*******Rolling in the Grass - A Wimbledon 2008 Thread!!******* [Archive] - Page 9 - MensTennisForums.com

*******Rolling in the Grass - A Wimbledon 2008 Thread!!*******

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Noelman
07-07-2008, 12:51 PM
As fans we will never know how Roger's mind is going to deal with the current situation. I can't concern that far too. Let's see how he will come out 2 weeks later.

glycina
07-07-2008, 12:57 PM
I don't think that Nadal will keep on winning Wimby.
I'm sure that Roger will win again Wimby. And I don't think either tnat no one
can beat Nadal at Wimby except Roger.

I see clearly that Roger has lost power in his shots this year.
To be exact, after Shanghai. His physical power will decline naturally.
But if other problems are resolved, he will be back as he did say himself.
Nadal, 22 years old, is at his peak now physically(like Roger was also at
22 years old. Il think about USO Final vs Hewitt).
But Roger too is still young and he ought not to be as he is now if he has
not been ill. I do hope that Roger will be healthy from the beginning of the season,
next year.

tim1987
07-07-2008, 01:02 PM
That has to be the most gutting moment I have ever had to endure. Hats off to Rafa, a worthy champion. I just hope Roger can bounce back. But I just think he has just gone down a slight level which has allowed Nadal in. He isn't producing as many awe-inspiring winners this year, his serve dipped yesterday which cost him in the end.

It's worse than watching England in a football penalty shoot out.

I feel sooooooo sorry for Fed, its sad when a great champion's reign finishes.

This is that Mac video where Rog looks on the brink of tears. Don't know if this has already been posted.

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/22825103/vp/25560637

nobama
07-07-2008, 01:11 PM
I wouldn't go that far. Next year is another year. On clay, Nadal is invincible. Outside of clay it depends on current form. I don't think it's inconceivable that he'll suck on grass next year (after all the grass "season" is so short). I do consider it inconceivable that he'll suck on clay.

If we were to rewind time by 14 days, I'd still say that the title would be a toss-up between Federer, Nadal and Djokovic.I wish I could be as optimistc as you, but when I saw how Roddick and Djoker played him at Queens and then Murray at Wimbledon I lost all hope of someone being there to challenge him. And as long as he keeps dominating during the clay court season he'll always come into the grass season full of confidence - especially if it's Roger that's taking the thumping like usual on the dirt.

glycina
07-07-2008, 01:22 PM
Last year, just after AO, Roger has predicted at rf com , in his message
to his fans, that it would be Nadal that can get the number one. But
he said also that it would be interesting in that situation too.
He will never give up, I'm sure. He belives in his possibility
as a athlete. I'm sad for his loss, but he has lost as a champion.
Who can come back after 2sets down against Nadal? Hats off also to Roger.
I dare say that Roger had no luck yesterday.

Sunset of Age
07-07-2008, 01:32 PM
:hug: :hug: :hug: to everyone out here feeling sad and lost...

Here's my post from GM. I understand many of you not venturing out there right now, so that's why I thought it appropriate to copy it over here.

What an absolutely FANTASTIC final that was! No doubt one of the best I ever witnessed, and I've witnessed quite a few.

Just like last year, there were quite a couple of moments at which I thought, 'why not just saw that trophy in half and give either player half of it?' (kidding of course)... it's one of those matches where the objective tennis lover wants to see BOTH win and neither lose... but alas, one of them had to lose, and this time it was Roger's turn. Well, after last year, where I also felt that Raf deserved the title just as much as Roger (as Roger said himself), I can't feel all too sad about it - I look forward for another five years or so where the both of them equally split the titles between them!

What a battle, what a drama. Congrats to Rafa, fantastic playing, what an achievement!!! :worship: :worship: :worship: :hatoff:
And of course, kudos to Roger as well. :hug: :hug: :hug: - I fully expect him to recover from this undoubtedly devastating loss, just as Rafa had to enjure last year and managed to recover as well.

Thanks, THANKS to both gentlemen to the entertainment they provide us, over and over again. Beautiful, lovely rivals. I can't get enough of it. Many over here have questioned how I can possibly love them both as much as I do, well now it's time for me to ask a question in return: HOW CAN YOU *NOT*? :hearts: :hearts: :hearts:

:angel:

BTW, I know not all of you share my feelings for Raf (;)), I understand that and respect that - but some people calling him an "unworthy champion", isn't that going a bit too far? :(

Show yourself worthy as tennis fans, and, just like Roger himself, show the guy the respect he deserves!

marcRD
07-07-2008, 01:59 PM
Damn, what a loss. :(

4hrs, 48 minutes. Comes back from two sets down.

This will be a match that people will still talk about 50 years from now. Federer, like Borg will be remembered more in his loss then in his wins.

Couple things here.

1. He has not lost anything he cannot regain again. He smashed Borg's streak tonight.

2. He's still number one going into his strongest surface.

3. Every record he is still chasing are all the longevity records. Most number of Grand Slams. Most number of total week number 1. He's 26, and to be only 2 slams away from these records is phenomenal.

He's already set the longest streak ever at Wimbly, and will set the longest streak at the USO this year.

:wavey: Good positive thinking. I like that. I wont tease you about our arguments before the match, I feel like I somewhat underrated Federer myself thinking he would lose in 3 or 4 sets. I didnt think he had this much hearth, but it made me all the more sad to see him lose when he was so close.

BlueSwan
07-07-2008, 02:01 PM
I wish I could be as optimistc as you, but when I saw how Roddick and Djoker played him at Queens and then Murray at Wimbledon I lost all hope of someone being there to challenge him. And as long as he keeps dominating during the clay court season he'll always come into the grass season full of confidence - especially if it's Roger that's taking the thumping like usual on the dirt.

Hey, I'm no optimist. That's why I always put money on Nadal to win when he and Federer meet up. ;)

All I'm saying is that on grass and hard courts, results will depend on current form, much more so than on clay, where it's really tough seeing anyone beat Nadal unless he's at something like 50% of his capabilities.

BlueSwan
07-07-2008, 02:05 PM
Last year, just after AO, Roger has predicted at rf com , in his message
to his fans, that it would be Nadal that can get the number one. But
he said also that it would be interesting in that situation too.
He will never give up, I'm sure. He belives in his possibility
as a athlete. I'm sad for his loss, but he has lost as a champion.
Who can come back after 2sets down against Nadal? Hats off also to Roger.
I dare say that Roger had no luck yesterday.

It's interesting that when everybody was talking about Djokovic being the next #1 (myself included, BTW), Roger maintained that Rafa was his main rival and the biggest threat to his ranking. Some of us interpreted it as Roger deliberately not acknowledging Novak, but maybe he was just being honest and was seeing something that most of us didn't see. Back in early 2008, the general feeling on MTF was that Nadal would be overtaken by Djokovic and might never become #1.

Sunset of Age
07-07-2008, 02:07 PM
It's interesting that when everybody was talking about Djokovic being the next #1 (myself included, BTW), Roger maintained that Rafa was his main rival and the biggest threat to his ranking. Some of us interpreted it as Roger deliberately not acknowledging Novak, but maybe he was just being honest and was seeing something that most of us didn't see. Back in early 2008, the general feeling on MTF was that Nadal would be overtaken by Djokovic and might never become #1.

Roger. :worship: :worship: :worship:

Puschkin
07-07-2008, 02:18 PM
I wish I could be as optimistc as you, but when I saw how Roddick and Djoker played him at Queens and then Murray at Wimbledon I lost all hope of someone being there to challenge him.
Salvation will come from where you don't expect it. :)

lina_seta
07-07-2008, 02:38 PM
I can't believe Nadal actually bit the Wimbledon trophy :o

EXACTLY
WIMBLEDON DESERVES BETTER
IT DESERVES TO BE KISSED NOT BITTEN! ;)

nobama
07-07-2008, 02:40 PM
Roger. :worship: :worship: :worship:Sorry I can't take comfort in the Roger/Nadal good natured relationship. IMO Roger really needed that win yesterday more than Nadal did. And Roger being his gracious self and Nadal still calling Roger the best doesn't make the loss any easier to take.

I know I'm just bitter because of this loss but I'm really starting to get sick of the whole fedal thing and love fest between those two. :(

Sunset of Age
07-07-2008, 02:46 PM
I know I'm just bitter because of this loss but I'm really starting to get sick of the whole fedal thing and love fest between those two. :(

I'm 'afraid' (;)) that it's just genuine. If it were fake, yesterday's final would have been the ideal trigger for either of them to drop the image, but it didn't happen. Rather the contrary. :shrug:

Do you feel like that just because of your dislike of Nadal, or because you think Roger's respect towards Raf troubles his mind and as such his game? Just a question, no trollish intentions or anything the like. :hug:

ExpectedWinner
07-07-2008, 03:02 PM
This is the first time when I don't want to analyze Fed's fh/bh/movement, etc. after a loss. It's not my obligation to make everyone feel better. It means I'm going to say the truth the way I see it. It's the end. I don't see Federer winning Slams anymore. He'll still reach later stages of important tournaments, but he'll run into faster, stronger, fitter players. It's going to happen due to 2 reasons: inevitable aging process/wear and tear and resting on his laurels in 2007.

*esther*
07-07-2008, 03:08 PM
I went to sleep when he was 2 sets down, i was just thinking at that moment, "today wasn't your day, Roger, LUCK isn't on your side (i was so frustrated with the rain, windy condition, huge UEs & etc), so it doesn't matter how hard you battled and fought you still had to lose!:sad:" You didn't lose to Rafa but to God's will.:tears::tears::tears::tears:

I am still gutted and sad.:crying2::crying2:

ExpectedWinner
07-07-2008, 03:09 PM
I'm 'afraid' (;)) that it's just genuine. If it were fake, yesterday's final would have been the ideal trigger for either of them to drop the image, but it didn't happen. Rather the contrary. :shrug:

Do you feel like that just because of your dislike of Nadal, or because you think Roger's respect towards Raf troubles his mind and as such his game? Just a question, no trollish intentions or anything the like. :hug:

Who cares? At the end of day it doesn't matter if they f**k each other in a locker room, or never say hello on an elevator.

Sunset of Age
07-07-2008, 03:40 PM
Who cares? At the end of day it doesn't matter if they f**k each other in a locker room, or never say hello on an elevator.

My post was in reply to Mellow Yellow's, nothing more, nothing less.
In contrary to you, obviously, I find it admirable that these two show each other the deserved respect in stead of pulling out dogfights like some of the earlier tennis rivals did... so yes, I do care. :shrug:

maskedmuffin
07-07-2008, 03:43 PM
hi folks; i was the threadstarter in this and it is a very very sad day;
I made a post on it at my blog, thought i would share it here
------------------------------------------------------------



Well folks - it has happened. Rafael Nadal is your 2008 wimbledon champion. Let me repeat that, rafael nadal is your 2008 wimbledon champion, having bested Roger federer in what most believe was not just the greatest wimbledon final of all time, but the greatest final in the history of the game. It is probably a logical conclusion to reach, given the improvement in racket technology, player training regiments, and overall athlecisim required of the current generation of athletes to maintain concentration while hitting serves, forehands and backhands at 100+ miles per hour; The quality of tennis exhibited yesterday per these standards certainly blows finals of yesteryear out the window.

And it was a very very high quality match; As a few of you may have picked up on, i am not a large fan of the man from mallorca, and a huge fan of the swiss maestro, so this is a particularly difficult post to write. I wanted to reserve judgement on the match after watching it, as i was in commute the whole day, and after a few hours to digest the excitement, some sober conclusions have been reached, some both Nadal and Federer fans will probably disagree with; If that is you reading this blog, please, feel free to leave a comment.

First of, give Nadal credit. He is the mentally toughest player in the game today, probably of all time. His resiliance when faced with adversity is almost as superhuman as those biceps he sports. We were all expecting the wilt in the 5th; After an amazing tie break that guided him to within 1 point of the championship only to have federer drop the bottom out from underneath him, any other normal athlete would have immediately been broken in the subsequent set. And he certainly was teetering; Nadal’s desire to win this tournament guided him in this situation, and i believe the rain delay at 2-2 40-40 actually helped him refocus and assuage some of the worries that may have been creeping up in his mind.

Nadal played a very clean match, more winners than errors, and converted on the break point opportunities presented to him.

But to me, despite Nadal’s win, this match is more of an indictment on Federer than it is on the greatness of Nadal. Forget all the statistics, forget all the percentages, just watch the match from a strategical, chess perspective, and one will realize why roger the great, unfortunately and to my chagrin, cannot be compared to players like rafter and sampras on this surface.

Rafter?! I know what some of you are thinking; How dare you put rafter in the same sentence with pete, and then try to make a comparison to roger. If anything it should be pete,roger, and then pat. Ahh, but folks this is not about # of championships. This is about the mentality which i had emphatically called out the rest of the field on in my prior posting - the style to play against nadal on the crucial and critical points.

Roger federer does not have a classical agressive grass court game. Martina navratilova is a classical agressive grass court player. Pat rafter and sampras, and this is where my analogy will begin to make sense, are ideal examplifiers of the agress grass court game in men’s tennis; The former moreso with being a serve-and-volleyer, frequent chip-and-charger, the latter a server first- volleyer second, and occasional chip and charger.

What do all three of these players have in common? Net Sense. Roger federer lost this match because he too often than not places himself in harder positions then required to hit volleys. This is due to the lacsadasical approach he takes coming into net, as he is extremely indecisive when to come in. He will watch his shot first, hesitate, and then come in. Against most others, this may work, against nadal it is his undoing. Even the slightest bit of hesitency costs him, as time and time again he is made to hit shoestring volleys due to poor positioning

Furthermore, roger federer does not try to traditionally punch the volleys; He likes to carve the volleys. He likes to even, *gasp*, do the unthinkable, drop his racquet head down below net level to put underspin on volleys. Except here is the problem, he is not very good with this approach. There is a term in tennis called “sticking volleys.” Federer did this for a set and a half against sampras in 2001. Watch him now, and you can see how the last 5 years of his dominance from the baseline has caused him to become extremely lazy in his approach at net.

Net is not about looking good; Net is about having the pitbull mentality of getting the job done. Dainty volleying cost Roger federer a 6th consecutive championship.

It is not just his actual volleying skills that are below par for a champion; It is his inability to dissect the opponents percentages while at net. This is what made johnny mac a genious, and stefan edberg a similar one at net. They knew what spin they were imparting on the ball based on the volley, and immediately calculated what the possibility was for the opponent to either pull the ball cross court or go up the line, and covered accordingly. In tennis, this is called anticipation. There were numerous times in the first couple of sets, where federer really had the large majority of his break changes, where roger would lounge into net on the rafa backhand side, only to look incredulously over at his opponent as nadal literally swept backhand after backhand cross court. Any adjustment from federer to poach towards the cross court, even when approaching off a blistering down the line forehand? Nope. Continued to cover the more difficult-to-execute, lower percentage down the line-on-the-full-run-rafa-backhand. I, a recreational player, was able to pick up on nadal’s propensity to give away the cross court sweeping backhand (he drops his wrists and begins a sweeping motion paralleling the baseline with hips perpendicular to sed baseline for those wondering) two shots into it; Mcenroe harped on it immediately. Did federer adjust? nope

This may finally be the wake up call that federer needs to take volleying seriously once again. He is an amazing on-the-ball timing player, one who can belt forehands and backhands with the best of them. Yet his game is the most difficult game to execute due to how much pressure he places on himself to meet the ball early, and whip through it across both wings. There is very little if any margin for error, and with the dimming light it was only a matter of time before the errors creeped back in his game and nadal took that title. Its a pity, because if he had an actual fall back plan, an actual solid volleying game, the scoreline would have looked much different.

-------------------------------

In closing, all i can say is; Roger you need to bring on john mcenroe as a volley coach, or pat rafter. Those 2
They will teach you all you need to know about it. Rest of your game is rock solid, but as you get older, the wisdom of these 2 will help you win majors like wimby much much easier.

What do you guys think? Or do you think that is just the "mentality" of the player; i.e. roger ain't all deep testosterone agressive ? He is the "carver"

Actually forger john or pat

just get martina navratilova. She was more agressive and better volleyer than the lot. And her "mentality" for volleying is all roger needs to pick up on. A true champion :)

avocadoe
07-07-2008, 03:46 PM
:hug: :hug: :hug: to everyone out here feeling sad and lost...

Here's my post from GM. I understand many of you not venturing out there right now, so that's why I thought it appropriate to copy it over here.



:angel:

BTW, I know not all of you share my feelings for Raf (;)), I understand that and respect that - but some people calling him an "unworthy champion", isn't that going a bit too far? :(

Show yourself worthy as tennis fans, and, just like Roger himself, show the guy the respect he deserves!

Thanks, that's really nice! I am one of those who will take my time before hitting 'mtf general messages", lol, and also like Rafa, quite a lot. I would never root for him against Roger, I do draw the line on that, but loved them both yesterday, the way they dealt with what they dealt themselves and was dealth them, 2 great Champions, for sure.:wavey::worship:

ExpectedWinner
07-07-2008, 03:48 PM
My post was in reply to Mellow Yellow's, nothing more, nothing less.
In contrary to you, obviously, I find it admirable that these two show each other the deserved respect in stead of pulling out dogfights like some of the earlier tennis rivals did... so yes, I do care. :shrug:

Well, you know the picture is not always in black and white. There were plenty of rivals who were not involved in any dogfights, but they also did not bother about being PC all year long.

anon57
07-07-2008, 04:25 PM
This is the first time when I don't want to analyze Fed's fh/bh/movement, etc. after a loss. It's not my obligation to make everyone feel better. It means I'm going to say the truth the way I see it. It's the end. I don't see Federer winning Slams anymore. He'll still reach later stages of important tournaments, but he'll run into faster, stronger, fitter players. It's going to happen due to 2 reasons: inevitable aging process/wear and tear and resting on his laurels in 2007.He'll definitely have a much harder time winning titles with the younger players coming into their own but for now in my opinion it's too early to be completely writing him off.

Daniel
07-07-2008, 04:37 PM
This is the first time when I don't want to analyze Fed's fh/bh/movement, etc. after a loss. It's not my obligation to make everyone feel better. It means I'm going to say the truth the way I see it. It's the end. I don't see Federer winning Slams anymore. He'll still reach later stages of important tournaments, but he'll run into faster, stronger, fitter players. It's going to happen due to 2 reasons: inevitable aging process/wear and tear and resting on his laurels in 2007.

That can be true but i still believe 1 more Slam is still within the reach.

Or Levy
07-07-2008, 04:49 PM
I think more than one slam is definitly within reach. Pete got his last one at 30! That's three years from now.

I think it is pointless to speculate. Maybe Roger will go on slamless from now on, I don't believe that would happen. I fancy his chances against Djoko OR Rafa in the USO.

I like to wait and see.

Sunset of Age
07-07-2008, 04:50 PM
That can be true but i still believe 1 more Slam is still within the reach.

Just ONE? Come on, here. Why all this sudden 'Roger is done'-talk, even in here? He's not made out of sugar, he'll surely bounce back. He isn't the type to pull a Borg either.

I believe that Roger has at least three fine years ahead of him, and yes, he WILL beat Sampras' record.

nobama
07-07-2008, 04:58 PM
Boy I never thought I'd see the day when it's worse here than on rf.com. :o I expect people there to jump off a cliff after a match like this but not here. I'm not suggesting Roger doesn't have a lot of hard work to do or winning one more more slams will be easy, but I'm not yet ready to write him off. I still believe in a best of 5 match it will be tough for anyone not named Nadal (and maybe Djoker) to beat him.

My only reservation is if this loss hits him so hard he doesn't recover from it. But who knows what will happen once he's no longer #1 and chasing a bunch of records. Maybe when some of that pressure is taken off he'll start to enjoy things again, play more freely and the play not to lose rather than play to win mentality will go away.

SUKTUEN
07-07-2008, 05:00 PM
Roger still have many chance in the future!!
He will try his best to win GS again!!!!

glycina
07-07-2008, 05:08 PM
Just ONE? Come on, here. Why all this sudden 'Roger is done'-talk, even in here? He's not made out of sugar, he'll surely bounce back. He isn't the type to pull a Borg either.

I believe that Roger has at least three fine years ahead of him, and yes, he WILL beat Sampras' record.

Me too, I think so.

nobama
07-07-2008, 05:09 PM
I'm 'afraid' (;)) that it's just genuine. If it were fake, yesterday's final would have been the ideal trigger for either of them to drop the image, but it didn't happen. Rather the contrary. :shrug:

Do you feel like that just because of your dislike of Nadal, or because you think Roger's respect towards Raf troubles his mind and as such his game? Just a question, no trollish intentions or anything the like. :hug:First, I think it is mental and does cause Roger issues. Itís been said about a lot of players re: Roger that they like/respect him too much. Now Iím not suggesting that Roger just accepts losing to Nadal (nor do I think anyone is content to lose to Roger either). Obviously based on his reaction yesterday this loss killed him. But no doubt Nadal is in his head and it doesnít help that Nadal is out there always saying ĎRogerís the bestí, heís no 1, blah, blah, blah. Especially after beating him. I think Nadal genuinely likes Roger as a person. But I do think there is some gamesmanship with the way heís always praising Roger and painting himself as the underdog. Itís his way of taking the pressure off himself and putting it right back on Roger. I mean how often on clay has Nadal said he needs to play his best to beat Roger, when we all know thatís pure BS. Of course I donít expect him to say he can play below average and still win, but he wouldnít have to say anything at all. Call me a cynic but itís hard to know what is genuine humility vs false humility.

ExpectedWinner
07-07-2008, 05:13 PM
I still believe in a best of 5 match it will be tough for anyone not named Nadal (and maybe Djoker) to beat him.



It's enough to have Nadal and Djoker, both are very strong on their favorite surfaces and most often than not go deep in important topurnaments. Murray will present problems as well. And someone like Gulbis has a lot of room for improvement.

When Fed fired Roche, he "fired" his bh and volleys along with him , add here his detoriating movement. From now on players will be pinning him into his bh corner, than they will hit either a winner dtl, or make Fed hit a running fh. End of the rally. Fed can't hit fhs on the run anymore.

Then there is a fitness issue. Why did he look tired in the 5th set? For sure, the match was long, but it was interrupted by rain a couple of times. If this happens on grass, then it will not be better on hc. As we all know, USO doesn't have a day off between a semi and a final, this always favors younger players.

soraya
07-07-2008, 05:29 PM
First, I think it is mental and does cause Roger issues. Itís been said about a lot of players re: Roger that they like/respect him too much. Now Iím not suggesting that Roger just accepts losing to Nadal (nor do I think anyone is content to lose to Roger either). Obviously based on his reaction yesterday this loss killed him. But no doubt Nadal is in his head and it doesnít help that Nadal is out there always saying ĎRogerís the bestí, heís no 1, blah, blah, blah. Especially after beating him. I think Nadal genuinely likes Roger as a person. But I do think there is some gamesmanship with the way heís always praising Roger and painting himself as the underdog. Itís his way of taking the pressure off himself and putting it right back on Roger. I mean how often on clay has Nadal said he needs to play his best to beat Roger, when we all know thatís pure BS. Of course I donít expect him to say he can play below average and still win, but he wouldnít have to say anything at all. Call me a cynic but itís hard to know what is genuine humility vs false humility.

You know I don't think we would be happy if he ever dared to say that he is a better player than Rogi and so on. Personally I don't see any false humility, he is just stating the obvious, Fed is and has been the contender for RG and in every and each tourney he enters and he is the # 1, to me it will be false humility when Rafa gets the #1 and he will still consider Roger to be the real # 1 and so on.
Hope we can all move on, I am sure Roger will bounce back once he deals with his loss, he is more resilient and stronger than we think. By common consent he is considered the greatest player ever, regardless of how many more slams he wins and how many weeks he will stay at # 1.

ExpectedWinner
07-07-2008, 05:41 PM
That can be true but i still believe 1 more Slam is still within the reach.

Maybe he''ll be lucky and get someone like Gonzalez in the final.
There will be time when Nadal and Jerk will be fighting for the No1, feeling a lot of "pression", and then Fed can use it to his own advantage and sneak in.

Sunset of Age
07-07-2008, 05:44 PM
You know I don't think we would be happy if he ever dared to say that he is a better player than Rogi and so on. Personally I don't see any false humility, he is just stating the obvious, Fed is and has been the contender for RG and in every and each tourney he enters and he is the # 1, to me it will be false humility when Rafa gets the #1 and he will still consider Roger to be the real # 1 and so on.

That's my opinion as well.
I don't think it's any form of gamesmanship from Raf, he's just brought up to show proper respect to a player who he truly admires, and this is one of the ways he does so. If it were false, would Rafa have stood up for Roger when all this 'decline' talk came about a few months ago? I don't think so, in that case he would have remained dead silent... but he didn't.

I'm sure Raf will quit downgrading himself as soon as he hits the #1 spot himself, but I'm equally sure he'll never quit giving Roger the respect he deserves. :angel:

Hope we can all move on, I am sure Roger will bounce back once he deals with his loss, he is more resilient and stronger than we think. By common consent he is considered the greatest player ever, regardless of how many more slams he wins and how many weeks he will stay at # 1.

:yeah: - he's not made out of sugar, he's a professional athlete, considered by many as the best ever - that doesn't come from nowhere!

Marek.
07-07-2008, 06:05 PM
Time to dump this wretched thread off into the bottom of the forum. We need to move on (or at least try to).

Hopefully Fed will rebound. This year might be lost for him, but I still think he can win more slams and get those three more.

rofe
07-07-2008, 07:03 PM
It's enough to have Nadal and Djoker, both are very strong on their favorite surfaces and most often than not go deep in important topurnaments. Murray will present problems as well. And someone like Gulbis has a lot of room for improvement.
When Fed fired Roche, he "fired" his bh and volleys along with him , add here his detoriating movement. From now on players will be pinnig him into his bh corner, than make him hit a running fh. End of the rally. Fed can't hit fhs on the run anymore.

Fed will have to come down from his stubborn positions within his game. For all this talk about his versatility on court and his tactical genius, it was Nadal who had a solid game plan against Fed and executed it well.

Fed better learn to adapt (and get rid his pride) if he wants to win any more slams.

maskedmuffin
07-07-2008, 07:23 PM
As the thread starter - i officially close this thread and let it die in the middle of the ocean
:(

now..roger go find martina navratilova and fix the volleying mentality pronto
mm..k you can go for a break first :)

Marek.
07-07-2008, 07:33 PM
Yeah but Nadal didn't really have to change much other than his serve against Fed. His normal game is good enough to bother Roger without taking a lot of risks. Really, Fed was taking more risks in the latter stages of the match. Since his BH was complete shit he was demanding more from his FH and it held up until that penultimate game. Overall, Nadal was just the better player so can't really complain a whole lot about what Fed did.

I do agree though that some changes need to be made. He needs to take more advantage of the second serve and take control of the rallies much sooner. He can't hang around with a lot of players long enough these days so he has to attack sooner. I think a new coach is necessary.

nobama
07-08-2008, 12:12 AM
All this coach stuff is just messing with his head IMO. Not sure if he still plans to work with Higueras but last think he needs is ANOTHER person filling his head with all these things he needs to do.

Seems to me a lot of his issues now center around the mental side - for instance being tentative on BPs. And just the fact he's more defensive and not swinging as freely. I'm not suggesting there aren't things Roger needs to work on game wise, I just think his problems are more mental than anything else.

Federerhingis
07-08-2008, 12:16 AM
:tape: :o

Btw, a Swiss fan said that Roger will be playing doubles with Stan in Toronto. Can anybody confirm if that's true?

Could be true, they may play doubles at the Olympics, hence why they would want to play together and test out this partnership. ;)

Federerhingis
07-08-2008, 12:23 AM
Yeah but Nadal didn't really have to change much other than his serve against Fed. His normal game is good enough to bother Roger without taking a lot of risks. Really, Fed was taking more risks in the latter stages of the match. Since his BH was complete shit he was demanding more from his FH and it held up until that penultimate game. Overall, Nadal was just the better player so can't really complain a whole lot about what Fed did.

I do agree though that some changes need to be made. He needs to take more advantage of the second serve and take control of the rallies much sooner. He can't hang around with a lot of players long enough these days so he has to attack sooner. I think a new coach is necessary.

He just needs to recuperate his explosiveness when on the stretch or when running on the forehand side. He never had an awesome forehand on the run like Sampras but he used to cover this side quite comfortably. Now a days any decent player that can change the direction of the ball effectively can expose this and easily wrong foot Fed on this side.

His return of serve needs a major overhaul. However his return was more an excellent counteracting counterpunching tool, he used to just redirect pace so well from huge serves.

FedFan_2007
07-08-2008, 12:30 AM
Can you PLEASE close this thread and all grass threads?

Sunset of Age
07-08-2008, 12:42 AM
Can you PLEASE close this thread and all grass threads?

I see no reason for that, as long as there's an interesting discussion going on - at least for me it is interesting to read. :shrug:

Federerhingis
07-08-2008, 12:44 AM
hi folks; i was the threadstarter in this and it is a very very sad day;
I made a post on it at my blog, thought i would share it here
------------------------------------------------------------


:)

I do agree Federer's net sense is far from being the best, Tim Henman used to expose this quite a bit. Nonetheless, more than improve his volleying Federer just needs to find a way to recuperate his explosiveness off the ground. His strokes are lacking their usual zip and general pace. His movement has improved since Australia, but it is still so far from what it was even at last years masters cup.

crude oil
07-08-2008, 01:18 AM
What a crazy match...even a day after, i am still in awe.

Federer could have been immortalized as an invincible hero at wimbledon if he pulled it off.

The same thing happened at MC when he was looking to tie Mcenroe's record. He was soo close.

What a pity. Roger just couldnt string a few baseline pts together in the 5th set despite serving inhuman.

crude oil
07-08-2008, 01:22 AM
I do agree Federer's net sense is far from being the best, Tim Henman used to expose this quite a bit. Nonetheless, more than improve his volleying Federer just needs to find a way to recuperate his explosiveness off the ground. His strokes are lacking their usual zip and general pace. His movement has improved since Australia, but it is still so far from what it was even at last years masters cup.

yeah i agree. but its tough to ask because we cannot compare.

henman never faced anyone of the calibre of nadal. The closest thing he saw was hewitt and he looked like a clown whenever he played lleyton.

nadal is like 10x better than hewitt on passing shots because even his regular ones have so much dipping spin that all the volleys are made below the level of the net-->you cant stick those volleys with any degree of consistency.

nadal also has much more feel and intuition for the court than hewitt ever did which makes him produce some ridiculous angles and even :scared: slice passing shots.

crude oil
07-08-2008, 01:23 AM
nadal crushed some bhs from like 15 feet behind the baseline.

I mean what the heck do you do?

Federerhingis
07-08-2008, 01:49 AM
nadal crushed some bhs from like 15 feet behind the baseline.

I mean what the heck do you do?

Yup he's just physically that gifted. There's not much you can do but try and hope that that's good enough.

Marek.
07-08-2008, 02:01 AM
I do agree Federer's net sense is far from being the best, Tim Henman used to expose this quite a bit. Nonetheless, more than improve his volleying Federer just needs to find a way to recuperate his explosiveness off the ground. His strokes are lacking their usual zip and general pace. His movement has improved since Australia, but it is still so far from what it was even at last years masters cup.

I thought his FH looked pretty good but his BH was pathetic. He's basically lost all confidence in that shot. I mean, how many times did he even do a full follow through during the match?

NYCtennisfan
07-08-2008, 02:17 AM
I thought his FH looked pretty good but his BH was pathetic. He's basically lost all confidence in that shot. I mean, how many times did he even do a full follow through during the match?

ONce or twice I think which is horrible.

NYCtennisfan
07-08-2008, 02:20 AM
What a crazy match...even a day after, i am still in awe.

Federer could have been immortalized as an invincible hero at wimbledon if he pulled it off.

The same thing happened at MC when he was looking to tie Mcenroe's record. He was soo close.

What a pity. Roger just couldnt string a few baseline pts together in the 5th set despite serving inhuman.

He needed one more point at 4-3 BP and even though the overall match would be about the same, he would feel invincible after escaping the jaws of defeat.

His other chance was in the first game Nadal served. He had 0-15, then at 15-15, Nadal appeared to hit long and Fed was sure of it as it was right at his feet--he didn't even play the ball. Shot spot shows that it was in and Federer can't believe it and looks disgustingly over at the ump. That would've been 15-30. He just dragged his feet on return since that point I think hoping for Nadal miscues that never came.

NYCtennisfan
07-08-2008, 02:27 AM
He just needs to recuperate his explosiveness when on the stretch or when running on the forehand side. He never had an awesome forehand on the run like Sampras but he used to cover this side quite comfortably. Now a days any decent player that can change the direction of the ball effectively can expose this and easily wrong foot Fed on this side.

His return of serve needs a major overhaul. However his return was more an excellent counteracting counterpunching tool, he used to just redirect pace so well from huge serves.

What's really interesting is that it's really only against Nadal and to an extent Djoko that he has this problem. Everyone else he's content to get into rallies with because he'll win the majority of them in the long run.

Here's the other thing about his matchup with Nadal. Everyone talks about the lefty FH to his BH which is his big bugaboo, but there is more. Federer loves going CC FH, getting CC replies and then going DTL and to net. It's his favorite combo, but he has no confidence in it after being passed so many times by that running FH. He then doesn't use that like he does against others.

Another thing he doesn't use is the short BH slice CC to draw the opponent to net because it goes right into the Nadal FH. If you look back at all of his big matches in slams and TMS events and maybe not even the big matches, I bet you'll find that 60-70% of the games that he breaks in he uses this shot. Marat mentioned how Fed likes using this shot in tense situations and it's so true. He doesn't have that against Nadal. Lastly, he doesn't have CC slice against Nadal because that will sit up and he'll be pulled off court. Add all this up with his reluctance to go to net after being passed again and again, and it leaves him completely out of his comfort zone.

NYCtennisfan
07-08-2008, 02:30 AM
hi folks; i was the threadstarter in this and it is a very very sad day;
I made a post on it at my blog, thought i would share it here
------------------------------------------------------------



Well folks - it has happened. Rafael Nadal is your 2008 wimbledon champion. Let me repeat that, rafael nadal is your 2008 wimbledon champion, having bested Roger federer in what most believe was not just the greatest wimbledon final of all time, but the greatest final in the history of the game. It is probably a logical conclusion to reach, given the improvement in racket technology, player training regiments, and overall athlecisim required of the current generation of athletes to maintain concentration while hitting serves, forehands and backhands at 100+ miles per hour; The quality of tennis exhibited yesterday per these standards certainly blows finals of yesteryear out the window.

And it was a very very high quality match; As a few of you may have picked up on, i am not a large fan of the man from mallorca, and a huge fan of the swiss maestro, so this is a particularly difficult post to write. I wanted to reserve judgement on the match after watching it, as i was in commute the whole day, and after a few hours to digest the excitement, some sober conclusions have been reached, some both Nadal and Federer fans will probably disagree with; If that is you reading this blog, please, feel free to leave a comment.

First of, give Nadal credit. He is the mentally toughest player in the game today, probably of all time. His resiliance when faced with adversity is almost as superhuman as those biceps he sports. We were all expecting the wilt in the 5th; After an amazing tie break that guided him to within 1 point of the championship only to have federer drop the bottom out from underneath him, any other normal athlete would have immediately been broken in the subsequent set. And he certainly was teetering; Nadalís desire to win this tournament guided him in this situation, and i believe the rain delay at 2-2 40-40 actually helped him refocus and assuage some of the worries that may have been creeping up in his mind.

Nadal played a very clean match, more winners than errors, and converted on the break point opportunities presented to him.

But to me, despite Nadalís win, this match is more of an indictment on Federer than it is on the greatness of Nadal. Forget all the statistics, forget all the percentages, just watch the match from a strategical, chess perspective, and one will realize why roger the great, unfortunately and to my chagrin, cannot be compared to players like rafter and sampras on this surface.

Rafter?! I know what some of you are thinking; How dare you put rafter in the same sentence with pete, and then try to make a comparison to roger. If anything it should be pete,roger, and then pat. Ahh, but folks this is not about # of championships. This is about the mentality which i had emphatically called out the rest of the field on in my prior posting - the style to play against nadal on the crucial and critical points.

Roger federer does not have a classical agressive grass court game. Martina navratilova is a classical agressive grass court player. Pat rafter and sampras, and this is where my analogy will begin to make sense, are ideal examplifiers of the agress grass court game in menís tennis; The former moreso with being a serve-and-volleyer, frequent chip-and-charger, the latter a server first- volleyer second, and occasional chip and charger.

What do all three of these players have in common? Net Sense. Roger federer lost this match because he too often than not places himself in harder positions then required to hit volleys. This is due to the lacsadasical approach he takes coming into net, as he is extremely indecisive when to come in. He will watch his shot first, hesitate, and then come in. Against most others, this may work, against nadal it is his undoing. Even the slightest bit of hesitency costs him, as time and time again he is made to hit shoestring volleys due to poor positioning

Furthermore, roger federer does not try to traditionally punch the volleys; He likes to carve the volleys. He likes to even, *gasp*, do the unthinkable, drop his racquet head down below net level to put underspin on volleys. Except here is the problem, he is not very good with this approach. There is a term in tennis called ďsticking volleys.Ē Federer did this for a set and a half against sampras in 2001. Watch him now, and you can see how the last 5 years of his dominance from the baseline has caused him to become extremely lazy in his approach at net.

Net is not about looking good; Net is about having the pitbull mentality of getting the job done. Dainty volleying cost Roger federer a 6th consecutive championship.

It is not just his actual volleying skills that are below par for a champion; It is his inability to dissect the opponents percentages while at net. This is what made johnny mac a genious, and stefan edberg a similar one at net. They knew what spin they were imparting on the ball based on the volley, and immediately calculated what the possibility was for the opponent to either pull the ball cross court or go up the line, and covered accordingly. In tennis, this is called anticipation. There were numerous times in the first couple of sets, where federer really had the large majority of his break changes, where roger would lounge into net on the rafa backhand side, only to look incredulously over at his opponent as nadal literally swept backhand after backhand cross court. Any adjustment from federer to poach towards the cross court, even when approaching off a blistering down the line forehand? Nope. Continued to cover the more difficult-to-execute, lower percentage down the line-on-the-full-run-rafa-backhand. I, a recreational player, was able to pick up on nadalís propensity to give away the cross court sweeping backhand (he drops his wrists and begins a sweeping motion paralleling the baseline with hips perpendicular to sed baseline for those wondering) two shots into it; Mcenroe harped on it immediately. Did federer adjust? nope

This may finally be the wake up call that federer needs to take volleying seriously once again. He is an amazing on-the-ball timing player, one who can belt forehands and backhands with the best of them. Yet his game is the most difficult game to execute due to how much pressure he places on himself to meet the ball early, and whip through it across both wings. There is very little if any margin for error, and with the dimming light it was only a matter of time before the errors creeped back in his game and nadal took that title. Its a pity, because if he had an actual fall back plan, an actual solid volleying game, the scoreline would have looked much different.

-------------------------------

In closing, all i can say is; Roger you need to bring on john mcenroe as a volley coach, or pat rafter. Those 2
They will teach you all you need to know about it. Rest of your game is rock solid, but as you get older, the wisdom of these 2 will help you win majors like wimby much much easier.

What do you guys think? Or do you think that is just the "mentality" of the player; i.e. roger ain't all deep testosterone agressive ? He is the "carver"

Actually forger john or pat

just get martina navratilova. She was more agressive and better volleyer than the lot. And her "mentality" for volleying is all roger needs to pick up on. A true champion :)

This is an excellent post although I've seen Federer make all kinds of volleys when he's confident up at net. His volleying against Safin in the AO SF in 2005 was amazing even though Safin was hitting the hell out of the ball. I don't think he'll ever be confident that he'll be able to read where Nadal is going with the passing shot because he's seen so many impossible shots from all angles and positions go by him. It's also very interesting to look at his face when he gets passed by an amazing shot and the crowd applauds loudly...he doesn't like being shown up and makes him even more reluctant to go to net.

I'll say this though about the match yesterday--he had some of his best success staying back in the 3rd set and 4th set TB's relying solely on his inside-out FH.

SUKTUEN
07-08-2008, 03:49 AM
I miss Roger~~~:D

Mrs. B
07-08-2008, 05:21 AM
so if Nadal becomes nr. 1 the so called Fedal fans become Naderer fans? :p

Marek.
07-08-2008, 05:23 AM
Another thing he doesn't use is the short BH slice CC to draw the opponent to net because it goes right into the Nadal FH. If you look back at all of his big matches in slams and TMS events and maybe not even the big matches, I bet you'll find that 60-70% of the games that he breaks in he uses this shot. Marat mentioned how Fed likes using this shot in tense situations and it's so true. He doesn't have that against Nadal. Lastly, he doesn't have CC slice against Nadal because that will sit up and he'll be pulled off court. Add all this up with his reluctance to go to net after being passed again and again, and it leaves him completely out of his comfort zone.

I always thought he didn't do this enough against Nadal but in that match he hit a few as good as he could yet Nadal hit great forehands off of it.

so if Nadal becomes nr. 1 the so called Fedal fans become Naderer fans? :p

I thought we just called them glory hunters? :confused:

(Just kidding Karin ;) :p)

crude oil
07-08-2008, 05:44 AM
He needed one more point at 4-3 BP and even though the overall match would be about the same, he would feel invincible after escaping the jaws of defeat.

His other chance was in the first game Nadal served. He had 0-15, then at 15-15, Nadal appeared to hit long and Fed was sure of it as it was right at his feet--he didn't even play the ball. Shot spot shows that it was in and Federer can't believe it and looks disgustingly over at the ump. That would've been 15-30. He just dragged his feet on return since that point I think hoping for Nadal miscues that never came.

im not sure if federer can count on miscues from rafa.

Ive seen federer hit winners early in games against opponents and then on break points use his defense + counter punching ability to win points. He usually just chips the return and uses his exceptional movement to get the error from the opponent.

Nadal just doesn miss with his ridiculous topspin and he has such sensible shot selection. He rarely makes stupid decisions. Federer cannot count on mistakes from rafa when rafa is that tough mentally. It may work on a few occasions - 3rd and 4th set but the 5th set rafa stepped it up. He stepped up also on BPs in RG 2007 and in the MC 06,Rome 06, MC 07, MC 08 etc.

Marek.
07-08-2008, 06:05 AM
I think if Fed could somehow win the Olympics, that would help him get over the loss big time. Especially since this is basically his last chance and he has already won Wimbledon plus has a few more chances to win it again. He keeps on mentioning on how much it would mean to him.

OTOH, if he has a bad loss there......I won't get into that :tape:

MissMoJo
07-08-2008, 06:19 AM
It's the story of almost every one of their matches: Roger has countless chances and can't convert, partly because of Nadal's play and his own scared, boneheaded tactics. Nadal gets very few, pounces on them and holds on for dear life. At worst it should've been one set all before that first rain delay but.....yeah, that's where the match was lost imo. I don't know how he managed to escape that 4th set tb but, as thrilled as I was to see him even get to a 5th, it felt like he was prolonging the inevitable. After the monumental effort expended to come back from 0-2, to break serve in the final set, considering his lack of success all match long and the history of him coming up short in every one of these 'classic' matches(with the exception of last year I guess) seemed like too big of an ask. I'm just so sad it had to happen at Wimbledon, to Nadal and especially this year. Truly heartbreaking .

A part of me is relieved that now they can put the pressure on someone else to live up to goat stature, and all the impossible standards that come with it. Let whoever the new sensation is feel the heat, and see how they handle it. It's a cross that Roger has had to bear for too long. Except that I'm really concerned about how this loss and losing #1, the position he's always prided himself in holding, is going to affect his already fragile confidence. As much as he insisted that he wasn't reading the press after RG, I didn't buy it, and there's no way that constantly reading and being told how great Nadal is, how supposedly washed up you are and how you have to achieve something that no man in the history of the game has ever done just to redeem yourself, can't have been weighing heavily on him during the match. How he recovers from this mentally is what I'm anxious to see. As for his game, can anyone tell me what purpose Luthi serves? Since this partnership started I haven't read any articles or interviews about what if anything he brings to his role as coach.

After this result I know it's tempting even for fans to rush to judgement, but just like the AO, Roger had a hand in this loss and there were things within his control that didn't have anything to do with physical decline that could've affected the outcome. Until I see him blown off the court in a slam other than RG, I'm not writing off his chances of winning another. Of course,only time will tell.


On another note reports about the final have been inescapable. I had on Access Hollywood and TMZ in the background noise and had to lunge for the remote because even they took precious time away from reporting about what Madonna had for lunch and cut short exclusive video of them stalking whichever famewhore of the week for pictures of Nadal and mentions of the match. I don't remember there being this much coverage of any of Roger's wins. Ugghh.

FedFan_2007
07-08-2008, 06:32 AM
Just watched the interview with JMac. Truly gut wrenching. Ironic that he was interviewed by the same guy who ended the other 5-Wimbly-winning streak.

crude oil
07-08-2008, 06:55 AM
Yup he's just physically that gifted. There's not much you can do but try and hope that that's good enough.

its not just physique...he has the talent to exploit his physique.;)

nadal is not some hulk. He is a terrific athlete but he is not a bodybuilder.

FairWeatherFan
07-08-2008, 06:56 AM
Please everyone, sign the petition I have created to the Wimbledon organisers to increase the speed of the grass. http://www.petitiononline.com/fastgras/petition.html

refero*fervens
07-08-2008, 07:10 AM
Oh, what a tough loss :sad:. I had to leave after the first rain delay but I had a feeling he'd pushed it to five sets. Proud that he fought like hell to keep his kingdom yet very sad, of course. Devastated for Roger, I hope he can bounce back from this one. It was heartbreaking, all thoughts with the guy. :hug: If we mere fans feel like this, I could only imagine his thoughts...:sad:

Thank you all for the posting of interviews and analysis, which I'm sorry I can't add to as of now cos I'm still feeling a bit hollow and achey. Plus I'll have to wait a while probably before I can bring myself to watch the last three sets. Or any media coverage :o Ooh, the bit where he compares it to the RG loss and how the Wimby one is of course more ... it's just painful.

I don't doubt in his ability in procuring more slams - it's just the mental effects of this loss that I hope won't resound. Because it is a much bigger thing in Roger's mind. And it couldn't have come at a worse time, compounded by all the media nay-saying, everything. When else has not winning a slam meant so much...

I guess every legend has at least one spectacular, significant loss in his career. Looks like this is Roger's. (Just let it not be a big downward turning point).
And let it be said that to break his magnificent grass streak it took an excellent player 9-7 in the fifth - congrats to Nadal. And while now, obviously, 'zero consolation' :sad:, maybe at the end of his career we can look at the loss with a different perspective. I like how they used 'run "interrupted" rather than 'ended' on rf.com. Hmm. The near future will be telling.

Alright, that's enough of my end of the worldish rant. Just needed to get that out. I think it was meant to be somewhat balanced, hehe, if not exactly optimistic - bit difficult with the emotional fan attachment - I swear in most parts of my life I am a completely rational person :p. Roger Federer, making the sane crazy, amongst other things. :rolleyes:.

crude oil, re: the immortality point: :awww: Yeah, true.

NYCtennisfan
07-08-2008, 09:08 AM
On another note reports about the final have been inescapable. I had on Access Hollywood and TMZ in the background noise and had to lunge for the remote because even they took precious time away from reporting about what Madonna had for lunch and cut short exclusive video of them stalking whichever famewhore of the week for pictures of Nadal and mentions of the match. I don't remember there being this much coverage of any of Roger's wins. Ugghh.

This match has received more attention here in the states than any tennis match in a long, long time. ESPN usually spends about a minute on the final, but they had review after review of it. Local news mentioned it, it's all over the sports boards (basketball and other sports boards have it as an Off-topic item), and so on. The circumstances alone make it difficult for a match to supercede this one. You have an all-time rivalry, you have a #2 nipping at the heels of the most dominant #1 in history, 5 Wimbledons in a row on the line, grass streak, #1 basically on the line, they play all afternoon through 2 rain delays, they play an amazing TB'er, there's an amazing comeback, etc. etc. They finally have a match to replace Borg vs. McEnroe for all the rain delays.

Xing
07-08-2008, 10:15 AM
It is heartbreaking that Roger lost in such a way. He fights so hard and deserves a better result.
It is tough to accept the fact that he did not win those epic matches (AO 05 semi, Rome 06 final, 08 Wimbledon final). The one he won was the Wimbledon final last year, but now it is shadowed by this year final. :(

trickcy
07-08-2008, 10:18 AM
It is heartbreaking that Roger lost in such a way. He fights so hard and deserves a better result.
It is tough to accept the fact that he didn't win those epic matches (AO 05 semi, Rome 06 final, 08 Wimbledon final). The one he won was the Wimbledon final last year, but now it is shadowed by this year final. :(

I understand ,but it's not often he gets stretched to five sets, ( or atleast it used to be like that :awww:)and when he is, it means that the opponents is playing some exceptional tennis. He won against Sampras in 2001 and against Tipsy this year too.. but I still hate that he lost these matches :( especially yesterday :(

yanchr
07-08-2008, 01:31 PM
Finally found some strength to go back reading the stuff here. Thanks everybody for the objective analysis.

Apart from the obvious things, I myself couldn't think of anything during and after the match. I was completely drained from the drama, or more precisely, the torture and continuous heart attacks lasting for 7 hours, and was devastated afterwards. I'm not sure how Roger will be able to get through this and recover very soon. I now can understand why Borg retired all of a sudden. It could be all over for Roger now with the bottom line broken, but as the Roger we know, it just won't happen I believe. I now just hope he can recover sooner than I think he will. This one really hurt.

Hard things happen in life to everybody, which sometimes you really think you are not going to make it at that particular moment. But then you are surprised that you find some power and you are able to make it. I know that Roger is not getting any younger, quicker and sharper, things are only getting tougher and tougher, but I still believe he has sth left in him to do more wonders. He is Roger Federer for a reason.

The important thing is to move on from now, no matter how hard the past days have been. The future is always more important than the past, even if the future means harder and tougher.

jtipson
07-08-2008, 02:11 PM
...I'm not sure how Roger will be able to get through this and recover very soon. I now can understand why Borg retired all of a sudden. It could be all over for Roger now with the bottom line broken, but as the Roger we know, it just won't happen I believe. I now just hope he can recover sooner than I think he will. This one really hurt...

I was a bit worried about that too, but then remembered what Borg said to Sue Barker on the beeb just before the match: that when he lost his sixth final, he didn't feel anything afterwards, which was very strange for him and he wondered whether he could continue the routine much longer. In contrast, it was evident that Roger had very strong feelings about his loss on Sunday, so I don't think he's at the stage where he's going to give up any time soon.

...the torture and continuous heart attacks lasting for 7 hours... That's a very apt way of describing it, unfortunately - exactly the same for me.

Or Levy
07-08-2008, 02:26 PM
I don't think Roger is going to retire, at all.

It is going to hit him hard, and be akward on his first few days back, with everyone's reactions... but a decent draw in Toronto, and a few matches under his belt, he would feel a lot better and look forward to his next few challanges - the Olympics, the USO, and getting as many points as possible.

This is going to hurt for a long while, but he would recover.

Or Levy
07-08-2008, 02:27 PM
That's a very apt way of describing it, unfortunately - exactly the same for me.

And Exactly the same for me. Sigh.

yanchr
07-08-2008, 02:38 PM
That's a very apt way of describing it, unfortunately - exactly the same for me.
To the end of the match, my commentators were saying after some rallies that they were also having heart attacks...and they were pretty neutral, or, a bit biased in favor of Nadal.

Up to this point, you seriously think it was way too much. You couldn't take any pleasure from watching the match. You couldn't enjoy its greatness at all. All you were through were stress, nerves, pain, agony...No fun, not healthy. My body was still aching today because of the extreme stress and screaming the day before...serious exhaustion. But unfortunately, one couldn't help...

Mrs. B
07-08-2008, 03:22 PM
Up to this point, you seriously think it was way too much. You couldn't take any pleasure from watching the match. You couldn't enjoy its greatness at all. All you were through were stress, nerves, pain, agony...No fun, not healthy. My body was still aching today because of the extreme stress and screaming the day before...serious exhaustion. But unfortunately, one couldn't help...

my sentiments exactly. i must have died a hundred times on Sunday just from the whole anxiety and like you, had an aching body on Monday, neck and shoulders very tense and stiff.

Laura, i thought of you and and knew how you felt. :hug:

rofe
07-08-2008, 03:29 PM
Finally found some strength to go back reading the stuff here. Thanks everybody for the objective analysis.

Apart from the obvious things, I myself couldn't think of anything during and after the match. I was completely drained from the drama, or more precisely, the torture and continuous heart attacks lasting for 7 hours, and was devastated afterwards. I'm not sure how Roger will be able to get through this and recover very soon. I now can understand why Borg retired all of a sudden. It could be all over for Roger now with the bottom line broken, but as the Roger we know, it just won't happen I believe. I now just hope he can recover sooner than I think he will. This one really hurt.

Hard things happen in life to everybody, which sometimes you really think you are not going to make it at that particular moment. But then you are surprised that you find some power and you are able to make it. I know that Roger is not getting any younger, quicker and sharper, things are only getting tougher and tougher, but I still believe he has sth left in him to do more wonders. He is Roger Federer for a reason.

The important thing is to move on from now, no matter how hard the past days have been. The future is always more important than the past, even if the future means harder and tougher.

This is the part I will never understand. I guess, fans react in different ways to a match but to be emotionally and physically drained because your favorite tennis player is having to struggle out there is something beyond my comprehension. I don't know Roger personally so I don't feel any personal involvement beyond the match itself - that is, it doesn't affect me once the match is done. I guess it is different strokes for different folks and I hope you are doing better now.

Federerhingis
07-08-2008, 03:33 PM
its not just physique...he has the talent to exploit his physique.;)

nadal is not some hulk. He is a terrific athlete but he is not a bodybuilder.


I did not mean it in that way, he's just so much more physically stronger and can generate a lot more pace. Besides no one moves faster on court than him. His agility is surely unsurpassed at the moment. Add to this better than average anticipation, therefore a good reason for his fantastic results.

yanchr
07-08-2008, 03:41 PM
This is the part I will never understand. I guess, fans react in different ways to a match but to be emotionally and physically drained because your favorite tennis player is having to struggle out there is something beyond my comprehension. I don't know Roger personally so I don't feel any personal involvement beyond the match itself - that is, it doesn't affect me once the match is done. I guess it is different strokes for different folks and I hope you are doing better now.
Yes, I know that some fans will never understand. While there are a lot of people who are feeling the same way as I do, there are also some who are feeling the same way as you do. I wish I can be objective, calm and kind of enjoy the match for its own good, not have to worry about the outcome the emotions and stuff, but it's just not possible. It is beyond my own control.

I think I kind of recover quite quickly most of the time. This one takes a bit longer - two days or so. But I'm doing fine now. Thanks. :)

glycina
07-08-2008, 03:58 PM
Please everyone, sign the petition I have created to the Wimbledon organisers to increase the speed of the grass. http://www.petitiononline.com/fastgras/petition.html

I agree with you.
I will mention this in the japanese site too.

Puschkin
07-08-2008, 04:02 PM
Up to this point, you seriously think it was way too much. You couldn't take any pleasure from watching the match. You couldn't enjoy its greatness at all. All you were through were stress, nerves, pain, agony...No fun, not healthy. My body was still aching today because of the extreme stress and screaming the day before...serious exhaustion....

I know I'm gonna make myself enemies, but a comment like this clearly shows: You love the man, not the sport, in a way which is unhealthy.

Of course, I would have preferred Roger to win, like all of you. But this is sport: Watching it should not make you sick.

nobama
07-08-2008, 04:08 PM
I know I'm gonna make myself enemies, but a comment like this clearly shows: You love the man, not the sport, in a way which is unhealthy.You know this is an interesting comment beceause I often times wonder myself if it's the tennis itself or just Roger that keeps my interest - because I am interested in things Roger does off the court. But at the same time, even though I was bummed on Sunday when he lost and it wrecked my day, once I got back to work on Monday I was fine and was thinking about other things. I guess as much as I admire Roger as a tennis player and a wonderful human being, because I don't know him personally I don't have that attachment. I know some fans that post on his site have met him several times so I guess I can understand where the emotional attachment might be greater for them.

yanchr
07-08-2008, 04:16 PM
I know I'm gonna make myself enemies, but a comment like this clearly shows: You love the man, not the sport, in a way which is unhealthy.
You are not enemies and I'm not denying this either. But I also couldn't care less about his other things outside tennis. Probably the best way to put is, I love the man's tennis :angel: I'll also deny that loving the man means you don't love the sport, or you know nothing about the sport - purely fangirl/boy, which is pretty much the idea that prevails in MTF.

And yes, it is not healthy.

Sunset of Age
07-08-2008, 04:43 PM
You know this is an interesting comment beceause I often times wonder myself if it's the tennis itself or just Roger that keeps my interest - because I am interested in things Roger does off the court. But at the same time, even though I was bummed on Sunday when he lost and it wrecked my day, once I got back to work on Monday I was fine and was thinking about other things. I guess as much as I admire Roger as a tennis player and a wonderful human being, because I don't know him personally I don't have that attachment. I know some fans that post on his site have met him several times so I guess I can understand where the emotional attachment might be greater for them.

That's my sentiment as well.
I was feeling bad for him Sunday, and even still get some bolts of 'shudder!' when I think of his loss, but it's not like I feel gutted or anything (completely apart from the fact that my other fav won, of course). It's part of the life of a pro tennis player, losses DO happen, even if it's a very bad one like this one. It's not like somebody died or anything...
I trust him to be able to recover fully and come back all strong and happy! :D

I don't know if it's different if you've met him personally. I've had that pleasure twice (although very shortly of course), but it didn't make much difference to me I think..

trickcy
07-08-2008, 04:53 PM
Well, I obviously would have preferred Roger winning, and I didn't like the fact that he lost. But that's where for me it stops. Sure, when I opened the papers yesterday and today, I wasn't on top on the world, but it's over, and that's it.
But to each their own.:D

Federerhingis
07-08-2008, 04:55 PM
You know this is an interesting comment beceause I often times wonder myself if it's the tennis itself or just Roger that keeps my interest - because I am interested in things Roger does off the court. But at the same time, even though I was bummed on Sunday when he lost and it wrecked my day, once I got back to work on Monday I was fine and was thinking about other things. I guess as much as I admire Roger as a tennis player and a wonderful human being, because I don't know him personally I don't have that attachment. I know some fans that post on his site have met him several times so I guess I can understand where the emotional attachment might be greater for them.

I totally agree it's not only Rogers great tennis skills that made me a fan and an admirer, it's his down to earth nature that is very admirable. He just seems like such a likeable person. His philosohpy in life too is so endearing. "It is nice to be important but its more important to be nice". :worship:

SUKTUEN
07-08-2008, 04:58 PM
I totally agree it's not only Rogers great tennis skills that made me a fan and an admirer, it's his down to earth nature that is very admirable. He just seems like such a likeable person. His philosohpy in life too is so endearing. "It is nice to be important but its more important to be nice". :worship:

Roger is a nice guy! He is so cute~~~~:bigcry::bigcry:

RogiFan88
07-09-2008, 05:36 AM
still feeling a little down for Rogi and hoping that he has had enough time to get over his toughest loss ever (never wanted the "dream" final at Wimby)and get right back on the horse in two short weeks for Toronto... it will be his toughest second-half of season, w everything to defend and TFA just over a TMS away from No 1 (finally!)

I don't expect much from Rogi from now on this year -- he needs a total break fr all the hoopla, the negativity and the overwhelming pressure and scrutiny.

Nevertheless, I shall cheer him on in TO and beyond. Just wish Beijing wasn't happening...

Minnie
07-09-2008, 11:20 PM
I see nothing wrong with "fan worship" - after all, don't some "worship" so-called celebs - pop stars/actors or whoever? And if you're going "worship" someone, or have a hero, be a fan, I think Roger is a much better role model than these so-called Z list (sorry, I mean A list of whatever they are) celebs. I always remember what Goldie Hawn said to him on some show ... her fame depends on whether the public like her or not .. but Roger has had to go out and earn his popularity/affection etc by hard fought victories.

I'm sure he'll come to terms with this loss though it may take a little while. As he said in an interview, he has to learn to accept that he's not Wimbledon champion anymore. That won't happen in a couple of days - this was the biggest loss to him of his career. Only the hardest heart could not have felt sympathy for him on Sunday night.

soraya
07-10-2008, 06:18 AM
wow! handsome guy in your signature Jen.