this article says it all really [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

this article says it all really

tennis2tennis
04-26-2008, 07:46 PM
Djokovic Taps Out Again, Sets Up Federer v. Nadal Monte Carlo Final

by Sean Randall
When the going gets tough, sometimes the tough and the not so tough quit. And thatís just what the not so tough Novak Djokovic did today, just as he has done before, hitting the eject button when things turned against him in a big match.

Today in the Monte Carlo semifinals, Djokovic retired with a breathing illness to Roger Federer after getting broken to go down 6-3, 3-2. The retirement follows a mysterious pattern of in-match withdrawals by the Serb, who pulled a similar act against Nadal at the French Open, Nadal at Wimbledon and even against Davydenko this year in Davis Cup.

And I feel confident in speaking for many tennis fans in saying that we are tired of this act.

You play to win. You donít play to quit. If Novakís looking to make fans and gain their respect, this isnít how to do it.

In Novakís defense, I understand heís had a breathing problem, one that was serious enough to require surgery. So itís there. Thatís a fact. Itís been an issue. But Novak, what I cannot understand is if itís that serious how come you donít ever retire when you are winning? And why is it only against the top guys and at moments when you feel like the match is no longer within grasp that decide to wave the white flag?

I think itís safe to say the guy has a game of a No. 1 player, but much like Richard Gasquet, his fate is going to be determined by what goes on between his ears. And right now heís not right up there.

Sure thereís a physical component, but itís seems to be more mental with Novak because he feels it more in the tougher times. And his ego maybe does get the best of him.

Part of being a great tennis player is being a great fighter. And Novak really hasnít shown much of that fighting spirit up to this point in his career. Even today, if this guy needed to draw some inspiration to continue and possibly come back Ė it wasnít like he was playing bad either! Ė all he needed to do was to look across at the net at Federer who could have easily mailed it in when in the second round Ruben Ramirez-Hidalgo had him by the throat up 5-1 in the third set. To his credit Federer didnít quit and now look how nicely itís paid off. Federer didnít get to No. 1, didnít win 12 Slams, by being a great frontrunner. Thereís more to it.

Novak is going to need to learn that. And last I checked - and Iím no tennis historian - but I donít recall too man guys with a history of retirements ever reaching the No. 1 ranking. Marcelo Rios had a lot of injuries, so did Gustavo Kuerten. Andy Roddick had issues early in his career, but heís overcome them. And has Roger Federer ever retired from a match? I canít remember.

So Novak, you canít retire your way to No. 1. Itís not going to happen that way. Few doubt your game, but whatís going on between your ears is another matter. You have a lot of money now, hire a psychologist or two and a good trainer and get it worked out in your head. And stop sapping your strength by bouncing the ball a thousand times (I get dizzy also just watching that!), re-adjusting your hat and doing imitations. Save your energy for actual play.

(Imitating Novak would be easy. Just bend over in exhaustion, take a few deep breaths, fall to your knees a few times, look distressed and then signal to the chair umpire. Thatís Novak. You donít even need to do the ball bounce routine.)

As for the match, Federer continued his high level he had set from his Nalbandian win. He looked that good, that impressive. (Did Fed really yell at Novakís parents telling them to ďShut upĒ as the announced hinted? If so that was great!). But will it be enough tomorrow against Nadal? Will he continue on this revenge tour? Probably not. I have to stick with Nadal in that one.

I think it will help Federer in getting such a quick match today after a few three setters this week, but this is Nadalís surface, Nadalís time of year. Heís built for clay supremacy. And of course Nadalís got Fedís number, especially on clay.

Federer, though, I think is playing at a level now where if Nadal is off his game the Swiss can take it. And heíll be playing without a lot of pressure. But Rogerís going to have to play impeccably and aggressively. Attacking when itís right and even using that new drop shot of his.

I guess the one bright side of Novakís retirement is that we do get the Federer-Nadal matchup. And we are assured no oneís going to hit the eject button during tomorrowís final.

NicoFan
04-26-2008, 07:48 PM
:worship:

Precisely. Great article. :yeah:

TMJordan
04-26-2008, 07:49 PM
Taps out again :haha: :haha: :haha:

TheBoiledEgg
04-26-2008, 07:50 PM
(Imitating Novak would be easy. Just bend over in exhaustion, take a few deep breaths, fall to your knees a few times, look distressed and then signal to the chair umpire. Thatís Novak. You donít even need to do the ball bounce routine.)



:haha: :devil:

Tommy fan
04-26-2008, 07:53 PM
Great article :worship:

wildegirl05
04-26-2008, 07:54 PM
two enthusiastic thumbs up. i don't know how objective this piece is but it certainly did a good job of capturing a lot of fans' reaction to his match today and the pattern of waving the white flag when the going gets tough. :worship:

Apemant
04-26-2008, 07:54 PM
But Novak, what I cannot understand is if itís that serious how come you donít ever retire when you are winning?

I thought he was winning against Davy in DC, and he surely wasn't losing to Wawrinka in Umag as well.

Henry Chinaski
04-26-2008, 07:57 PM
It's ok. Just stating the obvious. It must be a blog entry or something because it wouldn't have been very difficult to research the number of retirements Fed and others have had.
Plenty on mtf could write better. Expecially me.

robinhood
04-26-2008, 07:57 PM
A great article, but Mr. Randall needed to be meaner.
And why bring up Gasquet!!
He has his issues, but he certainly doesn't need to be mentioned in a conversation concerning this particular joke of a so-called pro athlete.

Rogiman
04-26-2008, 07:59 PM
I don't think he has any problem with his psych like the writer suggests.

In fact, I think he retires consciously to leave some doubts in his rivals' (the top 2 that is) minds about their ability to 'really' beat him.

Novak has an excellent game, but he would use ANYTHING he can to retain the mental edge over his rivals and I'm stating the obvious here.

trixtah
04-26-2008, 08:00 PM
I thought he was winning against Davy in DC, and he surely wasn't losing to Wawrinka in Umag as well.

If winning is being down in score the yeah, he was winning that match easily

star
04-26-2008, 08:02 PM
It's interesting that the people so decrying anyone who questioned in the slightest Federer's "strong mono", are now claiming Djokovic is feigning illness. :) :) :)

hra87
04-26-2008, 08:03 PM
I don't think he has any problem with his psych as the writer suggest.

In fact, I think he retires consciously to leave some doubts in his rivals' (the top 2 that is) minds about their ability to 'really' beat him.

Novak has an excellent game, but he would use ANYTHING he can to retain the mental edge over his rivals and I'm stating the obvious here.

Agreed, Djokovic has no mental problems whatsoever. Look at this (YTD):

Service Points Won %: 69
Break Points Saved %: 68

Return Points Won %: 43
Break Points Converted %: 48

Compare to Nadal:

Service Points Won %: 67
Break Points Saved %: 58

Return Points Won %: 41
Break Points Converted %: 41

And Federer:

Service Points Won %: 72
Break Points Saved %: 61

Return Points Won %: 40
Break Points Converted %: 41

l_mac
04-26-2008, 08:06 PM
It's interesting that the people so decrying anyone who questioned in the slightest Federer's "strong mono", are now claiming Djokovic is feigning illness. :) :) :)

:hug: It must be hard to be Nole's fan today.

Did you read his presser? :tape: :tape: If I wasn't afraid of being labelled a know-nothing, trolling hater I'd start a new thread and rip him to pieces on it :tape: :tape: :tape:

Being a know-nothing fangirl is enough I think.

GlennMirnyi
04-26-2008, 08:07 PM
I think this guy posts in MTF. :p

Rogiman
04-26-2008, 08:07 PM
It's interesting that the people so decrying anyone who questioned in the slightest Federer's "strong mono", are now claiming Djokovic is feigning illness. :) :) :)With all due respect whether Federer has had mono or not is of little relevance here. He has never (literally) retired midmatch even on his most dreadful days (the Fish match springs to mind).

The consensus here is not about whether Novak was ill or not, it's about whatever he had being far from a career-risking injury, meaning he should have completed the match.

Henry Chinaski
04-26-2008, 08:08 PM
If winning is being down in score the yeah, he was winning that match easily

Djokovic-Wawrinka was 6-6 in the 1st set with Djok leading a mb early in the tiebreak.

He was leading Davydenko 2 sets to 1.

So I'd like to revise my opinion that the article is "ok". It's horseshit.

jasmin
04-26-2008, 08:08 PM
I don't know if all the facts is right but it's still right on in a lot of ways and hilarious. He does put a question mark next to his question on fed retiring in a match.

TheSwissMaster
04-26-2008, 08:10 PM
It's interesting that the people so decrying anyone who questioned in the slightest Federer's "strong mono", are now claiming Djokovic is feigning illness. :) :) :)

i guess its the retirement that has brought this reaction and not his illness.
had he finished the game, the reaction would not have been that strong as it is now.

GlennMirnyi
04-26-2008, 08:13 PM
Djokovic-Wawrinka was 6-6 in the 1st set with Djok leading a mb early in the tiebreak.

He was leading Davydenko 2 sets to 1.

So I'd like to revise my opinion that the article is "ok". It's horseshit.

Yeah, but he lost the third set and Davydenko was gettin' better, as everybody knows.

l_mac
04-26-2008, 08:14 PM
Djokovic-Wawrinka was 6-6 in the 1st set with Djok leading a mb early in the tiebreak.

He was leading Davydenko 2 sets to 1.

So I'd like to revise my opinion that the article is "ok". It's horseshit.

The writer used Fed today, Nadal at Wimbledon and Davy in Davis Cup as examples of him retiring against the top players when the match started turning against him. He didn't retire in the 1st set at W against rafa while he was winning. He retired when he knew he would lose. He retired against Denko when Davy had won the 3rd, and he nkew he wouldn't be able to win in 3. He retired against Fed a set down, and unable to hold serve.

hra87
04-26-2008, 08:15 PM
:hug: It must be hard to be Nole's fan today.

Did you read his presser? :tape: :tape: If I wasn't afraid of being labelled a know-nothing, trolling hater I'd start a new thread and rip him to pieces on it :tape: :tape: :tape:

Being a know-nothing fangirl is enough I think.

link?

Apemant
04-26-2008, 08:22 PM
If winning is being down in score the yeah, he was winning that match easily

How was he down in score? :confused:

Henry Chinaski
04-26-2008, 08:24 PM
The writer used Fed today, Nadal at Wimbledon and Davy in Davis Cup as examples of him retiring against the top players when the match started turning against him. He didn't retire in the 1st set at W against rafa while he was winning. He retired when he knew he would lose. He retired against Denko when Davy had won the 3rd, and he nkew he wouldn't be able to win in 3. He retired against Fed a set down, and unable to hold serve.


I'm not here to defend Djokovic but there are inaccuracies in the article. and trixtah's post that I responded to made no sense.

"Why do you never retire when you're winning?" is pretty unambiguous.

(A. Because he'd find himself under investigation for match-fixing)

DrJules
04-26-2008, 08:26 PM
It's interesting that the people so decrying anyone who questioned in the slightest Federer's "strong mono", are now claiming Djokovic is feigning illness. :) :) :)

But in how many matches has Federer retired and how many has Djokovic retired.

The number does seem high. Yes, there are times when it is sensible to retire, but Djokovic probably does it too often.

Alex999
04-26-2008, 08:27 PM
link?
http://www.tennis-x.com/xblog/2008-04-26/436.php

It's a blog.

hra87
04-26-2008, 08:28 PM
I'm not here to defend Djokovic but there are inaccuracies in the article. and trixtah's post that I responded to made no sense.

"Why do you never retire when you're winning?" is pretty unambiguous.

(A. Because he'd find himself under investigation for match-fixing)

Unless there were betting irregularities, I don't see why he would be under investigation.

http://www.tennis-x.com/xblog/2008-04-26/436.php

It's a blog.

Thanks!

Edit: wait, no thanks, wrong link, meant the presser. Thanks anyway though.

l_mac
04-26-2008, 08:29 PM
link?

Q. Whatís the problem, Novak?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, I didnít feel good for last three days. Iíve been waking up with some sore throat. But I thought itís not going to be nothing special.
But obviously when youíre playing against the No. 1 player of the world, you obviously get a lot of balls back and longer points, and I just couldnít get enough energy back after each point. I needed a lot of time. And I just decided not to risk anything.

Q. Can you just talk about your symptoms. Do you feel sick? Is it just a sore throat?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, itís a sore throat. I feel dizziness a little bit in the last three days. I donít know. Doctor in the tournament couldnít give me the right diagnosis. Iíll check as soon as possible.

Q. Considering that, did you do well to actually get to the semifinal itself then? Did you do above what you could have possibly done to get to today?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, I think I could go even more. But, unfortunately, physically today I wasnít ready enough. Iím really disappointed that I had to finish this way. Feel sorry for the crowd and for everybody. In the first place, for me.
But, you know, I always put health in the first place. Semifinal is a great result. No doubt about that. Iím not extremely disappointed. You know, itís a good result to come in the best four of a strong tournament.

Q. Any fever at all?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Not for now, hopefully. I donít know.

Q. You were already sick in the first set of the previous match.
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Yeah, itís always like this. Last three days, as I said. But the previous opponents were not, you know, not that tough and I didnít have long rallies against the previous opponents like I had today.
Obviously I needed that step further and to do something more and special to win the points today. Of course, itís normal, youíre playing against the best player in the world. And, unfortunately, I couldnít do that.
But, you know, I have to look on the bright side.

Q. And you have to look at the season, as well, because the clay court season is a very tough season, very demanding. If youíre going to be in peak condition for Paris, you have to take care of yourself.
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Sure, sure. Thatís a task I need to think about very seriously in the future, especially in the next couple of days. Iím gonna have a week before Rome. So hopefully I can be ready.

Q. How did Roger look to you, facing him for the first time since Melbourne?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: He looks good. He was more aggressive than in Melbourne. I think he stepped up more. He was more patient. And I think I made some crucial mistakes in that first set. I had some chances on 3 All I think or 2 All, some breakpoints. Unfortunately in the end, physically I didnít hold on. You know, in them moments, when you just need to stay patient and just play another ball back, I wanted to finish up with the return. So resulted with a mistake.

Q. So when today did you start to feel it?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, from the start I didnít feel so great. But, obviously, on the start of the match you feel, you know, fresh still somehow. But then after a while, after five, six games, after long points, started to feel more and more worse. I was thinking about, you know, stopping even after the first set. But, you know, I just wanted to try and see how it goes.
But itís not worth it, you know. Iím just 20 years old. Still a lot of time, a lot of tournaments to come.

Q. After three days, nobody knows what it is exactly?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: No. Just I thought itís nothing serious. You know, on the matches, I played well and I felt okay afterwards. I asked doctor yesterday. But he said I donít have nothing, which I really donít believe. I think he didnít give me the right diagnosis, obviously. Iíll check as soon as possible.


http://www.blogquotidiani.net/tennis/?page_id=1939#djo26

Adler
04-26-2008, 08:29 PM
But Novak, what I cannot understand is if itís that serious how come you donít ever retire when you are winning?
He was trailing 2-0 in sets against Davydenko in DC actually

DrJules
04-26-2008, 08:31 PM
http://www.tennis-x.com/xblog/2008-04-26/436.php

It's a blog.

I felt below was a measured comment (except the final paragraph):

And once again, we have a Djokovic retirement. By my count, this is the 3rd high-profile ATP Tour Match retirement since he came onto the tour: 2006 French 4th Round vs. Nadal (saying in his press conference that day how in control of the match he thought he was, down 2 sets to love before packing it in LOL); 2007 Wimbledon Semi vs. Nadal (supposedly a blister); and now today vs. Federer (a vague unexplained “breathing” issue). All these retirements to players ranked above him. Hmm.

When I think about Sampras playing Agassi in the 2000 AO Semi with a torn groin muscle - he finished the match (not to mention his entire run at 2000 Wimby on an inflamed shin); when I think of Nadal laying on the ground at last years US Open in agony with tendenitis against Ferrer, yet he finished the match; when I think of Federer playing Canas at IW last year with blisters on both feet - he finished the match too. And countless other examples. Retiring once or so? Yeah, OK - I get that. But Djokovic is making retiring in matches a habit - and not just any match, like a first rounder. He quits when the stakes are highest - and always when he’s losing. Somebody needs to tell him to Man Up - take the loss no matter what the issue (unless you’re literally gonna DIE), and come back to live & fight another day. You can bet the other guys on the tour were howling watching Novak throw in the towel - again.

Quitting is for wusses. And no mater what he says, the REAL reason he quits is becoming obvious: he doesn’t want the outright loss to blemish his record, ESPECIALLY against Federer or Nadal, since his PR Narrative is that he’s the real #1 Player in the world. It’s tough to buy the spin if he loses outright to these guys. He wants the “well, I had to quit or else I would have won” excuse or asterisk next to these losses.

hra87
04-26-2008, 08:31 PM
http://www.blogquotidiani.net/tennis/?page_id=1939#djo26

Wow, every single answer...:tape:.

Apemant
04-26-2008, 08:38 PM
...


Hmm actually the stuff one could (in theory) infer from this interview is not good for Novak... seems he already considers him the #1 of the world so he needs to justify his losses, as if he's such a clear favourite (over Fed no less) that people should wonder how he could possibly lose. For someone so young that does seem kinda odd.

Perhaps it's actually understandable for someone who has risen to fame so fast, but then again, Nadal was up there at much younger age and also had 6-1 record over Fed at one point, and I don't recall him ever sounding so proud about himself.

Jelena
04-26-2008, 08:41 PM
:rolleyes: at Nole for the answers.

l_mac
04-26-2008, 08:44 PM
Hmm actually the stuff one could (in theory) infer from this interview is not good for Novak... seems he already considers him the #1 of the world so he needs to justify his losses, as if he's such a clear favourite (over Fed no less) that people should wonder how he could possibly lose. For someone so young that does seem kinda odd.

Perhaps it's actually understandable for someone who has risen to fame so fast, but then again, Nadal was up there at much younger age and also had 6-1 record over Fed at one point, and I don't recall him ever sounding so proud about himself.

Ah, it is unfair to compare him to Nadal, who is an angel :lol: Rafa's family have worked very hard (too hard many times, IMO) to keep his feet firmly on the ground, while I'd guess Novak's ... haven't.

Rumour
04-26-2008, 08:45 PM
It's interesting that the people so decrying anyone who questioned in the slightest Federer's "strong mono", are now claiming Djokovic is feigning illness. :) :) :)
The differences are obvious and I don't believe they truly escape you but I'll point out a few:

Djokovic has an established pattern of questionable timeouts and retirements in his still young career, while Federer has reportedly never pulled out of any professional match he started.

He was not pushed particularly hard in any of his previous matches this week and had plenty of time off beforehand so fatigue was not a factor.

His breathing problem, dizzy spell, sore throat or whatever (I'd go with the last one) supposedly started two or three days ago - when he started playing the tournament - yet didn't appear to hinder his perfomance whatsoever until he called a medical timeout after losing the first set of the SF. Even after that Djoko played reasonably well until just before retiring, at which point he was hitting a lot of errors. Despite that, he seemed physically fine and IMO showed no major signs of difficulty in breathing or moving.

The sudden timing of the retirement was also suspicious i.e. right after he had lost the game and without even seeking medical assistance again. I believe the rule is he can't keep getting treated for the same ailment but I'm sure he could have been creative and at least taken a tactical timeout as he's been accused of doing before. However, it looked like Djokovic simply didn't want to continue playing because he was losing and didn't see any way of turning the situation around, especially considering who was across the net and how solidly he was playing.

As someone who had always defended the Serb on this issue before, today really opened my eyes about his true 'competitive' nature and how his use of medical breaks and retirements seems to more accurately reflect his psychological rather than physical condition. Otherwise, please tell me all the other times Federer has acted in a similar way under comparable circumstances because I apparently missed them.

ReturnWinner
04-26-2008, 08:50 PM
anyone who thinks Djokovic has not faked should watch his match against Garcia Lopez in Estoril.

MariaV
04-26-2008, 08:51 PM
Djokovic may have mono too? :awww:

GlennMirnyi
04-26-2008, 08:58 PM
anyone who thinks Djokovic has not faked should watch his match against Garcia Lopez in Estoril.

Yep, since then I have no doubts about his jokes. I remember that match vividly.

Adler
04-26-2008, 08:59 PM
Yep, since then I have no doubts about his jokes. I remember that match vividly.
What happened there, I'm curious :confused:

Rumour
04-26-2008, 09:37 PM
Actually I think Djoko's post-match comments, not that first article, really say it all - my 'favourite' bits are bolded/underlined:

Q. Whatís the problem, Novak?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, I didnít feel good for last three days. Iíve been waking up with some sore throat. But I thought itís not going to be nothing special.
But obviously when youíre playing against the No. 1 player of the world, you obviously get a lot of balls back and longer points, and I just couldnít get enough energy back after each point. I needed a lot of time. And I just decided not to risk anything.

Q. Can you just talk about your symptoms. Do you feel sick? Is it just a sore throat?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, itís a sore throat. I feel dizziness a little bit in the last three days. I donít know. Doctor in the tournament couldnít give me the right diagnosis. Iíll check as soon as possible.

Q. Considering that, did you do well to actually get to the semifinal itself then? Did you do above what you could have possibly done to get to today?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, I think I could go even more. But, unfortunately, physically today I wasnít ready enough. Iím really disappointed that I had to finish this way. Feel sorry for the crowd and for everybody. In the first place, for me.
But, you know, I always put health in the first place. Semifinal is a great result. No doubt about that. Iím not extremely disappointed. You know, itís a good result to come in the best four of a strong tournament.

Q. Any fever at all?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Not for now, hopefully. I donít know.

Q. You were already sick in the first set of the previous match.
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Yeah, itís always like this. Last three days, as I said. But the previous opponents were not, you know, not that tough and I didnít have long rallies against the previous opponents like I had today.
Obviously I needed that step further and to do something more and special to win the points today. Of course, itís normal, youíre playing against the best player in the world. And, unfortunately, I couldnít do that.
But, you know, I have to look on the bright side.

Q. And you have to look at the season, as well, because the clay court season is a very tough season, very demanding. If youíre going to be in peak condition for Paris, you have to take care of yourself.
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Sure, sure. Thatís a task I need to think about very seriously in the future, especially in the next couple of days. Iím gonna have a week before Rome. So hopefully I can be ready.

Q. How did Roger look to you, facing him for the first time since Melbourne?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: He looks good. He was more aggressive than in Melbourne. I think he stepped up more. He was more patient. And I think I made some crucial mistakes in that first set. I had some chances on 3 All I think or 2 All, some breakpoints. Unfortunately in the end, physically I didnít hold on. You know, in them moments, when you just need to stay patient and just play another ball back, I wanted to finish up with the return. So resulted with a mistake.

Q. So when today did you start to feel it?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, from the start I didnít feel so great. But, obviously, on the start of the match you feel, you know, fresh still somehow. But then after a while, after five, six games, after long points, started to feel more and more worse. I was thinking about, you know, stopping even after the first set. But, you know, I just wanted to try and see how it goes.
But itís not worth it, you know. Iím just 20 years old. Still a lot of time, a lot of tournaments to come.

Q. After three days, nobody knows what it is exactly?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: No. Just I thought itís nothing serious. You know, on the matches, I played well and I felt okay afterwards. I asked doctor yesterday. But he said I donít have nothing, which I really donít believe. I think he didnít give me the right diagnosis, obviously. Iíll check as soon as possible.

http://www.blogquotidiani.net/tennis/?page_id=1939#djo26
To sum up: Djokovic felt fine when he was facing inferior opposition - and I suspect he put Federer in that category too before the match, given their previous few matches and how the No. 1 had been playing before MC (not to mention oddsmakers actually making the Serb a favourite). However, once he realized he'd have to give his full effort today and it still probably wouldn't be enough to defeat the man he's publicly stated he plans to dethrone, Novak's niggling sore throat suddenly became a serious impediment. That's how I interpret his various statements as a whole combined with what I saw in the match today.

Kitty de Sade
04-26-2008, 09:46 PM
Q. Considering that, did you do well to actually get to the semifinal itself then? Did you do above what you could have possibly done to get to today?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: Well, I think I could go even more. But, unfortunately, physically today I wasnít ready enough. Iím really disappointed that I had to finish this way. Feel sorry for the crowd and for everybody. In the first place, for me.


The only part of the whole thing that is worth anything. At the very least, that was due. :yeah:

Kuhne
04-26-2008, 09:48 PM
I think the only people that should be forgiven for being Djokovic fans are those who lived around his house when they were growing up... thats it, not even people from Serbia should support this shamefull athlete. The guy is arrogant, annoying, clearly comes from a family of people who suck, is an atention whore, has no real personality so he has to immitate others to be funny and on top of that, he cant take a good beating. Didn't someone say here before that federer has 700 matches 0 retires?

Learn from that DjoCocklover

Herdwick
04-26-2008, 10:00 PM
http://www.blogquotidiani.net/tennis/?page_id=1939#djo26

Grr. Nole - this will not wash. Those answers are a self-indulgent, unprofessional disgrace. Quite simply, Roger was going to win and you knew it. Your goal is to eventually become number 1 and, as a fan, I hope you make it but to stay there when you get there, you'll have to deal with this type of situation over and over again. Please recognise that what you did was wrong, that you let yourself down and don't do it again.

Aloimeh
04-26-2008, 10:04 PM
I think the only people that should be forgiven for being Djokovic fans are those who lived around his house when they were growing up... thats it, not even people from Serbia should support this shamefull athlete. The guy is arrogant, annoying, clearly comes from a family of people who suck, is an atention whore, has no real personality so he has to immitate others to be funny and on top of that, he cant take a good beating. Didn't someone say here before that federer has 700 matches 0 retires?

Learn from that DjoCocklover

You keep on bringing up his country, but most people there are pretty disappointed as well, not because he lost but because he withdrew. And a lot of comments commend Nadal as being a player who would never give up in this way:

http://www.b92.net/sport/komentari.php?nav_id=295933

I know you can't read it, but there's only about 10-15% positive comments on it. So he will definitely get bashed by the Serbian media (and the Monte Carlo media too, I'm sure), which is *exactly what he needs* at this moment. He's even getting bashed on his own website's forum.

robinhood
04-26-2008, 10:06 PM
The only part of the whole thing that is worth anything. At the very least, that was due. :yeah:

Uhm... I think if he really felt that sorry for anyone but himself, he would've finished the match.

Aloimeh
04-26-2008, 10:07 PM
Grr. Nole - this will not wash. Those answers are a self-indulgent, unprofessional disgrace. Quite simply, Roger was going to win and you knew it. Your goal is to eventually become number 1 and, as a fan, I hope you make it but to stay there when you get there, you'll have to deal with this type of situation over and over again. Please recognise that what you did was wrong, that you let yourself down and don't do it again.

He knows in his heart where the truth lies. Ironically, this is going to be much more damaging to his psyche vis-a-vis Roger than a 6-3 6-2 loss would have been.

mikkemus23
04-26-2008, 10:10 PM
Q. After three days, nobody knows what it is exactly?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: No. Just I thought it’s nothing serious. You know, on the matches, I played well and I felt okay afterwards. I asked doctor yesterday. But he said I don’t have nothing, which I really don’t believe. I think he didn’t give me the right diagnosis, obviously. I’ll check as soon as possible.

could it be mono?

;)

robinhood
04-26-2008, 10:14 PM
Q. After three days, nobody knows what it is exactly?
NOVAK DJOKOVIC: No. Just I thought it’s nothing serious. You know, on the matches, I played well and I felt okay afterwards. I asked doctor yesterday. But he said I don’t have nothing, which I really don’t believe. I think he didn’t give me the right diagnosis, obviously. I’ll check as soon as possible.

oould it be mono?

;)

My goodness.
Maybe we should give his "illness" the name it deserves.
Djoker Syndrome

tsk tsk tsk....

onewoman74
04-26-2008, 10:23 PM
I felt below was a measured comment (except the final paragraph):

And once again, we have a Djokovic retirement. By my count, this is the 3rd high-profile ATP Tour Match retirement since he came onto the tour: 2006 French 4th Round vs. Nadal (saying in his press conference that day how in control of the match he thought he was, down 2 sets to love before packing it in LOL); 2007 Wimbledon Semi vs. Nadal (supposedly a blister); and now today vs. Federer (a vague unexplained ďbreathingĒ issue). All these retirements to players ranked above him. Hmm.

When I think about Sampras playing Agassi in the 2000 AO Semi with a torn groin muscle - he finished the match (not to mention his entire run at 2000 Wimby on an inflamed shin); when I think of Nadal laying on the ground at last years US Open in agony with tendenitis against Ferrer, yet he finished the match; when I think of Federer playing Canas at IW last year with blisters on both feet - he finished the match too. And countless other examples. Retiring once or so? Yeah, OK - I get that. But Djokovic is making retiring in matches a habit - and not just any match, like a first rounder. He quits when the stakes are highest - and always when heís losing. Somebody needs to tell him to Man Up - take the loss no matter what the issue (unless youíre literally gonna DIE), and come back to live & fight another day. You can bet the other guys on the tour were howling watching Novak throw in the towel - again.

Quitting is for wusses. And no mater what he says, the REAL reason he quits is becoming obvious: he doesnít want the outright loss to blemish his record, ESPECIALLY against Federer or Nadal, since his PR Narrative is that heís the real #1 Player in the world. Itís tough to buy the spin if he loses outright to these guys. He wants the ďwell, I had to quit or else I would have wonĒ excuse or asterisk next to these losses.

This post is soooo on point!:worship:

Blondie1985
04-26-2008, 10:25 PM
I guess the one bright side of Novakís retirement is that we do get the Federer-Nadal matchup. And we are assured no oneís going to hit the eject button during tomorrowís final.


:worship::worship::worship::worship::worship::wors hip:

SAtennis
04-26-2008, 10:25 PM
Ditto to the post!!!

scoobs
04-26-2008, 10:29 PM
Djokovic will probably be #1 at some point in the next couple of years and with the way he pushes the eject button on these big matches where he's not winning with a story of an illness that shouldn't prevent him finishing the match at least, I think it will be a sad day.

Say what you will about Federer but his record on not retiring is exemplary and in a 10 year + career there must have been times when he felt like it.

Nadal as #2 has a couple of retirements here and there but there are several more matches where he has taken a severe beating and not flinched from the punishment.

Unless you are in real and sustained physical pain you should not quit a match. People are paying good money to come and see you and you owe it to them to give it your best shot and play the match out. You may not be able to give them a fabulous contest but you will at least give them a complete match and show them you're at least giving the best effort you can.

Djokovic is still young - I hope this attitude is something he grows out of.

rocketassist
04-26-2008, 10:35 PM
Djokovic will probably be #1 at some point in the next couple of years and with the way he pushes the eject button on these big matches where he's not winning with a story of an illness that shouldn't prevent him finishing the match at least, I think it will be a sad day.

Hopefully he will never, ever be #1.



Say what you will about Federer but his record on not retiring is exemplary and in a 10 year + career there must have been times when he felt like it.

Agreed, Federer is a classy sportsman although he does make excuses at times. ;)


Nadal as #2 has a couple of retirements here and there but there are several more matches where he has taken a severe beating and not flinched from the punishment.

Yep, like Youzhny in Chennai. The djerk will tank against opponents he doesn't care about, but retire against guys he hates losing to. Monaco in Cincinnati was not a big deal to Nadal, but he was genuinely hurt.


Unless you are in real and sustained physical pain you should not quit a match. People are paying good money to come and see you and you owe it to them to give it your best shot and play the match out. You may not be able to give them a fabulous contest but you will at least give them a complete match and show them you're at least giving the best effort you can.

Djokovic is still young - I hope this attitude is something he grows out of.

I don't hold out much hope for that. Not with these odious parents.

FedFan_2007
04-26-2008, 10:36 PM
I have to disagree with one thing. Fed was winning this in straight sets, retirement or not. He was kicking the snot out of Djoko.

Apemant
04-26-2008, 10:41 PM
Uhm... I think if he really felt that sorry for anyone but himself, he would've finished the match.

Actually he said he was sorry for himself in the first place - not last. So at least he's honest, if a bit egotistical. :devil:



To sum up: Djokovic felt fine when he was facing inferior opposition - and I suspect he put Federer in that category too before the match, given their previous few matches and how the No. 1 had been playing before MC (not to mention oddsmakers actually making the Serb a favourite). However, once he realized he'd have to give his full effort today and it still probably wouldn't be enough to defeat the man he's publicly stated he plans to dethrone, Novak's niggling sore throat suddenly became a serious impediment. That's how I interpret his various statements as a whole combined with what I saw in the match today.

That's precisely the same as I felt about it. Maybe someone should explain to him that it's not exactly sportmanlike... wouldn't kill him to give some credit where credit is due.

robinhood
04-26-2008, 10:55 PM
Djokovic will probably be #1 at some point in the next couple of years and with the way he pushes the eject button on these big matches where he's not winning with a story of an illness that shouldn't prevent him finishing the match at least, I think it will be a sad day.

Say what you will about Federer but his record on not retiring is exemplary and in a 10 year + career there must have been times when he felt like it.

Nadal as #2 has a couple of retirements here and there but there are several more matches where he has taken a severe beating and not flinched from the punishment.

Unless you are in real and sustained physical pain you should not quit a match. People are paying good money to come and see you and you owe it to them to give it your best shot and play the match out. You may not be able to give them a fabulous contest but you will at least give them a complete match and show them you're at least giving the best effort you can.

Djokovic is still young - I hope this attitude is something he grows out of.

One match that I'm sure every tennis fan might remember is the Agassi-Nieminen match at FO 1st round. (Was it 2005??)

Andre had hard time even sitting down during the changeovers after the 1st set or so, but still managed to finish the match out of respect for Jarkko and the crowd.

I didn't think too much of it at the time, but after watching someone retire over a sore throat, man..... WOW is all I can say right now.

Kuhne
04-26-2008, 11:18 PM
You keep on bringing up his country, but most people there are pretty disappointed as well, not because he lost but because he withdrew. And a lot of comments commend Nadal as being a player who would never give up in this way:

http://www.b92.net/sport/komentari.php?nav_id=295933

I know you can't read it, but there's only about 10-15% positive comments on it. So he will definitely get bashed by the Serbian media (and the Monte Carlo media too, I'm sure), which is *exactly what he needs* at this moment. He's even getting bashed on his own website's forum.

thats good news :)

Bibberz
04-27-2008, 12:12 AM
Nadal as #2 has a couple of retirements here and there but there are several more matches where he has taken a severe beating and not flinched from the punishment.

I'm not a sadist, but I like to see how players react when they take severe beatings (like Rafa in '07 Hamburg). I think that's when we learn the most about their character.

I always support Djokovic when he plays Federer. However, although I would like to see Federer dislodged from the #1 spot soon, I must admit that Federer always carries himself like a champion. His game and his conduct command respect. At present, only Djokovic's game commands respect.

We should cut Nole some slack, though. He is still only 20. It would be unfortunate if he's constantly "faking" injuries and retiring prematurely when he's 24.

Deboogle!.
04-27-2008, 12:17 AM
People actually take tennis-x seriously?

Burrow
04-27-2008, 12:18 AM
He was trailing 2-0 in sets against Davydenko in DC actually

No he wasn't, trailing is when you are losing, and he was 2 up.

Dirk
04-27-2008, 12:33 AM
The only part of the whole thing that is worth anything. At the very least, that was due. :yeah:

If he was so sorry then why not play on even if you have to lower your level and lose serve the rest of the time? It is easy to play professional during a press conference after you had some time to think of some good BS. :rolleyes:

krystlel
04-27-2008, 01:30 AM
People actually take tennis-x seriously?
I agree, Tennis-x is terrible. Everytime I have a look at their Who's Hot, Who's Not section, I end up shaking my head at their choices. The Who's Not section will usually consist of Federer, Nadal, Roddick and Blake. They really need to widen their range.

I think the interview transcript says it all. It sounds like he wasn't in much discomfort at all.

Deboogle!.
04-27-2008, 01:32 AM
I agree, Tennis-x is terrible. Everytime I have a look at their Who's Hot, Who's Not section, I end up shaking my head at their choices. The Who's Not section will usually consist of Federer, Nadal, Roddick and Blake.That site is nothing more than a few gossipy guys who seem bitter about something - but what's really gross is that most of their stuff is completely devoid of objective facts and when it is, they're ripped off (i mean serious plagiarism of entire sentences) from other sources :haha:

Jelena
04-27-2008, 06:16 AM
One match that I'm sure every tennis fan might remember is the Agassi-Nieminen match at FO 1st round. (Was it 2005??)

Andre had hard time even sitting down during the changeovers after the 1st set or so, but still managed to finish the match out of respect for Jarkko and the crowd.

I didn't think too much of it at the time, but after watching someone retire over a sore throat, man..... WOW is all I can say right now.
I remember that match, and though I never really was an Agassi-fan myself I felt sorry for Andrť because of the physical pain he obv had. I think he didn't care about losing the match with bagels in the latter sets, he only wanted to finish the match. NOBODY would have bashed him if he had retired, but he didn't want to give up.

About Nole and his statement I can only shake my head. What did he expect? That a #1 doesn't know how to bring him in long rallies and that it wouldn't be harder to win against a #1 than against a #50 or whatever? :rolleyes:

Rogiman
04-27-2008, 06:44 AM
We should cut Nole some slack, though. He is still only 20. It would be unfortunate if he's constantly "faking" injuries and retiring prematurely when he's 24.I disagree.

If you're mature enough to play with the big boys - let alone make a claim for the top spot - you deserve no special treatment.

And if there's anything worse than the retirement itself (and his frequent retirements in general) it's his indifference and self-righteousness about it.

It seems like he will continue that bad habit of his and feels completely fine with it.

Aloimeh
04-27-2008, 06:49 AM
It seems like he will continue that bad habit of his and feels completely fine with it.

On this I disagree and I'll tell you why. Novak is infantile. He both craves attention and approval from his parents and his "would-be" parents, i.e. the audience. He wasn't happy when the Australian audience didn't favor him, so he threw tantrums (like a child). As he's infantile, he also plays hooky (fake injuries and retirements) to help excuse himself to others (and possible in his own eyes, to himself :eek:).

Which will win? The infantilistic hooky-playing or the infantilistic craving for affection? I think the harsh response he's got from the media, analysts, crowd (booed), and even his fans (on his own website!) and the Serbian news media, will drive the idea that this is unacceptable into his brain like a red-hot poker.

It's sad, because he's so talented otherwise that he resorts to trash tactics.

Apolix
04-27-2008, 06:53 AM
Well it was completly stupid to retire so really. It was obvious he could have at least finished the set, in this way, he not only let down his fans, but also the crowd, who came to see a good game.

As per his illness, well, I am not going to over speculate. Who is anyone to judge how someone else feels but themselves. After all, if I remember correcly, he retired against Davydenko in the Davis Cup when he was winning, and he wasn't losing against Wawrinka when he retired either.

Djokovic is incredibly immature. It's so obvious he's still stuck in his teen years and that whole mentality. Not to say that he's a bad guy (probobly a really cool dude to chill with) but, definetly not mature enough.

Rogiman
04-27-2008, 07:05 AM
It's sad, because he's so talented otherwise that he resorts to trash tactics.That much is for sure. It would be much much more fun if we could enjoy his tennis and the added value a 3rd top player brings to the game if he could drop the gamesmanship.

Aloimeh
04-27-2008, 07:07 AM
Well it was completly stupid to retire so really. It was obvious he could have at least finished the set, in this way, he not only let down his fans, but also the crowd, who came to see a good game.

As per his illness, well, I am not going to over speculate. Who is anyone to judge how someone else feels but themselves. After all, if I remember correcly, he retired against Davydenko in the Davis Cup when he was winning, and he wasn't losing against Wawrinka when he retired either.

Djokovic is incredibly immature. It's so obvious he's still stuck in his teen years and that whole mentality. Not to say that he's a bad guy (probobly a really cool dude to chill with) but, definetly not mature enough.

Yeah, I don't want to say that he's an intrinsically rotten person (although it's possible), but he's certainly immature, infantile, and arrogant, and it doesn't help that his parents are role models of this.

What is Vajda doing anyway, or does he agree with this trashy behavior?

At any rate, I hope Novak goes through his growing pains very quickly and smartens up or it will really be painful when he's No. and I will actually miss the Roger Federer years.

Rogiman
04-27-2008, 07:12 AM
Maybe he needs to be hated, who knows :shrug:

Hewitt made a career out of fighting with everyone, and Novak seemed to relish the crowd's contempt in the AO final.

Apolix
04-27-2008, 07:19 AM
He's definetly not. If you have listened to several of his interviews both English but also in Serbian you can tell hes a really cool dude, who seems like he would get along with anyone. He speaks honestly, and always has the best to say of his opponents after matches. He seems like an all around nice guy, but doesnt seem to understand the significane of some of his actions. Thats why I think he is immature.

Considering a lot of young kids look up to him in his country, he clearly is not focusing on setting the best example. He is a much better tennis player than Jankovic and Ivanovic, yet they are much more liked than he is. After all, when Jankovic was sick and struggling in her last match at the AO this year, she openly said she wanted to desperatly retire but continued to play on, just so she wouldnt let down her fans.

I dont see why Nole isn't thinking like this.

Aloimeh
04-27-2008, 07:30 AM
He's definetly not. If you have listened to several of his interviews both English but also in Serbian you can tell hes a really cool dude, who seems like he would get along with anyone. He speaks honestly, and always has the best to say of his opponents after matches. He seems like an all around nice guy, but doesnt seem to understand the significane of some of his actions. Thats why I think he is immature.

Considering a lot of young kids look up to him in his country, he clearly is not focusing on setting the best example. He is a much better tennis player than Jankovic and Ivanovic, yet they are much more liked than he is. After all, when Jankovic was sick and struggling in her last match at the AO this year, she openly said she wanted to desperatly retire but continued to play on, just so she wouldnt let down her fans.

I dont see why Nole isn't thinking like this.

Strange. I would have thought that he would be the "role model" given the slam. However, I have to say that I am very surprised how the behavior of Ana and Jelena hasn't rubbed off on him, especially since he allegedly has known Ana since childhood. Jelena can be dramatic with the injuries but she doesn't retire often. She was crying at the AO when playing Maria, was blasted off the court, and didn't retire. She also fought back from multiple match points at AO 1st round to get up to the semis. Ana was down 6-0 2-0 against Hantuchova and she didn't retire but fought back and won (admittedly against a mental midget, not Federer).

Why can't he follow their example? Women mature faster than men? Or is it just the parents?

And since he says his role model is Sampras, why can't he follow that either? Sampras was positively vomiting on court and crying over the terminal illness/death (forget which) of his coach, and he still played. And this guy has a sore throat? Immature kid playing hooky.

And I also hate how he's always saying how he's so young and that he "has time." He doesn't know how much time he has, he should capitalize on every opportunity that presents itself and stop protecting his hypochondrial self over a sore throat.

Allure
04-27-2008, 07:33 AM
Strange. I would have thought that he would be the "role model" given the slam. However, I have to say that I am very surprised how the behavior of Ana and Jelena hasn't rubbed off on him, especially since he allegedly has known Ana since childhood. Jelena can be dramatic with the injuries but she doesn't retire often. She was crying at the AO when playing Maria, was blasted off the court, and didn't retire. She also fought back from multiple match points at AO 1st round to get up to the semis. Ana was down 6-0 2-0 against Hantuchova and she didn't retire but fought back and won (admittedly against a mental midget, not Federer).

Why can't he follow their example? Women mature faster than men? Or is it just the parents?

And since he says his role model is Sampras, why can't he follow that either? Sampras was positively vomiting on court and crying over the terminal illness/death (forget which) of his coach, and he still played. And this guy has a sore throat? Immature kid playing hooky.

And I also hate how he's always saying how he's so young and that he "has time." He doesn't know how much time he has, he should capitalize on every opportunity that presents itself and stop protecting his hypochondrial self over a sore throat.

This is exactly why. Djoko is a mere boy while Jankovic and Ivanovic are women. ;)

Apolix
04-27-2008, 07:41 AM
Well he is a role model because of the slam and all, but is not setting the best examples with some of his other actions.

Not sure why he cant be like the girls. I mean, they're parents come to the matches too, to a lot of matches, however, being so attached to children even at older ages, is more of a cultural trait of many Southern European nations, so I doubt his parent's influence will rub off anytime soon. Not to mention the media loves Jankovic's mom because she is so friendly, charasmatic, and easy to talk to. I just dont get how Djoko's parents aren't picking up the clues. I mean he's dad seems ok to me, but when I first heard about his mom mentioning that "King is dead" thing, wow, I thought it was a joke.

He strives to be an over achiever, and hes parents wont except less than #1. Whereas with the girls, I think #1 is important, but it's not everything.

Who knows..

Aloimeh
04-27-2008, 08:05 AM
Well he is a role model because of the slam and all, but is not setting the best examples with some of his other actions.

Not sure why he cant be like the girls. I mean, they're parents come to the matches too, to a lot of matches, however, being so attached to children even at older ages, is more of a cultural trait of many Southern European nations, so I doubt his parent's influence will rub off anytime soon. Not to mention the media loves Jankovic's mom because she is so friendly, charasmatic, and easy to talk to. I just dont get how Djoko's parents aren't picking up the clues. I mean he's dad seems ok to me, but when I first heard about his mom mentioning that "King is dead" thing, wow, I thought it was a joke.

He strives to be an over achiever, and hes parents wont except less than #1. Whereas with the girls, I think #1 is important, but it's not everything.

Who knows..

Now I'm going to be a hypocrite and classist myself, but perhaps it also has to do with their social status? Ana's parents are an engineer and a lawyer and Jelena's are both economists. They both seem well read and more educated than most of their peers. Djokovic's parents are....ski instructors/restaraunteurs? I know that sounds incredibly classist, and it is, and it's hypocritical of me especially since I dissed Allure in another thread about this, but it really does fit a certain stereotype. I don't think it has to do with money but with education.

The Pro
04-27-2008, 08:13 AM
I know I should say something considered and intelligent here. Something generous and philisophical about Nole's age and maturity, and perhaps his upbringing. But all I really want to say is

Fakerbitch is pathetic! :devil:

Aloimeh
04-27-2008, 08:19 AM
Fakerbitch is pathetic! :devil:

We all know that and have moved beyond it. We're in the trying-to-understand-why-he's-a-Fakerbitch phase. Please stay on track. Thanks.

Rogiman
04-27-2008, 08:21 AM
Now I'm going to be a hypocrite and classist myself, but perhaps it also has to do with their social status? Ana's parents are an engineer and a lawyer and Jelena's are both economists. They both seem well read and more educated than most of their peers. Djokovic's parents are....ski instructors/restaraunteurs? I know that sounds incredibly classist, and it is, and it's hypocritical of me especially since I dissed Allure in another thread about this, but it really does fit a certain stereotype. I don't think it has to do with money but with education.Something tells me you will regret this :tape:

MTF is not the place for honesty...

The Pro
04-27-2008, 08:43 AM
We all know that and have moved beyond it. We're in the trying-to-understand-why-he's-a-Fakerbitch phase. Please stay on track. Thanks.

Have we? You may want to check out l_mac's thread for where MTF is at right now. ;)

Fedexex
04-27-2008, 08:54 AM
great article:yeah:

luxsword
04-27-2008, 09:09 AM
An article about retiring from last year : http://www.tennis.com/features/general/features.aspx?id=70254

Number Crunching: The Retiring Type
By Gavin Versi Date : 3/20/2007

(...)Some pros are more prone to on-court injuries than others and there is no suggestion that any were not injured when they retired, but the statistics seem to speak volumes about the attitude of various players. Though they're equally likely to become injured while ahead as they are when they are behind, some will play on until a result has been determined, even if they went into the match carrying an injury. Others stop when they feel they can no longer win the match.

Retiring during a match doesnít just affect the player, but the crowd and the opponent as well. ďThere are definitely players that are retiring so that the opponent doesnít get the satisfaction of really beating them,Ē said John Lloyd, British Davis cup captain and former Australian Open finalist. ďI did it early in my career too, not with retiring but through tanking. Itís a similar thing: I was messing around and it was obvious to the opponent that I wasnít taking it seriously, so he didnít get the satisfaction of beating me. Itís the same with retiring Ė you donít want to give the opponent the satisfaction of actually beating you.Ē

Players with the best records for not retiring when losing include those who are generally well-regarded for their competitive fairness and sportsmanship. Among the men, Roger Federer and James Blake have never quit while behind in a match.(...)

ďItís pretty pitiful to do that unless itís an obvious physical thing,Ē said Lloyd. ďOnce you play, you should play until the end Ė unless you canít stand up, of course. These matches where players are retiring a game or two from defeat, thatís pathetic.Ē
It's much longer, quite interesting and there are some graphs with the ATP and WTA top 20 and where they are re: quitting or playing til the end. It could do with a little update, though, as it's from march 2007.

thesonofgray
04-27-2008, 09:16 AM
Maybe he needs to be hated, who knows :shrug:

Hewitt made a career out of fighting with everyone, and Novak seemed to relish the crowd's contempt in the AO final.

According to Cheryl Murray and some marketing gurus, yes, Novak needs to be hated, for the sake of tennis. :shrug:

http://www.tennistalk.com/en/blog/Cheryl_Murray/20080326/Novak_Djokovic_as_the_future_bad_boy_of_tennis

"I'm not complaining about this Ė really I'm not. It's about time that we have sports stars who are...well...good sports. But there is a gaping hole in tennis right now Ė we need a bad boy. I was having a conversation with a marketing expert that I know, Kelli DeMario, and she suggested that just maybe Novak Djokovic would become the missing piece of the puzzle, the plug to fill the hole that has been so long vacant. He fits the profile Ė he has a healthy lack of respect for the players ranked above him, a good sense of humor and best of all that certain brand of irreverence that marks the best of the tennis bad boys.

If he embraces his inner bad boy and wears the mantle proudly, it would make him a star. No, let me rephrase that Ė it would make him a Star. One of the John McEnroe ilk (except with more muscles), because strangely enough people never end up "hating" the bad boys Ė they're always the most popular ones of all. So go on, Nole. Show us how bad you can be."

madmanfool
04-27-2008, 09:55 AM
wish he had Rafter's parents, he needs some of this:

ANDREW DENTON: And as you became more successful, there were times where the family also pulled you back into line, didn't they? Where they thought you've changed?



PAT RAFTER: I was good in '94. Should have just asked me then. I got to 20 in the world and I came home and they just beat me down.



ANDREW DENTON: Yeah.



PAT RAFTER: And said you're just far too cocky for where you're at. And they were true. It was true, and you start losing a bit of a sense of reality of what you're doing and where you're going and that was really important for them, you know. I was losing my way a little bit, and I thought I'd made it and I was going around, and that was just going through a different stage in my life. I was trying to deal with what was coming my way and success.



ANDREW DENTON: The first reaction, generally, when somebody, even your family, says that to you, the ego kicks in. You don't want to hear it. Was it a hard thing to hear?



PAT RAFTER: Yeah, it was. Yeah, it was. Didn't take long though. I reckon it only took a couple of weeks of being at home before I was back to sort of abusing everyone, them abusing me again, and that's exactly what I needed to get home and get a lot of that, 'cos I'd been on the road away from it, and people telling you you're going to do this, you're going be this, you're going to be that. And I think a little bit of that's good, obviously not too much. You don't want to knock someone's self-esteem around too much, but a little bit of it was good.

Herdwick
04-27-2008, 10:22 AM
Re the remarks regarding Rafter's parents above; I am not optimistic that anyone in Djokovic's inner circle will ensure he is kept grounded in reality. Vajda possibly but he would probably be a lone voice and wish to keep his (presumably now well-paid) job. As a Nole fan this is quite a depressing thought.

oz_boz
04-27-2008, 10:26 AM
I don't think he has any problem with his psych like the writer suggests.

In fact, I think he retires consciously to leave some doubts in his rivals' (the top 2 that is) minds about their ability to 'really' beat him.

Novak has an excellent game, but he would use ANYTHING he can to retain the mental edge over his rivals and I'm stating the obvious here.

I agree with the above. Maybe he doesn't even have that kind of manipulative reasons, instead he just tries to save his self-image, which is of crucial importance when he faces Fed or Rafa the next time. Either way it is understandable but will him a few haters in the long run, me included. Not that he seems to care about that ;)

SAtennis
04-27-2008, 11:32 PM
:haha:According to Cheryl Murray and some marketing gurus, yes, Novak needs to be hated, for the sake of tennis. :shrug:

http://www.tennistalk.com/en/blog/Cheryl_Murray/20080326/Novak_Djokovic_as_the_future_bad_boy_of_tennis

"I'm not complaining about this Ė really I'm not. It's about time that we have sports stars who are...well...good sports. But there is a gaping hole in tennis right now Ė we need a bad boy. I was having a conversation with a marketing expert that I know, Kelli DeMario, and she suggested that just maybe Novak Djokovic would become the missing piece of the puzzle, the plug to fill the hole that has been so long vacant. He fits the profile Ė he has a healthy lack of respect for the players ranked above him, a good sense of humor and best of all that certain brand of irreverence that marks the best of the tennis bad boys.

If he embraces his inner bad boy and wears the mantle proudly, it would make him a star. No, let me rephrase that Ė it would make him a Star. One of the John McEnroe ilk (except with more muscles), because strangely enough people never end up "hating" the bad boys Ė they're always the most popular ones of all. So go on, Nole. Show us how bad you can be."

:haha:

MusicMyst
04-28-2008, 02:31 PM
I asked doctor yesterday. But he said I donít have nothing, which I really donít believe. I think he didnít give me the right diagnosis, obviously. Iíll check as soon as possible.


That's the language of the classic hypochondriac -- insisting on being ill when a doctor says nothing is wrong and always searching for the "right" diagnosis.

MusicMyst
04-28-2008, 02:33 PM
That site is nothing more than a few gossipy guys who seem bitter about something - but what's really gross is that most of their stuff is completely devoid of objective facts and when it is, they're ripped off (i mean serious plagiarism of entire sentences) from other sources :haha:

In Deb-speak, this translates as "they dissed Andy!" ;)

alfonsojose
04-28-2008, 02:48 PM
Nice article. Djokeb*tch is a prick :ras:

Manon
04-28-2008, 02:53 PM
Now I'm going to be a hypocrite and classist myself, but perhaps it also has to do with their social status? Ana's parents are an engineer and a lawyer and Jelena's are both economists. They both seem well read and more educated than most of their peers. Djokovic's parents are....ski instructors/restaraunteurs? I know that sounds incredibly classist, and it is, and it's hypocritical of me especially since I dissed Allure in another thread about this, but it really does fit a certain stereotype. I don't think it has to do with money but with education.

Shame on you. There's nothing about social status. You are not classist, you're almost rasist. This is the rudest post I've seen on MTF.

How about you grandmother for examle - no school=no manners?

Unbelievable.

Branimir
04-28-2008, 03:30 PM
Djokovic needs to check himself before he wrecks himself.

l_mac
04-28-2008, 04:21 PM
Now I'm going to be a hypocrite and classist myself, but perhaps it also has to do with their social status? Ana's parents are an engineer and a lawyer and Jelena's are both economists. They both seem well read and more educated than most of their peers. Djokovic's parents are....ski instructors/restaraunteurs? I know that sounds incredibly classist, and it is, and it's hypocritical of me especially since I dissed Allure in another thread about this, but it really does fit a certain stereotype. I don't think it has to do with money but with education.

So people of a lower class are less educated? Or you need a university education to know how to behave in a respectful manner? What a crock of shit. Awful, even by your low standards.