Player/Coach Changes /"The Changing of the Guard" - Page 4 - MensTennisForums.com
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post #46 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-19-2006, 03:26 PM Thread Starter
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

Whoa the thread was bumped again? Thanks for this article GW- interesting read. Although I think De La Pena is a good coach and has had success with Gonzalez; I also note that he isn't shy about mouthing off. Seems to get him into trouble. Wonder what the response will be? If you see anything will you post it? Thanks.

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post #47 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-19-2006, 03:40 PM
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

Quote:
Originally Posted by cobalt60
Whoa the thread was bumped again? Thanks for this article GW- interesting read. Although I think De La Pena is a good coach and has had success with Gonzalez; I also note that he isn't shy about mouthing off. Seems to get him into trouble. Wonder what the response will be? If you see anything will you post it? Thanks.
De la Peña is not so popular in Argentina because of his affiliation with all things Chilean so they will probably ignore him! And - yes he does open his big mouth quite often - but on this occasion I believe that he is right. It cannot be good for a player (especially a young, up-and-coming player) to lose the continuity that comes with a long-standing coaching relationship such as the one Guga had with Pasos.......with many young players the coach spends more time wth them than their own Father does, and trust and respect built over a long time is paramount. A good working relationship develops over time, where people can really get to know and undersand one another as human beings not just player/coach, and develop a rapport with each other on and off the court. Constant chopping and changing is damaging to their development just as most peoples' careers could be damaged by skipping into a new job every few months instead of staying with one company for a decent length of time and learning everything you need to know before moving on. Well said Horacio

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post #48 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-19-2006, 03:50 PM Thread Starter
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

I totally agree Rosie about players sticking with the same coach. I have to go back and reread my original post when I started this thread.
The other interesting coaching changes to me are when family coaches the player. Paradorn's dad now brother and now AndyR's bro. Dtiger posted a nice article yesterday where P's brother said that his job is mainly being supportive and not tactical. Obviously P had a good run at IW but I think tactics and being a direct observer and commenting/improving mistakes are important for coaches to deal with.

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post #49 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-19-2006, 03:57 PM
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

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Originally Posted by cobalt60
I totally agree Rosie about players sticking with the same coach. I have to go back and reread my original post when I started this thread.
The other interesting coaching changes to me are when family coaches the player. Paradorn's dad now brother and now AndyR's bro. Dtiger posted a nice article yesterday where P's brother said that his job is mainly being supportive and not tactical. Obviously P had a good run at IW but I think tactics and being a direct observer and commenting/improving mistakes are important for coaches to deal with.
I agree with you about the family thing too. It must be hard for a brother to criticise a player as much as he should do when that player is his own close family member. I always see it as a bit of a cop-out................the player doesn't want to listen so they choose a "coach" who isn't likely to answer them back or have a go at them!!!!!!! I know very little about Andy and his brother, so I can't really comment on their situation, but I'm sure Andy would do better with a more neutral and much more experienced professional coach by his side.

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post #50 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 12:02 AM
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

Our commentators said something very interesting earlier this tourney - that Andy can't blame the coach now b/c the coach is his brother. I think that's something that can help Andy - I think very arguably what Andy needs right now is someone who can give him the mental/emotional support and he needs to take the responsibility for his form.

Rosie, they're extremely close and his brother does run an academy for top juniors in Texas.. so it's a bit different of a situation from some other coach/brother relationships because his brother really does know tennis above and beyond what he's done with Andy. And as Andy said, his brother's always been involved with his career anyway - for 23 years his brother was the one sitting next to the guy they showed on tv and the only thing that's changed now is that his brother is the one they're showing on tv. That's how Andy put it and it makes sense.

I think ultimately overall, the coach depends on the player and what he needs and where he's at in his career. You have a guy like James who had clear weaknesses in his game 2 years ago and people cried out for him to dump the coach that he'd had his whole career or he'd never reach the next level.. well we all know how that turned out, James laughed in everyone's face, kept Brian on board and he'll be #9 next week. You have Andy who's searching and maybe making more frequent changes are what he needs right now - hard to know. With the coach/brother stuff, it depends on the relationships they have I guess. Everyone seems to say that Andy's brother often tells him what others won't, or that he listens more to his brother than to others, so maybe they have a relatiionship that can translate. Our commentators said that Davydenko's brother has coached him his whole career - that's obviously working right now, so it just depends i guess. Some guys need to have a new voice in their ear every once in a while and some need that static person always around them.

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post #51 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 12:17 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

Andy has the tools and not the confidence. That's what a loved one can do for you. Bump up one's self esteem and deal with you honestly. It might take some time though and that's ok. Andy did well for 2 matches at IW and that should be taken at face value.

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post #52 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 02:53 AM
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

Quote:
Originally Posted by cobalt60
Whoa the thread was bumped again? Thanks for this article GW- interesting read. Although I think De La Pena is a good coach and has had success with Gonzalez; I also note that he isn't shy about mouthing off. Seems to get him into trouble. Wonder what the response will be? If you see anything will you post it? Thanks.
It doesn't matter about De La Peña's personality really and as to whether he shoots his mouth or not. I mean he is not like Brad Gilbert where he wants to be more noticed than the player.

He has an interesting reputation in Argentina and he is outspoken for sure, but in this case what he says is fairly logical. Though not all of relationships are going to work and that's like with anything. I mean after 2 first round losses, the coach could be gone.

It's not like it's only South Americans. Malisse has had 11 coaches and Safin has had a lot as well, though in Marat's case he had good ones in Chesnokov, Volkov and Wilander before Lundgren. As long as Tiriac is far away from as possible, then it will be good.

Gaudio has been settled for a while with Davin and Nalle was with Infantino for quite some time. The thing is a lot of these players don't want to take responsibility for their own performances, so the coach in many instances is an easy scapegoat.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

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Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #53 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 06:19 AM
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

Quote:
Originally Posted by deb.
Our commentators said something very interesting earlier this tourney - that Andy can't blame the coach now b/c the coach is his brother. I think that's something that can help Andy - I think very arguably what Andy needs right now is someone who can give him the mental/emotional support and he needs to take the responsibility for his form.

Rosie, they're extremely close and his brother does run an academy for top juniors in Texas.. so it's a bit different of a situation from some other coach/brother relationships because his brother really does know tennis above and beyond what he's done with Andy. And as Andy said, his brother's always been involved with his career anyway - for 23 years his brother was the one sitting next to the guy they showed on tv and the only thing that's changed now is that his brother is the one they're showing on tv. That's how Andy put it and it makes sense.

I think ultimately overall, the coach depends on the player and what he needs and where he's at in his career. You have a guy like James who had clear weaknesses in his game 2 years ago and people cried out for him to dump the coach that he'd had his whole career or he'd never reach the next level.. well we all know how that turned out, James laughed in everyone's face, kept Brian on board and he'll be #9 next week. You have Andy who's searching and maybe making more frequent changes are what he needs right now - hard to know. With the coach/brother stuff, it depends on the relationships they have I guess. Everyone seems to say that Andy's brother often tells him what others won't, or that he listens more to his brother than to others, so maybe they have a relatiionship that can translate. Our commentators said that Davydenko's brother has coached him his whole career - that's obviously working right now, so it just depends i guess. Some guys need to have a new voice in their ear every once in a while and some need that static person always around them.
Thanks for the info Deb Btw - completely off-topic..............I have been trying to Rep you for a few days now because I really love your avatar, but the damned system won't let me - so please consider yourself "Repped" - the daffodils are really beautiful and remind me of Spring and sunshine

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post #54 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 01:00 PM Thread Starter
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

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Originally Posted by Rosie
Thanks for the info Deb Btw - completely off-topic..............I have been trying to Rep you for a few days now because I really love your avatar, but the damned system won't let me - so please consider yourself "Repped" - the daffodils are really beautiful and remind me of Spring and sunshine
And more off topic Rosie- They are the symbol in April of the American Cancer Society for the very reasons you quoted Daffodil Days the ACS calls it. On that day we give them to the patients in my office.

GW- I don't think De La Pena is as much of a hog the limelight kind of guy as Brad Gilbert was, but from what I have seen and read he comes close It isn't important though as far as his coaching. And he and his star pupil have a lot in common or they might not have lasted this far.

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post #55 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 01:03 PM
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

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Originally Posted by cobalt60
And more off topic Rosie- They are the symbol in April of the American Cancer Society for the very reasons you quoted Daffodil Days the ACS calls it. On that day we give them to the patients in my office.

GW- I don't think De La Pena is as much of a hog the limelight kind of guy as Brad Gilbert was, but from what I have seen and read he comes close It isn't important though as far as his coaching. And he and his star pupil have a lot in common or they might not have lasted this far.
They are also the symbol for the Cancer Relief Society in England and we have Daffodil Day here too I also have loads in my garden! Anyway - that was very off-topic and I am coming to the end of my lunchbreak so must log off here and go back to work now

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post #56 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 01:04 PM Thread Starter
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosie
They are also the symbol for the Cancer Relief Society in England and we have Daffodil Day here too I also have loads in my garden! Anyway - that was very off-topic and I am coming to the end of my lunchbreak so must log off here and go back to work now

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post #57 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-20-2006, 01:15 PM
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

Quote:
Originally Posted by deb.
Our commentators said that Davydenko's brother has coached him his whole career - that's obviously working right now, so it just depends i guess. Some guys need to have a new voice in their ear every once in a while and some need that static person always around them.
Your commentators were right about Kolya and Edik, Kolya's even said that as his brother's been his only coach he could never imagine someone else coaching him. Edik is pushing him alright and Kolya's game's developed nicely in the last years so... It's nice to see Kolya finally getting some attention worldwide. He's far from the 'boring' player (i.e. baseliner) he was a couple of years ago.

But as they say - different strokes for different folks I guess.
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post #58 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-27-2006, 02:05 PM
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

Nalbandian not working with Mastelli anymore.

http://www.ole.clarin.com/jsp/v4/pag...?pagId=1165920

Quote:
KEY BISCAYNE
No hay charla técnica

David decidió no continuar con su entrenador, Francisco Mastelli.


En medio de la alegría por la victoria y el apuro por seguir a River ante Boca, David Nalbandian sorprendió al anunciar que terminó la relación con su entrenador, Francisco Mastelli, también técnico del peruano Luis Horna. "Con Pancho habíamos arreglado hasta acá. De ahora en más, vamos a ver", le dijo Nalbandian a DPA. Mastelli estuvo en el banco en el triunfo del unquillense sobre el estadounidense Paul Goldstein, el viernes, y ayer ya no se encontraba junto al preparador físico Luis Barrionuevo, ex de Las Leonas, quien permanece con el cordobés. "Cuando Lucho perdió yo hablé con Pancho y no hubo ningún problema (en terminar la relación)", aseguró Nalbandian. El año pasado, meses después de cortar con Eduardo Infantino, el unquillense jugó el Masters de Shanghai sin entrenador y terminó ganándole la final a Federer.
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post #59 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-27-2006, 02:17 PM
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

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Originally Posted by Shotgun Blues
Nalbandian not working with Mastelli anymore.

http://www.ole.clarin.com/jsp/v4/pag...?pagId=1165920
Well that one lasted all of 3 months

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post #60 of 1479 (permalink) Old 03-27-2006, 02:31 PM Thread Starter
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Re: The Changing of the Guard

Wow another quick coaching change? This just doesn't seem to be in anyone's best interest.

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