Who will win Davis Cup Final. USA or Russia? [Archive] - MensTennisForums.com

Who will win Davis Cup Final. USA or Russia?

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Action Jackson
09-23-2007, 04:23 PM
Played in the USA.

Hope the Russians can bring a full strength team.

No, unless the USTA decide to use a massive greenhouse and have a drop in grasscourt, then the surface will be either carpet or indoor hard.

Exodus
09-23-2007, 04:24 PM
russia with safin winning the fifth rubber :-)

*Viva Chile*
09-23-2007, 04:26 PM
Lamentably USA, 4-1 (Blake will tank the dead rubber)

surface??? grass????

scarecrows
09-23-2007, 04:28 PM
USA

3-0 after 2 days

Action Jackson
09-23-2007, 04:28 PM
It won't be on grass.

TMJordan
09-23-2007, 04:30 PM
Probaly indoor hardcourts I would say.

Russia in 5, with Safin beating Roddick 19-17 in the 5th set of the 5th tie :rocker2:

Black Adam
09-23-2007, 04:30 PM
USA 3-0 or 3-1

Ruski
09-23-2007, 04:30 PM
Russia 3-2!!!

Horatio Caine
09-23-2007, 04:30 PM
USA - they already have the doubles in the bag anyway (but most do against the Russians :o).

AnnaK_4ever
09-23-2007, 04:31 PM
Russia 4-1. It's obvious :shrug:

tcorinna
09-23-2007, 04:32 PM
Russia ... :worship:

goldenlox
09-23-2007, 04:32 PM
Russia will need a big weekend from Youzhny.

*Viva Chile*
09-23-2007, 04:32 PM
Considering how Marat "loves" Miami's courts is not a bad idea to play there.

indoors = advantage Russia

Psichogauchovna
09-23-2007, 04:33 PM
Russia 3-2 ;) both Roddick and Blake are beatable :p

LilyRoseAva
09-23-2007, 04:34 PM
Russia IF Safin is there

TheBoiledEgg
09-23-2007, 04:36 PM
Russia :yeah:

Igor and his Magic Forehand will work wonders again

Marat will need to be there.

Action Jackson
09-23-2007, 04:37 PM
DC is the one thing that Marat seems to lift for these days.

The Freak
09-23-2007, 04:41 PM
USA 3-2. Russia will win the meaningless 5th rubber.

Labamba
09-23-2007, 04:42 PM
Russia 3-2 with Marat in the team

otherwise USA

Johnny Groove
09-23-2007, 04:42 PM
Considering how Marat "loves" Miami's courts is not a bad idea to play there.

indoors = advantage Russia

I'd love to see it in Miami, but it wont be happening. There are no shortage of grass courts in Florida and California, Im sure they could have found one for the tie, but noooooo :rolleyes:

keqtqiadv
09-23-2007, 04:43 PM
USA :zzz:

krakenzero
09-23-2007, 04:45 PM
Roddick, Blake, Bryans against Davydenko, Youzhny, Tursunov, Andreev. I'd say USA 3-2 as usual, with Roddick and Bryans' rubbers.

Burrow
09-23-2007, 04:46 PM
I'm sick of indoors.

Russia.

Jimnik
09-23-2007, 04:58 PM
Considering how Marat "loves" Miami's courts is not a bad idea to play there.

indoors = advantage Russia
Exactly. Miami, LA, Houston would have all been great options even played on hard courts. The USTA just lack imagination they go with the same venues for Davis Cup all the time.

LaTenista
09-23-2007, 05:03 PM
Venue confirmed yet?

Marek.
09-23-2007, 05:10 PM
USA 4-1 with Blake losing his first match as usual.

the cat
09-23-2007, 05:10 PM
As of today I think the United States will win 3-2. But I need to find out the health of the players right before the final so I can make a final prediction then. ;)

I don't think a Russian doubles team of Youzhny and Tursunov will beat the Bryan Brothers in the vital doubles point. But I think a team of Youznhy and Safin could if Safin is healthy. Safin's health is important to Russia for the final. Even if Marat only plays the doubles if Russia wins that point they would win the Tie and Davis Cup final by splitting the singles matches. It might be asking alot of Marat at this point of his career, but Russia needs him healthy and in good form for the finals.

Merton
09-23-2007, 05:17 PM
The US is the favourite, Russia will need to have Safin in form, most probably playing with Safin, Tursunov, Youzhny.

The US needs to win the DC at this moment, next year they will face away ties against Argentina, Spain, Russia and its unlikely they will avoid all of the above.

dylan24
09-23-2007, 05:26 PM
russia 3-2
james blake will lose both matches
because he is a fucking choking loser

Exodus
09-23-2007, 05:27 PM
if safin is on fire then russia easily but even without safin they should be able to beat US with davy if he doesn't place a bet hehe

dylan24
09-23-2007, 05:28 PM
i can't wait for safin to beat blake in 5th tie
and shut those fucking jblock assholes up

Dimonator133
09-23-2007, 05:44 PM
Is Safin even playing?


the USA will roll regardless

Johnny Groove
09-23-2007, 05:49 PM
if safin is on fire then russia easily but even without safin they should be able to beat US with davy if he doesn't place a bet hehe

Are you serious?

Kolya has a combined 0-10 record against Roddick and Blake, and has only won 2 sets over ten matches against them. :rolleyes:

Deboogle!.
09-23-2007, 06:16 PM
Exactly. Miami, LA, Houston would have all been great options even played on hard courts. The USTA just lack imagination they go with the same venues for Davis Cup all the time.LA and Houston don't have good enough weather for the end of November. Further inland in California like Rancho Mirage where they had the grass tie against Chile would be nice. Houston's out on several levels, I don't think Mattress Mack and the USTA are getting along that well right now from what was published earlier this year. But like I said in the other thread, moot point, it will be indoors and not on grass.
Venue confirmed yet?Winston-Salem, NC or Portland, OR - will probably be announced officially in the next couple days

Merton
09-23-2007, 06:22 PM
LA and Houston don't have good enough weather for the end of November. Further inland in California like Rancho Mirage where they had the grass tie against Chile would be nice. Houston's out on several levels, I don't think Mattress Mack and the USTA are getting along that well right now from what was published earlier this year. But like I said in the other thread, moot point, it will be indoors and not on grass.
Winston-Salem, NC or Portland, OR - will probably be announced officially in the next couple days

If it is NC they would need to work on the court, they shouldn't use against Russia the low-bouncing court they had against Spain.

Jimnik
09-23-2007, 06:25 PM
LA and Houston don't have good enough weather for the end of November. Further inland in California like Rancho Mirage where they had the grass tie against Chile would be nice. Houston's out on several levels, I don't think Mattress Mack and the USTA are getting along that well right now from what was published earlier this year. But like I said in the other thread, moot point, it will be indoors and not on grass.

You sure about that? My sister lives in LA and she says it's warm pretty much all year round. Houston hosted the TMC on outdoor hard courts so I'm sure the weather is fine there too.

But yeah the USTA have their issues and already narrowed it down to those indoor venues. :rolleyes:
I guess it doesn't make a difference which indoor surface they choose now as long as it isn't clay.

tennisgal_001
09-23-2007, 06:28 PM
Too early to call it. Depends on the surface, the players, etc... (doubles excluded)

Deboogle!.
09-23-2007, 06:29 PM
If it is NC they would need to work on the court, they shouldn't use against Russia the low-bouncing court they had against Spain.Pretty sure the court is a temporary one (they use the arena for other things) so it would be a totally different court.

You sure about that? My sister lives in LA and she says it's warm pretty much all year round. Houston hosted the TMC on outdoor hard courts so I'm sure the weather is fine there too.

But yeah the USTA have their issues and already narrowed it down to those indoor venues. :rolleyes:Yes I'm sure :lol: I've lived in both LA and Houston - in LA right now - and I've been in both places at the end of November. The TMC was held early november and it was cold and rainy both years they held it, 3 weeks later would be even worse. Plus like I said pretty sure Mack and the USTA are not on the best of terms at the moment.

Problem with LA is that it could be very chilly. It depends on your definition of "Warm" but I think attending outdoor tennis in late November here would be unenjoyable - like I said having it out at the desert where IW is held would be different, it is warmer there. It is still nice now, in the afternoon, but at the very end of November I sometimes use the heat. It probably wouldn't rain but it would be cool. San Diego has a similar climate to LA and the venue they were looking at down there is indoors anyway, even though there are plenty of outdoor HC venues in San Diego. So I mean would it be *possible*? Sure, could get a warmer spell up into the 70s, but I don't think it's something that you can count on. Sure outdoor tennis can still be played in the 60sF, but it's not particularly fun to sit there if nothing else.

TheBoiledEgg
09-23-2007, 06:31 PM
indoors will suit us just fine.
we got players for all conditions/any surface/speed

mangoes
09-23-2007, 06:52 PM
USA will win this

trixtah
09-23-2007, 07:08 PM
You sure about that? My sister lives in LA and she says it's warm pretty much all year round. Houston hosted the TMC on outdoor hard courts so I'm sure the weather is fine there too.

But yeah the USTA have their issues and already narrowed it down to those indoor venues. :rolleyes:
I guess it doesn't make a difference which indoor surface they choose now as long as it isn't clay.

Cold as hell here in socal! In November they use my nipples to cut diamond.

I'd have to say Russia definitely has Marat for the final team

DrJules
09-23-2007, 07:23 PM
I assume that Davydenko will not be playing. That would guarantee a USA win.

*Viva Chile*
09-23-2007, 07:28 PM
USA playing Russia on indoors is a suicide IMO

edit: well, not a suicide, but if they choose it, it will be the hardest way to reach the victory.

Marek.
09-23-2007, 07:29 PM
I assume that Davydenko will not be playing. That would guarantee a USA win.

Why wouldn't he play?

Deboogle!.
09-23-2007, 07:31 PM
Why wouldn't he play?Look at his record against the guys on the US Davis Cup team :lol:

shotgun
09-23-2007, 07:32 PM
Choosing indoor carpet to host the Russians is only a bit better than choosing clay. :lol:

USA still have the edge with the chest-bumping Bryans being a lock and Roddick has played very well in Davis Cup this year. The Russians have a chance as long as Davydenko isn't part of the team because not only he's owned by the Americans but he's also shown that he doesn't have what it takes to be a Davis Cup hero.

LoveFifteen
09-23-2007, 07:34 PM
I have no idea who will win. It's too early to tell.

Go USA! :bounce:

simona21
09-23-2007, 07:37 PM
no way that the boys will let this opportunity slip away...USA 4-1....all the way USA...
bring the trophy boys...

Deboogle!.
09-23-2007, 07:39 PM
Choosing indoor carpet to host the Russians is only a bit better than choosing clay. :lol:

USA still have the edge with the chest-bumping Bryans being a lock and Roddick has played very well in Davis Cup this year. The Russians have a chance as long as Davydenko isn't part of the team because not only he's owned by the Americans but he's also shown that he doesn't have what it takes to be a Davis Cup hero.I doubt it would be carpet. I think it would be some kind of indoor HC, like they have used in the past. I don't recall the last time the US had a home tie on carpet :scratch:

Fee
09-23-2007, 07:40 PM
I don't think indoor carpet would be a good choice. I'd say get the same surface they used in San Jose this past February because Marat sure seemed to HATE that, but I don't think Andy or James liked it much either.

I've been to the Rose Arena in Portland before, that would be a nice venue, but with the USTA it all comes down to whichever venue throws more money at them, not what is best for the team. Shame it won't be on grass, that would definitely give the US an advantage.

I say 3-2 US. James will lose his matches. As long as we're giving up a singles point, PMac should put Justin on the team, at least it will be more fun. ;)

shotgun
09-23-2007, 07:42 PM
I doubt it would be carpet. I think it would be some kind of indoor HC, like they have used in the past. I don't recall the last time the US had a home tie on carpet :scratch:

Makes more sense if it's indoor hardcourt. It would be the third best choice out of five.

Allure
09-23-2007, 07:44 PM
Russia.

Deboogle!.
09-23-2007, 07:47 PM
As long as we're giving up a singles point, PMac should put Justin on the team, at least it will be more fun. ;):rolls:

Makes more sense if it's indoor hardcourt. It would be the third best choice out of five.:lol: I guess :lol:

I just don't remember a home match on HC. they played spain on indoor HC, when they played Austria a few years ago it was HC, I don't think PMac would be dumb enough to lay carpet for Russia :lol:

Del_Toro
09-23-2007, 08:21 PM
I'd say Russia 3-2 but depends on the surface chosen by the US team

jonny84
09-23-2007, 08:35 PM
Bryan brothers should they be playing would be sure to win.

If Blake and Andy play then USA should have no problems at all.

Johnny Groove
09-23-2007, 08:38 PM
Bring Isner please :)

star
09-23-2007, 09:16 PM
Bring Isner please :)

He'll be the orange squeezer only. :) :)

He might get really nervous playing for a team like James seems to. He said he was more nervous playing for his college team than just for himself.

Mechlan
09-23-2007, 09:18 PM
Depends on how James plays. He seems to play well on home soil. But then he also wilts under pressure. Depending on who shows up, this could be really easy or pretty tricky. I'll say 4-1 USA, though it could be 3-2.
I've been to the Rose Arena in Portland before, that would be a nice venue, but with the USTA it all comes down to whichever venue throws more money at them, not what is best for the team.
For personal reasons I really hope it's Portland. :angel:

Black Adam
09-23-2007, 09:21 PM
I don't see Blake losing to Youzhny or Andreev on hard court even if it's indoors. By the way why are some people assuming Safin won't be available? Anyways I figure that with a chance of winning DC for the fist time in more than a decade and playing at home will be enough to fire up Roddick and to some extent Blake since he isn't all bad when playing at home.

Deboogle!.
09-23-2007, 10:05 PM
I don't see Blake losing to Youzhny or Andreev on hard court even if it's indoors. By the way why are some people assuming Safin won't be available? Anyways I figure that with a chance of winning DC for the fist time in more than a decade and playing at home will be enough to fire up Roddick and to some extent Blake since he isn't all bad when playing at home.Well, Andy's certainly going to put himself in the best possible position to win his matches. He said point blank he wouldn't care if he didn't win another match all season as long as they win this final and that he will adjust his schedule for the rest of the season to make sure he is in the best possible condition. It means more to him than almost anything in his career and he wants it badly. The last time the final was on home soil, he was like 9 or 10 and was there with his brothers, and he said today that "it changed his life" - how karmic if the next time it's on soil he is actually on the winning team :)

musefanatic
09-23-2007, 10:12 PM
I think Russia'll just edge it but i really don't know what's going on with Koyla, seems a bit worrying for them to me, they'll certainly get trounced by the Bryan's in doubles but they'll get through the singles, i'm sure.

ChinoRios4Ever
09-23-2007, 10:13 PM
USA 3-2

on grass?

ys
09-23-2007, 10:13 PM
They have doubles in the bag. We have two points against Blake in the bag. Can either of our guys take a point from Roddick, that's a question..

Deboogle!.
09-23-2007, 10:18 PM
on grass?no. grass is not an option at all. Andy said so himself today.

ChinoRios4Ever
09-23-2007, 10:23 PM
no. grass is not an option at all. Andy said so himself today.

thanks 4 the info :yeah:

Deboogle!.
09-23-2007, 10:49 PM
anytime:)

CyBorg
09-23-2007, 11:48 PM
The US is the favourite, Russia will need to have Safin in form, most probably playing with Safin, Tursunov, Youzhny.

The US needs to win the DC at this moment, next year they will face away ties against Argentina, Spain, Russia and its unlikely they will avoid all of the above.

I don't see why Russia needs Safin. Youzhny and Davydenko are better players and can definitely stand up to whoever the Americans have going up there. I suppose that Safin would be a nice finisher to come in fresh and rested, but I think Tursunov might be the guy who could get the job done like this. We'll see.

CyBorg
09-23-2007, 11:53 PM
Look at his record against the guys on the US Davis Cup team :lol:

Instead of being so naive you can look a bit closer at the details.

Davydenko hasn't played Roddick since the 2005 Aussie. That's almost three years ago. Since then Davydenko has vastly improved and Roddick has gone downhill.

As for Davydenko/Blake - the two have never played each other on carpet (which I assume is the likely surface) - only on hard. They had a close battle at the Tennis Masters Cup last year. Regardless Davydenko is due to hand Blake a loss.

@Sweet Cleopatra
09-23-2007, 11:57 PM
RUSSIA will win sure how dare any one don't think that , so obvious and clear.

Jimnik
09-24-2007, 12:00 AM
Instead of being so naive you can look a bit closer at the details.

Davydenko hasn't played Roddick since the 2005 Aussie. That's almost three years ago. Since then Davydenko has vastly improved and Roddick has gone downhill.

As for Davydenko/Blake - the two have never played each other on carpet (which I assume is the likely surface) - only on hard. They had a close battle at the Tennis Masters Cup last year. Regardless Davydenko is due to hand Blake a loss.
Davydenko doesn't have the belief and if you'd read Deb's posts you'd see that the final will probably not be on carpet. It is a match-up issue. Davydenko can't find a rhythm when playing Blake and I doubt he would against Roddick either. He is not a big match player. He cannot raise his game for the big occasions as he's shown many times, in grand slam SFs and the Davis Cup final last year.

CyBorg
09-24-2007, 12:18 AM
Davydenko doesn't have the belief and if you'd read Deb's posts you'd see that the final will probably not be on carpet. It is a match-up issue. Davydenko can't find a rhythm when playing Blake and I doubt he would against Roddick either. He is not a big match player. He cannot raise his game for the big occasions as he's shown many times, in grand slam SFs and the Davis Cup final last year.

A few things:

- there is no tangeable evidence that Davydenko can't play Roddick. None. I've already proven why.

- Davydenko is no less a money player than Blake is.

- Roddick's ground game has deteriorated to the point where he doesn't win rallies consistently anymore. Yes, he can win a set or two on his serve alone, but a guy like Davydenko can stay with him long enough to get him out of his comfort zone. Again, if we were talking about a younger Roddick I would agree with you, but not this Roddick. And, yes, Blake is talented enough to blow Davydenko out of the water, but he doesn't exactly have all the eggs in one basket.

DrJules
09-24-2007, 12:30 AM
Cannot see anything other than USA win 3-2 or 4-1.

Russia have to select Safin plus either Youzhny or Andreev. All have beaten Roddick, but do not expect victory in the final against Roddick. I would only confidently pick Federer or Djokovic to beat Roddick in a Davis Cup final on a hard court in the USA.

Blake is possibly the American version of Davydenko who cannot handle big occasions. Therefore, gives Russia their 1 or 2 points.

Would be shocked if Russia select either Davydenko or Tursunov.

DrJules
09-24-2007, 12:35 AM
A few things:

- there is no tangeable evidence that Davydenko can't play Roddick. None. I've already proven why.

- Davydenko is no less a money player than Blake is.

- Roddick's ground game has deteriorated to the point where he doesn't win rallies consistently anymore. Yes, he can win a set or two on his serve alone, but a guy like Davydenko can stay with him long enough to get him out of his comfort zone. Again, if we were talking about a younger Roddick I would agree with you, but not this Roddick. And, yes, Blake is talented enough to blow Davydenko out of the water, but he doesn't exactly have all the eggs in one basket.

Both have severely flawed personalities which prevent them maximising the return from their talents.

Jimnik
09-24-2007, 12:36 AM
A few things:

- there is no tangeable evidence that Davydenko can't play Roddick. None. I've already proven why.

- Davydenko is no less a money player than Blake is.

- Roddick's ground game has deteriorated to the point where he doesn't win rallies consistently anymore. Yes, he can win a set or two on his serve alone, but a guy like Davydenko can stay with him long enough to get him out of his comfort zone. Again, if we were talking about a younger Roddick I would agree with you, but not this Roddick. And, yes, Blake is talented enough to blow Davydenko out of the water, but he doesn't exactly have all the eggs in one basket.
Roddick can hit just as hard as when he was younger and he prooved it against Federer at the USO and a few other big matches. Davydenko doesn't have the belief to turn around H2Hs like that even though he has improved a lot over the last few years. The semi-finals at RG and the USO were a perfect demonstration of how he couldn't handle the occasion and lost all the crucial points.

Blake owns Davydenko, the Cincy meeting proved it, and especially the TMC meeting last year. Even though he played well he still didn't win, it's a mental problame more than anything else. Bottom line, Davydenko is not a big match player, Safin is.

CyBorg
09-24-2007, 12:37 AM
Both have severely flawed personalities which prevent them maximising the return from their talents.

Eh, I don't know about this. If Davydenko had Blake's talent he'd have won several masters series events by now.

Deboogle!.
09-24-2007, 12:41 AM
Instead of being so naive you can look a bit closer at the details.

Davydenko hasn't played Roddick since the 2005 Aussie. That's almost three years ago. Since then Davydenko has vastly improved and Roddick has gone downhill.

As for Davydenko/Blake - the two have never played each other on carpet (which I assume is the likely surface) - only on hard. They had a close battle at the Tennis Masters Cup last year. Regardless Davydenko is due to hand Blake a loss.:haha: You called me naive :haha: :haha: :haha: I admit, I have been called many names on this board over the past 4 years or so, but naive is not one of them :haha: this is really a first for me :haha: Winning Davis Cup is one of Andy's life goals. He's going to play well for this final, considering it is at home. I never once said Andy or the US team would win any particular matches. But it's just plain common sense when you have a team as deep as Russia you wouldn't put Davydenko in those matches. Naive :haha:

Davydenko doesn't have the belief and if you'd read Deb's posts you'd see that the final will probably not be on carpet. It is a match-up issue. Davydenko can't find a rhythm when playing Blake and I doubt he would against Roddick either. He is not a big match player. He cannot raise his game for the big occasions as he's shown many times, in grand slam SFs and the Davis Cup final last year.Thank you. And just because people still can't seem to read what i've said 10 times already :haha:




Q. Can you tell a few words about the decision making in your team for the final. It's a big event. How would you sit down what are their strengths, what are their weaknesses? Obviously not clay. How is the decision making?
ANDY RODDICK: For us?

Q. Yes, prior to the big final against Russia in the States.
ANDY RODDICK: You know what, I'm sure Patrick will talk to us about our preferences. I can promise you it will not be on anything other than a hard court or some sort of hard surface. We're going to try to export all of the clay out of the state of Oregon for the tie. I don't think we want to be -- I don't know if they have clay courts in Oregon, but hopefully they'll cover them up during that weekend.
I think it's a pretty straightforward decision for our captain. I'm sure he'll check with us. But ultimately the decision lies with Patrick, and that's why he's the captain.

Q. No grass? Grass is the weakness No. 1 for Russia.
ANDY RODDICK: Yeah, it's tough to make grass grow indoors in December in the States.

Q. They can do it in Holland, but not in December.
ANDY RODDICK: I promise you, any grass court that's put in indoors in December would be a piece of crap, I promise you. It's tough to make a makeshift grass court. They're not very good at all. We'll take our chances with our surface, I think.

===============================================
===============================================

Q. Andy just promised that the final wasn't going to be on clay. I'm assuming you concur with that?
CAPTAIN McENROE: Yeah, that's for sure. Yeah, it will not be on clay. It will be on a relatively quick court. We have just haven't decidedly exactly what it will be or where it will be. We know there's a couple options. But court-wise we make the decision, me and the players, on what the actual court will be, what they want it to be, and then I do the best I can to make sure it's right.

CyBorg
09-24-2007, 12:42 AM
Roddick can hit just as hard as when he was younger and he prooved it against Federer at the USO and a few other big matches. Davydenko doesn't have the belief to turn around H2Hs like that even though he has improved a lot over the last few years. The semi-finals at RG and the USO were a perfect demonstration of how he couldn't handle the occasion and lost all the crucial points.

Blake owns Davydenko, the Cincy meeting proved it, and especially the TMC meeting last year. Even though he played well he still didn't win, it's a mental problame more than anything else. Bottom line, Davydenko is not a big match player, Safin is.

Davydenko played Federer in those semifinals and, mind you, just as well as anyone else not named Nadal.

Saying stuff like "Davydenko doesn't have the belief to turn around H2Hs" is just plain silly. It's close-minded and irrational.

I agree that Blake has the skill to blow Davydenko away, but the guy is too loose a canon for us to expect this from him. If he plays a tight match and makes a lot of turnovers (as he often does) Davydenko will beat him. I disagree about Safin being a big-match player - this is like saying that Diego Maradonna is a great soccer player; it's sort of true but only historically. Safin is no longer much of a factor, regardless of much people would like to think that he still has something left in the tank.

CyBorg
09-24-2007, 12:43 AM
:haha: You called me naive :haha: :haha: :haha: I admit, I have been called many names on this board over the past 4 years or so, but naive is not one of them :haha: this is really a first for me :haha: Winning Davis Cup is one of Andy's life goals. He's going to play well for this final, considering it is at home. I never once said Andy or the US team would win any particular matches. But it's just plain common sense when you have a team as deep as Russia you wouldn't put Davydenko in those matches. Naive :haha:

Geeze Louise. Take a valium; then get back to me.

Deboogle!.
09-24-2007, 12:46 AM
:rolleyes:

I don't have anything to get back to you about. We don't agree about tennis. No need to make it personal.

Jimnik
09-24-2007, 12:54 AM
Davydenko played Federer in those semifinals and, mind you, just as well as anyone else not named Nadal.
I know and he probably should have won. He had so may chances and after he finally converts his 10th BP, he starts spraying UEs all over the place. Classic case of not believing in the final result even though he had the potential.

Saying stuff like "Davydenko doesn't have the belief to turn around H2Hs" is just plain silly. It's close-minded and irrational.
Mate, after making comments like "there is no tangeable evidence that Davydenko can't play Roddick" you shouldn't be lecturing others on silly comments. H2H is plenty evidence to show otherwise and Davydenko has proven against Blake, Hewitt and Federer that he's incapable of beating players who own him. He has the ability, he's clearly improved a lot, but then why does he still have the same results against players whom he always lost to? Even Nalbandian almost beat him at RG this year after spending 6 weeks eating burgers and watching rallies.

I agree that Blake has the skill to blow Davydenko away, but the guy is too loose a canon for us to expect this from him. If he plays a tight match and makes a lot of turnovers (as he often does) Davydenko will beat him. I disagree about Safin being a big-match player - this is like saying that Diego Maradonna is a great soccer player; it's sort of true but only historically. Safin is no longer much of a factor, regardless of much people would like to think that he still has something left in the tank.
You seem to have a real anti-Safin mentallity here. Give me one piece of evidence that proves that Davydenko is a better big match player than Safin. Otherwise everything you've said so far is based on main tour ATP and GS results this year which is just silly when it comes to a Davis Cup final.

CyBorg
09-24-2007, 01:05 AM
I know and he probably should have won. He had so may chances and after he finally converts his 10th BP, he starts spraying UEs all over the place. Classic case of not believing in the final result even though he had the potential.

You've sold me on this completely. Davydenko was absolutely pathetic against Federer, unlike Blake and Roddick who... oh, wait. I'm sorry - what's your point again?

Mate, after making comments like "there is no tangeable evidence that Davydenko can't play Roddick" you shouldn't be lecturing others on silly comments. H2H is plenty evidence to show otherwise and Davydenko has proven against Blake, Hewitt and Federer that he's incapable of beating players who own him. He has the ability, he's clearly improved a lot, but then why does he still have the same results against players whom he always lost to? Even Nalbandian almost beat him at RG this year after spending 6 weeks eating burgers and watching rallies.

Let me explain this to you in as down-to-earth manner as possible: A head-to-head is flawed evidence, made even more flawed when the results are more than 2.5 years old. In January 2005 (when Davydenko last played Roddick) Davydenko was not a top-10 player and Roddick may have been in his prime. I took you up on using the H2H as something representative of what is to be expected. This is, objectively speaking, nonsense. At worst this is spin.

You seem to have a real anti-Safin mentallity here. Give me one piece of evidence that proves that Davydenko is a better big match player than Safin. Otherwise everything you've said so far is based on main tour ATP and GS results this year which is just silly when it comes to a Davis Cup final.

Safin is one of my favorite players. Saying that I have an anti-Safin mentality simply because I speak without a hint of nostalgia about his game is amusing to me. Have you been watching the man play at all this year? Do you think he is going to come back like Rocky after contemplating climbing that mountain? I'll tell you what I think: Safin, bless his soul, is done.

Jimnik
09-24-2007, 01:18 AM
You've sold me on this completely. Davydenko was absolutely pathetic against Federer, unlike Blake and Roddick who... oh, wait. I'm sorry - what's your point again?
I recall Roddick coming a lot closer than Davydenko and he's had MPs against Federer in their meeting at the TMC last year (after his so-called decline). What has Davydenko done? Has he won a slam or TMS events beating top 10 players in the final?

Let me explain this to you in as down-to-earth manner as possible: A head-to-head is flawed evidence, made even more flawed when the results are more than 2.5 years old. In January 2005 (when Davydenko last played Roddick) Davydenko was not a top-10 player and Roddick may have been in his prime. I took you up on using the H2H as something representative of what is to be expected. This is, objectively speaking, nonsense. At worst this is spin.
Mate you think you're so smart and I'm so dumb trying to explain simple concepts to me. No matter how much you repeat yourself it won't change anything. They haven't met in two and a half years, doesn't matter. If Davydenko doesn't have the belief to beat Hewitt on clay this year, he certainly won't have it against Roddick on American soil.

Safin is one of my favorite players. Saying that I have an anti-Safin mentality simply because I speak without a hint of nostalgia about his game is amusing to me. Have you been watching the man play at all this year? Do you think he is going to come back like Rocky after contemplating climbing that mountain? I'll tell you what I think: Safin, bless his soul, is done.
Well I rest my case. You're basing your opinions on purely on Davydenko and Safin's results this year. That's form you're talking about it has nothing to do with big match play.

Deboogle!.
09-24-2007, 01:21 AM
I don't think it's prudent to ever doubt Safin in Davis Cup.

CyBorg
09-24-2007, 01:48 AM
I recall Roddick coming a lot closer than Davydenko and he's had MPs against Federer in their meeting at the TMC last year (after his so-called decline). What has Davydenko done? Has he won a slam or TMS events beating top 10 players in the final?

This is not a logical argument and is a red herring to be frankly. I am disputing the logic of the point that puts all of its stock on H2H. I have never stated that I feel that Davydenko is head and shoulders better than Roddick.

Mate you think you're so smart and I'm so dumb trying to explain simple concepts to me. No matter how much you repeat yourself it won't change anything. They haven't met in two and a half years, doesn't matter. If Davydenko doesn't have the belief to beat Hewitt on clay this year, he certainly won't have it against Roddick on American soil.

Well, that's fine and dandy but I certainly have more belief in Davydenko's abilities to win a match than any other Russian's. He's the best Russian player, he has made two major semis this year and he's much more durable than Youzhny. If this means that Russia has no chance against the States then so be it: we'll wait and see.

Well I rest my case. You're basing your opinions on purely on Davydenko and Safin's results this year. That's form you're talking about it has nothing to do with big match play.

Clutchness is something that figures in when a player actually has the goods to play consistently. Many will point to Safin's play at last year's DC, but there were indicators that he was still a good player, including his finals appearance in Moscow in the fall. This year there are no such indicators. Unless there was any way to insert Safin into key moments of matches there frankly is little hope that he can be useful for Russia. I'm sure that the world's #4 player will do okay.

GonzoFed
09-24-2007, 01:59 AM
Prediction: Gringos 3-2. And about Safin's performance on DC, he has an history of being solid, beating the players he is supposed to beat, but when he has been pitted against opponents as strong as he is/was, he's pretty beatable. He clinched the cup against Acasuso last year, sure, but that was the expected thing to happen. Nalbandian in that same tie, dispatched him easily. Fed in Moscow on clay (2002), Gonzo here in my country this year, also beat him comfortably. If you ask me, Andreev and Youzhny (specially Andreev, just ask GILdemeister) have being the ones stepping up above what it is expected from them to deliver under pressure.

Jimnik
09-24-2007, 02:04 AM
This is not a logical argument and is a red herring to be frankly. I am disputing the logic of the point that puts all of its stock on H2H. I have never stated that I feel that Davydenko is head and shoulders better than Roddick.
Nor have I indicated that you said so. Are you putting words in my mouth now?

Well, that's fine and dandy but I certainly have more belief in Davydenko's abilities to win a match than any other Russian's. He's the best Russian player, he has made two major semis this year and he's much more durable than Youzhny. If this means that Russia has no chance against the States then so be it: we'll wait and see.
Yet again it's all based on form and current rankings. Davydenko won all the early round matches and made loads of semi-finals this year but then what did he do? I don't recall Safin ever having a 0-6 record in SF matches in any year of his career.

Clutchness is something that figures in when a player actually has the goods to play consistently. Many will point to Safin's play at last year's DC, but there were indicators that he was still a good player, including his finals appearance in Moscow in the fall. This year there are no such indicators. Unless there was any way to insert Safin into key moments of matches there frankly is little hope that he can be useful for Russia. I'm sure that the world's #4 player will do okay.
Take the tie against France for an example. Safin in the middle of a slump, Davydenko on his usual consistent form. What happens? Davyenko loses to PHM, Safin beats PHM.

Marat was the one who raised his game in the doubles with Tursunov to beat Nalba/Calleri, he was the one who helped beat Chile in February, he has won rubbers in two DC finals. He's won slams beating top players, his record in big matches speaks for itself.

This isn't the usual overhyping of Safin, underrenting of Davydenko, this is fact. Big matches are what count and the two records are incomparable.

Clara Bow
09-24-2007, 03:31 AM
I really think the US will win this. Likely 3-2, with the Bryans being very important for the tie and the DC title being ignored by the general US sports media....sigh. (Not a huge fan of the Bryans per se- but I really respect how well they have done in dubs the past few years.)

Q. They can do it in Holland, but not in December.
ANDY RODDICK: I promise you, any grass court that's put in indoors in December would be a piece of crap, I promise you. It's tough to make a makeshift grass court. They're not very good at all. We'll take our chances with our surface, I think.

Andy- you speak the truth.

World Beater
09-24-2007, 03:33 AM
Prediction: Gringos 3-2. And about Safin's performance on DC, he has an history of being solid, beating the players he is supposed to beat, but when he has been pitted against opponents as strong as he is/was, he's pretty beatable. He clinched the cup against Acasuso last year, sure, but that was the expected thing to happen. Nalbandian in that same tie, dispatched him easily. Fed in Moscow on clay (2002), Gonzo here in my country this year, also beat him comfortably. If you ask me, Andreev and Youzhny (specially Andreev, just ask GILdemeister) have being the ones stepping up above what it is expected from them to deliver under pressure.

great post :yeah:

safin is a good davis cup player but truly overrated by those on this board.

ljubicic is actually one of those who seems to elevate his game for DC.

I remember that switzerland - russia tie. Federer trashed both kafelnikov and safin.

Winston's Human
09-24-2007, 04:00 AM
The USTA should re-consider Oklahoma City. I think a stadium filled with rowdy Okies and Texans would give the US boys the push they need.

Portland? Ugh. People in the Northwest are just too polite to host a Davis Cup final. We need a rowdy crowd.

Beer Monster
09-24-2007, 04:06 AM
I've gone for Russia 3-2.

The outcome could depend on whether Nikolay Davydenko has worked out a way to beat James Blake.

El Legenda
09-24-2007, 04:34 AM
Russia 10-0, Roddick, Blake and Pmac suck

ys
09-24-2007, 04:44 AM
I would only confidently pick Federer or Djokovic to beat Roddick in a Davis Cup final on a hard court in the USA.

I remember some loser named Ljubicic managing it just fine. And he is not half a player Safin or Davydenko is.

jayjay
09-24-2007, 04:49 AM
Congratulations to Russia on another Davis Cup title. Absolutely dominant in the team game with the men and women. Winning in the US will be their best title win to date. And possibly again by the same scoreline as the previous recent successes against us and France, 3-2.

ys
09-24-2007, 04:51 AM
And Tarpischev has a shot at the rarest possible tennis double - Fed Cup+Davis Cup.. I am not sure it has ever been accomplished before.

GlennMirnyi
09-24-2007, 05:05 AM
Prediction: Gringos 3-2. And about Safin's performance on DC, he has an history of being solid, beating the players he is supposed to beat, but when he has been pitted against opponents as strong as he is/was, he's pretty beatable. He clinched the cup against Acasuso last year, sure, but that was the expected thing to happen. Nalbandian in that same tie, dispatched him easily. Fed in Moscow on clay (2002), Gonzo here in my country this year, also beat him comfortably. If you ask me, Andreev and Youzhny (specially Andreev, just ask GILdemeister) have being the ones stepping up above what it is expected from them to deliver under pressure.

Tursunov too last year.

ys
09-24-2007, 05:09 AM
And about Safin's performance on DC, he has an history of being solid, beating the players he is supposed to beat, but when he has been pitted against opponents as strong as he is/was, he's pretty beatable.

Since 2000 Russia with Safin is 13-1 in Davis Cup. Russia without him is only 4-3. His influence transcends primitive math of matches and points. And playing Safin indoors is the silliest choice Americans could have made.

krystlel
09-24-2007, 05:14 AM
USA to win. I don't see Roddick losing either of his singles matches regardless of who he plays against and the Bryans are a lock in the doubles as usual. That the tie will be played indoors will help Safin's chances but I still think USA will win.

GonzoFed
09-24-2007, 05:19 AM
Tursunov too last year.

You are right. Impressive stuff against Gasquet, and we could say also against the Duck. Both clay court clowns, but Dima kept it together and didn't choke when it mattered the most.

anny12
09-24-2007, 05:44 AM
I'm not doubting the skills of the Russian team, I just can't imagine Roddick and the Bryan Bros letting this opportunity slip away. If Andy plays like he has been, the Bryan Bros show up and Blake is mentally there, they should win.

CyBorg
09-24-2007, 08:36 AM
Nor have I indicated that you said so. Are you putting words in my mouth now?

Read your own posts. You speak a bunch of nonsense about Davydenko v. Roddick and which of them came closer to beating Federer. And somehow this is supposed to tie in to Safin. Go figure.

Yet again it's all based on form and current rankings. Davydenko won all the early round matches and made loads of semi-finals this year but then what did he do? I don't recall Safin ever having a 0-6 record in SF matches in any year of his career.

Safin doesn't make semi finals anymore, because he's no longer any good.

Take the tie against France for an example. Safin in the middle of a slump, Davydenko on his usual consistent form. What happens? Davyenko loses to PHM, Safin beats PHM.

Well, that one instance must explain everything. The fact that Davydenko won the doubles match probably also means that he's better at that than Llodra.

Marat was the one who raised his game in the doubles with Tursunov to beat Nalba/Calleri, he was the one who helped beat Chile in February, he has won rubbers in two DC finals. He's won slams beating top players, his record in big matches speaks for itself.

I don't dispute that Safin has a great DC history. But he is not the player that he once was. Not even the player he was six months ago.

This isn't the usual overhyping of Safin, underrenting of Davydenko, this is fact. Big matches are what count and the two records are incomparable.

That's great. Maybe Safin and his bum knees have one last hurrah in them. I wouldn't be surprised if the Russians bet their mortgages on them, considering the health concerns of Davydenko and Youzhny. But if both guys are healthy Safin won't play a pivotal match.

Action Jackson
09-24-2007, 08:53 AM
Safin as long as he is fit, will be in the squad, so it wouldn't surprise at all if Davydenko was the one that was left out of the squad if all 5 main Russian players are fit.

laure xxx
09-24-2007, 10:04 AM
USA 4-1. Blake will win the 5th dead rubber.

laure xxx
09-24-2007, 10:06 AM
Majority of people have voted for Russia. :spit:

I wonder how much of that is fuelled by knowledge of the game or an ingrained hatred towards the US?

Action Jackson
09-24-2007, 10:10 AM
Majority of people have voted for Russia. :spit:

I wonder how much of that is fuelled by knowledge of the game or an ingrained hatred towards the US?

What makes you think the US are such overwhelming favourites?

The Russians are going to have Tursunov, Andreev, Safin and Youzhny out of the team by the final or something? Well it's not like having Stepanek and Soderling out of their respective ties didn't help the Americans.

Russians can play on all surfaces except grass, can win away from home consistently and not need withdrawals from the other squad members to help their cause in doing so.

Does this mean they will win this tie? Not necessarily, but to dismiss them cause of anti-American sentiments is ludicrous, when taken into account what they have done as a team consistently over a period of time.

fightingducky
09-24-2007, 10:19 AM
Majority of people have voted for Russia. :spit:

I wonder how much of that is fuelled by knowledge of the game or an ingrained hatred towards the US?

actually, the majority of people voted for US to win the tie, but more people voted for Russia to win 3-2 out of any other options.

rmb6687
09-24-2007, 10:19 AM
Last year I was totally behind Russia winning the Davis Cup but now I'm switching my allegiance back to the USA. It would be nice if both my favorite players had won a davis cup final in their homelands.

In terms of who is going to beat who. I'm betting Andy will defeat whoever is against him. The same goes for the bryan brothers. The third match, Blake's match, is way up in the air and I don't care who is across the net. I'm not a big fan of his, but the crowd will probably pull him through in the end.

Hopefully, Marat's match is worth watching even if he loses.

Neely
09-24-2007, 10:22 AM
Hope the USA pull this out, but I don't trust Blake that much at the moment and Roddick can't always win both singles even if they will suit the conditions perfectly for him.

But Russia is beatable away, so this is the big chance for the Americans I hope they use it :yeah:

Jimnik
09-24-2007, 11:54 AM
Read your own posts. You speak a bunch of nonsense about Davydenko v. Roddick and which of them came closer to beating Federer. And somehow this is supposed to tie in to Safin. Go figure.

Mate, you were the one that brought up Federer not me. I simply replied to your post.

Safin doesn't make semi finals anymore, because he's no longer any good.


Well, that one instance must explain everything. The fact that Davydenko won the doubles match probably also means that he's better at that than Llodra.


I don't dispute that Safin has a great DC history. But he is not the player that he once was. Not even the player he was six months ago.


That's great. Maybe Safin and his bum knees have one last hurrah in them. I wouldn't be surprised if the Russians bet their mortgages on them, considering the health concerns of Davydenko and Youzhny. But if both guys are healthy Safin won't play a pivotal match.
Look, it basically comes down to form vs big match play. You haven't provided me any evidence in any of your posts that Davydenko can be relied on in big matches. But you clearly think that because his ranking is much higher and because he's been so consistent on the main tour this year, he should play instead of Safin. That's a very simplistic way of looking at it and you clearly don't know much about Davis Cup if that is all you base your opinions on.

If you keep bringing up this year's form, combined with sarcasm, again and again as an argument for Davis Cup play then there's no point in replying to your posts anymore.

AnnaK_4ever
09-24-2007, 01:13 PM
I don't know why majority think Blake is the weak link in US team :shrug:
On the contrary, I believe it's Roddick who is beatable. In-form Tursunov, Andreev (and even Safin) can defeat him (though it's still a big question) but I don't see them beating Blake who is much more tricky player than Roddick.

smitty8
09-24-2007, 03:42 PM
Since I'm American, I'll say USA will win 3-2, but it will be very close, down to the fifth rubber. I want to see some of my favorite players giving their all, not wimping out. I just want to know where it's going to be so I can make plans and I hope it's on the east coast so I can get there easier, maybe even drive there instead of flying. I've been to a semifinal, but never a final, so this should be good.

Deboogle!.
09-24-2007, 04:31 PM
I don't know why majority think Blake is the weak link in US team :shrug:
On the contrary, I believe it's Roddick who is beatable. In-form Tursunov, Andreev (and even Safin) can defeat him (though it's still a big question) but I don't see them beating Blake who is much more tricky player than Roddick.Look at their Davis Cup records (and take out dead rubbers because James is money in those :rocker2: ), they speak for themselves :lol: nobody said andy's unbeatable, but his far superior DC record is undeniable :shrug: His biggest problem for this home final, IMO, is that he could get so overexcited that he comes out tentative and too nervous - he's done that before. Blake can be tricky, he has just badly underperformend in so many DC matches on the opening Friday, it is hard to trust him. But at home his record is obviously a lot better.

TheBoiledEgg
09-24-2007, 04:46 PM
all we need is for Roddick or Blake to injure themselves on the 1st Friday

and its all over.

Safin will be picked even its only for doubles.
but Safin will play indoors, no doubt.

star
09-24-2007, 05:05 PM
I don't know why majority think Blake is the weak link in US team :shrug:
On the contrary, I believe it's Roddick who is beatable. In-form Tursunov, Andreev (and even Safin) can defeat him (though it's still a big question) but I don't see them beating Blake who is much more tricky player than Roddick.

I think it's becuase of James's DC history and because of his recent form. That's why I see him as a weak link. But, you know, if Andy is the goat (non-acronym) and James is the hero, I won't mind. There's really no option but to play James anyway.

goldenlox
09-24-2007, 05:11 PM
If I were McEnroe, I'd play on grass. That takes Igor and Kolya out of it.

OnyxRose
09-24-2007, 06:11 PM
As mentioned in this thread several times, grass isn't an option.

Richard_from_Cal
09-24-2007, 06:50 PM
U.S.A. (I don't remember if I voted already.)

stebs
09-24-2007, 06:55 PM
Look, it basically comes down to form vs big match play. You haven't provided me any evidence in any of your posts that Davydenko can be relied on in big matches. But you clearly think that because his ranking is much higher and because he's been so consistent on the main tour this year, he should play instead of Safin. That's a very simplistic way of looking at it and you clearly don't know much about Davis Cup if that is all you base your opinions on.

If you keep bringing up this year's form, combined with sarcasm, again and again as an argument for Davis Cup play then there's no point in replying to your posts anymore.

I don't want to get involved I think both you and CyBorg have legitimate points and can continue the discussion if you wish.

However, you are getting something clearly wrong here:

You seem to be under the impression that this is form vs big matches play. That is NOT what CyBorg is saying. It's not about Safin's form. He's just not that good a player any more, he's not in a slump. Don't misinterpret me as well, he just isn't that good. I don't see why you aren't understanding CyBorg who continues to repeat it.

ZERO to do with form, it's about better player vs worse player.

Hope that helps clarity of the discussion.

gogogirl
09-24-2007, 07:35 PM
Hey All,

I'm still of the mind that in any given match, certain variables come in to play. Yes, form, surface, talent, skill, errors, winners, luck and fate. One could mention that, the odds are that James would beat Igor or Davy because he has never lost to either before. Then you'd have the ones to argue w/hand raised, "oh but James doesn't have a great DC record, so they could net their first win over him."

Sure, we can look at it from several different angles, to include, bring up the H2Hs, the surface and what not, but the bottom line will always be about "The way the ball ends up bouncing." Don't get wrong, this is a discussion board and this is a great discussion, but none of us will know how it will play out.

Like some have said, the only thing for certain is that the matches will be played on hard court.

And for the ones that think Safin is finished, I strongly disagree. The reason he lost to Nadal the last time they played was because he was not playing w/controlled aggression. We all saw flashes of brilliance. Even Nadal was getting a little worried there for a minute. Safin still has serious skill and talent. He's just been off his form lately. James has been off form. Roddick was for months last year. And Marat is just 27, the same age as James.

All players have room to improve.

Jaap
09-24-2007, 07:38 PM
USA easily.

AnnaK_4ever
09-24-2007, 07:43 PM
Tarpischev today basically said his 3 main picks for the final would be Tursunov, Youzhny and Safin.

groundstroke
09-24-2007, 07:46 PM
USA 3-2. Roddick will win it for USA.

bellascarlett
09-24-2007, 08:04 PM
Well, the Russians did get past Chile in Chile on clay esp back when Fernando was playing well...Surprisingly, the Russians were 2-0 up after the first day. So if any team knows how to win by getting through obstacles, it's the Russian team. So who knows...the US team definitely have an advantage and this might be an easy win for them...but it is final as well, the stakes are higher. As with any tie with the Americans, the most impt points would be against Roddick. Hope Marat plays (and I think he will) and will be able to lift his game up for his team.

AnnaK_4ever
09-24-2007, 08:07 PM
From Tarpischev words you could conclude he hopes Youzhny is capable to upset Roddick and Tursunov can beat Blake.

AnnaK_4ever
09-24-2007, 08:15 PM
Look at their Davis Cup records (and take out dead rubbers because James is money in those :rocker2: ), they speak for themselves :lol: nobody said andy's unbeatable, but his far superior DC record is undeniable :shrug: His biggest problem for this home final, IMO, is that he could get so overexcited that he comes out tentative and too nervous - he's done that before. Blake can be tricky, he has just badly underperformend in so many DC matches on the opening Friday, it is hard to trust him. But at home his record is obviously a lot better.

I think it's becuase of James's DC history and because of his recent form. That's why I see him as a weak link. But, you know, if Andy is the goat (non-acronym) and James is the hero, I won't mind. There's really no option but to play James anyway.

This is a valid point. But I think it's more the matter of match-ups. I mean Roddick is easy to play, his game is simple, you always know what to expect from him and you can always exploit his backhand and average volleys. He is predictable. Blake, on the contrary, is not. And though his mental toughness is a suspect it could cause much more troubles for our players.

Deboogle!.
09-24-2007, 08:57 PM
This is a valid point. But I think it's more the matter of match-ups. I mean Roddick is easy to play, his game is simple, you always know what to expect from him and you can always exploit his backhand and average volleys. He is predictable. Blake, on the contrary, is not. And though his mental toughness is a suspect it could cause much more troubles for our players.I disagree. I think Blake's game is predictable too. He will hit hard and harder. Perhaps his first-strike style is difficult to play in terms of rhythm, but there's no way he ever pulls out a surprise. he always goes for too big returns, he will move well, he will try to hit every forehand he can, he will come in sometimes. His game is the same all the time - that is one of his problems, he refuses to adapt and he doesn't particularly have a plan B for when his big flat shots aren't hitting the spots.

The difference is that in Davis Cup, Andy very often rises to the occasion, and James very often doesn't. We have enough Davis Cup surprises every single tie every single year to know that Davis Cup brings out different aspects in different people - that's why I said yesterday that regardless of his form, Safin can never ever be discounted in a Davis Cup match, and for the same reasons I think neither can Andy. Even in matches he loses in Davis Cup, he plays well. He rarely gets completely blown out in a DC match because he wants it so bad.

But perhaps even more importantly, since when does having a predictable game make a person easy to beat? This is new to me. Karlovic has the most predictable game of all, but he's not easy to beat. Heck, Rafa has a predictable game but he's hard to beat. So the fact that Andy's game won't be a surprise to his opponents is, IMO, irrelevant. If I'm PMac, I'm hoping and praying no tie goes to a 5th match with James playing that match. I certainly wouldn't trust him. And I think that's the point Nick was trying to make re: Safin and Davydenko. Form and game style is great but if the person cannot perform in the situation, the game they play is irrelevant. Just because andy's game has weaknesses doesn't make him easier to beat than a guy who has disappointed on the big stages time and time again. There's a reason why Andy has won more things than James has and has been consistently ranked higher - by your analysis because James plays a game that gives opponents less rhythm he should win more because his opponents don't know what to expect (which I disagree with anyway). I'm sorry but I don't see that logic making any sense and I especially don't see any reason to believe why it would start to make sense all of a sudden at this DC Final. The only thing James has going for him this time is that it's at home, and he plays better in the US anyway. But so does Andy.

If you were PMac, who would you put into a live 5th rubber? I think the answer is blatantly clear and has absolutely nothing to do with each player's actual game style or who the opponent across the net would be.

AnnaK_4ever
09-24-2007, 09:18 PM
I disagree. I think Blake's game is predictable too. He will hit hard and harder. Perhaps his first-strike style is difficult to play in terms of rhythm, but there's no way he ever pulls out a surprise. he always goes for too big returns, he will move well, he will try to hit every forehand he can, he will come in sometimes. His game is the same all the time - that is one of his problems, he refuses to adapt and he doesn't particularly have a plan B for when his big flat shots aren't hitting the spots.

The difference is that in Davis Cup, Andy very often rises to the occasion, and James very often doesn't. We have enough Davis Cup surprises every single tie every single year to know that Davis Cup brings out different aspects in different people - that's why I said yesterday that regardless of his form, Safin can never ever be discounted in a Davis Cup match, and for the same reasons I think neither can Andy. Even in matches he loses in Davis Cup, he plays well. He rarely gets completely blown out in a DC match because he wants it so bad.

But perhaps even more importantly, since when does having a predictable game make a person easy to beat? This is new to me. Karlovic has the most predictable game of all, but he's not easy to beat. Heck, Rafa has a predictable game but he's hard to beat. So the fact that Andy's game won't be a surprise to his opponents is, IMO, irrelevant. If I'm PMac, I'm hoping and praying no tie goes to a 5th match with James playing that match. I certainly wouldn't trust him. And I think that's the point Nick was trying to make re: Safin and Davydenko. Form and game style is great but if the person cannot perform in the situation, the game they play is irrelevant. Just because andy's game has weaknesses doesn't make him easier to beat than a guy who has disappointed on the big stages time and time again. There's a reason why Andy has won more things than James has and has been consistently ranked higher - by your analysis because James plays a game that gives opponents less rhythm he should win more because his opponents don't know what to expect (which I disagree with anyway). I'm sorry but I don't see that logic making any sense and I especially don't see any reason to believe why it would start to make sense all of a sudden at this DC Final. The only thing James has going for him this time is that it's at home, and he plays better in the US anyway. But so does Andy.

If you were PMac, who would you put into a live 5th rubber? I think the answer is blatantly clear and has absolutely nothing to do with each player's actual game style or who the opponent across the net would be.

My point was: both Safin and Tursunov struggle against players who give them no rhythm. I was talking only about these particular match-ups.

Deboogle!.
09-24-2007, 09:23 PM
My point was: both Safin and Tursunov struggle against players who give them no rhythm. I was talking only about these particular match-ups.And my point was, Davis Cup changes everything.

Fedex
09-25-2007, 12:52 AM
Usa 4-1

gogogirl
09-25-2007, 01:04 AM
I disagree. I think Blake's game is predictable too. He will hit hard and harder. Perhaps his first-strike style is difficult to play in terms of rhythm, but there's no way he ever pulls out a surprise. he always goes for too big returns, he will move well, he will try to hit every forehand he can, he will come in sometimes. His game is the same all the time - that is one of his problems, he refuses to adapt and he doesn't particularly have a plan B for when his big flat shots aren't hitting the spots.

The difference is that in Davis Cup, Andy very often rises to the occasion, and James very often doesn't. We have enough Davis Cup surprises every single tie every single year to know that Davis Cup brings out different aspects in different people - that's why I said yesterday that regardless of his form, Safin can never ever be discounted in a Davis Cup match, and for the same reasons I think neither can Andy. Even in matches he loses in Davis Cup, he plays well. He rarely gets completely blown out in a DC match because he wants it so bad.

But perhaps even more importantly, since when does having a predictable game make a person easy to beat? This is new to me. Karlovic has the most predictable game of all, but he's not easy to beat. Heck, Rafa has a predictable game but he's hard to beat. So the fact that Andy's game won't be a surprise to his opponents is, IMO, irrelevant. If I'm PMac, I'm hoping and praying no tie goes to a 5th match with James playing that match. I certainly wouldn't trust him. And I think that's the point Nick was trying to make re: Safin and Davydenko. Form and game style is great but if the person cannot perform in the situation, the game they play is irrelevant. Just because andy's game has weaknesses doesn't make him easier to beat than a guy who has disappointed on the big stages time and time again. There's a reason why Andy has won more things than James has and has been consistently ranked higher - by your analysis because James plays a game that gives opponents less rhythm he should win more because his opponents don't know what to expect (which I disagree with anyway). I'm sorry but I don't see that logic making any sense and I especially don't see any reason to believe why it would start to make sense all of a sudden at this DC Final. The only thing James has going for him this time is that it's at home, and he plays better in the US anyway. But so does Andy.

If you were PMac, who would you put into a live 5th rubber? I think the answer is blatantly clear and has absolutely nothing to do with each player's actual game style or who the opponent across the net would be.

All,

You make some good points. Yet, I still say that intangibles and other factors come into any given match. James plays better when he's serving better. Most players do. Finally and at the US Open, we saw Roger get that first serve % back up than where it was earlier in the year. It really does help to have the serving game going.

James made three finals this summer, and he was able to play w/more controlled aggression, and not just in a point or game here or there, but over all. I will give Andy the edge on keeping it in the court moreso than James - and for the most part, but the same could be said that James can hit more winners than Andy, for the most part.

If James didn't have to play Roger at the Cincy Masters final, he probably would have won against anyone else he had to face. I still say at times, it is about match-ups. Here he has never lost to Igor, but Andy has twice and etc.

The factors could involve the other person across the net, the surface, the serve, the will, the low error count, the high number of winners, fate, luck, destiny and some 'mo stuff. Ultimately and to me, it all could boil down to which player is more on his/her game than said opponent.

Svetlana.
09-25-2007, 04:44 PM
I would say it's 50/50 to me at this point. It's a little bit early to make the prediction. Both teams have advantages and disadvantages. Per record, the Russian team has been more stable for the last 2 years. But, Americans are very eager to win the DC cup this time, plus they are very close to achieve this dream especially on their soil.

The outcome is going to be clearer when location/surface and the team preparedness info are going to be available.

Either way it's going to be a very exciting final we all will enjoy.

World Beater
09-25-2007, 08:52 PM
on the atptour, blake is unpredictable.

in davis cup, blake is predictably bad and roddick is predictably good most of the time.

ys
09-25-2007, 09:11 PM
Tarpischev today basically said his 3 main picks for the final would be Tursunov, Youzhny and Safin.

If I were on his shoes, I'd play Safin ( in case he is in any resemblance of a form ) in both singles, I'd play Youzhnyi against Blake and Andreev against Roddick.

Richard_from_Cal
09-25-2007, 11:33 PM
Tarpischev today basically said his 3 main picks for the final would be Tursunov, Youzhny and Safin.Even so, with Tursunov, Safin on the Holy Spirit,....gonna go with the seedings.

Deboogle!.
09-26-2007, 03:33 AM
Apparently it will be officially announced tomorrow that Portland, Oregon will host the final. that's according to the AP

LaTenista
09-26-2007, 03:47 AM
Thanks Deb. Not looking likely that I could go. Only Alaska and Hawaii are farther away than Portland from me. :sad:

GlennMirnyi
09-26-2007, 03:52 AM
Which Russian will defeat Roddick? Andreev? Not in a fast surface. Safin? :haha: Tursunov? He's chronically injured.

No chance for the Russians, I'm afraid.

gulzhan
09-26-2007, 04:09 AM
Right now it looks like US will win but who knows what will be in a month? ;)

Any of the Russians can beat Roddick :p Youzhny, Safin, Tursunov and even Andreev :unsure: depends in what form they will come to the final and how well Andy's serve will feel but... that's jinxing is for :tape: :lol:

I'd say Russia 3-2 cause I believe in Tarpi's magic and cause I love when the 5th rubber decides :rocker2:

Marek.
09-26-2007, 04:13 AM
If it's in Oregon I might be able to go. I just hope my schedule that week is free.

bad gambler
09-26-2007, 01:08 PM
H2h between Roddick and Davydenko is a bit obsolete IMO given the last time they played a full match was in 2004. Shame Davydenko blows in DC because of all the Russians he has the game to dismantle Roddick and win, can't see any of the others beating him.

Corey Feldman
09-26-2007, 06:49 PM
The Yanks

great :rolleyes: now we can all look forward to Roddick with his strutting around like a peacock walk next year again

Richard_from_Cal
09-26-2007, 07:36 PM
The Yanks

great :rolleyes: now we can all look forward to Roddick with his strutting around like a peacock walk next year again
http://imgsrv2.tennisuniverse.com/mtf/images/smilies/erm.gif...Uhhh, might be a moot point. Andy just pulled out injured (foot) from Bangkok.

Deboogle!.
09-26-2007, 07:40 PM
:unsure:...Uhhh, might be a moot point. Andy just pulled out injured (foot) from Bangkok.luckily it doesn't sound like it's anything serious :)

Corey Feldman
09-26-2007, 07:52 PM
might be a moot point. Andy just pulled out injured (foot) from BangkokHe might do a Hewitt from 2003 and nurse himself through to December and skip everything cept TMC, Mac will want him wrapped in cotton wool... without him they'd probably lose the F as Blake is a total and utter mental midget.

wait and see Rod at the AO next January if they win this cup, he'll be walking around with his chest puffed out like the 'good old days' in 2003 :lol:

Argghhhh!!!

Byrd
09-27-2007, 01:24 AM
I wonder if Myskina will announce her undying love for Blake again :haha:

AnnaK_4ever
09-27-2007, 11:12 AM
I wonder if Myskina will announce her undying love for Blake again :haha:

She never announced it before...

Action Jackson
09-28-2007, 06:08 AM
wait and see Rod at the AO next January if they win this cup, he'll be walking around with his chest puffed out like the 'good old days' in 2003 :lol:

Argghhhh!!!

I will let you know if he does that.

switz
09-28-2007, 07:25 AM
The US will choke. None of their players know how to win on the biggest stages anymore. Even the Bryans are far from unbeatable against quality singles players who know how to play doubles.

Saumon
09-28-2007, 07:37 AM
She never announced it before...

I think it was a reference to this: http://www.menstennisforums.com/showthread.php?t=86587

;)

Kolya
09-28-2007, 07:41 AM
Russia 3-2.

The Bryans have got the doubles match already.

AnnaK_4ever
09-28-2007, 10:32 AM
I think it was a reference to this: http://www.menstennisforums.com/showthread.php?t=86587

;)

I know what it's referred to :p
I'm just tired of this :bs: because Myskina has never said a word about Blake in her real interviews.

ginnylegend
09-28-2007, 10:54 AM
Us, hopefully. We should pick a grass court realistically but Andy should win two rubbers and the twins will do the doubles business.

Topspin2
09-28-2007, 01:10 PM
Russia 3-2 =)

Fumus
11-20-2007, 03:31 PM
BIZZZZUMP!

The American Eagles or the Russian Bears?

I'm going to take the eagles 3-2, to edge out the bears.

Roddick will win both of his matches.
Blake will lose his match on the first day.
The Bryans will win....easy

Does anyone really see this going differently?

Action Jackson
11-20-2007, 03:34 PM
Good bump Fumus an actual tennis event and not some exho crap treated seriously.

Fumus
11-20-2007, 04:08 PM
Good bump Fumus an actual tennis event and not some exho crap treated seriously.

Yea, it's only the Davis Cup final...it hardly compares to the prestige, intrigue, and fangirling with Federer v. Sampras exhibition events. :yawn: :yawn: :yawn:

Maxine
11-20-2007, 04:24 PM
Russia will win, USA is just a team of ball bashers and doubles jerks. Russia has the skills and players.

Fumus
11-20-2007, 04:35 PM
Russia will win, USA is just a team of ball bashers and doubles jerks. Russia has the skills and players.

Russia isn't? We are talking about the same team with Tursonov and Safin on it right? Seriously, continue with some more baseless commentary I implore you.

The lifetime record of these players against each other on hard court.
(Andy,James) (Andreev, Davydenko, Youzhny)
US TEAM vs. RUSSIA TEAM
17 - 2

Maxine
11-20-2007, 04:40 PM
Tursunov is a ball basher but I doubt he will be selected, but what is your problem with Safin? He was never a ball basher, his game was never based around that. A talented player with great technical ability on both sides, Roddick could dream of only having half a backhand. Roddick couldn't maneveur a cripple round the court.

jcempire
11-20-2007, 04:43 PM
Usa, 4-1

jcempire
11-20-2007, 04:44 PM
If Andy, James, Bryans all heathly, USA at least 3-2. possible 4-1

Fumus
11-20-2007, 04:46 PM
Tursunov is a ball basher but I doubt he will be selected, but what is your problem with Safin? He was never a ball basher, his game was never based around that. A talented player with great technical ability on both sides, Roddick could dream of only having half a backhand. Roddick couldn't maneveur a cripple round the court.

psh? problem? I love Safin and Tursonov!! Safin is one of my most favorite players ever...both on and off the court. So please, hold that mustard!

What's all this about Roddick wanting a backhand and not being able to maneuver around the court? Well it hasn't stopped Andy from beating Safin four of the six times they have met on hard court.

Labamba
11-20-2007, 04:49 PM
www.daviscup.com

Official Team Nominations for 2007 Final

Russia and USA have named their teams for the final of the 2007 Davis Cup by BNP Paribas, to be held in Portland on November 30-December 2.

The official team nominations can be found below. Under Davis Cup rules, up to two nominations may then be changed up to an hour before the draw, which takes place on Thursday 29 November.

World Group Final: USA vs Russia
Venue: Portland, Oregon (Hard [Premier] - indoors)

USA

James Blake
Andy Roddick
Bob Bryan
Mike Bryan

Captain: Patrick McEnroe

Russia

Igor Andreev
Nikolay Davydenko
Dmitry Tursunov
Mikhail Youzhny

Captain: Shamil Tarpischev

Kitty de Sade
11-20-2007, 04:51 PM
On US soil...US wins 3-2.

MCL
11-20-2007, 04:56 PM
Hopefully Russia can come out with a win 3-2.

Svetlana.
11-21-2007, 02:34 AM
I don't think Russians will win... none of them is in the ultimate form on the moment to win Americans at home.

Marek.
11-21-2007, 06:16 AM
Hopefully Blake can win his first match, that would help us a lot. Since it's a big match, though, that's an automatic fuck up. :o

Merton
11-21-2007, 06:24 AM
The US is the big favourite, hopefully they can win this title. I wouldn't be surprised if Russia started with Tursunov and Youzhny in the first day, their best shot at the upset is to take a 2-0 lead and this way allows them to have Youzhny against Blake rather than against Roddick.

Fumus
11-21-2007, 03:00 PM
The US is the big favourite, hopefully they can win this title. I wouldn't be surprised if Russia started with Tursunov and Youzhny in the first day, their best shot at the upset is to take a 2-0 lead and this way allows them to have Youzhny against Blake rather than against Roddick.

I actually have no idea what the Russians will do. I know they will want to play Andreev against Andy because he's the only one on their team with a good record against Andy. I think they might play Youzhny second because he has a win against Blake...Blake has a huge match up advantage against Davydenko and Andreev, Andy matchs up well against Davy too. My guess is that Davydenko might sit this tie out. I guess if I was the Russian coach I would play it like this...

Singles - 1 Andreev
Singles - 2 Youzhny

then switch Andreev out on the last day with Tursunov who has never played Blake before...dunno.

Conjecture from the peanut gallery on this one??

TheBoiledEgg
11-21-2007, 04:10 PM
day 1 its 1 vs 2 so we can play
Youzhny vs Blake and Andreev vs Roddick.

just hope its this option he picks.

Jimnik
11-21-2007, 04:19 PM
To summarize the H2Hs:

Roddick 5-0 Davydenko
Roddick 3-2 Youzhny
Roddick 1-2 Andreev (clay)
Roddick 2-1 Tursunov (clay)
Blake 6-0 Davydenko
Blake 0-1 Youzhny (clay)
Blake 5-0 Andreev
Blake 0-0 Tursunov
Bryan/Bryan 1-0 Tursunov/Youzhny (clay)
Bryan/Bryan 1-0 Andreev/Davydenko (clay)


Only two of them are in Russia's favour, but both because of a clay meeting. I suspect they'll play Andreev against Roddick and Youzhny against Blake but it won't make much of a difference.

Without Safin, I fancy USA to win 3-0.

Johnny Groove
11-21-2007, 04:21 PM
Blake will surely fuck up and Roddick and the Bros will have to bail him out YET again :o

Fumus
11-21-2007, 04:38 PM
day 1 its 1 vs 2 so we can play
Youzhny vs Blake and Andreev vs Roddick.

just hope its this option he picks.

I suspected as much but lets remember the Russian coach is about as nutty as a whatchamacallit.

Monteque
11-21-2007, 04:38 PM
50-50.

Fumus
11-21-2007, 04:39 PM
50-50.

Not even close to 50-50.

These are not evenly matched teams, and the USA is at home. Clearly the US is favored...

Gonzalez88
11-21-2007, 06:10 PM
Russia WIN 3-2

Merton
11-21-2007, 10:26 PM
I actually have no idea what the Russians will do. I know they will want to play Andreev against Andy because he's the only one on their team with a good record against Andy. I think they might play Youzhny second because he has a win against Blake...Blake has a huge match up advantage against Davydenko and Andreev, Andy matchs up well against Davy too. My guess is that Davydenko might sit this tie out. I guess if I was the Russian coach I would play it like this...

Singles - 1 Andreev
Singles - 2 Youzhny

then switch Andreev out on the last day with Tursunov who has never played Blake before...dunno.

Conjecture from the peanut gallery on this one??

I guess that Tarpi would bet on Tursunov being red hot. If that happens, Tursunov is more dangerous indoors than Andreev. Jimnik is right, the Andy vs. Igor head-to-head hides the fact that a match was played at RG and another on slow outdoor hardcourts where Igor is certainly more dangerous than what he would be indoors. But I think the most important factor will be how Tarpi estimates the current form of his players. He is certainly no Emilio Sanchez.

The Freak
11-21-2007, 10:58 PM
I think Russia should use Safin despite his terrible and confusing results this year. He always seems to play well when it comes to Davis Cup, plus he has a solid record against both Andy and James.

Russian elephant
11-21-2007, 11:49 PM
who will be Russian hero this time?
it's a secret by Tarpishev :)

Jimnik
11-22-2007, 02:27 AM
What's the latest on Safin. Is he still staying home?

Action Jackson
11-22-2007, 02:29 AM
Take out Davydenko and put in Korolev.

Action Jackson
11-22-2007, 02:31 AM
Not even close to 50-50.

These are not evenly matched teams, and the USA is at home. Clearly the US is favored...

Croats weren't deemed to be evenly matches and they beat the US in the USA. It's not like they can't be beaten at home and there are worse places for foreign teams to play.

Tarpishev will have plans and the right combos to give themselves the best chance. It's not like the Russians can't play on the surface.

Voo de Mar
11-22-2007, 01:10 PM
I've got a dream last night - USA won 3-1. On the first day Roddick lost an epic five-setter, then Blake won his match 6-4 6-2 7-6. Second point for USA after The Bryans win and Roddick gives deciding win on Sunday.
;)

Jaap
11-22-2007, 02:02 PM
USA will win.

Hope this helps.

goldenlox
11-22-2007, 02:19 PM
USA is the favorite, but they haven't had their pre-match meal yet.

alfonsojose
11-22-2007, 06:46 PM
Who will poison Andy :tape: ?

alfonsojose
11-22-2007, 06:54 PM
Take out Davydenko and put in Korolev.

Bring Putin ... and some radioactive polonium :scared:

Veronique
11-23-2007, 09:52 AM
It was really fun to go back and read some of the bs posted in this thread back in September. Shouldn't we start a new poll now that we know who the players are going to be? BTW, nothing has changed between Roddick and Davydenko 2.5 years later.

Action Jackson
11-23-2007, 10:07 AM
No need to start a new poll, everything about the final that is available in here.

ilovemarat
11-23-2007, 10:15 AM
Russia will win! :nerner: Hopefully Marat will play as well. :bounce:

Merton
11-23-2007, 11:01 PM
I've got a dream last night - USA won 3-1. On the first day Roddick lost an epic five-setter, then Blake won his match 6-4 6-2 7-6. Second point for USA after The Bryans win and Roddick gives deciding win on Sunday.
;)

I am disappointed Voo, I thought that in a dream of yours there would be more details about how that tiebreak turned out. :)

Voo de Mar
11-23-2007, 11:08 PM
I am disappointed Voo, I thought that in a dream of yours there would be more details about how that tiebreak turned out. :)

Sorry :p
I've forgotten the score of first Roddick's match but there was something like 7-6 5-7 6-7 6-4 5-7 for his opponent. I don't remember tie-breaks and who beat Roddick as well.
:wavey:

cobalt60
11-23-2007, 11:30 PM
Hopefully the USA 4-1

Corey Feldman
11-24-2007, 12:25 AM
I've got a dream last night - USA won 3-1. On the first day Roddick lost an epic five-setter, then Blake won his match 6-4 6-2 7-6. Second point for USA after The Bryans win and Roddick gives deciding win on Sunday.;)Glad you have recovered from crying all during Shanghai about what a crap standard tournament it was (Nole getting slapped left right and centre)

Jimnik
11-24-2007, 10:32 PM
Has anybody else noticed the symmetry with 1995?

USA def Sweden 4-1
Russia def Germany 3-2

USA def Russia 3-2 ???

;)

Btw, while the Sampras bandwagon is in full and merry swing, it seems like a perfect time to remember that final 12 years ago - his best ever Davis Cup performance and almost certainly his greatest win on a clay court. First the 4 hour epic with Chesnokov, the doubles and then defeating Kafelnikov in straight sets in Moscow on what was no doubt the slowest clay he's ever played on.

I think Sampras has a very misleading reputation when it comes to Davis Cup. For sure he'll never be remembered for his two titles but arguably some of his best performances came in this competition.

trixtah
11-24-2007, 11:28 PM
if they put Sampras on the US team, there's nothing stopping it!! ;)

Jimnik
11-25-2007, 01:21 AM
If Blake mysteriously wakes up with an upset stomach and a certain Pistol Pete happens to be sitting in the stands, who would object? ;)

Action Jackson
11-25-2007, 07:47 AM
That was Sampras's best ever achievement what he achieved in Moscow, because of the unfavourable circumstances he was up against and how he handled it.

Tommy fan
11-25-2007, 08:09 AM
Since Marat isn't there..
USA 3-2 (Roddick&Bryans win)

jcempire
11-25-2007, 01:19 PM
If Donald Young and John Isner play for USA, they would win too

stebs
11-25-2007, 03:38 PM
I voted for 4-1 USA previously and I stand by that.

AnnaK_4ever
11-25-2007, 04:59 PM
USA 5-0 :sad:

Action Jackson
11-27-2007, 01:50 AM
Interesting that Russia 3-2 has the most votes so far.

It would be better for the Russians if Blake plays first on Day 1.

The Freak
11-27-2007, 01:21 PM
Interesting that Russia 3-2 has the most votes so far.

It would be better for the Russians if Blake plays first on Day 1.

It's also interesting that the US is dominating in the overall vote. Frankly, I'd be stunned if Russia wins.

Iván
11-27-2007, 02:01 PM
I hope russia have thought carefully about the match up process.

Because if they match up correctly they have an excellent chance of retaining the davis cup.

They are just gonna have to conceed that davy is no good against either roddick or blake, i hope they dont play davy just because of his name.

Action Jackson
11-27-2007, 02:04 PM
Davydenko will only play doubles.

cmurray
11-27-2007, 02:25 PM
The US is going to win this one I think.

bokehlicious
11-27-2007, 02:35 PM
USA hands down

Fumus
11-27-2007, 02:42 PM
Croats weren't deemed to be evenly matches and they beat the US in the USA. It's not like they can't be beaten at home and there are worse places for foreign teams to play.

Tarpishev will have plans and the right combos to give themselves the best chance. It's not like the Russians can't play on the surface.

When did I say it couldn't happen? Everyone always brings up the tie with Croatia. The fact that Croatia won, doesn't prove anything...that's why they call them upsets. So no, these squads are not evenly matched, USA is the clear favorite.

What do you see the lineup being? I think the singles for the Russian's will either be, Andreev and Youzhny or Tursonov. I think they will definitly play Andreev against Andy...but who will they play against Blake? The doubles squad will have to be Davydenko and Tursonov.

Horatio Caine
11-27-2007, 07:01 PM
I'll be mighty surprised if Russia win this. If I were Tarpischev, I'd be looking to put Tursunov up against Blake, to give the Russians the best chance at 1-1 on Friday. However, it seems that Tursunov is the 4th ranked Russian out of the 4 nominated for the team, so I guess that he can ONLY be their 2nd singles player?

...assuming Mike is relatively fit, the doubles is already a foregone conclusion. Roddick should win both singles...I think Tursunov would have a much greater chance of beating him on a slower court (e.g. clay), which would take some of the sting out of Roddick's delivery, and force the American to win more points in baseline duels.

Conclusion: USA 3-0 or 3-1.

Horatio Caine
11-27-2007, 07:02 PM
If Donald Young and John Isner play for USA, they would win too

:haha:

Horatio Caine
11-27-2007, 07:04 PM
If Blake mysteriously wakes up with an upset stomach

Why poison him when there is a good chance he craps his pants anyway? :p

tangerine_dream
11-27-2007, 11:01 PM
^^^ :lol: Mean but funny.

Here's a great article on everybody's favorite ESPN commentator, the PMac. ;) I posted some choice quotes. Click the link for the complete article. It's definitely worth the read.

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/ten...ory?id=3128529

McEnroe's commitment has U.S. on verge of title

At the end of the day, they're going to play because they want to be with each other, not because of me. I would only be a reason that they wouldn't play.
-- U.S. Davis Cup captain Patrick McEnroe,
in an interview with ESPN.com in early November.


In his debut as captain, McEnroe selected a green 18-year-old named Andy Roddick to be the fourth player on the team that would face Switzerland in the first round. Roddick watched from the bench as another emerging talent, Roger Federer, won both of his singles matches and played on a winning doubles team to hand the U.S. a loss.

McEnroe threw Roddick into the meaningless fifth match. "He just smoked this guy, Georg Bastl," McEnroe recalled. "And I remember turning to the guys on our bench right after the match ended and saying, 'We've got a future. This guy's our future.'"

............

McEnroe groomed himself for this job all his life. He soaked up different aspects of the Davis Cup tradition like an executive-in-training, first watching John play, then serving as a practice partner, then playing Davis Cup doubles himself, then breaking down matches from the TV booth when Tom Gullikson was captain.

Singer and actress Melissa Errico, McEnroe's wife, sensed his ambition when they started dating in 1996. McEnroe was still resisting retirement, trying to rehab after surgery for a bone spur on his arm that eventually forced him from playing.

"There was a lot of watching TV and not knowing how he was going to spend his time," said Errico, who grew up with McEnroe on Long Island and was re-introduced to him years later. "He would work out three to four hours a day because that was what he was used to doing. He had all these trainers with these funky ideas.

"I remember trying to provoke him and saying, 'What are the other dreams you have in your life?' He said, 'I'd love someday when I'm old to be Davis Cup captain.' That was the one thing."

............

His TV gig puts him in a bind where Blake and Roddick are concerned. Critique them too harshly and he risks straining key relationships; lay off and viewers will think he's biased and soft.

"It's obviously not the easiest situation," Roddick said. "The good thing about Patrick and the reason our relationship has been great is because we've had problems, heated discussions before, but we've talked about it. We haven't let it fester."

McEnroe handed credit right back to Roddick. "He actually helped me be more open," the captain said.

There have been contentious moments between McEnroe and all his regulars, but they generally get put into context and put to rest. The Bryans were miffed he didn't select them sooner, but said their resentment vanished forever the night before their first match in 2003, when McEnroe called to tell them they were cemented into the lineup for the foreseeable future.

In the September semifinal against Sweden, with the momentum in Blake's first match swinging against him, McEnroe got down on one knee during a changeover and, in a public rarity, got into the player's face. After Blake lost, McEnroe vehemently defended him in the post-match news conference.

His eyes get a little glassy when he talks about finding Roddick slumped in a hallway at Olympic Stadium in Moscow, spent and weeping, after losing a 17-15 fifth set to Dmitry Tursunov in the Davis Cup semifinals last year.

............

When McEnroe stands in the tunnel with his players, shifting from foot to foot, eyes dancing, ready to emerge into the cauldron of noise in the arena, he has the look of someone supremely happy in his work.

"I love the process, the pride that comes from being the captain," he said. "To walk out and stand there with those four guys, to me that's it. That's the moment."

goldenlox
11-27-2007, 11:45 PM
We'll find out if this US team is all chokers, or if they just had bad luck the last few years.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 12:16 PM
When did I say it couldn't happen? Everyone always brings up the tie with Croatia. The fact that Croatia won, doesn't prove anything...that's why they call them upsets. So no, these squads are not evenly matched, USA is the clear favorite.

What do you see the lineup being? I think the singles for the Russian's will either be, Andreev and Youzhny or Tursonov. I think they will definitly play Andreev against Andy...but who will they play against Blake? The doubles squad will have to be Davydenko and Tursonov.

The attitude is there that the Americans only have to show up and they have won it and this is not from the team themselves to make myself very clear. You by saying that they are the clear favourites is already suggesting that.

No, it proves that the Americans can be beaten at home, especially when the surface does not disadvantage the away team as was the case with the Croats and the same with the Russians.

PMk won't be playing singles that will be clear, but this is the same American team for years and there is an injury cloud over Mike Bryan, would hate to see anything happen like a withdrawal.

Andreev and Tursunov are very good Davis Cup players and the crowd won't bother them at all. The Americans are favourites, but it's far from clear.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 12:16 PM
...assuming Mike is relatively fit, the doubles is already a foregone conclusion. Roddick should win both singles...I think Tursunov would have a much greater chance of beating him on a slower court (e.g. clay), which would take some of the sting out of Roddick's delivery, and force the American to win more points in baseline duels.

Conclusion: USA 3-0 or 3-1.

Roddick is like Boris Becker now, we can pencil him in for 2 guaranteed wins.

Uraitan
11-28-2007, 01:14 PM
Russia ... :rocker2:

jcempire
11-28-2007, 01:21 PM
Roddick is like Boris Becker now, we can pencil him in for 2 guaranteed wins.

I hope so, but I'm not sure that Roddick for 2 guaranteed wins.

He is not Boris Becker.

I don't even think that he is close to.

Fumus
11-28-2007, 02:34 PM
The attitude is there that the Americans only have to show up and they have won it and this is not from the team themselves to make myself very clear. You by saying that they are the clear favourites is already suggesting that.

No, it proves that the Americans can be beaten at home, especially when the surface does not disadvantage the away team as was the case with the Croats and the same with the Russians.

PMk won't be playing singles that will be clear, but this is the same American team for years and there is an injury cloud over Mike Bryan, would hate to see anything happen like a withdrawal.

Andreev and Tursunov are very good Davis Cup players and the crowd won't bother them at all. The Americans are favourites, but it's far from clear.

Ok you're just taking that too far. I never said they were an unbeatable juggernaut, I said they were a clear favorite for numerous reasons. No it doesn't prove anything those were two different teams, and the USA had a different line up. Just because a team was beaten doesn't mean they weren't the favorite, just like the US was then and now. All I am saying that this is not an even match, USA is clearly favored both in match ups for the players, the home stadium, court speed, and intangibles.

Fumus
11-28-2007, 02:38 PM
I hope so, but I'm not sure that Roddick for 2 guaranteed wins.

He is not Boris Becker.

I don't even think that he is close to.

Roddick 25-9 in Davis Cup singles

Becker 35-3 in DC singles...:)

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 02:43 PM
Ok you're just taking that too far. I never said they were an unbeatable juggernaut, I said they were a clear favorite for numerous reasons. No it doesn't prove anything those were two different teams, and the USA had a different line up. Just because a team was beaten doesn't mean they weren't the favorite, just like the US was then and now. All I am saying that this is not an even match, USA is clearly favored both in match ups for the players, the home stadium, court speed, and intangibles.

I am not taking too far at all, when you think they are clear favourites against a team that shown its versatility, adaptabilty and proven that it can win in all conditions, except grass.

Tursunov, Youzhny, PMK ( though not for the purpose of this match up) and Andreev are capable of playing on all surfaces, the last 2 not on grass. Indoor hardcourt is going to bother them how? How is an American crowd going to bother them, when they have won playing in South America.

You keep saying that you aren't saying the American team is juggernaut, when your above post clearly shows otherwise. If they lose, what excuse are you going to come up with?

kaylee
11-28-2007, 02:44 PM
heehee I love coming on here now and then and seeing the "discussions" - look we can only speculate, the team looks healthy and ready to go as I am sure the Russians are. There is always a slight advantage when you have a home crowd especially with Roddick, who feeds off of it. Let's just wait and see, as Andy says they are confident but they have to translate it onto the court.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 02:50 PM
Roddick 25-9 in Davis Cup singles

Becker 35-3 in DC singles...:)

Proves what exactly? He isn't a Ljubicic, Hewitt or Nalbandian when it comes to Davis Cup.

He has beaten the players he should be beating apart from Berdych this year in Ostrava. He has lost enough big matches in DC.

http://www.daviscup.com/teams/player.asp?player=10022361

Fumus
11-28-2007, 02:56 PM
I am not taking too far at all, when you think they are clear favourites against a team that shown its versatility, adaptabilty and proven that it can win in all conditions, except grass.

Tursunov, Youzhny, PMK ( though not for the purpose of this match up) and Andreev are capable of playing on all surfaces, the last 2 not on grass. Indoor hardcourt is going to bother them how? How is an American crowd going to bother them, when they have won playing in South America.

You keep saying that you aren't saying the American team is juggernaut, when your above post clearly shows otherwise. If they lose, what excuse are you going to come up with?

Yea you are sorta twisting this argument. So I am going to repeat myself again, someone posted 50-50 way back there. I responded no, it's not a 50-50 for all aforementioned reasons it's not 50-50. I only list those reasons to illustrate that US is the out and out, clear favorite in the tie. I am not saying the Russian won't win, or couldn't win...all I am saying is that they are not favored to win. If they lose what excuse would I come up with? I wouldn't have to come up with any, I would still say the US was favored but were beaten by the better team. Which by the way is what I still say abot that famous Croatian tie. Capish?

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 03:03 PM
Yea you are sorta twisting this argument. So I am going to repeat myself again, someone posted 50-50 way back there. I responded no, it's not a 50-50 for all aforementioned reasons it's not 50-50. I only list those reasons to illustrate that US is the out and out, clear favorite in the tie. I am not saying the Russian won't win, or couldn't win...all I am saying is that they are not favored to win. If they lose what excuse would I come up with? I wouldn't have to come up with any, I would still say the US was favored but were beaten by the better team. Which by the way is what I still say abot that famous Croatian tie. Capish?

No, I am not twisting the argument at all. You are pretty much saying the title is in the bag and totally ignoring what the Russian team have done and it's already been highlighted what they are capable. Why are they clear favourites? Favourites, yet, but not clear against a team that has consistently won away from home.

Still didn't answer my question. How are the crowd and the surface going to bother them? They aren't playing on grass, if they were then it would be commonsense to say the US are strong to very strong favourites.

Fumus
11-28-2007, 03:27 PM
No, I am not twisting the argument at all. You are pretty much saying the title is in the bag and totally ignoring what the Russian team have done and it's already been highlighted what they are capable. Why are they clear favourites? Favourites, yet, but not clear against a team that has consistently won away from home.

Still didn't answer my question. How are the crowd and the surface going to bother them? They aren't playing on grass, if they were then it would be commonsense to say the US are strong to very strong favourites.

Yea, cuz that's exactly what I am doing. It's obvious to everyone reading my posts that I am completely discounting the Russians. I'm a nationalistic asshole...everyone look at me, I'm blind to all fact and reason that doesn't support my team...RUSSA WILL NEVER WIN THIS TIE!!!! Yea, good thing you could read between the lines and figure out exactly what I was saying, I couldn't possibly just be stating what the odds makers have already said, The US Davis Cup Team is tipped at -300 with BetUS Sportsbook, hardly 50-50.

The crowd will be Americans cheering for the United States, this can only help the US and hurt the Russians.

The surface helps the Americans because James Blake, and Andy Roddick are better on hardcourt than any of the Russians except Davydenko but he can't seem to win against either of them.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 03:39 PM
Yea, cuz that's exactly what I am doing. It's obvious to everyone reading my posts that I am completely discounting the Russians. I'm a nationalistic asshole...everyone look at me, I'm blind to all fact and reason that doesn't support my team...RUSSA WILL NEVER WIN THIS TIE!!!! Yea, good thing you could read between the lines and figure out exactly what I was saying, I couldn't possibly just be stating what the odds makers have already said, The US Davis Cup Team is tipped at -300 with BetUS Sportsbook, hardly 50-50.

What and home teams haven't lost Davis Cup finals before in recent times, while being favoured. A team that hasn't won the DC since 1995 is all of a sudden a clear favourite against a solid team that has done the job on many surfaces against quality opposition away from home.

The crowd will be Americans cheering for the United States, this can only help the US and hurt the Russians.

How will it hurt the Russians? You haven't explained how. They won the Davis Cup in France, they won in Chile and anyone with a basic clue knows how difficult and intimidating it is play in South America and that slipped your mind.

The surface helps the Americans because James Blake, and Andy Roddick are better on hardcourt than any of the Russians except Davydenko but he can't seem to win against either of them.

What is Tursunov's best surface? Youzhny can't play on hardcourts either, is the way you assume and Blake hasn't been known for handling the pressure situations that well has he?

stebs
11-28-2007, 03:47 PM
No, I am not twisting the argument at all. You are pretty much saying the title is in the bag and totally ignoring what the Russian team have done and it's already been highlighted what they are capable. Why are they clear favourites? Favourites, yet, but not clear against a team that has consistently won away from home.

Fumus is saying that the USA are favourites but that Russia have a chance which is perfectly true and you are acheiving nothing by trying to put words in his mouth. In what way is he sayng that USA have it in the bag? Truth is he isn't at all in any way and yes they are the favourites, doesn't take a genius to see that. Russia have the players to spring surprises and that's not rocket science but USA are still favoured to win the tie. Either you're misunderstanding or you're trolling. I assume it's the first one.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 03:52 PM
Fumus is saying that the USA are favourites but that Russia have a chance which is perfectly true and you are acheiving nothing by trying to put words in his mouth. In what way is he sayng that USA have it in the bag? Truth is he isn't at all in any way and yes they are the favourites, doesn't take a genius to see that. Russia have the players to spring surprises and that's not rocket science but USA are still favoured to win the tie. Either you're misunderstanding or you're trolling.

The problem I have is the clear favourites, not that the US are favourites and I haven't said otherwise.

You are assuming that I am trolling.

Fumus
11-28-2007, 03:55 PM
What and home teams haven't lost Davis Cup finals before in recent times, while being favoured. A team that hasn't won the DC since 1995 is all of a sudden a clear favourite against a solid team that has done the job on many surfaces against quality opposition away from home.



How will it hurt the Russians? You haven't explained how. They won the Davis Cup in France, they won in Chile and anyone with a basic clue knows how difficult and intimidating it is play in South America and that slipped your mind.



What is Tursunov's best surface? Youzhny can't play on hardcourts either, is the way you assume and Blake hasn't been known for handling the pressure situations that well has he?

So you admit the US is favored, you are just debating how strong of a favorite they are? What would make you say they were a favorite in any way shape or form? If the Russians are so good why haven't the odds makers taken your side.

How does it hurt any team? When you get behind and the crowd is cheering your double faults, errors, and applauding wildly every winner hit against you, this can wear on you mentally. Also the crowd can save your opponent and charge them back up. I know this from being a tennis player myself, when the crowd is against you it can be rattling. I don't care that the Russian's have won ties away from home against raucous crowds. It still doesn't change the fact that the crowd was against them.

Yea, so...Alberto Martin's best surface is clay that doesn't mean he's going to beat Nadal. Blake and Roddick are better hard court players than anyone on that team. Blake doesn't handle pressure situations well sometimes but he does handle them well in front of his home crowd. He played well in US against Spain.

stebs
11-28-2007, 03:57 PM
The problem I have is the clear favourites, not that the US are favourites and I haven't said otherwise.
It's just fiddly semantics and a misunderstanding. From my vantage point it seemed like you and Fumus were on similar wavelengths but what he perceived to be clear favourite you perceived to be in the bag when this wasn't the case.

Anyway, I am still thinking USA will win this 4-1 although to go into more detail that means 3-1 plus a final rubber which obviously doesn't matter. I'd love to see Andreev beat Roddick.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 04:09 PM
So you admit the US is favored, you are just debating how strong of a favorite they are? What would make you say they were a favorite in any way shape or form? If the Russians are so good why haven't the odds makers taken your side.

I have never said they weren't favourite, not at all, just the fact that the bookies got it wrong odds. Well it depends on which bookie you go through the odds. The fact that Safin isn't playing, though at his level at the moment, it makes sense, though he lifts for DC and continue to dismiss the Russians.

How does it hurt any team? When you get behind and the crowd is cheering your double faults, errors, and applauding wildly every winner hit against you, this can wear on you mentally. Also the crowd can save your opponent and charge them back up. I know this from being a tennis player myself, when the crowd is against you it can be rattling. I don't care that the Russian's have won ties away from home against raucous crowds. It still doesn't change the fact that the crowd was against them.


Oh it does, when a team that has proven consistently by winning in hostile environments, then that factor tends not be as important, that is commonsense. If a team can't win away from home regularly, then it becomes more of a factor.


Yea, so...Alberto Martin's best surface is clay that doesn't mean he's going to beat Nadal. Blake and Roddick are better hard court players than anyone on that team. Blake doesn't handle pressure situations well sometimes but he does handle them well in front of his home crowd. He played well in US against Spain.

Stupid example, so Youzhny, Andreev and Tursunov are at the Beto Martin level are they on hardcourt, don't be a donkey.

Youzhny made a semi final of the US Open, better than anything Blake has done on the surface. Tursunov is a hack is now, far from overawed and won 2 very important DC matches to win ties for Russia and not on his best surface.

Blake against Boredo, well he isn't losing that one is he? These guys are better than Boredo on hardcourt.

tangerine_dream
11-28-2007, 04:11 PM
George, you sound like you're fretting that the Americans might actually win this. Does that bother you so much?

Don't worry, Georgie, when Russia makes like Croatia and pulls off the upset of the year then you can relax and party like it's 2999. :aparty:

stebs
11-28-2007, 04:13 PM
Blake against Boredo, well he isn't losing that one is he? These guys are better than Boredo on hardcourt.

Well matchup wise of course fair enough but I thought I'd pull you up here. Robredo is ahead of Tursunov when you look at results and surely that's the only way to judge?

stebs
11-28-2007, 04:14 PM
George, you sound like you're fretting that the Americans might actually win this. Does that bother you so much?

Don't worry, Georgie, when Russia makes like Croatia and pulls off the upset of the year then you can relax and party like it's 2999. :aparty:

It's your wet dream to have someone on here who hates America so you can do your superhero American act.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 04:18 PM
Well matchup wise of course fair enough but I thought I'd pull you up here. Robredo is ahead of Tursunov when you look at results and surely that's the only way to judge?

Blake has the firepower to break through Boredo and James does well against those kinds of guys.

Tursunov loves the pace and that is what Blake will give him, hence the match up issue in this context is more important.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 04:20 PM
I wouldn't know 1995 was the greatest ever achievement from Sampras and probably one of the best performances in a Davis Cup final, but 2007 won't equal that.

Captain America you got work to do.

stebs
11-28-2007, 04:21 PM
Blake has the firepower to break through Boredo and James does well against those kinds of guys.

Tursunov loves the pace and that is what Blake will give him, hence the match up issue in this context is more important.

:shrug:

You said "these guys are better than Boredo on hardcourt" I agree it is a matchup issue. Just had to pull you up on that statement.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 04:25 PM
:shrug:

You said "these guys are better than Boredo on hardcourt" I agree it is a matchup issue. Just had to pull you up on that statement.

Tursunov is a better player on hardcourt than Robredo. Ok, Roddick has won more clay titles than Acasuso for example, but is Roddick a better claycourt player?

stebs
11-28-2007, 04:30 PM
Tursunov is a better player on hardcourt than Robredo. Ok, Roddick has won more clay titles than Acasuso for example, but is Roddick a better claycourt player?

Roddick and Acasuso are irrelevant. Robredo has outperformed Tursunov on the big stage.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 04:35 PM
Roddick and Acasuso are irrelevant. Robredo has outperformed Tursunov on the big stage.

If you want to take it to that degree, then Agassi had clearly better results than Muster at RG, but Agassi wasn't the better claycourt player was he?

There is more to than just results.

tangerine_dream
11-28-2007, 04:37 PM
It's your wet dream to have someone on here who hates America so you can do your superhero American act.
Sorry but my comment was based on reading years' worth of GWH's posts.

Fumus
11-28-2007, 04:40 PM
What?! Are you crazy, the crowd is always a factor Davis Cup or not. A good team can win on the road and at home, that doesn't mean they didn't have to overcome the crowd. It's a factor you can't discount it. I don't care if the Russians have won in hostile environments show me imperially how they aren't affected by the crowd anymore. lolz

Matchups and results together, as a whole James and Andy are better on hard court than the Russians...not only just better, they are a lot better. Don't be a donkey and throw out the fact that Youzhny made the semis at the US Open when consistently James has performed better than Misha on US hard courts. Ginepri made a semifinal too, is he better than James Blake on hard court?

Roddick is just a better player than Acasuso, surface aside.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 04:46 PM
What's all this about Roddick wanting a backhand and not being able to maneuver around the court? Well it hasn't stopped Andy from beating Safin four of the six times they have met on hard court.

:haha: :haha: :haha:

stebs
11-28-2007, 04:48 PM
Sorry but my comment was based on reading years' worth of GWH's posts.

Yes, and acting in the same ridiculous American action hero way each time. GWH doesn't hate America, you just hate anyone who isn't praising the stars and stripes 24/7.

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 04:52 PM
What?! Are you crazy, the crowd is always a factor Davis Cup or not. A good team can win on the road and at home, that doesn't mean they didn't have to overcome the crowd. It's a factor you can't discount it. I don't care if the Russians have won in hostile environments show me imperially how they aren't affected by the crowd anymore. lolz

Did I say it wasn't a factor? No, just that it can be overstated when there are players and teams that do well away from home, there are homers and there are others who can do it away from home. So winning in hostile environments isn't worth anything?

Matchups and results together, as a whole James and Andy are better on hard court than the Russians...not only just better, they are a lot better. Don't be a donkey and throw out the fact that Youzhny made the semis at the US Open when consistently James has performed better than Misha on US hard courts. Ginepri made a semifinal too, is he better than James Blake on hard court?

Misha has played in a DC final and won a vital match in the DC final? Has Blake performed on the biggest stages? He hasn't. You really are making out that these guys are absolute hacks.

Like I said get the excuses ready if they lose.

Roddick is just a better player than Acasuso, surface aside

It was only in reference to the surface and you know the answer to that. The results and the match up is the part that makes the most sense.

TheBoiledEgg
11-28-2007, 04:52 PM
WILL TARPISHEV PLAY DAVYDENKO? Russia's top player is a combined 0-11 against Andy Roddick and James Blake, so don't put it past the Russian captain to sub in Dmitry Tursunov on day 1 to face Blake (they've never played), and maybe Igor Andreev on day 2 to face Roddick (Andreev is 2-1 v. the American). Mikhail Youzhny is almost certain to face Roddick on day 1.

:shrug: does he know anything :rolleyes:
how is Youzhny gonna play Duck on day 1 ?? only way thats possible is if Davydenko plays.
Day 1 its #1 vs #2.

Duck is #1 and Big Butt #2

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 04:59 PM
Yes, and acting in the same ridiculous American action hero way each time. GWH doesn't hate America, you just hate anyone who isn't praising the stars and stripes 24/7.

Tangy is saving us from evil. She knows as much about what my views are, as Gaudio knows about grasscourt tennis.

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g239/GeorgeWH/GWH2/17059.jpg

kaylee
11-28-2007, 05:05 PM
Oh boy such hostility why don't we wait until they actually hit the tennis court?

Action Jackson
11-28-2007, 05:07 PM
Oh boy such hostility why don't we wait until they actually hit the tennis court?

It's all part of the fun. I mean if I was in the same place as Fumus, there'd be this repartee and then after the match I'd buy the man a beer.

Fumus
11-28-2007, 05:14 PM
Did I say it wasn't a factor? No, just that it can be overstated when there are players and teams that do well away from home, there are homers and there are others who can do it away from home. So winning in hostile environments isn't worth anything?



Misha has played in a DC final and won a vital match in the DC final? Has Blake performed on the biggest stages? He hasn't. You really are making out that these guys are absolute hacks.

Like I said get the excuses ready if they lose.



It was only in reference to the surface and you know the answer to that. The results and the match up is the part that makes the most sense.

Who cares? Who cares? Seriously bla bla bla...bla bla...bla...here's what I am going to do, I am going to get some music lyrics instead of posting anything relevant. That way you can keep repeating yourself, instead of listening to what I am saying. I bet this will be as effective as arguing with you but, before I post some Flight of the Concords lyrics, I will say one last time...

The crowd and the home court are a factor, it doesn't matter if you won a bunch of away ties. It's like that old joke, two boxers are in the ring, one in red shorts and one in blue shorts, one of the guys in the red shorted boxer's camp looks back to the priest behind him says "Father please pray for our man to win", the priest says "I will my son but it would help if he could box too". The point is, home crowds are a factor but they aren't going flip the scales enough that a far lesser team is going to beat a far greater team. I am not saying that! I am saying, in this instance the crowd helps, it does, it's a factor. You can win against the crowd it's just tougher, you have to overcome an opponent and an opposing crowd. Winning in a hostile environment means something, it means you are a good team, not that you aren't effected by hostile environments.

I am not making Russia out to be hacks, you are putting words in my mouth. I am saying they are good but the USA is favored to win. Look back in the thread it has the records of each player every time they played on hardcourt. Guess what? The USA leads the head to head...by alot.

Excuses!? Excuses?! For what!? What would I need them for? I don't have to explain why they lost, no more than anyone else who picked USA to win would. Yea they are favorites, not unbeatable. Russian can win, they aren't hacks, obviously they are good. It's just the USA has the undeniable advantage, even if you disagree.

If your next post is just more about how I don't think the Russian's can win, how I think the US is unbeatable, how I will owe you some excuses when the US loses, how the US players aren't better hard court players, or why home court/the crowd isn't a big advantage...you can just save yourself some time from typing it because I am going to be posting some lyrics.


I've made my point, several times already.