Fave Spaniard? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Fave Spaniard?

Nimi
09-27-2002, 07:15 PM
Well there was fave Argentinian & fave American sp why not do a poll about the biggest tennis country in the world (except for Israel, of course :o)

My fave is Alex Corretja btw.

Layla
09-27-2002, 07:42 PM
All right! Now you're talking. Spain is my favorite tennis nation. :D

Quite predictably, I voted for Juan Carlos Ferrero. :) But I also love Alex Corretja, Carlos Moya and Tommy Robredo.

lucyfer
09-27-2002, 07:49 PM
Juanqui :D

vaiva
09-27-2002, 07:55 PM
Carlos Moya is my big fav among them :)

But I also like Alex and Juanqui :D

anabel
09-27-2002, 08:00 PM
Argh i cant vote twice, so as Alex has already 1 vote, my vote goes for Tommy.

Nimi
09-27-2002, 08:06 PM
Also, Spain is THE BEST nation in Davis Cup, right?

Vera
09-27-2002, 08:06 PM
Spain is my favorite tennis nation and l like all spanish players.

But I have no problem choosing one: Juanqui :D he's the best!

Moya is second but if Carlos meet Juanqui in Salem Final, I wish Juanqui wins.

Mrs. B
09-27-2002, 08:07 PM
Alex--numero uno.

Juanqui & Moya are second place. ;)

TennisHack
09-27-2002, 08:16 PM
Juan Carlos is holding a pretty substantial lead. Helped, of course, by my vote :)

Kuilli
09-27-2002, 08:25 PM
Alex :)

veronika
09-27-2002, 08:25 PM
Alex

Jessi
09-27-2002, 08:45 PM
i voted for alex but i also like moya.

Lucas Arg
09-27-2002, 09:04 PM
Albert Costa:D

Sharon
09-27-2002, 09:12 PM
I voted for Ferrero

ILR
09-27-2002, 09:21 PM
Carlos no 1 :hearts: then JCF :hearts:

TheBoiledEgg
09-27-2002, 09:27 PM
Carlos Moya


there should only be 3 choices as others are non-entities :D

Carlos, JCF and Alex

Scotso
09-27-2002, 09:37 PM
I like both JC and Tommy, but I voted for JC.

Chloe le Bopper
09-27-2002, 09:39 PM
I like most of them :p

But of course I voted Ferrero, as he's my absolute fave :D

Pea
09-27-2002, 11:07 PM
Alex rules the world!:angel:

renatoal
09-27-2002, 11:25 PM
My favorite spanish player is Carlos Moya ...

dbc
09-27-2002, 11:33 PM
Where are all the moya Fans. Come & vote, he needs them to overtake at least Alex! After all Moya is still a bachelor & Alex is a married man!!!

ILR
09-27-2002, 11:37 PM
I voted!Hey Carlos is a bachelor?Hmm..................;) :drool:

seph617
09-27-2002, 11:41 PM
Albert Costa:D

Dissident
09-28-2002, 12:38 AM
Charlie! :D

joanbalcells
09-28-2002, 12:55 AM
well, i like all the Spaniards, though i have a soft spot for Alex, Albert and Joan Balcells. Never embraced JCF as much as the others.

let me also say that I miss Sergi Bruguera, Emilio Sanchez, and Carlos Costa very much.

Irish
09-28-2002, 01:58 AM
I tried to vote for Carlos Moya but keep getting the error message that my session has ended like on WTA World. :mad:

Carlos Moya :hearts:
Alex Corretja :hearts:
Feliciano Lopez :hearts:
Tommy Robredo :hearts:
Juan Carlos Ferrero :hearts:
Albert Costa :kiss:

Gonzo Hates Me!
09-28-2002, 02:18 AM
Ugh, I am boycottting this! No Juan Balcells! What a disgrace of a poll! LOL! He is so much more than "Other Spaniard!"

is6
09-28-2002, 03:41 AM
Moya does it for me:D

ys
09-28-2002, 04:10 AM
No, no - that is a question to Becca, i have no symapthy to any of these guys.. Well, Moya perhaps, for his skills of handling Australian fries.

Lapentti
09-28-2002, 04:58 AM
FERRERO :kiss:

peeler
09-28-2002, 08:44 AM
i really don't understand why u can't vote for two ppl coz i was torn between juanqui, robredo and moyke!!!!!!! but i put juanqui.

Nimi
09-28-2002, 09:26 AM
I was thinking of putting Balcells there, but.... Well... I wanted to piss Mrs Guga off :p

Elske
09-28-2002, 09:57 AM
Juan Carlos :drool:

cheliste
09-28-2002, 10:02 AM
I voted for Juan Carlos:D :D But Carlos Moya is my very very close second fave.
Too bad we couldn't vote for two players.:(

Carmody
09-28-2002, 10:06 AM
:bounce: Moya :)

vaiva
09-28-2002, 12:49 PM
Weu..... Carlos should be No 1

I wish I had multiple personalities to cast more votes on this poll ;)

And my penguins don't use computers :(

claudine140
09-28-2002, 12:55 PM
I don't care how many points another spanjard gets, to me NUMERO UNA = CARLOS MOYA!!!!!

CARLOS MOYA
CARLOS MOYA
CARLOS MOYA

Claudine

tennischick
09-28-2002, 01:32 PM
Moya and Correjta :hearts:

the recent platinum blond is my least favorite. :p

Daniel
09-28-2002, 03:22 PM
Mine are:

Alex CORRETJA
Carlos MOYA
Juan Carlos FERRERO
Tommy ROBREDO
Albert COSTA
Felix MATILLA
David FERRER
Fernando VINCENTE
Alberto MARTIN

Nacho
09-28-2002, 03:25 PM
1- JUAN CARLOS :D
2- TOMMY :)
3- CARLOS, ALEX, ALBERT, FELICIANO, BETO
4- The rest

hhx
09-28-2002, 03:27 PM
Tommy :)

Elisse
09-28-2002, 09:11 PM
Juan Carlos! :D

Lily
09-28-2002, 09:47 PM
This one's tough...I like Alex, Carlos and JC, but I'll say Carlos cause JC has enough votes :D

AdriRob
09-28-2002, 10:43 PM
I like Juanqui...but Alex is better

Ma. Estefania
09-28-2002, 11:59 PM
My fave one is Ferrero; but I also like Feliciano López who unfortunately is not in this list; anyway, I prefer Juan Carlos.

Chloe le Bopper
09-29-2002, 12:14 AM
Originally posted by y_s
No, no - that is a question to Becca, i have no symapthy to any of these guys.. Well, Moya perhaps, for his skills of handling Australian fries.

:p I saw this :fiery:

You KNOW that you voted for Ferrero :angel: :D

lin
09-29-2002, 01:08 AM
Alex Corretja :D

I also like Juan Carlos and Tommy :)

Alberto
09-29-2002, 01:49 AM
1st - Felix Mantilla :) :) :)
2nd - Carlos Moyá :) :)
3rd - Feliciano López :)

Pea
09-29-2002, 02:20 AM
PFFFF! Where are the Corretja fans!!!!:fiery:

KFS
09-29-2002, 03:55 AM
Clearly my vote is for who!!! ;)

Nimi
09-29-2002, 09:30 AM
Originally posted by Pea
PFFFF! Where are the Corretja fans!!!!:fiery:

Obviously here. :D

Chloe le Bopper
09-29-2002, 10:18 AM
There are lots of Corretja fans.

They just are massed in with the Ferrero and Moya fans, who overtake him ;)

Felix
09-29-2002, 10:21 AM
Ferrero

Gladia
09-29-2002, 11:01 AM
:bounce: Moya :bounce:

Nimi
09-29-2002, 01:24 PM
Originally posted by Rebecca
There are lots of Corretja fans.

They just are massed in with the Ferrero and Moya fans, who overtake him ;)

I will no longer talk to you :p

Layla
09-29-2002, 01:36 PM
LOL, I'm a huge Corretja fan. But Juanqui is my true love. :kiss: ;) :p

Gonzo Hates Me!
09-30-2002, 04:09 AM
That's so cool how we suddenly have so many Ecuadorian posters!

ROXY
09-30-2002, 05:37 AM
Ferrero and Corretja

maratski
09-30-2002, 09:29 AM
Ferrero's the man :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:

galadriel
09-30-2002, 09:46 PM
Corretja

Ma. Estefania
09-30-2002, 11:09 PM
Originally posted by Mrs_Guga
That's so cool how we suddenly have so many Ecuadorian posters!

Really? or you're saying it in an ironic way?:angel:
Je je, well, honestly I don't see to many ecuadorian posters here, so I hope I can be the leader for them, je je.;)

AmErIcAn
10-01-2002, 08:28 PM
Moya is just to die for :drool: :drool: :drool:

Jorge
10-30-2002, 11:38 PM
Carles Moyà
Albert Costa
Álex Corretja
Félix Mantilla
Galo Blanco
Francisco Clavet
and... Juan Carlos Ferrero. (As a deference to my dear friend Rebecca, who is in love with "el mosquito") :p

Go Nalby
10-31-2002, 12:05 AM
Alex gets my vote :)

I also like the other Spaniards (especially Carlos and JCF)

harry_potter
10-31-2002, 02:28 AM
alex coretja :drool: :drool: :lick:

TennisHack
10-31-2002, 03:33 AM
LOL, can I vote twice? :angel:

harry_potter
10-31-2002, 01:39 PM
ermm... maybe, if u ask nicely ;) :D

RogiFan
11-05-2002, 01:20 AM
:) Hey, is it too late to vote???

My all-time fave Spaniard is the one and only

ALEX CORRETJA.

[He has the game, the looks, the personality and the talent! Plus he has those "legendary thighs" -- as someone said somewhere and I agree!]

:p
;)

RogiFan
11-05-2002, 01:22 AM
;) Oh yeah, and can he milk a cow or what!! :p

claudine140
11-07-2002, 02:53 PM
1 moya
2 corretja
3 fererro
4 lopez
5 robredo

Moya is the big number UNO !!!!!!!!
:bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

claudine140
11-08-2002, 09:17 AM
COME ON MOYA FANS WHERE ARE YOU

Catriel
12-08-2002, 10:52 PM
I voted Alex Corretja, he is a gentleman, a very nice guy.

But my favorite non-argentinian players used to be Moyá and Philippousis, so..
Hey Carlos! Fuerza maestro! Vamos Charly!!!:D

claudine140
12-09-2002, 07:09 PM
MOYA MOYA MOYA MOYA

HE IS THE BEST EUROPEAN PLAYER FROM EUROPE THIS YEAR

HE MADE THE BIGGEST JUMP ON THE ENTRY LIST

HE WON ALMOST MOST TOURNEMENTS THIS YEAR

FOUR TOURNEMENTS
ANOTHER TWO FINALS
AND SOME SEMIFINALS

GET INTO THE SHANGHAI MASTERS SEMIFINAL
DEFEATED VERY BIG PLAYERS LIKE AGASSI SAFIN FERRERO (once) HEWITT ETC.....

I WISH HIM ANOTHER GREAT MARVELLOUS YEAR IN 2003
;) :D :) :bounce: :bounce: :wavey: :kiss: :hearts:

jrm
12-11-2002, 08:48 PM
Originally posted by RogiFan
:) Hey, is it too late to vote???

My all-time fave Spaniard is the one and only

ALEX CORRETJA.

[He has the game, the looks, the personality and the talent! Plus he has those "legendary thighs" -- as someone said somewhere and I agree!]

:p
;)

hey that was me saying about alex's thighs - wow they are really impressive. He must be the fittest guy on tour plus that strong right hand could only be challanged by Fernando Gonzalez

Ma. Estefania
12-11-2002, 11:11 PM
Originally posted by jrm
hey that was me saying about alex's thighs - wow they are really impressive. He must be the fittest guy on tour plus that strong right hand could only be challanged by Fernando Gonzalez

Oh yeah.....Fernando....:drool: :drool:

luvjcf
01-12-2003, 06:00 AM
JUAN CARLOS FERRERO is no. 1

:D :D :D :D :D

Moya is no. 2

claudine140
01-14-2003, 07:24 PM
Moya is the best, the most beautifull, the sexiest and friendly player of all spanish players.
Who agree with me,???????

Ma. Estefania
01-14-2003, 10:30 PM
By the way, I also like Feliciano López.

Laury
01-16-2003, 03:52 AM
Carlos Moyá :hearts: :hearts:

claudine140
01-16-2003, 05:14 PM
Yoepi thanks for all the moya supports!!!!!

aura of moya
01-17-2003, 01:37 PM
Hey Guys,
Well, my name answers the question really.
Moya will always be my fave spaniard as long as he's playing.

But I definitely have discovered his next of kin so to speak.
It use to be Juan Carlos but I have just enjoyed what I've seen of Feliciano Lopez so much, that he takes second place.

I'm really hanging for a match up between him and Hewitt.

I'll be there hoping he'll beat Younes :p

Simon

claudine140
01-17-2003, 01:48 PM
Yes me too i am a big fan from moyke as you all know , but i begin to like Lopez too, he just looks like moyke when he was younger. But i never saw lopez play, i hope i will in the futur.

claudine140
01-26-2003, 09:41 AM
in two weeks we will have daviscup week
than all the fans from this wonderfull spanjard team can enjoy looking to their favorite player: Moya, or Ferrero or Corretja...
I surely hope they all can win their matches against the Belgium team. So we can all be proud and happy
Claudine

JonBcn
01-30-2003, 01:50 PM
1. Juan Balcells
2. Alex Corretja
3. Albert Costa

I'll be in Seville for the Davis Cup...can't wait!

Gonzo Hates Me!
01-30-2003, 04:59 PM
How can Balcells not be on the list?! He is the only one I like. "Other Spaniard" just doesn't cut it

BALCELLS FOREVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Gonzo Hates Me!
01-30-2003, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by JonBcn
1. Juan Balcells
2. Alex Corretja
3. Albert Costa

I'll be in Seville for the Davis Cup...can't wait!

Honorary Spaniard, I am quite happy for you! Have fun. I can't wait to attend a tennis tournament one day

Chloe le Bopper
01-30-2003, 05:54 PM
I'll be in Seville for the Davis Cup...can't wait!

*jealous*

In unrelated news, Balcells=rwoar ;)

Sjengster
01-30-2003, 06:56 PM
"in two weeks we will have daviscup week
than all the fans from this wonderfull spanjard team can enjoy looking to their favorite player: Moya, or Ferrero or Corretja...
I surely hope they all can win their matches against the Belgium team. So we can all be proud and happy"

Trifle disloyal for a Belgian, aren't you?

I voted for Mantilla, simply because he's the only one to endure the misfortune of having his name misspelled - although come to think of it, I don't think Vincente is quite right either.

petchy
02-01-2003, 04:29 AM
I voted Ferreo.He's my most favourite.

Xin
02-02-2003, 12:06 AM
Originally posted by claudine140
Moya is the best, the most beautifull, the sexiest and friendly player of all spanish players.
Who agree with me,???????

I agree with you:hearts:

Raquel
02-09-2003, 02:53 AM
Juan Carlos, with Tommy a close second!

GabbylovesLleyton
02-09-2003, 11:46 PM
Definately Juan Carlos......I have to admit....he is a cutie!!!
:bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

Evita
02-13-2003, 09:16 AM
Juanqui, of course (look at my photo on the left).;) ;)

But I like Moya & Corretja as well.

All the spaniards are attractive to me.

azza
07-01-2003, 09:58 AM
david ferrer :o

HybridTheory
07-01-2003, 10:11 AM
Alex!!:kiss:

esther
07-01-2003, 01:10 PM
JC!!
ooooooobviously

Shadow
07-01-2003, 01:16 PM
Out of the list Juanqui and Alex

Overall its RAFAEL NADAL :p

Glenn
07-01-2003, 01:33 PM
Rafi Nadal! :drool:

Wojtek
07-01-2003, 01:46 PM
Robredo

JuaNQui FoReVeR
07-01-2003, 02:34 PM
Ferrero. :D

Corredian's_Mind
07-01-2003, 03:58 PM
ALEX and for sure i dont have doubt about it!!!!!! :hearts:

Action Jackson
12-03-2003, 10:25 AM
Alex Corretja and Felix Mantilla.

jtipson
12-03-2003, 10:40 AM
Where are Nadal and Lopez?

Springy
12-03-2003, 11:17 AM
FELICIANO AND RAFAEL ALL THE WAY!

WyverN
12-03-2003, 12:29 PM
Lopez

michelleg
12-03-2003, 01:02 PM
Actually, its not Feliciano. Never met the guy. He's just good totty, that's all.

My favorite is Fernando Vicente. Nice guy and a darn good tennis player who could be a damn good player if he really wanted to be one....

Kiara
12-03-2003, 01:43 PM
NADAL!!!

oxy
12-03-2003, 01:49 PM
one n only......JUAN CARLOS FERRERO.............!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yashirobai
12-03-2003, 02:26 PM
What there is no doubt about is that, today, Spain is the best country in tennis. Absoultely no doubt. And 2nd would be the USA, for sure.

WyverN
12-03-2003, 03:09 PM
I would say there is doubt. Argentina nearly beat you on clay with their second string team.

jtipson
12-03-2003, 03:19 PM
And the Australians would certainly have a case against them as well!
I wouldn't rate the US as the second strongest nation in men's tennis either. They may have the number one and four, but not a lot else right now ;-)

michelleg
12-03-2003, 04:05 PM
The Aussies don't have much in terms of depth, though.

MisterQ
12-03-2003, 04:08 PM
Moya is the only one I like a lot. But they are all good players.

Nadal sounds like an entertaining player --- but I have not yet had the chance to see him play.

Deboogle!.
12-03-2003, 04:14 PM
I wouldn't rate the US as the second strongest nation in men's tennis either. They may have the number one and four, but not a lot else right now ;-)

We'll see, there are a good handful of players who are making their move - led by Dent and Fish I'd say. Fish is already top 20 and if they both start 2004 well, we could have 4 guys in the top 20, that's not too shabby.

Deboogle!.
12-03-2003, 04:15 PM
and as far as the poll.... where's Lopez? I gotta stick by my fellow lefties :)

Yashirobai
12-03-2003, 04:56 PM
Argentina nearly beated Spain in DC, yes, but:

1) They lost. (And check DC historial: # of finals of Argentina?)

2) Check the Grand Slam winners (or even runner-ups) of the last 5-10 years and tell me how many argentinians are there (0) and how many spaniards are there (a lot...)

3) Check the number of players in the Top 100, which tells you a lot about the level of the country: Spain, #1, 17 players (2nd, France, with 11, but except for Grosejan and Clement they are all down 50; USA, 3rd, with 10 -almost tied with France- but with #1 and #4), and Argentina... just 6, so Spain is almost three times more.

4) Look at players who have played at Tennis Masters Cup for the last 5-10 years, as it tells you who are the top. Spain has a lot, Argentina, I think just Coria and Nalbandián for this year, tied with Spain, but with worse ranknings (SP, 2+7 = 9, Arg, 4+8=12).

5)# of #Ones (SP, 2 (Ferrero and Moya), ARG, 0).

6) Number of Tennis Masters Series won by Spaniards and Argentinians. Spain has a lot... while Argentina has just two, starting with Cañas last year.

7) Singles ATP Titles, the most commons, Spain has been for the last years, since 1996 I think, not sure, #1 or #2, like the USA, while Argentina, far away...

Well, I think it's enough, all the statistics show there is no doubt.

Spain is much better than Argentina, In any case, Spain could be more tied with the USA if we are talking about the last... 5 years, because there is no doubt that historically the US is extremely better than Spain). Australia, although they defeated us in Davis Cup, wouldn't be too far away, but it is clear that, as a team (not DC team), Spain is better and more complete (they don't have anybody else but Hewitt and Philippoussis in Top 100!!).

Sjengster
12-03-2003, 06:34 PM
and as far as the poll.... where's Lopez? I gotta stick by my fellow lefties :)

Ah, another lefty eh? That makes you, me and Tennis Fool I believe... Lopez is my favourite too, closely followed by Costa and Mantilla. It could be a single-handed backhand thing I suppose, but I also enjoy watching them play for very different reasons.

TennisLurker
12-03-2003, 06:56 PM
My favorite spaniards are Costa and Mantilla too, I like Moya but I dont like Ferrero.

Lopez annoys me with that slice backhand.

Sjengster
12-03-2003, 07:01 PM
Yes, if he could just hit through it normally I'm sure he could have won those tight matches he lost to Federer - as it is, whenever anyone comes in on his backhand side all he can do is throw up a weak defensive lob in response. He seems to be a bit of a Federer clone sometimes, he has the headband, the ponytail, the elegant serve and volley, but not quite the same level of ability.

undomiele
12-03-2003, 07:29 PM
Yashirobai: I agree that Spain is one of the best tennis countries in the world right now but Wyvern was just saying that the Argentines are competitive with Spain on clay now and that, you have to admit, is true. Coria is every bit the favorite for next year's FO as Ferrero is (if not more since he had a better all-round clay court season) and the Argentines dominating Hamburg was a notable feat. I for one am just content at the fact that we and all Latin Americans are getting better at the game. Kudos to Kuerten and Rios for paving the way.... :)

Can't wait till next year!

*Ljubica*
12-03-2003, 08:22 PM
I would vote for Alex - OK he's had a bad year this year and is probably coming to the end of his career, - but he's still a lovely guy and a credit to the sport, - a real gentleman.

rogicomel
12-04-2003, 01:52 AM
Vamos Moyke!

Chloe le Bopper
12-04-2003, 03:42 AM
Argentina nearly beated Spain in DC, yes, but:

1) They lost. (And check DC historial: # of finals of Argentina?)

They lost in the fifth live rubber, when their top two singles players didn't show up. This is true. Why is the number of finals relevant to which country is better TODAY? It isn't.


2) Check the Grand Slam winners (or even runner-ups) of the last 5-10 years and tell me how many argentinians are there (0) and how many spaniards are there (a lot...)

For one thing, you're stats are entirely wrong. Nalbandian was Wimbledon runner up JUST LAST YEAR. At last check, WIMBLEDON IS A SLAM. Christ. Furthermore, this is totally irrelevant to which nation is better TODAY.


3) Check the number of players in the Top 100, which tells you a lot about the level of the country: Spain, #1, 17 players (2nd, France, with 11, but except for Grosejan and Clement they are all down 50; USA, 3rd, with 10 -almost tied with France- but with #1 and #4), and Argentina... just 6, so Spain is almost three times more.

True, but of those 6 players, ALL of them are ranked in the top 40, and at one point this year, all of them were verging on the top 30. If Canas was healthy and played this year, it'd have been 7 in the top 40. Which is roughly what Spain has.

Spain also has a lot more money to dump into their tennis programs than Argentina does. Considering the ecomonic situation in Argentina, that they have so many young talents is rather impressive. Spain has been churning players out for decades... :)


4) Look at players who have played at Tennis Masters Cup for the last 5-10 years, as it tells you who are the top. Spain has a lot, Argentina, I think just Coria and Nalbandián for this year, tied with Spain, but with worse ranknings (SP, 2+7 = 9, Arg, 4+8=12).

The last 5-10 years ARE NOT RELEVANT WHEN DISCUSSING WHICH NATION IS THE BEST TODAY. Get it?


5)# of #Ones (SP, 2 (Ferrero and Moya), ARG, 0).

NOT RELEVANT (Moya, that is. Ferrero reached it this year, thus his case is relevant). Although it is worth noting that until 4-5 years ago Spain had never had a number one player either.


6) Number of Tennis Masters Series won by Spaniards and Argentinians. Spain has a lot... while Argentina has just two, starting with Cañas last year.

NOT RELEVANT.


7) Singles ATP Titles, the most commons, Spain has been for the last years, since 1996 I think, not sure, #1 or #2, like the USA, while Argentina, far away...

See that part where you go "since 1996"... NOT RELEVANT. When speaking about which nation is better NOW TODAY IN THE PRESENT TIME... all this historical crap means shit. Nada. Get it?

Well, I think it's enough, all the statistics show there is no doubt.

Not true. Your stats have left me with lots of doubt. Much of it over your ability to research stats and print them out properly, as well as concerns over your memory (hello? Wimbledon 2002? THAT WAS LAST YEAR)

Spain is much better than Argentina,

Not true. Spain almost lost to Argentina's B team - and had Argentina played Calleri day one, or Zab hadn't gotten inured, I believe they would have. Get it? Spain struggled to defeat Argentina's 3rd, 4th, and 5th best players, while using their top two.

Furthermore, they have the same number in the top 10, and roughly the same number of players in the top 40.

Spain has the best player of both nations up till this point - in Ferrero - but Coria at 21 has eclipsed what Ferrero had done at the same age (minus Davis Cup).


In any case, Spain could be more tied with the USA if we are talking about the last... 5 years,

I thought you were speaking of the last 10 years? Or was it since 1996? Get it straight.

WyverN
12-04-2003, 04:17 AM
Yes statistics are always bullshit and can be arranged to suit your needs. For example Argentina had the last four players in a TMC this year, something Spain never achieved.

Personally I think Argentinian top team will defeat the Spain top team on grass and hardcourts. Even clay is debatable.

Yashirobai
12-04-2003, 08:39 PM
They lost in the fifth live rubber, when their top two singles players didn't show up. This is true. Why is the number of finals relevant to which country is better TODAY? It isn't.

They lost in the fifth rubber, yes, which means they were tied. But, in that tie, Spain was better. DC historial is not relevant today, but IT IS important DC historial of the last 5-10 years, where Spain has won and reached one final. I should have specified that, yes.


For one thing, you're stats are entirely wrong. Nalbandian was Wimbledon runner up JUST LAST YEAR. At last check, WIMBLEDON IS A SLAM. Christ. Furthermore, this is totally irrelevant to which nation is better TODAY.
Quote:

I can only agree with you, I forgot Nalbandian in Wimbledon. Yes. But the difference between Spain and Argentina is still huge in that sense, and IT IS relevant to which nation is better TODAY if we look to GS of the last years, as they are, as you know, the most importants tournaments of the world.


True, but of those 6 players, ALL of them are ranked in the top 40, and at one point this year, all of them were verging on the top 30. If Canas was healthy and played this year, it'd have been 7 in the top 40. Which is roughly what Spain has.

Spain also has a lot more money to dump into their tennis programs than Argentina does. Considering the ecomonic situation in Argentina, that they have so many young talents is rather impressive. Spain has been churning players out for decades...

Yes, they are all in the TOP 40, but I was talking about TOP 100. They are almost tied in TOP 40, OK, but not in the TOP 100, which probably tlls you more about the real level of the country as it shows more players (otherwise, Switzerland would be #2 of the world if we only look at TOP 2, while the next player they have is Rosset after Top100...).


You are talking about Cañas (not Canas), who should be, you say, in TOP 30. Well, Corretja, for his game, he should also be there (he is... menatlly injured), Fernando Verdasco was in TOP 100 two or three weeks before, etc. For good or for bad, we can only check the stats the way they are, not suppousing other possibilitices that have not happened.

And true, Spain has more money, but according to this rule, Spain is about 20 times better than the USA if we llok at the money and the population, so... that's something that has a role in the whole thing, and you can say that it is more "meritorious" for Argentina having so many players up there, but not that they are better, because they are not.


The last 5-10 years ARE NOT RELEVANT WHEN DISCUSSING WHICH NATION IS THE BEST TODAY. Get it?

Yes, of course they are relevant. When we say TODAY it is kind of a expression to mean during the last years.


NOT RELEVANT (Moya, that is. Ferrero reached it this year, thus his case is relevant). Although it is worth noting that until 4-5 years ago Spain had never had a number one player either.

Well, we had Manuel Santana beore the Open era, so that is not totally correct. Also, we are again in the same. Is TODAY December 4, or how the things are in the last few years? I thought, here, it was the second one...


NOT RELEVANT.

Yes they are relevant, after GS, Masters Series are the most important, and for those statistics, even more, as there are more MS than GS played every year.


See that part where you go "since 1996"... NOT RELEVANT. When speaking about which nation is better NOW TODAY IN THE PRESENT TIME... all this historical crap means shit. Nada. Get it?

The same again. We are talking about players who are in active, not retired, when we say today, and except for Bruguera, then Corretja, Costa, Ferrero, Moyá, Mantilla and all them are still playing. So it is TODAY in that way.


Not true. Your stats have left me with lots of doubt. Much of it over your ability to research stats and print them out properly, as well as concerns over your memory (hello? Wimbledon 2002? THAT WAS LAST YEAR)

Sad from you that you use a single mistake which doesn't change the situation at all to attack my stats...


Not true. Spain almost lost to Argentina's B team - and had Argentina played Calleri day one, or Zab hadn't gotten inured, I believe they would have. Get it? Spain struggled to defeat Argentina's 3rd, 4th, and 5th best players, while using their top two.

Did you know that physical conditions are also important in sports? And what about suporting the pressure? This is what Spain did in DC and Argentina didn't. Or did you pretend Spain to play with Robredo and Costa because Argentina couldn't have their #1 and #2? It's their problem, not ours.


Furthermore, they have the same number in the top 10, and roughly the same number of players in the top 40.

Today, December 4, they do, but in the last few years they haven't. And they don't have a player so closed to #1 who has already been, and Nalbandian reache #8 in about 3 or 4 months as maximum. Moya is in the Top 8 or Top 10 since a much longer time ago...


Spain has the best player of both nations up till this point - in Ferrero - but Coria at 21 has eclipsed what Ferrero had done at the same age (minus Davis Cup).

It is not relevant. Otherwise, Nadal or Gasquet would be much better than all the Top 10... doesn't matter when we talk about who is better the age, it matters what you do. We'll see, when Coria is 23, if he is able to reach 3 GS finals, a MC one, win a Davis Cup and become #1. Don't thinks so, but even if it happens, it will be FUTURE, NOT PRESENT.
Quote:


I thought you were speaking of the last 10 years? Or was it since 1996? Get it straight.

As you could read, I used the word "about..." many times. It doesn't matter the exact date you start, the result eill be the same 4, 6, 8 or 10 years from now.


Would be nice from you to give some interesting stat to prove that Spain is not that better than Argentina... The ones that you gave were almost totally irrelevant.

WyverN
12-05-2003, 12:03 AM
Argentina had the last 4 players in a masters series event this year, Spain didn't.

Deboogle!.
12-05-2003, 12:23 AM
Yes, of course they are relevant. When we say TODAY it is kind of a expression to mean during the last years. [/B]



uh..... say what??????

the whole point of the word today is that it means TODAY, right here and now on this day.

In fact, the word can be used as 3 different parts of speech, all meaning the same thing:

NOUN: The present day, time, or age.
ADVERB: 1. During or on the present day.
2. During or at the present time.
ADJECTIVE: Concerned with or relating to the present time: today issues; the today generation.

ETYMOLOGY: Middle English to dai, from Old English t dæge : t, to; see to + dæge, dative of dæg, day;

Yashirobai
12-05-2003, 02:24 PM
Never mind, look to all the statistics applicable to TODAY the way you are using it and tell me who is better then.

But think that using TODAY in that sense, you cannot even take a look to the Tennis Maters Cup or Grands Slams or Davis Cup of this year, as an example, so it becomes real difficult to compare as you can only see the TOP 100... do you think it is logical?

Chloe le Bopper
12-07-2003, 04:04 AM
Personally I think Argentinian top team will defeat the Spain top team on grass and hardcourts. Even clay is debatable.

I agree. Spain has the best player at present, but Argentina can field a better team.

That said, obviously Spain tops Argentina as a top tennis nation at the moment... but that has nothing to do with who would beat who.

Lynne
12-07-2003, 04:05 AM
All of the Spaniards are all right but my fave is Juan Carlos Ferrero!! :angel:

Chloe le Bopper
12-07-2003, 04:07 AM
Yes, they are all in the TOP 40, but I was talking about TOP 100. They are almost tied in TOP 40, OK, but not in the TOP 100, which probably tlls you more about the real level of the country as it shows more players (otherwise, Switzerland would be #2 of the world if we only look at TOP 2, while the next player they have is Rosset after Top100...).

Forgive me for not being impressed by Blanco or Vicente...


You are talking about Cañas (not Canas), who should be, you say, in TOP 30. Well, Corretja, for his game, he should also be there (he is... menatlly injured), Fernando Verdasco was in TOP 100 two or three weeks before, etc. For good or for bad, we can only check the stats the way they are, not suppousing other possibilitices that have not happened.

Uh, you know who I meant, so why be a condesceding shithead about it? I don't have a function on my keyboard that allows me to place that accent above Guillermo's name, thus I don't place on there. Deal with it.

Chloe le Bopper
12-07-2003, 04:10 AM
(spare me the lecture on how Cañas and Canas mean totally different things because the "ñ" is different from the "n". I already know that.)

TennisLurker
12-07-2003, 05:02 AM
(spare me the lecture on how Cañas and Canas mean totally different things because the "ñ" is different from the "n". I already know that.)


alt 164

ñ


;)

Chloe le Bopper
12-07-2003, 05:22 AM
That doesn't work for me :(

But thanks for trying to help. Generally, if there is a spare "ñ" around, I will copy and paste it. Otherwise, if I write" Canas" absolutely ever person on this board knows who I am talking about, and while it may seem rude or disrespectful or what have you, if I don't have the option on my keyboard... I don't have the option on my keyboard.

MisterQ
12-07-2003, 06:29 AM
I hadn't tried to get the tilde in print before, but I just tried it... on my Mac it works to go option n, then type n. (option is the same as alt)

But clearly if someone types Canas we all know what is meant, come on guys...

Jazzy
12-07-2003, 11:31 AM
let me see. Just look at my signiture, obvouisly Juanqui!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!! :banana:

Yashirobai
12-07-2003, 11:43 AM
I just specified that the real name was Cañas n stead of Canas, but het, Queen Rebecca, I understood perfectly what you had said so I answered the same way I would have answered if you had said Cañas.

Besides, I don't care if you are not impressed about Blanco or Vicente, they are just t top 100 players who make Spain's general level rise more.

And I don't think they would beat us on hard or grass either: check the results of tournaments on these surfaces (OF THIS YEAR, not of the las 5-10 years, I hope it is Ok for you then...) and tell me what country had better results.

WyverN
12-07-2003, 01:27 PM
It is such a shame the Argentinians were undermanned in DC semi. Would have been the most interesting tie by far of the whole tournament.

Crazy_Fool
12-07-2003, 02:54 PM
Ferrero!!!!

Iza
12-07-2003, 08:08 PM
JUANQUI! :lick:

Yashirobai
12-07-2003, 08:25 PM
I agree, I would have preffered to see Argeninta in that DC tie with Coria and Nalbandian, for two reasons:

a) Better spectacle, better game, more fun, better matches...

b) No excuses for the Argenitninas, who would have also lost :)

undomiele
12-07-2003, 10:12 PM
Yeah at least we can content ourselves with the fact that Coria and Nalbandian put up a better fight in Houston than Moya and Ferrero.... ;)

TennisLurker
12-07-2003, 10:30 PM
I dont think Spain would have won.
I think David would have defeated both Ferrero and Moya, and we would have won the doubles.
And I think Coria beats Moya too, but Ferrero beats Coria.

lalaland
12-07-2003, 10:53 PM
Dunno if Spain is better than Argentina or vice verse, but pretty sure they will both lose to Australia in a DC final played on grass in Melbourne.

And why is Coria's result at 21 eclipsed Ferrero's?Ferrero at 21 had won a Davis Cup, reached French Open SF 2 times, won a master series and reached another TMS final, ended the year in Top 5 and had a ISG hard court title. It's a slightly better results than Coria, very slightly. But achievement by age is irrelevant anyway, who would have thought Chang never reach number 1, the man he won his first slam at 17.

Yashirobai
12-07-2003, 11:41 PM
You said it lalaland.

Besides, undomiele, why are TMC Houston results important here? You could have said just any other tournament (like Roland Garros, much more important and on clay, where Spain had 4 of the last 8 players)...

TennisLurker
12-07-2003, 11:44 PM
Maybe she said Houston because players 1 and 2 from Argentina defeated players 1 and 2 from Spain in that tournament.

Chloe le Bopper
12-07-2003, 11:52 PM
It is such a shame the Argentinians were undermanned in DC semi. Would have been the most interesting tie by far of the whole tournament.
Next year :devil:

undomiele
12-07-2003, 11:54 PM
Exactly. Its the tournament of the "masters" and besides, Houston was the only place where all 4 players played against eachother in a high-stakes tournament, like they would have in the Davis Cup if Coria and Nalbandian had made it.

TennisLurker
12-07-2003, 11:57 PM
Queen Rebecca,
Is your forum worth registering?

Chloe le Bopper
12-07-2003, 11:59 PM
And why is Coria's result at 21 eclipsed Ferrero's?Ferrero at 21 had won a Davis Cup, reached French Open SF 2 times, won a master series and reached another TMS final, ended the year in Top 5 and had a ISG hard court title.

Coria has 6 titles in his carreer; Ferrero had 5 when he was 21. 5 of Coria's have come on clay, one of which was a Masters Series, and the 6th was on carpet. Of Ferrero's 5, 4 were on clay, one of which was a MS, and the 5th came on hardcourts.

They had both been in one other Masters Series final - Ferrero in Hamburg and Coria in Monte Carlo.

Coria has posted better results in Australia (R4) and the USO (QF) than Ferrero had at 21 (R3, R4), making the second week.

All that Ferrero had on him was one RG semifinal and Davis Cup. Seeing as I'm counting individual achievement, DC is irrelevant.

Coria's 2003 was greater than Ferrero's 2001, and he's better than Ferrero was at the same age. This all means nothing, and you're welcome to disagree. But my reasonsing on this is perfectly sound.

Leo
12-08-2003, 12:04 AM
Dunno if Spain is better than Argentina or vice verse, but pretty sure they will both lose to Australia in a DC final played on grass in Melbourne.

And why is Coria's result at 21 eclipsed Ferrero's?Ferrero at 21 had won a Davis Cup, reached French Open SF 2 times, won a master series and reached another TMS final, ended the year in Top 5 and had a ISG hard court title. It's a slightly better results than Coria, very slightly. But achievement by age is irrelevant anyway, who would have thought Chang never reach number 1, the man he won his first slam at 17.

Yes, but Coria's results on non-clay surfaces are much better at 21 than Ferrero's were. Coria has already won a carpet tournament (which Ferrero is STILL yet to accomplish), he's reached the quarters of the US Open, and the fourth round of the Oz Open.

If Argentina had their two top players present for the DC semis this year, there's not much doubt in my mind that they would have beaten Spain. As Becca already said, the Argentina "B" team WOULD have won had it not been for Zabaleta's unfortunate injury from 2 sets to love up.

WyverN
12-08-2003, 12:52 AM
Would Argentina play Nalbandian on clay though? Definetly not his best surface

TennisLurker
12-08-2003, 01:24 AM
David defeated Ferrero last year on clay in Estoril, and he leads Moya 2-1 (the three matches were played on clay), David and Ccarlos have not played since 2002 Estoril.

Chloe le Bopper
12-08-2003, 01:30 AM
I imagine that they would have played David in the doubles with Arnold, and saved him to play singles on day three. At least, that's what my strategy would have been. I do hope they give Calleri a little more consideration next year after his heroics this year :)

Sjengster
12-08-2003, 02:02 AM
Anyhow Lurker, to answer your question: yes, it is worth registering. But then I would say that, considering that I'm already a card-carrying member...

RogiFan88
12-08-2003, 02:13 AM
Yes, if he could just hit through it normally I'm sure he could have won those tight matches he lost to Federer - as it is, whenever anyone comes in on his backhand side all he can do is throw up a weak defensive lob in response. He seems to be a bit of a Federer clone sometimes, he has the headband, the ponytail, the elegant serve and volley, but not quite the same level of ability.

Interesting, that Feli fellow, I wonder what he's really like... you're spot on re: his level of ability there, Sjengst, you realize Feli has yet to win a title! And he is about a month younger than Rogi. But I do like Feli. ;)

lalaland
12-08-2003, 02:15 AM
Coria's 2003 was greater than Ferrero's 2001, and he's better than Ferrero was at the same age. This all means nothing, and you're welcome to disagree. But my reasonsing on this is perfectly sound.

If you say so. I dont disagree that Coria has a great year at 21. But did his result eclipsed Ferrero's is what I'm challenging. Their result's is very similar. 6 titles from Coria is better than 5, his 6th is Basel, kinda lucky for him to win it if you ask me but that didn't make that title any less valid, and you have to show up in the Final to get a lucky break so I respect that. And/but his 1 other surface title other than clay is carpet, which is no better than Ferrero's one other surface which is hardcourt. Is it a big deal that Ferrero hasn't had a carpet title yet as Coria hasn't had a hardcourt title either. If you want to count the detail, how about TMC that Ferrero got to SF in his first TMC while Coria didn't?

I'm not trying to show any disrespect to Coria because he did have a wonderful year and I like his game very much and I think he's equally good as Ferrero. If you think Coria is better than Ferrero, if you don't like Ferrero and not think highly of him, that's fine with me.

But to say Coria's result eclipsed Ferrero's matter-of-factly, then I think you are getting out of your way to disregard him. They have very similar result and I don't see the big difference between them to say Coria did a lot better than Ferrero when they are at 21. A lot of players' results at age 21 eclipsed Ferrero's, for instance, Moya and Kuerten, but I don't see Coria as one of them.

michelleg
12-08-2003, 02:21 AM
I am obviously biased (does the avatar give it away?) but believe that what Feli lacks is the self confidence and maturity on the court. He will have to find both before he can be a top ten player. He also needs a more reliable backhand and to volley more aggressively and consistently (read less sloppy volleys...)

Roger is a brilliantly gifted tennis player with an amazing presence of mind and maturity level beyond his years. I do hope that more young tennis players, especially those in the juniors, will aspire to take on a serve and volley game like Roger's. He brings back such grace to tennis.

rassklovn
12-08-2003, 02:53 AM
Since when has Federer been a serve/volleyer? Federer is an all court player and has the capabilities of changing his style of game to suit the situation, whereas Mirnyi would be classified as a true serve/volleyer.

Though it would be good if some juniors could learn something from Federer's game.

rassklovn
12-08-2003, 02:54 AM
I couldn't vote on this so I say Fernando Vicente and Felix Mantilla are my favourite Spaniards.

JeLuliA88
12-25-2003, 04:48 AM
Juanqui :)

Followed by Carlos Moya. I pretty much like all the spaniards, so naturally they're my favourite tennis nation.

~EMiLiTA~
12-25-2003, 08:40 AM
I think all the Spaniards are cool...I've met basically all of them and chatted with them and they're really nice and friendly. My main faves are Carlos, Tommy, JCF and Feli though

Hispanica
12-27-2003, 11:17 PM
My two fave are Alex and Tommy.

Tingu
12-29-2003, 02:34 AM
I have to admit it that Juanqui is pretty good.