...

..

As always, thanks for all this, and good luck making sense of it all :)

Happy New Year to you, Judio! The season is not the same without your thread! :yeah:

Good luck Judio! :D

Good luck, you might just need it :p

Thanks!!

Good luck, Judio. You're great! :worship: :worship:

Welcome back Judio ! Keep up the good work :yeah:

Thank You!
Have a happy New Year!

:D Awesome dude, and I wish u the best with this :)

Good luck :bowdown:

Good luck.. hope it will be easy to follow ATP rules

Good luck.. hope it will be easy to follow ATP rules

Judio finds it easier than the ATP does :lol:

thanks for all your hard work.

You´re great! :-)

Thanks again as always Judio, you do a great job.

A thousand thanks as always Judio!

Even if I don't post here much, I want to throw in another thank you! You know how much this is appreciated by our whining when you're gone for a bit. Great work!

Even if I don't post here much, I want to throw in another thank you! You know how much this is appreciated by our whining when you're gone for a bit. Great work!
This. Thanks for your great work, Judio.

Kolya needs a few more wins to get 17-24 seed spot for AO

Happy New year and welcome back, Judio :wavey:

Thank you for your hard work :worship: GL.

When will ATP provide the Jan 3rd ranking? They still have the one as of Monday 12/27, 2010.

I think they have just forgotten to change the date - there will be no change in the rankings as there were no tournaments last week.

Thanks a lot Judio for your excellent work - also from tennis folk here in Finland. Whole globe is following your predicted rankings!

Thanks Judio! Feels like the season has begun when you return!!!

Thanks Judio as always :worship:

Thanks Judio! Feels like the season has begun when you return!!!

True :lol:

Judio the labour of love continues and high quality work as always.

Happy new year Judio. I look forward to keep a keen eye on the rankings update thanks to you

Goffin in top 100 in 2011 . ;)

shouldnt davy be up to about 24 now that he's gotten to the semi final in doha?

Thanks for your devotion to this, Judio. It's very much appreciated. :)

federer now has 3 0-penalties in his 500er ranking breakdown, the first one which will drop would be hamburg (25.07).
what will happen if roger plays dubai and monte carlo. will the points be counted for the ranking at the moment of apearance or later when there is space for? As I know it's a special thing with MC which is a master, but can be counted as a 500er.

Happy New Year to you Judio :) and thanks as always for your great work…..we would be lost without you.

The rules state that a Penalty stays on your Ranking for 12 months so when he plays Dubai he will not be able to gain any points
in February.

But he can count them in July after Hamburg

On a seperate note

Come on Robin only one more win needed ;)

Would be funny if he wins Dubai and after Wimbledon only less than 500 points away from Nadal. He would overtake him then without playing anything that week :D

silly rule! so if he would win both, dubai and MC e.g., then he has 1500 pts in his ranking which he can't use.
so in 2010 it would have been better for him joining in ill condition the tournament of dubai und give a w.o. in the first round. same in rotterdam, so that he could use free slots early in this year. the tokyo-penalty was unavoidable because he decided to play the stockholms 250er instead of tokyo.

hopefully he's not missing no 1 because of that

thanks, Judio.

And now he has won today, Federer cannot gain a single point in an ATP 250 event until after 25 October 2011 !!!!

MM King :worship:

And now he has won today, Federer cannot gain a single point in an ATP 250 event until after 25 October 2011 !!!!
Hopefull he plays a few 500 tournaments then instead to get some more points.

Soderling moves to #4

Hopefull he plays a few 500 tournaments then instead to get some more points.
He is only planning to play Dubai and Basel. Won't be surprise if he pulls out of Dubai

Soderling #4 :banana:

At least now he'll get Federer in the semis instead of the quarters. :rolleyes:

And now he has won today, Federer cannot gain a single point in an ATP 250 event until after 25 October 2011 !!!!

I think he can. He is allowed to count 2 of his best results from 250-point tournaments. So he has last year's Stockholm win and Halle finals. He can put Halle finals (150 points) into "non-countable" and count Doha win -- net gain is 100 points.

^^ I think Judio meant now that he's counting Doha and Stockholm, until Stockholm drops he won't be gaining points if say he wins Halle.

Judio,
Thanks for all your work, I always refer to your stats every day, and it is well appreciated.
Happy New Tennis Year.

New Old This Project Low
Rank Rank Player Week Points Opt
1 1 Nadal 0 12390 90
2 2 Federer 0 9245 250
3 3 Djokovic 0 6240 20
4 4 Soderling 0 5785 150
5 5 Murray 0 5760 20
6 6 Berdych 0 3955 90
7 7 Ferrer 90 3735 90 A
8 8 Roddick 0 3565 150
9 9 Verdasco 0 3240 150
10 10 Youzhny 0 2920 150
11 11 Melzer 0 2785 90
12 12 Monfils 0 2560 150
13 13 Tsonga 0 2345 90
14 14 Almagro 90 2160 90 A
15 15 Cilic 0 2140 150
16 17 Ljubicic 0 1965 90
17 16 Fish 0 1921 15
18 18 Querrey 0 1860 250
19 19 Wawrinka 0 1855 250
20 20 Isner 45 1645 45
21 21 Baghdatis 0 1580 45
22 24 Gulbis 90 1575 45 S
23 22 Llodra 0 1575 45
24 23 Davydenko 0 1555 45
25 27 Nalbandian 90 1550 45 A

Is Nalbandian today at 21?

Nalbaldian reached the final in Auckland, if Gulbis loses his semi in Sydney, then David will be 21.

terrible news for tennis.

Nalbaldian reached the final in Auckland, if Gulbis loses his semi in Sydney, then David will be 21.

David takes 21 :):):)

Important tournament for the Nr. 1 position. If Roger goes out early and Nadal far, it will be nearly impossible for Federer to regain that Nr.1 ranking anytime soon. However, if Nadal goes out early and Roger defends his title, suddenly he has a great chance in the coming months...

Nr.2 is also in play, depending on the results...

Important tournament for the Nr. 1 position. If Roger goes out early and Nadal far, it will be nearly impossible for Federer to regain that Nr.1 ranking anytime soon. However, if Nadal goes out early and Roger defends his title, suddenly he has a great chance in the coming months...

Nr.2 is also in play, depending on the results...

Well rafa has only 360 points to defend so even if he loses in the first round it won't be a hell lot of points lost, contrary to fed who has to win 2000 points!! I presume Even if he defends and nadal goes out in the first round, then their gap will narrow down only 360 pts, Nadal then would be 12030 to fed's 9245... So it's not like fed's chances of regaining #1 position are going to increase dramatically in any way!

According to judio's post There also would be a big chance of rafa doubling up the gap w/Fed Given their draw and points to defend!

Thanks!

Dimitrov at 92. The future has arrived!

Important tournament for the Nr. 1 position. If Roger goes out early and Nadal far, it will be nearly impossible for Federer to regain that Nr.1 ranking anytime soon. However, if Nadal goes out early and Roger defends his title, suddenly he has a great chance in the coming months...

Nr.2 is also in play, depending on the results...

Yes, if Feds wins he will have his chance during the summer

2011 ATP Rulebook is now reflecting points changes that were implemented in 2010 e.g. 16 points for last round loss in GS qualies.

But... there's a change for 2011 - 70 points for 125K (=100K+H) challenger final. Not in ATP rulebook as expected :rolleyes:

2010 Santiago-2 Runner-up points (http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tennis/Players/Top-Players/Paul-Capdeville.aspx?t=rb)
2011 Sao Paulo Runner-up points (http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tennis/Players/Ca/R/Rafael-Camilo.aspx?t=rb)

May I ask why Simon's base point this week is 1120? He has 1210 after Sydney, and should still be allowed to count 3 ATP250s, right?

Gil maybe top 80 again, after AO:worship:

If I'm correct, with this win against Cuevas, Gil is most certainly directly in Indian Wells and Miami, so he will play this two mandatory tournaments. I'm not sure if this is good news, since this means that he will only be able to play some challengers to obtain some needed points in the end of March. And by then, Estoril (150 points to defend) will be just around the corner... (repeated in Gil's support thread)

May I ask why Simon's base point this week is 1120? He has 1210 after Sydney, and should still be allowed to count 3 ATP250s, right?

You are right. Simon should have 1210 points before the start of the AO.
He has now 1255 points after he won his 1st round match.

If I'm correct, with this win against Cuevas, Gil is most certainly directly in Indian Wells and Miami, so he will play this two mandatory tournaments. I'm not sure if this is good news, since this means that he will only be able to play some challengers to obtain some needed points in the end of March. And by then, Estoril (150 points to defend) will be just around the corner... (repeated in Gil's support thread)

Not guarranttee for Indian Wells because the ranking will only be officially updated on Jan 31st. Indian Wells will use the ranking of Jan 24th but really it is Jan 17th

Not guarranttee for Indian Wells because the ranking will only be officially updated on Jan 31st. Indian Wells will use the ranking of Jan 24th but really it is Jan 17th

Yes, I guess you're correct. I miss-calculated (5 instead of 6 weeks) the acceptance list deadline. In that case, if afterwards he gets directly in Miami, it is impossible to guess what will he do the two weeks after playing DC for Portugal (on clay)...

bye bye Tsonga, ahah

Kolya :(

He will be out of Top 25 after exactly 6 years.. 31th January 2005 - 31th January 2011

He will be out of Top 25 after exactly 6 years.. 31th January 2005 - 31th January 2011

:yeah:

Kavko :yeah:

career high after AO '11

Top100 debut for Dimitrov and Sweeting after this AO :yeah:

Kolya will be back
got nothing to defend after indoor Rotterdam until August.

Judio.. do you have any idea when will this idiots from ATP put results from last week Futures.. some young players made good job and waiting for best career ranking from this Monday :mad:

That's just charming

Thanks any way

Next week will Dimitrov be the only player born in the 1990s in the top 100, or will Berankis be in there as well?

Berankis will be there as well. Dimitrov will be the only teenager. He turns 20 in May

Does anybody know why Kohli still counts as a commimant Player?

He is only able to count 2 ATP250

It looks like you have Seppi as eliminated, but he plays tsonga today, no?

Next week will Dimitrov be the only player born in the 1990s in the top 100, or will Berankis be in there as well?

Maybe Raonic too.

with tonights win I thnk Raonic has 531 points..which would put him into the 100th spot?

with tonights win I thnk Raonic has 531 points..which would put him into the 100th spot?

http://tennislive.free.fr/ seem to think he would have 556 points and be ranked at least #93. Would you mind double-checking your calculations?

Next week will Dimitrov be the only player born in the 1990s in the top 100, or will Berankis be in there as well?

Berankis, Dimitrov and Raonic should all be there, but Dimitrov will be the only teenager.

with tonights win I thnk Raonic has 531 points..which would put him into the 100th spot?

http://tennislive.free.fr/ seem to think he would have 556 points and be ranked at least #93. Would you mind double-checking your calculations?
Qualifiers get 25 points by making the main draw, on top of their main draw points.

ah, thanks for the additional info.

Melzer is now in the top 10 for the first time

Does El Burro or anyone else plan to start a 'Race' thread this year as well?

cilic still top20 :worship: thank god
zagreb will be critical for him

So Fed holds onto #2 for a while longer even if he loses in the QF and Djoko wins it all?

So Fed holds onto #2 for a while longer even if he loses in the QF and Djoko wins it all?

If Fed loses in QF, Djoko or even Sod can reach the #2 spot if they win the tournament.

Ok, I started watching tennis only recently (half a year ago or so), and I still dont understand one thing. If for example Roger won the AO last year, and wins it again this year, he will gain 0 points from it? How does this rule work? When someone defends his title it mean that they are only losing points and not gaining any, right?

No, he would gain 2000 points, it is just that the points from last year come off because points only last one year.

Basically, the ranking is determined by the points you've won in the last year. After a year those points are removed.

So Federer won the 2010 Australian Open, but those points will be replaced by whatever he does in the 2011 Australian Open. If he wins again he'll keep the same amount of points as he had going into the tournament, if he doesn't do as well he'll have less points.

Ok, so if we say for example that if federer loses in the final to someone else, then he will only lose 800 points and not the whole 2000, right?

Well yes, but it is important to remember that all of the 2000 from AO2010 are gone. It would be the 1200 from AO2011 that are used to calcualte the points.

Yep.

Well yes, but it is important to remember that all of the 2000 from AO2010 are gone. It would be the 1200 from AO2011 that are used to calcualte the points.

This.

Satasonic, this is why when tournaments start, Judio just takes all of the points from the previous year off of everyone, and updates them round by round with the new points, because unless the schedule changes, tournaments will usually come off from the previous year and go on for the new year in the same week.

cilic still top20 :worship: thank god
zagreb will be critical for him

Not if Dologopolov beats Murray (heaven forbid)!!

Ferrer going to be at least number 6 next week!

Good job Judio, thanks. Will their be an ATP race thread this year as well?

Ferrer could pass Murray if he beats him in SF, however thats very unlikely.

Ferrer could pass Murray if he beats him in SF, however thats very unlikely.

He would have to win the tournament.

oh ya. I mis-calculated.

wow nole

Federer has now changed playing from a more defensive position....creativity

Now that fed's gone out, Does novak have to win the whole thing in order to get to #2 rank or isn't even the title sufficient?

Now that fed's gone out, Does novak have to win the whole thing in order to get to #2 rank or isn't even the title sufficient?

not enough i think if my calculations are right... federer has 7965 points... djokovic will get 7880 if he wins the title...


regards,
wacky

If he wins he'll still be 85 points short :(

:)
how much does fed drop from last year now???

good for rafa this result despite everything:wavey:

:)
how much does fed drop from last year now???

good for rafa this result despite everything:wavey:

2000 - 720... that's 1280... nadal gain and lost nothing... so the gap between #1 and #2 increased by 1280... yes good for rafa indeed... i'm sure rafa will storm back again during clay season and wipe up most of the titles but not all -- i predict he won't replicate the clay slam last yr... but he'll probably just take french and get runner-up in 1 or 2 of the others...


regards,
wacky

2000 - 720... that's 1280... nadal gain and lost nothing... so the gap between #1 and #2 increased by 1280... yes good for rafa indeed... i'm sure rafa will storm back again during clay season and wipe up most of the titles but not all -- i predict he won't replicate the clay slam last yr... but he'll probably just take french and get runner-up in 1 or 2 of the others...


regards,
wacky

1280 great reasons to be happy rafa keep it up heal your wounds
and you will be back. Yes on clay Rafa is very dominant.

:p

Fed had a terrible season between AO & Wimby basically last season so he could potentially gain a fair amount of points..He went out early at Miami and IW where he should be able to make it deeper theoretically.

If he wins he'll still be 85 points short :(

It's not bad at all, I think for Djokovic matters the ranking before French open. He has enough time to get to n2.

Rafa's N1 is safe until 9th of May if Rogie doesn't play again Monte Carlo. That's about 14 more weeks at the top at least.

Rafa's N1 is safe until 9th of May if Rogie doesn't play again Monte Carlo. That's about 14 more weeks at the top at least.

of 2012?

Rafa's N1 is probably safe at least untill after USO..I think the only way Fed gets back the #1 is if he can win Wimby & USO and/or Rafa misses extended time with his recent injury.

Rafa's N1 is probably safe at least untill after USO..I think the only way Fed gets back the #1 is if he can win Wimby & USO and/or Rafa misses extended time with his recent injury.

No way, it has been diagnosed that he will be fine in 2 weeks. He will be perfect to play IW.

fed can return No. 1 after Madrid i think

of 2012?

2011.

Rafa's N1 is probably safe at least untill after USO..I think the only way Fed gets back the #1 is if he can win Wimby & USO and/or Rafa misses extended time with his recent injury.

When we do such calculations we always assume the leading player (Rafa) will not play any tournaments and the other player (Federer) wins all until certain date. So theoretically there could be new number 1 on 9th of May 2011. Of course normally this date will move further in time after each tennis week. Probably Rafa is practically safe until after USO... That's just speculations.

No way, it has been diagnosed that he will be fine in 2 weeks. He will be perfect to play IW.

Care to provide any reliable source?

fed can return No. 1 after Madrid i think

Theoretically true.

If Murray wins the Australian Open, will he overtake Soderling for fourth spot?

2011.

Care to provide any reliable source?

Minor muscle tear from scan result for Rafa:
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/australian-open-2011/rafael-nadal-flies-home-for-scans-on-injured-hamstring/story-fn77kxzt-1225995719044

If Murray wins the Australian Open, will he overtake Soderling for fourth spot?

Yes, he is only 195 points short now he is in the Final. Extra 800 points for winning.

Where is Del Potro now?

Where is Del Potro now?

After losing this 180 points.. almost nowhere

After losing this 180 points.. almost nowhere

:sobbing: he is not even in top 300.
Is there a rule for GS champion that they can request MD WC for unlimited times in tournaments? (There is one in WTA I reckon, but i am not sure if there's something like that on ATP as well)

With 540 points Fernando Gonzalez survived to stay in Top 100 after Australian Open

In that way he managed to stay in that group for 9 years :worship: 28th January 2002 - 31th January 2011 :worship:

:sobbing: he is not even in top 300.
Is there a rule for GS champion that they can request MD WC for unlimited times in tournaments? (There is one in WTA I reckon, but i am not sure if there's something like that on ATP as well)

Yes, there is a special rule in the ATP rulebook applicable for DelPo (injured for more than 6 months) called "protected ranking".

He will be able to enter tournaments using the average rank he had during his first 3 months of injury (rank #5 I think).

He will be able to use his protected ranking for a period of 9 months.

His protected rank is high (#5), but will not permit him to be seeded in the tournaments he will join.

More info in the ATP rulebook, see section F:
http://www.atpworldtour.com/~/media/3968641831524F80B9983093AC893BFE.ashx

After losing this 180 points.. almost nowhere

He has exactly 65 points:
20 pts for reaching the 2nd round in Sydney...
45 pts for reaching the 2nd round in the AO...

He will be ranked near the #500 position next Monday !

I was about to ask why DelPo isn't using protected ranking, didn't know he can't be seeded that way. Thanks.

I was about to ask why DelPo isn't using protected ranking, didn't know he can't be seeded that way. Thanks.
He used his first one for AO, he has #8 left

With 540 points Fernando Gonzalez survived to stay in Top 100 after Australian Open

In that way he managed to stay in that group for 9 years :worship: 28th January 2002 - 31th January 2011 :worship:

Impressive, but next week he'll fall out of the top 100, he'll lose 90 pts from Santiago's SF.

Impressive, but next week he'll fall out of the top 100, he'll lose 90 pts from Santiago's SF.

Yeah, no doubt.. but I really wanted to stay until the end of AO

Hi everybody,:)

I wonder whether you could help me regarding the ATP 500 tournaments.

In my view, 4 are compulsory, except that regarding Djokovic, only 3 are countable (DC, Dubai and Beijing)The 2 others, Basel and Rotterdam are non countable

How come ?

Thanks a lot

Del Potro will paly challengers and futures. Atrocious.

No, he still can use his protected ranking (8 tournament not counting WC) until June.

Another question though

Federer, regarding the 500 tournaments has got 3 zeros

04.10.2010 Tokyo - 0 10.10.2011
01.08.2010 Washington - 0 08.08.2011
19.07.2010 Hamburg - 0 25.07.2011

Can he play any 500 this year to get rid of those 3 ones ?

Sorry, but thank you so much.

Looking at Djokovic's Davis cup points. He has 505 pts (430 pts for the 7 live matches and 75 bonus points). Do we know when the 75 will drop ? Do they stay for 12 months ? Do they drop as soon as Nole don't have 7 wins ?

And guess what, there was an event in Germany last week which was 125K (=100K+H)

And Brands has been given 65 and not 70 for reaching the Final !!!

2011 Helibronn Runner-up points (http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tennis/Players/Br/D/Daniel-Brands.aspx?t=rb)

Another ATP error ??

But which is right 65 or 70

Helibronn was 85000+H and count like 125,000

Rafael Camilo made final in Sao Paolo from Qualis so he got another 5 points, to be on 70 http://www.atpworldtour.com/posting/2011/746/mds.pdf

now djokovic stays 85 pts behind federer.
he has 360 pkts of MC in the breakdown and 300 from rotterdam in the non-countable tournaments.
my question: if djokovic wins rotterdam, would he overtake federer because of replacing the points of MC 2010 (360) with the one of rotterdam(500), or will MC still stay there?
i know there is no must to play MC, because it is treaded like a 500-event.
but is there a special rule that MC if it's been played would still stay there like an other masters or will it be thrown away like a small 500-event?

now djokovic stays 85 pts behind federer.
he has 360 pkts of MC in the breakdown and 300 from rotterdam in the non-countable tournaments.
my question: if djokovic wins rotterdam, would he overtake federer because of replacing the points of MC 2010 (360) with the one of rotterdam(500), or will MC still stay there?
i know there is no must to play MC, because it is treaded like a 500-event.
but is there a special rule that MC if it's been played would still stay there like an other masters or will it be thrown away like a small 500-event?

Yes. No MC won't stay there

Milos nr. 94:yeah: First time inside of the top 100!

Sorry for the confusion... didn't notice he was qualifier.

If Djokovic withdraws from Rotterdam, as I think he would, what is the rankings impact?

a) He gets a 0 for Rotterdam which will count instead of DC points resulting in loss of 505 points

b) He gets a 0 for Rotterdam and since DC cannot replace a 0 pointer, Basel points will be counted instead of DC, resulting in a net loss of 205 points

c) No impact on his ranking points.

Thoughts? I am guessing option b).

Milos nr. 94:yeah: First time inside of the top 100!

He is now virtually #81 after qualifying & winning first round in Jo'burg...
Impressive start of the 2011 season, and he's barely 20 !

If you get a 0 then you can only count 3 ATP 500s so he will lose 360 points

So his best bet is to show up and do the Promotion on site

Or pretended to be injured

So Roger will stay Nr.1 untill Indian Wells at least

So Roger will stay Nr.1 untill Indian Wells at least

Nr 2 you mean ??? Djokovic hasn't withdrawn yet from Totterdam

Nr 2 you mean ??? Djokovic hasn't withdrawn yet from Totterdam

Yes I mean 2, sry

I mean even if Djokovic plays Rotterdam and wins the title there because the 500 points from Rotterdam won't replace anything as he has 505 (DC), 500 (Bejing), 500 (Dubai)

And when he plays Dubai, the best he can go is defending his points there.
So Djokovic's points won't get more than 7880 by Indian Wells
And also Roger's points won't get more than 7965 by Indian Wells

If Djokovic wins 500 points in Rotterdam, they will replace the 360 from Monte Carlo.

Yes I mean 2, sry

I mean even if Djokovic plays Rotterdam and wins the title there because the 500 points from Rotterdam won't replace anything as he has 505 (DC), 500 (Bejing), 500 (Dubai)

And when he plays Dubai, the best he can go is defending his points there.
So Djokovic's points won't get more than 7880 by Indian Wells
And also Roger's points won't get more than 7965 by Indian Wells


You mean won´t get less than 7965?

yes that's right
Thanks alot

For Djokovic to reach number 2 before Indian Wells, if I make no mistake, he must :
- first win Rotterdam to become number 2
- then win Dubai and one rubber in Davis Cup to defend it.

More likely he can aim at getting it in Indian Wells/ Miami where he has 35 less points than Federer to "defend".

He has already been given WCS to Memphis and Delray Beach

And he has used protected Rank to get into

San Jose and Indian Wells

Should be enough to get a decent ranking soon....

Del Potro's problem is that he was given zero-pointers for Hamburg, Washington and Valencia then until july (Hamburg's points going out), he will only be able to count one result in an ATP500 tournament (or Monte-Carlo) and two results in ATP250 tournaments

... unless he chooses not to take part in one Masters 1000 tournament (Monte-Carlo excluded).

For Indian Wells now we know that he chose to use his protected ranking then to take part.

Maybe he will choose not to take part in Roma (or maybe Madrid) to be able to replace that result with one more result in an ATP250 tournament, which are maybe easier for him, especially as he has problems with his movement then he may have difficulties on clay this year, comparing to hard courts.

For Djokovic to reach number 2 before Indian Wells, if I make no mistake, he must :
- first win Rotterdam to become number 2
- then win Dubai and one rubber in Davis Cup to defend it.

More likely he can aim at getting it in Indian Wells/ Miami where he has 35 less points than Federer to "defend".



Del Potro's problem is that he was given zero-pointers for Hamburg, Washington and Valencia then until july (Hamburg's points going out), he will only be able to count one result in an ATP500 tournament (or Monte-Carlo) and two results in ATP250 tournaments

... unless he chooses not to take part in one Masters 1000 tournament (Monte-Carlo excluded).

F[B]or Indian Wells now we know that he chose to use his protected ranking then to take part.

Maybe he will choose not to take part in Roma (or maybe Madrid) to be able to replace that result with one more result in an ATP250 tournament, which are maybe easier for him, especially as he has problems with his movement then he may have difficulties on clay this year, comparing to hard courts.

Djokovic isn't playing the first round of Davis Cup.

"Meanwhile, Djokovic will sit out defending Davis Cup champ Serbia's first-round tie against India. "There is no need to have a player like him on the team," Zivojinovic said. "We can do without him against India. I have no doubt this has nothing to do with Djokovic snubbing me and refusing to play for the Davis Cup team.”

Well, the Davis Cup will be in Novi Sad, Serbia (birthplace of Monica Seles), so India should pose no huge threat to the likes of Viktor Troicki or Janko Tipsarevic. But it's also not likely to generate revenue the way a tie would if Djokovic were involved. Maybe that NTC will have to wait."http://blogs.tennis.com/tennisworld/2011/02/a-gruel-fate.html


As of Del Potro, I think it will depends how he does next three weeks. Does well will play Master , not well will probably think about it.

Djokovic isn't playing the first round of Davis Cup.

"Meanwhile, Djokovic will sit out defending Davis Cup champ Serbia's first-round tie against India. "There is no need to have a player like him on the team," Zivojinovic said. "We can do without him against India. I have no doubt this has nothing to do with Djokovic snubbing me and refusing to play for the Davis Cup team.”

Well, the Davis Cup will be in Novi Sad, Serbia (birthplace of Monica Seles), so India should pose no huge threat to the likes of Viktor Troicki or Janko Tipsarevic. But it's also not likely to generate revenue the way a tie would if Djokovic were involved. Maybe that NTC will have to wait."http://blogs.tennis.com/tennisworld/2011/02/a-gruel-fate.html


Thank you then Federer will be seeded 2 and Djokovic 3 in Indian Wells (except injury) whatever the results this month ... and the best in Indian Wells and Miami will get number 2.

As for Murray, he has a very good shot at getting number 4 seed as Söderling will lose the points from his last year win in Rotterdam.

Thank you then Federer will be seeded 2 and Djokovic 3 in Indian Wells (except injury) whatever the results this month ... and the best in Indian Wells and Miami will get number 2.

As for Murray, he has a very good shot at getting number 4 seed as Söderling will lose the points from his last year win in Rotterdam.

Federer #2 seed in Miami too. There is no ranking update between IW and Miami

Federer #2 seed in Miami too. There is no ranking update between IW and Miami

There's one between them : Miami like Indian Wells starting on thursday not monday, the rankings used for the seedings are the ones from the monday before, which means for Miami the monday after Indian Wells.

It's in the middle monday of Indian Wells and Miami that there's no ranking update.

By the way, Djokovic being out of Rotterdam, he will not get number 2 at all this month, only possibly after Indian Wells (then he can get number 2 seed for Miami)

There's one between them : Miami like Indian Wells starting on thursday not monday, the rankings used for the seedings are the ones from the monday before, which means for Miami the monday after Indian Wells.

It's in the middle monday of Indian Wells and Miami that there's no ranking update.

By the way, Djokovic being out of Rotterdam, he will not get number 2 at all this month, only possibly after Indian Wells (then he can get number 2 seed for Miami)

No, there is no week off between Indian Wells and Miami. Indian Wells starts on March 10th(final will be play on March 20th) and Miami starts on March 23th. Miami will used the ranking of March 14th of course no update .

No, there is no week off between Indian Wells and Miami. Indian Wells starts on March 10th(final will be play on March 20th) and Miami starts on March 23th. Miami will used the ranking of March 14th of course no update .

it's the same as every year : Indian Wells and Miami starting on wednesday (the 23rd is a wednesday) or thursday, I don't remember, they are the only tournaments which can use for the seeds the rankings from the monday starting the week when they start.

Miami will use the rankings from the 21st of march for the seeds (there will be no rankings update on the 14th)

Just For Fun, A Ranking Of Atp Countries:
Player Ranked 100 Gets 1 Point, Player 1 Gets 100 Points And An Additional 5 Points For Each Player In The Top 100.
For Example Austria Gets 91 + 5

Spain 981
France 604
Germany 426
Usa 367
Argentina 284
Russia 241
Serbia 239
Croatia 199
Switzerland 196
Italia 183
Ukraine 162
Chezk 142
Brasil 119
Neth 112
Kazakastan 110
Sweden 102
Great Britain 101
Austria 96
Chipre 85
Latvia 74
Taiwan 69
Finlandia 63
Belgica 62
Uzbekistan 59
Rumania 53
Colombia 49
Sudafrica 47
Portugal 45
Uruguay 44
Australia 38
Japon 36
Lituania 33
Polonia 32
Slovakia 29
Bulgaria 21
Israel 16
Canada 12
Chile 9

Djokovic out of Rotterdam, so no #2 for him before Indian Wells

Djokovic out of Rotterdam, so no #2 for him before Indian Wells

more worrying if he doesn't fly to Rotterdam to make some promotion, he will get a zero-pointer there (then lose his 360 points from Monte-Carlo)
... unless his injury makes him out for 30 days and then he has to miss Dubai (and replace his 500 points there by 300 points in Basel).

Anyway he would be able to replace the zero-pointer later if he plays 4 ATP500 tournaments this year (for instance Dubai, MonteCarlo, Beijing and Basel) thanks to the rule which was introduced last year.

more worrying if he doesn't fly to Rotterdam to make some promotion, he will get a zero-pointer there (then lose his 360 points from Monte-Carlo)
... unless his injury makes him out for 30 days and then he has to miss Dubai (and replace his 500 points there by 300 points in Basel).

Anyway he would be able to replace the zero-pointer later if he plays 4 ATP500 tournaments this year (for instance Dubai, MonteCarlo, Beijing and Basel) thanks to the rule which was introduced last year.

Apparently he may go in Rotterdam to do some promotion but nothing confirmed yet.

Cilic, Monaco, Gasquet: 28, 29, 30 :) the mug squad reunite.

Djokovic's name isn't in the draw, so he'll lose 360 points

Djokovic's name isn't in the draw, so he'll lose 360 points

if he comes to Rotterdam to make some promotion, he won't lose them

Yes that's right :yeah:

So as I can see if Soderling doesn't win the title in Rotterdam, Murray will be nr.4

And Gilles Muller? He should be cracking top100 as well

Yes that's right :yeah:

So as I can see if Soderling doesn't win the title in Rotterdam, Murray will be nr.4

If you remove last year's points earned in Rotterdam, Sod is 215 pts behind Murray.

To become #4 again, Sod must either:

- win the tournament and hope for Andy Murray not to make the finals,

OR

- make the finals and hope for Murray to lose in 1st or 2nd round.

Welcome to the Wonderful Rankings World !!!

If you remove Soderling's Points he falls to 215 behind Murray

That is because he has replaced 2010 Rotterdam with a 95 Davis Cup Points

So to add Rotterdam 2011 (300 Points for reaching Final) he must remove the Davis Cup Points

Meaning he only gains 205 by reaching the Final

Meaning Soderling must win the event to have any chance of keeping Number 4.


Note: This is the only reason why Murray is showing up in Rotterdam so
that he is seeded 4th for Indian Wells.
He wanted a long break from tennis but couldnt risk the drop in ranking

You're right Judio :yeah:

I forgot to count the 95 Davis Cup points !

So, to be back at #4, Sod must win the tournament & hope for Murray to lose in SF
(or before SF).

If I am correct, if Sod wins, he will get 5955 points. If Murray reaches the finals,
he will get 6015 pts, and only 5895 pts if he reaches the semis.

Welcome to the Wonderful Rankings World !!!

If you remove Soderling's Points he falls to 215 behind Murray

That is because he has replaced 2010 Rotterdam with a 90 from Beijing (Edited)

So to add Rotterdam 2011 (300 Points for reaching Final) he must remove the Beijing Points

Meaning he only gains 210 by reaching the Final

Meaning Soderling must win the event to have any chance of keeping Number 4.


Note: This is the only reason why Murray is showing up in Rotterdam so
that he is seeded 4th for Indian Wells.
He wanted a long break from tennis but couldnt risk the drop in ranking

Robin is playing Marseille too. So lets say Robin wins the Rotterdam final over Murray or goes further(but drops to #5) he can still be seeded 4 for IW no? I know that Murray is playing in Dubai, but technically.

Why is Murray so obsessed with being #4 in IW??? :rolleyes: It's only a masters! Maybe he should put more effort into winning a slam instead? :o

Why is Murray so obsessed with being #4 in IW??? :rolleyes: It's only a masters! Maybe he should put more effort into winning a slam instead? :o

For the same reason Soderling was working hard to get #4 in AO, I suppose: to avoid meeting Nadal or Federer (or Djokovic, for that matter) in the QFs. (Of course, that was a moot point in Sod's case at AO, but still.)

Djokovic not coming to Rotterdam to make some promotion and probably not injured for 30 days and I guess he will play in Dubai, I think he will get a zero-pointer for his withdrawal (which means one less ATP500 result, so far MonteCarlo's 360 points).

But I guess he will be able to replace this zero-pointer with another ATP500 result later in the year, thanks to this rule :

e) Replacement Event. A player who has received a zero (0) point ranking penalty
for withdrawing from an ATP World Tour 500 event may replace the zero (0)
point by playing an additional ATP World Tour 500 event in that same calendar
year for a total of four (4) played. The replacement tournament must be after the
500 withdrawal that has resulted in a ranking penalty. Only one (1) additional
ATP World Tour 500 event per year may be used to replace an ATP World Tour
500 ranking penalty.

I know that Söderling used this rule last year to replace his zero-pointer from Washington after Valencia (also Simon for MonteCarlo)

However, it's not fully clear to me :

- is a top30 player allowed to one withdrawal like that as long as he plays 4 ATP500 tournaments in the year ?

- does MonteCarlo count as an ATP500 tournament for that ?

- what about a non-top30 player ? he also gets a zero-pointer for a withdrawal in an ATP500 tournament if he doesn't come on-site, but he doesn't have to play 4 ATP500 tournaments in the year, then how does the rule apply for him ?

- when is the zero-pointer cancelled ? when the player has played a 4th ATP500 tournament in the year, or when he has added one ATP500 tournament to his provisional schedule (since I think that the ATP asks a provisional ATP500 schedule to the top30 players in order to respect their engagement with the tournaments for a minimum of top30 players taking part) ?

All this is not clear to me, and watching how the zero-pointers are cancelled through the year, doesn't make it fully clear either as some zero-pointers may also be cancelled through appeal to a tribunal and we don't hear about this tribunal then it's not always clear why a zero-pointer is cancelled.

Why is Murray so obsessed with being #4 in IW??? :rolleyes: It's only a masters! Maybe he should put more effort into winning a slam instead? :o

Who says Murray is obsessed with being #4, apart from Judio in this thread (and he hates Murray).

Andy is on record as saying he is not concerned with rankings, he wants to concentrate on winning matches, and then the rankings will take care of themselves. He has said it more than once - I can't quite remember when, but probably after being questioned about it the twice he dropped out of the top 4!

Who says Murray is obsessed with being #4, apart from Judio in this thread (and he hates Murray).

Andy is on record as saying he is not concerned with rankings, he wants to concentrate on winning matches, and then the rankings will take care of themselves. He has said it more than once - I can't quite remember when, but probably after being questioned about it the twice he dropped out of the top 4!

fully agree, there's no reason to think that he's obsessed with this #4 seed.

Why did he come to Rotterdam while he was thinking of not going ?

we don't know, but maybe just because it was not the best way to do to "escape the problems" by avoiding the ATP tour, it's better being strong and just playing and winning.

When Agassi won Wimbledon just after three GS finals lost and a harsh defeat to Courier in RG semifinal 63 62 62 or something like that, it was totally unexpected : he just came, played and won, there's no other way than thinking of the present rather than the past. When Lendl came back from to two sets to love against McEnroe in RG84, the same : just thought of fighting and winning, and that did it.

the 500 rule is madness anyway. Gasquet will have a zero for rotterdam but does it replace a 250 result? Is it even part of his ranking points since he withdrawn before the draw was out? Is it a penalty event? Is it part of 4 ATP 500 knowing he has already played more than 4?

the 500 rule is madness anyway. Gasquet will have a zero for rotterdam but does it replace a 250 result? Is it even part of his ranking points since he withdrawn before the draw was out? Is it a penalty event? Is it part of 4 ATP 500 knowing he has already played more than 4?

I answered you in the "live score" thread :

I think that he and Gulbis will not get any zero-pointer :

I would like an explanation about the rule of top 30: Gulbis and Gasquet are forfeit for the Rotterdam event but in 2 different ways. Gasquet was forfeit before the draw was released, so he was no more part of the player list, and Gulbis declared forfeit hours before his match, but being in the draw, is replaced by a LL.

My question is, do they both get a "penalty 500 event" which is a 0 in their ranking points, or only Gulbis?

I think both of them should avoid the penalty zero-pointer" : see page 138 of the rulebook :

b) On-Site Medical Examination.

Players who withdraw after 12 noon Eastern Time, USA on Friday (or in the case
of doubles, after the entry deadline) before a tournament shall not have the late
withdrawal fine assessed if determined to be unfit to play that week if:
i) The player who is still competing in a tournament or Davis Cup* after the
Friday 12 noon deadline is forced to withdraw/retire and is examined by that
event's doctor and determined to be unfit for the following week's tournament;
or
ii) The player is examined on-site, at the event from which he withdrew, and
determined to be unfit for play by that tournament's doctor during qualifying
or within the first three (3) days of the main draw for Challengers. Players who
are examined by the on-site tournament doctor shall receive tournament provided
hotel rooms through the night of the examination.

I think Gasquet is first case, Gulbis second one.

What is Nishikori's highest ranking?

#56 I think, not sure though

Who says Murray is obsessed with being #4, apart from Judio in this thread (and he hates Murray).

Andy is on record as saying he is not concerned with rankings, he wants to concentrate on winning matches, and then the rankings will take care of themselves. He has said it more than once - I can't quite remember when, but probably after being questioned about it the twice he dropped out of the top 4!
Here

Even a loss for Murray could still result in him overtaking Robin Soderling as the world No.4 if the Swede fails to win the tournament, but Murray insists that the world rankings are not something he is overly concerned about.

“You want to try and win matches and tournaments,” Murray said. “If you are doing that, then you are going to move up the rankings, so you try and focus on ways to win matches rather than ways to win ranking points.”
http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/other-sports-news/murray-hits-back-at-critics-concern-over-mother-s-role-1.1084153

If you get a zero ATP 500 pointer

When you play the fifth ( includes Monte Carlo but NOT DC) ATP 500 (Including the one you got a zero), the zero disappears
If you do not play another 4 the zero will remain until 52 weeks after it was given
The Rules are the same even if you are "Top 30 " or not


yes I think it's like that (although I found no evidence about Monte-Carlo yet : I saw no case like that last year) ; as for playing the "fifth" one, it was confusing for me but it means that in the end you may have played only 4 ATP500 tournaments and cancel a zero-pointer in a 5th tournament - see Roddick for instance last year who cancelled his zero-pointer from Dubai after Basel having played Memphis, Washington, Tokyo and Basel.

As far as avoiding it in the first place
You do "a Federer" and just show up for an on site promo event
You do " a Gulbis" and enter the event and withdraw during the event before playing

As for appealing
You wait until 30 days later, do not play any events and it will come off, but only if you appeal

Otherwise you are stuck with it

yes but for the "Gulbis" you must be injured or ill then checked as unfit to play by a doctor in the tournament.

You may also do a "Gasquet" and withdraw from previous tournament after friday noon and have your injury checked in that tournament :lol:

There's also the rule "30 days off for injury" but I don't know when they validate it : they can do it as soon as they receive the medical prescription, I believe.

As for the "Federer" he did it in Dubai but in the end it didn't help him at all as he didn't play 4 ATP500 tournaments in the calendar year and then received 3 zero-pointers later, after Hamburg, Washington and Tokyo : for his rankings this year (it would have been a little bit less good last year however), a zero-pointer in Dubai would have been better as it would have disappeared this month and he would have been able to replace it with his next result in Dubai.

Anyway I think Federer did promotion in Dubai ... just because he's a resident from Dubai and had to do it for his good relationships with the city.

"Low Opt" for Troicki 45 or 90 ?

"Low Opt" for Troicki 45 or 90 ?

45, Troicki is allowed to count 8 "optional tournaments" since he could not play Shanghai and PAris

So now are there any points Nole will lose next week??

Yes! Murray's cunning scheme to steal the #4 position backfired! :yeah:

He didn't have a scheme to stay #4. If he wanted to stay #4 this week and if he tought if was important then he would've won today. He didn't, so he doesn't really think #4 ranking is important atm. He will get it back soon.

He didn't have a scheme to stay #4. If he wanted to stay #4 this week and if he tought if was important then he would've won today. He didn't, so he doesn't really think #4 ranking is important atm. He will get it back soon.

Yeah, that's it.

When will he feel like winning a slam is important?

When will he feel like winning a slam is important?

never
and that's good for the sport ;)

When will he feel like winning a slam is important?
He's always known that....

He just plays badly in some matches and runs into hot opponents.

His slams will come.

So now are there any points Nole will lose next week??

probably he'll get a zero-pointer and then lose his 360 points from Monte-Carlo ... but he might have this zero-pointer cancelled in the end of the year if he plays 4 ATP500 tournaments (Monte-Carlo included) as he probably intends to do.

Is Rainer the oldest guy in the top 100?

Is Rainer the oldest guy in the top 100?

yes he has been so since Santoro left, second is currently Ramirez-Hidalgo who is 21 months younger.

but his ranking is declining dangerously.

Yes! Murray's cunning scheme to steal the #4 position backfired! :yeah:

if Söderling doesn't win Rotterdam, Murray will still be number 4 next monday

Yes! Murray's cunning scheme to steal the #4 position backfired! :yeah:

Don't you ever read replies to your posts? See #205 and #212 in reply to your original post #202.

There was no cunning scheme. And how Andy could "steal" the position is beyond me. Apart from two short occasions he has held the #4 or higher for more than two years, I don't see how Soderling having it for a few weeks makes him the rightful owner for all time. At the moment he is, yes: those who get the points get the position - but that doesn't mean he has some sort of right to keep it forever.

i have to say i cant really blame murray even though its a shady scheming tactic

i have to say i cant really blame murray even though its a shady scheming tactic

Not true.

It's as silly as saying Soderling "schemed" to get the ranking by playing 5 more tournaments than Murray in the last year. And now we had better stop hijacking this thread. . .

Not true.

It's as silly as saying Soderling "schemed" to get the ranking by playing 5 more tournaments than Murray in the last year. And now we had better stop hijacking this thread.Geez, lighten up a bit will you? Ossie was kidding, and so was Mjau.

with this SF TRoicki enters top-20 : provisional number 19 :yeah:

Raonic 73

Definitely deserved for the kid, if he can keep this sort of level he'll be higher than that and being automatic to all the Masters events.

Anyone knows how to contact this site http://tennislive.free.fr/
I think there's a problem in the contact page

Of course he want.. he needs every Indoor tournament he can get in the season

Soderling keeps the Number 4

Also he can only extend his lead by winning Marseille so will
he pull out ??

So, his cunning sheme is working. :angel::angel::angel:

He will go in on thursday, so it should be fine.

Del Potro is what now?

But he'll only gain qf points since he's been drawn to meet Llodra in the quarters. But it might also be good to get some rest during these weeks.

Huge couple of weeks coming up for Roddick soon where he defends just about half of his current point stack. He really needs to step up now.

Del Potro is what now?
296-298

296-298
Thanks :)

Looks like Raonic goes up to #59 win this title... wow, spitting distance of the Top 50!

Judio, sorry if this is a stupid question.

Why is Almagro allowed to count 3 250s (on his atp page).

He only counts 3 500s (including Monte Carlo).

I thought top 30 players needed to count 4 500s?

So that means thata Djokovic won't play Dubai??

Thanks Judio :)

I'm a bit confused when you say "You can count it towards the end of that year" though. Am I right in interpreting that as long as you have played 4 500s at any point of time without penalty zeros, and you have a 250 that is higher, you can count it?

It isn't a stupid question

At the start of 2010 they brought in another New Rule

If you are a Designated Top 30 Player
AND you fulfil the entry criteria for 4 ATP 500s by entering 6 weeks before and play them all

THEN if you have a 3rd ATP 250 which is higher than your 4th ATP 500

You can count it towards the end of that year

Players who switched were
Almagro, Youzhny, Querrey, Robredo, Simon and Cilic

Cilic has switched back as he lost 2 ATP 250 titles in 2011 so he is better off counting 4 ATP 500s

Yet another confusing rule. I'm glad Almagro can count 3 ATP250s but it's all getting a bit much. Extra thanks to Judio for keeping on top of it all.

Welcome to the top 20 Troicki! Not many points to defend in the foreseeable future so he should be there (or close to it) for a while at least.

Thanks Judio :)

I'm a bit confused when you say "You can count it towards the end of that year" though. Am I right in interpreting that as long as you have played 4 500s at any point of time without penalty zeros, and you have a 250 that is higher, you can count it?

As far as I know, the rule is not clearly expressed by the ATP about how long you can keep this third ATP250 result.

Then we have to guess as always :lol:

I don't clearly understand how Judio has guessed himself.

Personally I would have rather thought that the most simple way to understand this rule would be that they would be able to count one more ATP250/challenger until the end of 2011 year (I mean until the final ATP500s -Basel and Valencia- have been played). And I would rather think that Cilic will still be able to count a third ATP250 result if he gets one better than his lowest ATP500.

By the way, I haven't checked my file but I'm sure a few other players (Ferrer at least) than the ones Judio mentioned also validated the conditions in 2010 which made them entitled to get this 3rd ATP250 result : it's just that they didn't have a 3rd better ATP250 result than their lowest ATP500 in the end of 2010 but I guess that if they get one, they will be able to count it.

So that means thata Djokovic won't play Dubai??

maybe because else I can't guess which rule he used to avoid the zero-pointer as he didn't even fly to Rotterdam from what we heard :confused:

I have not guessed, I am using the Players that the ATP made changes to in October and Novemebr 2010

I assumed Cilic would change back which ATP confirmed the week after Chennai

There is no guesswork anymore, we should have no new players until October 2011(unless as you say Ferrer
loses all his ATP 500 points)

I didn't mean guessing about the names of the players concerned, I meant guessing about how long these players can keep 3 ATP250 results in their rankings.

I haven't seen it clearly written.

My guess (like you I think ?) is that they can keep this allowance until Basel/Valencia are played but what if they play too few ATP500s this year, for instance if one of these players gets a penalty zero-pointer after Beijing for having played only 2 ATP500 tournaments in 2011 ? or not correctly entered ?

I guess it would not cancel his allowance to count 3 ATP250s at once, they would wait until Basel/Valencia for that, but I'm not sure yet.

Kubot #135 :crying2:

Why Hewitt on this week Low opt 45?

The simple answer is to scrap the ATP 500 Rule

It makes no sense at all, apart from to confuse everybody

I am sure Mr Disney said that the new Rankings would make things easier !!!!
Yeah well Mr Disney said a lot of things.

Round Robin is a good idea.

Monte-Carlo should not be a Masters 1000

The ranking situation is as bad as understanding the implications of special relativity or the Schleswig-Holstein question. The old system was bad enough but this is absurd.

Because he Still has to Count 4 ATP 500s as he is an "Old" Top 30 Player.

He can only remove one 12 months after he played(or earned a penalty)

So in 2011 he must wait until after Monte Carlo and then Barcelona

before he can count a 3rd or 4th ATP 250

Memphis is a tournament series 500, in the ATP world 500, Barcelona 20 points, 5 points of Davis Cup, and another 0, unless Memphis can not now be replaced by points Davis Cup?

Memphis is a tournament series 500, in the ATP world 500, Barcelona 20 points, 5 points of Davis Cup, and another 0, unless Memphis can not now be replaced by points Davis Cup?
Memphis will be added next monday. Yes, he can replace Davis cup points

Memphis will be added next monday. Yes, he can replace Davis cup points
then why in the table Low opt stands 45 points instead of 5 points?:D

then why in the table Low opt stands 45 points instead of 5 points?:D

you're right : in such a case, Judio should write "5" as he wrote that during ATP500 tournaments, he writes the lowest ATP500 "for the top-30 players" only but he should also do it for "previous top-30 players" in such a case probably ;)

Not too bad for Raonic, going up almost 100 ranking spots in less than two months!

At the start of 2010 they brought in another New Rule

If you are a Designated Top 30 Player
AND you fulfil the entry criteria for 4 ATP 500s by entering 6 weeks before and play them all

THEN if you have a 3rd ATP 250 which is higher than your 4th ATP 500

You can count it towards the end of that year

Players who switched were
Almagro, Youzhny, Querrey, Robredo, Simon and Cilic

Cilic has switched back as he lost 2 ATP 250 titles in 2011 so he is better off counting 4 ATP 500s

I just checked my file : apart from Almagro, Youzhny, Querrey, Robredo, Simon and Cilic, these other players did might have validated the conditions in 2010 to be able to count one more ATP250 but just didn't need to because their 4th ATP500 result was good enough :

Djokovic, Ferrer, Verdasco, Davydenko, Melzer, Troicki (for Troicki the situation is a little bit more complex, as he is allowed to count 2 more results as he was not in the original entry-list for Shanghai and Paris tournaments : then his 4th ATP500 result had to be better than his 5th ATP250 result and not the third one)

Nothing is sure as they may have missed one rule which we can't check but it might be possible that if one day it was useful for them to count only 3 ATP500 results and count one more ATP250 result, they would be allowed to do it.

I just checked my file : apart from Almagro, Youzhny, Querrey, Robredo, Simon and Cilic, I guess these other players did validate the conditions in 2010 to be able to count one more ATP250 but just didn't need to because their 4th ATP500 result was good enough :

Djokovic, Ferrer, Verdasco, Davydenko, Melzer, Troicki (for Troicki the situation is a little bit more complex, as he is allowed to count 2 more results as he was not in the original entry-list for Shanghai and Paris tournaments : then his 4th ATP500 result had to be better than his 5th ATP250 result and not the third one)

I guess that if one day it was useful for them to count only 3 ATP500 results and count one more ATP250 result, they would be allowed to do it.
Monaco played 5 ATP 500 last year but was not allowed to count a third better ATP 250

Monaco played 5 ATP 500 last year but was not allowed to count a third better ATP 250

yes it's true, for him we could see it was refused and it was strange (was strange also for Berdych for instance), he had a withdrawal in Hamburg but he was out for more than one month because of a wrist surgery and he was not counted a zero in that moment.

Then yes it's possible anyway that for some of the players I mentioned, the ATP would not accept a 3rd ATP250 result.

Let's say they all might be concerned but it's not certain.

Duong, The Main point that they would fall down on is the 12 week entry deadline

The Minimum is 6 weeks and unless you are Federer(who decides a year ahead) you would probably not enter
until the required 6 week deadline

Ah yes thank you I wondered that there was one rule I didn't know which could explain that,

and definitely it's this one :yeah:

rather than what I said about withdrawals because if the withdrawal had been undue for instance for Monaco in Hamburg, we would have seen a zero-pointer in his ranking points at that moment

Lol Almagro just got nothing for winning his last tittle. Raonic at 59 and Tomic up to 185.:)

Almagro and Wawrinka are both playing an ATP 250 event

They can both gain ZERO points for winning !!!

yes Almagro started his SouthAmerican clay season earlier than last year and was successful at once, but with the points he will get this week, he can maybe play less in july, avoid Gstaad especially, or be less successful in Bastad which is a tough tournament.

As for Wawrinka, he also chose to play SouthAmerican clay season, maybe this way he will not play Casablanca again.

They might get nothing points-wise, but they will still get the $$$$$. . .

Also the points will stay on for a whole year unlike the ones they have at present in their counting tournaments.

yes Almagro started his SouthAmerican clay season earlier than last year and was successful at once, but with the points he will get this week, he can maybe play less in july, avoid Gstaad especially, or be less successful in Bastad which is a tough tournament.

As for Wawrinka, he also chose to play SouthAmerican clay season, maybe this way he will not play Casablanca again.

His current schedule says he is playing Casablanca IIRC

I have a question.

I know a player can apply for a protected ranking once he's out of action for six months. Is it six months from the day the player played the last match before the injury/illness layoff or from the day the tournament he last played ended?

I'm asking because JCF may return to tour in IW, which starts on March 10. The last match he played was on Sept. 4, during USO, which ended on Sept. 13. So, if he returns to IW, he will have been out of action for more than six months from the day he played his last match to date, but it will be three days short of six months if the rules say those six months must have passed from the final day the tournament he last played.

I reckon the entry deadline for Monte Carlo four weeks before the tournament this year too, which I think is March 14. If JC really plays IW, I hope he will be also able to use PR to enter MC because by then his rankings will be around #50 and not high enough for direct entry!

I have a question.

I know a player can apply for a protected ranking once he's out of action for six months. Is it six months from the day the player played the last match before the injury/illness layoff or from the day the tournament he last played ended?

I'm asking because JCF may return to tour in IW, which starts on March 10. The last match he played was on Sept. 4, during USO, which ended on Sept. 13. So, if he returns to IW, he will have been out of action for more than six months from the day he played his last match to date, but it will be three days short of six months if the rules say those six months must have passed from the final day the tournament he last played.

I reckon the entry deadline for Monte Carlo four weeks before the tournament this year too, which I think is March 14. If JC really plays IW, I hope he will be also able to use PR to enter MC because by then his rankings will be around #50 and not high enough for direct entry!
The rulebook just says 6 months .It doesn't specify but I think it is probably end of tournament .

F. Entry Protection
1) Petition. A player may petition the President, or his designee, for an entry protection
when he is physically injured and does not compete in any tennis event,
including Special Events – Exhibitions, for a minimum period of six (6) months. The
written petition must be received within six (6) months after his last tournament Atp rulebook http://www.atpworldtour.com/Corporate/Rulebook.aspx IX ATP Ranking

The rulebook just says 6 months .It doesn't specify but I think it is probably end of tournament .

Atp rulebook http://www.atpworldtour.com/Corporate/Rulebook.aspx IX ATP Ranking
Thanx guichard! :yeah:
Yeah the way the rulebook is written sounds like it's six months from the final day of the last tournament he played...in which case he'd better skip IW and start in Miami or later...

Thanx guichard! :yeah:
Yeah the way the rulebook is written sounds like it's six months from the final day of the last tournament he played...in which case he'd better skip IW and start in Miami or later...

yes, the way it's written page 171 ("F entry protection") clearly expresses what you say imo, and you're right if he takes part in Indian Wells, it would be 25 weeks and not 26 weeks without playing.

But is it really that interesting for him to apply for a protected ranking ? he has to think about that.

Anyway, if he doesn't play Indian Wells, he will get zero point for that event (10 points if he loses in first round)

Judio at Lleyton Low Opt 5 points instead of 45 points

Raonic now 53, he will reach the top-50 (45 so far) if he beats Kendrick

what will del potros ranking be when he wins memphis?

what will del potros ranking be when he wins memphis?

at best 73

doubt Del Potro will win, should make it pretty far though.

at best 73nice, i wonder what tournament he is going to play next

nice, i wonder what tournament he is going to play next

Delray Beach next week

sorry but can someone explain the zero point rule again
and how Djokovic will play Dubai even if he didn't get a zero in Rotterdam??

sorry but can someone explain the zero point rule again
and how Djokovic will play Dubai even if he didn't get a zero in Rotterdam??

we don't know how Djokovic avoided the zero-pointer in Rotterdam : imo there are three solutions ... or maybe more :lol: :

- he came to Rotterdam to make some promotion without people here noticing

- people weren't sure how long his injury might take him out, and esp if he could go to Dubai or not, and the ATP allowed him not to count a zero-pointer provisionally

- the third solution ... bah for any reason they didn't give him the zero-pointer at once but will give him later, as it already happened sometimes (even though it's most usual the other way round : a zero-pointer cancelled)

- ah the fourth one ... he will skip Dubai :confused:

- fifth one : there is any other kind of arrangement between him and the ATP :lol: , maybe making promotion elsewhere than in Rotterdam would be enough ... but it's not what's written in the rulebook. But you know not everything is written in the rulebook : for instance the suspension for missing a Masters 1000 tournament has never been applied :shrug:

Raonic 45 now, 37 if he beats Fish

if Fish defeats Raonic, he will be number 14, his best ranking in his carreer (which so far was 16)

Will be Tursunov in top 100 next week? Thanks.

Will be Tursunov in top 100 next week? Thanks.

Almost he is # 105 now , so if he wins his semi final then yes

Raonic now 37

Del Potro has to win two matches to jump from around 160 to 73 :clap2:

yeah it will be intersting.

If Raonic wins the final tonight or picks up enough points in Acapulco, AND gets a wild card in IW, he'll be seeded, right? :eek:

It will be interesting to See Soderling's Ranking on Monday

His third Best ATP 250 is now 150
His fourth Best ATP 500 is only 95

Will he meet the criteria so he can switch the scores over ???

At the end of last year when some players DID switch, his 3rd Best ATP 250 score was only
worth 45 points
No, he didn't get the third ATP 250

Roddikc has lots of points to defend now :eek: Out of top ten again?

Sure looks that way. He has 3735 points with 1600 points to defend in IW/Miami. :help: He needs to win Delray Beach bad to help cushion the fall he's about to take. The way points are set up at 1000 events, there is really no way to defend even close to the points needed when you win or make a final, unless you equal it.

At least he'll keep his top 8 seeding for IW/Miami and hopefully he can get it back for Wimbledon. He had no clay matches last year aside from the FO.

Good news is for him that he has nothing too significant and out of the question to defend after that and good easily be top 10 after Wimbledon (maybe even before it).

Delray beach, DC with a cold :help: Better Withdarw from DC and try a clean start at IW. Something like QF, SF wouldn't be bad

Well I just looked up some stats:

Miami:
Since 2004 he has only lost before the QFs once and has won twice. He's made the QFs or better since 2006 (even has a win against Fed there).

Indian Wells:
In eight career starts, only lost before the QFs twice and has been to the SFs and beyond four times.

So even though he's obviously not likely to defend the majority of the points. Those two tournaments produce some of his best tennis so I don't think it's out of the realm to think he could make two QFs at least.

After that, he can't do much worse than he did for the rest of the year so I still think it's a high possibility that he'll get back into the top 10 at some point in the year.