Juniors who fail at the senior level. [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Juniors who fail at the senior level.

Filo V.
05-18-2011, 03:59 AM
Today Dusan Lojda was playing and lost quite badly to Frederik Nielsen in RG qualifying. And it made me think, I remember this guy doing great in juniors, and winning junior US Open in 2006. I remember people saying he would be top 100 and beyond quickly once he starts playing futures/challengers consistently. He's well below .500 in challengers and ATP qualifying in his career.

That then reminded me of probably a top 5 bust in tennis history, Tommy Ho. This guy was doing great in juniors and setting records for youngest-ever accomplishments. He was 36-66 on the ATP tour in his career.

I was wondering, what players do you think of when considering the biggest flops in tennis history? Or players who simply have failed in transitioning to the senior tour from juniors? Also, why do you think they fail in transitioning?

Filo V.
05-18-2011, 04:08 AM
Peter Polansky is another guy who hasn't done anything although I remember all the hype he received a few years ago. He's got a below .500 record in challengers and ATP qualifying also. These guys just stall out. I can understand developing slow, but then you have guys who completely bust and never produce decent level tennis. In other sports, the top draft picks or "future" talents don't bust on the semi-regular basis you see in tennis.

Smoke944
05-18-2011, 04:16 AM
A couple that come to mind from the birth years of 80-81 that produced so many good players are Kristian Pless and Julian Jeanpierre. Pless had better moments than Jeanpierre but still didn't live up to his junior results.

edit: One that I was thinking of from a few years ago is Nicolas Santos. Got to 2 in the world but at 23 hasn't yet broken the top 450.

Filo V.
05-18-2011, 04:24 AM
Eysseric and Sidorenko are other Frenchman of recent who has done little on the senior tour, although they had a lot of hype. Especially Essyeric. I heard people saying he was as good if not better than Monfils. Ouanna is another guy who had a lot of hype and has bombed.

Pless was a great junior, when I first started watching tennis, he played the junior final at the US Open, I forgot the year, it was like 1999 or 2000. And he had a lot of hype, because he was physically developed and hit the ball very hard. But he didn't do much at the ATP level. Very poor mentally, and very injury prone.

ssin
05-18-2011, 04:27 AM
Tipsarevic won junior AO ten years ago and still has zero titles.

Smoke944
05-18-2011, 04:34 AM
I just don't think Eysseric physically developed much more after 16 or 17. Still, he's improving and there's plenty of time.

Pless was brilliant in juniors, as you said final at the USO but also final at Wimby and won the AO over Youzhny.

What's obvious is that the Australian juniors doesn't count for a ton. Plenty of the top juniors don't play it and you have some winners that are not that talented. Sidorenko is one, Eysseric is another, and a third Frenchmen that won it is Clement Morel(though I think he ended up playing for Monaco)
Also you can throw Klein into this category.

Filo V.
05-18-2011, 04:36 AM
Nicolas Pereira has a hilarious history really. Won RG, W and USO as a junior in 1988. Had huge wins over top 20/10/5 players throughout his career. But his highest career ranking was 74 and he never maintained a consistent top 100 spot. I saw him play on old tapes, dude had game, sort of awkward, but he had ability. Wonder why he never put it fully together.

Filo V.
05-18-2011, 04:47 AM
I just don't think Eysseric physically developed much more after 16 or 17. Still, he's improving and there's plenty of time.

Pless was brilliant in juniors, as you said final at the USO but also final at Wimby and won the AO over Youzhny.

What's obvious is that the Australian juniors doesn't count for a ton. Plenty of the top juniors don't play it and you have some winners that are not that talented. Sidorenko is one, Eysseric is another, and a third Frenchmen that won it is Clement Morel(though I think he ended up playing for Monaco)
Also you can throw Klein into this category.
Klein, yup, won AO juniors in 2008. But he's not that talented so I'm not surprised he has struggled, and of course most know him to be volatile.

Eysseric is a scrawny guy physically for sure, guess he simply develops at a physically slower pace than other players. I've never been impressed by what he's brought to the court, however. I think he was totally overrated from the beginning.

Morel did play for Monaco. I saw him play too a few years back, and saw nothing in terms of ability.

You're right about AO and I guess ultimately, it comes down to some guys developing mentally and physically and peaking at a little bit later age and developing throughout their years, instead of peaking at 16-19 and then not developing further as players.

GugaF1
05-18-2011, 04:47 AM
I think whoever makes into the top 40/50 can't be considered a failure even if he did a lot of things at the Jr. level, because at the Juniors there are so many other factors into play, physical development mental development, is just like compairing kids teen world with the adult world in real life.

Like Tiago Fernandes a Brazilian who the Australian open last year at 16/17 I believe, people were hyping him like hell here and is silly to do so, based only on Jr. If he were to make the top 50 I think it is already ok.

njnetswill
05-18-2011, 04:49 AM
Junior GS champ Florin Mergea. Never broke top 200.

Smoke944
05-18-2011, 04:55 AM
In general, if you look at the year ending junior top-10s you will just see so many guys that didn't ever do much. And there are so many factors that it's just tough to say.
But I would say that the majority fall under two categories:

1. Guys that are physically ahead of their peers at 17-18 but don't develop further and get passed by in seniors.

2. Guys that don't have any weapons or move well/are consistent.

MayerFan
05-18-2011, 04:59 AM
Nicolas Santos never had game to be a top 400 player.

Junior level tennis is a whole another deal compared to pro level.

Caralimon
05-18-2011, 05:00 AM
Sometimes a certain generation is just plain weak. Remember that the whole top ten (or most of it) changes every year due to age limit, so top juniors players flopping isn't always that surprising.

Smoke944
05-18-2011, 05:02 AM
Sometimes a certain generation is just plain weak. Remember that the whole top ten (or most of it) changes every year due to age limit, so top juniors players flopping isn't always that surprising.

This is a good point. Guys can simply slide into the top-10 when the last year's guys leave juniors.

Ibracadabra
05-18-2011, 05:03 AM
Brian dabul

Smoke944
05-18-2011, 05:07 AM
Brian dabul

I'd say a guy like Dabul has completely lived up to his potential. He doesn't have any special talent, he is really small, and yet he has not done too badly for himself.

fast_clay
05-18-2011, 05:09 AM
Andy Roddick

Topspindoctor
05-18-2011, 06:57 AM
Nalbandian.

straitup
05-18-2011, 07:04 AM
Nicolas Santos never had game to be a top 400 player.

Junior level tennis is a whole another deal compared to pro level.

This is the key for sure. A lot of the players in juniors might have games that work well against the other juniors...but those types of games might not work in the pros or transition to the pros as easily. For instance, the small guys are usually going to struggle because they normally won't have a huge weapon (other than speed perhaps), and pros are just bigger and fully developed.

Others just don't add enough to their game or don't have the consistency.

I don't want to jump the gun because I want DY to do well, but Don is slowly falling into this same category

VIPer7
05-18-2011, 07:30 AM
Daniel Elsner won 3 Junior Grand Slams in 1996-1997, and was expected to be the next Boris Becker. With a career high ranking of #92 he didn't really live up to these expectations...
Even worse, Elsner's main adversary during that time, Wesley Whitehouse (1 Junior GS and a few more finals), didn't even make it into the top 200!

GugaF1
05-18-2011, 07:33 AM
Nicolas Mahut was another case of a great Junior wasn't, winning Wimbledon and everything? But it can not said that he has failed too. Being I believe a top 40 palyer for a amount time, It ain't bad.

Ad Wim
05-18-2011, 08:49 AM
I'm still waiting on Bhambri, where is he?! Wasn't he winning everything in juniors a few years ago?

Hewitt =Legend
05-18-2011, 08:51 AM
Kristian Pless.

Li Ching Yuen
05-18-2011, 09:23 AM
Junior GS champ Florin Mergea. Never broke top 200.

His own fault.

Got fat like a donut when he was supposed to be heading to his best years.
His only coach was his father and so on, didn't leave the country to train somewhere else and etc.
Played with Horia Tecau doubles a lot but they had to break it up as it was clear which of the two was destined to make it.

Horia Tecau is now a Wimbledon finalist and the other guy can barely play in Futures.

Super Djoker
05-18-2011, 11:01 AM
One that will fail IMO, Oliver Golding!

TennisOnWood
05-18-2011, 11:09 AM
I'm still waiting on Bhambri, where is he?! Wasn't he winning everything in juniors a few years ago?

Not a good start of the season but in 3 Futures in home country he made Title, Final and 1/4.. still far from what was expected and we can't expect some big results soon

iriraz
05-18-2011, 11:46 AM
We`ve seen lots of Spanish guys in the last few years who had lots of success but this cannot be said about Carlos Cuadrado.He won the juniors at the French Open in 2001 but his career never got going(he never got into top 200) and a hip injury made him stop playing at age 22.
At least he has a decent job now in coaching Kuznetsova

gaitare
05-18-2011, 12:12 PM
We`ve seen lots of Spanish guys in the last few years who had lots of success but this cannot be said about Carlos Cuadrado.He won the juniors at the French Open in 2001 but his career never got going(he never got into top 200) and a hip injury made him stop playing at age 22.
At least he has a decent job now in coaching Kuznetsova

Had. :) She dumped him earlier this month I think.

gaitare
05-18-2011, 12:16 PM
Do we have any young and very interesting prospect now who's pretty much skipping the juniors and plans to start the senior career rather early?

TennisOnWood
05-18-2011, 12:31 PM
Do we have any young and very interesting prospect now who's pretty much skipping the juniors and plans to start the senior career rather early?

Not really.. its hard for them to break thtrough this days

Snowwy
05-18-2011, 12:48 PM
Phil Bester had higher expectations than PP.

Chase Visa
05-18-2011, 12:54 PM
Bernard Tomic might join this list. Has got heaps of talent but is still a tool who gets propped up everywhere.

Månu
05-18-2011, 01:02 PM
Mahut won Wimbledon in juniors.

MaxPower
05-18-2011, 01:15 PM
Björn Rehnquist won the junior Australien Open in 1996 and was pretty promising. Then he injured his left wrist and never got anywhere. Hasn't been higher than 146 in singles. Now he is 33..

I think juniors unlucky enough to get a fairly serious injury often get their careers derailed

going to be interesting to see what happens with Daniel Berta who won junior french open in 2009 and got ranked nr1 junior later that year. Then got injured in 2010

Machiavelli
05-18-2011, 01:22 PM
Elsner liked his guitar more, and at a crucial age of 19-20 was already fed up with tennis, the talent and ability were amazing, he did not want it enough, never liked training and i doubt he liked tennis at all too much, they made an interview with him once he came to Zagreb to play a CH in 2006, won it from Qualifying, I was there watching it, and he was toying with everybody he played against, one of the biggest talents i ever saw playing, he hit the ball so smooth and easily, nalbandian like tennis, when he cared or wanted it he was just too good...

But he clearly stated that tennis wasn't even in his TOP10 priorities in life

Daniel Elsner won 3 Junior Grand Slams in 1996-1997, and was expected to be the next Boris Becker. With a career high ranking of #92 he didn't really live up to these expectations...
Even worse, Elsner's main adversary during that time, Wesley Whitehouse (1 Junior GS and a few more finals), didn't even make it into the top 200!

out_here_grindin
05-18-2011, 02:39 PM
It just takes some players more time than others. For a while it looked like Berankis might be on this list, but then suddenly found his game or adapted to the pros.

Eysseric looks like he may be done. Has made no progress recently. Ouanna also looks done, his peak was beating Safin one time. Eysseric's peak was challenging Murray at RG.

Action Jackson
05-18-2011, 02:43 PM
Elsner liked his guitar more, and at a crucial age of 19-20 was already fed up with tennis, the talent and ability were amazing, he did not want it enough, never liked training and i doubt he liked tennis at all too much, they made an interview with him once he came to Zagreb to play a CH in 2006, won it from Qualifying, I was there watching it, and he was toying with everybody he played against, one of the biggest talents i ever saw playing, he hit the ball so smooth and easily, nalbandian like tennis, when he cared or wanted it he was just too good...

But he clearly stated that tennis wasn't even in his TOP10 priorities in life

Loved the parties, the guy could play when he was bothered.

Andre♥
05-18-2011, 04:39 PM
I would say Monfils failed or is currently failing, considering the hype he got during his junior career, especially after his AO + RG + W wins with a total of just two sets dropped in the process. He was billed like a future GOAT after his junior career and all he got for now was being an occasional Top 10 player, a GS SF, two MS finals and three mickey mouse tournament wins. Surely not enough for the talent he was supposed to have.

Tom Paulman
05-18-2011, 04:53 PM
I thought of Lojda immediately when I saw the thread title. He's been really a failure so far. After he won a 100k challenger, which I think was in 2007, I expected him to do well, but it has stayed his biggest accomplishment to date ^_^

Xavier7
05-18-2011, 04:54 PM
Martin Lee - won the boys doubles at Wimbledon and reached World No 1 in junior rankings but never did much in seniors - briefly inside the top 100 for just a few weeks I believe.

zlaja777
05-18-2011, 05:29 PM
Gilles Müller also. Won 2001 USO and finished the year as no.1 but never got into top 50 on senior level. Although he played QF's at 2008 USO where he lost to Roger in 3 tight sets. He also beat Roddik at USO 2005, Rafa at Wim same year if I remember correctly.

Nadull_tard
05-18-2011, 05:30 PM
I suppose 95% of youngsters don't deliver at ATP level.

Nathaliia
05-18-2011, 05:34 PM
Apparently Lojda had chlamydia and didn't play at all for a long time.

Todor Enev is my fave example.

Renaud
05-18-2011, 05:43 PM
Todor Enev is my fave example.
Mine is this one:

1998 year end ranking:
1 Roger FEDERER (SUI)
2 Julien JEANPIERRE (FRA) :worship:
3 David NALBANDIAN (ARG)
4 Fernando GONZALEZ (CHI)
5 Guillermo CORIA (ARG)

Nathaliia
05-18-2011, 05:54 PM
wow, 1998 was really strong, all the top players.... and then Jeanpierre :worship:

straitup
05-18-2011, 06:21 PM
Phil Bester had higher expectations than PP.

I forgot about that guy...saw him play once when he was supposed to be promising, but nothing panned out for him

sameerph
05-18-2011, 06:55 PM
I'm still waiting on Bhambri, where is he?! Wasn't he winning everything in juniors a few years ago?

Also started well at futures level winning 5 titles in his debut year in 2009. But, had injury issues since last year & that has affected him. Looked to be getting back on track after winning a title a couple of months back but it seems is again injured again.

Still, we in India are hopeful that he will breakthrough at least in a couple of years time when he is better developed physically.

fast_clay
05-18-2011, 07:10 PM
ferrer had the best junior career of all

out_here_grindin
05-18-2011, 07:30 PM
I would say Monfils failed or is currently failing, considering the hype he got during his junior career, especially after his AO + RG + W wins with a total of just two sets dropped in the process. He was billed like a future GOAT after his junior career and all he got for now was being an occasional Top 10 player, a GS SF, two MS finals and three mickey mouse tournament wins. Surely not enough for the talent he was supposed to have.

No way. Making the top 10 and being a grand slam semifinalist is hardly "failing at the senior tour level".

The others players mentioning in this thread truly failed at the tour level, not players who didn't quite live up to their hype becuase that would be a much longer list.

yuri27
05-18-2011, 09:32 PM
Gasquet (was rated as an almost certain GS winner at the tender age of 9),Monfils,Nalbandian,Baghdatis,G.Muller,D.Young.

NoFroz
05-18-2011, 09:44 PM
Both Felder and Vilarrubi (URU) were top 10 in juniors back in 2002.

Felder has been playing futures/weak challengers for years; Vilarrubi tried at being a doubles specialist but didn't achieved much and ended up retiring in 2008.

Johnny_Bravo
05-18-2011, 09:49 PM
Oli Rochus

Renaud
05-18-2011, 10:23 PM
Gasquet (was rated as an almost certain GS winner at the tender age of 9),Monfils,Nalbandian,Baghdatis,G.Muller,D.Young.
See post above yours.

Gonzil
05-18-2011, 11:52 PM
I would say one of the biggest bombs in recent times is Devin Britton - not a top, top junior (13) but obviously fancied his chances after his early college success. On the pro tour he is just unbelievably bad.

straitup
05-18-2011, 11:57 PM
I would say one of the biggest bombs in recent times is Devin Britton - not a top, top junior (13) but obviously fancied his chances after his early college success. On the pro tour he is just unbelievably bad.

He hasn't even been around for that long...all I can remember of him so far is his match against Federer at the USO

Oli Rochus...no way. I'd say if you've heard of the guy and seen him play more than a few times, they've been successful enough. Ollie got into the top 25 and was very tough for many players. His height was a bit of a disadvantage, but as I said before, that can be an unfortunate part of how junior players who do so well struggle a little on the pro tour

Andre♥
05-19-2011, 12:03 AM
No way. Making the top 10 and being a grand slam semifinalist is hardly "failing at the senior tour level".

He was appointed to be a future multi-Grand Slam winner by every freaking "expert" when he was a junior. His hype was much bigger than Donald Young's and that is saying a lot. Considering the expectations people had for his future, he is failing for sure. He was supposed to have a bunch of Slams by now, according to a lot of tennis writers.

straitup
05-19-2011, 12:06 AM
He was appointed to be a future multi-Grand Slam winner by every freaking "expert" when he was a junior. His hype was much bigger than Donald Young's and that is saying a lot. Considering the expectations people had for his future, he is failing for sure. He was supposed to have a bunch of Slams by now, according to a lot of tennis writers.

It's too hard to predict who's going to be a multi-GS winner when they are in juniors. Maybe he's failing for some people's expectations, but no I would never say top 10 and GS SF and Paris Masters runner-up twice is a "failure"

tennisfan856
05-19-2011, 12:11 AM
kevin kim, bastard was supposed to be chang's replacement.

oranges
05-19-2011, 12:19 AM
He was appointed to be a future multi-Grand Slam winner by every freaking "expert" when he was a junior. His hype was much bigger than Donald Young's and that is saying a lot. Considering the expectations people had for his future, he is failing for sure. He was supposed to have a bunch of Slams by now, according to a lot of tennis writers.

Honestly, that says more about those experts than anything else. Just because there are idiots eager on overhype doesn't mean one's a flop for not meeting it. Just go through some of the names and results mentioned in the thread and it's abundantly clear why anyone who's been to top 30-50 doesn't belong in the thread, let alone top 10.

Filo V.
05-19-2011, 12:57 AM
Niels Desein. I remember him being the next top Belgian talent, he and Vliegen. Vliegen had his moments, dealt with tons of injuries. Desein has a career high ranking of 164 and has a 23-42 record in challengers in his career.

BK123
05-19-2011, 01:31 AM
This is pretty pointless. Most of these guys fail at senior level. But that's not too different from the 99% of people in life who don't end up the boss of the company.

Everyone was smart in kindergaten, then in primary school, secondary school, college, university etc there are thousands of people who graduate etc how many do actually succeed to their potential?

This goes for everything anyway. There are thousands of actors but how many make it? Most people are just another face in the crowd.

oranges
05-19-2011, 01:35 AM
This is pretty pointless. Most of these guys fail at senior level. But that's not too different from the 99% of people in life who don't end up the boss of the company.

Everyone was smart in kindergaten, then in primary school, secondary school, college, university etc there are thousands of people who graduate etc how many do actually succeed to their potential?

This goes for everything anyway. There are thousands of actors but how many make it? Most people are just another face in the crowd.

Not really, there are not many valedictorians who do not manage to get a university degree, which is a comparable example. Your analogy works only for those who proposed Monfils and the like.

MayerFan
05-19-2011, 02:08 AM
Gilles Müller also. Won 2001 USO and finished the year as no.1 but never got into top 50 on senior level. Although he played QF's at 2008 USO where he lost to Roger in 3 tight sets. He also beat Roddik at USO 2005, Rafa at Wim same year if I remember correctly.

Muller is one of the guys most affected by the development of strings and slowing of courts.

abraxas21
05-19-2011, 06:00 AM
Brian dabul

too short

abraxas21
05-19-2011, 06:20 AM
Oli Rochus

too short

Chase Visa
05-19-2011, 06:29 AM
too short

Yeah, Oli did pretty well despite being a midget even by women's standards, imo.

Li Ching Yuen
05-19-2011, 08:45 AM
ferrer had the best junior career of all

Instead of fucking around like most juniors do these days, he worked as a construction worker in those times.

No wonder he scrapes wins over mugs these days left and right. Guy did the right thing when he was young.

sheva07
05-19-2011, 10:53 AM
Last year I saw a very interesting documentary about Paul Dogger. He was a huge talent from Holland, considered better than Krajicek at early age. He played an exhibition against Lendl when he was like 14 years old, he played great and almost won. He also won a challenger but in the end he only played seven matches on the main tour. He started to drink and use drugs. Ironically when Krajicek won Wimbledon, Dogger watched in the pub with a few pints. Big contrast.

TennisOnWood
05-19-2011, 10:59 AM
Last year I saw a very interesting documentary about Paul Dogger. He was a huge talent from Holland, considered better than Krajicek at early age. He played an exhibition against Lendl when he was like 14 years old, he played great and almost won. He also won a challenger but in the end he only played seven matches on the main tour. He started to drink and use drugs. Ironically when Krajicek won Wimbledon, Dogger watched in the pub with a few pints. Big contrast.

This is interesting, thanks

interruptus25
05-19-2011, 11:30 AM
Another prime example: Matteo Trevisan, he was ranked No. 1 at Junior level.
Today he is still struggling at the chaalenger/futures level.

nevenez
05-19-2011, 01:10 PM
Trevisan
Klizan

Snowwy
05-19-2011, 01:40 PM
Trevisan
Klizan

Almost too early with these guys still.

LEO_Legionario
05-19-2011, 01:53 PM
Federico Browne

SeagullUK
05-19-2011, 03:29 PM
One that will fail IMO, Oliver Golding!

Your user name pretty much sums you up with comments like that

SeagullUK
05-19-2011, 03:33 PM
Martin Lee - won the boys doubles at Wimbledon and reached World No 1 in junior rankings but never did much in seniors - briefly inside the top 100 for just a few weeks I believe.

Only got to 3 in Juniors - plauged by injuries.

His dad coaches my son :D

Champion number 1
05-19-2011, 04:42 PM
Trevisan and Fabbiano have disappointed for sure, but they still have a bit of time on their side (a couple years I'd say to break top 100)

Marc23
05-19-2011, 04:48 PM
Tipsarevic won junior AO ten years ago and still has zero titles.

He was also junior number 1 battling with Baghdatis...both of them suck today!

philosophicalarf
05-19-2011, 05:01 PM
Last year I saw a very interesting documentary about Paul Dogger. He was a huge talent from Holland, considered better than Krajicek at early age.

More importantly, he had the best tennis name in the history of the sport.

Kolya
05-19-2011, 05:06 PM
Davydenko on the other hand, his highest junior ranking was 510.

straitup
05-19-2011, 05:30 PM
He was also junior number 1 battling with Baghdatis...both of them suck today!

Janko has underachieved a little considering some of his upsets the last few years, but definitely didn't fail. And nor did Baggy, a guy who has made a slam F and SF and was in the top 10

The Hooded Claw
05-19-2011, 05:52 PM
Todor Enev is my fave example.

Enev was also the first player I thought of when I saw this thread. I don't think he even played an ATP level match despite being a top 5 junior (although I could be wrong and I cba checking).

Roman Valent also won Wimbledon juniors in the early 2000's and I don't think ever reached the top 300.

Filo V.
05-19-2011, 07:46 PM
Valent, that dude was/is brittle as heck. But a really entertaining player to watch when he was healthy.

nadejda
05-19-2011, 07:57 PM
Enev was also the first player I thought of when I saw this thread. I don't think he even played an ATP level match despite being a top 5 junior (although I could be wrong and I cba checking).


Todor Enev plays a couple of futures per year in the region as well as Davis Cup matches. He is 779 ranked (age 29)in ATP curently and with career high 252.

ibreak4coffee
05-19-2011, 08:07 PM
When I lived in France I remember Arnaud Di Paquale getting hype and winning the US Open juniors in 1997. Then that medal in the 2000 Olympics beating Federer along the way - but really no sustained success or titles at the ATP level.

I always thought Leander Paes should have been a much better singles player than he turned out to be - number one junior, US Open and Wimbledon titles etc... and you can still see his skills in doubles 20 years later

Klizan has done nothing to back up that 2006 French Open Boys title either... and Polansky is heading quickly to bust territory.

oranges
05-19-2011, 08:38 PM
More importantly, he had the best tennis name in the history of the sport.

IDK, there's Boluda ;)

fast_clay
05-19-2011, 08:47 PM
ferrer had the best junior career of all

Instead of fucking around like most juniors do these days, he worked as a construction worker in those times.

No wonder he scrapes wins over mugs these days left and right. Guy did the right thing when he was young.

:yeah: yep... less pissfarting around.. cos sure as shit you're not gonna be a junior forever...

packhorse ferrer removed meaningless shit from the pro equation...

i would go as far to say that junior success is more of a hindrance... what a fantastic way to develop a false ego...

Getta
05-19-2011, 09:14 PM
i would go as far to say that junior success is more of a hindrance... what a fantastic way to develop a false ego...

a few months ago, Steve took it upon himself to do a little research (http://atoughcrowd.blogspot.com/2010/09/can-jack-sock-it-to-pros.html) to find out if it's true.

shuhrat
05-19-2011, 09:37 PM
Davydenko on the other hand, his highest junior ranking was 510.
I was wondering about the opposite cases. Someone that didn't have any stellar junior career, but made a big step on the tour.

ibreak4coffee
05-19-2011, 09:38 PM
I was wondering about the opposite cases. Someone that didn't have any stellar junior career, but made a big step on the tour.

Milos Raonic was nothing to write home about in juniors either

shuhrat
05-19-2011, 09:39 PM
Milos Raonic was nothing to write home about in juniors either
Yeah, he was the first player that crossed my mind. :)

Nathaliia
05-19-2011, 09:51 PM
Enev was also the first player I thought of when I saw this thread. I don't think he even played an ATP level match despite being a top 5 junior (although I could be wrong and I cba checking).

Roman Valent also won Wimbledon juniors in the early 2000's and I don't think ever reached the top 300.
He was #2 after Andy Roddick :tape:

Another huge letdown I can think of, Federico Browne from Argentina. I think he was #1 in 1994. But the guys he was beating (Rios, Kuerten) made the #1 among seniors ;) ;)

fast_clay
05-19-2011, 10:31 PM
Mark Kratzmann

won jnr wimbledon, jnr australian... lost to becker in final of junior roland garros before gaining revenge against becker in the final of the jnr US open... so nearly repeated edberg's junior slam...

the next year the wunderkind becker won wimbledon for the first time... at 17yrs...

for kratzmann... he peaked in singles at #50 in 1990, spending just over a year in the top 100..

became a very accomplished doubles player however, reaching #5 while partnering darren chaill to reach the final of the aussie open dubs, and did play davis cup, clinching a tie winning davis cup rubber w/ cahill 15 games to 13 in the fifth set vs argentina (frana & miniussi) in 1990... so some joy at least...

and... with that davis cup cap, he became a duel international in two different sports when he represented hong kong for three cricket ODI's early last decade...

MayerFan
05-20-2011, 02:12 AM
Vladimir Voltchkov as well. A great junior, reached a surprising Wimbledon SF and then disappeared completely after winning a few top DC matches.

Action Jackson
05-20-2011, 02:44 AM
When I lived in France I remember Arnaud Di Paquale getting hype and winning the US Open juniors in 1997. Then that medal in the 2000 Olympics beating Federer along the way - but really no sustained success or titles at the ATP level.

Di Pasquale had lots of injuries.

Action Jackson
05-20-2011, 02:45 AM
I was wondering about the opposite cases. Someone that didn't have any stellar junior career, but made a big step on the tour.

Gaston Gaudio.

fast_clay
05-20-2011, 02:45 AM
pat rafter - used to get beat up at state level in queensland, let alone national level... didnt grow till late, but, his mentors persisted with the serve and volley / full court press approach despite it costing him success at junior level...

Roadmap
05-20-2011, 04:09 AM
Federer

kobulingam
05-20-2011, 05:44 AM
Main reason is this......

Juniors are at physical peaks 0 to 2 or 3 years tops.

Seniors are at physical peaks (or near it) for possibly 20 years.


So people like Federer stay on senior tour for many many many years. So they stick around. So have MANY generations of junior level superstars in the senior tour. Get it?

straitup
05-20-2011, 05:44 AM
pat rafter - used to get beat up at state level in queensland, let alone national level... didnt grow till late, but, his mentors persisted with the serve and volley / full court press approach despite it costing him success at junior level...

To some extent Pete Sampras was the same way...struggled in juniors as his coaches switched him to a 1-handed BH. He didn't have quite the illustrious junior career although he was still a very very good American prospect

Nathaliia
05-20-2011, 05:53 AM
Rafa didn't play in juniors but he took part at Wimbledon and lost to Everko's finest Lamine Ouahab of all people... Probably still better than Tsonga who lost to some dude named Michael Koning. Berdych lost to Michael Ryderstedt.

Chase Visa
05-20-2011, 08:32 AM
Rafa didn't play in juniors but he took part at Wimbledon and lost to Everko's finest Lamine Ouahab of all people... Probably still better than Tsonga who lost to some dude named Michael Koning. Berdych lost to Michael Ryderstedt.

Well at least Ouahab played in slams and the Olympics! :p