Best serve on the tour at the moment [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Best serve on the tour at the moment

Topspindoctor
05-09-2012, 04:46 AM
Watching some highlights of Raonic match today, I have to say I think his serve is best on tour today. He really hits the spots and hits tons of aces/service winners. On fast surface like Madrid he's unbreakable :eek:

But in another thread, someone argued that Isner has, in fact, better serve. What do you think? I think Raonic is the greatest server on ATP tour right now. It's scary to think about the monster he'll become with more consistent ground game and better footwork.

I have also included a couple of other options, but I think those players are not as good as they were before.

156mphserve
05-09-2012, 04:50 AM
if I were on tour Mine

but I'm not.

Milos has the best first serve. Isner probably has the best 2nd serve. I'll go for Milos

BroTree123
05-09-2012, 05:01 AM
Isner just has a ballbashing 1st serve. Just goes for it anywhere without thinking. He has no 1st serve tactic whereas Milos does.

nellis_lv
05-09-2012, 05:22 AM
Isner relies heavily on his height and same goes for Karlovic.

Milos is 4-5 inches shorter and hits a much harder first serve than any of them.

SelvenluvJo
05-09-2012, 06:49 AM
Peak Roddick conquers all of them.
But nowadays, I agree with Raonic.

romismak
05-09-2012, 11:16 AM
Itīs close between John and Milos, but both are another league comparing to other big servers, even Ivo is far behind them-his serve declined dramatically over lat 2-3 years.

John-highest FS% among big servers, best 2nd serve in the game - his 1st serve isnīt better than some other, hardly even top 5-but with high FS% and great 2nd serve to back up it, really dangerous combo- plus his serve is really great under pressure.

Milos- clearly best 1st serve in the game right now, hitting harder than anyone else-among ATP tour player. Hitting flat bombs-aces, unreturnables, or great slice on 1st serve too.

2nd serve is top 5, not better than Johnīs but, very good, in almos every match he got ace on 2nd serve and many unreturnables too.

But his FS% is lower than Johnīs so now the question stands what is better have best 1st +top 5 2nd with lower FS% or high FS% - top 5-10 1st and best 2nd. Hard to argue here, i think it is very close and i want to see those guys play each other, actually i am dreaming about this match since Milos made his run in Australia 2011. I was hoping they would face each other in Memphis final but they both lost to Melzer....

Topspindoctor
05-09-2012, 11:21 AM
Indeed, Isner vs Raonic match could be interesting somewhere like Cinci or even Paris indoors, preferably deep in the draw so more is at stake.

Mark Lenders
05-09-2012, 11:30 AM
Isner, by a distance. He can regularly serve over 70% in big matches, which is an incredible number for a guy with such a big serve. And his second serve is fantastic as well, and he tends to come up with the goods when he's up against the wall.

His serve keeps him in matches (and even wins) against the likes of Federer and Djokovic in slow surfaces. It's amazing how much of a weapon Isner's serve is, it might very well be the best serve in tennis history. It'd be unthinkable for someone with such a piss poor % of return games won as Isner to be in the top 10 or reach a Masters Finals, but with that serve it's all possible. What makes Isner's serve so impressive isn't how it works against low ranked players (Raonic's might perhaps be more effective there), but how he uses it to, with his very limited game for a top-20/30 player, push the top players (Nadal to 5 at RG) and even beat them.

In terms of game, Raonic has much more though. Which is why, along with the second best serve (and best first serve by a distance) in the tour, he will surely have a much more successful career. He can actually break his opponents as well.

Li Ching Yuen
05-09-2012, 11:32 AM
Isner has the best serve in the history of the sport.

Topspindoctor
05-09-2012, 11:33 AM
Karlovic (at his best) is better server than Isner.

Mark Lenders
05-09-2012, 11:35 AM
Isner has the best serve in the history of the sport.

I tend to agree with this. There are many guys with a better first serve than him, but overall (%, 2nd serve, clutch serving, intelligent serving too...) I can't think of a better server in tennis history.

Mark Lenders
05-09-2012, 11:37 AM
Karlovic (at his best) is better server than Isner.

He has a far better first serve, the best of all-time for sure.

But his % isn't that and his second serve isn't great either. There's more to serve than just the first serve.

Karlovic is the best first server of all-time, but that's it I think.

Topspindoctor
05-09-2012, 11:41 AM
Are you kidding? Karlovic FS% is usually in high 60's. If it was low, then he would never make top 20.

For second serve how would you rate Sampras second serve when compared to Isner.

Because it's widely accepted by many that Sampras has best second serve of all time.

Mark Lenders
05-09-2012, 11:49 AM
Sampras's second serve is a bit overrated. The legend is based upon some big occasions where he took risks with his second serve and it paid off. Generally, it was a great second serve but attackable.

I'd definitely have to go with Isner. Even Djokovic struggles to do anything with Isner's second serve, it's better than most players' first serves.

And yes, Karlovic had a decent %. But you could never rely him to serve 70%+ against the top guys and he had the annoying habit of never putting first serves in tiebreaks/set points in tie breaks (under pressure).

Karlovic took players to tie breaks with their serve. Isner can actually win big matches even against the top players with his serve.

MaxPower
05-09-2012, 11:57 AM
Isner got a much better serve than Raonic. It's too be expected. He's much taller. Raonic is extremely good for 6'5 and definitely up there with the best servers. Hope he doesn't burn out his shoulder like former swedish top10 Joachim Johansson who actually had a serve and game that is kinda similar to Milos

Roddick is insanely good for his height but past seasons he's dropped off a little. I think Soderling, Berdych, Tsonga all can give Roddick a run for his money in serving.

Looking at first serve points won any server that lies around 90% is excellent and then it usually comes down to personal bias who you find the best server. Some servers like Berdych and Soderling work a lot with setting up their own forehand for the finisher rather than always go for the ace, but yet the point is almost for free as they are so used to it they could put away those forehands in their sleep


ohh yeah and personally I think Kevin Anderson got a very solid serve. He hasn't gotten much attention but i caught some matches with him last year and that serve is a Milos-like weapon when on

duong
05-09-2012, 12:02 PM
I already wondered about that during San Jose-Memphis.

Since then I've heard a lot of people saying Isner had clearly the best first serve but somewhere in my mind I was still remembering that Raonic.

For the first serve I'd rather say Raonic, for the second clearly Isner (clearly better than Sampras's which was overrated), I think the first serve % is the argument which could bring Isner on top,

but what exactly has been the difference in first serve % between them in 2011 and since the beginning of this year ? (ATP website is forbidden at my work, I can't look)

Topspindoctor
05-09-2012, 12:05 PM
^^^

For 2012 Raonic is @ 62%

Isner @ 68%

Isner is #10, and Milos #29


EDIT:

Looking at FS % won

Milos is #1 at 82%

Isner is at 76%

duong
05-09-2012, 12:25 PM
^^^

For 2012 Raonic is @ 62%

Isner @ 68%

Isner is #10, and Milos #29


EDIT:

Looking at FS % won

Milos is #1 at 82%

Isner is at 76%

thank you :)

Actually I had kept Tennis_Analyst's file and it shows the stats for 2011 :

Isner 69% first serves, Raonic 64
Isner 77% first serve won, Raonic 79%
Isner 55% second serves won, Raonic 53

it makes overall Isner 70.2% service points won, Raonic 69.6

But on hardcourts only, Raonic's stats were better,

which makes Isner 69.9 and Raonic 70.9

They both saved 68% breakpoints on hardcourts (66 on all surfaces)

It's really tight to say the truth

Isner may be given a slight edge considering the way he managed to keep his serve when he was very tired like against Mahut, and his consistency (first serve %) and the mental abilities he showed consistently. His serve is probably a little bit more solid, but it's really tight.

romismak
05-09-2012, 01:15 PM
I read other posts and glad that people agree about that - Isner-Raonic by far best servers in 2012 - really close between them and how i wrote in my first post than in goes which you prefer - to have higher FS% with worse 1st serve and better 2nd - Isner or vs Raonic - best 1st, lower FS%, worse 2nd - but both guys serves are incredible weapons.

About Isnerīs 2nd serve - his 2nd serve i believe is best 2nd ever, Sampras canīt be even compared here, i mean everyone who is thinking must agree that Samprasīs 2nd serve is overrated - simply guy with so many slams must be included in discussions,, the same goes for Roger- even his serve is many times included in discussions - but those guys are overrated - their overall games make them multiple slam champions, but thatīs it. Isner 2nd serve is best 2nd ever, Raonic 1st is best since peak Karlovic, and maybe 2nd best 1st ever- hard to argue here with Roddick, but Roddickīsplacement never was that good, thatīs why his ace per set, ace-per 1st serve put in play never was such impressive. Maybe Johansson can challenger here, his 1st was lethal weapon too.

Raonic-Isner really i hope they will soon face each other, i am hoping for such match.

About best server ever that is really hard to tell, so many big servers, - peak Karlovic, peak Roddick- i mean serving peak , peak Ivanisevci vs peak Isner, peak Raonic, probably one of those is best server in history, but hard to tell.

duong
05-09-2012, 01:33 PM
I remember Simon, I think, saying, that Isner didn't use his full power on first serve usually, but using it only when he really needs it.

That's why I think his first serve sometimes doesn't look that good but his first serve % is great.

RoddickFan88
05-09-2012, 01:43 PM
At this moment, Raonic definitely.

Roddick's at his peak was even better...but it's...past unfortunately.

tennis_analyst
05-09-2012, 01:57 PM
Over the last two years on hard courts, the serve stats are as follows.

I say, Ivo Karlovic still holds a considerable advantage on everybody. Raonic's first serve wins more points when it goes in (penultimate column) but he pays for it with lower first serve % than Inser.

http://i1069.photobucket.com/albums/u472/gagaden/serve_2010-2011.jpg

Methodology description is here:
http://www.menstennisforums.com/showthread.php?t=199461&highlight=

MaxPower
05-09-2012, 02:02 PM
I knew K.Anderson was up there among the best serves and G.Muller too. Just because they are lesser known doesn't mean their serves aren't absolute top notch on the tour

emotion
05-09-2012, 02:07 PM
Karlovic is serving GOAT imo, but has declined
Raonic by a hair I think, Isner and Muller close

mystic ice cube
05-09-2012, 02:10 PM
Isner. The figures this man puts up is incredible. His second serve is the most dangerous I've seen since I started watching tennis.

Let's not forget in the past while, Isner has come up against better returners since reaching a higher ranking.

Gonzil
05-09-2012, 02:12 PM
Poor John must have felt the pressure all this discussion was putting on his serve, so he doublefaults twice in the TB to lose the match.

Mark Lenders
05-09-2012, 03:51 PM
Karlovic is serving GOAT imo, but has declined
Raonic by a hair I think, Isner and Muller close

He's first serve goat for sure.

Serve overall, don't think so. I believe Isner might be the best server who ever played the game, all things considered - 1st serve, 2nd serve, 1st serve %, clutch serving...

Ibracadabra
05-09-2012, 04:35 PM
Right now? horacio zeballos, this much is certain.

Nr 1 Fan
05-09-2012, 04:46 PM
Itīs close between John and Milos, but both are another league comparing to other big servers, even Ivo is far behind them-his serve declined dramatically over lat 2-3 years.

John-highest FS% among big servers, best 2nd serve in the game - his 1st serve isnīt better than some other, hardly even top 5-but with high FS% and great 2nd serve to back up it, really dangerous combo- plus his serve is really great under pressure.

Milos- clearly best 1st serve in the game right now, hitting harder than anyone else-among ATP tour player. Hitting flat bombs-aces, unreturnables, or great slice on 1st serve too.

2nd serve is top 5, not better than Johnīs but, very good, in almos every match he got ace on 2nd serve and many unreturnables too.

But his FS% is lower than Johnīs so now the question stands what is better have best 1st +top 5 2nd with lower FS% or high FS% - top 5-10 1st and best 2nd. Hard to argue here, i think it is very close and i want to see those guys play each other, actually i am dreaming about this match since Milos made his run in Australia 2011. I was hoping they would face each other in Memphis final but they both lost to Melzer....

This is spot on. Isner by a small margin the most complete server atm, I feel Raonic will surpass him in the years to come though.