The usage of the word ra*e casually. [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

The usage of the word ra*e casually.

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 03:40 AM
Now, of course, being a gay man, I hear/see that's so gay and the f-bomb thrown a lot. But the interesting thing is, I see it less now than I see/hear the word r@pe thrown around EXTREMELY casually about everything. Most likely because people know that using homophobic slurs will get them in a heap of trouble and the fact gay visibility has increased so therefore using the word gay for things that have nothing to do with it makes people look stupid. But why isn't this the case with the word r@pe? The word retarded applies too, but even with retarded, there is actually an effort to diminish the usage of this word as a slur. R@pe, no. No real efforts have been made to stop the usage of this word in a slurring manner. It's definitely sexist, without question. It's a word describing an extremely horrifying experience that at least 1/5 individuals experience in their lifetimes. It's not a joke; it shouldn't be taken with as much flippancy as it is.

When you call people out on using the word r@pe this way, and using slurs in general, many call you oversensitive and whiners, as they are socially privileged and have zero understanding of why it's offensive, as they have never had to question anything in their lives, or question their views and their actions towards things like this. But also it's an indication that people consider individuals who do not use the word r@pe or other words in such a manner, weak. First you're seen as weak, then you're mocked because of that implication. Especially if you're a man and you speak out against these slurs and speak out against the word r@pe used in such a way. And it is mostly males using these slurs and using the word r@pe so casually. All of this is related to sexism because weakness is incorrectly attributed to femininity. And femininity isn't respected in our world overall, especially not in America. People don't even seem to realize at least 1/6 boys/men (the real number is actually more likely 1/4-4.5) are r@ped in their lifetimes. Personally, it just highlights the obvious reality this is a patriarchal society and world filled with ignorance, but also a world that increasingly lacks empathy.

What do you all think?

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 03:46 AM
This forum doesn't allow you to use the word which is a good thing. The word is blanked out. Why don't other forums do this? Free speech, yeah yeah, but some speech doesn't bring anything positive to our society. Some speech should be checked for the betterment of our world. And by that, I don't mean these people shouldn't allow to say the stupid shit they're saying. But they should be condemned and ostracized accordingly. It's time to stop bullshitting and start calling a spade a spade. And that means not simply "letting" people say and do offensive things without having to take responsibility for their actions.

emotion
04-08-2012, 03:59 AM
all speech is contribution, if only negatively

rocketassist
04-08-2012, 05:43 AM
I've used 'that's gay' loads of times but I'm not thinking of a gay person when I use it. It's just... lingo.

out_here_grindin
04-08-2012, 06:07 AM
It is thrown around too casually. I see many many facebook statuses that mentioned getting ***** by a test or ****** a test or some activity.

People also throw out the word kill and murder casually. But that is way too de-sensitized.

BroTree123
04-08-2012, 06:21 AM
Like the other bad words, give it time.

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 10:40 AM
I've used 'that's gay' loads of times but I'm not thinking of a gay person when I use it. It's just... lingo.

You not thinking about a gay person is the problem. Not thinking before you speak is the issue. Using gay as an insult is insulting to gay people. It's not just lingo. It's taking how a person identifies and making it a pejorative. Which inherently makes the statement that it's wrong. Whether or not you're thinking it or it's instinctive, using the word gay in such a way is saying gay=bad. That's the issue.

A lot of people, with the that's so gay shit and r@pe shit want to talk about intent. Intent is irrelevant. Actions are what is being judged.

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 10:56 AM
It is thrown around too casually. I see many many facebook statuses that mentioned getting ***** by a test or ****** a test or some activity.

People also throw out the word kill and murder casually. But that is way too de-sensitized.I agree about kill and especially murder. Personally, saying something like "dude, you totally killed that _____ today" for example offends me less than other things, maybe because the word is like, obviously, completely separated from actual killing. Usually when someone makes that statement they mean you did something exemplary, you did something awesome. It's not used in a negative, violent fashion in that sense.

However, what's beyond obvious is that people are desensitized to violence and murder. These slurs do not need to be used to realize that's the case, tragically.

With r@pe, it's always connected with aggression and violence and the thing that is being r@ped is always being described in a negative fashion. That's the big difference to me when it comes to slurs, are they used/seen in a favorable light or not. The n-word is being slung around a ton now by suburban white kids, which I don't like, but at the same time, they generally are not using the n-word negatively. It's ignorant, but even being mixed, it doesn't offend me quite as much.

R@pe, gay, these words are used negatively 95% of the time. And that's because these words, the meaning behind them, and who/what they are directed towards, are all seen in a unfavorable light. That would be women and gay men in this case. Women and gay men, in particular, are not respected in our society and world.

peribsen
04-08-2012, 01:47 PM
This forum doesn't allow you to use the word which is a good thing.

Is it really? Doesn't it look rather stupid to have to type r@pe even when you are trying to have a serious discussion about a tragic reality? Should women who have been r@ped also blank out the word?

With r@pe, it's always connected with aggression and violence

Which is as it should be, I'd really be worried if it was used in relation with having fun.

and the thing that is being r@ped is always being described in a negative fashion.

Would you please explain which part of a sentence like "The r@pe of Africa by slavery" is derogatory of Africans? Doesn't the use of the word actually help to convey the tragedy and appalling injustice of the slave trade? What's disrespectful of women in that sentence?

Maybe you are referring to some other form of usage of the word in US slang, like in "Nole r@ped Nadal" or something like that, which would indeed be a trivialization of r@ape. If that is the case, well, all I can say is that I don't think it is much used in that sense in other languages.

And that's because these words, the meaning behind them, and who/what they are directed towards, are all seen in a unfavorable light. That would be women and gay men in this case.

Well, homophobia is a very real problem, but in the case of the word 'gay' there may be another explanation. For many people, including me and even most of the homosexuals I know, the words homosexual or lesbian refer to a very serious issue of human freedom and demand great respect, while the word 'gay' (meaning happy, merry, joyful, wild) unavoidably is often perceived in a much lighter tone. I mean, defenders of women's rights would surely have shot themselves in the foot if they had chosen to call themselves 'bimbos' or 'fannies' instead of feminists. As a Spaniard, I have been very much supportive of the legalization of homosexual marriage in my country, which includes the right to pater(mater)nity. However, at the same time, the word gay for me mostly brings up images of drag queens in a parade (charade) and of seedy bars. Maybe you should consider changing your name. No sense protesting that others don't take you seriously if you don't respect yourselves.

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 02:25 PM
Is it really? Doesn't it look rather stupid to have to type r@pe even when you are trying to have a serious discussion about a tragic reality? Should women who have been r@ped also blank out the word? Your point is valid, but again, the main way individuals use the word r@pe is not meant in the specific sense. It's trivialized and used as a pejorative. Which is why it has been blanked out, since the word wasn't originally blanked out. It became blanked out after I and many other complained.

Which is as it should be, I'd really be worried if it was used in relation with having fun.True, but again, it's about how the word is used, the manner in which it's used. It demonizes r@pe. And by extension, demonizes r@pe victims. That is the problem. R@pe and r@pe victims-----are taken negatively. Instead of being taken as a severe trauma in an individuals' life. The word isn't taken seriously enough.

Would you please explain which part of a sentence like "The r@pe of Africa by slavery" is derogatory of Africans? Doesn't the use of the word actually help to convey the tragedy and appalling injustice of the slave trade? What's disrespectful of women in that sentence?

Maybe you are referring to some other form of usage of the word in US slang, like in "Nole r@ped Nadal" or something like that, which would indeed be a trivialization of r@ape. If that is the case, well, all I can say is that I don't think it is much used in that sense in other languages.I said the use of the word r@pe CASUALLY. Obviously, there is a difference between using the word casually, and using the word when it would naturally apply. As for the word not being used in other languages, I know that is false, since on a different forum it was a French woman who started a thread describing this. And how she always heard it (real life) and saw it (virtual world). The word is not taken seriously, that's just what the deal is, tragically.

Trivializing r@pe is also disrespectful to men, since there are billions of men who are r@ped. Again, sexism comes in where r@pe is 100% attributed to femininity and therefore, denigrated.

Well, homophobia is a very real problem, but in the case of the word 'gay' there may be another explanation. For many people, including me and even most of the homosexuals I know, the words homosexual or lesbian refer to a very serious issue of human freedom and demand great respect, while the word 'gay' (meaning happy, merry, joyful, wild) unavoidably is often perceived in a much lighter tone.Maybe in Spain, that's how it is, but that's not how it is in America. American gays and straight supporters do not use terms like homosexual. Homosexual and lesbian, um, first of all, LESBIANS ARE HOMOSEXUALS. That's the entire stupidity about it. Homosexual=sex with the same sex. We're more than sexual beings. Homosexual is a clinical term and dehumanizing.

Now, as for gay being perceived in a much lighter tone, I'm not exactly sure that's the case, again at least in America. No, in America, a lot of people think gay just isn't a "homosexual" word. They think it's just a word. And a word that has evolved into an all encompassing slang term. The problem is that the word has become an insult and a negative when there is ZERO history behind such a definition of the word gay. Gay either means carefree and light, or it means homosexual male. So for the word to have transformed into a negative is for ONE reason only-----because of the connection to homosexuality. Let's get real about that.

It's beginning to change, mostly because people are being checked when they do this. Because kids/teens aren't just being allowed to use gay as a pejorative. Because the connection with homophobia has gotten more ingrained in the psyches of people as there has been more visibility brought onto these concerns. But it's still a problem and it's not acceptable.

I mean, defenders of women's rights would surely have shot themselves in the foot if they had chosen to call themselves 'bimbos' or 'fannies' instead of feminists.If you're saying gay people stole the term gay, that is false. Straight people called gay people gay, due to gay stereotypes. Gay men being feminine, flamboyant queens, you know :rolleyes: We TOOK the word for ourselves. We took control of the word from bigots who threw it onto us. Now, we have others acting as if they can take it back? No. It has too much history with our community. It's our word now. It can't be stolen from us. And it will not be used as a pejorative because gay is not an insult.

As a Spaniard, I have been very much supportive of the legalization of homosexual marriage in my country, which includes the right to pater(mater)nity.Accepting gay rights and accepting the gay community aren't the same thing.

However, at the same time, the word gay for me mostly brings up images of drag queens in a parade (charade) and of seedy bars. Maybe you should consider changing your name. No sense protesting that others don't take you seriously if you don't respect yourselves.:spit:

If you don't respect yourselves? You really just threw that one out there? Let me tell you something, fucker. What a way to paint a wide brush over an entire group based on the actions of a few (which, BTW, first of all, most drag queens identify as STRAIGHT. Secondly, STRAIGHT people make up at least 50% of gay pride parades in general. Thirdly, there are STRAIGHT bars that are extremely seedy. NOTHING you have said cannot be unconnected to straight people, either, but I KNOW BETTER than to judge an entire community on the actions of a few) Maybe you should consider changing your mentality. It's not I who needs the changing. It's not my community with the problem. It's you.

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 02:29 PM
That whole bullshit "gay people engage in risky sex and go to seedy bars and act like flamboyant queens" shit is SO over. I can't even believe someone would go there, especially with me. Because you know I'll fuck you up on that shit. It's so ignorant and a BLATANT sign of hypocrisy, because the people who say these things judge gay people on a different level than straight people. (ie. Mardi Gras, Spring Break, Cinco de Mayo, 65% of straight bars) Stop acting as if we're living in two different fucking worlds; we're not aliens and to BIGOTED STRAIGHT HOMOPHOBIC SHITS, you are not above anyone because you're straight. Stop telling me and my community how to live and what to do to gain your tolerance as if we are going to grovel for you pieces of shit, get off the privileged act, you're not special.

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 02:36 PM
Now, side stepping the homophobic POS who responded to me, let's get back to topic.

Johnny Groove
04-08-2012, 02:41 PM
As a straight male, I find any slur to be in bad taste. Whether insulting a group of people due to their race, religion, sex orientation, I have no tolerance for intolerance. We are all humans on a planet the size of a hair speck on the asshole of the universe. And we have the guts to hate each other?

I do believe that we as a society have been desensitized to murder, and ****, guns, violence, etc. etc. due to Hollywood movies and TV shows, and daily news shows. This has trickled down into everyday life when people think it is ok to use such words with no regard to the feelings of other people.

Me, I never use gay in a derogatory term, not since I was like 14 years old or so. I like the message of the following commercial.

8z7EOG8z_e0

Too bad the youtube commenting morons don't agree :tape:

I also don't use the word retarded at all in a derogatory sense, and **** and murder to describe tennis results or how I did on a test is just in bad taste.

Instead of saying: "That movie was gay", say instead "That movie was shit!"

Instead of: "Djokovic ***** Nadal in that last match", say instead "Rafa got whooped by Nole"

Instead of: "I murdered that test", say instead "I kicked that test's ass".

There are easier and better ways to say things without offending anybody.

peribsen
04-08-2012, 03:35 PM
Maybe in Spain, that's how it is, but that's not how it is in America.

Oh, to be sure most homosexuals in Spain also use the term gay quite freely.

American gays and straight supporters do not use terms like homosexual. Homosexual and lesbian, um, first of all, LESBIANS ARE HOMOSEXUALS. That's the entire stupidity about it. Homosexual=sex with the same sex. We're more than sexual beings. Homosexual is a clinical term and dehumanizing.

Of course lesbians are homosexual. Female homosexuality historically has adquired a descriptive word for itself that is not necceseraly derogatory (I mean, the word by itself, not how some homophobiacs may use it), while male homosexuality lacks sucha a term (at least, I can't recall it, all the options are very insulting). For myself, I see nothing dehumanizing about the term homosexual. Maybe that's a cultural difference, I'd much rather describe myself as heterosexual(*) than as straight, but maybe in the USA you have a knack for preferring more informal words.

(*I would only describe myself as heterosexual in the sense that my preferences fall clearly more towards the hetero end of the continuous spectrum of human sexuality, the dualistic idea that one is either one thing or the other, like if hetero and homo belonged in totally different categories, is reactionary and fuels discrimination).

Now, as for gay being perceived in a much lighter tone, I'm not exactly sure that's the case, again at least in America. No, in America, a lot of people think gay just isn't a "homosexual" word. They think it's just a word. And a word that has evolved into an all encompassing slang term. The problem is that the word has become an insult and a negative when there is ZERO history behind such a definition of the word gay. Gay either means carefree and light, or it means homosexual male. So for the word to have transformed into a negative is for ONE reason only-----because of the connection to homosexuality. Let's get real about that.

The problem is that the word gay already has a rather festive meaning. You simply cannot change that, unless you demand that people stop using it in its original sense.

If you're saying gay people stole the term gay, that is false. Straight people called gay people gay, due to gay stereotypes. Gay men being feminine, flamboyant queens, you know :rolleyes: We TOOK the word for ourselves. We took control of the word from bigots who threw it onto us. Now, we have others acting as if they can take it back? No. It has too much history with our community. It's our word now. It can't be stolen from us. And it will not be used as a pejorative because gay is not an insult.

Now that is a very good argument, seriously. I had never thought of it this way. If you mean that you took a derogatory term and incorporated it as a sign of pride, I can really respect that.

Accepting gay rights and accepting the gay community aren't the same thing.

Well, the problem here is that accepting 'gay' rights is a must for any one who has any respect for human dignity (if I don't respect you, I'm demeaning not only you, but ultimately myself). While acritically 'accepting' the gay community (except in the basic sense of tolerance, everybody is free to live his/her life as he pleases, of course) is a non-compulsory option. Just what is to be understood by the 'gay community'? If it means the group of people who share a common condition and often a common discrimination, I'm all for it. But if it means a full-blown special way of life, I don't know even if all homosexuals share it. I've spoken about this with some homosexuals, including one deeply involved in your G&L activism. He told me that the ultimate objective is for homosexual relations to be accepted as normal, to be able to live them out within the community, with the same ease that heterosexual relations are. In other words, he wanted sexual orientation to stop being an issue, at all levels. In his opinion (which is what I was referring to), some aspects of what has come to be known as the 'gay community' (gay-only hotels, bars, shops, travel agencies, you name it) are up to some point a side-track. What he was saying was that he wanted more, much more, than simply changing the closet for an accepted ghetto, but that he feared part of your community was heading towards one.

I very much want to stress the 'part of the community' issue. In Madrid we have one of the liveliest gay quarters in Europe (Chueca). Most of it is not at all ghetto-like, but open and inviting for everyone, so it seems that our gay community is growing out of the ghetto phase, which is great news.

If you don't respect yourselves? You really just threw that one out there? Let me tell you something, fucker. What a way to paint a wide brush over an entire group based on the actions of a few (which, BTW, first of all, most drag queens identify as STRAIGHT. Secondly, STRAIGHT people make up at least 50% of gay pride parades in general. Thirdly, there are STRAIGHT bars that are extremely seedy. NOTHING you have said cannot be unconnected to straight people, either, but I KNOW BETTER than to judge an entire community on the actions of a few) Maybe you should consider changing your mentality. It's not I who needs the changing. It's not my community with the problem. It's you.

1) You are seeing insults where none were intended. I have no problem at all begging your pardon if you felt insulted. I am much more friendly towards your cause than most people you'll find out there, however much politically correct they may seem.

2) Well of course 'straight' people include all sorts, this isn't about 'straight' vs 'gay', don't turn it into a competition. And what I am surely not doing is judging a group for some of its members.

3) Your reaction could lead one to suspect you have some unresolved issue. I'm sure that is not really the case. You just bolted the horses because you mistook something for what it wasn't. I'm sure you'll take hold of them and relax a bit.

peribsen
04-08-2012, 03:52 PM
That whole bullshit "gay people engage in risky sex and go to seedy bars and act like flamboyant queens" shit is SO over. I can't even believe someone would go there, especially with me. Because you know I'll fuck you up on that shit. It's so ignorant and a BLATANT sign of hypocrisy, because the people who say these things judge gay people on a different level than straight people. (ie. Mardi Gras, Spring Break, Cinco de Mayo, 65% of straight bars) Stop acting as if we're living in two different fucking worlds; we're not aliens and to BIGOTED STRAIGHT HOMOPHOBIC SHITS, you are not above anyone because you're straight. Stop telling me and my community how to live and what to do to gain your tolerance as if we are going to grovel for you pieces of shit, get off the privileged act, you're not special.

Now, side stepping the homophobic POS who responded to me, let's get back to topic.

Sometimes, we all get things wrong. But this trumps up anything I had seen lately. Filo, thank you for making my day! I'll show this to a lesbian friend I'm meeting for lunch tomorrow, we'll have a really good laugh!

rocketassist
04-08-2012, 08:43 PM
You not thinking about a gay person is the problem. Not thinking before you speak is the issue. Using gay as an insult is insulting to gay people. It's not just lingo. It's taking how a person identifies and making it a pejorative. Which inherently makes the statement that it's wrong. Whether or not you're thinking it or it's instinctive, using the word gay in such a way is saying gay=bad. That's the issue.

A lot of people, with the that's so gay shit and r@pe shit want to talk about intent. Intent is irrelevant. Actions are what is being judged.

Well the word fag I consider to mean someone who drives a Harley motorbike in an annoying manner, so sometimes words can be interpreted differently.

Grinder
04-08-2012, 08:51 PM
"Fag" means a cigarette to me.

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 08:53 PM
Well the word fag I consider to mean someone who drives a Harley motorbike in an annoying manner, so sometimes words can be interpreted differently.People who use South Park as a guide for their own lives really aren't worth taking seriously.

No, there is one meaning of the f-word. You're just using it incorrectly and unfortunately society doesn't respect gay people enough nor give enough of a damn to stop using this slur in an offensive manner. It's taken COMPLETE ostracizing and condemnation to change this trend to a certain extent.

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 08:56 PM
"Fag" means a cigarette to me.
Are you British? :lol:

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 09:04 PM
Also, I have to say, the bullshit argument of "words change" and "language evolves" doesn't fit here because, lets say for example, stupid. The word has become an all-encompassing insult to denigrate a persons' intelligence. The word has not evolved from what it originally meant. Same with lame. Lame when used these days usually means something sucks ie. something is uncool. Something stupid. Which still has connection with the original word lame.

The f-bomb is still used as a slur against gay people, so to say it isn't anti-gay in nature is false, now that's in America (and really all over), other cultures this word is used in a different sense without any sort of negativity attached to it, but NO-ONE is ignorant enough to not realize how the word is generally used these days. Because it's not a word used in a positive way. It's used as denigration. It's used as an insult. The f-bomb generally is used by men against men to dehumanize and emasculate. What are the stereotypes of gay people? That gay men aren't masculine. Put 2+2 together. The reason this word has become more normalized is because homophobia is so prevalent.

Offensive is still offensive, if you know you're doing something that causes legitimate offense, why continue to do it when it's completely avoidable? It's so hardheaded and rude to just do something for the sake of doing it.

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 09:17 PM
Now, back on subject, the same applies with the word r@pe. The word STILL has the same connections with the original, long-time definition. Which is why I brought up the entire aggressiveness and quite violent nature behind the word. It's a sharp, cutting word. Just like the actual act of r@pe is. The word hasn't evolved beyond r@pe still being identified as an act in which someone is taken advantage of sexually and/or physically without their consent. Same as gay and the f-word, which are still connected to and in the case of the word gay, used, by the gay community. Same with the n-word and the black community. People need to respect history and respect the power behind these words and why they are more than just being random words that can be slung around. People need to respect r@pe victims and stop using this word casually. R@pe is a tragedy. It isn't a joke, it isn't a slur, and it's disrespectful to insinuate it is.

peribsen
04-08-2012, 09:42 PM
Concise Oxford English Dictionary © 2008 Oxford University Press:

fag

1 Brit.
noun
1 informal a tiring or unwelcome task.
2 a junior pupil at a public school who does minor chores for a senior pupil.
verb (fags, fagging, fagged)
1 informal work hard.
2 (of a public-school pupil) act as a fag.
3 (as adj. fagged out) informal, chiefly Brit. exhausted.
– origin C16 (in the sense ‘grow weary’): of unknown origin.

2 N. Amer. informal, derogatory a male homosexual.
faggy adjective.
– origin 1920s: short for faggot (sense 3 of the noun).

3 Brit. informal a cigarette.
noun
– origin C19: elliptically from fag end.

Filo V.
04-08-2012, 11:07 PM
Cultural differences. Different cultures have different original/main definitions of the word. But ALL cultures use the word in a homophobic sense. Which is what makes the word homophobic. The one thing all cultures share is that this word is used against gay men, is used as a means to denigrate a persons' masculinity, and is anti-gay in nature when used in such a manner.

Time Violation
04-09-2012, 09:53 AM
Think the standard of language got much lower, so to say. Even when it's not used offensively/as an insult, it's pretty poor that someone finds no better words to express himself than s**t, f**k, r*pe, kill, fag, etc.

tripwires
04-09-2012, 10:33 AM
Cultural differences. Different cultures have different original/main definitions of the word. But ALL cultures use the word in a homophobic sense. Which is what makes the word homophobic. The one thing all cultures share is that this word is used against gay men, is used as a means to denigrate a persons' masculinity, and is anti-gay in nature when used in such a manner.

:facepalm: I think it's been pointed out sufficiently in this thread that 'fag' is a British slang for 'cigarettes' and therefore the bolded sentence of your post is incorrect. It obviously has a different meaning when used in North America, amongst other places (in Singapore, for instance, 'fag' is more likely used to refer to gays than a cigarette), but it doesn't make the sentence in bold less of an incorrect sweeping statement.

Filo V.
04-09-2012, 02:05 PM
:facepalm: I think it's been pointed out sufficiently in this thread that 'fag' is a British slang for 'cigarettes' and therefore the bolded sentence of your post is incorrect. It obviously has a different meaning when used in North America, amongst other places (in Singapore, for instance, 'fag' is more likely used to refer to gays than a cigarette), but it doesn't make the sentence in bold less of an incorrect sweeping statement.
And the word is used against gay people in British culture, too. So no, it's not a sweeping statement, it's a reality. The word is homophobic, and the fact it isn't blanked out on this forum shows that most people just don't give a fuck, about the gay community. That's the reality. That should be a glaring indication of homophobia. I got called a FAGGOT on SEVERAL occasions during the ACC thread and in general on this forum and the people who have called me this haven't been banned. They should all be permabanned. There are some things you just don't say.

No other group has to deal with this JUSTIFICATION OF USING A SLUR THAT HAS BEEN USED TO DEMONIZE THEM THROUGHOUT HISTORY. No other group. Except WOMEN AND GAYS. Which is why the f-bomb, why the word "c*nt", why the word r@pe are all used so much. I don't hear people justifying the use of the n-word. I don't hear people justifying the usage of anti-semitic slurs, anti-Muslim slurs. No, but when it comes to gay people and women, it's open season, because we're considered weak. Well, I see it for what it is, and I am not going to let anyone get away with it.

Filo V.
04-09-2012, 02:15 PM
Think the standard of language got much lower, so to say. Even when it's not used offensively/as an insult, it's pretty poor that someone finds no better words to express himself than s**t, f**k, r*pe, kill, fag, etc.

I know, right? I mean, yeah, the type of people who use these words are probably not very smart, not very educated, but really? At least make an attempt to sound sort of mature. At least make an attempt to care about the way you present yourself. Once you hit about 15-16, with proper parenting, you should know better. There are no excuses whatsoever. It's ignorant, rude and lower class.

rocketassist
04-09-2012, 02:17 PM
And the word is used against gay people in British culture, too. So no, it's not a sweeping statement, it's a reality. The word is homophobic, and the fact it isn't blanked out on this forum shows that most people just don't give a fuck, about the gay community. That's the reality. That should be a glaring indication of homophobia. I got called a FAGGOT on SEVERAL occasions during the ACC thread and in general on this forum and the people who have called me this haven't been banned. They should all be permabanned. There are some things you just don't say.

No other group has to deal with this JUSTIFICATION OF USING A SLUR THAT HAS BEEN USED TO DEMONIZE THEM THROUGHOUT HISTORY. No other group. Except WOMEN AND GAYS. Which is why the f-bomb, why the word "c*nt", why the word r@pe are all used so much. I don't hear people justifying the use of the n-word. I don't hear people justifying the usage of anti-semitic slurs, anti-Muslim slurs. No, but when it comes to gay people and women, it's open season, because we're considered weak. Well, I see it for what it is, and I am not going to let anyone get away with it.

Where I live, the only word I know that's used against gays is 'queg'. Fag is said but for the reason tripwires has said.

Filo V.
04-09-2012, 02:19 PM
Sometimes, we all get things wrong. But this trumps up anything I had seen lately. Filo, thank you for making my day! I'll show this to a lesbian friend I'm meeting for lunch tomorrow, we'll have a really good laugh!

Well, you said that gay people don't respect themselves and that other people don't respect gays, because of our name, so we should "change our name". That is insulting. Now, I may be reading into it more than what is there, but yeah, that's what I interpreted it as. I'll allow you to clarify if that isn't what you meant to say.

Filo V.
04-09-2012, 02:22 PM
Where I live, the only word I know that's used against gays is 'queg'. Fag is said but for the reason tripwires has said.
Different cultures have different terminology. But to say that this word isn't used in Britain against gay people is false. It's also false to imply that the f-bomb doesn't impact gay people in Britain regardless of intent. Because it's a worldwide, cutting, anti-gay term. We all know that the word is used against gay people so to act as if it isn't is simply nonsense.

For your culture, maybe it isn't anti-gay. But the word overall is a homophobic term because it is known to be connected to homosexuality and homosexuals.

Filo V.
04-09-2012, 02:24 PM
Women and gays are not respected. That's all it comes down to. Even other women don't respect women, gay people and themselves enough to take this issue seriously. Because they've been brainwashed by our patriarchal world. So they think that this is all about words, when it's truly about mentality.

Snowwy
04-09-2012, 02:33 PM
Women and gays are not respected. That's all it comes down to. Even other women don't respect women, gay people and themselves enough to take this issue seriously. Because they've been brainwashed by our patriarchal world. So they think that this is all about words, when it's truly about mentality.

You can't generalize the entire world based on what you see where you live. Where you live, the world is way behind some other places, it is not like that everywhere. Where you live is also ahead of some places, but the world is going in the right direction and to say that women and gays are not respected really in an unfair generalization.

Filo V.
04-09-2012, 02:58 PM
You can't generalize the entire world based on what you see where you live. Where you live, the world is way behind some other places, it is not like that everywhere. Where you live is also ahead of some places, but the world is going in the right direction and to say that women and gays are not respected really in an unfair generalization.It really isn't. Not when we're living in a world where women are given about 60-65% on average of what men are given financially at work. Women are discriminated against in the workplace dramatically. 60% of women have been abused in relationships, emotionally and/or physically. 30% have been in long-term abusive relationships and 57% of women are not given any help. They are either told that their experience doesn't constitute abuse, or they are flat out not taken seriously. Socially, women who are overweight and women who are less attractive are discriminated against in EVERY single way, more so than less attractive men. Women are expected to portray themselves in a sexual light, are expected to do their part to make themselves appealing towards men, and women are pressured into basically being as "hot" as possible because that is, tragically, completely tied into a woman's worth. Which is why women have high-rates of eating disorders and image issues.

As for the gay community, HOMOPHOBIA is the worst form of discrimination worldwide. Gay/lesbian couples can't even hold hands and kiss in most places in society, including Canada. Gay-bashings are 30% more likely to occur than other forms of physical violence against minorities. 80-90% of LGBTQ teens are bullied in schools and 56% of school systems have hiring practices that discriminate against gay people, because of the stereotype that gay/lesbian folk prey on children and want to indoctrinate. Churches worldwide continue to demonize gay people and blood banks worldwide won't allow gay men give blood based on an HIV scare which occurred 30 years ago. This isn't even bringing up the topic of marriage and adoption and employment and housing discrimination. Canada may be beyond those issues but most of the world isn't and about 40% of individuals in developed countries believe anti-gay discrimination is justifiable.

All of these facts highlight why women and gays tend to be companions. Because we go through hard shit just for being who we are, we understand each other and our life histories share many commonalities, and we can relate with one another in significant ways that other groups simply aren't aware nor capable of.

About 50% of homophobia is rooted in sexism (the rest is rooted in "morality"). Eliminate sexism, you'll eliminate a huge amount of homophobia. A lot of straight men have issues with both groups because both groups do not have goals that uplift them. Straight male privilege. A lot of women are affected by this, naturally, because they've been brainwashed by society and are damaged. So instead of fighting for what would uplift them, they follow what society expects of them, they follow what they think is right for them instead of what truly will make life for women worldwide much easier.

peribsen
04-09-2012, 04:15 PM
Well, you said that gay people don't respect themselves and that other people don't respect gays, because of our name, so we should "change our name". That is insulting. Now, I may be reading into it more than what is there, but yeah, that's what I interpreted it as. I'll allow you to clarify if that isn't what you meant to say.

What I said was that the choice of the word 'gay' may have been unfortunate, since it has other meanings that may help to trivialize it. I never meant to say that you people don't respect yourselfs, I was referring only to whether the choice of word was or wasn't helpful in that regard. Nothing insulting there.

As I already said in my previous post, one of your answers has led me to look at the matter in a somewhat different light. If you chose the word gay as an act of reassertion, precisely because it was hurled against you, I find that a brave act for which I can only feel respect. I wasn't aware of that origin for the use of gay as a banner behind which to rally.

To pack all of what I have written in this thread and sum it up as a case of raging homophobia, I find really quite funny, hilarious in fact if applied to a guy like me. Anyway, I've taken it humorously, no harm done.

However, this does raise a serious issue, that is just how easy it is to be misunderstood when debating issues that may be critical ones for others. Once again, I assure you no insult was meant, sorry if it looked otherwise.

Filo V.
04-10-2012, 12:24 AM
What I said was that the choice of the word 'gay' may have been unfortunate, since it has other meanings that may help to trivialize it. I never meant to say that you people don't respect yourselfs, I was referring only to whether the choice of word was or wasn't helpful in that regard. Nothing insulting there. OK, thank you for clarifying :)

As I already said in my previous post, one of your answers has led me to look at the matter in a somewhat different light. If you chose the word gay as an act of reassertion, precisely because it was hurled against you, I find that a brave act for which I can only feel respect. I wasn't aware of that origin for the use of gay as a banner behind which to rally. Well I am happy to have illuminate your mind a bit then! Yes, most people, unfortunately, simply do not know and understand the history behind the word gay being liked to our community. Same applies with the f-word as well, queer, all these words. They are all words that, one time or another, we've been attacked with. This is why we take these words seriously, because we have reclaimed them, taken the power from these words to empower our community. And to have them used against us and stolen from us is a definite slap in the face. I am glad you understand and have respect for that, it's definitely a very deep thing.

To pack all of what I have written in this thread and sum it up as a case of raging homophobia, I find really quite funny, hilarious in fact if applied to a guy like me. Anyway, I've taken it humorously, no harm done. I apologize for interpreting what you said incorrectly. What you said hit a nerve because it sounded like the typical words and playbook that is continuously used to denigrate my community. It's something that I'm really sensitive towards.

You're right as well in saying that things such as gay rights, these issues are contentious, emotional, human issues. And an attempt of understanding is needed on all sides to create the comfort to talk about these issues and progress forward as a society. I apologize again for jumping the gun.