Quarterfinalists' performances in this Moonballing event [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Quarterfinalists' performances in this Moonballing event

Black Adam
06-02-2008, 10:44 PM
Hi all,
All the Quarterfinals are set in this moonballing event and I thought we could look at how the quarter finalists are playing so far. The Stats are really revealing about this whole moonball fest in erms of winners per game and Unforced errors per game. By the way the winners exclude service winners because I want to show you how the players are performing with their ground games. Whilst this tournament has had its moment of Drama the overall game play is disappointing.

Federer

Games Played:126
Winners per Game:0.67
Unforced Errors per Game:0.86
Break Point Conversion:46%
Break Points Saved:72%

Gonzalez

Games Played:148
Winners per Game:0.7
Unforced Errors per Game:0.93
Break Point Conversion:42%
Break Points Saved:79%

Monfils

Games Played:149
Winners per Game:0.79
Unforced Errors per Game:0.89
Break Point Conversion:55%
Break Points Saved:43%

Ferrer

Games Played:135
Winners per Game:0.56
Unforced Errors per Game:0.7
Break Point Conversion:60%
Break Points Saved:71%

Djokovic

Games Played:129
Winners per Game:0.59
Unforced Errors per Game:0.68
Break Point Conversion:55%
Break Points Saved:60%

Gulbis

Games Played:130
Winners per Game:0.91 :yeah:
Unforced Errors per Game: 1.03 :rolleyes:
Break Point Conversion:38%
Break Points Saved:49%

Almagro

Games Played:138
Winners per Game:0.85 :yeah:
Unforced Errors per Game:1.01 :o
Break Point Conversion:37%
Break Points Saved:61.4%

Nadal

Games Played:95
Winners per Game:0.46
Unforced Errors per Game:0.71
Break Point Conversion:61%
Break Points Saved:71%

Albop
06-02-2008, 11:45 PM
RG winners stats sucks ;)

DrJules
06-03-2008, 12:09 AM
Monfil 3 out of 8 for winners per game ahead of Federer, Djokovic and Nadal, but in another thread called a moonballer.:eek:

FedFan_2007
06-03-2008, 12:17 AM
Fed is just a moonballing pusher.

Black Adam
06-03-2008, 10:31 AM
Monfils 3 out of 8 for winners per game ahead of Federer, Djokovic and Nadal, but in another thread called a moonballer.:eek:
I know, reading the Fedtards' description of Roger's awesome shot making you would expect him to be averaging more than 2 winners per game. Anyways we will just say it's because of the clay surface.

Deivid23
06-03-2008, 10:38 AM
Monfils having better ratio of winners than Federer tells you enough about how much RG stats suck this year :o

Bazooka
06-03-2008, 10:40 AM
Thanks for the stats. However, the earlier rounds in the case of Nadal have been cake matches, he will go more for winners today for sure. Sometimes, just moonballing is not enough...

Bilbo
06-03-2008, 10:41 AM
federer playing worse than last year

TheSwissMaster
06-03-2008, 10:49 AM
Thanks for the stats. However, the earlier rounds in the case of Nadal have been cake matches, he will go more for winners today for sure. Sometimes, just moonballing is not enough...

moonballers cannot hit winners
secondly if he cant hit winners in cake matches then....

3rd damn at rogers BP conversion rate. looks like we are going to see another RG final of roger missing 3435354645656 BP chances.:mad:

Apemant
06-03-2008, 11:57 AM
So I gather you didn't exactly notice that the stats this year are completely messed up. :devil:

Update: actually, now I checked all the matches again and it seems they've updated them. But now they look wrong again, albeit in completely opposite way. Now it seems Fed hit 229 winners (excluding aces) in 126 games - 1.82 per game, which is definitely too high.

Anyway: trust your eyes more than dubious or suspicious looking stats. Fed isn't a moonballer an no amount of stats will convince me otherwise. :p


Edit: OMG now they messed it up BIG time! The stats for Ljubo vs. Monfils are definitely wrong, the match was piss poor and no way they hit so many winners as the stats claim. OMG what an incompetent lot those stat guys at RG. :rolleyes:

Bazooka
06-03-2008, 12:10 PM
moonballers cannot hit winners
secondly if he cant hit winners in cake matches then....

3rd damn at rogers BP conversion rate. looks like we are going to see another RG final of roger missing 3435354645656 BP chances.:mad:

Hamburg Final 2008

WINNERS

Winners (by Swing Type) Federer Nadal
Forehand 12 14
Forehand Return 1 0
Forehand Pass 0 2
Backhand 3 2
Backhand Return 0 0
Backhand Pass 0 5
Volley - Forehand 8 4
Volley - Backhand 9 2
Other Winners 0 1

kafemotor
06-03-2008, 12:25 PM
Good topic IM0. I don't follow all the match so to see how accurate the stats was. Tnq Apemant for the correction...

Rogiman
06-03-2008, 12:31 PM
Monfils having better ratio of winners than Federer tells you enough about how much RG stats suck this year :o
Agree. Not reliable at all.
federer playing worse than last year
Disagree. He's actually playing better. Not better than 2006 though.

Black Adam
06-03-2008, 12:45 PM
So I gather you didn't exactly notice that the stats this year are completely messed up. :devil:

Update: actually, now I checked all the matches again and it seems they've updated them. But now they look wrong again, albeit in completely opposite way. Now it seems Fed hit 229 winners (excluding aces) in 126 games - 1.82 per game, which is definitely too high.

Anyway: trust your eyes more than dubious or suspicious looking stats. Fed isn't a moonballer an no amount of stats will convince me otherwise. :p


Edit: OMG now they messed it up BIG time! The stats for Ljubo vs. Monfils are definitely wrong, the match was piss poor and no way they hit so many winners as the stats claim. OMG what an incompetent lot those stat guys at RG. :rolleyes:
Don't worry my stats are very reliable because I didn't use the completed matches section of the Roland Garros website, instead I went under Tournament stats where the stats are more like what I saw during the matches.

My stats exclude service winners. I used the Roland Garros website. Click on players==> Tournament Statistics and they will give you a table with accurate stats on games played and winners. For example check the Federer Stats. (http://www.rolandgarros.com/en_FR/bios/stats/atpf324.html)They are different from those under matches completed because they don't count forced errors and service winners.

BTW, having watched most of the matches I can tell you that most of the points are won off opponents' Unforced Errors, even in Federer's matches with the exception of the one vs Ancic where both players where winning the majority of the points with winners.

Black Adam
06-03-2008, 12:51 PM
I find it interesting that the players who are really going for winners (Almagro and Gulbis) also have the worst break point conversion of the lot. This means that moonballing is securing a break of serve by waiting for an UE :help: The grass season can't come soon enough.

Black Adam
06-03-2008, 12:53 PM
Don't worry my stats are very reliable because I didn't use the completed matches section of the Roland Garros website, instead I went under Tournament stats where the stats are more like what I saw during the matches.

My stats exclude service winners. I used the Roland Garros website. Click on players==> Tournament Statistics and they will give you a table with accurate stats on games played and winners. For example check the Federer Stats. (http://www.rolandgarros.com/en_FR/bios/stats/atpf324.html)They are different from those under matches completed because they don't count forced errors and service winners.

BTW, having watched most of the matches I can tell you that most of the points are won off opponents' Unforced Errors, even in Federer's matches with the exception of the one vs Ancic where both players where winning the majority of the points with winners.
I find it interesting that the players who are really going for winners (Almagro and Gulbis) also have the worst break point conversion of the lot. This means that moonballing is securing a break of serve by waiting for an UE :help: The grass season can't come soon enough.

Apemant
06-03-2008, 12:53 PM
Good topic IM0. I don't follow all the match so to see how accurate the stats was. Tnq Apemant for the correction...

The stats I posted are even worse than the original. It is only to show that they are unrealiable.

Check out that Ljubo-Monfils stats. They say he hit 71 winners - and to that my only comment is, no chance in hell. They probably count all the unreturned 1st serves as 'winners' as well, which is wrong, despite they being called 'service winners'.

In fact, no, it's not even that, because if it was, then 71 + 10 aces + 28 UEs from Monfils = 109 points, while he won only 107 points. That would mean Monfils hit -2 forced errors outside failed returns, which is impossible even for him. :devil:

At any rate, the stats are completely bogus now, and they were also bogus before this latest 'fix'. :rolleyes:

Black Adam
06-03-2008, 12:57 PM
You are looking for the winners stats in the wrong place that's all.

Apemant
06-03-2008, 01:00 PM
Don't worry my stats are very reliable because I didn't use the completed matches section of the Roland Garros website, instead I went under Tournament stats where the stats are more like what I saw during the matches.

My stats exclude service winners. I used the Roland Garros website. Click on players==> Tournament Statistics and they will give you a table with accurate stats on games played and winners. For example check the Federer Stats. (http://www.rolandgarros.com/en_FR/bios/stats/atpf324.html)They are different from those under matches completed because they don't count forced errors and service winners.

BTW, having watched most of the matches I can tell you that most of the points are won off opponents' Unforced Errors, even in Federer's matches with the exception of the one vs Ancic where both players where winning the majority of the points with winners.

Those stats are wrong as well, in fact, those stats are exactly the same ones as in match completed stats, only BEFORE this latest 'fix'. They definitely show way too few winners for most players.

Anyway, it is true that the majority of points are won by opponent's UEs, but no way Fed hit only 0.67 winners per GAME. 11 winners in the entire Querrey match? I bet he had more than 11 easy putaways after a good 1st serve. Those stats are simply wrong :shrug:

Edit: check Coria's profile, for example. Those 'accurate' stats claim he hit only 20 winners in the entire match. Now I watched that match on TV and I remember for sure that at 4-2 for Coria in the last set they showed 45 winners to his name, which is about what I felt was right at that point. And yet, match completed stats showed 20 winners, exactly the same number your profile page still shows. However, match completed stats NOW show 57 winners which is too high, by some 10 or so, because Coria hardly hit a winner after 4-2. On the other hand, for Robredo they say he hit 72 winners :haha: :haha: - no way...

Bottom line, they were wrong, and they are still wrong. Why did you assume those on your links were 'accurate'? Just because they suit your preconceptions? :devil:

oz_boz
06-04-2008, 12:51 AM
and I remember for sure that at 4-2 for Coria in the last set they showed 45 winners to his name, which is about what I felt was right at that point...why did you assume those on your links were 'accurate'? Just because they suit your preconceptions? :devil:

Hey Apemant, you disappoint me ;) you are usually a lot sharper than this. You refer to a match were you "felt" how many winners were hit and accuse BA of being biased?

I definitely believe you and not him/her but it would be better if you make a thorough count in a couple matches to see if the stats actually are wrong.

rhinooooo
06-04-2008, 12:55 AM
I think Fed hit more winners in that Montanes match, and Gulbis hit more against Lapentti than Monfils has the whole tournament...

RG Stats are all wrong. They gave Fed about 20 winners for the Montanes match when TV gave him over 60. They gave Acasuso 5 winners against Murray when TV gave him 9 in the FIRST SET alone! So many other mistakes I can't remember.

GlennMirnyi
06-04-2008, 02:02 AM
RG winners stats sucks ;)

So true.

GlennMirnyi
06-04-2008, 02:03 AM
I think Gonzalez has hit more winners in his match against Wawrinka than Monfils has hit his whole life.

Apemant
06-05-2008, 11:58 PM
Hey Apemant, you disappoint me ;) you are usually a lot sharper than this. You refer to a match were you "felt" how many winners were hit and accuse BA of being biased?

I definitely believe you and not him/her but it would be better if you make a thorough count in a couple matches to see if the stats actually are wrong.

I don't have any of the matches recorded, but if I had, I'd go and count them. I even have a small Java app (written by me) to make tracking of stats super-easy. ;)

As for the 'bias', sorry but I have to disagree. I wasn't biased in any way about that Coria match, I just thought I've seen way more than 20 winners in those 4 sets; that 'feeling' wasn't due to some preconception, if you get my meaning. It was a result of observation, even if it wasn't scientifically accurate. :devil: