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post #76 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-19-2011, 10:31 PM
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Re: TT changes 2012

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Great Post lolada!
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post #77 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-20-2011, 11:17 AM
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Re: TT changes 2012

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Originally Posted by Gavnich77 View Post
It's an interesting idea to standardise the order of the OOP but I think it would increase the burden on the managers if they have to work out the rankings differential of the players before posting the OOP especially in a GS where there are 64 matches in the first round.
Tottally against for this, for example Rolland Garros SF

Nalbaldian vs. Chela
Djokovic vs. Federer


24 vs. 25
1 vs. 4

So Nalbi - Chela will be higher PTS/SR.


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post #78 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-20-2011, 11:43 AM
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Re: TT changes 2012

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Originally Posted by Gavnich77 View Post
It's an interesting idea to standardise the order of the OOP but I think it would increase the burden on the managers if they have to work out the rankings differential of the players before posting the OOP especially in a GS where there are 64 matches in the first round.
I must admit I was a little unsure of this and am a bit more unsure now - in the two qually rounds of the challenger I did a large amount of names were unknowns to me so I just cut and pasted the whole OOP and moved the matches around with names I'd heard of before to the bottom of the TT OOP - but from the main draw onwards that was exactly what I did - worked out the ranking differential between players and placed them in order. Obviously in events like Wimbly and the US Open it's obvious which matches are going to be closer - on what basis should I have actually done it and on what basis should I be doing in the future?

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post #79 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-20-2011, 01:33 PM
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Re: TT changes 2012

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Originally Posted by AdeyC View Post
I must admit I was a little unsure of this and am a bit more unsure now - in the two qually rounds of the challenger I did a large amount of names were unknowns to me so I just cut and pasted the whole OOP and moved the matches around with names I'd heard of before to the bottom of the TT OOP - but from the main draw onwards that was exactly what I did - worked out the ranking differential between players and placed them in order. Obviously in events like Wimbly and the US Open it's obvious which matches are going to be closer - on what basis should I have actually done it and on what basis should I be doing in the future?
The generally accepted way of doing it is that the matches that the manager feels will provide the biggest split of picks will have the highest priority (SR1, 2, etc) but ultimately it's up to the manager to decide the order of the OOP.
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post #80 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-20-2011, 09:05 PM
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Re: TT changes 2012

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Originally Posted by Gavnich77 View Post
The generally accepted way of doing it is that the matches that the manager feels will provide the biggest split of picks will have the highest priority (SR1, 2, etc) but ultimately it's up to the manager to decide the order of the OOP.
I have taken the liberty of bolding part of Gav's post.
Some players also suggessted that gambling odds rather than differences in ranking should form the criterion.

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post #81 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-21-2011, 10:57 PM Thread Starter
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Re: TT changes 2012

TT changes/corrections of the current rules:

- Lucky loser rule on 1st round matches where neither player send picks: late picks won't be accepted anymore (the 2nd round spot goes directly to the LL).

- Two-round day: 1st & 2nd rounds played on the same day (mostly for the first day of increased qualifying events): a player/team who has a bye to the second round but doesn't send picks will be replaced by the 1st round loser with the highest score.

- Top 30 players & SE's: top 30 players won't be eligible to get SE's into challengers.

- Alternate placements: alternates & lucky losers won't be able to get byes to the second round. The current alternate/LL placement rule will remain the same. After the alternate/LL placements, if there are any alternates or lucky losers placed against a player/team who doesn't send picks, the draw will be adjusted in order to give the byes to the best ranked players who enter the draw directly. The alternates and lucky losers will play their first round matches against the opponents of the players who are given the byes.

Polls:

- Winston-Salem's main draw starting day? Sunday x Monday.

- WTF Challengers & WTF - should players be allowed to play both competitions in case they're played in different weeks? Yes x No.

- Late entries: should they be eligible to get SEs? Yes x No.

Remaining topics:

Suggestions like the ATP ranking system adoption, wild cards, entries/commitments improvements and tie-break changes will continue to be discussed during the 2012 season for a possible implementation in 2013. These topics could require big changes to the game which would have to be planned in advance. We'll open specific threads about these topics early in 2012.
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post #82 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 08:51 AM
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Re: TT changes 2012

I am wondering how do you decide which topics should be voted on and which you approve and which you ignore? Is there a criteria for that. Like how many people were in favor of a certain topic and how many were against it or which you as board members think is sensible?
Something like the change in the ranking system had 4 in favor and 3 against, from which 2 are board members. This idea would require 2 years to be changed, so if you say you would open topics early in 2012 to discuss it and I don't know how again would you decide if you approve it or not, based on your criteria, which I also don't know. Then if happened and it's approved to implement the new change you would need then 2013 as a transitional year and then in 2014 the new system would be approved. By that time maybe some of you would leave the board already. So that's basically killing the idea. I am not saying implement it now, but let people vote and see if the majority wants it and everyone should then accept what the majority wants. It not like I will gain anything by having this system. I just suggested it as it makes more sense for me than the one we have right now.

I am also wondering why don't you discuss these topics (ATP ranking system adoption, wild cards, entries/commitments improvements and tie-break changes) now in the off-season? Why do you need to wait to 2012?

I am just asking these two question and hoping for an answer and please don't take it personal. I am just asking to make things clear for me.
Thanks

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post #83 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 09:06 AM
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Re: TT changes 2012

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Originally Posted by abollo View Post

I am also wondering why don't you discuss these topics (ATP ranking system adoption, wild cards, entries/commitments improvements and tie-break changes) now in the off-season? Why do you need to wait to 2012?
Because that is a huge changes and needs some time for preparation


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post #84 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 09:10 AM
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Re: TT changes 2012

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Originally Posted by abollo View Post
I am wondering how do you decide which topics should be voted on and which you approve and which you ignore? Is there a criteria for that. Like how many people were in favor of a certain topic and how many were against it or which you as board members think is sensible?
I asked the same thing in Post 62 and am waiting answer on that one too.

Edit - I've just had a look at the exact same thread you had for this last year and I see there were just 22 posts in the whole thread and it was basically just a board talking shop with hardly anyone else contributing to the thread. This year you’ve got 84 posts which is to be highly commended and must surely tell you that you’ve done something right in asking for other opinions and engagement from other people, now you’re getting people giving ideas – you need to make the next bold step forward and let people see that their new ideas and suggestions are actually being considered.
As far as I can see there’s not been one single new idea or suggestion that has been taken up on or given a vote on which is such a wasted opportunity, you're getting a lot more engagement, please please make some valid use of it and don't throw it all to waste.

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Last edited by AdeyC; 12-22-2011 at 11:35 AM.
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post #85 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 11:40 AM
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Re: TT changes 2012

Quote:
Originally Posted by abollo View Post
I am wondering how do you decide which topics should be voted on and which you approve and which you ignore? Is there a criteria for that. Like how many people were in favor of a certain topic and how many were against it or which you as board members think is sensible?
Something like the change in the ranking system had 4 in favor and 3 against, from which 2 are board members. This idea would require 2 years to be changed, so if you say you would open topics early in 2012 to discuss it and I don't know how again would you decide if you approve it or not, based on your criteria, which I also don't know. Then if happened and it's approved to implement the new change you would need then 2013 as a transitional year and then in 2014 the new system would be approved. By that time maybe some of you would leave the board already. So that's basically killing the idea. I am not saying implement it now, but let people vote and see if the majority wants it and everyone should then accept what the majority wants. It not like I will gain anything by having this system. I just suggested it as it makes more sense for me than the one we have right now.

I am also wondering why don't you discuss these topics (ATP ranking system adoption, wild cards, entries/commitments improvements and tie-break changes) now in the off-season? Why do you need to wait to 2012?

I am just asking these two question and hoping for an answer and please don't take it personal. I am just asking to make things clear for me.
Thanks
I do not agree with changing the ranking system. Now 4 people are in favor and 4 against.

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post #86 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 11:56 AM
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Re: TT changes 2012

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Originally Posted by Vilnietė View Post
It was explained that the same points as ATP would not working well for TT because luck is playing much bigger role here and (more important) because unlike in ATP here you have to defeat almost the same players in most events. To win 250 series event you have to defeat similar players as in grand slam, so wining GS isn't realy 8 times more difficult as wining 250 pts event. So It wouldn't be "fair" to make such big point differences between the tournaments. And if anyone cares about new players, such big differences would make it very difficult to earn some good ranking for them.

So it would be nice to hear some opinions on this from people who still insist on changing pts system.
5-4 babe, no changes.

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post #87 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 12:18 PM
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Re: TT changes 2012

Thanks for the answer Marto.

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Originally Posted by Belludal View Post
I do not agree with changing the ranking system. Now 4 people are in favor and 4 against.
Seems like either you didn't read what I wrote or didn't understand it or I didn't explain my point correctly.
It's not about what your vote now because there is no vote at all. It's about the criteria they use while reviewing changes. At that time more people were in favor than against, so I just wanted to know how do they decide which topics they have a vote at and which they approve and which they decline.

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post #88 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 01:55 PM
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Re: TT changes 2012

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5-4 babe, no changes.
6-4

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post #89 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 02:06 PM
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Re: TT changes 2012

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6-4
7-4

Troicki - Djokovic - Del Potro - Kyrgios - Berankis
Cibulkova - Robson - Kirilenko - Azarenka
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post #90 of 94 (permalink) Old 12-22-2011, 02:18 PM
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Re: TT changes 2012

8-4

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