When a player can't play at his normal level due to health reasons...? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

When a player can't play at his normal level due to health reasons...?

NinaNina19
01-27-2009, 09:37 PM
Should he retire or tank the match. I'm not talking about rolling an ankle, but as is the case of Djokovic last night where the heat was obviously affecting him and he couldn't play normally. Should he have just tanked the match or was retiring the right thing to do? Personally I'm glad he retired because I bet on him :p and had he been healthy I think he would've won in straights. But in general I think it's OK to retire in this situation because it isn't going to be a good match from then on anyway, might as well save people the time and torment of watching that disaster.

MacTheKnife
01-27-2009, 09:44 PM
I don't know that tank is the right word, but fight as best you can till the end. I've been in enough matches to know, you never really know what's going to happen in extreme conditions. I've been in, and seen some matches that totally turned around. The thing is, you never really know for sure how close to exhaustion your opponent is. Nor do you really know for sure you will not come back. Just dig deep and hang in there and see what happens. At the very least, future opponents will KNOW, you will not quit !!!

finishingmove
01-27-2009, 09:58 PM
retiring is the better option obviously

Johnny Groove
01-27-2009, 10:09 PM
It depends. If its a legit injury or if a player is really about to die out there, then retirement is the correct option.

But if a player didn't put in the work in the off season and can't stand the Aussie heat while his opponent is fresh as a daisy, you have to play till the end.

Aliciasace
01-27-2009, 10:09 PM
Personally, i believe roddick was fine, hes not playing great and i think he was scared of defeat.

LleytonMonfils
01-27-2009, 10:11 PM
hey nina in your negative rep of me you said: i'd like to see you play in 100 degree heat with a history of breathing problems. ummm hellllo... when did novak say he had breathing problems in that match? he made up some BS about cramping, when obviously his body just couldn't handle the conditions, and he wasn't prepared.

wtf are you talking about?

~*BGT*~
01-27-2009, 10:12 PM
hey nina in your negative rep of me you said: i'd like to see you play in 100 degree heat with a history of breathing problems. ummm hellllo... when did novak say he had breathing problems in that match? he made up some BS about cramping, when obviously his body just couldn't handle the conditions, and he wasn't prepared.

wtf are you talking about?

He's had surgery for breathing problems and he has asthma. I don't blame him for retiring. Heck, I wanted Andy out of there too. :unsure:

LleytonMonfils
01-27-2009, 10:15 PM
He's had surgery for breathing problems and he has asthma. I don't blame him for retiring. Heck, I wanted Andy out of there too. :unsure:

yesterday's match had nothing to do with breathing problems. :rolleyes:

~*BGT*~
01-27-2009, 10:20 PM
yesterday's match had nothing to do with breathing problems. :rolleyes:

I'm just answering your question. He has had a history of breathing problems. :rolleyes:

FedFan_2007
01-27-2009, 10:27 PM
So he retired because he was feeling hot? My god, I can only imagine what Clay Death would say... When does he get unbanned?

~Maya~
01-27-2009, 10:29 PM
I am not sure in this case, but heat injuries can be serious. I was just told that people who suffered a heat injury when younger could be very heat sensitive. (not sure if that was ever the case with Novak). I don't think he had a good prep. He spent the most of his prep time in cold Serbia. :silly:

finishingmove
01-27-2009, 10:30 PM
So he retired because he was feeling hot? My god, I can only imagine what Clay Death would say... When does he get unbanned?

you just can't wait

LleytonMonfils
01-27-2009, 10:34 PM
I'm just answering your question. He has had a history of breathing problems. :rolleyes:

i know all about his breathing problems, i was responding to the person who tried to say breathing problems had anything to do with this match. novak needs to be criticized for spending the off season in serbia. that's like practicing for the super bowl at lambeau field when the game is in san diego.

Myrre
01-27-2009, 10:53 PM
Only reason for retiring is if you risk agravating an injury.

GlennMirnyi
01-27-2009, 10:56 PM
You step on the court, you go 'till the end.

Andi-M
01-27-2009, 10:59 PM
I don't know that tank is the right word, but fight as best you can till the end. I've been in enough matches to know, you never really know what's going to happen in extreme conditions. I've been in, and seen some matches that totally turned around. The thing is, you never really know for sure how close to exhaustion your opponent is. Nor do you really know for sure you will not come back. Just dig deep and hang in there and see what happens. At the very least, future opponents will KNOW, you will not quit !!!

Sounds about right.

groundstroke
01-27-2009, 11:04 PM
Tanking or fight till the end, Jimmy Connors often had nothing left in the tank and would win a few matches because the opponent just dropped his level slightly and Connors took advantage.

Another example is Williams vs Hantuchova at Wimbledon a couple of years ago, Serena WIlliams had nothing left in the tank, she was cramping, but she stayed playing and eventually beat Hantuchova after she made about 200 UE's.

Clydey
01-27-2009, 11:37 PM
You step on the court, you go 'till the end.

No matter what?

GlennMirnyi
01-27-2009, 11:42 PM
If you get a legit injury, like rupturing a tendon, or straining an ankle, that's the end mate.

Exhaustion isn't a reason. You hang in there 4 minutes more and your opponent blitzes through you.

BalkanBoy
01-27-2009, 11:42 PM
Depends on situations in this case it was dangerous for him to continue. As a comentator said, do we need someone to die to react?

GlennMirnyi
01-27-2009, 11:45 PM
Oh poor Faker was going to die on court.

What a martyr for tennis.

Clydey
01-27-2009, 11:47 PM
If you get a legit injury, like rupturing a tendon, or straining an ankle, that's the end mate.

Exhaustion isn't a reason. You hang in there 4 minutes more and your opponent blitzes through you.

That's my feeling on it too. I thought for a minute that you were suggesting that you shouldn't withdraw for any reason.

Henry Chinaski
01-27-2009, 11:47 PM
it obviously depends on whether I have bet on the injured player or his opponent and on the rules of the particular bookie I have made the bet with.

Clydey
01-27-2009, 11:48 PM
Depends on situations in this case it was dangerous for him to continue. As a comentator said, do we need someone to die to react?

It wasn't dangerous. Where did you get that from? He said he was sore and cramping a little.

Johnny Groove
01-27-2009, 11:58 PM
it obviously depends on whether I have bet on the injured player or his opponent and on the rules of the particular bookie I have made the bet with.

:lol:

Byrd
01-28-2009, 12:02 AM
At the end of the day, if your injured your injured, you retire and that's that, but with Djokovic the guy only retires when he is on the verge of losing, that's why I found it suspect, and think the guy is a clown.

Snoo Foo
01-28-2009, 12:06 AM
"fighting till the end" is the opposite of tanking, this poll is :cuckoo:

NinaNina19
01-28-2009, 01:13 AM
it obviously depends on whether I have bet on the injured player or his opponent and on the rules of the particular bookie I have made the bet with.

Agreed :worship:.

Sebby
01-28-2009, 01:13 AM
Committing suicide on court is the best way to save his honour and please the fans.

trixtah
01-28-2009, 01:16 AM
I'm just answering your question. He has had a history of breathing problems. :rolleyes:

You didn't answer his question. Your biased response was skewed toward defending Djokovic that you didn't see the original question: Where did Djokovic say he retired that match because of breathing problems?

Tankman
01-28-2009, 01:48 AM
It depends. If its a legit injury or if a player is really about to die out there, then retirement is the correct option.

But if a player didn't put in the work in the off season and can't stand the Aussie heat while his opponent is fresh as a daisy, you have to play till the end.

Agree with your first point. However, not putting in the work in the off-season is not really any reason for someone to stay out there. First time, I'd say they definitely should retire - however if it keeps happening over and over, as is potentially happening with Djokovic, I'm going to go as far as some posters and say that they shouldn't even bother coming down here in the first place. They know perfectly well what they're coming up against and they should be prepared. As they say - if you can't handle the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

I am not sure in this case, but heat injuries can be serious. I was just told that people who suffered a heat injury when younger could be very heat sensitive. (not sure if that was ever the case with Novak). I don't think he had a good prep. He spent the most of his prep time in cold Serbia. :silly:

That's a possibility, but it's not an excuse. Like I said in another thread, if he knows he has this predisposition he should be working twice as hard on his fitness and conditioning as the other players on tour.

And that is just stupid from Nole. Stupid beyond belief :smash:

10nisfan
01-28-2009, 03:07 AM
So he retired because he was feeling hot? My god, I can only imagine what Clay Death would say...

CD would say that DJOKER Doesn't have The TESTICULAR FORTITUDE to continue till the match ends! :lol:

Experimentee
01-28-2009, 03:08 AM
If they are really feeling that bad then they should retire. No point in continuing when it could endanger their health, and spectators don't want to see a tank.

I was at the match a couple of years ago between Tipsarevic and Nalbandian, Tipsarevic was just losing all the games in a row and could barely move due to heat illness. He retired and it was the right thing, as nothing could have been achieved from staying out there. I think Djokovic was in the same situation.

VolandriFan
01-28-2009, 03:12 AM
If the player is dizzy, nauseated or having breathing difficulties, then I am perfectly fine with them retiring.

Bascule
01-28-2009, 03:17 AM
If they are sick or injured, they should retire. Otherwise it's stupid. They are not gladiators, not soldiers on the front. And they don't fight as the knights for some lady's honor.:retard:
They do it for money.
How could anyone enjoy the win if the opponent was clearly injured or sick? Why we were not happy with the mono story? Because it made Novak's triumph less...as Nadal's and of others. You just can't feel good with such win. And a player is risking not only his/her own health, but the whole carrier sometimes.

Bascule
01-28-2009, 03:29 AM
At the end of the day, if your injured your injured, you retire and that's that, but with Djokovic the guy only retires when he is on the verge of losing, that's why I found it suspect, and think the guy is a clown.

As I remember last year on Davis Cup playing with Davy and retired, he had better result.:p

Kolya
01-28-2009, 03:46 AM
Ironically, Nole went to a children's hospital the day before the match.

Obviously he didn't notice what real pain and suffering really is...

Bascule
01-28-2009, 03:49 AM
Ironically, Nole went to a children's hospital the day before the match.

Obviously he didn't notice what real pain and suffering really is...

:retard:

Kolya
01-28-2009, 03:51 AM
:retard:

:o

Snoo Foo
01-28-2009, 03:54 AM
As I remember last year on Davis Cup playing with Davy and retired, he had better result.:p

...not exactly, Nole won the first 2 sets but retired after losing the 3d set :awww:

Kolya
01-28-2009, 03:56 AM
Michael Stich said on Eurosport that Djokovic disrespected Roddick.

Bascule
01-28-2009, 04:00 AM
Michael Stich said on Eurosport that Djokovic disrespected Roddick.

I agree. Why should he anyway respect Andy after he showed no respect for Novak on USO?

Kolya
01-28-2009, 04:02 AM
I agree. Why should he anyway respect Andy after he showed no respect for Novak on USO?

:lol:

I actually don't mind that, I like the feud between players.

Battle of Egos.

philosophicalarf
01-28-2009, 04:08 AM
Only reason for retiring is if you risk agravating an injury.

Yup, if left untreated those sore threats can be fatal.

thesonofgray
01-28-2009, 04:20 AM
Committing suicide on court is the best way to save his honour and please the fans.

For some here on MTF, absolutely.

Maybe I actually care about the well-being of these players too much, but if the player thinks it is damaging in any way to go on (outside of the normal risk of playing a high impact sport), then I have no problem with a retirement.

Pushing the limits of an illness or injury or debilitating condition can be much more damaging than the embarrassment and ridicule of a retirement.

For Novak, I think he is less physically capable than most other players (not because of any laziness on his part), so his retirement isn't too surprising due to the pretty extreme conditions of the last match. And no matter what anyone says - breathing and heat go hand in hand. Novak might have not outlined in detail everything that was going wrong with him during the match, but just his appearance on court made it obvious the heat was a problem, hence the history of breathing problems some have brought up in light of this latest retirement.

Some just like to kick people when they're down (especially behind the safety of their computer screen). And, well, Djokovic's performance has a lot of ups and downs.

tangerine_dream
01-28-2009, 04:28 AM
They should play until they vomit, faint, and die of heat stroke.

Kolya
01-28-2009, 04:29 AM
They should play until they vomit, faint, and die of sun stroke.

Sparta pride!

Tankman
01-28-2009, 05:01 AM
I agree. Why should he anyway respect Andy after he showed no respect for Novak on USO?

As I remember, Andy was just joking - Novak should be the last person to take offence at being made fun of :shrug:

It'd be pretty sad if Novak really hasn't gotten over that slight. Especially now

For Novak, I think he is less physically capable than most other players (not because of any laziness on his part), so his retirement isn't too surprising due to the pretty extreme conditions of the last match. And no matter what anyone says - breathing and heat go hand in hand. Novak might have not outlined in detail everything that was going wrong with him during the match, but just his appearance on court made it obvious the heat was a problem, hence the history of breathing problems some have brought up in light of this latest retirement.

Some just like to kick people when they're down (especially behind the safety of their computer screen). And, well, Djokovic's performance has a lot of ups and downs.

He must know this though - it's affected him in the past. If he doesn't start working harder on his fitness and conditioning after this match, I'm not accepting his explanations any more.

habibko
01-28-2009, 05:02 AM
So he retired because he was feeling hot? My god, I can only imagine what Clay Death would say... When does he get unbanned?

CD would say that DJOKER Doesn't have The TESTICULAR FORTITUDE to continue till the match ends! :lol:

here is some of what CD said about it:

Djokovic came in unprepared and paid a steep price. Fed again gets a free ride to the final. D-Pot is evidently without any testicles at all. either that or he was hurt.

Fed owns Roddick. has him 15 matches to 2. he will have no problem steamrolling Roddick.

a clinic awaits the 2 Frenchmen. they wont know what hit them. Warrior King has blood on his mind. he wants their blood and he will have it.

====

Djokovic miscalculated. it was cool here last year. he was in the Serbian Mountains for about 10 days before going to Monaco to practice.

other top guns were working out in Dubai and Miami which have similar conditions to the those in Melbourne this year.

he did mention the testicles but elsewhere :lol:

Bascule
01-28-2009, 05:11 AM
They should play until they vomit, faint, and die of heat stroke.

They shoot horses, don't they?;)

lxQL3dcpQ3E

thesonofgray
01-28-2009, 05:43 AM
He must know this though - it's affected him in the past. If he doesn't start working harder on his fitness and conditioning after this match, I'm not accepting his explanations any more.

Of course he knows it. And that's probably why he asked for a night match. I'm always nervous for Novak when he has to play during hot days, and I'm sure he is too. I read in another thread that Roddick lobbied to keep the roof open for his match with Djoko, which probably means Andy knows Novak's intolerance to heat as well. It's no secret, and if it was easily corrected, I'm sure it would have been.

It's all part of the game, I suppose. The quality of your tennis will only get you so far if you can't stand the conditions you have to play in. Fortunately for Djokovic, the extreme heat he can't tolerate isn't a constant element of the game, and his quality of tennis usually makes up for those shortcomings.

And I don't accept his retirement excuses either. I think they're simply a meager attempt at avoiding the real answer - that he simply can't physically perform at the level of some of the other players. He can always improve his game, but if a genetic disposition prevents him, or makes it harder for him to tolerate certain elements, it's probably not something easily admitted - especially to the public and his peers.

Anyways, this is all from my observations of him and the little we do know. No one knows for sure everything that goes on in that head of his but him.

dusk
01-28-2009, 05:53 AM
It's Miss Fitness Brad Gilbert and likes' that put physical condition over talent and brain in tennis. He thinks if you show up on the court looking like Conan, you'll win the match.
Oh wait...he justhad couple of orgasms over (unfit) Tsonga's forehands:angel: