Roddick's change in style [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Roddick's change in style

Everko
01-24-2010, 10:01 PM
why has Roddick changed from an agressive big serve, big forehand player into a pusher. I haven't seen to many Roddick matche slately but watched the Gonzon one and was sure I was watching another man playing in Roddick's body. He rarely went for winners and was spinning his serve a lot.

Is he a better player because of this? I think he was better back when he had a bigger serve and bigger shots.

Why did he change? and when did he change his style of play?

KolyaLegend
01-24-2010, 10:09 PM
Because Federer traumatized him

The Magician
01-24-2010, 10:10 PM
Because Federer traumatized him

Pretty much. Welcome to 5 years ago with this thread:wavey:

To expand, the guys who have a good record against Fed (other than Nadal obv) are Simon and Murray, pushers through and through. Roddick is attempting to emulate this against Fed with some success.

partygirl
01-24-2010, 10:11 PM
:sobbing:

Bilbo
01-24-2010, 10:13 PM
because he has lost power. normal when you get older.

Certinfy
01-24-2010, 10:14 PM
Would defo prefer him to hit that FH the way he used to if possible.

Everko
01-24-2010, 10:44 PM
because he has lost power. normal when you get older.

He's not old and Gonzo hasn't lost power in his forehand.

TennisOnWood
01-24-2010, 10:46 PM
Actually,I love to watch this tennis from him. Today he stayed in some points very long and in last months he plays some shots that we couldn't see few years ago.

After all,he is not that young any more and that big powerful tennis brought him just 1 GS. Even at Wimbledon 2009 he pushed Fed better then he did in first two finals

cocrcici
01-24-2010, 10:51 PM
Actually,I love to watch this tennis from him. Today he stayed in some points very long and in last months he plays some shots that we couldn't see few years ago.

After all,he is not that young any more and that big powerful tennis brought him just 1 GS. Even at Wimbledon 2009 he pushed Fed better then he did in first two finals

:)

Fee
01-24-2010, 10:52 PM
Would defo prefer him to hit that FH the way he used to if possible.

Yeah join the club. I miss the days when Andy could end points in two strokes. We fondly refer to those days as '2004'.

DwyaneWade
01-24-2010, 11:06 PM
Because the game is evolving that way?

The days of serve-FH winner tennis being enough are basically done. To be the best you have to be solid and consistent enough to stay in long rallies. Roddick has improved mightily in that aspect (BH DTL, BH slice).

His FH also was never big enough to win points consistently against the great defenders you have now (Federer, Nadal, Djokovic, Murray being the best examples). Look back at 2003-2004 Roddick. He would barely be top 20 these days.

Jimnik
01-25-2010, 12:30 AM
Because Federer traumatized him
Probably true. :o


because he has lost power. normal when you get older.
If anything footwork and reactions should deteriorate with age, not so much power. Also mentally it's usually harder to remain patient and focused for longer rallies at an older age. :shrug:

McAlistar
01-25-2010, 12:33 AM
Roddicks power has gone down overall. He used to be comfortably be the fastest serve in the game, now hes 3rd or 4th. His max now is usually about 220kmh unlike the regular 230+ we saw a few years back.

moon language
01-25-2010, 12:42 AM
He's trying to play what has proven to be the modern, effective style.

Chip_s_m
01-25-2010, 01:10 AM
Roddicks power has gone down overall. He used to be comfortably be the fastest serve in the game, now hes 3rd or 4th. His max now is usually about 220kmh unlike the regular 230+ we saw a few years back.

To be fair he's putting a greater emphasis on placement and 1st serve % now. He's better off serving at 140 mph rather than 150 mph if he can get just as many aces/unreturnables and a higher 1st serve %. I don't know offhand his serving stats from 2003-2004, but I'd be surprised if he really was able to produce significantly more service winners than modern Roddick.

Look at the serving stats on the Aussie Open website. Roddick has the 7th highest 1st serve % of the tournament at 71%. That's incredible for a guy with such a strong serve. It's that type of consistent serving that allowed him to almost pull off the Wimbledon title last year.

The weaker forehand is disappointing, though. He'd be much better off if he could bring that back.

General Suburbia
01-25-2010, 01:23 AM
Roddick's change in style has its ups and downs. I prefer the way he serves now than he did before. It sets up the point nicely for him and because he doesn't go for so much, his percentage in GS are usually around the 70+% range, which is pretty fucking incredible, even though it (and his game in general) aren't as flashy as it used to be.

His court positioning, backhand, movement, and approaches are a lot better now. It's easy not to pay attention when watching his matches and wonder how on earth he's able to beat opponents during neutral rallies, but these improvements were made specifically to draw and force errors from opponents instead of going riskier winners. He's a great percentage player.

However, I do wish Roddick would occasionally go for bigger shots. Even when the opportunity presents itself he would prefer to dink the ball back in instead of blast an easy forehand and in doing so sometimes makes life a lot more difficult for himself. There's a fine line between being patient and being passive, and too often Roddick chooses the latter. His forehand has also regressed and is one of the worst in the top 20. High bouncing topspin approach shots are fodder for good players, but Roddick keeps trying and keeps getting passed with that shot.

I think the reason his forehand isn't so much an attacking shot anymore is because the modern game has evolved to a point where his monster forehand has just become a weakness. I remember a couple years back when Roddick's game was becoming more what it is today, he'd occasionally go for the big shot and his opponent would get it back over and over again; not only that but because of his horrible court positioning they'd not only get it back but they'd hit winners on the run when retrieving the big shot. Since his movement and positioning are much better than it was years ago, I think he could bring that shot back and not lose because of it, but that's just wishful thinking. His grit, determination, and asshole nature are still as strong as ever, so it's nice to know that some things don't change.

vamosinator
01-25-2010, 01:54 AM
I like Roddick's change in style, it has raised him to a level of being able to compete for every slam (maybe even clay). Federer might have to consider making similar changes to his game if he wants to move with the times :yeah:

brithater
01-25-2010, 02:08 AM
I like Roddick's change in style, it has raised him to a level of being able to compete for every slam (maybe even clay). Federer might have to consider making similar changes to his game if he wants to move with the times :yeah:

Right because Federer is really haveing trouble in the slams the last few years.:eek:

Roddick is a way better players now than when he won the US Open. He has a lot more ability. Just not as dangerous and he has gotton too comfortable with not takeing chances. When he won the US Open he was very dangerous. It was a fluke. He had a great draw and he was young enough not to be scared of losing. There was no pressure and he was rideing the wave. Its the pressure of being the top American that has changed Roddicks game. If he was agressive and loosing everyone would be bitching about him makeing to many errors and telling him to not go for so much.

My personal view is that with where his ability level is now the biggest factor is how close he can stay to that baseline and move forward. I dont think he has to necessarily go bigger on shots but he can not get pinned 10 feet behind that basline. Once that happens his whole game is pushing and he is done.

bjurra
01-25-2010, 02:49 AM
Right because Federer is really haveing trouble in the slams the last few years.:eek:

Roddick is a way better players now than when he won the US Open. He has a lot more ability. Just not as dangerous and he has gotton too comfortable with not takeing chances.

I dont think he has to necessarily go bigger on shots but he can not get pinned 10 feet behind that basline. Once that happens his whole game is pushing and he is done.

Roddicks current game will book him a 4th round or QF in every Slam (except RG) but it wont give him any titles. This is how he should play:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbSRRDQF7YQ

Notice the huge difference in pace compared to his pushing against Gonzo. In this clip, he is even hitting bh winners!

bjurra
01-25-2010, 02:52 AM
Right because Federer is really haveing trouble in the slams the last few years.:eek:

Roddick is a way better players now than when he won the US Open. He has a lot more ability. Just not as dangerous and he has gotton too comfortable with not takeing chances. When he won the US Open he was very dangerous. It was a fluke. He had a great draw and he was young enough not to be scared of losing. There was no pressure and he was rideing the wave. Its the pressure of being the top American that has changed Roddicks game. If he was agressive and loosing everyone would be bitching about him makeing to many errors and telling him to not go for so much.

My personal view is that with where his ability level is now the biggest factor is how close he can stay to that baseline and move forward. I dont think he has to necessarily go bigger on shots but he can not get pinned 10 feet behind that basline. Once that happens his whole game is pushing and he is done.

Roddicks current game is safe but wont give him any titles. He should play like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbSRRDQF7YQ

Notice the difference in aggressivness compared to last nights pushing.

DartMarcus
01-25-2010, 05:38 AM
LOL. He has changed his style like 5 years ago. Sometimes he finds he forehand back but than goes back to pushing. I remember some matches where Andy played great aggressive tennis last year. As you see, he isn't really motivated to change this play style, as pushing allows him to beat 95% of tour pretty easily.

serveandvolley80
01-25-2010, 05:45 AM
Notice the huge difference in pace compared to his pushing against Gonzo. In this clip, he is even hitting bh winners!

The courts are slowing down year by year it seems, and even in 2004 it was easier to hit a winner in a place like Australia then it is now, the only thing that sped up was the Rolland Garros clay.

Homogenization of surfaces= Better defensive skills for all players.

brithater
01-25-2010, 06:19 AM
Roddicks current game is safe but wont give him any titles. He should play like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbSRRDQF7YQ

Notice the difference in aggressivness compared to last nights pushing.

I disagree. The current crop of players wont let him play that far back and will eat him up with angles. You also have to take it into context who he is playing. Andre in those days did not go for winners. He pretty much ran guys corner to corner to break them down. He was not looking to end points quickly. The plan was to break guys down.

More important for Andy now to stay close to the baseline than it is to blast. I am all for him taking chances when there is an opening though and cracking the forehand once in a while but I think for him to just start cracking every shot would be a mistake. Its not his natural mindset and this current generation of the tour is all about movement, takeing the ball early, and useing the court.

gjr
01-25-2010, 06:41 AM
Apparently Roddick has lost a fair bit a weight since Stefanki because his coach to improve his movement around the court.

Now, I'm no expert but I can't see Roddick having much excess fat to get rid of so I assume the weight loss was muscle mass. Whereever that muscle mass has come from will mean he will lose some power from somewhere.

:)

brithater
01-25-2010, 09:51 AM
Apparently Roddick has lost a fair bit a weight since Stefanki because his coach to improve his movement around the court.

Now, I'm no expert but I can't see Roddick having much excess fat to get rid of so I assume the weight loss was muscle mass. Whereever that muscle mass has come from will mean he will lose some power from somewhere.

:)

Not necesarily. It is very possible to loose muscle mass and keep strength with sports focussed training. Its more about Muscle density than anything. You will also get a lot quicker. Bulking up in tennis has serious a threshold and if you go past a certain point it can be devistating to a players game. All that muscle can be heavy. I think Roddick slimming down was a very good move.

Mjordan23
01-25-2010, 08:42 PM
Roddick's change in style has its ups and downs. I prefer the way he serves now than he did before. It sets up the point nicely for him and because he doesn't go for so much, his percentage in GS are usually around the 70+% range, which is pretty fucking incredible, even though it (and his game in general) aren't as flashy as it used to be.

His court positioning, backhand, movement, and approaches are a lot better now. It's easy not to pay attention when watching his matches and wonder how on earth he's able to beat opponents during neutral rallies, but these improvements were made specifically to draw and force errors from opponents instead of going riskier winners. He's a great percentage player.

However, I do wish Roddick would occasionally go for bigger shots. Even when the opportunity presents itself he would prefer to dink the ball back in instead of blast an easy forehand and in doing so sometimes makes life a lot more difficult for himself. There's a fine line between being patient and being passive, and too often Roddick chooses the latter. His forehand has also regressed and is one of the worst in the top 20. High bouncing topspin approach shots are fodder for good players, but Roddick keeps trying and keeps getting passed with that shot.

I think the reason his forehand isn't so much an attacking shot anymore is because the modern game has evolved to a point where his monster forehand has just become a weakness. I remember a couple years back when Roddick's game was becoming more what it is today, he'd occasionally go for the big shot and his opponent would get it back over and over again; not only that but because of his horrible court positioning they'd not only get it back but they'd hit winners on the run when retrieving the big shot. Since his movement and positioning are much better than it was years ago, I think he could bring that shot back and not lose because of it, but that's just wishful thinking. His grit, determination, and asshole nature are still as strong as ever, so it's nice to know that some things don't change.

Good post. It`s great to see how much more variation Roddick has to his game now, backhand and movement has improved much. He should be more aggressive with his forehand at times, but it`s good to see how he thinks tennis. Now if only he could stop those stupid crosscourt net approaches....

General Suburbia
01-25-2010, 11:25 PM
The biggest thing I can say about Roddick is his willingness to change pretty much his whole style of gameplay in order to stay at the top of the men's game. I really can't think of any other player who changed their style over the course of their career to the extent that Roddick has.

selyoink
01-26-2010, 12:27 AM
Roddick hasn't had a big forehand in at least 5 years nor has he had an aggressive game at any point in the last 5 years. He is a big serve and retreat way behind the baseline player.

Knightmace
01-26-2010, 12:37 AM
Pretty much. Welcome to 5 years ago with this thread:wavey:

To expand, the guys who have a good record against Fed (other than Nadal obv) are Simon and Murray, pushers through and through. Roddick is attempting to emulate this against Fed with some success.
AND FAILS

swebright
01-26-2010, 02:54 AM
He tried to change but never conquered and move on to next coach. He became famous/won his first slam before he was a complete player. He tried and gave it all but not enough. And then the guy called Federer happened.

SetSampras
01-26-2010, 03:54 AM
He should have just stayed with his old style along with Gilbert. Thats where he was at his best, his deadliest, and had his best results. He isnt a great returner. Doesnt have the talent to be the best baseliner so I wish he would go back to his old strategy.. The way he plays now will not get him slams.. Why?? Because there are some who do it better and when Roddick runs into them more times than not he loses. He was at his best big serving, hitting the big forehand and keeping his opponent on his toes.

SetSampras
01-26-2010, 03:57 AM
Because the game is evolving that way?

The days of serve-FH winner tennis being enough are basically done. To be the best you have to be solid and consistent enough to stay in long rallies. Roddick has improved mightily in that aspect (BH DTL, BH slice).

His FH also was never big enough to win points consistently against the great defenders you have now (Federer, Nadal, Djokovic, Murray being the best examples). Look back at 2003-2004 Roddick. He would barely be top 20 these days.

And Roddick never was or will never be the best at this aspect. There are quite a few players around who are superior to him in this regard. So adopting this style of play didnt improve his career by leaps and bounds. You gotta stick with primarily you are good at it. Adopt some tactics into your game but stick to your bread and butter.. Not totally altar your game to a style you will never great at

ChinoRios4Ever
01-26-2010, 04:10 AM
He's not old and Gonzo hasn't lost power in his forehand.

Yup, but his knees are in real trouble with cronical tendinitis and his shoulder needs many rehab after the tournaments. That's why Gonzo is one of the players who plays less tournaments by year on the tour.

Roddick's style isn't that offensive except for the amazing big serve, now he's more smart on court, his footwork has improved a lot and now is a decent defender. Probably the experience, also i'm agree with Bilbo, he's more older and he lost power too and that's why the change, also he has in Stefanki one of the best coaches, sure he's learning a lot from him.

Fee
01-26-2010, 04:12 AM
Okay then, so we are all agreed: Andy Roddick was a no-talent, nothing but a serve, one slam wonder, but now he's changed his game style and he's become a no-talent, nothing but a serve, one slam wonder with a slice backhand.

SetSampras
01-26-2010, 04:14 AM
Okay then, so we are all agreed: Andy Roddick was a no-talent, nothing but a serve, one slam wonder, but now he's changed his game style and he's become a no-talent, nothing but a serve, one slam wonder with a slice backhand.

He grabbed a slam with the big serve and FH and reached number 1 in the world. Now hes just a consistent top 10 with no slam to his name since 2003. So I dunno. Results dont lie. He had better results before

Kolya
01-26-2010, 04:27 AM
Courier called him a pusher.

bluefork
01-26-2010, 04:39 AM
Okay then, so we are all agreed: Andy Roddick was a no-talent, nothing but a serve, one slam wonder, but now he's changed his game style and he's become a no-talent, nothing but a serve, one slam wonder with a slice backhand.

Other than his serve, Roddick's greatest strength, particularly in the last five years, is his refusal to beat himself. He's done everything he possibly can to maximize his potential (hire a slew of different coaches, improve his backhand and his net game, get himself in the best shape possible), but the fact of the matter is that he doesn't have the natural talent that other players have. He just works a lot harder. This is enough to get him to the second weeks of majors fairly consistently and to stay in the top ten, but his limited game is the reason why he can't win another major. There are just too many guys who work hard AND have more talent than him.

I also think Roddick doesn't really understand tennis very well. It's like coaches tell him he needs to come into net more--so rushes into net without a plan. Or they tell him to get in better shape so he can defend better--so he starts playing defense exclusively. He doesn't seem to get how to put it all together.

River
01-26-2010, 04:44 AM
Other than his serve, Roddick's greatest strength, particularly in the last five years, is his refusal to beat himself. He's done everything he possibly can to maximize his potential (hire a slew of different coaches, improve his backhand and his net game, get himself in the best shape possible), but the fact of the matter is that he doesn't have the natural talent that other players have. He just works a lot harder. This is enough to get him to the second weeks of majors fairly consistently and to stay in the top ten, but his limited game is the reason why he can't win another major. There are just too many guys who work hard AND have more talent than him.

I also think Roddick doesn't really understand tennis very well. It's like coaches tell him he needs to come into net more--so rushes into net without a plan. Or they tell him to get in better shape so he can defend better--so he starts playing defense exclusively. He doesn't seem to get how to put it all together.

I think that also has to do with talent; I do believe that court sense is a part of a player's talent, and because Andy's so limited with his potential, it unfortunately shows.

Though since you put it that way, Brad Gilbert must be proud, considering he didn't have a lot of talent but his hard work paid dividends.

superslam77
01-26-2010, 04:47 AM
because he has lost power. normal when you get older.

NO...it's not power that you lose in your 30's or late 20's but flexibility and speed and reflexes.

Everko
07-29-2010, 03:09 PM
he sucks now. Needs to go back to his old ways. Although I hope he does not because I want him out of top 15 soon

Certinfy
07-29-2010, 03:18 PM
Against Nadal in Miami this year we clearly saw that he still can play aggressive if he wants, which still confuses me why he goes down the route of pushing, it's not like he doesn't have a huge FH anymore. :rolleyes:

Serenidad
07-29-2010, 03:27 PM
As if a win over Nadal on a hardcourt proves you are not a complete clown. 97% of the tour can beat Nadal on a hardcourt with a good day.

Everko
07-29-2010, 03:31 PM
As if a win over Nadal on a hardcourt proves you are not a complete clown. 97% of the tour can beat Nadal on a hardcourt with a good day.

another post added to the worst post of all time list

check into the mental hospital pronto. I have seen Orangutangs in Malaysia make better points about a sport they have no conception of.

Certinfy
07-29-2010, 03:34 PM
As if a win over Nadal on a hardcourt proves you are not a complete clown. 97% of the tour can beat Nadal on a hardcourt with a good day.That's not the point, the point is how aggressive he was in the last set and a half.

Serenidad
07-29-2010, 03:42 PM
So Roddick plays one match in the past 52 weeks aggressively. :shrug: If he could do it all the time, he would be doing it and beating the top of the game more than he does.

He had a good day. Good for him.

Roddick doesn't have the ballstriking talent to consistently play aggressive and take out big names.

Ozone
07-29-2010, 03:48 PM
Actually in Atlanta, Andy looked like he was playing more aggresive finally. But the past 2-3 years, he's been a backboard from the baseline. It really hasn't failed him. He simply isnt talented enough to be aggresive and beat the big boys week in and week out. When he's playing his pushing game at his best, it can honestly beat anyone as he proved in 2009.

Certinfy
07-29-2010, 04:04 PM
So Roddick plays one match in the past 52 weeks aggressively. :shrug: If he could do it all the time, he would be doing it and beating the top of the game more than he does.

He had a good day. Good for him.

Roddick doesn't have the ballstriking talent to consistently play aggressive and take out big names.No, actually he does it in quite a lot of matches when he's down in the score, but I mean he does it and then somehow goes back to pushing.

Serenidad
07-29-2010, 04:07 PM
No, actually he does it in quite a lot of matches when he's down in the score, but I mean he does it and then somehow goes back to pushing.

Which matches has he done this in lately? RG pushed all 3 matches. Wimbledon pushed all 4 matches. AO pushed all 5 matches.

When is this?

Certinfy
07-29-2010, 04:44 PM
Which matches has he done this in lately? RG pushed all 3 matches. Wimbledon pushed all 4 matches. AO pushed all 5 matches.

When is this?Like said above in Atlanta he did some. At the AO he did it a few times, most noticeably when 2 sets to love down against Cilic in the QF, in Brisbane against Berdych he did it a few times, and against Berdych in San Jose he played aggressive when he needed to. I haven't even seen much of his matches this year, but from what I've seen he can still play agressive.

straitup
07-29-2010, 04:54 PM
Which matches has he done this in lately? RG pushed all 3 matches. Wimbledon pushed all 4 matches. AO pushed all 5 matches.

When is this?

At least he's played 3 matches at RG, 4 matches at Wimby, and 5 matches at the AO. :shrug:

He has certainly been aggressive at times, like mentioned with the Cilic AO match, and during the spring hard courts. I think that his "keeping the ball in play" tactic works pretty well for him...maybe it's not too appreciated on here and I don't exactly love watching him all the time, but he can hold easily and then keep the ball in play on return games - that's a tough combo. Hey I would love to see him being as aggressive as when he was younger, but he's still doing fine

Mats68
07-29-2010, 05:26 PM
He served and volleyed on his second serve 5 times at key moments against Nadal in Miami this year. It completely surprised RN and eventually gave him the win.
He's developed a decent slice BH, why doesn't he surprise his opponenents more with some approaches to the net, or bigger FH?

Sapeod
07-29-2010, 05:37 PM
NO...it's not power that you lose in your 30's or late 20's but flexibility and speed and reflexes.
Yeah, I'd think men in their 30s are stronger than men in their 20s. Depends I guess.

Anyway, hope Roddick sticks to this style. Almost out of the top 10 :D

Roddickominator
07-29-2010, 08:56 PM
Other than his serve, Roddick's greatest strength, particularly in the last five years, is his refusal to beat himself. He's done everything he possibly can to maximize his potential (hire a slew of different coaches, improve his backhand and his net game, get himself in the best shape possible), but the fact of the matter is that he doesn't have the natural talent that other players have. He just works a lot harder. This is enough to get him to the second weeks of majors fairly consistently and to stay in the top ten, but his limited game is the reason why he can't win another major. There are just too many guys who work hard AND have more talent than him.

I also think Roddick doesn't really understand tennis very well. It's like coaches tell him he needs to come into net more--so rushes into net without a plan. Or they tell him to get in better shape so he can defend better--so he starts playing defense exclusively. He doesn't seem to get how to put it all together.

This guy got it pretty much right. I give Roddick more credit on the issues in the 2nd paragraph....I just think he'd rather get passed at the net hitting a mediocre approach than hit the approach shot out. I disagree with it myself but he's a stubborn dude.

leng jai
07-29-2010, 09:42 PM
because he has lost power. normal when you get older.

Quality analysis from Bilbo as usual.

MacTheKnife
07-29-2010, 10:18 PM
He never regained his confidence from the 09 wimby. Less confidence = more pushing and cautious play. It's a vicious circle.

brent-o
07-30-2010, 05:49 AM
As if a win over Nadal on a hardcourt proves you are not a complete clown. 97% of the tour can beat Nadal on a hardcourt with a good day.

Ha, those are some mighty convincing stats, I have to admit.

NADALbULLS
07-30-2010, 06:48 AM
97% of the tour can beat Federer on a hardcourt with a good day too. In fact it may be even higher for Federer, like 100% considering the number of unforced errors he hits now, and considering how many of his bunnies are beating him now.