Norway abducts Indian children [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Norway abducts Indian children

abraxas21
01-07-2012, 03:06 PM
white people know better

In May this year, two children – a four-month-old infant and a two-and-a-half-year toddler – were taken away by childcare authorities from an NRI couple in Norway.

The reason: authorities in the country believe the couple is unfit to raise kids and one of the proofs offered is that the couple sleeps on the same bed as their little kids.

“They told me ‘why are you sleeping with the children in the same bed?’. This is also a purely cultural issue. We never leave the children in another room and say goodnight to them,” Anurup Bhattacharya, the aggrieved father, told Indian television channel NDTV.

The kids were picked up by childcare services on May 11 simultaneously from kindergarten and home. The Indian parents were given ‘bizarre explanations’ for this horrific act and were declared unfit parents by the Norwegian Child Protection Services (CPS).

The Indian mission in Oslo has requested officials to take a sympathetic view of the case on the grounds of cultural differences, but Norwegian officials seem to have, so far, turned a deaf ear to such requests.

The parents have been told that they will be allowed to meet their children only twice a year for an hour till the children turn 18. The kids are currently staying with two separate foster families.

The frantic father told IBNLive, another Indian television channel: “They said the mother was incapable of taking care of the children - that our daughter looked at the faces of other people around her instead of her mother’s, was evidence that we were not taking proper care of her, and that our son remained aloof in the kindergarten and banged his head on the floor.”

When the couple went to file a report at a local police station in May 2011, the mother was frantic and started shouting and the officials took that as a confirmation that the mother was incapable of handling the children.

The Norwegian officials have even suggested that if the couple agrees on a separation, the officials might do a rethink and send the kids back to the father.

Indian officials have tried to intervene and, citing cultural differences, they’ve have even offered that the couple would leave Norway for good once the children are handed back to the parents. However, Norwegian officials have so far ignored all explanations from Indian diplomats.

http://www.emirates247.com/news/world/parents-lose-kids-for-sleeping-on-same-bed-2011-12-26-1.434527

Har-Tru
01-07-2012, 03:34 PM
Title made in abraxas...

Any statements from the Norwegian authorities? I'd like to hear what they have to say. Something tells me their all sleeping in the same bed is not the only reason for their actions.

noddzy
01-07-2012, 07:35 PM
This is a very strange incident indeed! Sleeping in one bed should not be the only reason; the article hints at some incidents at school, but makes the bed issue a central one..

buddyholly
01-07-2012, 08:12 PM
Title made in abraxas...

Any statements from the Norwegian authorities? I'd like to hear what they have to say. Something tells me their all sleeping in the same bed is not the only reason for their actions.

Why look for statements from Norwegian authorities? They are just puppets of the imperialist Westerners. Stick with the real hard facts from the Emirates.

Kat_YYZ
01-07-2012, 10:15 PM
This is a very strange incident indeed! Sleeping in one bed should not be the only reason; the article hints at some incidents at school, but makes the bed issue a central one..

I don't even see why anyone is calling it a cultural issue. Kids sleeping in the parents' bed is not uncommon anywhere. Millions of people do it. I've seen these "Supernanny" reality TV shows in North America where a 3- or 4-year old sleeps with the parents because they refuse to sleep in their own room (get up all the time, cry, say they are scared), so the tired parents just give up and let the kid sleep with them. The nanny gets them to stop it (because the kid is manipulating them and being clingy/not learning independence), but no one calls the authorities on them. And with infants it's even more common: people don't want to get up and go to another room every two hours when the baby wakes up; easier to just have it there. :shrug:

There's nothing uniquely "Indian" about it.

EddceLLent
01-07-2012, 10:31 PM
I despise the tendency of media outlets to pick up these kinds of stories, carelessly sum them up in a way that's sufficiently sensationalist (but that ignores many important facts), and then expect us to unify in our outrage at the picture of injustice they've painted.

Nothing is black and white, and i'm sure there's other reasons for the decision that was made. Even if the decision was wrong, a civilised society like Norway will surely have proper recourse for the parents should they wish to appeal it.

noddzy
01-07-2012, 10:34 PM
I don't even see why anyone is calling it a cultural issue. Kids sleeping in the parents' bed is not uncommon anywhere. Millions of people do it. I've seen these "Supernanny" reality TV shows in North America where a 3- or 4-year old sleeps with the parents because they refuse to sleep in their own room (get up all the time, cry, say they are scared), so the tired parents just give up and let the kid sleep with them. The nanny gets them to stop it (because the kid is manipulating them and being clingy/not learning independence), but no one calls the authorities on them. And with infants it's even more common: people don't want to get up and go to another room every two hours when the baby wakes up; easier to just have it there. :shrug:

There's nothing uniquely "Indian" about it.

I agree..lots of parents in North America do it too (have seen one or 2 episodes of those supernanny shows too :tape: ). I watched an Indian TV video of this incident on youtube, in which they only show the parents' side of the story. I agree with the previous posters that the side of the Norwegian authorities needs to be presented. There is a possibility though, that the authorities may have acted too aggressively and there may have been a communication gap between the authorities and the parents( I think the majority speaks very good English in Norway, so I don't think it is a language issue ).

abraxas21
01-08-2012, 12:16 AM
the latest

Glimpse of hope for couple in Norway
TNN Jan 6, 2012, 04.30AM

KOLKATA: There's finally some light at the end of the tunnel for the couple who has been forced to stay away from their children in Norway. The Indian embassy in Oslo has taken up the matter and is trying to unite the parents with their children.

On May 11 last year, a Norwegian childcare agency had taken custody of the children after alleging the parents were not capable of taking care of the little ones.

P Balachandran, first secretary (political) of Indian embassy in Oslo, met Anurup and Sagarika Bhattacharya at their Stavanger residence to discuss the issue. The embassy also held talks with the childcare agency. The Indian diplomat is trying to withdraw the cases framed against the parents so that they can be reunited with their children.

Balachandran has reportedly assured the agency that the Indian government will make sure that the children are taken care of once they return to their parents.

The agency had taken custody of the two children - Avigyan (3) and Aishwarya (1) - and had placed them with two different foster-care families.

The couple had appealed for help to Bengal chief minister Mamata Banerjee in December. Mamata had taken up the matter with the foreign minister. Following the CM's initiative, the Indian embassy in Oslo had been asked to provide necessary support to the couple.

Anurup told TOI from Norway that the Indian diplomat had assured all possible support to get the children back. "He also spoke to the childcare agency and wanted to visit the children. But the agency has asked the diplomat to contact them next week. He might be allowed to visit the children now placed with two different families," he said.

Anurup added the agency placed certain conditions for returning the children. "They want documentary evidence to assure that the children can be brought up properly in India. We have to prove that we have the financial capability along with proof of sufficient resources to show that we can look after them till they turn 18. Moreover, we have to show them that there are enough parks and recreation facilities for the children in Kolkata."

The couple said they were ready to leave Norway once they got the custody of their children. "But the agency has plans to arrange the visa of the children and keep them in their custody till they turn 18, if in any case we say that we are unable to care them. My visa will be expiring in early March and if it is not extended, it could be difficult for me to apply for the visa of the children and get their custody," said Anurup.

The Norwegian agency has also proposed to place the children with some Indian families.

Sagarika, who is very depressed with the developments, broke down while speaking to ToI over phone. "When will I get my children back? They are so small. How can they stay away from their mother? It is a real torture on them in the name of childcare. Now, even my daughter cannot see her brother as they have been placed with two different families. My children can't follow Norwegian language and that is a major problem for them," she said.

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2012-01-06/kolkata/30597332_1_indian-embassy-indian-diplomat-indian-families

the arrogance of the norwegian authorities is too much to bear. who the fuck do they think they are to ask if there are enough parks in india where the children can be raised? someone should tell those twats that children have been brough up in india for centuries without the need of western-designed parks 5 blocks away from every random house in the suburbs

abraxas21
01-08-2012, 12:22 AM
Even if the decision was wrong, a civilised society like Norway will surely have proper recourse for the parents should they wish to appeal it.

sure, a civilized society like norway will always find a way to give justice at the end... :lol:

orangehat
01-08-2012, 03:21 AM
bizzare story.

buddyholly
01-08-2012, 03:33 AM
the arrogance of the norwegian authorities is too much to bear. who the fuck do they think they are to ask if there are enough parks in india where the children can be raised? someone should tell those twats that children have been brough up in india for centuries without the need of western-designed parks 5 blocks away from every random house in the suburbs

''western-designed parks?'' How do these differ from non-western designed parks? You are becoming a caricature of yourself these days.

And you make the above comments while lecturing other people to get their news from reliable sources!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

buddyholly
01-08-2012, 03:37 AM
Now that Natalee Halliday is back in the news, I would like to add that nobody here gives a damn about two little brown kids. There are plenty of abused blonde American kids to fuss about.

Kat_YYZ
01-08-2012, 04:22 AM
''western-designed parks?'' How do these differ from non-western designed parks? You are becoming a caricature of yourself these days.

And you make the above comments while lecturing other people to get their news from reliable sources!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

'fraid to say buddyholly has a point here. In the first article the kids were "a four-month-old infant and a two-and-a-half-year toddler" -- in the second article they are ages 3 and 1. Not a big difference as it relates to the case, but one always has to think 'where there's one error, there could be others.'

shiaben
01-08-2012, 06:35 AM
Disagree with the Norwegians on this account.

MaxPower
01-08-2012, 06:56 AM
Funny how people can have so strong opinions when they got barely any background at all in this case. Norwegian childcare services are no different than the swedish counterpart.

Firstly they don't act if there isn't something very wrong. In this case the parents probably had failed big time multiple times and in turned caused an investigation.

That investigation must have found even more things wrong with the family situation. Then they must act because norwegian law is probably exactly like swedish law, that is the children and their needs are put first

What the parents want is secondary. If they can't look out for their own children they can't and should not keep them. It works the same for norwegians themselves. If you can't handle your children you can't keep them and they will be put in a foster family either for their entire childhood or until there is some change in the situation.

That's how it works and the family in question has most certainly been informed multiple times exactly what they must do but still failed and failed again. Because taking the children away is like the final step in a long chain.

Can't just take a random proof like "they sleep in the same bed". That's like one thing in a report that probably lists hundreds of things. As I said no outsiders got the full story here and it's a very severe action the childcare services chose so you can rest assured they wouldn't do that unless they had a good reason

Pirata.
01-08-2012, 07:41 AM
'fraid to say buddyholly has a point here. In the first article the kids were "a four-month-old infant and a two-and-a-half-year toddler" -- in the second article they are ages 3 and 1. Not a big difference as it relates to the case, but one always has to think 'where there's one error, there could be others.'

The original article mentions that the children were taken away in May 2011, the article abraxas posted is from yesterday, so eight months have passed, a four month old would now be a year old and the two 1/2 year old would be 3 :)

Logical
01-08-2012, 08:30 AM
Norway:help:
Now that Natalee Halliday is back in the news, I would like to add that nobody here gives a damn about two little brown kids. There are plenty of abused blonde American kids to fuss about.We bring disgrace to our white race with that words:wavey:We are in 21'st century.In France snow white women pair up with coal black men.In Germany and USA white men go with black women.My brother's friend married a Indian girl but she looks white not brown with black hair:confused:Some Asians looks white and some not.I don't know.

buddyholly
01-08-2012, 11:27 AM
Norway:help:
We bring disgrace to our white race with that words:wavey:We are in 21'st century.In France snow white women pair up with coal black men.In Germany and USA white men go with black women.My brother's friend married a Indian girl but she looks white not brown with black hair:confused:Some Asians looks white and some not.I don't know.

Some members will understand that I am mocking the posters who five years ago posted in droves that they sympathized with Joran van der Sloot and that if Natalee Halliday were not a rich, white, blonde American girl, nobody would give a damn about her disappearance.

I understand that you were not here then, but since the van der Sloot trial in Peru starts this week, I wanted to keep things current.

abraxas21
01-08-2012, 01:08 PM
'fraid to say buddyholly has a point here. In the first article the kids were "a four-month-old infant and a two-and-a-half-year toddler" -- in the second article they are ages 3 and 1. Not a big difference as it relates to the case, but one always has to think 'where there's one error, there could be others.'

it's not an error. the first article refers to what happened in may 2011 while the second article refers to the current situation in january 2012.

obviously the ages have changed accordingly.

abraxas21
01-08-2012, 01:11 PM
Funny how people can have so strong opinions when they got barely any background at all in this case. Norwegian childcare services are no different than the swedish counterpart.

Firstly they don't act if there isn't something very wrong. In this case the parents probably had failed big time multiple times and in turned caused an investigation.

That investigation must have found even more things wrong with the family situation. Then they must act because norwegian law is probably exactly like swedish law, that is the children and their needs are put first

What the parents want is secondary. If they can't look out for their own children they can't and should not keep them. It works the same for norwegians themselves. If you can't handle your children you can't keep them and they will be put in a foster family either for their entire childhood or until there is some change in the situation.

That's how it works and the family in question has most certainly been informed multiple times exactly what they must do but still failed and failed again. Because taking the children away is like the final step in a long chain.

Can't just take a random proof like "they sleep in the same bed". That's like one thing in a report that probably lists hundreds of things. As I said no outsiders got the full story here and it's a very severe action the childcare services chose so you can rest assured they wouldn't do that unless they had a good reason

i'd find your faith in the system endearing if only it wasn't so arrogant. at the end norwegians and swedish are only human. they can get things wrong some times, you know...

star
01-08-2012, 03:48 PM
Title made in abraxas...

Any statements from the Norwegian authorities? I'd like to hear what they have to say. Something tells me their all sleeping in the same bed is not the only reason for their actions.

It may be that the officials cannot respond. In this country, child welfare cases are confidential and no one can make a public statement unless the parents authorize the agency to do so.

What the parents say and what actually happened may be completely different. Of course, governmental agencies make mistakes so we canít really know.

Logical
01-08-2012, 05:01 PM
Some members will understand that I am mocking the posters who five years ago posted in droves that they sympathized with Joran van der Sloot and that if Natalee Halliday were not a rich, white, blonde American girl, nobody would give a damn about her disappearance.

I understand that you were not here then, but since the van der Sloot trial in Peru starts this week, I wanted to keep things current.Then :yeah:

MaxPower
01-08-2012, 05:06 PM
i'd find your faith in the system endearing if only it wasn't so arrogant. at the end norwegians and swedish are only human. they can get things wrong some times, you know...

Sure they get it wrong sometimes. But as I said do we really have the story here? It's sensitive information and also according to law the norwegian authority cannot openly discuss this case with the media.

All we got is some understandably angry parents who probably focus on some petty detail they thought got give them support in the media and from the public.


Here in Sweden we have had hundreds of very severe cases of abuse involving people from other countries that might have held their children away from school, prevented them certain medical care etc.

Parents in Scandinavia most certainly have more requirements then they would have in India for example but in Norway everyone that lives their is subject to norwegian law and not the law in their home-country.

They also get more support. Here in Sweden the parents get substantial tax free support for every child all the way until they are 16. Other types of support are also raised with every child if such support is needed (in case of low income which is common for immigrants) That makes sure the parents can afford clothes, a bed, food, medicine and all those things. But sadly some people that come here think that support is "free money" so they sometimes neglect their children, take it for themselves and their expenses or send it home or something.

Child protective services normally only get alerted if something has been wrong for quite some time. It's not like they drive up with a bus, abduct children and then laugh about it. It's a very severe action that takes very solid proof and multiple decision makers. It's not a thing taken lightly. It's easy to get that impression from the article that it was something stupid like authorities paid a surprise visit, saw they slept in the same bed and then decided to take the children. It's because we don't get the real story behind but only some ramblings from the parents

Chip_s_m
01-08-2012, 05:07 PM
Give the kids back. Child rearing is too important to be left up to the state.

Har-Tru
01-08-2012, 05:14 PM
Give the kids back. Child rearing is too important to be left up to the state.

So should we leave it to the parents no matter how irresponsible and reckless they are?

What is more important, the right of the parents to bring up their children or the right of the children to receive an appropriate upbringing?

Logical
01-08-2012, 05:21 PM
I think Parents are good always.Sometimes they are angry but good.Children are loved only by parents.Trusts cannot show love.cannot breastfeed children.:wavey:This abduction of foreign kids is very stupid.

MaxPower
01-08-2012, 05:25 PM
Give the kids back. Child rearing is too important to be left up to the state.

Except the state wouldn't bring them up. They are given to a foster family that would bring them up like their own.

Also parents doesn't own their children like a possession. Parents are the caretakers. If they are unfit to be caretakers the society should act. That's why the child protective services exist in the first place. They often take the children away from for example drug abusers and mentally unstable people and thereby often saving the child from injury and sometimes even death.

Har-Tru
01-08-2012, 05:35 PM
I think Parents are good always.Sometimes they are angry but good.Children are loved only by parents.Trusts cannot show love.cannot breastfeed children.:wavey:This abduction of foreign kids is very stupid.

What if the parents are a pair of drug-addicts that aren't even able to feed and bathe their children?

Logical
01-08-2012, 05:43 PM
What if the parents are a pair of drug-addicts that aren't even able to feed and bathe their children?Grandparents and relations.But that is very rare cases?i think family love is better then caretaking homes because society is very bad too.They can grow kids and later misuse them.

Lee
01-08-2012, 05:47 PM
Grandparents and relations.But that is very rare cases?i think family love is better then caretaking homes because society is very bad too.

It is not difficult to go on internet and search how many children were killed by their abusive, alcoholic, drug addict, and/or uncaring parents. Yes, these are not majority (and thank God for that) but still there are one too many.

It will be great if there are reliable grandparents and/or relatives to take care of children whose parent are unfit but unfortunately lots of abusive parents come from abusive families themselves

star
01-08-2012, 06:44 PM
I think Parents are good always.Sometimes they are angry but good.Children are loved only by parents.Trusts cannot show love.cannot breastfeed children.:wavey:This abduction of foreign kids is very stupid.

I wish parents were always good. :hug:

The cold hard fact is that in some instances parents cruelly physically and sexually abuse their children. Sometimes they even kill their children. Sometimes parents are incapacitated by mental illness or drug abuse.

I agree with your later post that it is best to place children with their extended family if the parents are unfit. Sometimes that isnít possible, and sadly sometimes family members are blinded by their love and give the children back to the unfit parents. I also agree that foster parents can sometimes turn out to be bad people too.

Itís a terrible, terrible situation when children are removed from their home. Itís hard on everyone. I hope that the Norwegian agency did everything they could to make sure the children could not be safe in their home before removing them.

Shinoj
01-09-2012, 01:58 PM
The line of reasoning to abduct the children is crazy indeed. if the Reports are true its high handedness

buddyholly
01-09-2012, 02:18 PM
http://www.emirates247.com/news/world/parents-lose-kids-for-sleeping-on-same-bed-2011-12-26-1.434527

A couple of weeks ago you complained when I mentioned a trial going on in Canada right now, where an Afghan father and his twenty year old son are on trial for putting 3 daughters/sisters and wife #1 in a car and drowning them in a canal. You said something like ''the Western media should not be reporting cases like this, because they are prejudicial to Islam and not typical of Muslim life.''

So my question is "Why did you consider this full-of-holes account of child ''abduction'' in Norway worth its own thread? Are two children taken away from their parents by Norway's child welfare authorities a much more worthy story than four women murdered by their immediate male family members for ''liking'' boys?