Can 2 Slams be worth more than 3? - MensTennisForums.com
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 01:31 AM Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Ace Tracker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 420
                     
Can 2 Slams be worth more than 3?

Quote:
from the Tennis Mailbag, by Jon Wertheim

The ATP Tour has a multitude of young, talented players, such as Andy Roddick, Lleyton Hewitt, Roger Federer, Marat Safin, Gustavo Kuerten and Tommy Haas. Who do you think has the most potential to be the greatest player of his generation? Which player will be the greatest of his generation?
—Josh Silverman, Blacksburg, Va.

Thanks for the making the distinction, because they really are two different questions. Strictly on potential, I'd cast my vote for Safin. He hits the ball beautifully; with the exception of Roddick, he hits the hardest serve; and he doesn't really have a weak surface. If he could ever get his inner circuitry wired right, he'd retire with a trunkload of Slams. It still could happen, but right now it looks as though Hewitt will be the greatest of this generation. More than any other player you've mentioned, he has filled the breach. Guga, of course, has more Slams to date, but I'd have to say that 1 Wimbledon title + 1 U.S. Open title > 3 French Open titles.

(OK, that was just an excuse to use the ">" character, which doesn't get much play on the keyboard.)

Seriously, in addition to being a good deal younger the Kuerten, Hewitt has also spent more time at No. 1. I should note that there is still time for a lot of New Balls to make their respective moves before the home stretch. (Remember that Agassi didn't win his first Slam until he was 22.) But right now, Hewitt has a sizable lead.
What do you guys think? Is the math right and 1Wimbledon+1USOpen > 3French Opens? Please be objective and try not to base your opinions only to your fave's benefit...
Ace Tracker is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 01:35 AM
Registered User
 
TennisHack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: the arms of a Swissie
Posts: 10,038
                     
How?!?! is one Wimbly title and 1 US Open title greater than 3 French Opens? Because Hewitt won Slams on two different surfaces and Guga only on one?!

Yeah, because the structure of the Slams are so different between the Australian, the French, Wimbly, and the US. It's not like, you know, a player has to win 7 matches to win each or anything

Sounds to me like another reason to "look down" on good clay-court players.

~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
The Tennis Refuge

You will be missed, Michel Kratochvil!
TennisHack is offline  
post #3 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 02:18 PM
country flag ys
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 3,055
                     
Don't you think that finding Guga in the list of "young and talented" players is bit of a stretch?
ys is offline  
 
post #4 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 02:43 PM
Registered User
 
Chloe le Bopper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Munchkin Land
Posts: 28,276
                     
Ys - no more than Guga being a "new ball" after having won a slam 3 years earlier, was a stretch

As for the question - Guga has not only won 3 of them, he has succesfully defended his crown.

This is clearly a failed attempt, to take credit away from a clay great

Nice try John.

I lack direction.

Chocking makes me sad.
Chloe le Bopper is offline  
post #5 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 02:44 PM
Registered User
 
Chloe le Bopper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Munchkin Land
Posts: 28,276
                     
I'd also like to personally slap that person for putting Andy on their list over other people

I lack direction.

Chocking makes me sad.
Chloe le Bopper is offline  
post #6 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 02:52 PM
country flag Lee
Gugaholic
 
Lee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Under the blue sky
Posts: 84,779
                     
YS, if you think Guga is talented a bit stretch, I doubt how many matches you have watched Guga played.

And I agree with Becca, Mr. Hewitt has still to successfully defend his GS title.
Lee is offline  
post #7 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 03:01 PM
Registered User
 
Scotso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Baltimore, MD
Age: 33
Posts: 70,027
                     
Well personally I think that it shows more ability to win slams on different surfaces, but I wouldn't trade 3 for 2.


Le Poussin! Faithfully ignoring the haters since 1995.

Le Poulailler de Poussin! (Simontarded.)

Ron Paul for President 2012!
Scotso is offline  
post #8 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 03:04 PM
Registered User
 
Chloe le Bopper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Munchkin Land
Posts: 28,276
                     
leecal - I think he was refering to Guga as being "young" as being a stretch.

Saying he shouldn't be in the same group as the guys under 24.

I lack direction.

Chocking makes me sad.
Chloe le Bopper is offline  
post #9 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 03:13 PM
country flag ys
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 3,055
                     
Well, I am not sure. Guga is a great claycourter. Perhaps Top 5 in Open Era. But even with his hardcourt Masters title, and indoors Masters Cup title, he is still a one trick pony, because of his inability to get further than QF in non-clay GSs. Like it or not, that's one' s performance at Grand Slams that matters. In my book, Hewitt has already passed Kuerten, Kafelnikov and Rafter on greatness scale.
ys is offline  
post #10 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 03:17 PM
country flag ys
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 3,055
                     
Quote:
leecal - I think he was refering to Guga as being "young" as being a stretch.
Thank you, Becca, for figuring that out.. Given that Guga is just 2.5 years younger than Kafelnikov, and Kafelnikov is as good as retired, calling him "young" is almost an insult to his achievements. In fact, given his style and a degree of reliance on his stamina and speed, I don't expect him to be anywhere close to the top of the game in 3, perhaps even in 2 years.
ys is offline  
post #11 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 03:28 PM
Banned!
 
joanbalcells's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 147
                     
no 3 is greater than 2. always. only when they're equal should they look at the break-down.

can't stand it when people say that agassi's achievements surpass sampras, just because he won all four slams rather than just 3.

slam assessment should be done on quantity, not subjective stuff about quality. we already hear that AO+FO is not equal to WB+US. the tournaments may differ in exposure, popular imagination, history, but they're too close in stature to make these sort of distinctions.
joanbalcells is offline  
post #12 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 04:06 PM
country flag ys
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 3,055
                     
Of course, AO+FO is less than WB+US. Just look at who was winning AO or FO, say, last 5-6 years. Korda,Johansson, Costa, Moya. They all are good players, but nowhere close to being elite players. While all WB and US winners were clearly elite. In terms of prestige, AO or FO is nowhere near W or US. Like it or not.
ys is offline  
post #13 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 04:24 PM
country flag Lee
Gugaholic
 
Lee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Under the blue sky
Posts: 84,779
                     
Hmm... May be we should not count those AO & FO titles that Sampras, Bjorg, Connors, etc. win.

No wonder Safin didn't win last year AO. May be he don't want to put in those non-elite player list.

It's better Hewitt don't try to win 2003 AO too.
Lee is offline  
post #14 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 04:47 PM
Registered User
 
RogiFan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: RogiLand
Posts: 2,689
                     
I agree w Hackie and leecal. If RG is worth less than Wimby and USO, why does it have the same # of points then???!!!

Besides, this is a dumb statement from JW...!!! and he does say dumb things now and then!

Actually I find RG and Wimby the most interesting slams, given the surface. USO is the least interesting with the most # of American players.
RogiFan is offline  
post #15 of 55 (permalink) Old 11-20-2002, 04:54 PM
Registered User
 
Murkofan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
Age: 32
Posts: 27,194
                     
I think it's all subjective, really.

To me, winning slams on two different surfaces (with the exception of the US and AO, which are pretty similar) signifies more diverse ability. But like Scott said, I wouldn't trade 3 for 2.

Providing he's able to get rested and healthy again, I think Guga can win the FO a couple more times. I don't see him winning any other slams. Lleyton can certainly also win a few more slams. As far as determining who ends up having had the better career, we'll have to wait until they both retire.

Brazen Barmy Bitch

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v622/LosDosMos/10.jpg


"I'm just on a mission today. But the end result, you will feel better."
"Not when you go home alone tonight I won't..."

"What is your good luck charm?"
"You."
--Derek and Shannon
Murkofan is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the MensTennisForums.com forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome