LLodra best volleyier on tour? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

LLodra best volleyier on tour?

bornnl
05-15-2012, 01:59 PM
It is just unbeliveble how he is doing at net against delpotro.
Best net performance ever

DJ Soup
05-15-2012, 02:02 PM
it's what he does for a living. pretty coherent ain't?

LastRocket
05-15-2012, 02:05 PM
last of its kind

gators0708
05-15-2012, 02:07 PM
By far the best.

Orka_n
05-15-2012, 02:18 PM
Yes, he is.

Mark Lenders
05-15-2012, 02:19 PM
Yes, no doubt about that.

Too bad he doesn't have a better serve to play serve & volley more effectively.

Certinfy
05-15-2012, 02:22 PM
Yes, by a very long way.

SVK
05-15-2012, 02:26 PM
Too bad he doesn't have a better serve to play serve & volley more effectively.

He has actually very good and strong serve...we definitely can´t say it´s his weakness or that it limits him. Very effective on fast surfaces.

Chris Kuerten
05-15-2012, 02:30 PM
Too bad he only plays decent tennis a couple of tournaments each year.

motorhead
05-15-2012, 03:33 PM
Yes.

Agrajag
05-15-2012, 04:03 PM
Yes, no doubt about that.

Too bad he doesn't have a better serve to play serve & volley more effectively.

I think most players would disagree with that statement. Söderling called it unbelievable, and Lindstedt said it's impossible to read. It is far from the fastest, but it is well placed and usually comes with a lot of spin.

Besides, his second serve can be lethal indoors.

Dougie
05-15-2012, 05:00 PM
Too bad he only plays decent tennis a couple of tournaments each year.

He plays much more than that, just not in singles.

Chris Kuerten
05-15-2012, 05:08 PM
He plays much more than that, just not in singles.Yeah, but doubles isn't really relevant.

Li Ching Yuen
05-15-2012, 05:14 PM
Always nice to have new fans of the sport joining in.

mooncreek
05-15-2012, 05:29 PM
I will be sad the day Llodra decides to only play doubles. What was great about today's match is it forced del Potro to show off touch he's not normally known for. Plus, he's half of the craziest game of tennis all year (Murray at AO).

Hian-GOAT
05-15-2012, 05:30 PM
As much as I dislike him as a person, yes, he is the best volleyer on court by far.

Fumus
05-15-2012, 05:33 PM
Better than Federer?

The Bryan Brothers have some pretty nice hands at net as well.

I would say he's pretty creative with his vollies but certainly there are ton of players on tour just as good...no?

Dougie
05-15-2012, 05:39 PM
Yeah, but doubles isn't really relevant.

Some of the best volleys and shotmaking are done in doubles nowadays. But if your idea of tennis is Nadal and Djokovic, then sure, I guess doubles isn´t that relevant.

Orka_n
05-15-2012, 05:54 PM
Better than Federer?Yes. Whether that is because Federer has chosen not to play Serve & volley that much since his yearly years isn't really relevant.
The Bryan Brothers have some pretty nice hands at net as well.

I would say he's pretty creative with his vollies but certainly there are ton of players on tour just as good...no?Doubles players are in general much better at the net but we're talking singles here and no, I don't think there's anyone better then. Sexy is good too though.

loopback
05-15-2012, 06:01 PM
I think he does it a little too often.

Fumus
05-15-2012, 06:01 PM
Yes. Whether that is because Federer has chosen not to play Serve & volley that much since his yearly years isn't really relevant.
We're talking singles here and no, I don't think there's anyone better. Sexy is good too though.


Llodra is really good, I just don't know if you can say he's the best on tour. I suppose on his day it's possible...but he's so limited by the rest of his game that I think the vollies stick out because other than the serve it's really the only bright spot.

It's why I think players like Nalbandian or even Feliciano can volley just as well but fans don't notice because their entire game isn't built around it.

timafi
05-15-2012, 06:05 PM
well duh!

Orka_n
05-15-2012, 06:07 PM
Llodra is really good, I just don't know if you can say he's the best on tour. I suppose on his day it's possible...but he's so limited by the rest of his game that I think the vollies stick out because other than the serve it's really the only bright spot.

It's why I think players like Nalbandian or even Feliciano can volley just as well but fans don't notice because their entire game isn't built around it.Llodra has high ranking only because of his volleys. Had the courts in this day and age been faster, he'd probably be top 10. Nalby and Lopez? No way.

Fumus
05-15-2012, 06:33 PM
Llodra has high ranking only because of his volleys. Had the courts in this day and age been faster, he'd probably be top 10. Nalby and Lopez? No way.

Silly argument really because if the courts were faster than you would see more S&V and more players coming to net and Llodra wouldn't even be in the discussion. He has great vollies but the only reason posters are even suggesting he is the best at it is because he spends so much time up there relative to other players. I just think you can't discount the all court players that do come to net from time to time. Just because they don't base their game around it doesn't mean their netplay isn't just as effective.

I do think guys like Nalby, Tommy Haas, Federer, etc. have great hands at net and can produce some of the best vollies on tour on their day.

Llodra isn't even the best S&V player on tour at the moment, it's sexy Stepanek.

Orka_n
05-15-2012, 06:38 PM
Silly argument really because if the courts were faster than you would see more S&V and more players coming to net and Llodra wouldn't even be in the discussion. He has great vollies but the only reason posters are even suggesting he is the best at it is because he spends so much time up there relative to other players.Enough already. As I said, the only reason Llodra is high ranked is his volleys. That says something in this era of slow courts.
I just think you can't discount the all court players that do come to net from time to time. Just because they don't base their game around it doesn't mean their netplay isn't just as effective.Yet you still can't give me a name of someone who's better.

I do think guys like Nalby, Tommy Haas, Federer, etc. have great hands at net and can produce some of the best vollies on their day.

Llodra isn't even the best S&V player on tour at the moment, it's sexy Stepanek.Go ahead, you're free to think what you want. Don't think many agree with you tho

Fumus
05-15-2012, 07:32 PM
Enough already. As I said, the only reason Llodra is high ranked is his volleys. That says something in this era of slow courts.
Yet you still can't give me a name of someone who's better.

Go ahead, you're free to think what you want. Don't think many agree with you tho

1) This is where you are wrong and you are disregarding my argument about the well rounded all court players. The slowing of the game has to do with the demise of the serve and volley... the pure net game players...but vollies are vollies. It doesn't matter if the court is slow or not. If you take the ball out of the air instead of letting it bounce that's a volley it doesn't matter if you are doing it 3 times a match or 30. So you need to decide on your argument here, are you saying Llodra is the best S&V/net rushing player on tour? According the rankings he's not...he's behind Stepanek.

If you are saying he has the best vollies, I disagree and I think players like Federer, Haas, Nalbandian, Tsonga, Mardy Fish have vollies that are just as good if not better.

2) Quantifying something like who has "the best [insert shot here]" is so subjective it's really hard to actually come up with an answer because everyone has an opinion about what the best is. Also players form changes so it's a fluid thing. As far as vollies go, I named a bunch of players that I think were equal or better but you dismissed them.

3)Thank you for letting me have an opinion. Here I was thinking we as a forum had to come to one giant consensus about everything...phew! I was worried.

Agrajag
05-15-2012, 09:10 PM
So you need to decide on your argument here, are you saying Llodra is the best S&V/net rushing player on tour? According the rankings he's not...he's behind Stepanek.

If you are saying he has the best vollies, I disagree and I think players like Federer, Haas, Nalbandian, Tsonga, Mardy Fish have vollies that are just as good if not better.


When discussing the enigma that is Michael Llodra, there are many things that has to be said. Llodra only shows up for around half of the singles tournaments he plays. He is well known for his tanking, retiring and maybe even a fix or two.

Regarding his game, all the players you compare him with are vastly superior in every element besides serve, volley and touch. Stepanek is by no means a pure S&V player. Throughout a season, I am sure he does this on less than 30% of his service points. I would say Llodra follows in on around 70% of his. (Including second serve.)

On the singles tour, he is the best volleyer. Others can probably finish of a an easy put-away as good as him, but no one can dig up so many low half-volleys and cover the net as well as he does.

He is, along with Mahut to a lesser degree, the last of his kind. "The last samurai" as he was named in an older thread.

When he calls it a day and begins his new career as a sommelier, tennis will miss him.

That is of course just my opinion, but the players did pick him in the Miami perfect player thingy.

Orka_n
05-15-2012, 09:13 PM
1) This is where you are wrong and you are disregarding my argument about the well rounded all court players. The slowing of the game has to do with the demise of the serve and volley... the pure net game players...but vollies are vollies. It doesn't matter if the court is slow or not. If you take the ball out of the air instead of letting it bounce that's a volley it doesn't matter if you are doing it 3 times a match or 30. So you need to decide on your argument here, are you saying Llodra is the best S&V/net rushing player on tour? According the rankings he's not...he's behind Stepanek.Stepanek has a better ground game and uses his experience more on court. And I have already admitted Sexy volleys very well. Not quite at Llodra's level though.

If you are saying he has the best vollies, I disagree and I think players like Federer, Haas, Nalbandian, Tsonga, Mardy Fish have vollies that are just as good if not better.:haha:

2) Quantifying something like who has "the best [insert shot here]" is so subjective it's really hard to actually come up with an answer because everyone has an opinion about what the best is. Also players form changes so it's a fluid thing. As far as vollies go, I named a bunch of players that I think were equal or better but you dismissed them.Ok, fact is I think Nadal has the best volleys on tour. But hey it's such a subjective thing.

3)Thank you for letting me have an opinion. Here I was thinking we as a forum had to come to one giant consensus about everything...phew! I was worried.Of course, just a general tip: when too many people are disagreeing with you, you might have missed something.

TigerTim
05-15-2012, 09:18 PM
such a shame this art has died. Nothing more exciting in tennis than two radically contrasting styles going head to head

ApproachShot
05-15-2012, 10:08 PM
I'd have to agree that he is. Great to watch the variation from the baseline style.

Haelfix
05-15-2012, 10:18 PM
I think Federer has hands and volleying variety that easily equals Llodra's at net, but he doesn't cover the net or anticipate quite as well (the flip side is he has a better serve). Those two definitely have the best overall volleying ability on tour, at least in the singles game.

Filo V.
05-15-2012, 10:30 PM
His anticipation ability and hands are better than his actual volleying skills............to answer the question, yes, he has the best volley on tour, as he uses his volley as a weapon more than any other player and does so effectively for the most part.

Orange Wombat
05-15-2012, 11:05 PM
Yes he is. Llodra has it all, athleticism, reflexes, touch, angle, spin....Of course his game is just dancing around at the net and hitting wild shots.

I think Granollers also has surprisingly a great volley. A pity half is game is ugly grinding.:o

Topspindoctor
05-16-2012, 12:20 AM
Why is this topic still open?

Federer has the best volleys of all time :worship::bowdown:

MIMIC
05-16-2012, 01:52 AM
Watching the match now.

Holy shit...his volleying is like Raonic's serve: unbelievable, reliable, and seemingly effortless.

tektonac
05-16-2012, 02:30 AM
llodra all the way.

evilmindbulgaria
05-16-2012, 02:35 AM
Llodra's volleys are amazing!

rosehavn
05-16-2012, 02:57 AM
I really enjoyed watching the match between Llodra and del Potro today. Llodra was amazing, and he was the reason I joined the forum today. I have never seen volleying like that before. I wanted him to win...so I could see him play more singles.

Henry Chinaski
05-16-2012, 04:40 AM
I just watched the highlights.

came in my pants 3 (three) times.

Topspindoctor
05-16-2012, 04:43 AM
Whoa. You came by watching an ATP match? For shame.

BroTree123
05-16-2012, 04:45 AM
The best part of this thread is the spelling.

Puschkin
05-16-2012, 05:33 AM
Some of the best volleys and shotmaking are done in doubles nowadays.

Good point. I have been in Monte Carlo for the whole week and the best match I saw was the doubles between the Murray and the Bryan brothers. Too bad that there is hardly no doubles on TV or on streams.

green25814
05-16-2012, 06:05 AM
I know a lot of people dislike his personality and I agree he can be a dick at times, but for me there isn't a better sight in tennis today than Llodra net-rushing someone like Del Potro.

Fumus
05-16-2012, 01:57 PM
Stepanek has a better ground game and uses his experience more on court. And I have already admitted Sexy volleys very well. Not quite at Llodra's level though.

:haha:

Ok, fact is I think Nadal has the best volleys on tour. But hey it's such a subjective thing.

Of course, just a general tip: when too many people are disagreeing with you, you might have missed something.

Bla-bla-bla, I didn't read anything Fumus wrote. Post some smilies. bla-bla-bla. I think Llodra has the best vollies, everyone else thinks this too therefore you cannot be right. bla-bla-bla.

You respond like 90% of the posters here on MTF, neither bothering to craft a coherent argument or even acknowledging the valid points I've made. I'm wasting my effort writing anything, I think.

You could think Nadal has the best vollies on tour, why not? It's an opinion.

ANY TOPIC ABOUT WHO HAS THE BEST _________ IS SUBJECTIVE. Posters rate these things so differently...either by the beauty of the shot, the pace of it, it's effectiveness, the spin..etc. etc. I mean it's just silly. We all have our own thoughts about what makes the best, the best.

Sorry but you telling me Llodra is the best simply because he is...is just stupid. I'm not worried about anyone else disagreeing with me, I was having a discussion about this with you. You can't seem to come up with any reasons why Llodra is the best except that, I am wrong and he is.

Now that I've made my points, let me put this in a post you will understand.

bla-bla-bla. Smiley face. One word dismissive answer. Everyone knows I'm right.

Orka_n
05-16-2012, 02:29 PM
Bla-bla-bla, I didn't read anything Fumus wrote. Post some smilies. bla-bla-bla. I think Llodra has the best vollies, everyone else thinks this too therefore you cannot be right. bla-bla-bla.

You respond like 90% of the posters here on MTF, neither bothering to craft a coherent argument or even acknowledging the valid points I've made. I'm wasting my effort writing anything, I think.

You could think Nadal has the best vollies on tour, why not? It's an opinion.

ANY TOPIC ABOUT WHO HAS THE BEST _________ IS SUBJECTIVE. Posters rate these things so differently...either by the beauty of the shot, the pace of it, it's effectiveness, the spin..etc. etc. I mean it's just silly. We all have our own thoughts about what makes the best, the best.

Sorry but you telling me Llodra is the best simply because he is...is just stupid. I'm not worried about anyone else disagreeing with me, I was having a discussion about this with you. You can't seem to come up with any reasons why Llodra is the best except that, I am wrong and he is.

Now that I've made my points, let me put this in a post you will understand.

bla-bla-bla. Smiley face. One word dismissive answer. Everyone knows I'm right.Put a lid on the cockiness already, you're still making zero sense. I didn't elaborate on my opinions in the last post exactly because of that; I've tried to talk sense to nonsensical people here before without any luck. "You could think Nadal has the best vollies on tour, why not?" Really? Then why are you even talking here and disputing OPs post about Llodra if there literally is no right and wrong? "Player X is the best at _______" is not nearly as subjective as you think. (Or pretends to think because saying it is sounds cool.)

Thing is, when you bring in Tsonga and Fish who can't hit a punch volley to save their life into this discussion you can't really convince anyone anymore.

You want reasons why Llodra is the best? Because he has the best mix of touch, depth & variation at the net. His movement there is great too. Happy? (And for further information on the subject, read the other posts in this thread.)

Fumus
05-16-2012, 03:38 PM
Put a lid on the cockiness already, you're still making zero sense. I didn't elaborate on my opinions in the last post exactly because of that; I've tried to talk sense to nonsensical people here before without any luck. "You could think Nadal has the best vollies on tour, why not?" Really? Then why are you even talking here and disputing OPs post about Llodra if there literally is no right and wrong? "Player X is the best at _______" is not nearly as subjective as you think. (Or pretends to think because saying it is sounds cool.)

Thing is, when you bring in Tsonga and Fish who can't hit a punch volley to save their life into this discussion you can't really convince anyone anymore.

You want reasons why Llodra is the best? Because he has the best mix of touch, depth & variation at the net. His movement there is great too. Happy? (And for further information on the subject, read the other posts in this thread.)

Aha! So there is actually a mind working behind the random key punching.

Because this is a freaking bandwaggon thread and you're riding shotgun. OP was watching Llodra playing DelPo yesterday and suddenly decided he has the best vollies on tour because he's one of the few players that netrushes.

Netrushing doesn't not a great vollier make. Yes you spend a ton of time at net but so what, there are are plenty of all court players that I've mentioned that volley just as a well if not better...volleying is by definition simply taking the ball out of the air and not letting it bounce...they do this just as well if not better then Llodra. It just happens to be that Micheal charges to net all the time so you get to see him take all of these crazy off balance pickups/vollies because that's his style of play. I'll give Llodra this, he certainly makes volleying the most entertaining on tour because he takes all kinds of crazy ones that no sensible all court player would attempt(they would stay back).


I don't think Llodra is the best vollier on tour I think he's one* of the best S&V players.

Really Tsonga can't volley? Neither can Fish? Wow. Are you drunk 90% of the time during their matches?

How about Federer and Haas? I suppose they can't hit punch volleys either.

Nalbandian has amazing hands at net...no credit to him either?

What about Mischa Zverev? Does he not have equal volley skill?

I disagree that Llodra is the best vollier on tour, there is no right or wrong...only opinions on these such things. I've already discussed why that is. Because everyone's idea of beauty, effectiveness and even proper technique differs...also because form is fluid. Surely there are days when even Llodra is not as good as his average self and thus another who would not normally be as good of a vollier would be better than him on that day. Sometimes Federer can't keep the ball in the court off his forehand and other days he arguably has the best forehand on tour. Nothing is always the best in sports.

You can quantify who has the highest first serve win percentage, who wins the most return games, etc...the ATP doesn't keep a stat as far as I can tell for net points won, if they did you might actually have some type of factual ground to stand on. As of right now, you just have an opinion which I disagree with...by nature I cannot be wrong because an opinion is a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge (that's from the dictionary).

I hope you can acknowledge that unlike you I have ground my arguments in logic....who's making zero sense?

Orka_n
05-16-2012, 04:20 PM
Aha! So there is actually a mind working behind the random key punching.

Because this is a freaking bandwaggon thread and you're riding shotgun. OP was watching Llodra playing DelPo yesterday and suddenly decided he has the best vollies on tour because he's one of the few players that netrushes.

Netrushing doesn't not a great vollier make. Yes you spend a ton of time at net but so what, there are are plenty of all court players that I've mentioned that volley just as a well if not better...volleying is by definition simply taking the ball out of the air and not letting it bounce...they do this just as well if not better then Llodra. It just happens to be that Micheal charges to net all the time so you get to see him take all of these crazy off balance pickups/vollies because that's his style of play. I'll give Llodra this, he certainly makes volleying the most entertaining on tour because he takes all kinds of crazy ones that no sensible all court player would attempt(they would stay back).


I don't think Llodra is the best vollier on tour I think he's one* of the best S&V players.

Really Tsonga can't volley? Neither can Fish? Wow. Are you drunk 90% of the time during their matches?

How about Federer and Haas? I suppose they can't hit punch volleys either.

Nalbandian has amazing hands at net...no credit to him either?

What about Mischa Zverev? Does he not have equal volley skill?

I disagree that Llodra is the best vollier on tour, there is no right or wrong...only opinions on these such things. I've already discussed why that is. Because everyone's idea of beauty, effectiveness and even proper technique differs...also because form is fluid. Surely there are days when even Llodra is not as good as his average self and thus another who would not normally be as good of a vollier would be better than him on that day. Sometimes Federer can't keep the ball in the court off his forehand and other days he arguably has the best forehand on tour. Nothing is always the best in sports.

You can quantify who has the highest first serve win percentage, who wins the most return games, etc...the ATP doesn't keep a stat as far as I can tell for net points won, if they did you might actually have some type of factual ground to stand on. As of right now, you just have an opinion which I disagree with...by nature I cannot be wrong because an opinion is a view or judgment formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge (that's from the dictionary).

I hope you can acknowledge that unlike you I have ground my arguments in logic....who's making zero sense?Honestly, I don't know where you get your energy from. Perhaps you're trying the classic Sapeod strategy of "if I get the last word I win the argument". Opinions cannot be wrong, fine, but they sure can be stupid (in the eyes of others). I don't have the time nor the energy to respond to all of this, however I will say that this is hardly a bandwagon thread. I'm willing to bet many here (including me) didn't even watch the Llodra - Delpo match but it is a well known fact that Llodra has perhaps the best volleys on tour (many players agree with this as well). And nowhere did I say that the players you mentioned like Fed, Sexy or Haas were poor volleyers. I have only been crass and compared them to Llodra (which is actually the topic) and I can't see them beating him in that particular part of the game. Also, I get the feeling that you don't really like the frenchman.

Fumus
05-16-2012, 06:01 PM
Honestly, I don't know where you get your energy from. Perhaps you're trying the classic Sapeod strategy of "if I get the last word I win the argument". Opinions cannot be wrong, fine, but they sure can be stupid (in the eyes of others). I don't have the time nor the energy to respond to all of this, however I will say that this is hardly a bandwagon thread. I'm willing to bet many here (including me) didn't even watch the Llodra - Delpo match but it is a well known fact that Llodra has perhaps the best volleys on tour (many players agree with this as well). And nowhere did I say that the players you mentioned like Fed, Sexy or Haas were poor volleyers. I have only been crass and compared them to Llodra (which is actually the topic) and I can't see them beating him in that particular part of the game. Also, I get the feeling that you don't really like the frenchman.

Huh?!?

1) You admit to not reading or at the very least not wanting to respond to everything I've written. I mentioned this a couple posts back that you are exactly like 90% of posters on the board that do the same. You refuse to read and think and respond. You just repeat your same tired statements. I get it you think Micheal Llodra is the best vollier on tour and you think that most people and even professional players agree with you. What I don't get is why you fail to see having the best vollies doesn't mean you have to spend 100% of your time at net. The volley is just another tool players use to win points.

For Llodra it's the best part of his game but that doesn't mean it has to be better than other players who have 5-7 other ways to win any given point. Federer's backhand is way better than Jarkko Nieminen's and that might be Jarko's best shot.

Just because Jarkko wins alot of points by hitting off backhands for example, I'm not going to say it's better than Feds. Just because a shot might be your best shot, it doesn't mean it's the best on tour. Just because you do something alot more than anyways else on tour, doesn't make you the best at it.

2) I have the classic strategy anyone does who plans to win an argument. You create points, base them in logic/fact and then give examples. This is how one makes a case. You don't seem to follow that same strategy, you are dismissive and your rebuttals are repetitive. I don't know who you think you are but I don't find your posts be insightful at all.

3) This isn't a bandwaggon thread? Really? OP said -
It is just unbeliveble how he is doing at net against delpotro.
Best net performance ever
Understanding the OP correctly, I believe he asserted that Llodra was the best vollier on tour while watching his match yesterday...in which, he gave the "Best net performance ever". I'll just leave the definition of a bandwagon here for you...A particular activity or cause that has suddenly become fashionable or popular.

4) Wait so you say that I can have my opinion that Llorda doesn't have the best vollies on tour but then you go on to say that it's a fact that he does? I thought we just agreed these were opinions. Now you're really not making any sense.

5) You just fail to recognize that all court players like Federer, Haas, Nalbandian, etc. can have better vollies than an S&V player(Llodra included) because the other areas of their game are so strong they don't have to rely on volleying.

6) I don't dislike LLodra in the least bit. I enjoy watching him as much as everyone else. I do however, like your attempt to discredit me now that you are losing this argument. Perhaps you should say some other bad things about me too...if you think it will really help you.

green25814
05-16-2012, 06:40 PM
Honestly, I don't know where you get your energy from. Perhaps you're trying the classic Sapeod strategy of "if I get the last word I win the argument". Opinions cannot be wrong, fine, but they sure can be stupid (in the eyes of others). I don't have the time nor the energy to respond to all of this, however I will say that this is hardly a bandwagon thread. I'm willing to bet many here (including me) didn't even watch the Llodra - Delpo match but it is a well known fact that Llodra has perhaps the best volleys on tour (many players agree with this as well). And nowhere did I say that the players you mentioned like Fed, Sexy or Haas were poor volleyers. I have only been crass and compared them to Llodra (which is actually the topic) and I can't see them beating him in that particular part of the game. Also, I get the feeling that you don't really like the frenchman.

:lol:

Though tbf Fumus prefers the tactic of boring you to death using walls of text filled with inane ramblings about the philosophy of tennis or some other bullshit

cutesteve22
05-16-2012, 07:04 PM
I think Granollers is one of the best

latso
05-16-2012, 07:38 PM
No doubt. Among the best ever s&v players, if not the...

EddieNero
05-16-2012, 07:45 PM
Llodra=tennis.

Orka_n
05-16-2012, 07:48 PM
:lol:

Though tbf Fumus prefers the tactic of boring you to death using walls of text filled with inane ramblings about the philosophy of tennis or some other bullshitYeh I give up.

GSMnadal
05-16-2012, 07:49 PM
nvm

GSMnadal
05-16-2012, 07:51 PM
No doubt. Among the best ever s&v players, if not the...

he's just unlucky...would've had numerous wimbledones in the 90's

Orka_n
05-16-2012, 08:07 PM
Huh?!?

1) You admit to not reading or at the very least not wanting to respond to everything I've written. I mentioned this a couple posts back that you are exactly like 90% of posters on the board that do the same. You refuse to read and think and respond. You just repeat your same tired statements. I get it you think Micheal Llodra is the best vollier on tour and you think that most people and even professional players agree with you. What I don't get is why you fail to see having the best vollies doesn't mean you have to spend 100% of your time at net. The volley is just another tool players use to win points.

For Llodra it's the best part of his game but that doesn't mean it has to be better than other players who have 5-7 other ways to win any given point. Federer's backhand is way better than Jarkko Nieminen's and that might be Jarko's best shot.

Just because Jarkko wins alot of points by hitting off backhands for example, I'm not going to say it's better than Feds. Just because a shot might be your best shot, it doesn't mean it's the best on tour. Just because you do something alot more than anyways else on tour, doesn't make you the best at it.

2) I have the classic strategy anyone does who plans to win an argument. You create points, base them in logic/fact and then give examples. This is how one makes a case. You don't seem to follow that same strategy, you are dismissive and your rebuttals are repetitive. I don't know who you think you are but I don't find your posts be insightful at all.

3) This isn't a bandwaggon thread? Really? OP said -

Understanding the OP correctly, I believe he asserted that Llodra was the best vollier on tour while watching his match yesterday...in which, he gave the "Best net performance ever". I'll just leave the definition of a bandwagon here for you...A particular activity or cause that has suddenly become fashionable or popular.

4) Wait so you say that I can have my opinion that Llorda doesn't have the best vollies on tour but then you go on to say that it's a fact that he does? I thought we just agreed these were opinions. Now you're really not making any sense.

5) You just fail to recognize that all court players like Federer, Haas, Nalbandian, etc. can have better vollies than an S&V player(Llodra included) because the other areas of their game are so strong they don't have to rely on volleying.

6) I don't dislike LLodra in the least bit. I enjoy watching him as much as everyone else. I do however, like your attempt to discredit me now that you are losing this argument. Perhaps you should say some other bad things about me too...if you think it will really help you.Your posts really are Seingeist-long - though I honestly find reading Seingeist's lengthy posts soothing as that guy has a way with words. As I said, I have no energy to respond to you as it is totally pointless. Find someone else to bother. (In the Sapeod scoring system I guess you... "won" the argument?) Just gotta say that #6 was genius, playing the victim after being so arrogant. Great stuff.

latso
05-16-2012, 08:39 PM
he's just unlucky...would've had numerous wimbledones in the 90's
Most probably. And your previous pre-edited post was correct too.

Generally Edberg is considered perhaps the best in this game, yet he didn't suffer the same firepower against.

In my head Llodra is the very best anyways, but i would understand ppl disagreing.

bornnl
05-16-2012, 09:24 PM
Yes llodra is best and i am not saying that someone other wouldnt be better if he spents so much time on net but Llodra is just something special...,he is voleying from all positions on court.

Dougie
05-16-2012, 10:45 PM
he's just unlucky...would've had numerous wimbledones in the 90's

No. Llodra is one of the best volleyers today, but he wouldnt have stood a chance against the likes of Sampras, Edberg, Becker etc.

nole_no1
05-16-2012, 11:23 PM
Yes he is. He's a very good doubles player so automatically his volley must be high quality stuff

Clay Death
05-16-2012, 11:28 PM
negative.

fed is the best net player on the tour in singles. end of story.


next topic please.

Serve&Volley01
05-16-2012, 11:35 PM
Llodra is why I joined MTF hence my name.

Llodra has won grand slams with his volleys (doubles). In this era of slow and slower surfaces Serve & Volley is nearly extinct in singles.

Serve&Volley01
05-16-2012, 11:41 PM
negative.

fed is the best net player on the tour in singles. end of story.


next topic please.

This is false. Llodra volleys 10 times more than Fed in any given match. Llodra uses volley as his best and only weapon while to Fed it just one of his secondary weapons he uses every once in a while.

Llodra can hit that sidespin approach mid-court volley like no one on tour while Federer is only better at drop volleys. In fact Llodra's serve may be comparable to Federer as well. Llodra serve is the best out of all the French players.

Mark Lenders
05-16-2012, 11:57 PM
This is false. Llodra volleys 10 times more than Fed in any given match. Llodra uses volley as his best and only weapon while to Fed it just one of his secondary weapons he uses every once in a while.

Llodra can hit that sidespin approach mid-court volley like no one on tour while Federer is only better at drop volleys. In fact Llodra's serve may be comparable to Federer as well. Llodra serve is the best out of all the French players.

Agree about Llodra having the best volleys.

However, Tsonga's serve is considerably better than Llodra's.

lucyfur
05-17-2012, 12:05 AM
LLodra would have fared better in the 90's, he just gets overpowered by the big hitters or out grinded by the defenders in today's game.

Clay Death
05-17-2012, 12:05 AM
llodra is up there folks but he is no Fed at the net.

Fumus
05-17-2012, 01:57 PM
Your posts really are Seingeist-long - though I honestly find reading Seingeist's lengthy posts soothing as that guy has a way with words. As I said, I have no energy to respond to you as it is totally pointless. Find someone else to bother. (In the Sapeod scoring system I guess you... "won" the argument?) Just gotta say that #6 was genius, playing the victim after being so arrogant. Great stuff.

I'm not arrogant, you just don't know what you are talking about and I've been on the forums alot longer than you. I've seen these topics, they happen all the time.

Why do you bother to post at all?

:lol:

Though tbf Fumus prefers the tactic of boring you to death using walls of text filled with inane ramblings about the philosophy of tennis or some other bullshit

Fumus prefers to remember the days when this was a tennis forum and posters focused on the tennis. Not hating on "mugs" and trolling the GM.

llodra is up there folks but he is no Fed at the net.

CD...I don't know if you gotta the memo but everyone else thinks otherwise so therefore we are wrong.

Federer in 2
11-02-2012, 09:30 PM
So IS Llodra better than Stepanek?

IOFH
11-02-2012, 09:39 PM
You're all wrong. Murray rules them all.

Serve&Volley01
11-02-2012, 09:45 PM
Llodra = the last samurai

latso
11-02-2012, 09:46 PM
of course. by far

The Prince
11-02-2012, 09:48 PM
I've always said Llodra is the best. Stepanek and Granollers are the next best, though.

MuzzahLovah
11-02-2012, 10:00 PM
lol now I have to watch the rome highlights.

Mountaindewslave
11-02-2012, 10:19 PM
I'm not arrogant, you just don't know what you are talking about and I've been on the forums alot longer than you. I've seen these topics, they happen all the time.

Why do you bother to post at all?



Fumus prefers to remember the days when this was a tennis forum and posters focused on the tennis. Not hating on "mugs" and trolling the GM.



CD...I don't know if you gotta the memo but everyone else thinks otherwise so therefore we are wrong.

I thiNK Fumus made some good points. just because the best part of your game are your vollies, does not mean you are the best volleyer out there. Llodra vollies ALL THE TIME. if more players tried this tactic (which they don't and is a mistake with the game styles of today, just look at Llodra's results with that tactic the rest of the season when not indoor) then you would likely be impressed with them in similar fashion because naturally you will have incredible gets and an exciting dynamic between opponents

granted, Llodra is a very good volleyer. one of the best. but that's not to say he's any better than Stepanek/Federer, the like. they have adapted more and play a lot with their ground game as well but I'm equally as impressed when I see Stepanek's great instincts and touch at the net

Serve&Volley01
11-02-2012, 10:22 PM
Dude just beat Stepanek R1 this tournament.

Federer in 2
11-02-2012, 10:24 PM
Dude just beat Stepanek R1 this tournament.

Nope, steps retired.
Stepanek on the other hand beat Llodra a couple of weeks ago in straights.

Hensafmurrafter
11-04-2012, 04:03 AM
Well, Llodra is clearly either slumping or declining right now. That is unfortunate.

I love Llodra. He plays the role of Villain/Antihero of Tennis well. And his game is lovely to watch.

GhostUnholy
11-04-2012, 05:28 AM
No doubt. Among the best ever s&v players, if not the...

He's great but come on man. Among the best ever in a style that dominated decades of tennis history?

he's just unlucky...would've had numerous wimbledones in the 90's

I find it hard to believe Llodra would hold up at wimbledon in the 90s against the Henmans and Rafters of the era let alone the truly dominant fast court players, not to even mention the guys that were less consistent threats.


Fumus prefers to remember the days when this was a tennis forum and posters focused on the tennis. Not hating on "mugs" and trolling the GM.


I somehow find it highly difficult to believe that this mythical utopia ever existed on GM