-GOAT
05-19-2012, 03:52 AM
I prefer Tomas, but in terms of constancy Ferrer is way better.

Mystique
05-19-2012, 04:27 AM
Berdych is a better tennis player, but David is more consistent.
And and rankings done lie.

:wavey:

Mystique
05-19-2012, 04:29 AM
Ferrer haters out in full force here. They claim he has done nothing of importance in non Mickey-Mouse tournaments. But clearly he is important enough for them to launch vicious attacks on him for being consistent on tour.

duchuy89
05-19-2012, 04:40 AM
Berdych Better!

shiaben
05-19-2012, 05:15 AM
The Bird Man. He's been to a grand slam final.

duong
05-20-2012, 03:01 PM
Ferrer played really great in Barcelona final, quite equivalent level as Berdych today, maybe better

After writing that, I was wondering : I really had the impression that Ferrer had played better in Barcelona than Berdych in Roma, and yesterday's macth reminded me that.

Ferrer's level on red clay in these two matches has been clearly better than Berdych's : less power but such versatility and consistency, that's clearly a superior level.

Ferrer on clay is at a huge level, hope he can keep that despite Nadal's mental destruction :sad:

duong
05-20-2012, 03:02 PM
Berdych is a better tennis player, but David is more consistent.


Actually that's the opposite : Berdych has been very consistent for one year, more than Ferrer (I already explained in the "Ferrer vs Tsonga" that describing Ferrer as a "consistent player" who beats lower ranked players and loses to higher ranked is a completely wrong legend)

But Ferrer's highest level now implies much more tennis versatily than Berdych.

william_renshaw
05-20-2012, 03:13 PM
Ferrer has a better attitude to the sport and to life in general.

mooncreek
05-20-2012, 07:08 PM
The question is what you mean by "better".

If we're talking better career, that's Berdych. GS final & Masters title.

That said, Berdych is my least favorite player. It pained me to root for him in the Madrid final (due to Federer going for #2 ranking).

Better ranking (both currently and career high)? Better for the game? Better to watch? That's all Ferrer. Wish there were more players like him on the tour.

tennisphilia
05-20-2012, 08:44 PM
game wise, it would be Berdych. wonder why the czech no. 1 doesnt go for the smaller tournament wins to boost himself in the rankings. he can easily be behind big four, and him going up a few notches will certainly help him not having to meet the top 4 in the quarters all the time.

duong
05-20-2012, 09:19 PM
wonder why the czech no. 1 doesnt go for the smaller tournament wins to boost himself in the rankings. he can easily be behind big four

he's played 3 ATP250 tournaments, 4 ATP500 tournaments, Monte-Carlo and Davis cup in the last 52 weeks, exactly the same as Ferrer :shrug:

nevenez
09-07-2012, 10:23 PM
Berdych

TigerTim
09-07-2012, 10:25 PM
Ferrer, more consistent, better record vs Nadal, nicer guy etc etc

blank_frackis
09-07-2012, 10:38 PM
Coming into this tournament Berdych hadn't won a match against a top 20 player since May (Almagro). If he beats Murray then fine, but the only good thing about Berdych's form for the past few months is his last match.

Ferrer on the other hand has played pretty well all year.

Mark Lenders
09-08-2012, 02:31 AM
I really hope no one has any doubts anymore after seeing Berdych beat Federer. He just has far more weapons and variety in his game than one dimensional pusher Ferrer.

emotion
09-08-2012, 02:40 AM
On the other hand, if Ferrer makes final, I think it is definitively him

Mark Lenders
09-08-2012, 02:43 AM
On the other hand, if Ferrer makes final, I think it is definitively him

Unless Berdych makes the final too and beats Ferrer there of course.

That said, Ferrer has 0 chances of making the final. He does not have what it takes to trouble Djokovic, let alone beat him.

Topspindoctor
09-08-2012, 02:43 AM
Berdych won masters and reached a slam final. Ferrer is more consistent.

If Berdych reaches slam final this USO, he'll be without a doubt better IMO.

jcempire
09-08-2012, 02:45 AM
Career David Ferrer
HC Berdych

Freak3yman84
09-08-2012, 02:46 AM
Well I really dislike Berdych so that might influence my opinion, but the dude is sooo inconsistent in his results. Ferrer may be a "vulture", but at least he comes up with the results on a regular basis. It is very close though.

Slade
09-08-2012, 02:50 AM
Bird DICK is horribly inconsistent, but both playing at peak level I will admit Berdick is the better player.

David doesn't have as many "bad losses" as Berdick so he is ranked higher.

With that being said, Berdick will never have as much heart as Ferrer

Mark Lenders
09-08-2012, 02:53 AM
Well I really dislike Berdych so that might influence my opinion, but the dude is sooo inconsistent in his results. Ferrer may be a "vulture", but at least he comes up with the results on a regular basis. It is very close though.

He is inconsistent, but his highest level of tennis is just miles ahead of Ferrer's. I trust you watched his recent match against Federer; Ferrer simply isn't able to produce tennis of that quality. He's also not capable of reaching a Slam final by beaten two top 3 players back to back. It's not close at all.

Freak3yman84
09-08-2012, 02:59 AM
He is inconsistent, but his highest level of tennis is just miles ahead of Ferrer's. I trust you watched his recent match against Federer; Ferrer simply isn't able to produce tennis of that quality. He's also not capable of reaching a Slam final by beaten two top 3 players back to back. It's not close at all.

Agreed about Berdych being better than Ferrer when they're both at their peak, but honestly how often is Berdych at his peak? Maybe 4-5 times a year? At least Ferrer is peaking 99% of the time despite him still being inferior. Ferrer makes the most he can out of his seemingly weaponless game.

Mark Lenders
09-08-2012, 03:10 AM
Agreed about Berdych being better than Ferrer when they're both at their peak, but honestly how often is Berdych at his peak? Maybe 4-5 times a year? At least Ferrer is peaking 99% of the time despite him still being inferior. Ferrer makes the most he can out of his seemingly weaponless game.

Yeah, if the question was who made the most of their talent, the answer would definitely be Ferrer. Tomas has definitely not maximized his potential in the same way. But he's still the better and more dangerous player; there's basically no top player who would not rather see Ferrer on the other side of the net in a big match than Berdych.

Federer in 2
09-08-2012, 03:11 AM
Ferrer.

Freak3yman84
09-08-2012, 03:12 AM
Yeah, if the question was who made the most of their talent, the answer would definitely be Ferrer. Tomas has definitely not maximized his potential in the same way. But he's still the better and more dangerous player; there's basically no top player who would not rather see Ferrer on the other side of the net in a big match than Berdych.

But if I were a lower ranked player I would rather face Berdych because he can be really off and lose to low ranked players whereas Ferrer really only struggles with top 10/15 players. Personally, I would think Ferrer's scenario is better because he only faces top players in later rounds and therefore has more success and consistency.

Mark Lenders
09-08-2012, 03:18 AM
Ferrer.

I thought Berdych beating Federer at a Slam for the second time would make you change your mind, but you seem pretty set in your ways :rolleyes: Let's hope the next Slams draws are kind to Federer and he draws Berdych instead of the superior Ferrer eh :lol:


But if I were a lower ranked player I would rather face Berdych because he can be really off and lose to low ranked players whereas Ferrer really only struggles with top 10/15 players. Personally, I would think Ferrer's scenario is better because he only faces top players in later rounds and therefore has more success and consistency.

This is true. Ferrer is the sixth least likely player on tour to losing to non-top 10 players (after the top 4 and Del Potro), Berdych is far more likely to lose to some random mug.

But at the end of the day, if you are to stand any chance of winning any title above 500 or reach a Slam final, you need to be able to take it to the top players. That's why, despite his inconsistency, Tomas has a Masters title and a Slam final to his name and is likely to add to this tally in the coming years (maybe this weekend already).

Freak3yman84
09-08-2012, 03:21 AM
This is true. Ferrer is the sixth least likely player on tour to losing to non-top 10 players (after the top 4 and Del Potro), Berdych is far more likely to lose to some random mug.

But at the end of the day, if you are to stand any chance of winning any title above 500 or reach a Slam final, you need to be able to take it to the top players. That's why, despite his inconsistency, Tomas has a Masters title and a Slam final to his name and is likely to add to this tally in the coming years (maybe this weekend already).

I guess it's just a matter of whether you prefer consistent results with a medium peak or inconsistent results with a higher peak :shrug:

Ziros
09-08-2012, 03:39 AM
At his peak,it's gotta be Berdych. But no doubt,Ferrer is more consistent.

Pirata.
09-08-2012, 04:59 AM
Didn't Berdych win his Masters title in Paris in a year when neither Fed or Nadal participated? Beating such indoor legends like Coria, Gaudio and Stepanek?

Masters vulture tbh

Mark Lenders
09-08-2012, 05:12 AM
Didn't Berdych win his Masters title in Paris in a year when neither Fed or Nadal participated? Beating such indoor legends like Coria, Gaudio and Stepanek?

Masters vulture tbh

And what Masters has Ferrer won? Exactly...

Ferrer was in the draw of the Paris Masters 2005 too btw

evilmindbulgaria
09-08-2012, 06:41 AM
Berdych at the moment.

Tag
09-08-2012, 06:48 AM
Didn't Berdych win his Masters title in Paris in a year when neither Fed or Nadal participated? Beating such indoor legends like Coria, Gaudio and Stepanek?

Masters vulture tbh

disgusting behaviour as usual from berdych :o

anyway, berdych has the higher level of play, but only against federer of course. normally he just clowns around and hits the ball like a 2 year old on a sugar rush

ferrer is without a doubt the far more likeable person and is far more hard working. despite his notorious abuse of the ranking system, he is certainly a better ambassador for tennis than berdych will ever be

Jverweij
09-08-2012, 06:51 AM
in terms of potential - Berdych
in terms of achievements - Ferrer

Chris Kuerten
09-08-2012, 08:08 AM
Ferrer would never get straight setted by clowns like Gulbis and Darcis :o

It also must sting that their H2H is 5-3 to Ferrer, no?

Marcoo
09-08-2012, 08:10 AM
I like Ferrer a lot, but i have to say berdych is better. I mean He defeated the great Roger Federer, what elese to say ? :D

The Prince
09-08-2012, 08:47 AM
Ferrer.

TigerTim
09-08-2012, 09:06 AM
I like Ferrer a lot, but i have to say berdych is better. I mean He defeated the great Roger Federer, what elese to say ? :D

Ferrer has beaten Nadal in a grand slam. Twice.

Nole Rules
09-08-2012, 09:23 AM
Ferrer has beaten injured Nadal in a grand slam. Twice.

True.

BroTree123
09-08-2012, 09:27 AM
Who's Better = whoever you like more.
Who's Worse = whoever you hate more.

rocketassist
09-08-2012, 09:28 AM
True.

Once.

He was fine at the 07 USO.

Sanya
09-08-2012, 09:36 AM
Today in the morning it`s Berdych with comfortable lead. But in 24 hours it can be close and later in a day Ferrer even with bigger hole between them in his favour than Tomas has now. ;)

BackhandDTL
09-08-2012, 10:01 AM
Berdych, easily. When I think of "better player", I don't think of the more consistent player. I think of the one with more upside, and based on that criteria, Berdych trumps Ferrer.

Ferrer is consistently good, and more likely to show up than some of the other top players, but his best will always be a notch or two lower than the best of his peers'. It's the gatekeeper effect. Berdych is more capable of pulling off a big match performance than Ferrer is, which is probably why his best results are better despite Ferrer's recent consistency.

The overall scope of their careers is a pointless thing to judge at this point since Ferrer, at 30, has 4 years on the 26 year old Czech.

BodyServe
09-08-2012, 10:08 AM
Ferrer isn't even half the player Berdych is, and i'm not talking about size only.

If it wasn't for the slower courts and such a long clay season, Ferrer wouldn't be top 10.

Tyson0712
09-08-2012, 10:45 AM
Berdych and it's not even close, infact its unfair to compare Tomas to a limited pusher like Ferrer. Better comparisons would be Monaco vs Ferrer and Berdych vs Tsonga. Yes Ferrer can beat lower ranked players...so what that's irrelevant when comparing him with Berdych. Beating lower ranked players doesn't suddenly make you a superior player to members of the top ten. No, Berdych is the better tennis player by far, all of his shots are better, he had a better serve and for his height he is a much better mover. When you talk about guys who can defeat the big four and make a dent in the majors you don't talk about Ferrer (hes just there as a bye or to make up the numbers), you talk about guys like Berdych who actually have the tennis to win what matters in this sport.

uxyzapenje
09-08-2012, 10:57 AM
Berdych > Ferrer but Ferrer>Birdshit
And Tomas is playing like the other half of the time.

Tyson0712
09-08-2012, 11:03 AM
Ferrer, more consistent, better record vs Nadal, nicer guy etc etc

Being more consistent is really irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Get that through your head, you are remembered for what you do in the grand-slams and other big events, not the 250s you win. Tomas is a bigger threat to Nadal, unless Nadal is injured of-course, that's where vultures like Ferrer thrive...picking up the craps and preying on the injured player to falsely boost your profile. He's not a nicer guy either, that's an absurd statement to make. When has Berdych done something as classless as lobbing a ball at a child. If you want to go down that route, Berdcyh has star-power and Ferrer does not, why do think Ferrer gets shafted to the outside courts during majors, it's because no-one wants to watch an uncharacteristic grinder. People want to watch guys that have a chance of winning the whole thing. Oh and for Nadal, you won't see Ferrer put up the level that Tomas showed in the quarter this year in Australia, you just won't because he quite simply doesn't have the ability to do so.

Well I really dislike Berdych so that might influence my opinion, but the dude is sooo inconsistent in his results. Ferrer may be a "vulture", but at least he comes up with the results on a regular basis. It is very close though.

No it's not close. The fact that Tomas could blow Ferrer of the court if he was in shape should be enough to end this thread. Seriously yes the annoying Ferrer fanbase has brought up his tiring 'consistency' (at getting owned by the top dogs when it matters ;)) but is there anything else?. When has Ferrer done what Berdych did at Madrid?. Look at thier matches vs Nadal on clay this year, that's the difference. Berdych is a contender, Ferrer is a pretender...:rolleyes:

Ferrer's slam results are a hoax. Look at his draw for gods sake and the look at what Berdych had to do. Berdych had to beat Querrey, the one who has been the form player of the US Open series, Almagro in the quarters (his nemesis) and Federer in the quarter. Ferrer's semi is nothing compared to Berdych's one. There's a major difference in how they earn them.


Agreed about Berdych being better than Ferrer when they're both at their peak, but honestly how often is Berdych at his peak? Maybe 4-5 times a year? At least Ferrer is peaking 99% of the time despite him still being inferior. Ferrer makes the most he can out of his seemingly weaponless game.

Berdych is at his peak when it matters normally, unlike Ferrer who peaks for 250 finals. "still being inferior" "weaponless game" you took the words out of my mouth. A guy with those attributes you eloquently put, cannot be a better player than Berdych. Ferrer's better at running a marathon, Berdych is better at playing tennis.

So reaching two Slams semis in your entire career (losing both) and never winning a Masters are numbers of an elite player.

That's actually good to know; with the standards so low, some of my underachieving favorites are elite players too.

:lol::yeah:

losing both in embarrassing fashion and in the process soiling the top 10 ranking. How can anyone say Ferrer is a worthy number 5 after the performance he put in vs Nadal in Roland-Garros? come on, he's so far behind Berdych that anyone who argues against is taking the piss.

so far carreer-wise Ferrer imo, but Berdych surely can do many big things in next years, bigger than Ferrer did, and I've suspected for several years that Berdych could be better than Tsonga, it comes in the light more and more as Berdych improves everything.

At the moment probably Berdych but once again imo Ferrer played really great in Barcelona final, quite equivalent level as Berdych today, maybe better, but Berdych surely can do better things on other surfaces.

Yes Ferrer played well in the Barcelona final only to show zero mental strength and choke it away like an absolute loser. He even chokes at the late stages of 500 level. Career-wise Berdych has made a grand-slam final at the most prestigious tournament in existence beating Federer and Djokovic along the way. He even has a masters title.

blank_frackis
09-08-2012, 11:22 AM
Berdych, easily. When I think of "better player", I don't think of the more consistent player. I think of the one with more upside, and based on that criteria, Berdych trumps Ferrer.

The sport is about consistency. There's about 50 guys who can look great for short periods, but it means nothing if you can't keep it up.

If the two of them played in the final tomorrow (regardless of what miracle would need to occur for that situation to actually happen) I'd expect Ferrer to win because he's the more consistent player. The fact that Berdych is capable of having a purple patch every 6 months is irrelevant because the chances of that happening in any given match are slim.

BodyServe
09-08-2012, 11:39 AM
The sport is about consistency. There's about 50 guys who can look great for short periods, but it means nothing if you can't keep it up.

If the two of them played in the final tomorrow (regardless of what miracle would need to occur for that situation to actually happen) I'd expect Ferrer to win because he's the more consistent player. The fact that Berdych is capable of having a purple patch every 6 months is irrelevant because the chances of that happening in any given match are slim.

But it can happen... unlike Ferrer beating Federer...

And this is exactly what makes Berdych a much better tennis player.

blank_frackis
09-08-2012, 11:54 AM
But it can happen... unlike Ferrer beating Federer...

And this is exactly what makes Berdych a much better tennis player.

Well let's take the hypothetical situation above of them both being in the final tomorrow. If we assume that Berdych brings his best tennis 25% of the time (a gross exaggeration in reality) and we also assume that Ferrer just plays his normal game every match, then if Ferrer's normal game beats Berdych on an off day (but loses to him on a good day), he's more likely to win the match. Ferrer should win 75% of the time and Berdych 25% of the time.

It's a strange definition of "better player" we're using when the supposedly inferior one of the two is actually more likely to win.

GSMnadal
09-08-2012, 11:57 AM
It's a strange definition of "better player" we're using when the supposedly inferior one of the two is actually more likely to win.

Agreed, but surprised to see this coming from a Federer fan :p

Sophitia36
09-08-2012, 12:05 PM
The tongue. :hearts: :inlove:

He should win just because of his ridiculous level of hotness. :drool:

Since Lenders brought up the topic Berdych's supposedly hotter girlfriend, I think that might actually be a legitimate criteria. (although TBH I do find Berdych pretty handsome)


Anyway. Never understood the point of all those "who is better" debates. It sometimes reminds me of playground disputes between children of about 6 or 7, arguing about which Saint Seiya knight is the best, whether it's Seiya because he always wins in the end although he's weaker, or Ikki who kicks ass but only shows up once every three months...
Or if you prefer, geeks who bicker for hours about whether Ironman would beat Hulk or something.

Even if you assume there is a point to debating "who is the best" or the GOAT (and I don't really believe there is a point, but that's just me)... You would first have to explain what you mean by "better", and there are so many criteria, it's just not possible to agree.

The magic of tennis is that there's no logic in it, you can beat a player all the time and yet this player might do better than you against another player that you can't beat... You can't just count the brownie points to see who's better in the end. It's endless.

Anyway, I don't think Berdych has a much better record against the top 3 than Ferrer, seems pretty equivalent to me.

MaxPower
09-08-2012, 12:17 PM
Watch the SFs later today. Then you'll know why one of them has a slam final and a M1000 title while the other doesn't.

If better means who can play the best tennis, highest level tennis = Berdych

if better means who has the highest "low level", that is who is best on a bad day: Ferrer

Ben D.
09-08-2012, 01:00 PM
You wont know for sure, because they wont meet this week :)
sorry Nadaltards/Fedtards, another top 4 is winning a slam this week.

Roy Emerson
09-08-2012, 01:03 PM
Berdych

Orange Wombat
09-08-2012, 03:20 PM
Easy answer: Who is better when they are playing their best? Berdych

Who plays better on average? Ferrer

Who has the best slam result? Berdych

Who has better slam results on average? Ferrer

Who has won the biggest title? Berdych

Who has won more titles? Ferrer

Sanya
11-04-2012, 03:03 PM
And now... :rolleyes:

Mark Lenders
11-04-2012, 03:04 PM
Still Berdych by far.

Slade
11-04-2012, 03:06 PM
Bashdyck is better because he hits the ball harder.

GSMnadal
11-04-2012, 03:07 PM
Where is Ferrer's slam final? Yeah, beating Llodra and Janowicz doesn't change a thing :rolleyes:

Ben.
11-04-2012, 03:08 PM
Prettier game and now a prettier CV. Too good David :bowdown:

MuzzahLovah
11-04-2012, 03:09 PM
Had to be done.

Berdych wins only because he's more attractive :hearts:

Ferrer is the bigger threat, especially indoors with his masters.

manadrainer
11-04-2012, 03:11 PM
Berdych and it's bit even close. He's clearly a superior player. And that's coming from a Fed fan who's supposed to hate berdych.

Filo V.
11-04-2012, 03:12 PM
The answer is Ferrer. Berdych has the higher peak but that does not make him the better player overall.

BroTree123
11-04-2012, 03:14 PM
Still Berdych. He has that slam final.

Certinfy
11-04-2012, 03:16 PM
Berdych and it's bit even close. He's clearly a superior player. And that's coming from a Fed fan who's supposed to hate berdych.
A Federer fan with sense. :eek: :worship:

Mark Lenders
11-04-2012, 03:16 PM
Berdych and it's bit even close. He's clearly a superior player. And that's coming from a Fed fan who's supposed to hate berdych.

Good to see some people are able to preserve their objectivity :yeah:

Chris Kuerten
11-04-2012, 03:31 PM
If you ignore the fact that Ferrer is better in virtually every department, Berdych is clearly better.

pusher for life
11-04-2012, 03:34 PM
Comparing a Wimbledon finalist who beat Federer on his way to a vulture who beat a qualifier to win his first masters :facepalm:

Looner
11-04-2012, 03:36 PM
If you ignore the fact that Ferrer is better in virtually every department, Berdych is clearly better.

Every department :confused:. If you mean results, it's clearly Berdych. If you mean consistency, it's possibly Ferrer. However, both have a Masters now and still Berdie has the slam final. Hard to see where your virtually every department is...

TigerTim
11-04-2012, 03:37 PM
Ferrer

Berdych's slam final appearance was a one sided embarrassing destruction. Kind of like Fed v Hewitt or Nole v Murray.

End da Game
11-04-2012, 03:38 PM
berdshit's tantrums are a disgrace to tennis, on the other hand ferrer is a vulture

nastoff
11-04-2012, 03:38 PM
Ferrer better, ranked higher therefore he's better...simples

Chris Kuerten
11-04-2012, 03:42 PM
Every department :confused:. If you mean results, it's clearly Berdych. If you mean consistency, it's possibly Ferrer. However, both have a Masters now and still Berdie has the slam final. Hard to see where your virtually every department is...Titles, performance in finals, overall win/loss record, overall win/loss record in slams, career high ranking, record versus top 10, do you get the picture?

nastoff
11-04-2012, 03:43 PM
h2h record Ferrer 8 Berdych 3

Javi
11-04-2012, 03:44 PM
Where is Ferrer's slam final? Yeah, beating Llodra and Janowicz doesn't change a thing :rolleyes:

Where is Berdych WTF final? :rolleyes:

Nole Rules
11-04-2012, 03:47 PM
Where is Berdych WTF final? :rolleyes:

Slam Final > WTF Final.

Javi
11-04-2012, 03:47 PM
H2H: Ferrer
Results against top players: Ferrer
Current ranking: Ferrer
Best ranking: Ferrer
Number of titles: Ferrer
Best Slam result: Berdych
Best WTF result: Ferrer
Number of WTF played: Ferrer
TMS titles: Tied

So we have an obvious winner, FERRER

Javi
11-04-2012, 03:48 PM
One Slam Final doesn't make a difference.

Nole Rules
11-04-2012, 03:51 PM
One Slam Final doesn't make a difference.

For Ferrertards, yes it doesn't make a difference. :lol:

Mark Lenders
11-04-2012, 03:52 PM
H2H: Ferrer
Results against top players: Ferrer
Current ranking: Ferrer
Best ranking: Ferrer
Number of titles: Ferrer
Best Slam result: Berdych
Best WTF result: Ferrer
Number of WTF played: Ferrer
TMS titles: Tied

So we have an obvious winner, FERRER

:superlol:

Are we talking about David 3 sets in 13 matches vs Federer never beat a top 8 player in the semis or final of any tournament Ferrer :spit:?

Berdych actually beat Federer twice in a Slam, and Federer & Djokovic back to back once.

Javi
11-04-2012, 03:55 PM
For Ferrertards, yes it doesn't make a difference. :lol:

Verkerk and Puerta have a GS final, for God's sake :facepalm:

Mark Lenders
11-04-2012, 03:56 PM
Verkerk and Puerta have a GS final, for God's sake :facepalm:

Yup, and both are better players than Ferrer, so I don't see what your point is.

Chris Kuerten
11-04-2012, 03:57 PM
:superlol:

Are we talking about David 3 sets in 13 matches vs Federer never beat a top 8 player in the semis or final of any tournament Ferrer :spit:?

Berdych actually beat Federer twice in a Slam, and Federer & Djokovic back to back once.And he still has a better record versus top 10 players than Berdych, imagine how bad this Berdych guy must be :shrug:

GSMnadal
11-04-2012, 03:58 PM
Don't speak badly about the great Verkerk :armed:

Jverweij
11-04-2012, 03:59 PM
Don't speak badly about the great Verkerk :armed:

hear hear!

Certinfy
11-04-2012, 03:59 PM
And he still has a better record versus top 10 players than Berdych, imagine how bad this Berdych guy must be :shrug:
Berdych only plays well against GOATs.

Looner
11-04-2012, 04:02 PM
I love how people talk about most titles but there's a few years difference between them :facepalm:. I am not even a fan of either and am happy about Ferrer. But it's definitely not as clear-cut as some might it to be.

Nole Rules
11-04-2012, 04:04 PM
Backhand: Berdych
Forehand: Berdych
ROS: Ferrer
Serve: Berdych
Power: Berdych
Consistency: Ferrer
Movement: Ferrer
Net game: Berdych
Shotmaking: Berdych
Ballstriking: Berdych
Raw talent: Berdych by far.
Higher level of tennis: Berdych by far.
The more skilled player: Berdych by far.
Bigger threat to top players: Berdych.

There is simply a huge gap between these 2 in terms of tennis ability.
Berdych will end up with the better career for sure.

Chris Kuerten
11-04-2012, 04:06 PM
I love how people talk about most titles but there's a few years difference between them :facepalm:. I am not even a fan of either and am happy about Ferrer. But it's definitely not as clear-cut as some might it to be.I love how you ignore the other points and start about that :lol:

Berdych is three years younger and needs to win 10 titles to catch up :shrug:

green25814
11-04-2012, 04:28 PM
Ferrer has better groundstrokes than Berdych, easily

latso
11-04-2012, 04:57 PM
Ferrer has better groundstrokes than Berdych, easily
If better means more consistent then ok, but if it means more dangerous/powerful/precise - then no.

"Who is better" could mean different things. Ferrer is a better person, Berdych is a better basketball player.

Career wise so far - Ferrer. He's been a solid top 10 for years.

After both end their careers - i think Berdych will have achieved more.

It's a classical defense against offense kind of discussion here and while offense is prettier to watch, defense is most often more efficient.

So it's really hard to say. At the moment they're pretty equal. In a few years should be Tbird.

Tag
11-04-2012, 05:29 PM
berdych lived for beating frauderer

he denied the abusive swiss a gold medal at a time when frauderer still played exciting tennis

this gave him a meaning to his life, the oxygen for him to breathe

mugbych got all excited in wimbledon 2010 when he beat the arrogant serve bot then laid down for the humble spainard

his career peaked then. now he only lives to deny olderer fluke grand slams

Federer in 2
06-07-2013, 06:31 PM
/case closed.

Nidhogg
06-07-2013, 06:35 PM
/case closed.

How so?

InfoKenway
01-21-2014, 04:49 PM
Can we say that now Berdych is better?

GSMnadal
01-21-2014, 04:51 PM
Can we say that now Berdych is better?

We all knew that already

fede37
01-21-2014, 06:20 PM
Tomas is the better and most talented player
And not even close!

Mark Lenders
01-21-2014, 06:22 PM
Can we say that now Berdych is better?

Has there ever been any doubt?

InfoKenway
01-21-2014, 06:24 PM
Has there ever been any doubt?

After Ferrer's GS F it was doubtful.

fede37
01-21-2014, 07:06 PM
Berdych
M1000 title: beat 5 top 20 in a row
GS F: beat Federer and Djokovic btb

Vulturrer
M1000 title: beat 2 top 20
GS F: beat Tsonga :lol:

Pangloss
01-21-2014, 07:21 PM
Ferrer.

Both have 1 GS final.
Ferrer has 5 GS SF vs Berdych's 3, and 8 QF vs Berdych's 5.
Both have 1 M1000, but Ferrer has 5 M1000 final's vs Berdych's 2.
Ferrer has 20 career titles, including 7 500's. Berdych has 8 titles, 1 of which is a 500.
Ferrer has done better at the WTF.

This is quite obvious.