Rome Draw Out [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Rome Draw Out

l_mac
04-25-2009, 11:15 AM
http://www.atpworldtour.com/tennis/en/common/TrackIt.asp?file=/1/posting/2009/416/mds.pdf

[1] NADAL, Rafael ESP vs BYE
SEPPI, Andreas ITA vs QUERREY, Sam USA
SODERLING, Robin SWE vs GRANOLLERS, Marcel ESP
QUALIFIER vs [14] BLAKE, James USA

[9] TSONGA, Jo-Wilfried FRA vs GASQUET, Richard FRA
ALMAGRO, Nicolas ESP vs GULBIS, Ernests LAT
FISH, Mardy USA vs ANDREEV, Igor RUS
BYE vs [6] VERDASCO, Fernando ESP

[4] MURRAY, Andy GBR vs BYE
KIEFER, Nicolas GER vs i]QUALIFIER[/i]
CHELA, Juan Ignacio ARG vs ROCHUS, Christophe BEL
[WC] CIPOLLA, Flavio ITA vs [15] CILIC, Marin CR

[12] GONZALEZ, Fernando CHI vs CHARDY, Jeremy FRA
TIPSAREVIC, Janko SRB vs ACASUSO, Jose ARG
BENNETEAU, Julien FRA vs MELZER, Jurgen AUT
BYE vs [7] DAVYDENKO, Nikolay RUS

[5] DEL POTRO, Juan Martin ARG vs BYE
HANESCU, Victor ROU vs TROICKI, Viktor SRB
QUALIFIER vs QUALIFIER
KUNITSYN, Igor RUS vs [10] WAWRINKA, Stanislas SUI

[13] ROBREDO, Tommy ESP vs SAFIN, Marat RUS
KOHLSCHREIBER, Philipp GER vs BOLELLI, Simone ITA
[WC] STARACE, Potito ITA vs MONTANES, Albert ESP
BYE vs [3] DJOKOVIC, Novak SRB

[8] SIMON, Gilles FRA vs BYE
[WC] FOGNINI, Fabio ITA vs [WC] VOLANDRI, Filippo ITA
QUALIFIER vs BERDYCH, Tomas CZE vs
MATHIEU, Paul-Henri FRA vs [11] FERRER, David ESP

[16] STEPANEK, Radek CZE vs SERRA, Florent FRA
QUALIFIER vs LOPEZ, Feliciano ESP
QUALIFIER vs KARLOVIC, Ivo CRO
BYE vs [2] FEDERER, Roger SUI

adee-gee
04-25-2009, 11:16 AM
Wow, what a shock. Murray in Rafa's half :zzz:

StanisKing
04-25-2009, 11:17 AM
Seppi against Nadal :)

This guy has no luck lately

StanisKing
04-25-2009, 11:18 AM
Tough one for Fed.

scoobs
04-25-2009, 11:19 AM
Play it again, Sam :rolleyes:

Sapeod
04-25-2009, 11:21 AM
Seppi :tape: I feel sorry for the guy. No luck at all.
Kiefer has a lot of luck :lol: a qualifier again :)
Montanes has Djokovic...again :o Damn it.
No Vassallo Arguello :sad:
Murray in Nadal's half :o What a surprise :rolleyes:
Steamroll Nadal Murray :D

ImmzB
04-25-2009, 11:27 AM
Gasquet v Tsonga
Robredo v Safin

rhinooooo
04-25-2009, 11:32 AM
Top half looks very interesting

Stepanek could face Fed again!

ORGASMATRON
04-25-2009, 11:32 AM
Merci madam. Can you add the bottom bracket please that link shows a blank page.

l_mac
04-25-2009, 11:35 AM
Draw now in OP.

petar_pan
04-25-2009, 11:39 AM
cilic always going on top 4 as soon as possible in draw on last 6 masters(except del potro in iw,but he is 5., that is player of same quality).he hasn't no luck at all.

orangehat
04-25-2009, 11:40 AM
wawa-joker again.

FaceyFacem
04-25-2009, 11:40 AM
Good for Novak for sure. And lots of tough players in with Nadal. He will have to work, it seems.

The semis and finals of MC were both intriguing. Would be pleased with the same match-ups in Rome

ORGASMATRON
04-25-2009, 11:41 AM
Mmm possible Fed/Djoker semi, would be interesting...

l_mac
04-25-2009, 11:42 AM
cilic always going on top 4 as soon as possible in draw on last 6 masters(except del potro in iw,but that is player of same quality).he hasn't no luck at all.

:rolleyes: His ranking/seeding mean he will meet one of the top 4 in R3 in a MS event.

petar_pan
04-25-2009, 11:46 AM
:rolleyes: His ranking/seeding mean he will meet one of the top 4 in R3 in a MS event.

no,no man.he has 50%-50% chances to play against top 4 or against players from 5-8(so he wouldn't play against del potro in iw).

finishingmove
04-25-2009, 11:48 AM
federer has a tough draw facing last year's spartans karlovic, stepanek.

Afleet Alex
04-25-2009, 11:50 AM
exact same draw as Monte-Carlo

they need to do it over

zlaja777
04-25-2009, 11:50 AM
Djokovic has a nice draw...hope he reaches final again.

petar_pan
04-25-2009, 11:51 AM
but otherwise it's very possible that cilic go out before murray match because he is in bad form.

kiwi10is
04-25-2009, 11:55 AM
Kiefer has a lot of luck :lol: a qualifier again :)

so much luck to have Murray in 2nd round :yeah:

Garson007
04-25-2009, 11:59 AM
so much luck to have Murray in 2nd round :yeah:
The one that's a clay mug? Easy match for Kiefer.

Pfloyd
04-25-2009, 12:01 PM
Fed could be taken out by Radek again, or Simon, if he gets his game back.

lamnathalie
04-25-2009, 12:01 PM
Gasquet v Tsonga
Oh no...:eek:

Bascule
04-25-2009, 12:02 PM
:lol: The history's repeating. It would be interesting to see the different results this time, but with the same draw.

No one said Fed has the cakewalk draw and Nadal the though one. Funny.:)

ImmzB
04-25-2009, 12:11 PM
Nadal WILL win this!

kiwi10is
04-25-2009, 12:12 PM
The one that's a clay mug? Easy match for Kiefer.

yes the clay mug who only made it to the semis in Monte Carlo.. what a loser

BaselineSmash
04-25-2009, 12:24 PM
I can see Djokovic being drawn away from Nadal in Madrid also, only to end up on his side at RG. As always.

bizzle
04-25-2009, 12:28 PM
QF Murray .vs. Davydenko
SF Murray .vs. Nadal

What a suprise :speakles:

l_mac
04-25-2009, 12:42 PM
no,no man.he has 50%-50% chances to play against top 4 or against players from 5-8(so he wouldn't play against del potro in iw).

No, he doesn't.

1-4 vs 13-16
5-8 vs 9-12

That's 4th round in Slams (and the two bigger MS draws IW and Miami) and 3rd round in normal MS draws.

Cilic was ranked 17 in Miami.

gulzhan
04-25-2009, 12:43 PM
Gasquet v Tsonga
Robredo v Safin

:(

ORGASMATRON
04-25-2009, 12:57 PM
A potential rematch between Murray and Davy should be very interesting. Davy should be ready to tear him a new one this time :drool:

Johnny Groove
04-25-2009, 01:25 PM
federer has a tough draw facing last year's spartans karlovic, stepanek.

That's what I'm sayin. Simon is there too. Fed's potential path to the final:

R2: Karlovic (beat Fed in Cincy 08)
R3: Stepanek (beat Fed in Rome 08)
QF: Simon (beat Fed in Canada and Shanghai 08)
SF: Djokovic (multiple times)
F: Nadal (no other explanation needed)

Roger can score some revenge wins this week.

Nadal-Querrey should be at least slightly intriguing especially on a faster clay surface. Nadal's got some hardcourters in his quarter, but as we saw last year in Rome, anything can happen.

As for Murray, he could make the semis again, but with how Davydenko is playing this week, it'll be tough. Djokovic should make the semis with no problem and I'm interested in how Del Potro does too.

superhoops
04-25-2009, 01:41 PM
Easy draw for the top 4 to get to QF and I expect the top 4 to all be in the Semis.

kingfederer
04-25-2009, 01:55 PM
i hope nadal doesnt play querry, rafa struggles with tall players with good backhands, the topsspin sits up nicely for them to whack it and they get good net clearence as a result of the high topspin. verdasco is in rafa's quarter, i hope rafa can thrash him if they meet so fernando 'hot sauce' verdasco can go and shag his models! rafa has to do well in rome if he wants to gap madrid.

shotgun
04-25-2009, 02:05 PM
Wow, what a shock. Murray in Rafa's half :zzz:

You talk as if Murray were some kind of factor. The guy is heavily dependant on his draw to live up to his seeding.

Will be interesting to see if he can go past the quarters this time.

Merton
04-25-2009, 02:25 PM
You talk as if Murray were some kind of factor. The guy is heavily dependant on his draw to live up to his seeding.

Will be interesting to see if he can go past the quarters this time.

Murray has odds 17:1 to win the French Open (3rd favourite) I think laying him on 17.5:1 looks like a very safe bet.

http://www.betfair.com/?clkID=11108_855BF06A5EA24093AF81CA2EC88CE8&rfr=11108&ttp=111&pi.localeId=en&pi.regionId=GBR&target=portal

Cloudygirl
04-25-2009, 02:31 PM
Are round 1 matches not televised again :( there are some good match ups.

ORGASMATRON
04-25-2009, 02:35 PM
Murray has odds 17:1 to win the French Open (3rd favourite) I think laying him on 17.5:1 looks like a very safe bet.

http://www.betfair.com/?clkID=11108_855BF06A5EA24093AF81CA2EC88CE8&rfr=11108&ttp=111&pi.localeId=en&pi.regionId=GBR&target=portal

:haha: I see the bookies havent learned jack from the AO :o

shotgun
04-25-2009, 03:00 PM
Murray has odds 17:1 to win the French Open (3rd favourite) I think laying him on 17.5:1 looks like a very safe bet.

http://www.betfair.com/?clkID=11108_855BF06A5EA24093AF81CA2EC88CE8&rfr=11108&ttp=111&pi.localeId=en&pi.regionId=GBR&target=portal

Unbelievable that Murray is ahead of Djokovic. :lol:

Clydey
04-25-2009, 03:00 PM
:haha: I see the bookies havent learned jack from the AO :o

The bookies were supposed to anticipate that he would come down with a virus?

ORGASMATRON
04-25-2009, 03:05 PM
The bookies were supposed to anticipate that he would come down with a virus?

You think thats why he lost?

Clydey
04-25-2009, 03:05 PM
Unbelievable that Murray is ahead of Djokovic. :lol:

I'm assuming Betfair are British based, so it's not so surprising if that's the case. British bookies aren't exactly great at business. They let their heart rule their head a lot of the time.

I remember when England lost to Portugal at the European Championships. The public kicked up a fuss about a disallowed John Terry goal, if I remember right (goal was rightly chopped off). The bookies actually paid out to the people who had bet on England to win. That's how pathetic these people are.

Clydey
04-25-2009, 03:10 PM
You think thats why he lost?

I think it had a lot to do with it. I don't think you can just disregard an illness that stopped him from practicing since before the Melzer match and kept him in bed pretty much the whole time. A lot of people are either unaware or just ignore the fact that he was clearly run down.

Let's say Federer came down with the same virus, was bed bound and couldn't practice. I'm sure you would take those circumstances into account. It's a bit harsh on Murray to keep bringing up the Verdasco match as though it was a level playing field.

shotgun
04-25-2009, 03:11 PM
I'm assuming Betfair are British based, so it's not so surprising if that's the case. British bookies aren't exactly great at business. They let their heart rule their head a lot of the time.

I remember when England lost to Portugal at the European Championships. The public kicked up a fuss about a disallowed John Terry goal, if I remember right (goal was rightly chopped off). The bookies actually paid out to the people who had bet on England to win. That's how pathetic these people are.

OMG. :lol:

Yeah, there's a lot of nationalism when it comes to British based bookies, also a lot of money going in from patriotic British gamblers that end up influencing the odds.

Clydey
04-25-2009, 03:14 PM
OMG. :lol:

Yeah, there's a lot of nationalism when it comes to British based bookies, also a lot of money going in from patriotic British gamblers that end up influencing the odds.

Exactly. A lot of it is based on hopeless optimism, rather than expectation.

Aenea
04-25-2009, 03:32 PM
I think it had a lot to do with it. I don't think you can just disregard an illness that stopped him from practicing since before the Melzer match and kept him in bed pretty much the whole time. A lot of people are either unaware or just ignore the fact that he was clearly run down.

Let's say Federer came down with the same virus, was bed bound and couldn't practice. I'm sure you would take those circumstances into account. It's a bit harsh on Murray to keep bringing up the Verdasco match as though it was a level playing field.

I reckon post match Murray had said he never felt in danger in that Verdasco match. How can you be ill with a virus deprived from practicing and still not feel in danger against an opponent who has taken you to a 5th set?

finishingmove
04-25-2009, 03:36 PM
backing roddick @400 to win the french looks sound.

Clydey
04-25-2009, 03:44 PM
I reckon post match Murray had said he never felt in danger in that Verdasco match. How can you be ill with a virus deprived from practicing and still not feel in danger against an opponent who has taken you to a 5th set?

I'm not sure what the suggestions is. That he wasn't ill or that it had no bearing on the result? Well, we know he was ill. It came out prior to the Melzer match. It's not as if this all came out after he lost. It was well before.

He was in a 5th set and probably still thought he was going to win. I don't see what that has to do with the illness. He clearly thought he could still win despite how he felt.

Like I said, this was all well-documented. I can provide you with some links if you want. You can ignore his illness if you want, but it doesn't change the fact that he was in fact unwell. It's becoming pretty tedious having to explain this to people. When their favourite player is ill or injured, they are only too happy to make excuses, but when it comes to other players they just won't accept certain inconvenient truths.

star
04-25-2009, 03:44 PM
Rome draw thread turns into the Why Andy Murray Didn't Win the AO thread? :cuckoo:

desigundah
04-25-2009, 03:46 PM
What a horrible draw for Federer. Ivo who beat him last year in Cincinatti. Then Worm who beat him here in Rome, then Ferrer or Simon who beat him twice last year, then Djokovic and then Rafa. Brutal. Nadal by contrast has such a cakewalk draw. Blake and Tsonga on clay? Then that mental fuckup Verdasco and then Murray or Kolya. So easy.

kingfederer
04-25-2009, 03:49 PM
this is eaxctly y everyone wants the british to lose at everything. u win a few matches n u r the goat.

miura
04-25-2009, 03:51 PM
Cakewalk draw for Federer :sport:

Crazy Girl
04-25-2009, 03:55 PM
Davydenko is on the side of Nadal.
Have I well understood?
If Yes..., I'm always very happy when Niko and Roger are on the opposite sides!!!

Aenea
04-25-2009, 03:56 PM
I'm not sure what the suggestions is. That he wasn't ill or that it had no bearing on the result?

That. And you better drop this excuse. It's really embarrassing. I could go on and underestimate Murray's win in Rotterdam over Nadal citing Rafa's injury and though he had pains in his knee he still managed to win a set, Murray practically beat a one legged Nadal etc. But I wouldn't do that.

Now back on topic. Rafa's half looks more difficult than the one in MC but I still think he will win Rome since I saw him playing Barcelona and he looks much more confident and plays better than in MC.

LinkMage
04-25-2009, 04:00 PM
Wow, what a shock. Murray in Rafa's half :zzz:

Djokovic is better than Murray on clay. Rafito got an easier draw there. :shrug:

Lee
04-25-2009, 04:09 PM
That's what I'm sayin. Simon is there too. Fed's potential path to the final:

R2: Karlovic (beat Fed in Cincy 08)
R3: Stepanek (beat Fed in Rome 08)
QF: Simon (beat Fed in Canada and Shanghai 08)
SF: Djokovic (multiple times)
F: Nadal (no other explanation needed)

Roger can score some revenge wins this week.

Nadal-Querrey should be at least slightly intriguing especially on a faster clay surface. Nadal's got some hardcourters in his quarter, but as we saw last year in Rome, anything can happen.

As for Murray, he could make the semis again, but with how Davydenko is playing this week, it'll be tough. Djokovic should make the semis with no problem and I'm interested in how Del Potro does too.


I doubt Simon will reach QF. Fed's potential QF opponent is likely Ferrer. Simon may not even pass Fognini :o

Clydey
04-25-2009, 04:11 PM
That. And you better drop this excuse. It's really embarrassing. I could go on and underestimate Murray's win in Rotterdam over Nadal citing Rafa's injury and though he had pains in his knee he still managed to win a set, Murray practically beat a one legged Nadal etc. But I wouldn't do that.


You just did, genius.

And Murray won the first set before Nadal was injured. Rafa got injured in the second. The fact is Rafa's knee should be used an excuse for that match. It killed it as a contest and made the last two sets irrelevant.

angry1
04-25-2009, 04:13 PM
Djokovic is better than Murray on clay. Rafito got an easier draw there. :shrug:

Surely that was a moan on Murray's behalf,Rafa will hardly be quaking in his boots.

star
04-25-2009, 04:18 PM
Djokovic is better than Murray on clay. Rafito got an easier draw there. :shrug:

I think maybe the concern is that Murray didn't get the easier draw. ;)

angry1
04-25-2009, 04:22 PM
Can someone show me where anybody British has remotely suggested Murray will win this or the FO?I see a lot of whining about it but no evidence of it.

Betfair's quoted odds which most of you are able to exploit the error of if you wish,suggest about a a 94% certainty he won't win the French.I would put it at 98%,the majority of the 2% being thwe chance of injury to Nadal.The difference is hardly worth branding a whole nation(many of whom don't even like Murray)presumptious and by implication stupid.Murray's results at MC were a lot closer to the "might fluke a semi" his fans predicted than most experts on here's guesses.

desigundah
04-25-2009, 04:24 PM
Djokovic is better than Murray on clay. Rafito got an easier draw there. :shrug:

Murray got lucky facing a few scrubs really. Kiefer is well over 30 and got destroyed by Beck a couple weeks ago. Then Rochus or Chela and then most likely Cilic who lost 6-1 6-0 to Fognini. Murray will glide into the quarters where he'll get schooled by Gonzo or Kolya. Only thing is Gonzo doesn't have a history of playing well back to back weeks and Kolya has played a lot of tennis the past 2 weeks considering the fact that he was out of action for months.

Clydey
04-25-2009, 04:25 PM
Can someone show me where anybody British has remotely suggested Murray will win this or the FO?I see a lot of whining about it but no evidence of it.

Betfair's quoted odds which most of you are able to exploit the error of if you wish,suggest about a a 94% certainty he won't win the French.I would put it at 98%,the majority of the 2% being thwe chance of injury to Nadal.The difference is hardly worth branding a whole nation(many of whom don't even like Murray)presumptious and by implication stupid.Murray's results at MC were a lot closer to the "might fluke a semi" his fans predicted than most experts on here's guesses.

It's the notion that he is 3rd favourite, ahead of Djokovic, that people are moaning about. I don't think anyone thinks he can win it.

Daniel
04-25-2009, 04:26 PM
Federer will win this one :)

Johnny Groove
04-25-2009, 04:26 PM
Murray got lucky facing a few scrubs really. Kiefer is well over 30 and got destroyed by Beck a couple weeks ago. Then Rochus or Chela and then most likely Cilic who lost 6-1 6-0 to Fognini. Murray will glide into the quarters where he'll get schooled by Gonzo or Kolya. Only thing is Gonzo doesn't have a history of playing well back to back weeks and Kolya has played a lot of tennis the past 2 weeks considering the fact that he was out of action for months.

Unless Pico Monaco qualifies, gets some lucky in placement, beats Kiefer in the first round, and upsets Muzza in the 2nd.

Clydey
04-25-2009, 04:27 PM
Murray got lucky facing a few scrubs really. Kiefer is well over 30 and got destroyed by Beck a couple weeks ago. Then Rochus or Chela and then most likely Cilic who lost 6-1 6-0 to Fognini. Murray will glide into the quarters where he'll get schooled by Gonzo or Kolya. Only thing is Gonzo doesn't have a history of playing well back to back weeks and Kolya has played a lot of tennis the past 2 weeks considering the fact that he was out of action for months.

Nicely done. You're right no matter what happens, then. You've predicted a Murray beating, yet you've got your excuses in early just in case he beats those guys.

You're smart.

finishingmove
04-25-2009, 04:30 PM
murray will probably reach the semis here.

what's the fuss about?

yellowboy906
04-25-2009, 04:33 PM
That. And you better drop this excuse. It's really embarrassing. I could go on and underestimate Murray's win in Rotterdam over Nadal citing Rafa's injury and though he had pains in his knee he still managed to win a set, Murray practically beat a one legged Nadal etc. But I wouldn't do that.

of course you wouldn't give any excuse about a mm final. if murray beat a one leg nadal in a grand slam final, i'm sure you wouldn't just let it go.:wavey:

angry1
04-25-2009, 04:33 PM
It's the notion that he is 3rd favourite, ahead of Djokovic, that people are moaning about. I don't think anyone thinks he can win it.

I don't either.The slight difference in odds could just as easily be down to a perception that Murray has a better chance of being no.2 seed at the French.

Incidentally oddschecker lists several British based bookies and they by a margin of 5-1 make Djokovic shorter for the French.Both Irish bookies make Djokovic shorter too.I still don't get the anger of some about something so supremely unimportant as betting position though.

yellowboy906
04-25-2009, 04:36 PM
Djokovic is better than Murray on clay. Rafito got an easier draw there. :shrug:

i think that guy probably doesn't want murray to play nadal on clay.

Rafa = Fed Killa
04-25-2009, 04:36 PM
Federer will win this one :)

drugs are bad

Guy Haines
04-25-2009, 04:53 PM
I doubt Simon will reach QF. Fed's potential QF opponent is likely Ferrer. Simon may not even pass Fognini :o

I wish you weren't right on all counts, but I think you are.

Total role-reversal with many Federer fans starting to act like scaredy-cat Nadal fans of old. :lol: at anyone trying to present Karlovic as a clay threat.

Tho I would love to see Steps make lightning strike twice.

I'm kind of surprised Tsonga is even playing. He should be training on grass. Clay is a waste of time for him.

~*BGT*~
04-25-2009, 04:55 PM
Murray has odds 17:1 to win the French Open (3rd favourite) I think laying him on 17.5:1 looks like a very safe bet.

http://www.betfair.com/?clkID=11108_855BF06A5EA24093AF81CA2EC88CE8&rfr=11108&ttp=111&pi.localeId=en&pi.regionId=GBR&target=portal

What? A man who's never won a clay tournament is not 3rd favorite for the most prestigious of them all? :haha: Sharapova could beat Murray on clay. :o

LinkMage
04-25-2009, 04:56 PM
i think that guy probably doesn't want murray to play nadal on clay.

Well, then he can tank before facing Nadal. But he would have to play Nadal no matter where he is on the draw to win, doesn't change much if it is in the semis or the final.

But Rafatards were always whining last year when Djokovic was on Rafito's side. This year Djokovic is mostly on the other side and they whine about Murray being on his half. Who understands them? Rafito can't play Schuttler in every semi he plays. :cuckoo:

yellowboy906
04-25-2009, 04:59 PM
i think fognini is actually a pretty good clay court player. any player who beat cilic 6-1 6-0 is pretty good i guess. he was also up 5-0 against murray. any player who could get a 5-0 lead on murray is pretty good especially the murray this year.

christallh24
04-25-2009, 05:02 PM
Fed could be taken out by Radek again, or Simon, if he gets his game back.

Roger won't get taken out by Radek, Roger won't get taken out by Simon, Roger will reach the finals.

Nadal WILL win this!

Why tempt fate by boldly stating this?


SF Murray .vs. Nadal

What a suprise :speakles:

:lol:

This will be their forth time meeting this year if that happens. Geez, we went from Rafa/Roger meeting consecutive times during tournaments, now we could go to Rafa/Andy. If they both reach the semis, I doubt this will be the last time they meet this year. Who would have thought we'd go from Rafa/Roger meeting the most to Rafa/Andy?

Federer will win this one :)

Good for him! It would be his first Masters Series win since...when, again? I can't remember.:confused: And I'm not being facetious here, I just honestly can't remember.

star
04-25-2009, 05:05 PM
I think Murray has his best shot at winning a clay title this season at Rome. Rome traditionally plays much faster than MC or RG. This is where Sampras won his red clay title. It's better for a hardcourt specialist than the other clay tournaments (don't know how Madrid will play yet.)

Guy Haines
04-25-2009, 05:06 PM
Rafito can't play Schuttler in every semi he plays. :cuckoo:

Just like JesusFed can't always play Bjorkman in every semi.

I think of Djokovic and Murray as equal tests right now on clay in semis, Djokovic maybe a bit more of one. On hard courts, Djokovic's familiarity with Nadal's game and point-construction patterns helps him. On clay he isn't as assured in that way, even though he;'s the #2 clay player.

The Murray-worry amongst Nadal fans comes from the fact that Murray has been improving the most of all the top players near Rafa. Murray's performance in the second set of the MC semi showed that he isn't trifling.

It's frustrating that Djokovic and Murray can't meet in a clay semi.

yellowboy906
04-25-2009, 05:08 PM
Well, then he can tank before facing Nadal. But he would have to play Nadal no matter where he is on the draw to win, doesn't change much if it is in the semis or the final.

But Rafatards were always whining last year when Djokovic was on Rafito's side. This year Djokovic is mostly on the other side and they whine about Murray being on his half. Who understands them? Rafito can't play Schuttler in every semi he plays. :cuckoo:

what kind of idiot tank just to avoid nadal? playing nadal more on clay will also help your game on clay. i think murray has the game to beat nadal though. if he can develop his game more, maybe he can beat nadal on clay. murray just have to learn to move better on clay and add a little more power and he'd be nasty.

ORGASMATRON
04-25-2009, 05:18 PM
I think it had a lot to do with it. I don't think you can just disregard an illness that stopped him from practicing since before the Melzer match and kept him in bed pretty much the whole time. A lot of people are either unaware or just ignore the fact that he was clearly run down.

Let's say Federer came down with the same virus, was bed bound and couldn't practice. I'm sure you would take those circumstances into account. It's a bit harsh on Murray to keep bringing up the Verdasco match as though it was a level playing field.

Ok

Matt01
04-25-2009, 05:21 PM
Good for him! It would be his first Masters Series win since...when, again? I can't remember.:confused: And I'm not being facetious here, I just honestly can't remember.


Cincy 2007 I think. That's almost 2 years now :sobbing:

nkhera1
04-25-2009, 05:22 PM
Did Roddick pull out or what? I understand he just got married but could he really use that as his excuse?

LinkMage
04-25-2009, 05:30 PM
what kind of idiot tank just to avoid nadal? playing nadal more on clay will also help your game on clay. i think murray has the game to beat nadal though. if he can develop his game more, maybe he can beat nadal on clay. murray just have to learn to move better on clay and add a little more power and he'd be nasty.

I'm not saying Murray should tank. You said that Adam (adee-gee) doesn't want Murray to play Rafito on clay, then I just said he should hope Murray tanks before the match to avoid facing him. ;)

rocketassist
04-25-2009, 05:43 PM
Just like JesusFed can't always play Bjorkman in every semi.

I think of Djokovic and Murray as equal tests right now on clay in semis, Djokovic maybe a bit more of one. On hard courts, Djokovic's familiarity with Nadal's game and point-construction patterns helps him. On clay he isn't as assured in that way, even though he;'s the #2 clay player.

The Murray-worry amongst Nadal fans comes from the fact that Murray has been improving the most of all the top players near Rafa. Murray's performance in the second set of the MC semi showed that he isn't trifling.

It's frustrating that Djokovic and Murray can't meet in a clay semi.

Federer is still no 2 on clay.

christallh24
04-25-2009, 05:46 PM
Cincy 2007 I think. That's almost 2 years now :sobbing:

Really?! Wow! Roger! :hug:

Rocketassist, Roger was the second best on clay. I'm really curious to see if that is still the case. I really hope he does better than MC.

sammy01
04-25-2009, 06:00 PM
i wouldn't be suprised to see a repeat of the MC semis except ferrer will be the 'suprise' semi finalist not stan from feds section.

fred perry
04-25-2009, 06:12 PM
soderling up for bagels and bread sticks in Rome?

Mechlan
04-25-2009, 06:13 PM
Long as we're making predictions, I would be surprised to see Roger losing early again. Djokovic or Nadal will probably take him out. Murray/Nadal will be the best match this tournament.

morningglory
04-25-2009, 06:56 PM
Federer Vs Karlovic R2 :devil:

morningglory
04-25-2009, 07:01 PM
Really?! Wow! Roger! :hug:

Rocketassist, Roger was the second best on clay. I'm really curious to see if that is still the case. I really hope he does better than MC.

The operative word there :lol: Kuerten WAS the best on clay... Muster WAS the best on clay...
The current second best player on clay, rankings be darned, clearly should not have lost to Wawrinka in straight sets while shanking the ball dozens of time.

Corey Feldman
04-25-2009, 08:00 PM
this week Rafa was the unlucky one to get Murray in his half

Stefwhit
04-25-2009, 08:16 PM
^So are we really considering Murray more of a threat on clay than Djokovic? What's caused this sudden switch of thinking cuz in my eyes Djoko > Murray on clay- what's changed?

Corey Feldman
04-25-2009, 08:30 PM
^So are we really considering Murray more of a threat on clay than Djokovic? What's caused this sudden switch of thinking cuz in my eyes Djoko > Murray on clay- what's changed?

Nope

Imo its Murray > Nadal > Djoko

Stensland
04-25-2009, 08:33 PM
watch kiefer take out murray in r2. :)

christallh24
04-25-2009, 09:27 PM
The operative word there :lol: Kuerten WAS the best on clay... Muster WAS the best on clay...
The current second best player on clay, rankings be darned, clearly should not have lost to Wawrinka in straight sets while shanking the ball dozens of time.

Well, it's not the first time Roger lost to someone surprising. Karlovic. To be fair, Monte Carlo was the first clay tournament. Let's see what Roger's form is come Rome.

BTW, there will come a day :hysteric: that Rafa will be the...was.

nkhera1
04-25-2009, 09:35 PM
Plus it seems kinda like a last minute entry for Federer so I don't think he had his heart fully into it. He probably just accepted a wild card just to see how he would do. I expect him to be much better prepared for Rome. I don't think he will get challenged until he gets to Ferrer depending on how much Ferrer expends in the Barca final.

ORGASMATRON
04-25-2009, 09:38 PM
Nope

Imo its Murray > Nadal > Djoko

Denial is always easier then facing reality, but it doesnt mean its better. Just look at Fed.

Acer
04-25-2009, 09:43 PM
^So are we really considering Murray more of a threat on clay than Djokovic? What's caused this sudden switch of thinking cuz in my eyes Djoko > Murray on clay- what's changed?

Nadal gets Murray in his half in two clay tournaments => Murray > Djokovic on clay

(your average Rafatard's logic)

christallh24
04-25-2009, 09:51 PM
Plus it seems kinda like a last minute entry for Federer so I don't think he had his heart fully into it. He probably just accepted a wild card just to see how he would do. I expect him to be much better prepared for Rome. I don't think he will get challenged until he gets to Ferrer depending on how much Ferrer expends in the Barca final.

True. Roger did seem a bit...appatheic toward the whole thing. I'm sure he was disappointed, but I still don't think he wanted to be there.

Oh, and can someone tell me what < < means? Does it mean better than?

Deboogle!.
04-25-2009, 10:13 PM
Did Roddick pull out or what? I understand he just got married but could he really use that as his excuse?he's allegedly still on his honeymoon and was probably never planning to play, despite what he said at IW (which was obviously a lie :lol: ). He can give whatever reason he wants, he is one of the few who played enough matches by the beginning of the season to withdraw from one required 1000 event with no consequences

Arhaych
04-25-2009, 10:21 PM
Mmm possible Fed/Djoker semi, would be interesting...

I'm sure we all entertained the same thought after the MC draw was released, before the Swiss Shanker revealed himself, and no, that's not Cockney slang.

Can't see past Rafa, can you? Although nice to hear this surface plays quickly, gives me hope for a non-Rafa winner.

nkhera1
04-25-2009, 10:27 PM
he's allegedly still on his honeymoon and was probably never planning to play, despite what he said at IW (which was obviously a lie :lol: ). He can give whatever reason he wants, he is one of the few who played enough matches by the beginning of the season to withdraw from one required 1000 event with no consequences

I didn't know that it was possible to withdraw from a 1000 with no consequences. Its a shame because this is the surface where he can probably do his best work on clay, but then again I would spend as much time as possible on my honeymoon if I were married to Brooklyn Decker.

Clydey
04-25-2009, 10:33 PM
I didn't know that it was possible to withdraw from a 1000 with no consequences. Its a shame because this is the surface where he can probably do his best work on clay, but then again I would spend as much time as possible on my honeymoon if I were married to Brooklyn Decker.

Monte Carlo is no longer mandatory, so that's why there would be no consequences.

nkhera1
04-25-2009, 10:36 PM
Monte Carlo is no longer mandatory, so that's why there would be no consequences.

Im talking about Rome

delpiero7
04-25-2009, 10:37 PM
I really don't understand the relevance of arguing whether Nadal is lucky for not getting certain players in his quarter/half in a clay court tourney.

He's repeatedly owned everyone on this surface over the last 5 years, and the one dangerous player that he is yet to play against on clay pulled out of playing him this week like a farking pansy.

The end story is that any result other than a tournament victory in a clay court event is a bad result for Nadal, so if he were to lose would it make a difference if it were in the QF, SF or F?

He wouldn't be massively physically affected by playing epics in the earlier rounds anyway, seeing as he's got much more physical prowess than everyone else.

Talk of Nadal's draw in clay tournaments should be banned. Unless he has a draw of Coria, Muster, Kuerten, Borg and Vilas in which case it would possibly be worthy of discussion.

kingfederer
04-25-2009, 10:45 PM
who the heck is this murray guy? what a tosser, the guy gets a lucky draw and the british media and fans declare him the greatest spotsman along side lewis hamilton. and british people wonder why britain is one of the most disliked and unpopular nations on earth?? pretty soon brits will be nominating simon reed as prime minister, and say he is the smartest guy on earth.

just unreal!
*sigh*

Deboogle!.
04-25-2009, 10:53 PM
I didn't know that it was possible to withdraw from a 1000 with no consequences. Its a shame because this is the surface where he can probably do his best work on clay, but then again I would spend as much time as possible on my honeymoon if I were married to Brooklyn Decker.If you read the rulebook carefully, there are exemptions for players who have achieved a certain number of things (age, years on tour...), and one of those is if you had played 500 matches by the start of the season. Andy had played 500 singles matches at the start of 2009. So, he is allowed to pull out of one event without consequence (unless many of us have misread the rules, which of course is entirely possible :lol: ). Roger would be in this same position, I believe; I think they're the only ones in the top 10 who'd qualify right now. Anyway, it's stupid, but he's the only one who suffers, so, that is his choice. It's too bad his fans care more about him doing well on clay than he does, but oh well :lol:

nkhera1
04-25-2009, 11:00 PM
If you read the rulebook carefully, there are exemptions for players who have achieved a certain number of things (age, years on tour...), and one of those is if you had played 500 matches by the start of the season. Andy had played 500 singles matches at the start of 2009. So, he is allowed to pull out of one event without consequence (unless many of us have misread the rules, which of course is entirely possible :lol: ). Roger would be in this same position, I believe; I think they're the only ones in the top 10 who'd qualify right now. Anyway, it's stupid, but he's the only one who suffers, so, that is his choice. It's too bad his fans care more about him doing well on clay than he does, but oh well :lol:

Yeah I feel like he has kind of given up on that surface but with the way his game is going I feel more hopeful about him on this surface than ever though I guess sliding will be the big issue. It's hard to see him get back into the top 5 without a somewhat decent clay season. Maybe the clay season gets his confidence down (though he has done well at Wimbledon after tough clay seasons) or it messes with his game somehow and he would rather focus more on the faster surfaces. I definitely can't question his commitment.


edit: So does that mean he gets one automatic withdrawal every year. If so that is quite handy.

angry1
04-25-2009, 11:04 PM
who the heck is this murray guy? what a tosser, the guy gets a lucky draw and the british media and fans declare him the greatest spotsman along side lewis hamilton. and british people wonder why britain is one of the most disliked and unpopular nations on earth?? pretty soon brits will be nominating simon reed as prime minister, and say he is the smartest guy on earth.

just unreal!
*sigh*

How does what's said about him make Murray a tosser?Because if praise does that, then you must have been lauded hugely on a daily basis for years.

kingfederer
04-25-2009, 11:07 PM
How does what's said about him make Murray a tosser?Because if praise does that, then you must have been lauded hugely on a daily basis for years.

yea simon reed saying everyone fear murray is praise, this is exactly y i NEVER EVER support britain in ANYTHING. murray then comes out and says he will definitely be number 1, what arrogance. never liked murray, he just looks like a dehydrated dog to me!

ugh

angry1
04-25-2009, 11:15 PM
yea simon reed saying everyone fear murray is praise, this is exactly y i NEVER EVER support britain in ANYTHING. murray then comes out and says he will definitely be number 1, what arrogance. never liked murray, he just looks like a dehydrated dog to me!

ugh

Where the hell did he say that?If that's true he's bloody daft.The closest I've seen was when he said if he wins 86% of his service games and 40% of his return games he would be number 1.As he knew he couldn't keep that rate up it was hardly a promise.He had as good a week as he could have hoped for last week and still dropped off that pace.

christallh24
04-25-2009, 11:22 PM
Aww, Kingfederer, Andy is a good enough kid. Although, I do think he is a threat to Rafa, which kinda scares me, but other than that...

Plus, he really likes Rafa. That endears me to him. And it's not his fault that others are tooting his horn.

delpiero7
04-25-2009, 11:25 PM
who the heck is this murray guy? what a tosser, the guy gets a lucky draw and the british media and fans declare him the greatest spotsman along side lewis hamilton. and british people wonder why britain is one of the most disliked and unpopular nations on earth?? pretty soon brits will be nominating simon reed as prime minister, and say he is the smartest guy on earth.

just unreal!
*sigh*

ROFL, can you please provide a link to a credible article (not written by a deluded fanboy) that claims that Murray is the greatest sportsman? The hype about Hamilton is/was kind of understandable given his age etc and that he won the world championship, although the fact that he had the best car for two years was overlooked in favour of worshipping Hamilton.

The only reason why there is hype about Murray is because he is a very good tennis player. It's not as though winning 3 Masters Series and reaching a GS final at 21 is a common occurence for every tennis player, no matter where they come from. This, combined with the fact that he is currently the ONLY successful Brit player and there is bound to be media coverage.

I'm sure the same happens in Australia (as it would in any other nation) if a young Aussie cricketer / rugby player / Aussie Rules (LMAO) player experiences a chunk of success - he'll get media coverage and be hyped up in Australia. Not really a hard concept to understand, and not really an argument to base a hatred of Britain upon.

habibko
04-25-2009, 11:42 PM
tricky draw for Roger :unsure: I'm eager to see how his form will be like.

kingfederer
04-25-2009, 11:55 PM
ROFL, can you please provide a link to a credible article (not written by a deluded fanboy) that claims that Murray is the greatest sportsman? The hype about Hamilton is/was kind of understandable given his age etc and that he won the world championship, although the fact that he had the best car for two years was overlooked in favour of worshipping Hamilton.

The only reason why there is hype about Murray is because he is a very good tennis player. It's not as though winning 3 Masters Series and reaching a GS final at 21 is a common occurence for every tennis player, no matter where they come from. This, combined with the fact that he is currently the ONLY successful Brit player and there is bound to be media coverage.

I'm sure the same happens in Australia (as it would in any other nation) if a young Aussie cricketer / rugby player / Aussie Rules (LMAO) player experiences a chunk of success - he'll get media coverage and be hyped up in Australia. Not really a hard concept to understand, and not really an argument to base a hatred of Britain upon.

most countries when they do get a talent, they dont proclaim he is the greatest and that everyone fears him, unlike some worshipped brits in britain like simon reed and barr flatman ir whatever from timesonline! some sucess for a british sportsman and they are instantly named the greatest ever by the british media. murray is favourite for this and that and nadal fears murray on clay, murray is greater than federer, murray should get laureus award and murray this and murray that and u realise he hasnt done jack, for the hype of greatest ever tag!

Roddickominator
04-26-2009, 12:08 AM
Time for Sam to take down Nadal.

FedFan_2007
04-26-2009, 12:09 AM
Steps to take out Federer again with a brilliant S/V display.

philosophicalarf
04-26-2009, 01:38 AM
Federer is still no 2 on clay.

He's not even top10 on anything based on recent performances.

tangerine_dream
04-26-2009, 03:17 AM
Roddick is still on his honeymoon so that's one obstacle out of Rafa's way.

~Maya~
04-26-2009, 03:27 AM
Roddick is still on his honeymoon so that's one obstacle out of Rafa's way.

Rafa's luck is just endless :p

morningglory
04-26-2009, 03:30 AM
my my my... even some Fed fans have defected to Nadal's side? Although they didn't bother changing their user names :o sad when a "fed fan" has more faith in Stepanek than in him :lol:

rafa_maniac
04-26-2009, 03:44 AM
Nadal gets Murray in his half in two clay tournaments => Murray > Djokovic on clay

(your average Rafatard's logic)

I'm confused, this thread has been full of people laughing at Rafatards wariness of playing Murray on clay, yet I haven't seen a single comment from a Rafa fan mentioning anything remotely of the sort :scratch:

azza
04-26-2009, 03:48 AM
Karlovic Federer :unsure:

habibko
04-26-2009, 03:53 AM
Karlovic Federer :unsure:

what about it? they played on hard courts this year, it's easier on clay.

I'm more worried about Sexy and Ferrer :unsure:

kingfederer
04-26-2009, 05:45 AM
is sexy still shagging nicole vaidisova?

ORGASMATRON
04-26-2009, 05:53 AM
is sexy still shagging nicole vaidisova?

No she caught him cheating on her with Korda.

Ad Wim
04-26-2009, 08:52 AM
tricky draw for Roger :unsure: I'm eager to see how his form will be like.

Tricky draw?! :haha:

He has by far the easiest draw with all mugs near him and the easiest of the top 8 players.

MIMIC
04-26-2009, 08:53 AM
ANY draw is considered tricky for Federer. He's losing to just about everyone these days.

christallh24
04-26-2009, 09:26 AM
Roger has lost to Rafa, Nole, Andy and a top twenty player. Hardly anything to hang his head about.

kingfederer
04-26-2009, 09:54 AM
federer is a mental midget, anytime anyone gives him a little challenge he cannot overcome it and he crumbles. he is mentally very weak person as seen by his constant crying and lack of will power to hold his emotions in check. he cannot face challnges, he is too afraid.

Matt01
04-26-2009, 10:59 AM
Roddick is still on his honeymoon so that's one obstacle out of Rafa's way.


What's his punishment for not playing Rome?

christallh24
04-26-2009, 11:00 AM
Rafa has cried, too. Okay, maybe not boo-hoo crying and runny nose, but he's had tears in his eyes.

Alright, I tried my best to defend Roger, but I don't like the crying. I wish he would stop.

And I don't think it's anyone that challenges him. It's mostly, like I said above, Rafa, Nole and Andy.

dijus
04-26-2009, 01:17 PM
Volandri is back :inlove:

:lol:

murray_2k8
04-26-2009, 04:39 PM
this is eaxctly y everyone wants the british to lose at everything. u win a few matches n u r the goat.

Oh really...I thought its coz we used to rule half the world.... Including Australia ;)

Aenea
04-26-2009, 05:37 PM
Unless Pico Monaco qualifies, gets some lucky in placement, beats Kiefer in the first round, and upsets Muzza in the 2nd.

:D

Take a look at the draw, Jonathan.

Johnny Groove
04-26-2009, 05:38 PM
:D

Take a look at the draw, Jonathan.

I saw it :devil: We'll see what happens :devil:

Hopefully Pico can finish the job from Miami.

alfonsojose
04-26-2009, 06:05 PM
No she caught him cheating on her with Korda.

Sexy has to stay away from Korda's juicy fluids :eek:

StanisKing
04-26-2009, 06:19 PM
Fed has dificult draw.
Not dificult from the quality opponents but all of these guys really have the game that doesn't give lot of rhytm( Ivo, Sexy) or he is having priblems playing them (Simon).
But don't write him off, he is just a click away from a good form.

As for other, Djokovic has the players he really owns in his quarter (Robredo, my favourite, Delpo).
Murray not good at all, Gonzo is in very good form,everyone here overlooks him, I predict him to make the semis here-only if he passes Tipsarevic.Last year their match was full of broken raquets.

Rafa- every draw is easy for him. He is just God on clay courts.And even he is not playing that well as last year in Paris.

Aenea
04-29-2009, 01:59 PM
Unless Pico Monaco qualifies, gets some lucky in placement, beats Kiefer in the first round, and upsets Muzza in the 2nd.

:worship: :worship:

asmazif
04-29-2009, 02:05 PM
Unless Pico Monaco qualifies, gets some lucky in placement, beats Kiefer in the first round, and upsets Muzza in the 2nd.

haha, fucking epic prediction.