Bodo's New Blog on Nadal [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Bodo's New Blog on Nadal

l_mac
02-05-2008, 08:02 PM
I also posted this in Rafa's forum, but I know lots of people don't visit (fools - you have no idea what you are missing!!) and I wouldn't want anyone to miss out.

http://tennisworld.typepad.com/tennisworld/2008/02/rafa.html#comments

You know who I've been thinking about a lot lately? Rafael Nadal. I suppose this is because of the progress Novak Djokovic made over the past eight or so months, as well as the degree to which Jet Boy has been spinning his wheels over the same period.

So how big does Roger Federer's win at Wimbledon last July look now? To me, plenty big - if not as a career-shaping encounter than as a huge missed opportunity for Nadal. I'm open to the idea that Rafa hasn't been quite the same player since that loss. Certain matches stay with a player much like a lingering cough or cold sometimes remains with us so long that we forget what it's like not to have it.

To attribute Nadal's results in the second half of last season, and so far in this one, to that Wimbledon final would be presumptuous, unless Jet Boy indicated otherwise. But unlike, say, Federer's recent loss to The Djoker in Australia, there's some distance now between us and that Wimbledon final. It looms fairly large in the rear view mirror, although it's more useful as a reference points for events of the recent past than as a predictor for future ones.

Anyway, I've been thinking that Jet Boy is in a bind. A pattern has been emerging over the past few years, and it suggests that Rafa isn't as well designed to compete in an 11-month season as in a six- month one. Throw in Rafa's increasingly frequent struggle with injury and the case becomes even more persuasive. The long year presents special problems for a player whose game is nothing if not "effortful" and whose zest for combat denies him the use of cruise control.

I wrote some time ago that Nadal is a child of the sun and south, while TMF is a man of the chill and hard north. I stand by that, and believe that the actions and sensibilities of both men bear that out. We are each the sum of history, of particular times, places and antecedents, albeit subject to subversion to greater or lesser degrees - and with greater or lesser consequences.

In an earlier era still dominated by Anglo venues, values and game theory, Nadal would have been deemed a "novelty" - an exotic, volatile, idiosyncratic and unorthodox challenger who was as formidable in his natural environment as a leopard on the veld, but as lost on unfamiliar turf as that same leopard in the boreal forest. The game once was choc-a- bloc with such characters, right into the early Open era. You could call them "provincial" contenders ("provincial" really being more about surface and surroundings than specific geography; remember that for a long time European clay was considered an aberration). Of course, when the "provincial" contenders made the long trip abroad, they often floundered. So let me ask you this: if you had to cast TMF and Nadal as the city mouse and country mouse, is there any doubt over who would play who?


We resist this kind of thinking today for fear of causing offense and stereotyping. We also like to think of tennis as a "one world, one game" enterprise, dedicated to a level global playing field. This reinforces certain strivings for "fairness," never mind the big theme of the brotherhood of man. So we conveniently forget that a playing field is only level in a meaningful way if the athletes bring the same skills and mind-set to it. Of course, man certainly is more adaptive than a leopard (and you underestimate the powers of a leopard in any environment at your peril). But it's easier to understand people if you see them through the naturally imposed filters.


Hence, Rafa's clay-court game is still a clay-court game, even when it's played on grass, just as a leopard is a leopard even if it kills a stag on an Alpine peak - something of which a leopard is more than capable. The hard bits for the leopard are navigating the foreign terrain and habits of its prey, and whatever degree of instinctual confusion it experiences while so doing.

Okay, that's a pretty highfalutin' comparison. There are on-the-ground aspects to consider as well. Practically speaking, all players are subject to conditioning, which is why it's usually important for them to establish winning traditions on various surfaces or at a variety of venues early in their careers. Nadal has accomplished this, on a large scale, with his Wimbledon performances and Masters shields.

Yet you could argue that Jet Boy has achieved that mainly on the strength of his fighting spirit and exuberant athleticism; in this interpretation, those have overrun the built-in controls and determinants. In theory, Nadal should not fare nearly as well as he has on those faster surfaces, but then the New York Giants weren't supposed to win the Super Bowl. One of the main reasons we love sports is because of their potential for sedition; we love to see theory ruined and expectations blown up. It tends to reinforce our hope that anything is possible in a way that poses no threat to our equally strong conviction and hope that it is not.

One critical aspect of Nadal's nature is that the non-clay tournaments in which he does well tend to be different from the clay events in which he shines only in the particulars having the most to do with technique and strategy - areas that are of lesser importance to Nadal's genius than others. That is, he does well at events that suit him, in some temperamentally rather than purely technical way.

Nadal's performance at Wimbledon last year was impressive to me because he kept his desire and spirits up despite the rain and gloom, not because he managed to cobb together a passable game to go with his mental and emotional strengths. The further Nadal gets from the warmth of the sun, the breezes that wash over a court, and the smell of freshly watered clay, the less well he does. Come the Paris Indoors, and he's a mess of conflicting signals - never a good thing for a predator. I think he responds to environment in as significant a way as he does to surface speed, and I know that's a pretty radical notion.

The most puzzling aspect of Rafa's resume is his relatively poor performances at the sunny, warm, colorful US Open. But in this, he's similar to many other players who are essentially provincial. The American major has proven to be a formidable stumbling block for many players from outside the U.S., and often for reasons obviously having nothing to do with the surface - and everything to do with the full menu of New York's famed distractions. In fact, Roger Federer's ability to overcome the habitual European fear of the American challenge is a particularly powerful testament to his versatility and underscores the degree that he has transcended whatever provincial urges once defined him. His most valuable asset in that regard has been his cool temperament; he took measure of the event and then tailored his approach and game to ensure a good fit.

TMF is a problem-solver; Rafa is a problem-attacker.

That suggestion may ring true for those of you who are familiar with all those studies about how little boys tend to try to break through walls while little girls are more likely to navigate around them. Nadal's greatest strength, as well has his most outstanding weakness, is his boyishness. This is a lingering condition that all but defines him to many of us. It is why so many people love him, and why disliking him has always seemed to me a little like disliking a kid brother. Rafa is the Little Engine that Could, never mind that he what he "could" do is blast a tennis ball through your forehead with such force that it would leave a volleyball-sized exit wound on the back of your skull.

But for all his bellicose instincts (does anyone else spank the ball as gleefully as Jet Boy?), he continues to engage us with incredible charm and insouciance. We all know how Uncle Toni insists that Rafa not get a swelled head - that Toni makes Rafa carry his own bags, and has him sweep the court after practice. We all know that the photo ops of Nadal tend to produce images of Rafa blowing out the candles on a birthday cake, surrounded by Spanish journalists in some press room, rather shots of him with a dude all in black on one side, and a ranking fashionista on the other.

Nadal has resisted, or is impervious to, sophistication. If Federer is the game's ambassador to the world, Rafa is its poster boy; frankly, I'm amazed that nobody has come up with a comic strip character based on Nadal yet; instead of lugging around a football or a security blanket, he could drag around a tennis racket. We love TMF for his skill, we love Jet Boy for his exuberance. If there is a caveat to that, it's this: Going forward, it may be increasingly difficult for Rafa to rely on exuberance (and in him, even his stamina, strength and will seem subordinate to it) to the same degree he has so far in his career.

What got me thinking along these lines has been Djokovic's progress. Another man of northern inclinations, Djoker has matured as a player at an amazing rate. I get the sense that he's measured up his mission with a cold eye and concluded, "I can do this. This is what I need to do to make this happen." Yet when I try to come up with a comparably simple (and perhaps simplistic) formulation for Nadal, I come up only with: "I go and play my game and I fight, we see what happen, no?"

That approach is disarmingly honest and touching. And like any child - or, in this case, manchild - Nadal does "touching" very well. I'm not suggesting that Nadal would benefit from an intensive course of Tennis Technique and Strategy, 101. It's too late for that, and the elements at play here go much deeper. The boyishness of Nadal, which has always been such a great source of his appeal, may also hold him back. A comparison with Bjorn Borg seems in order here. Borg, at 16, played like he was 23, and at 25 he played like he was 23. Nadal at 16 played like he was 18, and at 21 he plays like he's 18.

Of course, you can reduce the line items on Nadal's resume to X's and O's. Sure, he could flatten out his forehand, play more from inside the court on hard courts and really force the action. But it would be naive to assume that Nadal and his team haven't thought about that; it's more likely that Nadal's game has changed so little because: a: it works, and, b: he has a temperamental disposition to play the way he does.

Hail, at some deep level, he may enjoy playing the way he does too much to bother with all the rest of it. Leave that to the "students of the game" and to those who are more inclined to calculation. This kid is having fun in a way he has not outgrown yet.

Whatever the case, Nadal is only 21, and - injury aside - he's got plenty of time to figure things out. I've always liked my youth young, if you know what I mean.

tennizen
02-05-2008, 08:13 PM
^^ He is trying to be nice and complimentary to Nadal but imo he's talking a whole bunch of nonsense again.

Jaap
02-05-2008, 08:16 PM
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tangerine_dream
02-05-2008, 08:17 PM
You know who I've been thinking about a lot lately? Rafael Nadal. I suppose this is because of the progress Novak Djokovic made over the past eight or so months, as well as the degree to which Jet Boy has been spinning his wheels over the same period.
"Jet Boy"? What does that mean?

l_mac
02-05-2008, 08:18 PM
"Jet Boy"? What does that mean?

It's his superhero-esque nickname for Rafa. Because of his on court clothes and playing style, I think.

DhammaTiger
02-05-2008, 08:23 PM
I Mac thanks for the article.

DhammaTiger
02-05-2008, 08:31 PM
Excuse my ignorance but what does TMF mean?

l_mac
02-05-2008, 08:32 PM
Excuse my ignorance but what does TMF mean?
The Mighty Fed.

virex
02-05-2008, 08:35 PM
the mighty federer

Sunset of Age
02-05-2008, 08:41 PM
Bodo = Pathetic Fanboy.

Here it shows again.

l_mac
02-05-2008, 08:43 PM
Bodo = Pathetic Fanboy.

Here it shows again.

Who is he fanboying in this article? As a Rafa fan, I don't find it particularly complimentary.

stebs
02-05-2008, 08:53 PM
Who is he fanboying in this article? As a Rafa fan, I don't find it particularly complimentary.

You say it says why Rafa sucks. I disagree very much, it focuses on some of the strengths of Nadals game and yes it transposes them to weaknesses in alternative contexts which has been done before. I think it is maybe a little broad with not enough specification but what parts do you disagree with (assuming you don't agree that 'Rafa...sucks')?

Sunset of Age
02-05-2008, 08:54 PM
Who is he fanboying in this article? As a Rafa fan, I don't find it particularly complimentary.

Mr. Bodo has this nasty habit of always being negative of Roger (and yes, I LIKE Mr. TMF, no secret here) and hyping up - in a rather bad, childish manner - all of his opponents.

And I agree with you - this doesn't do much honour to Rafa either.
In fact, I cringe at all of those who still address Rafa as being a 'kid', as I think it's an insult to a very mature 21-year old, who only displays very mature behaviour indeed. I guess THAT is just one of the reasons I refer to Mr. Bozo as a 'fanboy' (or 'fangirl' for that matter).

Alex999
02-05-2008, 08:57 PM
Thanks for the article. I liked it (very colourful).

l_mac
02-05-2008, 08:58 PM
You say it says why Rafa sucks. I disagree very much, it focuses on some of the strengths of Nadals game and yes it transposes them to weaknesses in alternative contexts which has been done before. I think it is maybe a little broad with not enough specification but what parts do you disagree with (assuming you don't agree that 'Rafa...sucks')?


My original thread title was Bodo on Nadal, but it wasn't getting any responses, so I changed it. I am aware it is misleading, and will change it :lol:

I don't specifically disagree with any of the points (maybe I don't agree that the W loss to Fed was the reason for his poor form in the latter half of '07), but I do find the article a little patronising.

l_mac
02-05-2008, 09:00 PM
Mr. Bodo has this nasty habit of always being negative of Roger (and yes, I LIKE Mr. TMF, no secret here) and hyping up - in a rather bad, childish manner - all of his opponents.

And I agree with you - this doesn't do much honour to Rafa either.
In fact, I cringe at all of those who still address Rafa as being a 'kid', as I think it's an insult to a very mature 21-year old, who only displays very mature behaviour indeed. I guess THAT is just one of the reasons I refer to Mr. Bozo as a 'fanboy' (or 'fangirl' for that matter).

Really??? I always think Bodo is right up Roger's ass. :shrug: All a matter of perception, I guess. I distinctly remember his FO coverage being all about Federer.

Sunset of Age
02-05-2008, 09:03 PM
Really??? I always think Bodo is right up Roger's ass. :shrug: All a matter of perception, I guess. I distinctly remember his FO coverage being all about Federer.

Yeah, he was pretty much fanboying Roger at that time, I remember well.
That might just be the reason why I don't like the guy.

Ah, I should've called him a 'bandwagonner' rather than a 'fanboy' I realize right now. ;)
In all honesty, what's the difference? :p

l_mac
02-05-2008, 09:05 PM
Yeah, he was pretty much fanboying Roger at that time, I remember well.
That might just be the reason why I don't like the guy.

Ah, I should've called him a 'bandwagonner' rather than a 'fanboy' I realize right now. ;)
In all honesty, what's the difference? :p

:lol: I don't know. I think I'm a fangirl, but not a bandwagonner. Bodo only really fanboys Sampras and Agassi. Especially Pete.

Sunset of Age
02-05-2008, 09:08 PM
:lol: I don't know. I think I'm a fangirl, but not a bandwagonner. Bodo only really fanboys Sampras and Agassi. Especially Pete.

Coming to think of it, I should've dubbed him a 'bandwagonner' more than anything else. :angel:

Or... perhaps a better verdict: a journalist. ;)

l_mac
02-05-2008, 09:09 PM
You say it says why Rafa sucks. I disagree very much, it focuses on some of the strengths of Nadals game and yes it transposes them to weaknesses in alternative contexts which has been done before. I think it is maybe a little broad with not enough specification but what parts do you disagree with (assuming you don't agree that 'Rafa...sucks')?

My original thread title was Bodo on Nadal, but it wasn't getting any responses, so I changed it. I am aware it is misleading, and will change it :lol:

I don't specifically disagree with any of the points (maybe I don't agree that the W loss to Fed was the reason for his poor form in the latter half of '07), but I do find the article a little patronising.

I also think the article was Bodo's attempt to explain why Rafa can't win non-clay Slams, and why his career will be shorter than I would like. So if, like many enlightened minds on MTF (I do not count you as one), you believe that Rafa's failure to win a Slam away from RG makes him a crap player my previous thread title was a fairly accurate description of the article.

stebs
02-05-2008, 09:18 PM
My original thread title was Bodo on Nadal, but it wasn't getting any responses, so I changed it. I am aware it is misleading, and will change it :lol:

I don't specifically disagree with any of the points (maybe I don't agree that the W loss to Fed was the reson for his poor form in the latter half of '07), but I do find the article a little patronising.

I actually think the loss to Federer in '06 was more damaging to Nadal from a mental point of view.

2006:

Pre Wimbledon I think even Nadal was beginning to believe the hype. Remember he still had the points from two AMS events in late 2005 at this stage and he had beaten Federer not only in three of the four clay AMS events but also in Dubai on a relatively quick hardcourt. For a lot of people, if
Nadal won that match he was as much a #1 as Federer. Pre defeat his confidence was SKY high, then he came, got beat and this happened:

Lost to Berdych. Yes a bad matchup for Nadal but unlike Madrid later in that year the match was not a good one. Berdych played okay but was very up and down and Nadal was just plain old mediocre.

Lost to Ferrero. Worst defeat of the year surely to a Ferrero who was playing okay but nothing special and he even lost a set to Sam Querrey in this tournament.

Lost to Youzhny. At times Youzhny was just too good but lets not forget Nadal had SP for a two sets to one lead and for me if he was Wimbledon champion at that time he would've won that match for sure. Confidence wasn't there and Youzhny began dominating.

Lost to Johansson. Yes he has been a very good player at times but the guy just came back on tour and Nadal got beaten in straights. That's bad.

Rest of the year was fine and he was playing good tennis in Madrid and the TMC despite three straight set losses in those events.

2007

This time he knew Federer was the king for now and whats more I doubt whether Nadal really expected himself to reach another W final. I am sure he had belief that he could do it but certainly I doubt he assumed he would get there. The five set defeat was crushing but lets look at what happens thereafter:

Wins Stuttgart. Clay = Win.

Lost to Djokovic. This was a guy playing very well, saving BP after BP after BP with huge serves. Nadal got beaten by a better HC player, no shame there.

Lost to Monaco. Injured.

Lost to Ferrer. By the time he got to Ferrer I think he was hurting but his injury wasn't affecting his tennis. However, he ran into a guy playing the worst type of tennis for his pain, getting everything and hitting very well. It was a very close, high quality match and like the previous year Nadal had his chances but again that's tennis.

Lost to Nalbandian. A shock defeat to on fire Nalbandian but consider his previous match, up against a very hot Murray he took the match in straights after a highlight reel including mny outragoeus winners. He was outplayed on the day but that can happen, not confidence based.

Lost to Nalbandian. Reached the final here before going down, confidence issue? Bah. He was fine.

scarecrows
02-05-2008, 09:19 PM
you're having fun with the title change, arent you? :p

Corey Feldman
02-05-2008, 09:21 PM
Far too long a read

i got bored after the first couple of lines

Kitty de Sade
02-05-2008, 09:21 PM
Grazie for posting the article, girly- and the entertainment of the MTF discussion, sure to follow. :hatoff:

stebs
02-05-2008, 09:23 PM
I also think the article was Bodo's attempt to explain why Rafa can't win non-clay Slams, and why his career will be shorter than I would like.
I think that is the aim also but it certainly doesn't mean Nadal sucks. I don't think you can say Nadal can't win slams off clay. He has been in two finals, a semi and two quarters and he is 21 years old. Maybe his career will be shorter than some (it does seem likely) but he certainly has a long time still to get a win.

As for me, I don't think he will and I don't think he won't. I think it's a possibility and probably he will have chances to do it and I do include HC in that where so far he hasn't really been close enough to say he's had chances.

l_mac
02-05-2008, 09:23 PM
you're having fun with the title change, arent you? :p

:lol: Yes. I changed the thread title of Rafa's AO thread every day (sometimes twice) and now I thirst to start more threads, just so I can edit :sobbing:

l_mac
02-05-2008, 09:28 PM
Far too long a read

i got bored after the first couple of lines
:hug:

I'll summarize:

Rafa sunny from Spain. Likes clay. Game hasn't translated well to hardcourts. Runs a lot. Boyish manchild. Injury fears. Too late to significantly change playing style. Danger. Bodo likes the kid.

Grazie for posting the article, girly- and the entertainment of the MTF discussion, sure to follow. :hatoff:
:hug:

I think that is the aim also but it certainly doesn't mean Nadal sucks. I don't think you can say Nadal can't win slams off clay. He has been in two finals, a semi and two quarters and he is 21 years old. Maybe his career will be shorter than some (it does seem likely) but he certainly has a long time still to get a win.

As for me, I don't think he will and I don't think he won't. I think it's a possibility and probably he will have chances to do it and I do include HC in that where so far he hasn't really been close enough to say he's had chances.
I don't think we're disagreeing here - are we?

stebs
02-05-2008, 09:29 PM
:lol: Yes. I changed the thread title of Rafa's AO thread every day (sometimes twice) and now I thirst to start more threads, just so I can edit :sobbing:

Maybe if you change your posting name to I_mac people will start calling you l_mac. The opposite seems to be true though I've seen you correct a thousand posters.

DhammaTiger
02-05-2008, 09:29 PM
My original thread title was Bodo on Nadal, but it wasn't getting any responses, so I changed it. I am aware it is misleading, and will change it :lol:

I don't specifically disagree with any of the points (maybe I don't agree that the W loss to Fed was the reason for his poor form in the latter half of '07), but I do find the article a little patronising.

I agree with you it's very patronizing, indeed. I don't like his depiction of Rafa as provincial, or saying Clay was looked down upon. If I am not mistaken wasn't the usopen a clay tournament at one time?

stebs
02-05-2008, 09:30 PM
I don't think we're disagreeing here - are we?

I don't only post to disagree with people. ;)

scarecrows
02-05-2008, 09:33 PM
:hug:

I'll summarize:

Rafa sunny from Spain. Likes clay. Game hasn't translated well to hardcourts. Runs a lot. Boyish manchild. Injury fears. Too late to significantly change playing style. Danger. Bodo likes the kid.



thanks
I didnt bother reading either

tennizen
02-05-2008, 09:38 PM
I agree with you it's very patronizing, indeed. I don't like his depiction of Rafa as provincial, or saying Clay was looked down upon. If I am not mistaken wasn't the usopen a clay tournament at one time?

Agree and my favorite part of the blog is this:rolleyes:

What got me thinking along these lines has been Djokovic's progress. Another man of northern inclinations, Djoker has matured as a player at an amazing rate. I get the sense that he's measured up his mission with a cold eye and concluded, "I can do this. This is what I need to do to make this happen." Yet when I try to come up with a comparably simple (and perhaps simplistic) formulation for Nadal, I come up only with: "I go and play my game and I fight, we see what happen, no?"

That approach is disarmingly honest and touching.

Sunset of Age
02-05-2008, 09:41 PM
Agree and my favorite part of the blog is this:rolleyes:

YEP. Fully agree.

Mr Bozo = BiggestBandwaggoner EVAH. :worship: :retard:

l_mac
02-05-2008, 09:43 PM
Maybe if you change your posting name to I_mac people will start calling you l_mac. The opposite seems to be true though I've seen you correct a thousand posters.
:lol: Maybe I will.
I don't only post to disagree with people. ;)
Okay. At first reading I thought you were still under the assumption that I thought Nadal sucked, or that I thought Bodo was saying Nadal sucks. Sometimes I can be too defensive ;)
thanks
I didnt bother reading either

:ras:

platinum
02-05-2008, 09:47 PM
Mr. Bodo has this nasty habit of always being negative of Roger (and yes, I LIKE Mr. TMF, no secret here) and hyping up - in a rather bad, childish manner - all of his opponents.

And I agree with you - this doesn't do much honour to Rafa either.
In fact, I cringe at all of those who still address Rafa as being a 'kid', as I think it's an insult to a very mature 21-year old, who only displays very mature behaviour indeed. I guess THAT is just one of the reasons I refer to Mr. Bozo as a 'fanboy' (or 'fangirl' for that matter).

Well, people much older than Nadal still see him as a kid coz he is only 21.... If you are 31, 35, 40 or older you will probably see a 21 year old as a kid coz you are so much older than him....

platinum
02-05-2008, 09:50 PM
I don't agree that the W loss to Fed was the reason for his poor form in the latter half of '07

I don't agree either.....

Sunset of Age
02-05-2008, 10:03 PM
Well, people much older than Nadal still see him as a kid coz he is only 21.... If you are 31, 35, 40 or older you will probably see a 21 year old as a kid coz you are so much older than him....

In fact, I am much OLDER than he is. But I've also recognized him - HIM = RAFAEL- as a very mature human being, so that might well be the reason why I think that referring to him as a 'kid' or anything the like, is pretty much insulting to him.

Well, even more: I am an OLD WOMAN to many around over here _ and I can only bow to the maturity that Rafael displays all the time! :worship:

The problem with Bodo's "journalism" is that he likes his stereotypes, his easy labels, and his broad, shallow generalizations. No surprise seeing more of the same :bs: about both Rafa and Rogi.

Spot on. The guy is only angling for glory, nothing else.
And that's exactly the reason why I don't like him. :angel:

tennizen
02-05-2008, 10:05 PM
The problem with Bodo's "journalism" is that he likes his stereotypes, his easy labels, and his broad, shallow generalizations. He thinks the labels are cute and clever when they're really just cringeworthy, and he thinks his generalizations are insightful when all they do is serve to further ridiculous simplifications of various players. No surprise seeing more of the same :bs: about both Rafa and Rogi.

You summarized it very well:hug: And reading some of the comments there makes me cringe even more. All that adulation for Dear Mr. Bodo:o

Merton
02-05-2008, 10:13 PM
I think that is the aim also but it certainly doesn't mean Nadal sucks. I don't think you can say Nadal can't win slams off clay. He has been in two finals, a semi and two quarters and he is 21 years old. Maybe his career will be shorter than some (it does seem likely) but he certainly has a long time still to get a win.

As for me, I don't think he will and I don't think he won't. I think it's a possibility and probably he will have chances to do it and I do include HC in that where so far he hasn't really been close enough to say he's had chances.

Agree there, Nadal may win a slam outside clay or he may not. When he is confident and plays well it will take great execution to bring him down.

What is still surprising is why expectations in his case are so extreme: Either he is better than Borg on clay and he will inevitably inherit Federer's position and his dominance or he is a spent force, just about to burnout and not a threat anymore.

tangerine_dream
02-05-2008, 10:17 PM
He lost me at "Roger is north Rafa is south".

Merton
02-05-2008, 10:19 PM
I don't like Bodo in general, he has too much prose for my taste and he enjoys employing different standards, for example I still remember his critique for top players playing in Dubai without bothering to mention Agassi in the same category. In general though journalists should have much more leniency in their blogs than when they write for mass media.

This article does not look too interesting for me, it is often the case that an athlete's weaknesses are simply the continuations of his strenghts, basically that is the article for the Nadal case, stripping all the prose and leaving aside only the description of what this strength is in the case of Nadal and how it becomes a weakness. The interesting thing is to predict how Nadal's game and attitude will evolve with experience, the article never goes there.

Merton
02-05-2008, 10:22 PM
Coming to think of it, I should've dubbed him a 'bandwagonner' more than anything else. :angel:

Or... perhaps a better verdict: a journalist. ;)

Journalists can be much worse bandwagoners than fans, since they disguise bandwagoning with "knowledge", prose and "authority".

tennizen
02-05-2008, 10:28 PM
Journalists can be much worse bandwagoners than fans, since they disguise bandwagoning with "knowledge", prose and "authority".

Same with former players. They have their own agenda and what they say a lot of times is based on their preference not based on their knowledge. The best example seems to be Borg. He praises Fed during RG, Nadal during Wimbledon, Murray when he won against Fed and Djokovic when he won against Fed. Even I can do that:)

Sunset of Age
02-05-2008, 10:43 PM
Well, people much older than Nadal still see him as a kid coz he is only 21.... If you are 31, 35, 40 or older you will probably see a 21 year old as a kid coz you are so much older than him....

No - it's quite simple. I don't judge people on their age - I judge people on their behaviour. Rafa appears to be able to act a lot more mature than many of his fellows - reason for me to acknowledge him to be a very MATURE bloke of his age. :angel:

Journalists can be much worse bandwagoners than fans, since they disguise bandwagoning with "knowledge", prose and "authority".

Yep. Spot on. :yeah:

Sunset of Age
02-05-2008, 10:49 PM
In most cases, they are merely fans themselves, just with access to an entity that will publish and distribute their opinion, warts and all.

Spot on. :worship:

Johnny Groove
02-05-2008, 11:15 PM
Bozo the clown showing his "expert" adjective again. :rolleyes:

Re: Nadal's hard court prowess, i mean, hes not losing to clowns, he is losing to legit players.

Since IW last year, he won that, lost to Nole in Miami, Djoko again in Montreal, was injured in Cincy to Monaco, Pics in USO, Dave in Madrid/Paris, Pics in TMC, Fed in TMC, Youzhny in Chennai, Tsonga in AO.

So the rundown:

IW win
Miami- Djokovic, he went on to win the tourney
Montreal- Djokovic, went on to win it, beating Fed in final
Cincy- Monaco, but he was injured in more ways than one, i'd throw this one out
USO- Pics in a hard-fought 4th round match deep into the night. Pics is now a top 10 player and reached the final in TMC
Madrid/Paris- Got bent over and violated by Nalbandian, but to be fair, EVERYONE was getting bent over and violated by him that month
TMC- Pics and Federer, 2 huge clowns
Chennai- Youzhny, all tiredness from the 4 hour semifinal the day before aside, Youzhny is still a better hardcourter
AO- Tsonga. Simply got beat by an on-fire player

:shrug:

Allure
02-05-2008, 11:46 PM
Peter Bodo is a tool.

platinum
02-06-2008, 12:21 AM
Agree that Rafa is very mature for his age, I don't thnk he's ever broken a racquet :cool:

Sunset of Age
02-06-2008, 12:21 AM
Well, people much older than Nadal still see him as a kid coz he is only 21.... If you are 31, 35, 40 or older you will probably see a 21 year old as a kid coz you are so much older than him....

No - age is not a number, but rather the way someone *acts*.

I don't judge people on their particular birth date, but more on the way they actually manage to live in 'real live'... ;) :p ;)

sawan66278
02-06-2008, 12:26 AM
The next thing you know, Bodo will refer to Rafa as a "pig" like many on this board do. While there may be some kernels of truth in the LONG and drawn out Bofo blog, the man still fails in his overall analysis. If you aren't Roger Federer or Novak Djokovic, then you're a limited, one-trick pony who whose game is meant for only one surface:rolleyes:

Only the "MTF" is complete enough to adapt...:rolleyes:

Bodo acts like Roger is playing chess (and Novak too) and everyone else (Rafa included) is playing checkers.

I would love to see how he views the ONE many since Laver to win all four slams: Andre Agassi. Let's see: the man was a baseliner with a net game that ALMOST made Roddick look like a volleyer. And yet, I am sure he would view him as an "all court" player.

I guess you have to wear your pants on backwards at a grand slam trophy ceremony to be considered a man.:mad:

Metis
02-06-2008, 12:59 AM
It seems to me Bodo writes a lot of nonsense and ends up saying very little.


I wrote some time ago that Nadal is a child of the sun and south, while TMF is a man of the chill and hard north.......

What got me thinking along these lines has been Djokovic's progress. Another man of northern inclinations,......


what a heap of :bs: not to mention the "provincial", "country mouse" and "city mouse" analogies... :tape:

The worst part is where he says he was impressed Nadal reached the Wimbledon final despite the "cold, gloomy climate" and was puzzled he hasn't done well at the "sunny, warm, colorful" US Open. Obviously these don't agree with his charming theory about north vs south, cold vs sun, but at least for the latter he is covered since the US Open has proved an unsurmountable challenge to provincial players... :retard:

The best part is that (as he writes towards the end) this brilliant theory was inspired/reinforced by Djokovic's recent progress, since he is "another man of northern inclinations". :spit: :rolls:

Sunset of Age
02-06-2008, 01:06 AM
Mr. Bodo is a TOOL.
And as such, whatever I said - I rest my case. :angel:

Marek.
02-06-2008, 01:30 AM
Peter Bodo is a tool.

That sums it up.

Johnny Groove
02-06-2008, 01:33 AM
It seems to me Bodo writes a lot of nonsense and ends up saying very little.



what a heap of :bs: not to mention the "provincial", "country mouse" and "city mouse" analogies... :tape:

The worst part is where he says he was impressed Nadal reached the Wimbledon final despite the "cold, gloomy climate" and was puzzled he hasn't done well at the "sunny, warm, colorful" US Open. Obviously these don't agree with his charming theory about north vs south, cold vs sun, but at least for the latter he is covered since the US Open has proved an unsurmountable challenge to provincial players... :retard:

The best part is that (as he writes towards the end) this brilliant theory was inspired/reinforced by Djokovic's recent progress, since he is "another man of northern inclinations". :spit: :rolls:

Yeah, that north vs south bullshit is just wrong. Maybe if Nadal was from Argentina or something he might have a point. Not only is he wrong in terms of latitude, he is just a massive clown.

Johnny Groove
02-06-2008, 01:39 AM
Federer could be from San Francisco and Nadal could be from Berkeley and I'm sure Bodo could still come up with a whole list explaining how Rogi is cloudy and northern and Rafa is sunny and southern. :scratch:

Bodo's next article:

Nadal= Robert E. Lee

Federer= Ulysses S. Grant

Based on his personal experience in the affair, im sure he remembers :o

Sunset of Age
02-06-2008, 01:56 AM
Collapse The Light Into Earth... (http://solarfallsrealm.livejournal.com/248404.html) :angel:

cmurray
02-06-2008, 02:30 AM
So what is he trying to get at? I mean, really. Forget the idiotic nicknames - could the term Jet Boy BE any more annoying and patronizing? Forget the sweeping generalizations about City Mouse and Country Mouse. What was he REALLY trying to say? That the reason Nadal doesn't perform well during the summer is because it's not...warm enough for him? I'm sorry. Come again?

What really gets me though is his suggestion that Nadal, the world number two for going on three years now, goes out on court with no game plan. Yep. All of his wins are just happy coincidences. "I just see what happens, no?" Nadal must be the luckiest bastard in the world that all of those matches just went his way. :rolleyes:

Action Jackson
02-06-2008, 02:38 AM
Bozo writes another great article. I used to think Wertheim was Tennis Fool's father, maybe he is TF's uncle.

soraya
02-06-2008, 03:13 AM
In an earlier era still dominated by Anglo venues, values and game theory, Nadal would have been deemed a "novelty" - an exotic, volatile, idiosyncratic and unorthodox challenger who was as formidable in his natural environment as a leopard on the veld, but as lost on unfamiliar turf as that same leopard in the boreal forest.


I might be wrong, but I found the above distasteful and almost racist in nature.

Lopaka
02-06-2008, 05:58 AM
Interesting article. I may consider taking down my Peter Bodo dart board. With all the past "dirt boy" comments just changing the nickname to "jet boy" does make me think PD has had a Nadal epiphany.

At least he recognize Rafa is 21 which hardly required all the that went before.

barbadosan
02-06-2008, 06:31 AM
I found the article interesting reading which took a different slant and offered some options (some colourful) for consideration to explain why the two players have been successful (or not) in different environments. It obviously also achieved what any journalist wants when he writes a piece for press or broadcast - it elicited reaction.

A propos of nothing in particular, I would challenge any of you to hammer out a reasonably lengthy piece even once a week for a few months -- and I don't mean a deadly dull report -- and then tell me how easy you found it to come up with different and interesting angles that every other journalist on the planet hadn't already done to death. Pshaw!

GuiroNl
02-06-2008, 07:02 AM
I really can't stand this poetic allegoric nonsensical blog posts. Can't this guy just write normally? Why does he have to 'spice it up' with this Nadal is a child of the sun and south, while TMF is a man of the chill and hard north kind of nonsense.

Here's another great one, Nadal would have been deemed a "novelty" - an exotic, volatile, idiosyncratic and unorthodox challenger who was as formidable in his natural environment as a leopard on the veld, but as lost on unfamiliar turf as that same leopard in the boreal forest.

It makes these articles totally unreadable IMO. (Since when is Switzerland a northern country anyway :confused:, oh wait, it's an allegory :rolleyes:). I also get the feeling that this guy is making it up as he goes, with his European fear for the USO. If you start with that kind of reasoning, Roddick has such a great record at the FO, not because of the surface but because he just doesn't like France :rolleyes:

Weel, enough of my ranting :D

Action Jackson
02-06-2008, 07:34 AM
Bodo is consistent in mediocrity.

peripheral
02-06-2008, 08:51 AM
So what is he trying to get at? I mean, really. Forget the idiotic nicknames - could the term Jet Boy BE any more annoying and patronizing? Forget the sweeping generalizations about City Mouse and Country Mouse. What was he REALLY trying to say? That the reason Nadal doesn't perform well during the summer is because it's not...warm enough for him? I'm sorry. Come again?

What really gets me though is his suggestion that Nadal, the world number two for going on three years now, goes out on court with no game plan. Yep. All of his wins are just happy coincidences. "I just see what happens, no?" Nadal must be the luckiest bastard in the world that all of those matches just went his way. :rolleyes:

Exactly. The entire, bloated thing seems like a self-indulgent exercise in airing those clunky metaphors and idiotic generalisations that, as J'torian says, he thinks are oh so clever.

*bunny*
02-06-2008, 10:10 AM
Yep those metaphors are really annoying and self-indulgent. It serves only to give some relief to those who like to believe Rafa is only about being physical without any technique and is destined to have a short career. :ras: Bodo needs to know Rafa's uncle played in the Spanish national team until he was 36! (Not that I'm saying he will play until 36.)

tennizen
02-06-2008, 12:50 PM
A propos of nothing in particular, I would challenge any of you to hammer out a reasonably lengthy piece even once a week for a few months -- and I don't mean a deadly dull report -- and then tell me how easy you found it to come up with different and interesting angles that every other journalist on the planet hadn't already done to death. Pshaw!


Peter Bodo's pieces are an exercise in self-indulgence. It has nothing to do with creating interesting angles. I agree that it's difficult to come up with interesting articles all the time but that's not an excuse to come up with crappy stereotypes. In fact, while people may dislike Steve Tignor, I am sure far less people would view his articles with as much contempt as for Peter Bodo.

yana
02-06-2008, 02:22 PM
:hug:

I'll summarize:

Rafa sunny from Spain. Likes clay. Game hasn't translated well to hardcourts. Runs a lot. Boyish manchild. Injury fears. Too late to significantly change playing style. Danger. Bodo likes the kid.

Bodo has great tastes. :yeah: Doesn't he say anything about The Ass?

l_mac
02-06-2008, 02:56 PM
Bodo has great tastes. :yeah: Doesn't he say anything about The Ass?

He doesn't. Unbelievable, no?

platinum
02-06-2008, 03:49 PM
I might be wrong, but I found the above distasteful and almost racist in nature.

Yeah, like Nadal is an exotic creature or something :(:mad::o

stebs
02-06-2008, 04:29 PM
I might be wrong, but I found the above distasteful and almost racist in nature.

Unfounded and dull it is but racist it certainly is not. It's not sexist to say a girl stands out in a line of boys just as it is not racist to say what Bodo says.

acionescu
02-06-2008, 05:25 PM
I red the article. All of it! All! Actually I read everything I can find on Nadal unless it clearly states: Nadal sucks! I don't think that Bodo dislikes Nadal, I actually think the opposite but between metaphors, leppards, north and south, little girls and sunny walls, I got lost! Maybe he's somehow paid per word? :shrug:
I don't see another reason for putting so many non-related words together whitout saying something meaningfull! :cuckoo:

brent-o
02-06-2008, 06:06 PM
I think Bodo is surprisingly fair in this article for a change. He raises some good points about Nadal. However, I don't agree with his characterization about his game being all thoughtless attack. That's better suited to Roddick. On clay, Nadal is great at constructing points and his athleticism just compliments this.

DDrago2
02-06-2008, 06:08 PM
The Force is strong with Nadal, yeah

brent-o
02-06-2008, 06:19 PM
Peter Bodo's pieces are an exercise in self-indulgence. It has nothing to do with creating interesting angles. I agree that it's difficult to come up with interesting articles all the time but that's not an excuse to come up with crappy stereotypes. In fact, while people may dislike Steve Tignor, I am sure far less people would view his articles with as much contempt as for Peter Bodo.

I agree, I think Steve Tignor is a much better tennis analyst and always interesting to read. I don't know how he does it, but he just adds something interesting to things that have been discussed before. Not to mention, he doesn't sensationalize like Bodo does.