Bodo Bodo [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Bodo Bodo

peterparker
12-05-2008, 06:37 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=3746853&name=bodo_peter

Something in this piece sounds right to me. It sounds like a nice compromise between having the top guys who are likely to do well all the time (djokovic, nadal, murray, federer) play less and still have the quality of the draws remain nearly the same.

Maybe take like two clay masters and two hard court masters and turn them into a challenge system. You can even shift around which ones every five years or so. Or you might even shift it every year but just have a rule that says the one who won miami is now the guy who gets to sit out until the final in indian wells next year.

Action Jackson
12-05-2008, 06:41 PM
Fuck off Bodo and just have a top 4 playing exhos against each other.

peterparker
12-05-2008, 06:44 PM
Fuck off Bodo and just have a top 4 playing exhos against each other.

Does he say somewhere in the article that it's just about the top 4? Seems like a drastic reaction to a reasonable column. Yes he's written some bad ones.

scoobs
12-05-2008, 07:36 PM
Reasonable?

Reinstating the challenge round is reasonable?

Not having to earn your place on merit in a slam final because you won the title 12 months ago is reasonable?

People wouldn't complain about the challenge system today if had never been abolished? What the hell is he smoking?

I think the word you were reaching for, here, is "ridiculous".

Has he been reading "How to make Etienne de Villiers Look Reasonable For Dummies" ?

:help:

peterparker
12-05-2008, 07:49 PM
Reasonable?

Reinstating the challenge round is reasonable?

Not having to earn your place on merit in a slam final because you won the title 12 months ago is reasonable?

People wouldn't complain about the challenge system today if had never been abolished? What the hell is he smoking?

I think the word you were reaching for, here, is "ridiculous".

Has he been reading "How to make Etienne de Villiers Look Reasonable For Dummies" ?

:help:


Notice that I also did not say anything about grandslams and I said that there is "something" right about this piece. The idea is to minimize the workload for the guys who are winning ALL THE TIME and instituting a challenge system in SOME masters events where everyone is required to show up seems like a nice compromise.

less knee jerk reactions and thinking more about what other problems might arise from instituting a challenge system in 3 or 4 of the masters tournaments might be the way to go. The benefits for the best players are obvious, the costs seem minimal to me.

scoobs
12-05-2008, 07:54 PM
Notice that I also did not say anything about grandslams and I said that there is "something" right about this piece. The idea is to minimize the workload for the guys who are winning ALL THE TIME and instituting a challenge system in SOME masters events where everyone is required to show up seems like a nice compromise.

less knee jerk reactions and thinking more about what other problems might arise from instituting a challenge system in 3 or 4 of the masters tournaments might be the way to go. The benefits for the best players are obvious, the costs seem minimal to me.
There's nothing knee-jerk about my reaction at all.

As it happens I read that article 4 days ago and thought about it and I still find the idea ludicrous under ALL circumstances. The best players should have to prove they are the best by getting to the finals, same as everyone else. Otherwise it's just meaningless, totally inequality of effort. Whatever the solution to the calendar and scheduling concerns, giving the top players free passes to the finals is not the way to go, in my view, emphatically not.

Sunset of Age
12-05-2008, 08:19 PM
There's nothing knee-jerk about my reaction at all.

As it happens I read that article 4 days ago and thought about it and I still find the idea ludicrous under ALL circumstances. The best players should have to prove they are the best by getting to the finals, same as everyone else. Otherwise it's just meaningless, totally inequality of effort. Whatever the solution to the calendar and scheduling concerns, giving the top players free passes to the finals is not the way to go, in my view, emphatically not.

Absolutely. :yeah:

This idea of Bodo's sounds like something we should never tolerate, namely: 'class justice'. In other words: to him, and anyone agreeing with him: "You can't be serious!!!".

peterparker
12-05-2008, 08:33 PM
There's nothing knee-jerk about my reaction at all.

As it happens I read that article 4 days ago and thought about it and I still find the idea ludicrous under ALL circumstances. The best players should have to prove they are the best by getting to the finals, same as everyone else. Otherwise it's just meaningless, totally inequality of effort. Whatever the solution to the calendar and scheduling concerns, giving the top players free passes to the finals is not the way to go, in my view, emphatically not.

Not even in a few tournaments? The benefits to everyone seem large (tour, lower ranked players, higher ranked players). The quality of the average match might even rise. If rafa played a few less matches early on, but was able to compete across the entire season, wouldn't most people (players,atp,fans) have been better off? It might also protect from injury players who do well at a young age, one of the points in the age trajectory where the grind of the tour seems to have a big impact (sometimes with long lasting consequences, as possibly with Safin).

You don't like it. But "Meaningless" is a strong word, certainly there is a lot of meaning for the majority of players. Do all the matches that the players play lose meaning just because the player they play in the final didn't go through the draw like everyone else? Yes there is some "inequality" of effort and in some cases this might impact that person's chances in the final vs. the well rested guy. But the structure of the tour now also causes some trouble for the top players. It's clear they are not in the same shape at the end of the year as a davydenko or a blake.

it's possible that even a 10 match per year lowering in the number of matches played all the way through a top player's career might increase the longevity of that player. Would you favor a system that lead federer or a nadal to play for a few more years or not? I would.

I wonder if you are in the majority or minority in your view.

peterparker
12-05-2008, 08:39 PM
Absolutely. :yeah:

This idea of Bodo's sounds like something we should never tolerate, namely: 'class justice'. In other words: to him, and anyone agreeing with him: "You can't be serious!!!".

It's has nothing to do with class etc. The way the tour is structured now seems to be leading to injuries. One can hypothesize about why there are more complaints now (safin previously, roddick, nadal, etc.) than before (fitter players, more competition, homogeneity of surfaces). The idea is whether you can restructure with minimal damage. Notice that it is players and ex-players who argue for some type of restructuring and not atp tour etc.

JolánGagó
12-06-2008, 01:04 AM
Ridiculous. Let them sweat their asses as everyone else, that's what being top4 takes. When they become unable, others will take their places. That's how it works in tennis, this is not the America's Cup.

peterparker
12-06-2008, 01:13 AM
Ridiculous. Let them sweat their asses as everyone else, that's what being top4 takes. When they become unable, others will take their places. That's how it works in tennis, this is not the America's Cup.

lol :)

elessar
12-06-2008, 02:04 AM
Pete :yeah:
You always find new ways to amaze me :worship:

Sunset of Age
12-06-2008, 02:11 AM
It's has nothing to do with class etc. The way the tour is structured now seems to be leading to injuries. One can hypothesize about why there are more complaints now (safin previously, roddick, nadal, etc.) than before (fitter players, more competition, homogeneity of surfaces). The idea is whether you can restructure with minimal damage. Notice that it is players and ex-players who argue for some type of restructuring and not atp tour etc.

Complete nonsense, and I guess you've never heard of what 'class justice' actually is - benefiting those who actually are benefited already. That's about the LAST thing we need in sports, just like we shouldn't want that anywhere else either. Equal chances to all, and let those who managed to come on top be the deserved top players, whatever the circumstances they have to deal with.

On a side note - I've never heard you promote such an ridiculous idea when Fed was #1. Maybe because he managed to deal with his schedule a lot better than the players that you that want to see coming out on top? :rolleyes:

Ridiculous. Let them sweat their asses as everyone else, that's what being top4 takes. When they become unable, others will take their places. That's how it works in tennis, this is not the America's Cup.

Exactly. :yeah:

Action Jackson
12-06-2008, 02:17 AM
Does he say somewhere in the article that it's just about the top 4? Seems like a drastic reaction to a reasonable column. Yes he's written some bad ones.

No, it's a shit article and he has not written a good once since the 90s and this is drivel just to fill the off season. You must be related to Bodo, to actually think this is a decent article.

Usain Bolt shouldn't be put straight in the final of any event in the 100m and 200m because he is the fastest man in the world, he has to run the rounds like everyone else.

It doesn't happen on the Challengers and the Futures circuit, seriously might as well just create a top 8 and play among themselves. Facts are players improve playing against better opposition. No, it's not like royalty, where just because a person is born with the right last name, that are part of the monarchy.

The fact that the play more tennis on hardcourts is a bigger factor with the type of injuries and the length of the season, they have been talking the same shit since the 80s.

fast_clay
12-06-2008, 02:17 AM
there is something about bodo that makes me feel pretty violent...

peterparker
12-06-2008, 02:19 AM
Pete :yeah:
You always find new ways to amaze me :worship:

perfect! :)

peterparker
12-06-2008, 02:23 AM
Complete nonsense, and I guess you've never heard of what 'class justice' actually is - benefiting those who actually are benefited already. That's about the LAST thing we need in sports, just like we shouldn't want that anywhere else either. Equal chances to all, and let those who managed to come on top be the deserved top players, whatever the circumstances they have to deal with.

On a side note - I've never heard you promote such an ridiculous idea when Fed was #1. Maybe because he managed to deal with his schedule a lot better than the players that you that want to see coming out on top? :rolleyes:



Exactly. :yeah:

Sorry I don't think your first paragraph is a response at all to what I wrote.

lol, I would have no problem with this system being around a few years ago. Just like I have no problem with them going back to faster grass now. :) Good for fed. that he was able to deal with it but others might be blessed with his genetics.

edit: that should be "others might NOT be"

peterparker
12-06-2008, 02:25 AM
No, it's a shit article and he has not written a good once since the 90s and this is drivel just to fill the off season. You must be related to Bodo, to actually think this is a decent article.

Usain Bolt shouldn't be put straight in the final of any event in the 100m and 200m because he is the fastest man in the world, he has to run the rounds like everyone else.

It doesn't happen on the Challengers and the Futures circuit, seriously might as well just create a top 8 and play among themselves. Facts are players improve playing against better opposition. No, it's not like royalty, where just because a person is born with the right last name, that are part of the monarchy.

The fact that the play more tennis on hardcourts is a bigger factor with the type of injuries and the length of the season, they have been talking the same shit since the 80s.

so your response is basically, no one does it now so don't do it in the future. Much simpler to have written that.

You keep bringing this straw man of top 8, top 4. what's that all about?

Action Jackson
12-06-2008, 04:21 AM
so your response is basically, no one does it now so don't do it in the future. Much simpler to have written that.

You keep bringing this straw man of top 8, top 4. what's that all about?

You're taking the piss. The Usain Bolt example is very clear, even to Ray Charles and Stevie Wonder. Read it again.

It's not hard to understand, these top players got to the top how, they did it by winning matches at all levels and not getting handouts. They don't win, then they get replaced by better players.

You probably thought RR was a good idea for tournament play with events over 8.

Ok, so this crap you are going on with, so why are the players getting injured more these days? The calendar has always been long and yes there were many players playing 75-90 matches a season and it's not a new thing.

alfonsojose
12-06-2008, 04:48 AM
Bodo should get a WC into the 2009 ACC .. he would win it.

Sunset of Age
12-06-2008, 04:51 AM
Bodo should get a WC into the 2009 ACC .. he would win it.

Depends on his bandwagon voting for/against him. :angel:

peterparker
12-06-2008, 04:55 AM
You're taking the piss. The Usain Bolt example is very clear, even to Ray Charles and Stevie Wonder. Read it again.

It's not hard to understand, these top players got to the top how, they did it by winning matches at all levels and not getting handouts. They don't win, then they get replaced by better players.

You probably thought RR was a good idea for tournament play with events over 8.

Ok, so this crap you are going on with, so why are the players getting injured more these days? The calendar has always been long and yes there were many players playing 75-90 matches a season and it's not a new thing.

lol it's all blood and thunder with you PMK. :) I don't understand the Usain Bolt reference. Are track field athletes complaining about the # of races they have to run? Do the best track and field guys end up running a lot more races than the not so good guys? If not I don't see why this is relevant at all.

That's a good question about why players are getting more injured these days (if true). It does seem like rumblings are louder now than say 3 or 4 years ago. It's possible that the homogenization of the surfaces means the best guys are going deeper in more tournaments. Slowing down of the surfaces might also mean matches are probably longer-more rallies, less aces. Some of these things can be looked at if data is available.

alfonsojose
12-06-2008, 05:21 AM
Not even in a few tournaments? The benefits to everyone seem large (tour, lower ranked players, higher ranked players). The quality of the average match might even rise. If rafa played a few less matches early on, but was able to compete across the entire season, wouldn't most people (players,atp,fans) have been better off? It might also protect from injury players who do well at a young age, one of the points in the age trajectory where the grind of the tour seems to have a big impact (sometimes with long lasting consequences, as possibly with Safin).

You don't like it. But "Meaningless" is a strong word, certainly there is a lot of meaning for the majority of players. Do all the matches that the players play lose meaning just because the player they play in the final didn't go through the draw like everyone else? Yes there is some "inequality" of effort and in some cases this might impact that person's chances in the final vs. the well rested guy. But the structure of the tour now also causes some trouble for the top players. It's clear they are not in the same shape at the end of the year as a davydenko or a blake.

it's possible that even a 10 match per year lowering in the number of matches played all the way through a top player's career might increase the longevity of that player. Would you favor a system that lead federer or a nadal to play for a few more years or not? I would.

I wonder if you are in the majority or minority in your view.

The top player are just selfish bithces. JesusFed and Pocahontas would travel to the artic to play on ice against Phelps a day after the Wimby final and the next week they'd withdraw from the next MM because the schedule is too much.

Lee
12-06-2008, 05:31 AM
I can only discern two scenarios for the final.

1. The challenger is totally exhausted by the time he reaches the final and is utterly destroyed by the defending champion.
2. The defending champion is so rusty that it's a one sided match for the challenger.

Both are not what fans want in a final.

peterparker
12-06-2008, 05:33 AM
The top player are just selfish bithces. JesusFed and Pocahontas would travel to the artic to play on ice against Phelps a day after the Wimby final and the next week they'd withdraw from the next MM because the schedule is too much.

hah hah. It's possible. That's why some stats. on injuries, matches played etc. would be nice. :)

peterparker
12-06-2008, 05:35 AM
I can only discern two scenarios for the final.

1. The challenger is totally exhausted by the time he reaches the final and is utterly destroyed by the defending champion.
2. The defending champion is so rusty that it's a one sided match for the challenger.

Both are not what fans want in a final.

That will certainly happen sometimes!

Lee
12-06-2008, 05:40 AM
That will certainly happen sometimes!

Not sometimes. IMO, 90% of the time.

peterparker
12-06-2008, 05:46 AM
Not sometimes. IMO, 90% of the time.

90% seems high to me. If the champ played a tournament the week before the chances of rustiness go down imo. Players also play at a high level in their first round matches a nontrivial amount of times. I might be more concerned about the other guy being tired, I am sure this can be gauged with a survey.

alfonsojose
12-06-2008, 05:50 AM
peterparker? :lol: I'm going to change my name to brucewayne

mateuszw
12-06-2008, 05:52 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=3746853&name=bodo_peter

Something in this piece sounds right to me. It sounds like a nice compromise between having the top guys who are likely to do well all the time (djokovic, nadal, murray, federer) play less and still have the quality of the draws remain nearly the same.

Maybe take like two clay masters and two hard court masters and turn them into a challenge system. You can even shift around which ones every five years or so. Or you might even shift it every year but just have a rule that says the one who won miami is now the guy who gets to sit out until the final in indian wells next year.


wait a minute,

did you just agree with peter bodo?

and you are advocating the challenge system?

my god, you have just threw in the towel.. u concur u know nothing about tennis

Fee
12-06-2008, 06:28 AM
No, the top 4 need to play all the rounds and prove that they deserve their rankings. If they lose in the early rounds like Novak did in Wimbly and Roger did in Dubai, then so be it.

The season needs to be shortened so that the Masters Cup is over by the first Sunday in November, giving the Top 4 a pass into the finals won't accomplish that.

Action Jackson
12-06-2008, 06:48 AM
lol it's all blood and thunder with you PMK. :) I don't understand the Usain Bolt reference. Are track field athletes complaining about the # of races they have to run? Do the best track and field guys end up running a lot more races than the not so good guys? If not I don't see why this is relevant at all.

The reference isn't hard to get all, everyone else seems to grasp the concept of why this is just bullshit but you and Bodo. How is your father Pete these days?

Which basically means either you believe this shit or you are so bored at the moment that you are arguing for the sake of arguing and having fun with it.

How did the top players reach the top ranking? What processes did they have to go through to get this ranking? If you know how they managed to do that and then able to hold down their position.

Funny thing about playing tennis matches, strangely players need to play them to get into peak condition in match circumstances.

Snoo Foo
12-06-2008, 06:56 AM
AND furthermore... the title is missing an apostrophe

peterparker
12-06-2008, 08:15 AM
peterparker? :lol: I'm going to change my name to brucewayne

bruce wayne's a good name, but I am not dark or brooding. :(

Nathaliia
12-06-2008, 08:26 AM
Peter who are your favourite tennis players? Maybe then we can understand why you defend this idiotic column.

peterparker
12-06-2008, 08:27 AM
No, the top 4 need to play all the rounds and prove that they deserve their rankings. If they lose in the early rounds like Novak did in Wimbly and Roger did in Dubai, then so be it.

The season needs to be shortened so that the Masters Cup is over by the first Sunday in November, giving the Top 4 a pass into the finals won't accomplish that.

shortening the season is an option as well. But there will be some push back there. The nice thing about having 3-4 four non Grand Slam tournaments with the challenge system is that the season would not need to be shortened.

Snoo Foo
12-06-2008, 08:33 AM
peter is your real last name "bodo"?

peterparker
12-06-2008, 08:48 AM
Peter who are your favourite tennis players? Maybe then we can understand why you defend this idiotic column.

My favorite player is nadal, after that I like to watch a lot of players (murray, federer, berdych, nishikori, berdych etc.). This has nothing to do with that.

It's just a possible solution to players complaints about long season, injuries etc. Lee has the best potential reasons to not do it imo. The thing to notice is that most people seem to think the tour surfaces have been homogenized. This seems to to lead the best players to do well through most of the year and burning out towards the end (certainly with nadal and djokovic last year-although djokovic has the added disadvantage of not being superfit). This is circumstantially backed up by the top 3 players over the last several years accumulating a tremendous amount of points. Murray also has the potential to play a tremendous number of matches although he will get a little more of a break during the clay court season. As I said the length of matches might have also gone up due to the slower courts which also puts more stress on the athletes.

Fee has a suggestion as well, but there will be pushback to that. Which tournament are you going to cut to shorten the season?

peterparker
12-06-2008, 08:49 AM
peter is your real last name "bodo"?

yes:wavey:

mateuszw
12-06-2008, 08:51 AM
peterparker

i would bet all my bankroll that peter bodo is laughing at you right now for believing in what he wrote in that article and agreeing with him. that is if he'd ever care to head this

peterparker
12-06-2008, 08:53 AM
peterparker

i would bet all my bankroll that peter bodo is laughing at you right now for believing in what he wrote in that article and agreeing with him. that is if he'd ever care to head this


Now that I have admitted that I (not my father) am peter bodo, I am sorry for writing that article about nalby mateuszw. :)

mateuszw
12-06-2008, 08:56 AM
article about nalby is long gone. u've brought up his newest piece of art. perhaps his best yet. and you agreed with it. so don't change the subject and deal with it.

peterparker
12-06-2008, 09:00 AM
article about nalby is long gone. u've brought up his newest piece of art. perhaps his best yet. and you agreed with it. so don't change the subject and deal with it.

really? I see it as the fifth thread in general messages. :confused:

mateuszw
12-06-2008, 09:04 AM
gone as in forgotten about it.. or better yet, replaced by his latest work.

so keep changing the subject

peterparker
12-06-2008, 09:07 AM
gone as in forgotten about it.. or better yet, replaced by his latest work.

so keep changing the subject

lol. so you are not going to accept my apology?

mateuszw
12-06-2008, 09:12 AM
lol. so you are not going to accept my apology?


challenged in support of the challenge system. go figure

peterparker
12-06-2008, 09:17 AM
challenged in support of the challenge system. go figure

would you call that irony?

nobama
12-06-2008, 10:42 AM
Bozo's a clown. One of his recent articles was that guys should easily be able to play 100+ maches a year without complaint. Because that's what Vilas & company did in the 1970s. :retard:

http://tennisworld.typepad.com/tennisworld/2008/12/tk.html

Dougie
12-06-2008, 02:33 PM
Bozo's a clown. One of his recent articles was that guys should easily be able to play 100+ maches a year without complaint. Because that's what Vilas & company did in the 1970s. :retard:

http://tennisworld.typepad.com/tennisworld/2008/12/tk.html

Well,oviously the game is much harder than in the -70´s, and pysically more demanding. But on the other hand, those guys were not ballerinas who complained about the schedule at every possible chance. Players today have much more money than players 30 years ago, but nothing pleases them. Vilas & company played a huge amount of matches in a year but made peanuts compared to today. And there were no Abu Dhabi exhos 30 years ago. A bit off topic, but you have to give some credit to the former champions, they were some hard working men!

CyBorg
12-07-2008, 12:10 AM
Bozo's a clown. One of his recent articles was that guys should easily be able to play 100+ maches a year without complaint. Because that's what Vilas & company did in the 1970s. :retard:

http://tennisworld.typepad.com/tennisworld/2008/12/tk.html

How can one write an article like this and not even mention the geographic conditions of Vilas's 80-1 streak in 1977? Bodo just throws out a few numbers and hopes that they stick to the wall. Sadly for him no is buying the bullshit.

Sunset of Age
12-07-2008, 12:19 AM
How can one write an article like this and not even mention the geographic conditions of Vilas's 80-1 streak in 1977? Bodo just throws out a few numbers and hopes that they stick to the wall. Sadly for him no is buying the bullshit.

I hope so, but the fact that Mr. Bozo is still allowed to come near to a keyboard, let alone to publish his :retard: rubbish somehow makes me feel this is not the case. :(

fast_clay
12-07-2008, 01:36 AM
they still cut peoples fingers and thumbs off in some countries for sh!t like this...

nobama
12-07-2008, 01:43 AM
I hope so, but the fact that Mr. Bozo is still allowed to come near to a keyboard, let alone to publish his :retard: rubbish somehow makes me feel this is not the case. :(Sad thing is he's got a lot of sycophants on his blog who :worship: every sentence he utters. :rolleyes:

Sunset of Age
12-07-2008, 01:57 AM
Sad thing is he's got a lot of sycophants on his blog who :worship: every sentence he utters. :rolleyes:

Even Bodo has bandwagoners! :haha:

Nah, you know - in a culture where 'Mac Donald's' is regarded as the best food there is by many, what can one expect? :p

Chip_s_m
12-07-2008, 02:03 AM
Even Bodo has bandwagoners! :haha:

Nah, you know - in a culture where 'Mac Donald's' is regarded as the best food there is by many, what can one expect? :p

Looks like you've never spent significant time in the US.

Sunset of Age
12-07-2008, 02:06 AM
Looks like you've never spent significant time in the US.

I wasn't talking about the US, mate. :p

Chip_s_m
12-07-2008, 02:13 AM
I wasn't talking about the US, mate. :p

Bodo is American, the majority of people who read his blog are American, and "Mac Donald's" (I'm assuming you're talking about the fast-food chain McDonald's) is American too. If you weren't talking about the US then what country were you talking about?

Snoo Foo
12-07-2008, 02:14 AM
I wasn't talking about the US, mate. :p

Australia?

Snoo Foo
12-07-2008, 02:15 AM
earth?

Sunset of Age
12-07-2008, 02:15 AM
Australia?

How about 'General Western Culture'? ;)

Sunset of Age
12-07-2008, 02:17 AM
Bodo is American, the majority of people who read his blog are American, and "Mac Donald's" (I'm assuming you're talking about the fast-food chain McDonald's) is American too. If you weren't talking about the US then what country were you talking about?

I can only conclude you haven't been to Europe very often. Do you really think Mac Donald's only exists in the US? ;)

BTW, no prob - I do think you know what I mean. I'm no US-hater at all, I've been there quite a few times, and I liked it a lot. :wavey:

Chip_s_m
12-07-2008, 02:24 AM
I can only conclude you haven't been to Europe very often. Do you really think Mac Donald's only exists in the US? ;)

BTW, no prob - I do think you know what I mean. I'm no US-hater at all, I've been there quite a few times, and I liked it a lot. :wavey:

Thank you for clarifying (and yes, I'm well aware that McDonald's is located practically everywhere).

daz_petite
12-07-2008, 03:33 AM
it's funny because in my home country (Malaysia) bodo/bodoh = stupid :tape:

nobama
12-07-2008, 12:29 PM
Even Bodo has bandwagoners! :haha:

Nah, you know - in a culture where 'Mac Donald's' is regarded as the best food there is by many, what can one expect? :pHey this isn't fair to the rest of Western Culture. :(