Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong? - Page 3 - MensTennisForums.com
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post #31 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 04:55 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Mjau! View Post
Well, then he shouldn't masquerade as one.
Typical american then... they share the same upsetting lack of morals and sense of fair play. Unlike us honest northeners.

There was an AC in OP. A french newspaper said this was Contador and we all know the french are trustworthy.
Oh I get it now... good shot. You fail at trolling though. Rule one of trolling is you must not let others see you're deliberately trying to troll.

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Originally Posted by philosophicalarf View Post
Armstrong says in-competition testing will never catch anyone, only out-of-competition testing and the blood passport can.

Tennis has no blood passport system, and does basically no out of competition testing.

The methods and drugs used by Armstrong in 1999 would work in tennis right now, with zero chance of being caught (not slightly surprising to anyone familiar with the topic, btw).
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post #32 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 04:57 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Groove Dude View Post
Yep.

Floyd Landis the snitch. Pathetic. You can admit you did it without throwing Lance Armstrong under the bus.

Spineless.
Totally agree. What a hypocrite! He even got a consultation on when the statute of limitation runs out! Anything for attention. Guess wants to make as much money as Agassi did with his so-called truth book.
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post #33 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 04:59 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

And a Kazakh steps in! This is shaping up to be something fun...

Quote:
Originally Posted by philosophicalarf View Post
Armstrong says in-competition testing will never catch anyone, only out-of-competition testing and the blood passport can.

Tennis has no blood passport system, and does basically no out of competition testing.

The methods and drugs used by Armstrong in 1999 would work in tennis right now, with zero chance of being caught (not slightly surprising to anyone familiar with the topic, btw).
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post #34 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:07 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Mjau! View Post
Typical spaniards defending obvious dopers. Just like judge Serrano protected Valverde and Contador. Disgraceful.
You're a fucking moron Like Jose said, I'm not Spanish.

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Originally Posted by Clay Death View Post
floyd`s lack of credibility does come into play.

he is the same clown who previously denied any doping charges leveled against him.

we will just have to see how this plays out.
It's gonna get big with Galea. Santana Moss from the Redskins is also mixed up in this.

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Originally Posted by Mjau! View Post
Well, then he shouldn't masquerade as one.
Typical american then... they share the same upsetting lack of morals and sense of fair play. Unlike us honest northeners.

There was an AC in OP. A french newspaper said this was Contador and we all know the french are trustworthy.
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post #35 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:08 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

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Oh I get it now... good shot. You fail at trolling though. Rule one of trolling is you must not let others see you're deliberately trying to troll.
I'm not trolling. The US and Spain are the worst nations on earth (along with Italy and Russia) when it comes to these matters. Unlike the scandinavian countries which are ardently anti-doping and do not have a widespread doping culture and acceptance of these procedures. The french are usually right about doping in cycling.
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post #36 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:12 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Groove Dude View Post
You're a fucking moron Like Jose said, I'm not Spanish.



It's gonna get big with Galea. Santana Moss from the Redskins is also mixed up in this.



I'll wear whatever flag I want.
How am I a moron for assuming that someone with a spanish flag is spanish? It's a totally logical assumption to make. You on the other hand, is either a gullible fool who thinks Lance is clean, or a cynical ass who thinks dopers should be protected (since you bag on Floyd for outing LA). Not sure which it is.
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post #37 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:19 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Mjau! View Post
I'm not trolling. The US and Spain are the worst nations on earth (along with Italy and Russia) when it comes to these matters. Unlike the scandinavian countries which are ardently anti-doping and do not have a widespread doping culture and acceptance of these procedures. The french are usually right about doping in cycling.
Oh well that's too bad you're not trolling then, cause that means you're just a fuckhead.

You're right about Scandinavia though. You're all admirable nuns there. I should especially single out people like Bjarne Riis, who did not win a Tour with blood levels that made him risk death, nor waited until the crime prescribed to confess, and is not receiving financial and logistic support by a big Danish bank to manage a team.

Then there's good old Brian Holm, who admitted to having used systematic doping his whole career, only to see the Danish Cycling Federation renew his contract as General Manager.

And who can forget Mike Rasmussen, but hey, he was just on vacation in Italy, wasn't he?

True examples of anti-doping culture these Scandinavians.


And the French media are usually right about doping uh? Well that's obviously not true, and surprisingly so, since they accuse pretty much every moving (non-French, naturelment) cyclist.

Quote:
Originally Posted by philosophicalarf View Post
Armstrong says in-competition testing will never catch anyone, only out-of-competition testing and the blood passport can.

Tennis has no blood passport system, and does basically no out of competition testing.

The methods and drugs used by Armstrong in 1999 would work in tennis right now, with zero chance of being caught (not slightly surprising to anyone familiar with the topic, btw).
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post #38 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:29 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Mjau! View Post
How am I a moron for assuming that someone with a spanish flag is spanish? It's a totally logical assumption to make. You on the other hand, is either a gullible fool who thinks Lance is clean, or a cynical ass who thinks dopers should be protected (since you bag on Floyd for outing LA). Not sure which it is.
Neither.

Lance has had to battle doping allegations every year since he first won the Tour de France.

If you had a Swedish cyclist who overcame cancer to win the Tour 7 times, would you be defensive about whether or not he doped? Especially considering the source of the allegations? Come on, now.

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post #39 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:30 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

I'm going to go on with the examples of the great anti-doping culture in Scandinavia with the case of Brian Dalgaard Jensen, who admitted to have ridden his whole life on performance-enhancing drugs, especially during his successful 1997 season, in a Danish TV show, and as a consequence received an anti-doping award, in recognition for his openness.


Quote:
Originally Posted by philosophicalarf View Post
Armstrong says in-competition testing will never catch anyone, only out-of-competition testing and the blood passport can.

Tennis has no blood passport system, and does basically no out of competition testing.

The methods and drugs used by Armstrong in 1999 would work in tennis right now, with zero chance of being caught (not slightly surprising to anyone familiar with the topic, btw).
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post #40 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:36 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Har-Tru View Post
Oh well that's too bad you're not trolling then, cause that means you're just a fuckhead.

You're right about Scandinavia though. You're all admirable nuns there. I should especially single out people like Bjarne Riis, who did not win a Tour with blood levels that made him risk death, nor waited until the crime prescribed to confess, and is not receiving financial and logistic support by a big Danish bank to manage a team.

Then there's good old Brian Holm, who admitted to having used systematic doping his whole career, only to see the Danish Cycling Federation renew his contract as General Manager.

And who can forget Mike Rasmussen, but hey, he was just on vacation in Italy, wasn't he?

True examples of anti-doping culture these Scandinavians.


And the French media are usually right about doping uh? Well that's obviously not true, and surprisingly so, since they accuse pretty much every moving (non-French) cyclist.
The danes do not count, nor does the finns. The anti-doping culture I'm talking about is only prevalent in Sweden and Norway. Look at XC skiing for example. The average Hb values of the swedes and norwegians did not increase at all after EPO was introduced, unlike the international average that climbed by 10%. Swedes and norwegians had lower avg values off-season than in-season, again, unlike the others. The highest value ever recorded in a swede or norwegian was ~ 30% lower than the values recorded in several international skiers at World championships. The peak value in any swede at the 2001 Worlds (where a swede won 2 golds) was lower than the international seasonal average. This is all well documented. A swede or norwegian has never tested positive in this sport, unlike russians, finns, italians, austrians, czechs, poles, estonians etc.

Of course there are both dopers and clean athletes in all countries, but it is evident that the issue is much bigger in some and lesser in others. Spain is widely considered to be a rotten apple within the cycling community, while for example France is considered less rotten. Spain has a problem that needs to be dealt with and the same goes for numerous other countries as well of course. But not all countries are equal in this regard, that's just the way it is.
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post #41 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:38 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Groove Dude View Post
Neither.

Lance has had to battle doping allegations every year since he first won the Tour de France.

If you had a Swedish cyclist who overcame cancer to win the Tour 7 times, would you be defensive about whether or not he doped? Especially considering the source of the allegations? Come on, now.
I think you mean sourceS in Armstrong case, no offense but anyone who thinks that guy wasn't doped to his eyeballs is a bit delusional or just doesn't know enough about his case.

Unless Landis can provide some hard evidence it's not gonna change anything anyway.
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post #42 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:40 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by Groove Dude View Post
Neither.

Lance has had to battle doping allegations every year since he first won the Tour de France.

If you had a Swedish cyclist who overcame cancer to win the Tour 7 times, would you be defensive about whether or not he doped? Especially considering the source of the allegations? Come on, now.
Not if...

...former team mates and masseurs claimed he's dirty
...~10 (?) ex team mates had been busted for doping
...synthetic EPO was found in 6 of the samples he left at the -99 TdF
...his blood values at the -09 TdF strongly indicated blood doping

Then I'd wake up and smell the coffee!
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post #43 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:43 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

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Originally Posted by elessar View Post
I think you mean sourceS in Armstrong case, no offense but anyone who thinks that guy wasn't doped to his eyeballs is a bit delusional or just doesn't know enough about his case.

Unless Landis can provide some hard evidence it's not gonna change anything anyway.
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Originally Posted by Mjau! View Post
Not if...

...former team mates and masseurs claimed he's dirty
...~10 (?) ex team mates had been busted for doping
...synthetic EPO was found in 6 of the samples he left at the -99 TdF
...his blood values at the -09 TdF strongly indicated blood doping

Then I'd wake up and smell the coffee!
If the evidence against him is so overwhelming as you two say, then how come Lance hasn't been busted yet?

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We all choke. That’s all right. We’re not machines. What you have to learn is to accept that fact and not panic. It’s the panic that loses the matches, not the nerves.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary Player
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post #44 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:45 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mjau! View Post
The danes do not count, nor does the finns. The anti-doping culture I'm talking about is only prevalent in Sweden and Norway. Look at XC skiing for example. The average Hb values of the swedes and norwegians did not increase at all after EPO was introduced, unlike the international average that climbed by 10%. Swedes and norwegians had lower avg values off-season than in-season, again, unlike the others. The highest value ever recorded in a swede or norwegian was ~ 30% lower than the values recorded in several international skiers at World championships. The peak value in any swede at the 2001 Worlds (where a swede won 2 golds) was lower than the international seasonal average. This is all well documented. A swede or norwegian has never tested positive in this sport, unlike russians, finns, italians, austrians, czechs, poles, estonians etc.

Of course there are both dopers and clean athletes in all countries, but it is evident that the issue is much bigger in some and lesser in others. Spain is widely considered to be a rotten apple within the cycling community, while for example France is considered less rotten. Spain has a problem that needs to be dealt with and the same goes for numerous other countries as well of course. But not all countries are equal in this regard, that's just the way it is.
Oh so Denmark doesn't count as Scandinavia. OK then.

We're talking about cycling here, I know jackshit about other sports so I have no idea what you're talking about.

Not that you can say much about Norwegian and Swedish cyclists since they pretty much suck, but it's pretty significative that the biggest Swedish cyclist of the last years with Magnus Bäckstedt, Niklas Axelsson, went "beep" just months ago.

Quote:
Originally Posted by philosophicalarf View Post
Armstrong says in-competition testing will never catch anyone, only out-of-competition testing and the blood passport can.

Tennis has no blood passport system, and does basically no out of competition testing.

The methods and drugs used by Armstrong in 1999 would work in tennis right now, with zero chance of being caught (not slightly surprising to anyone familiar with the topic, btw).
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post #45 of 154 (permalink) Old 05-20-2010, 05:45 PM
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Re: Is it finally over for Lance Armstrong?

Here's a good read on the EPO positives.

http://nyvelocity.com/content/interv...chael-ashenden
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