Endless Federer-Nadal debates - Page 61 - MensTennisForums.com
View Poll Results: How will it look?
Nadal more than 15 matches ahead. 108 40.15%
Nadal 13-14 matches ahead. 25 9.29%
Nadal 11-12 matches ahead. 20 7.43%
Nadal 9-10 matches ahead. 20 7.43%
Nadal 7-8 matches ahead. 20 7.43%
Nadal 5-6 matches ahead. 19 7.06%
Nadal 3-4 matches ahead. 5 1.86%
Nadal 1-2 matches ahead. 1 0.37%
Equal 4 1.49%
Federer ahead 47 17.47%
Voters: 269. You may not vote on this poll

 
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post #901 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 10:08 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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post #902 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 10:09 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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I agree. It is useless. But all I'm saying is if one's trying to argue that Fed's doubles gold and singles silver somehow elevates him above Nadal at the Olympics or that Murray's mixed dubs silver is relevant, at all, then let's just have any old argument - Nadal won it at his first attempt - Fed's had 4 and still not won it.

The fact is there is a LOT of luck involved with the Olympics - once every 4 years, best of 3 till the final - but over 4 outings you'd think it would be enough for Fed. He didn't win it. Why not just accept that this is something that Nadal has that is better than Federer rather than clinging to that doubles gold for dear life?
The first paragraph does not bring any value or relevance to your argument. As for the second one, it is a fact that both Murray and Federer have an extra silver to go with their gold. People have to just accept those facts.
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post #903 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 10:09 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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Nadal texted Murray to congratulate him after the win and said "Congrats, you won the hardest one." and he's right - things need to fall in place for you and Murray's lucky that it did.


This victory should be a boost for Murray's self-confidence.
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post #904 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 10:16 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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Nadal texted Murray to congratulate him after the win and said "Congrats, you won the hardest one." and he's right - things need to fall in place for you and Murray's lucky that it did.
Murray calls Nadal GOAT and Nadal now responds with this.

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post #905 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 10:25 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

Ash86 proving just how far you can take stat-cherrypicking to defend your guy.

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Complete nonsense. If Phelps ONLY had relay medals no one would know who he was or care - can you name the rest of the members of the relay teams that won the swimming gold medals? No. He's great because of his single, individual success. Fed only has a Silver in the individual discipline - a "golden career slam" means achievements in singles events - otherwise why don't we just combine total doubles and singles success - in tennis it doesn't work that way.
This is like saying "if Fed only had the Olympic doubles gold would anyone care"? Of course not, but that obviously wasn't the point. Fed has the highest individual achievements possible in this sport, meaning the question your asking is misplaced. Olympics singles tennis also is very poor indicator of greatness, considering the level on display. WTF of course beats Olympics in that as well.

I'm sure a person posting in swimming forums would have an excellent knowledge of those members, to my mind comes the Hansen-Peirsol-Phelps-Lezak combo on the medley. All (except Lezak?) great individual swimmers in their own right.

slam". OTOH "Golden career slam" is in no way
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Nadals singles record at Olympics = unbeaten.
Federer's record = 4 defeats.
Murray' record = 1 defeat.
One of the most pointless stats I've ever seen, well done.

Fact: being 10-10 on Slam finals is better than being 10-0, you have had a better career with the 1st one.

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I don't even need to say that the Olympics matters more - every single player and their reactions has made it clear and so have the pronouncements of past greats like McEnroe etc. - the tennis media, the players and the past champions all think it's an important event and put it just below a slam. Fed's got a silver at a very important event - his fans should be celebrating that rather than pretending anyone will be caring about the WTF vs the Olympics in a decade's time.
Untrue. What they are talking about it the importance of being an Olympic champion in general, which is of course about the value of the Olympics, not the value of Olympics tennis to tennis in general. This goes to my point of making Olympics a completely separate event and not giving points at all. The importance is about being an Olympic champion in general.

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post #906 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 10:26 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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The first paragraph does not bring any value or relevance to your argument. As for the second one, it is a fact that both Murray and Federer have an extra silver to go with their gold. People have to just accept those facts.
I'm not going to say anything further as really it just must hurt all the Fed fans that no one in the tennis media cares about Fed's double medal - he's not got a career golden slam and that's that. Whatever he wins in doubles means nothing - it's the singles career that matters. Agassi and Nadal are the only players to have career golden slams - Fed, one of the greatest ever, has one little hole still on his CV and it won't be going away barring some Rio miracle...
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post #907 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 10:31 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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The first paragraph does not bring any value or relevance to your argument. As for the second one, it is a fact that both Murray and Federer have an extra silver to go with their gold. People have to just accept those facts.
It's proving to be very hard for some.

There is no qualifications for the term "Olympic champion". The only differentiation I would make is whether Olympics is the biggest event in the season for a spesific sport. In tennis and football it isn't, but even that doesn't matter. They all count the same in the end.

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The US Open Final was especially enjoyable, with 'Why are there white spots all over my body?' Djokovic and 'Why am I sweating boils?' Nadal embarked on a titanic battle, concluding with the inferior player, Nadal, entering a sort of delirious state of psychosis. This allowed him to, while showing very little fatigue, consume inhuman amounts of energy, before he literally ran his legs from underneath him. This is truly the stuff dreams are made of.
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post #908 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 10:33 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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I'm not going to say anything further as really it just must hurt all the Fed fans that no one in the tennis media cares about Fed's double medal - he's not got a career golden slam and that's that. Whatever he wins in doubles means nothing - it's the singles career that matters. Agassi and Nadal are the only players to have career golden slams - Fed, one of the greatest ever, has one little hole still on his CV and it won't be going away barring some Rio miracle...
If I would have to classify one group of fans as hurt, Fed fans would be fighting for last position in that list along with Murray fans.

Edit: You mention Agassi, pretty much every time people are talking about him and for example comparing him to Agassi, they talk about the career slam. I don't think I've ever in these debates hear anyone mention Golden career slam specifically, that tells you something on the value of it.

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Favourite tennis matches: 2011 US Open Final & 2012 Australian Open Final, starring Novak Djokovic & Rafael Nadal, showing us just how far science can take humanity.

The US Open Final was especially enjoyable, with 'Why are there white spots all over my body?' Djokovic and 'Why am I sweating boils?' Nadal embarked on a titanic battle, concluding with the inferior player, Nadal, entering a sort of delirious state of psychosis. This allowed him to, while showing very little fatigue, consume inhuman amounts of energy, before he literally ran his legs from underneath him. This is truly the stuff dreams are made of.
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post #909 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 10:41 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

Federer can't have every record, now.

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post #910 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 10:42 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

FACT fed n Murray are greater Olympians than rafole has hit a nerve in some.

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post #911 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 10:59 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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Federer can't have every record, now.
And he clearly doesn't, doesn't mean we have to be silly, now. Using Nadal's injury forcing him to skip Olympics as something that increases his greatness is just

Educating MTF clowns one post at a time.
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Favourite tennis matches: 2011 US Open Final & 2012 Australian Open Final, starring Novak Djokovic & Rafael Nadal, showing us just how far science can take humanity.

The US Open Final was especially enjoyable, with 'Why are there white spots all over my body?' Djokovic and 'Why am I sweating boils?' Nadal embarked on a titanic battle, concluding with the inferior player, Nadal, entering a sort of delirious state of psychosis. This allowed him to, while showing very little fatigue, consume inhuman amounts of energy, before he literally ran his legs from underneath him. This is truly the stuff dreams are made of.
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post #912 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 11:04 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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And he clearly doesn't, doesn't mean we have to be silly, now. Using Nadal's injury forcing him to skip Olympics as something that increases his greatness is just
Nadal's injury has got nothing to the fuck to do with Federer. If Nadal isn't there it ain't federer's fault but Nadal's himself. It's Nadal who's missing out.

The fact not winning the Olympics Singles doesn't hurt Federer. He's come through so many slams, tournaments that at this stage it doesn't detract from his superiority. This conversation is something to be had if Nadal get to 17 slams, and so the difference is important. Right now, it's not relevant.
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post #913 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-06-2012, 11:17 PM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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Federer can't have every record, now.
This. So Federer "only" got silver. That's fine, that's life. You can't win everything. Federer still has the most career achievements of any player ever. That's plenty good if you ask me.
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post #914 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-07-2012, 12:56 AM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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This. So Federer "only" got silver. That's fine, that's life. You can't win everything. Federer still has the most career achievements of any player ever. That's plenty good if you ask me.
Exactly

when all is said and done, Nadal, Agassi and Serena may have a golden slam but their careers are still dwarfed by Fed's career, simple as.
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post #915 of 4037 (permalink) Old 08-07-2012, 01:27 AM
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Re: Endless Federer-Nadal debates (WTF vs Olympics)

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Just 4 players in history of game have been #1 for more than 200 weeks. Almost that much is difference in time spent at #1 between Fed and Nadal . So much about debate
I know right. Connors and Lendl must also be greater than Borg.
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