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post #46 of 128 (permalink) Old 03-25-2013, 05:57 PM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by purtov45 View Post
В том-то и дело, что у нас при замене соперника ставка сохранялась, наверно это меня и сбило с толку. Но в чужой монастырь со своим уставом не ходят ...
Разве? Значит хреново я наши правила читал
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post #47 of 128 (permalink) Old 03-25-2013, 07:23 PM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Zenjo View Post
Purtov, I also was eliminated on day 2 because of the withdrawal. I understand it's annoying but that was the correct ruling as per the existing rules. The board had to make a tough decision and they made it. It has been recognised that the rules are poorly worded and are in need of updating, so that there isn't any controversy like this again.

The fact is that both you and I chose Bellucci to win because he was playing a wild card ranked 377. Had it been known he was going to play the world no. 68 instead then neither of us would have picked him and gone with our backup picks instead.
No, I don't feel disappointment as soon as I understand, that all is made by rules.
Imho, a rule very complex, well worded it will not be possible. Perhaps, to add an example?

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post #48 of 128 (permalink) Old 03-26-2013, 06:46 AM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by Zenjo View Post
Purtov, I also was eliminated on day 2 because of the withdrawal. I understand it's annoying but that was the correct ruling as per the existing rules. The board had to make a tough decision and they made it. It has been recognised that the rules are poorly worded and are in need of updating, so that there isn't any controversy like this again.

The fact is that both you and I chose Bellucci to win because he was playing a wild card ranked 377. Had it been known he was going to play the world no. 68 instead then neither of us would have picked him and gone with our backup picks instead.
After this issue, I'd say the rules are not only poorly worded, but also don't account for LLs properly.
For example, OOP in thread has a match Ferrer vs Fognini, and someone really wants a safe bet in Day 1: Ferrer. I imagine one would fancy his pick on Ferrer against any unseeded in the draw. Fognini withdraws, and is replaced with Brands. Now there can be 2 situations depending on the time of withdrawal:

1) Withdrawal and LL info is known after the play has started this day. Here, rules need proper wording - as Day 1: Ferrer means Ferrer over Fognini. Although again, what if one doesn't care who Ferrer plays and just wants a safe bet on a top-10 player?

2) Withdrawal and LL Brands are known before the play has started this day, but after the manager has posted the OOP - and one makes a pick on Ferrer based on LL info. The player makes a pick Day 1: Ferrer meaning Ferrer over Brands. Some ST managers update the thread once a day - so not online to sort this situation before the deadline (and objectively can't be each day). What is the decision here?
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post #49 of 128 (permalink) Old 03-26-2013, 07:02 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

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After this issue, I'd say the rules are not only poorly worded, but also don't account for LLs properly.
For example, OOP in thread has a match Ferrer vs Fognini, and someone really wants a safe bet in Day 1: Ferrer. I imagine one would fancy his pick on Ferrer against any unseeded in the draw. Fognini withdraws, and is replaced with Brands. Now there can be 2 situations depending on the time of withdrawal:

1) Withdrawal and LL info is known after the play has started this day. Here, rules need proper wording - as Day 1: Ferrer means Ferrer over Fognini. Although again, what if one doesn't care who Ferrer plays and just wants a safe bet on a top-10 player?

2) Withdrawal and LL Brands are known before the play has started this day, but after the manager has posted the OOP - and one makes a pick on Ferrer based on LL info. The player makes a pick Day 1: Ferrer meaning Ferrer over Brands. Some ST managers update the thread once a day - so not online to sort this situation before the deadline (and objectively can't be each day). What is the decision here?
If it is known that an opponent has withdrawn before the deadline, and a player wishes to pick the new match. In your example he wishes to pick Ferrer over Brands. Then I would think it's fair to count this pick as long as the player notifies when picking that he is indeed picking the new match Ferrer over Brands, and not the original match involving Ferrer. For all intents and purposes since the player withdrew before the dealine this would be a valid suicide tennis match.

However if a player picks Ferrer and fails to notify that this is the new match that he is picking I tink we'd have to go with the backup. We cannot assume that he intended to pick this new Ferrer match. It's possible that they did, but it would be unfair to the ones who didn't realize and was just picking from the OOP posted.

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post #50 of 128 (permalink) Old 03-26-2013, 08:00 AM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

The problem arises when not completed pick is made. The manager should finish the pick, and for this purpose we do a heap of rules. Now I always shall do only the completed picks, and me rules-4 cease to interest.

Thus, I shall not do pick Day2 Bellucci.
I shall choose from two possibilities.
1) Day2 Bellucci def Harrison
2) Day2 Bellucci def anyone

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post #51 of 128 (permalink) Old 03-26-2013, 10:58 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by purtov45 View Post
The problem arises when not completed pick is made. The manager should finish the pick, and for this purpose we do a heap of rules. Now I always shall do only the completed picks, and me rules-4 cease to interest.

Thus, I shall not do pick Day2 Bellucci.
I shall choose from two possibilities.
1) Day2 Bellucci def Harrison
2) Day2 Bellucci def anyone
in my opinion if Bellucci's opponent gets replaced after play starts then this is an invalid match.

I would not agree with someone posting a pick like

Day 2: Bellucci(vs. C.Harrison)
BU: Bellucci(vs. LL)
BU2: Berlocq

I feel as if the deadline passes and the LL hasn't come in by then then it's not an official Suicide Tennis match as it's not on the OOP and the deadline has passed.

However it's not up to me to decide that. Maybe we should have a vote on it since there's no concrete rule for that scenario

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post #52 of 128 (permalink) Old 06-02-2013, 08:50 PM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

First: Thanks to all the managers for doing a great job.

I have the following suggestions:

1. Roland Garros should start on Sunday as the only Tournament of the year. I understand why the other tournaments starts on Monday and it makes sense because there are only a few matches on Sunday (e.g. in Madrid) and it does not make sense when half of the players is out after that.
But at RG you really have a nice and difficile competition with those 16 matches.
On the womens side it was actually not really easy to predict, but it makes the whole French Open even more exciting and tough which would be great.

2. I don't understand the points on day five.
They should be 160 and not 140 in my opinion.
The point structure is very hard.
Was it actually in discussion already?
Because it really changes the whole game when you would change the point system.

With this system you really risk something because you think that 2000 is so much more than e.g. 500.
If the point structure is more flat, than you don't want to end/win tournaments anymore and you won't risk that much.

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post #53 of 128 (permalink) Old 06-02-2013, 08:53 PM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

The problem with RG starting Sunday is that everyone is used to tournaments always starting Monday. It will be difficult to remember that one time a year it's Sunday.
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post #54 of 128 (permalink) Old 06-02-2013, 09:59 PM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by RNW View Post
First: Thanks to all the managers for doing a great job.

I have the following suggestions:

1. Roland Garros should start on Sunday as the only Tournament of the year. I understand why the other tournaments starts on Monday and it makes sense because there are only a few matches on Sunday (e.g. in Madrid) and it does not make sense when half of the players is out after that.
But at RG you really have a nice and difficile competition with those 16 matches.
On the womens side it was actually not really easy to predict, but it makes the whole French Open even more exciting and tough which would be great.

2. I don't understand the points on day five.
They should be 160 and not 140 in my opinion.
The point structure is very hard.
Was it actually in discussion already?
Because it really changes the whole game when you would change the point system.

With this system you really risk something because you think that 2000 is so much more than e.g. 500.
If the point structure is more flat, than you don't want to end/win tournaments anymore and you won't risk that much.
With Roland Garros, you might have a point. We discussed in the off-season whether it would be wise to let tournaments start when a certain amount of matches are on Sunday. But the clearest reason to start on Monday is the fact that people than don't have to remember when tournaments start, they always start on Monday. I am still in favor for this.

For the points system, I don't really see what you mean. You start with day 5 points and end up saying the whole system is wrong. The idea of the system is to copy the real life tennis tournaments, that is what we use. And for the fact that it should be more flat, I disagree. It is clearly more difficult to end up picking the right finalist, so that should be much more points than picking correct on day 1, which is really easy! So, that is why you can get so much more points on the final days! We want risk to be promoted here!

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post #55 of 128 (permalink) Old 06-15-2013, 06:04 AM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

Is there even going to be a suicide game for next week, cause there is no poll yet?

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post #56 of 128 (permalink) Old 06-16-2013, 04:23 PM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

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Is there even going to be a suicide game for next week, cause there is no poll yet?
Good question. I just started one for Eastbourne as it was no time for a poll now.
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post #57 of 128 (permalink) Old 09-15-2013, 06:55 AM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

No poll for Suicide this week, will there be a game?

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post #58 of 128 (permalink) Old 09-15-2013, 07:04 AM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

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No poll for Suicide this week, will there be a game?
I think that Sapeod forgot to do it , I will send him a PM but if he doesn't answer before I get up (in like 5 hours) I will manage this week and I will decide what tournament we will play by a coin flipping

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post #59 of 128 (permalink) Old 11-07-2013, 03:04 PM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

I edited Post 90 in the Suicide WTF thread. POST: "It's quite interesting to see "Sunshine" managing our Suicide End Tournament haha "

It's not a post where I posted a pick in it but it is a bit irritating that it is not mentioned that it is edited...
So I guess probably someone could change a pick as well and it is not mentioned...?

I just wanted to mention that, probably there are other ways for MODs to see if a post is edited.

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post #60 of 128 (permalink) Old 11-07-2013, 03:31 PM
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Re: Suicide Tennis Suggestion/Discussion Thread

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Originally Posted by RNW View Post
I edited Post 90 in the Suicide WTF thread. POST: "It's quite interesting to see "Sunshine" managing our Suicide End Tournament haha "

It's not a post where I posted a pick in it but it is a bit irritating that it is not mentioned that it is edited...
So I guess probably someone could change a pick as well and it is not mentioned...?

I just wanted to mention that, probably there are other ways for MODs to see if a post is edited.
You have two minutes to edit a post before it says it has been changed. So you can edit your suicide pick within those two minutes, if for instance you made a silly typo.

After 121 seconds it will be visible that the post has been edited, and that post will no longer be valid in the competition. But you can of course make a new one if you're in time.

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