Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please. - MensTennisForums.com
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post #1 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 11:51 AM Thread Starter
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Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

Dear administrators,

Mr. Clay Death was recently given a permanent ban for multiple and repeated rule violations. Perhaps I have misread, but I see no guidelines on this particular offense as to how many infractions may accumulate and what expiration there is for this. I only see where each violation has it's own guidelines.

His latest reported violation was obviously baited by some haters/trolls, and he obviously counter attacked. Ok, he broke a relatively minor rule. How many go unreported?

Also, this board has a overly negative moderation/punishment system where good deeds are for practical purposes ignored and bad ones punished.

1. How many good things has he done for MTF vs. the bad?
2. Why isn't good behavior rewarded by removing past accumulation of any kind of infraction?
3. Do all past infractions drop off after a certain amount of time? Or do they forever remain on one's record? It appears some do and some don't. Why?
4. Is the time spent on the board a factor (x number of infractions/year)? Or x number of infraction posts/total posts?

We need true human judgement in moderation, not simple number counters. I was monitoring him closely and would say that a very low percentage of posts were questionable. I also think that he has generally improved his attitude and quality of posts over the last few months. He posted many threads that were applauding accomplishments of players other than his favorites. He frequently criticized his favorites.

Sure he got defensive when he saw what was an all out barrage to his favorites, especially when they were down (like Nadal's injury thread) and occasionally went on the counter attack, especially against historical posting "unfriendlies".

But I have to say on his behalf that on the whole he was mostly very restrained and preferred to stay away from GM when there was a feeding frenzy on his players. He often preached to come relax in the NT Chat Castle thread, take the high road, and stay away from GM. Unfortunately, he occasionally couldn't take his own advice when he saw attacks on his favorite players or posters. Yes, he could have reported these attacks. But he has been a great believer in one who fights his own battles, and never liked having to "tell on people". He preferred to face them head on, and challenge what he saw as injustice. I respect that, even if it's not the stated preferred method of dealing with inappropriate posts.

I'm sure there are others that have been banned in the past who may have fallen into this category, but there are a much higher percentage of others where a majority of their posts are negative, attacking, and have little positive value to the forum.

Rules are rules, and they need to be there to prevent anarchy. And when the line is crossed there needs to be enforcement and penalty. From my vantage point (granted, I don't know all that goes on behind the scenes), the thing I most question on this board though is whether appropriate consideration is being given before meting out the appropriate judgement and "sentence" given for breaking the rules. In many cases it seems too automatic, too black and white, and doesn't always take a poster's history into account.

I ask that administrators and moderators take a little more time to consider the totality of a poster's contributions on the board vs. the "crime", not to go blindly by the numbers, and judge and pass out punishments with more granularity. Also, I believe all past infractions should drop off after x amount of time.

And finally, I believe a relatively minor infraction should NEVER result in a permanent ban, even if it crossed some arbitrary numerical accumulation of violations.

I would ask and implore you to please reconsider the Permanent ban on Clay Death.
Thank you.

Respectfully,
masterclass

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post #2 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 01:28 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

The thing is he's had plenty of bans in the past and when they add up they eventually become permanent. But seeing as Sapeod was permabanned and then got it reduced to a six month one (I think) I don't see why they couldn't just make it that so at least one day he will come back.

He wasn't the worst guy I thought and I did have some interesting tennis chatter with him, which is more than can be said for some of his mates on here.

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post #3 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 01:45 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

i like the idea of counting the good deeds some people just contribute nothing, insult left and right, are double accounts

but the fact is a few posters-institutions, who had many friends in here, went out, too

i know that all the given permabans were deserved because people had it coming for long, but if someone was around for a few years and actually was improving his attitude... just like glenn mirnyi on his final strike ate the permaban actually for defending himself by replying to someone who insulted him - it's a bit sad way to go

i'm far from being feldman fangirl, but he's had a million bans as well, can you imagine if he gets the final one? it would be just one curse word or something similarly insignificant to receive this final infraction (i haven't followed, but i believe it happened now to CD?)

some people are controversial for sure, but contribute much more than trolling and insulting, and it's pity when they go

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post #4 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 02:23 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

I agree with this thread 100%.

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post #5 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 03:09 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

bring general Hercules aka Clay Death back

TOMMY HAAS

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post #6 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 05:29 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

Please bring Clay Death back to life. Resurrect him like Lazarus. He knew shit about tennis but he was what he was - a great conductor of GM threads, maybe the best emcee this forum has seen. GM was his life, and his assassin, HkZ himself confessed to CD's ability to craft 40+ tedious repetitive posts per day. That's telling something. So let him enjoy a 3 month sentence, and well deserved rest but thereafter, please bring him back.

MTF's best PERMACLOWN: CD

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post #7 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 05:57 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

Agreed. Please mods. I implore you. We want him back. Slap him with a 6 month ban if you must. If he did something so terrible...but please don't let it be permanent. Count the good deeds as well. Fed for 100 titles. Do the math. Good deeds far outweigh the bad deeds.
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post #8 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 06:03 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

masterclass wrote a masterpiece as far as I'm concerned. My writing ability is no where near his high standard, but I sincerely agree with every word he wrote! And I would like to add I think CD and the Castle Thread has been generally misunderstood at MTF. The Castle is not closed to anyone it is open to all no matter who your favorite player may be. It is not just about Rafa in fact right now there are more Roger fans that post in there than Rafa fans. CD always said, Everyone is welcome in the Castle." And he truly meant it! Everyone is immediately made to feel welcome in the Castle Thread. CD showed great respect to everyone that ever posted there. Indeed I wish posters in all threads showed each other the respect that all posters show to each other in the Castle Thread. And it was CD that set the standard in that thread. The Castle posters are a big happy family. We are not some "elitist group" that think we are better than other posters although sadly I think that is the impression some posters here have of the Castle Thread and the people who post there.

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post #9 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 07:04 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

There is now (thank goodness)a proper appeals procedure for banned posters to follow if they wish. I don't think CD's popularity (or lack of it) will or should be a factor.

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post #10 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 07:18 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

I am against permabanning . Even of people with which i wasn't good like CD, but calling every second poster ejaculon and similar terms had to stop. Term ejaculon is imo like every other personal attack infraction

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post #11 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 07:22 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

I agree. Permanent ban is too much.

Anyone know what was exactly the rule-infraction?

I'm still pissed off for my ban from Sep2010. "Go to hell" isn't wishing death, it still pissed me the fuck off.

I like the guy, sometimes he is a little bit too agressive with some posters, but PERMA is too much.

Ah, appeal moderation? Wanna know what appeal moderation did to me?
LOOK AT ME!
LOOK AT ME, BOY! THESE ARE THE SCARS OF APPEAL MODERATION!
Take a good long stare, you know you want to.
You're not even man enough to look at my face.

Appeal moderation isn't pretty, you have to watch your friends go to dust.
Appeal moderation is always hungry for your soul and sweet emotions.


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post #12 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 07:30 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

Can't believe the mods not acknowledging how much CD contributed to this site.


Yes, he has been a little bit out of control in GM (whether provoked or not) but he has also put respect and great discussions to this page.


On the top of my head I can think about 10 + much, much worser posters who are just trolling / violating 24/7 and who are still active. Hopefully this PERMAban can be turned into a 3 or 6 month ban. Don't know if CD still wants to return to this forum but at least give the guy his own choice.


Former #1 in FITD (Titles: 11 / US Open 2009 + MS Shanghai 2010 + MS Cincinatti 2011 champion)
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post #13 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 07:31 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

OK, here's how I see it.

I haven't been around here for very long. Most of you guys will know the ropes much more than myself, BUT in the short time I have been here, Clay Death was very nice to me, and seemed like a reasonable poster on the whole. Sure he may have been aggressive when he was heckled, but I've seen some disgusting behaviour on this forum that has gone relatively unpunished. A permanent ban is a very harsh punishment, though I'm yet to gather whether it's reasonable or not. I would guess the latter, but the mods have a hard time in here as it is, and who am I to complain with any great intent?
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post #14 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 07:42 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger the Dodger View Post
Please bring Clay Death back to life. Resurrect him like Lazarus. He knew shit about tennis but he was what he was - a great conductor of GM threads, maybe the best emcee this forum has seen. GM was his life, and his assassin, HkZ himself confessed to CD's ability to craft 40+ tedious repetitive posts per day. That's telling something. So let him enjoy a 3 month sentence, and well deserved rest but thereafter, please bring him back.

MTF's best PERMACLOWN: CD
He knew shit about tennis, did he now?
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post #15 of 219 (permalink) Old 07-24-2012, 07:47 PM
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Re: Clay Death Permaban: Consider rescinding please.

CD became a member here in Feb. 2008 and had put in 65,991 posts before the ban. I have been looking around the Forum there aren't many posters who are in that class of posting at all! The posting in the Chat Section Threads are down now anyway so who makes up for CD's posting power? With all the new social sites around now like Facebook and Tweeter the days of the Forum may be numbered anyway!

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