Unofficial Live ATP Rankings [in Post #1] - Page 25 - MensTennisForums.com
 
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post #361 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-09-2012, 05:11 AM
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

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Rankings aren't showing on my computer
Read this on reason why Unofficial Live ATP Rankings [in Post #1]
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post #362 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-09-2012, 07:38 PM
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Rankings and drop dates

This year the season is shortened a few weeks. The drop dates of Basel, Paris and WTF are later than when the tournaments acctually is held in 2012. What happens then to rankings after these tournaments are finished? Can you have two Paris M1000 tournaments in the rankings breakdown? And in that case, are both mandatory?
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post #363 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 09:51 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

I apologize, it crashed Sunday morning I see. Fixing it now.

It crashed because the freakin Australia F6 final draw on ATP is a PICTURE !!!! The text cannot be copied from a picture... $^%%#^#**@%$^&*@^#$&

Last edited by Slasher1985; 09-10-2012 at 10:31 AM.
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post #364 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 10:41 AM
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Re: Rankings and drop dates

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Originally Posted by drazyc View Post
This year the season is shortened a few weeks. The drop dates of Basel, Paris and WTF are later than when the tournaments acctually is held in 2012. What happens then to rankings after these tournaments are finished? Can you have two Paris M1000 tournaments in the rankings breakdown? And in that case, are both mandatory?
I think that all Basel, Paris and WTF ranking points from 2011 will drop out of the rankings on the final day of Paris tournament this year, right before the WTF.

It's clear for Basel and the WTF from the rulebook, not so clear for Paris. If Paris points from 2011 are not dropped that week, then one optional result will be taken out of the rankings of the players who take part in Paris this year.

It had been discussed a little bit here from post 111 :

http://www.menstennisforums.com/show...l#post12220377

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Last edited by duong; 09-10-2012 at 10:49 AM.
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post #365 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 10:49 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

The drop date for WTF is always the first Monday after the regular season ends, regardless of the 52 week rule. That is, the next Monday after the last ATP event (ALWAYS).

If there are two Mandatory Masters or two Grand Slams of the same tournament within 52 weeks, the best result of the two is counted until the older event drops out of the rankings.

There can be two Basels within the same 52 weeks of Singles Rankings.

Basel points drop out on the Monday after Paris, Paris points drop off a week later (52 weeks rule applies). WTF points drop at the same time as Basel points.
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post #366 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 10:57 AM
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

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Originally Posted by Slasher1985 View Post
If there are two Mandatory Masters or two Grand Slams of the same tournament within 52 weeks, the best result of the two is counted until the older event drops out of the rankings.
no sorry it's wrong here : what you say is only true for one round of Davis cup,

but for mandatory tournaments, both do count in such a case and an optional result is dropped.

I know that, has happened several times since I've followed the rankings, and also it's clearly written in the rulebook.

It means that if they don't drop the points from Paris 2011 right after Paris 2012, there will be the points from two Paris tournaments in the rankings on monday before the WTF.

Which will happen for Basel one week earlier anyway yes.

The question which remains not clearly answered is : will they drop the points from Bercy 2011 before or after the WTF ? if you strictly follow the rulebook, it would be after the WTF, but I guess they won't do that, because it would mean that Paris 2011 would count for the qualifying for the WTF and the ATP didn't include Paris 2011 in the "Race to London" calculation last time I checked.
But there's still a question mark about that.

This has never happened before that Paris from year N is separated from the WTF from year N+1 by just 52 weeks like this year. Then one can't be sure what the ATP will do unless asking them directly maybe.

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Last edited by duong; 09-10-2012 at 11:02 AM.
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post #367 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 11:30 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

We're mixing things and it shouldn't be so.

The 2011 Paris result doesn't count for London because it's 2011, not 2012. So that is why it won't count this year at all in the Race To London. The 2012 result will enter the Race to London rankings, whilst the 2011 result will be ignored.

The Singles Rankings schema will follow the rulebook though, no matter if Paris is ahead of schedule.

I do follow on your mandatory rule you mentioned though, although the rulebook is not as clear as you're thinking. It only says the number of optionals is adjusted when there are not 12 mandatories, not if more than 12 mandatories are accepted.
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post #368 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 11:44 AM
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

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Originally Posted by Slasher1985 View Post
We're mixing things and it shouldn't be so.

The 2011 Paris result doesn't count for London because it's 2011, not 2012. So that is why it won't count this year at all in the Race To London. The 2012 result will enter the Race to London rankings, whilst the 2011 result will be ignored.
Well, in the rulebook the qualifying for the WTF is nomore based on the "Race to London" but on the ATP rankings (which is why the ATP had stopped displaying a Race on its website for two years) :

Quote:
Originally Posted by rulebook 4.01B
The selection list for the event shall be:
a) The top seven (7) players in the South African Airways ATP Rankings as of the Monday after the last ATP World Tour tournament of the calendar year;
followed by
b) Up to two (2) Grand Slam winners of that year, in order of their positions, positioned between eight (8) and twenty (20) in the South African Airways ATP Rankings as of that Monday;
followed by
c) Players positioned eight (8) and below in the South African Airways ATP Rankings as of that Monday.
The "Race to London" which is displayed by the ATP on its website now is only a help for people because it's easier to follow the way to the ATP rankings on the monday after Paris tournament which will actually determine the qualifying to the WTF.

Which means that on monday after Bercy, the ATP rankings and the "Race to London" should coincide because the former determines the official qualifying to the WTF, the latter was a help to "predict" that qualifying.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slasher1985 View Post
It only says the number of optionals is adjusted when there are not 12 mandatories, not if more than 12 mandatories are accepted.
yes, "when there are not" doesn't mean "less than", it means when it's different. The evidence of that is that it's "adjusted accordingly", not "increased by one" as they say in previous sentence for the case of players who are not allowed to enter mandatory tournaments as direct acceptances.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rulebook 9.03A
In weeks where there are not four (4) Grand Slams and eight (8) ATP World Tour Masters 1000 tournaments in the ranking period, the number of a player’s best results from all eligible tournaments in the ranking period will be adjusted accordingly.

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Last edited by duong; 09-10-2012 at 11:52 AM.
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post #369 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 11:48 AM
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

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Originally Posted by Slasher1985 View Post
I apologize, it crashed Sunday morning I see. Fixing it now.

It crashed because the freakin Australia F6 final draw on ATP is a PICTURE !!!! The text cannot be copied from a picture... $^%%#^#**@%$^&*@^#$&
lol there really is a picture inside..
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post #370 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 12:47 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

Alright duong, I understand that rule now. I still don't think they're gonna drop Paris before the 52 week marker though.
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post #371 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 03:20 PM
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

What will Roger, Novak and Andy's seeding be by next week?
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post #372 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 03:36 PM
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

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What will Roger, Novak and Andy's seeding be by next week?
Ranking: Federer #1, Djokovic #2, Murray #3, Nadal #4
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post #373 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 03:48 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

Alright, we're back online. Had to also create the functionality for adding new players that have gained the first points in an ATP event, because this event happened in Petange qualifiers.
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post #374 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 10:10 PM
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Re: Rankings and drop dates

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Originally Posted by duong View Post
I think that all Basel, Paris and WTF ranking points from 2011 will drop out of the rankings on the final day of Paris tournament this year, right before the WTF.

It's clear for Basel and the WTF from the rulebook, not so clear for Paris. If Paris points from 2011 are not dropped that week, then one optional result will be taken out of the rankings of the players who take part in Paris this year.

It had been discussed a little bit here from post 111 :

http://www.menstennisforums.com/show...l#post12220377
I agree with duong here. The point of the WTF not following the 52-week rule is that the rankings dated the monday after the last regular event of the year reflect the 8 players who qualify for the WTF, so it would be absurd to do this and then have two Paris events.
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post #375 of 1052 (permalink) Old 09-10-2012, 10:46 PM
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Re: Unofficial Live ATP Rankings

when was the last time that nadal fell to number 4?
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