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post #541 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-13-2012, 01:37 PM
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

No problem tripwires. I think they implemented it so that the latter MS1000s were guaranteed to have stars there.

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post #542 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-13-2012, 02:56 PM
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

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Yes, as much as you don't want to think it SdG, the Masters is actually part of the tennis tour, therefore it counts as tennis reform. The Masters are run by the ATP it classifies in both categories.

Ordering me to do anything is a going to end in a whole lot of nothing.
why din't you merge "nadal skeptical about his montecarlo chances" with the "monte carlo early discussions" thread? nadal's chances are also part of montecarlo discussions.....

that is just one example and just because it is a nadal bashing thread, you want it to remain separate.....when no other mod had a problem with my thread for 2 days since its creation, how do you suddenly find a problem with that?

what if masters is part of tennis tour? a separate thread was created because it needed some attention......

are we creating a common grandslam thread and discussing all 4 slams in it? no.....
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post #543 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-13-2012, 03:09 PM
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

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why din't you merge "nadal skeptical about his montecarlo chances" with the "monte carlo early discussions" thread? nadal's chances are also part of montecarlo discussions.....

that is just one example and just because it is a nadal bashing thread, you want it to remain separate.....when no other mod had a problem with my thread for 2 days since its creation, how do you suddenly find a problem with that?

what if masters is part of tennis tour? a separate thread was created because it needed some attention......

are we creating a common grandslam thread and discussing all 4 slams in it? no.....
Yeah that last sentence was a solid comparison. Your thread was not about random discussion about the WTF, you made a (ridiculous) proposal to change that tournament.
WTF is perhaps the ATP's most important tourney, so merging your thread with "MTF suggestions to reform the ATP" sounds about right to me.

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We should be appreciative of Federer though, because we will never see anything like him again. The fact he can still compete for slams ever after the erosion of his physical skills is really a greater testament to the natural talent he has than the period of time when he was dominating the tour.
Noletards in 2015 in a single post:
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24 Year old Federer is nothing but a 2015 Djokovic minus 50 % of his fighting capability.
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Nadal is by far the most naturally talented player of all time and that is the reason his stay at the top is a lot longer than players like Federer etc were able to do.
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post #544 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 04:23 AM Thread Starter
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

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Yes, I've been to ATP events in Asia. Considerable growth there.

There are only 8 out of 90 total ATP Challenger events in Asia: http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tourname...nger-Tour.aspx

How is 8.8% of the total "too many challengers in Asia"?
Asian Challengers are a joke this sad but true, they aren't getting better.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

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I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #545 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 05:25 AM
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

Any good snake-oil seller could pitch a challenger in Macau and make a lot of money. There's been a lot of interest in the game because of Li Na and what Drewett's been doing in China. If I was Stanley Ho I'd put on some challenger in Macau with a decent-sized purse for the punters.

I'm looking at some past Asian challenger events and their entry lists aren't as geographically biased as one might think. Last year Tursunov won the Singaporean one, Stebe won in Shanghai, Dudi Sela won in Busan, Farukh Dustov won in Beijing. So it's not as if it's only Asian players who are entering, when the purse is big enough then European and American players also make the trip.

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post #546 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 06:08 AM
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

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Originally Posted by LisaKoh View Post
Yes, I've been to ATP events in Asia. Considerable growth there.

There are only 8 out of 90 total ATP Challenger events in Asia: http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tourname...nger-Tour.aspx

How is 8.8% of the total "too many challengers in Asia"?
Are 8.8% of the fans Asian using actualy attendence numbers, not just your feelings.

Are 8.8% of the players in the top 100 Asian?

Are 8.8% of the top 500 players Asia?

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post #547 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 09:04 AM
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

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Are 8.8% of the fans Asian using actualy attendence numbers, not just your feelings.

Are 8.8% of the players in the top 100 Asian?

Are 8.8% of the top 500 players Asia?
I think only 8.8% of your post actually makes sense. You said that there are too many challengers in Asia, I said that only 8.8% of the current challengers are held there, thereby refuting your statement that there are too many challengers in Asia.

What exactly is the rationale behind asking for 8.8% of the top 100 to be Asian or the top 500 players to be Asian just to host challenger tournaments in a particular continent, in order to aid tennis there? That's like asking me to be Spanish just to be a fan of Barcelona.

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post #548 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 09:08 AM
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

he means that asia has too many challengers given the below par asian attendance, participation from players etc......
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post #549 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 09:21 AM Thread Starter
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

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I think only 8.8% of your post actually makes sense. You said that there are too many challengers in Asia, I said that only 8.8% of the current challengers are held there, thereby refuting your statement that there are too many challengers in Asia.

What exactly is the rationale behind asking for 8.8% of the top 100 to be Asian or the top 500 players to be Asian just to host challenger tournaments in a particular continent, in order to aid tennis there? That's like asking me to be Spanish just to be a fan of Barcelona.
If you followed the Challenger series closely then you would know the fields to the Asian Challengers are poor at all level. Even when Tashkent was 125K it wasn't as good as it could be.

How is it that 30K clay challengers in Europe have stronger fields, it's logistic reasons as well when it comes to travelling a lot easier to base themselves there. Yes, it would help the Aussies and other Asian players, but Shanghai has poor crowds when there aren't stars, so it's not like it will be better for Challengers.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #550 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 09:32 AM
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

They need to come back to 16 seeds and best of five sets in master series events finals.
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post #551 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 09:52 AM
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

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If you followed the Challenger series closely then you would know the fields to the Asian Challengers are poor at all level. Even when Tashkent was 125K it wasn't as good as it could be.

How is it that 30K clay challengers in Europe have stronger fields, it's logistic reasons as well when it comes to travelling a lot easier to base themselves there. Yes, it would help the Aussies and other Asian players, but Shanghai has poor crowds when there aren't stars, so it's not like it will be better for Challengers.
They got a pretty decent attendance for Beijing Challenger last year when they made it a mixed event and brought in Henin. When Li Na and the Chinese girls started winning, things started to explode in terms of popularity and marketability. Japan has a solid homegrown Challenger following as well.

Shanghai MS1000 doesn't seem to click with audiences but as I said, this is supposed to be a suggested reform list and the way I see it is to position the game in strategic growth areas rather than rely on historical precedent. I still think it's a good move to put the MS there. Shanghai MS1000 is also not representative of all the tournaments in the Asian region, which are pretty well-attended.

As I see it, there are plenty of opportunities to market the Challenger circuit properly like other sports that have decent second-tier leagues. It isn't even about trying to help out the local boys because quite a few of these tournaments have very good European and American fields and half of the Asian challengers last year were won by people not from the region.

You just need a good snake-oil salesman who knows what he's doing.

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post #552 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 09:58 AM Thread Starter
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

The crowds aren't great at Challenger level, even worse in Asia and no amount of spin is going to change that. They only want stars.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #553 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 10:06 AM
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

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The crowds aren't great at Challenger level, even worse in Asia and no amount of spin is going to change that. They only want stars.
Stars are made, not born. If Kim Kardashian can make 85 million dollars a year for doing essentially nothing on television, there is an agent out there who can make something out of the Challenger circuit.

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post #554 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 10:10 AM Thread Starter
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

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Stars are made, not born. If Kim Kardashian can make 85 million dollars a year for doing essentially nothing on television, there is an agent out there who can make something out of the Challenger circuit.
Different world can't compare that to professional sport. Actually the best rivalries and personalities grow organically from their performances and are not forced.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #555 of 599 (permalink) Old 04-14-2012, 12:29 PM
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Re: MTF suggestions to reform the ATP and tennis in general

How soon we have forgotten about mullets, wigs, Streisand affairs and Image is Everything.

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